treestarfae Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/dumb-as-a-rock-you-will-be-absolutely-amazed-at-the-things-that-u-s-high-school-students-do-not-know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butterflymommy Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Maybe it differs state to state/ district to district, but where I live the literate kids are put into AP classes or qualify for specialized high schools. The rest of the kids are basically warehoused all day. One statistic I read is that 70% of students from our public high schools require remedial math and reading instruction when entering the city college system. Meanwhile 20k+ of taxpayer funds is spent on each student each year. That being said, it's easy to look at these statistics and shake our heads and cluck our tongues. I have a very unmotivated teen on my hands who I fear is heading toward math illiteracy. The schools don't have an easy task-- trying to teach a disinterested teen is about as easy as herding squirrels. And when you segregate the high achieving kids from the slackers the disparity increases even more (I'm not implying they shouldn't be segregated-- high achievers deserve a decent learning environment). It's frightening to think that people who don't know what the constitution is are voting. You have to wonder what exactly they base their vote on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonshineLearner Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 My public school teens amaze me with what they know. As they're studying, I peek over and see how it's going. I hate to hear Homeschoolers here who mock the public schools and joke about how they couldn't do worse. Maybe for some of the kids, but the ones I've heard do it..... I know that my girls are just as educated as they are. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen in PA Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Terrifying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldskool Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 My public school teens amaze me with what they know. As they're studying, I peek over and see how it's going. I hate to hear Homeschoolers here who mock the public schools and joke about how they couldn't do worse. Maybe for some of the kids, but the ones I've heard do it..... I know that my girls are just as educated as they are. :( :iagree: I am sure there are students from all walks of schools that are both good and bad at answering these questions. I don't think we can even say that this generation is worse than any other, but we just tend to always think that one generation (usually the ones before us) were somehow more knowledgeable. I highly doubt that is the case. I know my mother who is a part of the "greatest generation" would not know the answers to most of the questions posed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/dumb-as-a-rock-you-will-be-absolutely-amazed-at-the-things-that-u-s-high-school-students-do-not-know This is really pathetic. Even that Comments to this article are pathetic. One 30 year old "researcher and writer" expresses his opinion that he gained a fine education at a private school early on, learning to read with the use of "phonix". He discusses the "principle" who was the head of one school, and indicates that he was "fasinated" by another aspect of learning. Gah! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 (edited) Deleted for TMI in case this gets locked without going *poof into the abyss*. Edited February 29, 2012 by LibraryLover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsMe Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I agree. The money they spend per child is crazy! And I agree w/the pp that if they're doing a little better than most of the class, they're excelling, and frankly, they're not, they just get it. I'd like to compare an honor student now, with an honor student from 30 years ago. I'll bet it's a pretty pathetic comparison. There's always some schools that do well, but as a whole it's not the norm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 It amazes me a mother would sit by and let a child read at a first grade level at age 18. Or maybe has an LD? Before I started schooling kiddo, I worked with my husband, who has severe dyslexia. Yes, his reading improved quite a bit BUT all his gains slipped away without regular practice. Reading is quite a task for him, so he doesn't do it for fun. How many adults would drill daily to keep their skills? It is easier to just go to the same gas station where you know "regular" is the end pump, or to stop and ask directions rather than read a map. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 To be fair it could be that either the mother's reading level isn't so high, or she truly thinks that since she is not a teacher (AKA expert) then how could she question one. A lot of people fall into that trap of trusting teachers, doctors, etc. to always do what is best. We are taught to trust these people (even above ourselves). Some people don't even know that they can demand something from a school. You wouldn't have noticed your 18 year old not progressing past See Dick Run? It isn't a matter of questioning a teacher, it is a matter of seeing your child is illiterate. And I have a beef with parents who don't try to bring themselves up to a level of competency. If you have some disability, then make sure someone else deals with the child. I am regularly amazed that parents at work who don't try to better their grammar, expand their cultural horizons, or just turn off the toob or step away from the casino and READ just can't believe their "really bright child" with a "great future", drops out and runs off with a guy with a rap sheet. Set the example you want from your children. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I notice most things and I'm bold enough to question anyone. :D Not everyone values those things as much as we do. That doesn't really bother me because I don't value all things either. Then she should be happy to have healthy child who is going to get by on other talents. The people at work I talk to want their kids to have degrees and good jobs. They do "value" it, but only when someone else is doing the work of study (the child). I wouldn't question anyone either. I'd get out a book and help child, just like my father did when I was a struggling reader. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Elf Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 My public school teens amaze me with what they know. As they're studying, I peek over and see how it's going. I hate to hear Homeschoolers here who mock the public schools and joke about how they couldn't do worse. Maybe for some of the kids, but the ones I've heard do it..... I know that my girls are just as educated as they are. :( There is also the group that thinks all homeschoolers, by definition I suppose, are cream of the crop, highly educated students. I've been on the butt end of that joke on this board more than once because my kids will never be the highly sought after by the ivy leagues type. I will be happy if they get accepted into the local 4-yr state school. No, not all ps students are dumb. And no, not all hs are genius. I am quite wary of anyone spouting such sweeping generalizations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Elf Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Why would that get this thread pulled? And sorry for mentioning Ron Paul. That lead-in was just too enticing! Because politics of any kind is very touchy on this board. SWB herself posted a sticky note at the top of this forum detailing her wishes about the discussion of politics. I'm interpreting your posts to be nothing but political baiting even though you may have no intent to do so. But since it's really unclear in many cases, posts are usually closed down when politics come into the discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I am not dumb as a rock, and I attended public school. :tongue_smilie: I don't understand threads like this. Just do your thing. Don't worry about where the other side may be succeeding or failing. Worry about where you are succeeding or failing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Because politics of any kind is very touchy on this board. SWB herself posted a sticky note at the top of this forum detailing her wishes about the discussion of politics. I'm interpreting your posts to be nothing but political baiting even though you may have no intent to do so. But since it's really unclear in many cases, posts are usually closed down when politics come into the discussion. That is no fun at ALL in an election year! I'd much prefer a vigorous exchange of ideas, but it seems this board prefer that you talk only about homeschooling or very benign topics. Sigh. But ok. WOW. That didn't take one minute! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lang Syne Boardie Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 That is no fun at ALL in an election year! I'd much prefer a vigorous exchange of ideas, but it seems this board prefer that you talk only about homeschooling or very benign topics. Sigh. In 2008 we nearly took down the whole internet with our vigorous exchange of ideas. It's better this way. And SWB has the right to set the rules in her house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I am not dumb as a rock, and I attended public school. :tongue_smilie: I don't understand threads like this. Just do your thing. Don't worry about where the other side may be succeeding or failing. Worry about where you are succeeding or failing. Further, does anyone really want to get into a dog fight over who wrote the Declaration of Independence? ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TranquilMind Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Tibbie Dunbar: In 2008 we nearly took down the whole internet with our vigorous exchange of ideas. I seriously doubt that. And I was reading here then. SWB has the right to set the rules in her house This is true. I just didn't realize these rules or that they were so exceedingly strict. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 In 2008 we nearly took down the whole internet with our vigorous exchange of ideas. It's better this way. And SWB has the right to set the rules in her house. :iagree:Has it already been that long? I remember that election and the uproar it caused on the boards. Trust me it is a very good thing it is prohibited on this board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibraryLover Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 If we're deleting posts for political reasons, wouldn't the OP's link/site be considered political baiting? Simply wondering, not asking for a 24 hour ban. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama Geek Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 As far as homeschooling or public schooling goes it is still the responsibility of the parents to make sure their kids get an education. It is all to often that people have the attitude of "oh I have sent my kids to school, now I don't have to educate my kid, I am off the hook, let the experts do it". I have seen that on one extreme and on the other I have talked to parents who are in their kids classrooms multiple days a week to watch what is going on and to be involved in their kids education. I would rather put that effort into homeschooling my dd. I do realize that there are kids who do get a decent education in spite of lack of support from their parents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coffeefreak Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 There is also the group that thinks all homeschoolers, by definition I suppose, are cream of the crop, highly educated students. I've been on the butt end of that joke on this board more than once because my kids will never be the highly sought after by the ivy leagues type. I will be happy if they get accepted into the local 4-yr state school. No, not all ps students are dumb. And no, not all hs are genius. I am quite wary of anyone spouting such sweeping generalizations. I am not dumb as a rock, and I attended public school. :tongue_smilie: I don't understand threads like this. Just do your thing. Don't worry about where the other side may be succeeding or failing. Worry about where you are succeeding or failing. :iagree: I seriously doubt that. And I was reading here then. This is true. I just didn't realize these rules or that they were so exceedingly strict. Oh, but Tibbie is right. They shut down the boards for a day or two to stop the runaway train of discussions. There are other boards for politics. Enjoy this one for what it was intended for. The rest of us do :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I agree with the article. What I see in my local public school continues to depress me. That's not the same as saying "no" public high school student gets a good education, nor is it the same as saying "all" homeschooled students get a good education. It's saying that I, personally, feel very frustrated at the lack of knowledge most high school students have - and this while they are still in school. Knowledge tends to get dusty after one graduates (unless one actively uses it), so if it's not there to start with, well, I worry about America's future. Hopefully those who continue to rise above the averages will be able to run the country (and any nursing home/hospital I might need later on in life)! Stats wise, my local public high school ranks slightly below average in what is generally a slightly above average state. Therefore, I consider us roughly "average." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I think the questions are quite narrow in scope. I graduated from a top rated high school overseas, attended (and succeeded) college and graduate school, and had a career. I may not have known the answers to some of these questions while in high school. I was a far cry from a rock. Dawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I skimmed through the article. It another agenda based article, and smacked of those stereo-typical homeschooling articles we see. I agree the questions were quite narrow. Had all those students had a government or American history class yet? Maybe not. Maybe so. There is a fracture in the educational system of this country, I don't think this is the biggest fault line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucyStoner Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I am not dumb as a rock, and I attended public school. :tongue_smilie: I don't understand threads like this. Just do your thing. Don't worry about where the other side may be succeeding or failing. Worry about where you are succeeding or failing. :iagree: I do think that in some cases the teaching to the test is dumbing down education but that is not across the board. And frankly, if I grabbed a few hundred random adults if all income levels and asked the same types of questions it is quite likely I would get pretty dismal results in history. Many adults I know are terrible at recalling facts about history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 (edited) Clearly, the linked-to web-page is just political fodder. One of the polls cited on this page has been pretty clearly debunked as being falsified: If you like statistics at all, this report on how to tell the poll was faked is fascinating: http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/09/are-oklahoma-students-really-this-dumb.html Edited February 29, 2012 by GGardner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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