Should you change curricula even if it is working for you?

[kristinannie]

We are using McRuffy Color Math K. The more we use it, the more I love it! DS5 is learning a lot and it is a fun program. However, I can't stop looking at posts about Singapore Math. I know people swear by it and I am sure I would love it, but should I make the switch? Could we do the IP and CWP without doing the main text? Should you ever switch when something is working so well for you? Thanks in advance for the advice!

[mama25angels]

I would not switch. Yes, you can use the IP and CWP without the rest of the program.

[Karen in CO]

Changing math programs mulitple times is one of the large complaints my two oldest have about our homeschool. Don't change things that are working. Don't change just because something is working for someone else. DOn't change just because a kid complains (some older kids like my ds do this know they can confuse mom and get out of some work). Change for a reason after much consideration.

 

Having said that, you can easily add CWPs or IPs into a math program that is working, expecially if you start at the beginning and when a child has already been taught the topic in your main program. I have a nice, full set of them waiting for my dd to be ready to do them.

[RootAnn]

:iagree:

[Mommy2BeautifulGirls]

I wouldn't. It's too hard to find something that works.

[Jean in CA]

I have used Singapore with 2 kids, starting on the 3rd. We start roughly at age 6 with Singapore 1.

 

So, I wouldn't consider this a "switch" for you, since your ds is only 5. (The Earlybird Series has little added value, IMO, and can be skipped entirely.)

 

Borrow some Primary Math books if you can. I highly recommend you purchase a copy of "Elementary Mathematics for Teachers" by Parker and Baldridge. It is a short, but detailed mathematics course for teachers based on Singapore's Primary math series (specifically 3A-6A). Even if you don't end up using Singagpore, you will benefit greatly from learning to think mathematically and relationally. You'll learn how to think about how different arithmetic concepts are related to each other, instead of as separate scope and sequence tasks to check off. This book greatly improved my understanding of elementary math.

 

Then, if you like the methods and think you'd like to invest some time into teaching the Singapore way, go ahead and start your children in at level 1A. Even 2A is a good entry level. After 2nd grade, I highly recommend you settle on a math program and stick with it (we combine Abeka and Sinagpore).

 

FYIW, I think to choose a good math program, you'd want to look at their upper levels of elementary math. Look at how they teach story problems. Are they challenging? Look at how they teach addition, subtraction, mental math. Look at how they teach long division. Do they offer mulitiple ways of manipulating numbers, or do they just teach an algorithm and expect the student to plug and chug w/o much comprehension? Math is such an important subject that I think it is worth researching well, while your kids are still young. My son did Abeka for a long time, than asked to switch to Singapore in 4th grade. His sister was using the program and he knew he wasn't being challenged as much as she was.... But I love Abeka for building a solid foundation in muliplication and addition/subtraction in the early years. But they are a bit weak on story problems and mental calculations.

 

Have you looked at the upper levels of your current math program to know they approach they take?

 

Jean

Edited July 14, 2011 by Jean in CA

[kristinannie]

 

So, I wouldn't consider this a "switch" for you, since your ds is only 5. (The Earlybird Series has little added value, IMO, and can be skipped entirely.)

 

 

 

 

Have you looked at the upper levels of your current math program to know they approach they take?

 

Jean

 

 

:iagree: I really want to be settled on a program by 1st grade for better or for worse. Right now, McRuffy only goes to 3rd grade! I was planning on switching to Saxon 5/4, but I am rethinking that!

[boscopup]

I'd be ok with switching at this point because as a PP said, you're still doing K now. So "switching" in first grade is not a big deal at all.

 

That said, yes, you can use the IP and CWP without the whole program. I use MM as my spine, and I add IP for the extra challenge and CWP just for fun (DS loves word problems). It's working out great. MM is very similar to Singapore in method though, so that can make a difference.

 

I agree with looking at the upper levels of your math program to see if that's where you want to be later on. I look ahead at grades 5 and 6 and like what I see, so I'm sticking with my current plan (we'll use regular textbooks for pre-algebra on up, so that level didn't matter to me).

 

This would be a good time to try out Singapore and see if you like it. If you don't, you can stick with McRuffy.

 

There are times when making a switch IS a good thing, because even though one thing might be working, another thing may actually work better. The problem can be when you switch a LOT just because the grass is greener. I would expect you to switch around some at this point. I'm still switching around a bit, figuring out what works best for us. I'll be making a couple changes next year from things that are working "ok" this year (so I'll use them for the entire 2011-2012 school year), but I think these other programs might be a better fit. Switching to them won't harm us in anyway, even if they don't work out. It's not like we're switching math programs in grades 2, 3, 4, and 5, ending up 2-3 grades behind because of scope and sequence differences. ;)

[EmilyGF]

Consistency in a math program is really important. Don't change. :) To CWP and IP if you want, but if it works, especially in math, don't fix it. You'll have plenty of years to do Singapore if you want to start using it after 3rd grade.

 

Emily

[FairProspects]

I'd consider selling you my Singapore 1 curriculum if you are interested. It didn't work for us here at all.

[Mandi in Ohio]

Consistency in a math program is really important. Don't change. :) To CWP and IP if you want, but if it works, especially in math, don't fix it. You'll have plenty of years to do Singapore if you want to start using it after 3rd grade.

 

Emily

 

 

Totally agree!

[Embassy]

I think starting Singapore at 1A is a good move if it sounds like something that would work well for your son.

[janainaz]

Because your child is still so young, I would consider it. You might ask Spycar (he?) seems to know a lot about math from what I've read (and I believe) he uses Singapore, and favors that program over the others. I've used Saxon from K-7/6, and while I don't plan on switching, I am curious to know why that math program might have been better.

 

If you are wanting to switch, I would research it now and then stick with whatever you choose.

[Mommy22alyns]

No, I would not change!!

[kristinannie]

Because your child is still so young, I would consider it. You might ask Spycar (he?) seems to know a lot about math from what I've read (and I believe) he uses Singapore, and favors that program over the others. I've used Saxon from K-7/6, and while I don't plan on switching, I am curious to know why that math program might have been better.

 

If you are wanting to switch, I would research it now and then stick with whatever you choose.

 

 

 

How do you like Saxon? I was planning on using them starting in 4th grade. I like that it is really rigorous. I know that lots of people say it is boring, but it is really solid and I want that solid math foundation for my kids. That is the one thing I really worry about with Singapore math. It is so new and I know kids in Singapore do great, but I really think that might have a lot to do with their culture and the emphasis put on math. I have also read that the teachers there are very highly trained so that makes a difference as well. I would love to hear your feelings on Saxon. I feel really comfortable that you can't go wrong with Saxon.

[Spy Car]

We are using McRuffy Color Math K. The more we use it, the more I love it! DS5 is learning a lot and it is a fun program. However, I can't stop looking at posts about Singapore Math. I know people swear by it and I am sure I would love it, but should I make the switch? Could we do the IP and CWP without doing the main text? Should you ever switch when something is working so well for you? Thanks in advance for the advice!

 

If your son is enjoying the whole-parts math in Miquon (as I gather from other posts of yours that he is) I would definately consider adding Singapore Math. This program is really hard to beat for developing the whole-parts approach he is learning with C Rods and Miquon into a rigiorus math problem-solving model and method.

 

I know nothing about McRuffy (so no judgement on it one way or another) but Primary Mathematics is a very strong program. It is also efficient enough that one can add supplementation if the math-bug hits and you want to do additional things.

 

Combining Miquon and Singapore adds synergy, the combo is greater than the sum of the parts.

 

Bill

[janainaz]

How do you like Saxon? I was planning on using them starting in 4th grade. I like that it is really rigorous. I know that lots of people say it is boring, but it is really solid and I want that solid math foundation for my kids. That is the one thing I really worry about with Singapore math. It is so new and I know kids in Singapore do great, but I really think that might have a lot to do with their culture and the emphasis put on math. I have also read that the teachers there are very highly trained so that makes a difference as well. I would love to hear your feelings on Saxon. I feel really comfortable that you can't go wrong with Saxon.

 

 

I love Saxon math. It's a solid math program, and I particularly like it because it continues to revisit previously learned concepts every lesson. Six years ago, I compared three math programs, and I chose Saxon because it clicked with me in the area of teaching. No, it's not colorful, and it does not look 'fun', but it is an exceptional curriculum. Many people complain about the repetition, but from my understanding, it's necessary to lay a proper foundation. It does seem to be a year behind - Saxon 1 feels more like K math to me, and so on.

 

My only complaint, and it's not necessarily about Saxon math, but my son has a math brain, and he has never been challenged. Every book seems to be review for him. I am ok in math - enough to teach Algebra, but then I'm done. I'd like to supplement with something to make math more exciting for him - if that's possible!

[cuckoomamma]

I agree with those who said that because you're still so early, it's not as if you're really switching. Sometimes things work, but they aren't going to go where you want them to go. I think you have to define what "working" means. I'm not familiar with the curr you're using, but have loved Singapore.

 

I wouldn't start Singapore with the K, wait until he's ready for the 1a. The books are inexpensive enough that if you aren't happy, you wouldn't feel so bad. I wouldn't be comfortable knowing I had to switch later on because the math program I was using didn't continue past third.

 

I just think that working with K and working with first may be entirely different.

[ehommel]

I wouldn't switch. There are so many good curriculums out there. It is easy to get overwhelmed. Specially if it works!

[momma aimee]

We are using McRuffy Color Math K. The more we use it, the more I love it! DS5 is learning a lot and it is a fun program. However, I can't stop looking at posts about Singapore Math. I know people swear by it and I am sure I would love it, but should I make the switch? Could we do the IP and CWP without doing the main text? Should you ever switch when something is working so well for you? Thanks in advance for the advice!

 

i my my limited opin ion -- if it ain't broke, don't try to fix it :D

[grace'smom]

I don't know if anyone has mentioned this, but would it be a good compromise to try Math Mammoth as a supplement? Aren't they similar programs?

 

Ducking my head in case there are strong opinions about that, LOL.

[Mimm]

No, I would not switch unless I had an actual problem with the curriculum. Even if it was serious doubts that it was covering everything I wanted it to, or as challenges as I felt my kids needed it to be. There is always another program out there which may be fun and interesting and provide something new. If I switched every time something new came along, we would curriculum hop all the time.

[NanceXToo]

I definitely wouldn't. If we're enjoying something and it's working, we stick with it.

[gracyomalley]

No need to switch - but I would not be afraid to do so if the need came up - the best thing we have done for math was to "change it up" a bit! You don't have to change what's working, but kids really "get math" if they have to learn it a few different ways - and doing some of different programs does that! It means you really have to teach some of it - but a kids who really understands will do so even if the wording and scope and sequence is different - so DO NOT FEAR MATH CHANGE!!!!

 

We hated saxon. We love Mammoth Math - its hard but very solid. NOT self teaching here! We supplement with Teaching Textbooks (at higher than grade level) for a review, and other stuff too. I am not in a hurry to finish math with them, so we often do a couple levels of the same stuff - in different forms.

 

Your child is young, stick with what's working and if you start to feel that its not, then worry about "changing" - supplement if you wish...

Erin

[Haiku]

Since your son is in K, I think you could switch no problem. HOWEVER! I don't think you should if your current program is working. If your son is enjoying it and you are satisfied, well ... don't fix it if it ain't broke, ya know?

 

Full disclosure: I HATE Singapore. But I love Math Mammoth and would give you the same advice if you were contemplating switching to that.

 

Tara

[TheAutumnOak]

I think the only real issue is whether you should switch now or later...If what you are using only goes up to the 3rd grade level, you will have to switch either now or later...If this was a question of continuing with what you are using or switching and both programs went into higher levels, then I would say stay with what works...You will have to switch eventually, so if you are interested in using Singapore for the elementary years, why not switch now and get your child use to that program?...Your child is still so young that the effects of switching really won't apply...

[kristinannie]

Since your son is in K, I think you could switch no problem. HOWEVER! I don't think you should if your current program is working. If your son is enjoying it and you are satisfied, well ... don't fix it if it ain't broke, ya know?

 

Full disclosure: I HATE Singapore. But I love Math Mammoth and would give you the same advice if you were contemplating switching to that.

 

Tara

 

 

Why do you hate Singapore?

[boscopup]

I think the only real issue is whether you should switch now or later...If what you are using only goes up to the 3rd grade level, you will have to switch either now or later...If this was a question of continuing with what you are using or switching and both programs went into higher levels, then I would say stay with what works...You will have to switch eventually, so if you are interested in using Singapore for the elementary years, why not switch now and get your child use to that program?...Your child is still so young that the effects of switching really won't apply...

 

I agree. If you're going to switch to Singapore at some point, switching in 1st grade would be "starting at the beginning" (because K math really doesn't matter what you use - 1st grade math doesn't depend on anything from K math, except that they can write numbers and count, which all K math programs do). Switching in 4th grade would be way more difficult, because by then, Singapore is deep into the bar diagrams and mental math techniques that McRuffy may or may not teach (I haven't looked at the program, so I don't know what it teaches). Now if you've been using IP and CWP from grade 1, it might not be so bad of a switch, as long as you're able to figure out how to teach the material in IP/CWP that isn't covered by McRuffy.

 

Singapore is the type of program that it really is best to start at grade 1 if you can, rather than waiting until 4th grade. Way less stressful on you AND the child to start at the beginning.

[Spy Car]

I agree. If you're going to switch to Singapore at some point, switching in 1st grade would be "starting at the beginning" (because K math really doesn't matter what you use - 1st grade math doesn't depend on anything from K math, except that they can write numbers and count, which all K math programs do). Switching in 4th grade would be way more difficult, because by then, Singapore is deep into the bar diagrams and mental math techniques that McRuffy may or may not teach (I haven't looked at the program, so I don't know what it teaches). Now if you've been using IP and CWP from grade 1, it might not be so bad of a switch, as long as you're able to figure out how to teach the material in IP/CWP that isn't covered by McRuffy.

 

Singapore is the type of program that it really is best to start at grade 1 if you can, rather than waiting until 4th grade. Way less stressful on you AND the child to start at the beginning.

 

:iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree:

 

Anyone figured out that I agree?

 

One of the beauty-parts of Singapore is the incremental build. There is a Model and a Method that builds and builds. If one is going to use this program it is best to start at the very beginning (perhaps with a Miquon introduction as the OP is doing).

 

Switch now! And make your life easy.

 

Bill

[kristinannie]

:iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree:

 

Anyone figured out that I agree?

 

One of the beauty-parts of Singapore is the incremental build. There is a Model and a Method that builds and builds. If one is going to use this program it is best to start at the very beginning (perhaps with a Miquon introduction as the OP is doing).

 

Switch now! And make your life easy.

 

Bill

 

 

:lol::lol::lol:

[Satori]

Switch now, switch now! :D

 

We started Singapore at age 6 after trying 3 different math programs for ages 4-5. I don't consider it "switching" when you are transitioning from PreK/K to First Grade math. Singapore is working out so well! So glad we started.

[TheAutumnOak]

I agree. If you're going to switch to Singapore at some point, switching in 1st grade would be "starting at the beginning" (because K math really doesn't matter what you use - 1st grade math doesn't depend on anything from K math, except that they can write numbers and count, which all K math programs do). Switching in 4th grade would be way more difficult, because by then, Singapore is deep into the bar diagrams and mental math techniques that McRuffy may or may not teach (I haven't looked at the program, so I don't know what it teaches). Now if you've been using IP and CWP from grade 1, it might not be so bad of a switch, as long as you're able to figure out how to teach the material in IP/CWP that isn't covered by McRuffy.

 

Singapore is the type of program that it really is best to start at grade 1 if you can, rather than waiting until 4th grade. Way less stressful on you AND the child to start at the beginning.

 

:iagree:

[WishboneDawn]

We are using McRuffy Color Math K. The more we use it, the more I love it! DS5 is learning a lot and it is a fun program. However, I can't stop looking at posts about Singapore Math. I know people swear by it and I am sure I would love it, but should I make the switch? Could we do the IP and CWP without doing the main text? Should you ever switch when something is working so well for you? Thanks in advance for the advice!

 

Nope and I'm a Singapore fanatic.

 

I've used a similar analogy before but right now you're married to Hugh Jackman and the relationship is fantastic. Why toss that out because George Clooney keeps winking at you? It's Hugh Jackman and he's crazy about you! Stay the course woman!!!

[kristinannie]

Nope and I'm a Singapore fanatic.

 

I've used a similar analogy before but right now you're married to Hugh Jackman and the relationship is fantastic. Why toss that out because George Clooney keeps winking at you? It's Hugh Jackman and he's crazy about you! Stay the course woman!!!

 

 

:D

[Spy Car]

Oh brother :rolleyes:

 

Bill

[boscopup]

I've used a similar analogy before but right now you're married to Hugh Jackman and the relationship is fantastic. Why toss that out because George Clooney keeps winking at you? It's Hugh Jackman and he's crazy about you! Stay the course woman!!!

 

But what if Hugh Jackman is planning to leave you in 3 years, and George Clooney will be married by then? ;)

[WishboneDawn]

But what if Hugh Jackman is planning to leave you in 3 years, and George Clooney will be married by then? ;)

 

*sigh* That's where the Old Spice man comes in. :001_wub:

[WishboneDawn]

Oh brother :rolleyes:

 

Bill

 

:lol:

[grace'smom]

But what if Hugh Jackman is planning to leave you in 3 years, and George Clooney will be married by then? ;)

 

:lol::lol::lol:

I knew there was a reason why I came back from dinner and checked the forums, LOL.

[boscopup]

*sigh* That's where the Old Spice man comes in. :001_wub:

 

What if George Clooney is wearing a kilt?!?

[WishboneDawn]

What if George Clooney is wearing a kilt?!?

 

Sorry but the Old Spice man wears a towel. That beats a kilt any day. :D

[Haiku]

Why do you hate Singapore?

 

Because it's weirdy. :D I used Singapore with my oldest child, who is now 17. We used the first four or five books, I believe. It was confusing, the explanations were brief, and there wasn't nearly enough practice. The pictures made zero sense to my dd. I was able to understand how Singapore was teaching, but my dd wasn't, at all. It made no sense to her.

 

Many people say that Math Mammoth is very similar to Singapore. I can't really say because it's been such a long time since I used Singapore, but I can say that MM makes complete sense AND has plenty of practice.

 

Tara

[Spy Car]

Singapore looks über-conventional next to Miquon ;) :D

 

Bill

[twoxcell]

Your child is in K? I think you can switch easily at that age. I wouldn't feel like I was locked in to a curriculum with a 5 year old. Now when you get further into elementary it becomes much harder to switch, because of scope and sequence. I would say now is an ideal time to switch if something else appeals to you. I switched my ds from Horizons to SM after 1st grade with no issues at all. Horizons was working fine for him, but I wanted something different.

[shinyhappypeople]

:iagree: I really want to be settled on a program by 1st grade for better or for worse. Right now, McRuffy only goes to 3rd grade! I was planning on switching to Saxon 5/4, but I am rethinking that!

 

McRuffy goes up to 4th grade, actually. AFAIK, the plans are to continue to 6th grade, which would be ready by the time your child hits that age.

Edited July 16, 2011 by shinyhappypeople

[Mallory]

I think most of the points made are good. If you decide to switch, I don't think it is really switching, if you decide to stay that is good too.

 

But I don't agree with this-

 

Singapore is the type of program that it really is best to start at grade 1 if you can, rather than waiting until 4th grade. Way less stressful on you AND the child to start at the beginning.

 

We started in 4th grade, with no formal math earlier then that (some Miquon and math lab), and it worked just fine. In fact I think it probably worked better then sitting down to math workbook for the 4 years before that.

[Spy Car]

I think most of the points made are good. If you decide to switch, I don't think it is really switching, if you decide to stay that is good too.

 

But I don't agree with this-

 

 

 

We started in 4th grade, with no formal math earlier then that (some Miquon and math lab), and it worked just fine. In fact I think it probably worked better then sitting down to math workbook for the 4 years before that.

 

The thing is if you were using Miquon you were using whole-parts math. So the "transition" was from one program using the same basic method (despite some differences of style and sequence) to another. That is very different that coming in cold.

 

Bill

[MamaChristina]

There is no reason why you can't do both! Oh, and btw, McRuffy just came out with Color Math 4. They are going to go through 6th grade. I've used Singapore and McRuffy both. McRuffy lessons are so short and effective that it would be very easy to do Singapore as well....at least for this year to see if it's for you. It isn't for everyone and neither is any other math program. If you are both having fun with McRuffy I'd say continue with it.:)

[Spy Car]

There is no reason why you can't do both! Oh, and btw, McRuffy just came out with Color Math 4. They are going to go through 6th grade. I've used Singapore and McRuffy both. McRuffy lessons are so short and effective that it would be very easy to do Singapore as well....at least for this year to see if it's for you. It isn't for everyone and neither is any other math program. If you are both having fun with McRuffy I'd say continue with it.:)

 

The lessons in Singapore (and Miquon) are short and effective as well. Seeing math from different perspectives is a good thing. There is no reason one couldn't do a combination of different programs. We did.

 

Bill