Interesting article on "crying it out"

[mom31257]

http://shine.yahoo.com/parenting/crying-dangerous-kids-one-expert-says-222400379.html

 

I always knew that "crying it out" went against every mothering instinct in me. I was sleep deprived at times, though.

[Scarlett]

http://shine.yahoo.com/parenting/crying-dangerous-kids-one-expert-says-222400379.html

 

I always knew that "crying it out" went against every mothering instinct in me. I was sleep deprived at times, though.

 

I guess we would have to definite CIO. :glare:

 

I wouldn't leave a baby in a crib for hours crying. However, when ds was 9 months old he inexplicably began waking up every. single. hour. Finally when I was about to crack I took 3 nights of my life and soothed him with pats and my voice but didn't take him out of his crib. I felt like his sleep pattern needed reset. He wasn't getting the sleep he needed either by my taking him from his crib every time he cried. It worked.

 

I can see other options working fine too though. A kingsize bed for co-sleeping...

[mom31257]

I guess we would have to definite CIO. :glare:

 

I wouldn't leave a baby in a crib for hours crying. However, when ds was 9 months old he inexplicably began waking up every. single. hour. Finally when I was about to crack I took 3 nights of my life and soothed him with pats and my voice but didn't take him out of his crib. I felt like his sleep pattern needed reset. He wasn't getting the sleep he needed either by my taking him from his crib every time he cried. It worked.

 

I can see other options working fine too though. A kingsize bed for co-sleeping...

 

I agree about defining CIO. At 4 months old, ds began waking 7-8 times a night. The pediatrician gave me the advice to let him cry it out by going in every 10-15 minutes to sooth him, but leave the room the rest of the time. I did try it, but after 4 hours of relentless crying, throwing up, etc., I knew he wasn't going to cry himself to sleep. I began co-sleeping at that point. I wonder how many parents are trying "cry it out" without doing the soothing and such that you did. How is it affecting their development?

 

I thought the rat experiment was most interesting. My dh teaches in a school with many students performing poorly academically and raised in poor homes with drug/alcohol addicted parents. How has the possible lack of good parenting in those early months affected his students today? Will they ever be able to overcome it if genes are affected or never turned on?

[fairfarmhand]

I guess we would have to definite CIO. :glare:

 

I wouldn't leave a baby in a crib for hours crying. However, when ds was 9 months old he inexplicably began waking up every. single. hour. Finally when I was about to crack I took 3 nights of my life and soothed him with pats and my voice but didn't take him out of his crib. I felt like his sleep pattern needed reset. He wasn't getting the sleep he needed either by my taking him from his crib every time he cried. It worked.

 

I can see other options working fine too though. A kingsize bed for co-sleeping...

 

Yep, I had one of those too. She needed to fuss alone for a few minutes to settle down. Not for hours, but if I held her, nursed, whatever, she was just more stimulated and more miserable. This was when she was close to a year old.

 

I wish there was another name for the pat your baby, comfort him, but not pick him up method. It is not traditional CIO, but telling parents that their child will always need to be comforted or soothed, especially as they reach toddler ages, can sometimes backfire.

[Rebecca VA]

I don't believe that Narvaez's problems (social anxiety, irritable bowel, etc.) can be traced so neatly back to CIO. My older child has very severe anxiety problems, and he was definitely an attached baby. My son's problems are probably genetic. It is likely that Narvaez's problems are genetic as well -- it says right in the article that his mom had depression, which has a strong genetic link.

 

I believe strongly in attachment parenting. My second child slept in our bed for YEARS, holding my hand in her sleep. I wore out a copy of Dr. Sears' book "The Fussy Baby" because I read it so often. I loved that book because it approached attachment parenting from the standpoint of the relationship between baby and parent. This poorly-written scare-tactic article heaps guilt onto parents without explaining the beauty of a trusting parent-child relationship and the lifelong benefits it yields.

[jennsmile]

I think it is insteresting. It runs true in my family as I think of parenting styles and issues that face family members.

[SKL]

A non-nurturing mother rat does not equal a parent who determines that her child needs more sleep.

 

The way the article is written, it seems the researcher was looking for ways to blame bad parenting for his/her own problems. "My mommy was depressed, therefore I have IBS and poor memory, therefore nobody should ever let their kid cry." Sure, sounds logical to me.

 

Like other articles about the topic, it assumes that parents have no instincts and no heart when it comes to what their individual kids need at a given moment. Maybe true of someone who is stoned on drugs all the time or whatever, but that doesn't directly implicate CIO as most parents apply it.

 

Interestingly, they note how theoretically, our ancestors adopted behaviors to prevent babies from crying and alerting predators of a tasty, helpless morsel. I recall reading a book about a Native American tribe, which preveted its babies from crying in order to keep safe from neighboring enemies. How they did it? They covered the babies' nose and mouth (cut off air supply) until the baby learned to shut up! Much better than CIO, don't you think? At any rate, the predator concern is a bit outdated, I think.

[SKL]

By the way, I assume that this theory holds true also for allowing tantrums, right? So it is absolutely wrong to allow a child, during the day, to scream and cry when things don't go his way. Why, if you allow that, your child will grow up stupid and miserable.

[Scarlett]

By the way, I assume that this theory holds true also for allowing tantrums, right? So it is absolutely wrong to allow a child, during the day, to scream and cry when things don't go his way. Why, if you allow that, your child will grow up stupid and miserable.

 

Ha! Good point.

 

Also I think there is a big difference between letting a newborn CIO and a baby closer to a year old who can easily sleep through the night.

[mom31257]

Also I think there is a big difference between letting a newborn CIO and a baby closer to a year old who can easily sleep through the night.

 

I think the article is trying to say there is a fine line that parents should be careful not to cross. The older a child is the more they should be able to be talked to and understand. I don't think anyone here would advocate letting a very young infant cry it out. There are definitely psychological results of infants not being held enough or being cared for.

 

My hope that this article may cause doctors, professionals, and even friends to be careful in advice that they give.

[Perry]

A non-nurturing mother rat does not equal a parent who determines that her child needs more sleep.

 

The way the article is written, it seems the researcher was looking for ways to blame bad parenting for his/her own problems.

Yes, exactly.

 

I had an exceptionally colicky baby, who had terrible problems going to and staying asleep. We were very attached, and she was held pretty much non-stop. But at one point, we had to do CIO, or I was going to end up committed. It took 3 days (using Ferber's techniques) and her sleep problems (and mine) were cured. There is just no way that that is comparable to a chronically non-nurturing experience.

 

I do believe that chronic neglect leads to changes in the brain and long-term damage. But not a couple days of CIO.

 

The article posted by the OP links to this one, which states

 

One study showed infants who experienced persistent crying episodes were 10 times more likely to have ADHD as a child, along with poor school performance and antisocial behavior. The researchers concluded these findings may be due to the lack of responsive attitude of the parents toward their babies. 14.

This really angers me. If they don't understand the difference between correlation and causation they shouldn't be doing research.

 

It is much more likely that kids who have ADHD are much more likely to have persistent crying episodes, poor school performance, and antisocial behavior. It's genetic! Although I also recognize that neglect and poor parenting can cause similar issues.

[Melinda in VT]

I'm not a fan of letting babies cry, but there comes a time when the health and safety of the other family members might necessitate letting the babies cry it out at night.

 

We let our twins cry it out around 6 months of age. I didn't feel it was safe for me to co-sleep with two (tried it a time or two, but I only "knew" where one baby was at a time and that scared me), and DH was in danger of falling asleep during his commute. He was already falling asleep at work in the middle of one-on-one conversations.

[Plucky]

\

 

This really angers me. If they don't understand the difference between correlation and causation they shouldn't be doing research.

 

It is much more likely that kids who have ADHD are much more likely to have persistent crying episodes, poor school performance, and antisocial behavior. It's genetic! Although I also recognize that neglect and poor parenting can cause similar issues.

 

Yep, it's just because I'm a horrible mother that feeds my child a horrible diet that he has adhd/anxiety/sensory issues/tics/and now trichotillomania. I am not a CIO mom, but I used to have to put this baby in his crib for a half hour break so I wouldn't hurt him or myself - the crying and screaming was so bad - 3 years of it mind you.

[Laurie4b]

By the way, I assume that this theory holds true also for allowing tantrums, right? So it is absolutely wrong to allow a child, during the day, to scream and cry when things don't go his way. Why, if you allow that, your child will grow up stupid and miserable.

 

I think that is a whole different issue and that it is dangerous to conflate an infant's crying with a toddler's tantrum. In fact, I get really concerned by parenting "experts" like the Ezzos or the Pearls who interpret infant's behavior in the same way they would interpret a toddler's tantrum--as a manipulation to "get their own way." Allowing babies to "cry it out" when they are desiring parental contact because they are anxious, etc can go on for hours. In that case, prior to words, it is the infant's only means for communicating with a parent.

 

That is a whole different ball game from "allowing" a toddler (not a baby--babies don't have tantrums) to cry when tantrumming. That is entirely within the toddler's control and is typically much more short-lived than a baby crying because she is separated from her parent.

 

I don't agree with letting a baby "cry it out" but neither do I condemn parents who do it within reasonable limits. I would call the latter a different parenting philsophy. The ones who take it to extremes, however, are the ones who believe the infant's behavior is a manipulation equivalent to a toddler's tantrum.

[twoxcell]

I think there is a huge difference with someone letting their 6 month+ baby cry for 10-15 minutes with constant soothing and someone letting their baby constanly cry for hours on end. I'm not talking about those with babies who cry no matter what you do.;) Infants need constant love and attention and not just during the day.

[Scarlett]

I think that is a whole different issue and that it is dangerous to conflate an infant's crying with a toddler's tantrum. In fact, I get really concerned by parenting "experts" like the Ezzos or the Pearls who interpret infant's behavior in the same way they would interpret a toddler's tantrum--as a manipulation to "get their own way." Allowing babies to "cry it out" when they are desiring parental contact because they are anxious, etc can go on for hours. In that case, prior to words, it is the infant's only means for communicating with a parent.

 

That is a whole different ball game from "allowing" a toddler (not a baby--babies don't have tantrums) to cry when tantrumming. That is entirely within the toddler's control and is typically much more short-lived than a baby crying because she is separated from her parent.

 

I don't agree with letting a baby "cry it out" but neither do I condemn parents who do it within reasonable limits. I would call the latter a different parenting philsophy. The ones who take it to extremes, however, are the ones who believe the infant's behavior is a manipulation equivalent to a toddler's tantrum.

 

Uh oh. You mentioned the E word and the P word. :glare: Disclaimer: I read On Becoming Babywise and took away a few good points. I guess I culled through the bad enough that I don't remember it, but I've heard enough people say the bad is there that I believe them.

 

Again, as mentioned earlier, CIO needs to be defined. I let my 9 month old CIO, but I did comfort him with touch and my voice.

 

And as others have mentioned sometimes a crying baby needs to be left alone in the crib for the sanity and safety of all concerned.

[justamouse]

It is much more likely that kids who have ADHD are much more likely to have persistent crying episodes, poor school performance, and antisocial behavior. It's genetic! Although I also recognize that neglect and poor parenting can cause similar issues.

I don't think it's genetic, as 'genetic', if that makes any sense.

I have spectrum kids in my surrounding family, but until our generation-no one had it. No one had Autism, no one had ADHD, and every single one of my cousin's kids do and one of my own kids does.

 

I think we've-in our generation, mutated genes we are too stupid (<--anger at the establishment) to understand and are passing this defect down to our kids.

 

Having raised a severely ADHD kid who never slept, and who attachment parented until it was shamed out of me (and then I broke away attachment parented the rest) I do see that there is a line. I do think, that for the most part, they are NOT talking about colic children, but parents who want to 'set a schedule' and put their kids in a closed room, in a crib, and let them wail. I DO know parents of normal children who did that. It happens a lot. You obviously see it in certain orphanages-the cortisol level on those kids is so very high.

 

Anyway, I don't think anyone should read the study and take it personally-but as a whole.

[choirfarm]

Well, just call me a bad mother. My first one cried/screamed for hours as a baby...even when held. He was on phonobarbitol and had horrible exema (sp)? There were nights when I had to put him in bed because I was exhausted and had no help. I only meant to leave him there for 15 minutes or so, but I fell into an exhausted sleep and when I woke up he would be asleep. I honestly don't know how long he cried. After several nights of no sleep, I just couldn't take it anymore. I remember hiding in the garage in the car occasionally. I loved cuddling with him, but I couldn't do it 24/7. Thankfully, my others were fine. I just didn't know what to do. I tried the holding, waiting 5 minutes, holding, waiting 10 minute thing. I didn't sleep if he was next to me for fear of smothering him. It was awful... So I judge no one. I was SO exhausted...

[twoxcell]

I have spectrum kids in my surrounding family, but until our generation-no one had it. No one had Autism, no one had ADHD, and every single one of my cousin's kids do and one of my own kids does.

 

Seriously, no one?

[meggie]

Well, just call me a bad mother. My first one cried/screamed for hours as a baby...even when held. He was on phonobarbitol and had horrible exema (sp)? There were nights when I had to put him in bed because I was exhausted and had no help. I only meant to leave him there for 15 minutes or so, but I fell into an exhausted sleep and when I woke up he would be asleep. I honestly don't know how long he cried. After several nights of no sleep, I just couldn't take it anymore. I remember hiding in the garage in the car occasionally. I loved cuddling with him, but I couldn't do it 24/7. Thankfully, my others were fine. I just didn't know what to do. I tried the holding, waiting 5 minutes, holding, waiting 10 minute thing. I didn't sleep if he was next to me for fear of smothering him. It was awful... So I judge no one. I was SO exhausted...

 

Something similar happened to me last night. Baby girl doesn't have many issues (that I know of) except the eczema and her's isn't too terrible. But the first time she got up last night, I was so out of it. Brain fog, couldn't think, falling over while walking to get her. The next time she woke up, I rolled over to get her, but the next thing I remember is waking up and she was asleep.

 

I think sometimes the body can only take so much before it shuts down on you. :grouphug: You're not a bad mother.

[PeacefulChaos]

Kinda funny, but one of the rare times my son would not cry as an infant was when we took him to the Austrian club on Friday nights for loud polka music. I kid you not, he was fixated on it. :lol:

 

:lol:

 

I usually interpret CIO as the responsible way of doing it - a little at a time.

I'm in no way whatsoever an 'AP' type parent. I want my kids in their beds from the time they come home from the hospital. DS7 came home and went into his crib. We had to do very little with him as far as the crying went - I was blessed to never have a colicky baby (I so feel for those who do!) - but sometimes he was just happier to be put in bed and let cry for a couple of minutes. There were a few times that no matter what we did, he was still crying, so we would lay him down. He'd sometimes stop within 30 seconds, like he was just tired or wanted some down time or something. Other times he would cool down but would still be a little fussy - at which point we could go back in and get him and he'd chill with us happily again. Kids. :)

The worst experience I had was with DD when she came home from the hospital. She was a month old and had been living in the NICU - constant noise - monitors buzzing, beeping, nurses walking down the hallway, etc - as well as a crib full of fuzzy blankets, some stuffed animals, etc (being on the monitors all the time and under constant supervision they didn't have any reason to worry about SIDS. They were more interested in her being surrounded by things from home, that smelled like us - mainly me). So when she came home and I laid her in the pack n play (I did digress to a bassinet with DS6 since he and DS7 shared a room. I didn't want an almost 2 year old waking up every time the baby did. And then with DD, DH actually slept in the bed in her room until she slept through the night @ 8 weeks, so that he could get a good night's rest) with nothing else in it, she SCREAMED bloody murder. She hated it. Seriously. Hated it. She would lay there and cry and NOTHING I did could get her to stop. When we first brought her home, the ONLY way she would sleep was being held (though I did sneak in a couple of hours worth in her bouncy chair or carseat a couple of times - don't hate. ;) and ONCE I gave in and laid her in the bed next to me. But I was so worried about her suffocating that I had a little sheet on me, and the entire part of the bed she was on was empty as possible :lol: - pretty uncomfortable, so I never did that again) We did over the first couple of weeks finally get her in a routine where she would sleep ok in the pack and play with receiving blankets rolled up next to her sides and another one over her, tucked in on both sides. It really was a nightmare. But by the time she had been home a month, she was sleeping like a pro (and had finally learned how to take a bottle without it taking her forEVER to eat it!)

Anyway, that was a really long story just for me to say that responsible, loving CIO is not a bad thing, IMO. I honestly think it's the best thing for them.

[twoxcell]

but sometimes he was just happier to be put in bed and let cry for a couple of minutes. There were a few times that no matter what we did, he was still crying, so we would lay him down. He'd sometimes stop within 30 seconds, like he was just tired or wanted some down time or something. Other times he would cool down but would still be a little fussy - at which point we could go back in and get him and he'd chill with us happily again. Kids. :)

 

That is not CIO in my opinion. Every baby is going to cry for short periods of time. To me CIO is when you let a baby lay and scream so hard they are turning red and hyperventilating for long periods of time. Not short periods of crying or fussing.

[mommymilkies]

Exactly. The baby crying is less dangerous than you operating on zero sleep for days.

 

I think in that case, it's important to look at what's causing the crying. I've had 4 colicky babies. All 5, if you count one month of it with my eldest. Addressing food intolerances and allergies made all the difference. I've known wayyyyyyyyy too many weeks of no sleep. But that's what partners, friends, and family should be for. And if they aren't, then that's an outrage. I've never left any of my children to CIO except my ds because I was working nights and literally slept through him crying several times after 16 hour shifts. It's one thing, IMO, if a baby is ill or colicky and crying. You can hold them, pass them off, go for a walk/drive. But leaving a baby to CIO to train it makes me sick.

[meggie]

See and here's another topic where IT. JUST. DEPENDS!!!!

 

It depends on the kid, it depends on the parent, it depends on lots of other factors. There is no one size fits all. Pigby slept in the carseat the first few weeks of life. It tricked him into thinking he was being held. The same trick did not work for Digby. Actually, nothing worked for Digby. Baby girl never needed such help. After about two weeks old, I would just lay her down and she'd go to sleep on her own :001_huh: Why couldn't every kid be like that?! Well, at least til she was six months old and now we're dealing with this again.

 

Pigby could handle crying it out. Digby could not. Baby girl sometimes can and sometimes cannot. It just depends. And I don't fault a desperate parent for trying. Sometimes you have to try lots of things to find something that works.

[justamouse]

Seriously, no one?

 

No one. And I do know my family tree pretty well. My mother, I would say, has a bent toward ADD, but I think much of it may be her own unchecked personal habits or personality.

 

Also, the people that my cousins married don't have it in their families. We've talked at length about all of this.

[butterflymommy]

The way the article is written, it seems the researcher was looking for ways to blame bad parenting for his/her own problems. "My mommy was depressed, therefore I have IBS and poor memory, therefore nobody should ever let their kid cry." Sure, sounds logical to me.

 

:iagree:

 

I've let my babies cry on occasion-- sometimes it seems they need to cry in order to fall asleep or "express themselves." No, I don't abandon them while they cry for hours, but a few minutes here and there, or a few minutes before conking out asleep-- I really don't see a problem with it.

 

Interestingly, they note how theoretically, our ancestors adopted behaviors to prevent babies from crying and alerting predators of a tasty, helpless morsel.

I've seen old advertisements for morphine to give to babies to "help them sleep." And I went to school with kids whose parents had put booze in their bottles to make them sleep.

 

At any rate, the predator concern is a bit outdated, I think.

No, but parental sleep deprivation is very dangerous, from everything to raising the risk of car accidents to child abuse. I read a statistic once that parental fatigue and stress are common factors in a lot of incidents of child abuse.

[KatA]

I wish there was another name for the pat your baby, comfort him, but not pick him up method.

 

We used Tracy Hogg's Baby Whisperer method that was very similar, not cry it out, but not co-sleeping.

[PeacefulChaos]

That is not CIO in my opinion. Every baby is going to cry for short periods of time. To me CIO is when you let a baby lay and scream so hard they are turning red and hyperventilating for long periods of time. Not short periods of crying or fussing.

 

See, to me CIO is what other posters have described - letting a baby cry for a few minutes, going in to comfort WITHOUT picking up, then a few more minutes, etc.

To me, what you describe as CIO is an extreme which I doubt most parents are speaking of when they use the term.

[twoxcell]

No one. And I do know my family tree pretty well. My mother, I would say, has a bent toward ADD, but I think much of it may be her own unchecked personal habits or personality.

 

Also, the people that my cousins married don't have it in their families. We've talked at length about all of this.

Ok, so your talking about your specific family?

[twoxcell]

See, to me CIO is what other posters have described - letting a baby cry for a few minutes, going in to comfort WITHOUT picking up, then a few more minutes, etc.

To me, what you describe as CIO is an extreme which I doubt most parents are speaking of when they use the term.

Every article I have read about damaging CIO was talking about letting you baby scream for long periods of time consistently, and yes that does happen all too often. My kids have all cried for short periods of time, but I do respond to my babies needs period. I'm can't stand listening to an infant scream. All my dc were different though. My oldest slept through the night somewhat by 4-5 months old, my second was 7-8 months(she was just one hungry girl), 3rd slept through the night at 2 months(no CIO she just did it), 4th I swear didn't sleep for the first month and then didn't sleep through the night once until he was nearly 18 months old. Yes he slept with me, and no I didn't let him CIO for long periods of time. With him he could have literally screamed the entire night and never stopped. He is a very affectionate child and has always craved touch. He sleeps in his own bed now just fine but a few nights a week he wakes up in the early morning and I bring him to my bed. He also has a few nights a week when I put him to bed he freaks out. Generally if I just get him up and hold him for a little while he will go to sleep just fine when I lay him down again.

[PeacefulChaos]

]Every article I have read about damaging CIO was talking about letting you baby scream for long periods of time consistently' date='[/b'] and yes that does happen all too often. My kids have all cried for short periods of time, but I do respond to my babies needs period. I'm can't stand listening to an infant scream. All my dc were different though. My oldest slept through the night somewhat by 4-5 months old, my second was 7-8 months(she was just one hungry girl), 3rd slept through the night at 2 months(no CIO she just did it), 4th I swear didn't sleep for the first month and then didn't sleep through the night once until he was nearly 18 months old. Yes he slept with me, and no I didn't let him CIO for long periods of time. With him he could have literally screamed the entire night and never stopped. He is a very affectionate child and has always craved touch. He sleeps in his own bed now just fine but a few nights a week he wakes up in the early morning and I bring him to my bed. He also has a few nights a week when I put him to bed he freaks out. Generally if I just get him up and hold him for a little while he will go to sleep just fine when I lay him down again.

 

I see. I don't read articles about it much, I usually try to stay away from the subject. :) (You see how well I'm doing? :lol: ) But I don't doubt that when articles are written regarding damaging CIO, that is what they are speaking of. I still doubt that is the majority of people who use CIO, though. To me, what those articles describe - children laying there for hours on end screaming until they choke on their own vomit or whatnot - not a child rearing philosophy like CIO, but negligence. I don't really put the two things in the same category.

But that's me. :) We can agree to disagree on this one. ;)

[justamouse]

Ok, so your talking about your specific family?

 

I live in NJ. We have the highest rate of Autism. You cannot NOT know anyone here without it. I know one family with three Autistic kids and no autism in previous generations.

 

NJ Newsroom July 2011 (for both link and quote)

 

A new study from Stanford found that environmental factors may play a more important role in causing autism than genetics.

 

 

The study of 192 pairs of twins in California found that genetics accounted for about 38 percent of autism cases, while environment was responsible for about 62 percent. The results went against previous studies of twins, which showed genetics being accountable in 90 percent of the cases.

 

 

 

But yes, I was speaking of my own personal family's experience. No one in previous generations-6 of our kids (all the cousins and my children combined) with it. And my grandparents (I was saying my mom might have a slight case of ADD) didn't have it.

Edited December 16, 2011 by justamouse

[twoxcell]

I see. I don't read articles about it much, I usually try to stay away from the subject. :) (You see how well I'm doing? :lol: ) But I don't doubt that when articles are written regarding damaging CIO, that is what they are speaking of. I still doubt that is the majority of people who use CIO, though. To me, what those articles describe - children laying there for hours on end screaming until they choke on their own vomit or whatnot - not a child rearing philosophy like CIO, but negligence. I don't really put the two things in the same category.

But that's me. :) We can agree to disagree on this one. ;)

No biggie, I just wanted to clarify for those who were annoyed with the article that let their babies cry for short periods of time. I really do not think that is who is going to be damaged by CIO. We always need to be leary of the extremes for all parenting.;)

[PeacefulChaos]

No biggie, I just wanted to clarify for those who were annoyed with the article that let their babies cry for short periods of time. I really do not think that is who is going to be damaged by CIO. We always need to be leary of the extremes for all parenting.;)

 

:iagree: For real. :)

[twoxcell]

I live in NJ. We have the highest rate of Autism. You cannot NOT know anyone here without it. I know one family with three Autistic kids and no autism in previous generations.

 

NJ Newsroom July 2011 (for both link and quote)

 

You know I am not familiar with Autism at all. I really know very few people who have it and no one related to me or a close friend has been diagnosed with it. I just thought you were saying NO One in previous generations had Autism or ADHD which I think is false. Those kind of things were just simply not known or diagnosed before.

[Scarlett]

:iagree: For real. :)

 

 

 

Oh, my gosh "bedroom intruder" popped into my mind. :lol:

[Scarlett]

No biggie, I just wanted to clarify for those who were annoyed with the article that let their babies cry for short periods of time. I really do not think that is who is going to be damaged by CIO. We always need to be leary of the extremes for all parenting.;)

 

THIS.

[twoxcell]

Oh, my gosh "bedroom intruder" popped into my mind. :lol:

? Did I miss something? What did I say:lol:!

[choirfarm]

I think in that case, it's important to look at what's causing the crying. I've had 4 colicky babies. All 5, if you count one month of it with my eldest. Addressing food intolerances and allergies made all the difference. I've known wayyyyyyyyy too many weeks of no sleep. But that's what partners, friends, and family should be for. And if they aren't, then that's an outrage. I've never left any of my children to CIO except my ds because I was working nights and literally slept through him crying several times after 16 hour shifts. It's one thing, IMO, if a baby is ill or colicky and crying. You can hold them, pass them off, go for a walk/drive. But leaving a baby to CIO to train it makes me sick.

 

Well...when you are far away from your family and your husband is in a residency program, you don't have many options. I tried hard not to let the baby interfere with dh's sleep. He was up a lot anyway and you don't want your surgical resident any more sleep deprived than he already is.. Yes, he was allergic to milk and peanuts.( didn't find that out until late. I breasfead him exclusively for 6 monthsr) I was going to doctors all the time... so much so that we walked into a doctor's office and anyone in scrubs or a white coat would make him scream whether they did anthing to him or not (lasted until he was 2) Dh had to take off his white coat so he wouldn't think he was a doc. It was horrible. No one knew why he was screaming. I had to get his heel pricked at least once a week for blood. It was horrible. I'm really surprised I had more. So did I let him cry it out.. Sometimes, yes I did. Sorry. But I had to. I was on the edge of a nervous breakdown.

[Scarlett]

? Did I miss something? What did I say:lol:!

 

Lets just say my 11 year old has shown me one too many Youtube videos of 'songifys'. News reports turned into 'song's.'

 

Bedroom intruder is an interview with some victims....a young woman and her brother....an intruder broke in and attempted to um, harm her. It is hilarious...google 'bed intruder song'. I was horrified when ds first showed it to me because of the subject matter....then he showed me the original interview and then it was funny. Anyway, if you listen to it you will hear a line in there, 'you are so dumb, you're really really dumb, for real.'

 

I'm sorry my 12 year old boy humor is coming out.

[twoxcell]

Lets just say my 11 year old has shown me one too many Youtube videos of 'songifys'. News reports turned into 'song's.'

 

Bedroom intruder is an interview with some victims....a young woman and her brother....an intruder broke in and attempted to um, harm her. It is hilarious...google 'bed intruder song'. I was horrified when ds first showed it to me because of the subject matter....then he showed me the original interview and then it was funny. Anyway, if you listen to it you will hear a line in there, 'you are so dumb, you're really really dumb, for real.'

 

I'm sorry my 12 year old boy humor is coming out.

 

Hehe! You had me racking my brain trying to figure out what I said about intruding peoples bedrooms.;)

[fairfarmhand]

As I said, I was at the doctor at least once per week for months. I tried EVERYTHING. He was tested. Food was adjusted. Gadgets for colic were bought. Medications were tried. NOTHING worked.

 

I had my husband and he is a saint, but 99% of the time I was alone. There were times I went into the bathroom and took a hot shower and cried my head off while my baby cried in the other room. I can think of worse things I could have done.

 

I remember thinking, when I was doing this EXACT SAME THING, something along the lines of " If a baby's crying in a crib and I can't hear her, does she really make a sound?" I think I was half insane at that point anyway. Post partum, no sleep, bone tired......

 

I remember looking out the window at the weeds in my flower beds and crying because I had NO energy to pull them. I have no pictures of my dd2 from hospital pictures to 1 month old because I WAS TOO TIRED TO WALK ACROSS THE ROOM FOR THE CAMERA!

 

I told my dh this a couple years later and he was angry at me for not telling him about it. I guess I never thought to mention it. Or I was too tired to mention it. I was a walking zombie.

[SKL]

You all reminded me of my CIO day.

 

I adopted my kids. Took custody on a Tuesday (their ages were 9mos and 12mos). Everything was awesome on Tuesday and Wednesday. Here comes Thursday (still in a hotel room with two babies and my mom) and both babies decide to wail all day long.

 

No matter what I did, all day long. And they very clearly needed to sleep.

 

Obviously this was not a case of me not caring about my kids. I mean, shoot, I went through a lot to get these kids. I dreamed for months about all the wonderful ways I'd show them love and caring once I had the chance. BUT. What if they don't want my love and caring on a particular day?

 

Finally in the evening, my mom and I went into the other part of the suite and closed the door (the girls were in cribs). I said to my mom, "wow, somebody's babies are making an awful lot of noise in the next room. I feel sorry for their poor mother." My mom said, "me too." Then we took a little break before I went back in there.

 

My kids liked me just fine the next day, and over 4 years later, they are awesome. I cannot help the fact that they were overcome with grief and there was nothing I could do about it on that Thursday back in 2007. Hate me if you want to.

 

I am blessed to have kids who are generally very calm and great sleepers. When I hear stories of kids who NEVER sleep, I almost want to pass out in sympathy for their mothers. God bless them if they try to help themselves and their kids by getting them to sleep somehow!

[mommymilkies]

As I said, I was at the doctor at least once per week for months. I tried EVERYTHING. He was tested. Food was adjusted. Gadgets for colic were bought. Medications were tried. NOTHING worked.

 

I had my husband and he is a saint, but 99% of the time I was alone. There were times I went into the bathroom and took a hot shower and cried my head off while my baby cried in the other room. I can think of worse things I could have done.

 

And like I said, that's totally different, IMO. I've been there!

[SnowWhite]

The article is about this method:

While some decry it as cruel, others have had success with the "cry it out" method -- teaching babies to "self-soothe" by letting their nighttime crying go unanswered.

 

Most of the mommies on this thread are talking about Ferberizing (with comforting and patting and talking) and not for long periods. I think we can all agree mother's sanity sometimes requires exceptions. I do however agree with the rule set forth in the article: Babies' cries need answering in general.

 

My in-laws bought ear plugs when BIL was two and locked him in his room for the night. On doctor's recommendation.

 

A cousin and his wife NIGHTLY let their 7 month old cry for 30 min or more until he falls asleep. If he wakes in the night their common practice is not to go get him. YES, he is a breastfed baby, but he's chubby so if he's hungry, so what?

 

I shared this article on my FB wall, hoping cousin and wife would take notice. (Doubtful, they know I don't parent this way).

[mommymilkies]

I know, but it's rather annoying to read these "articles". KWIM? I think it's unfair to characterize a parent as uncaring, abusive, screwing up, because they don't always do the perfect things. I guess I take things to heart. No matter how hard I try I think I'm screwing it up. I could write 100,000 advice books because it all sounds so warm and fuzzy, but living it, that I've yet to see. It's so easy to give advice.

 

Most that I have read decry the "training" of babies and ignoring their needs. I agree with you, though. I hate reading all of these "perfect parenting" articles with simple advice that just did not work for my kids that make it seem like I must be doing something wrong because white noise (or whatever) would have cured it. :lol: You have to wonder if they have kids sometimes!

[coralloyd]

All three of mine had to at some point CIO. Not one of them has ADHD. They are all very smart. Plus they most definitely do not have anxiety. In fact both my girls are in a Christmas play tomorrow, in which they both have leading roles. When asks by a friend yesterday if they were nervous, they answered, "No. Why would we be nervous?" So I think that premise is bunk.