The science behind reading all day

[ElizabethB]

Reading all day is good for you...if you are not reading leveled readers!

 

I was re-looking at some things on the Matthew effect last night, it is an interesting topic. Basically, if you read 65 minutes a day (the 98th percentile), you are exposed to over 4 million words per year. For those at the 10th percentile, they read .1 minutes per day and are exposed to 8,000 words per year, those at the 30th percentile read 1.3 minutes per day, and are exposed to 106,000 words per year.

 

Here are Stanovich's papers and an interesting video he did for Children of the Code, "

?"

 

Leveled readers control vocabulary so you are not getting many new words. Here is an example of common leveled readers used in schools. Many abridged editions of things also dumb down the vocabulary, that's just one reason to avoid them! (I love the language and lyricism in unabridged editions of great works.)

 

My "Why Johnny Doesn't Like to Read" page has, about 1/3 of the way down, a section entitled "The Hidden Nature of the Reading Problem and its Impact on Vocabulary Development" which explains why and how whole word teaching has dumbed down many texts and compares something Stanovich talked about, "Lexical rarity," of the KJV to the NIV, with a linked pdf that shows this lexical difference with colors.

 

So, read away! (Just read real books!!)

 

(Of course, there has to be some math and a few other subjects eventually! :))

Edited February 10, 2011 by ElizabethB

[AngelBee]

:lurk5: Markng to read in a bit

[jplain]

Real books, I completely agree. But I'm frustrated, because I worry that few recently published books for younger readers are real. I suspect they all have controlled vocabulary and grammatical complexity.

 

I think it was here that I read a theory about the sentence fragment nonsense in Magic Tree House books. The fragments result in shorter sentences, which earn the books a lower reading level. If Pope Osborne is dumbing down the writing in her books, it seems likely that others are too.

 

Of course the local library is under pressure to carry the books that are popular with kids, so they are rapidly moving out real books and replacing them with insipid series.

[melissel]

Real books, I completely agree. But I'm frustrated, because I worry that few recently published books for younger readers are real. I suspect they all have controlled vocabulary and grammatical complexity.

 

I think it was here that I read a theory about the sentence fragment nonsense in Magic Tree House books. The fragments result in shorter sentences, which earn the books a lower reading level. If Pope Osborne is dumbing down the writing in her books, it seems likely that others are too.

 

Of course the local library is under pressure to carry the books that are popular with kids, so they are rapidly moving out real books and replacing them with insipid series.

 

I agree, though the sentence fragment thing in the Osborne books was only in the first several books. Thankfully, they stopped doing that!

 

But yes, I hate leveled readers. Elizabeth, that's great research, thank you for sharing it. DD8 reads at least an hour day, often two or three, and at a high level, so I'm glad to hear it's scientifically worthwhile :D

[lovetobehome]

So, if I am having a bad day, I can just tell my kids to sit on the couch all day and read, and we are set? Check that off as a day of school?

[Mejane]

I suspected as much. ;) Thanks for the corroboration.

[Tabrett]

Is there a list of book that are not leveled designed for new readers? I know Dr.Seuss books were written with the Dolch list. That makes it leveled, right?

 

What about Frog and Toad, Mouse Tales or Amelia Badelia? Are they leveled readers?

 

How do you not use a leveled reader until dc are reading fluently and without help?

 

What are good beginning readers?

[Virg]

Love it! Thanks for sharing! I have long been telling people that reading makes you smart. My kids always ask how I know something I am telling them and the answer invariably is "I read it!" :)

[jplain]

 

How do you not use a leveled reader until dc are reading fluently and without help?

 

What are good beginning readers?

My inclination is to go ahead and use leveled readers while still teaching phonics, and then wean off of them as reading confidence increases. This happened naturally with older DD. And carefully chosen read-alouds provided exposure to new vocabulary and complex sentence structures.

[Shellydon]

Thank you for posting this!

[Farrar]

Real books, I completely agree. But I'm frustrated, because I worry that few recently published books for younger readers are real. I suspect they all have controlled vocabulary and grammatical complexity.

 

I think it was here that I read a theory about the sentence fragment nonsense in Magic Tree House books. The fragments result in shorter sentences, which earn the books a lower reading level. If Pope Osborne is dumbing down the writing in her books, it seems likely that others are too.

 

Of course the local library is under pressure to carry the books that are popular with kids, so they are rapidly moving out real books and replacing them with insipid series.

 

Hm... I find that the quality of *some* early reader offerings is increasing actually. Some of this is probably due to the Geisel Award being created a few years ago (if you award it, they'll write for it). Obviously, there are a lot of really cruddy early readers out there - in particular (but not limited to) all the marketing tie in books for Disney, Nickelodeon, etc.

 

However, I think there are plenty of good "real" books for newish readers. Older classics like Frog and Toad, but also lots of newer series like Henry and Mudge, The High-Rise Private Eyes, Poppleton, Mouse and Mole, Cowgirl Kate and Cocoa, Elephant and Piggie... They all have limited vocabulary, yes, but you can't just give most 6 year olds War and Peace or even The Secret Garden.

 

I know Elizabeth B is generally against leveled readers. I have a frustration with leveled readers like the BOB books, though we did use various things in that category somewhat. Elizabeth, do you include books like Frog and Toad in that as well? To me, while the vocabulary in those books is limited, the stories go beyond that to be funny and even poignant. I think that makes them "real" books and very different.

[ElizabethB]

Real books, I completely agree. But I'm frustrated, because I worry that few recently published books for younger readers are real. I suspect they all have controlled vocabulary and grammatical complexity.

 

I think it was here that I read a theory about the sentence fragment nonsense in Magic Tree House books. The fragments result in shorter sentences, which earn the books a lower reading level. If Pope Osborne is dumbing down the writing in her books, it seems likely that others are too.

 

Of course the local library is under pressure to carry the books that are popular with kids, so they are rapidly moving out real books and replacing them with insipid series.

:iagree:

 

They are selling most of the good books, I love library sales, but it is bad for current patrons. They do keep a couple of classics and real books, but they are becoming fewer and fewer.

 

 

But yes, I hate leveled readers. Elizabeth, that's great research, thank you for sharing it. DD8 reads at least an hour day, often two or three, and at a high level, so I'm glad to hear it's scientifically worthwhile :D

 

:D :lol::lol:

 

So, if I am having a bad day, I can just tell my kids to sit on the couch all day and read, and we are set? Check that off as a day of school?

 

:001_smile: Yes, I would. But, the lawyers and box checkers probably don't if you're in a high regulation state. Maybe add in 1 minute of math so you can check off that box!!

 

I suspected as much. ;) Thanks for the corroboration.

 

You're welcome!!

[Rosie_0801]

Ha ha! I always thought my dad was wrong when he said I read too much.

 

:D

 

Rosie

[ElizabethB]

Is there a list of book that are not leveled designed for new readers? I know Dr.Seuss books were written with the Dolch list. That makes it leveled, right?

 

What about Frog and Toad, Mouse Tales or Amelia Badelia? Are they leveled readers?

 

How do you not use a leveled reader until dc are reading fluently and without help?

 

What are good beginning readers?

 

Some of the Seuss books were written with the Dolch list, some weren't.

 

Most books from before 1930 will not be leveled, and some books after that are fine. Also, there are well written leveled readers, and a few of them early on won't kill you. It's just when that is all you read that it becomes a problem...you are then never exposed to large quantities of new vocabulary.

 

Hm... I find that the quality of *some* early reader offerings is increasing actually. Some of this is probably due to the Geisel Award being created a few years ago (if you award it, they'll write for it). Obviously, there are a lot of really cruddy early readers out there - in particular (but not limited to) all the marketing tie in books for Disney, Nickelodeon, etc.

 

However, I think there are plenty of good "real" books for newish readers. Older classics like Frog and Toad, but also lots of newer series like Henry and Mudge, The High-Rise Private Eyes, Poppleton, Mouse and Mole, Cowgirl Kate and Cocoa, Elephant and Piggie... They all have limited vocabulary, yes, but you can't just give most 6 year olds War and Peace or even The Secret Garden.

 

I know Elizabeth B is generally against leveled readers. I have a frustration with leveled readers like the BOB books, though we did use various things in that category somewhat. Elizabeth, do you include books like Frog and Toad in that as well? To me, while the vocabulary in those books is limited, the stories go beyond that to be funny and even poignant. I think that makes them "real" books and very different.

 

If you enjoy the stories, a few are OK. I personally hate the sentence structure and don't really enjoy any leveled readers, although I do like Oh, David, a series which uses maybe 10 different words throughout the whole book.

 

I let my daughter read board books when she was in K after she finished Webster's Speller, they are written for the parent to read to a child, so have good sentence structure and a fair amount of vocabulary, but have large print and not too many words on a page to be intimidating.

 

It is hard to find good books for that age--a list of "real" books that are favorites would be great!! I will be looking for some soon for my son, right now all he can read is the I See Sam books, and I'm limiting those, they do make him guess a bit, but he likes to read them occasionally.

 

I do like the I See Sam books better than most early readers. Also, the old Open Court stories were very good. They start with long vowels, you can make a much better story with long vowels. They also re-wrote a lot of classic tales so you weren't reading twaddle.

[teachmejoy]

I was an avid reader growing up and I think my ds is leaning that direction. I was just thinking about switching him to more "chapter book" style reading instead of readers. I'm so glad you posted this! It has given me some things to think about. I LOVE BOOKS!! :D

[Barb_]

I was an avid reader growing up and I think my ds is leaning that direction. I was just thinking about switching him to more "chapter book" style reading instead of readers. I'm so glad you posted this! It has given me some things to think about. I LOVE BOOKS!! :D

 

A nice stepping stone between readers and chapter books are picture books meant to be read by an adult to a child. The sentence structure is more complex and the vocabulary is at a higher level than early chapter books. They are often more interesting. Yet they can be read in one sitting and younger children don't find them as intimidating.

 

"What good is a book without pictures?" -Alice in Wonderland

[gardening momma]

Is there a list of book that are not leveled designed for new readers? I know Dr.Seuss books were written with the Dolch list. That makes it leveled, right?

 

What about Frog and Toad, Mouse Tales or Amelia Badelia? Are they leveled readers?

 

How do you not use a leveled reader until dc are reading fluently and without help?

 

What are good beginning readers?

Exactly what I was wondering.

[gardening momma]

I do like the I See Sam books better than most early readers. Also, the old Open Court stories were very good. They start with long vowels, you can make a much better story with long vowels. They also re-wrote a lot of classic tales so you weren't reading twaddle.

At my library, they separate the fiction and non-fiction early readers (well, any children's books are separated, really). All of the non-fiction children's books are in the adult non-fiction section of the library, shelved according to the Dewey decimal numbers. This means that most parents will not ever find the non-fiction books because they won't think to look outside of the children's room. Anyway, what I'm getting at is that I have been getting non-fiction early readers from the library. It takes a little research online to find them (I usually search Amazon and then see if my library has the title--my library's online search function isn't that great). So dd7 might be reading simpler words and sentences, but at least she's reading educational stuff. Today she read about stars, going into outer space, and an assortment of animals. I still have a good stack of non-fiction books for her to read.

[lisamarie]

Would this apply to reading abridged texts? For example, I wanted DS to read Robinson Crusoe. I checked out the original text book and it was a struggle for me to get through, no way could DS7 read it. So I gave him a children's classic version. I do read more challenging books as read alouds but not for him to read by himself.

[zusjames]

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing this. :D

[lovetobehome]

Can you just summarize all that, or are we actually supposed to READ all of it? ROFL! :lol:

Seriously, I read the links, very interesting stuff...sad, too. The question is, do I send this on to my neighbor who is a reading specialist in the schools? She came over once to test my son, just to make sure I'm doing a good job with the homeschooling, you know. HA!

[Cedarmom]

So, if I am having a bad day, I can just tell my kids to sit on the couch all day and read, and we are set? Check that off as a day of school?

 

Truthfully...Yes!! My ds is in college now . When we homeschooled, we did occasionally(especially in the younger years before high school) take days off and just read. Now, guess what the stuff he most rememeber is? The books he read on his days off>:001_smile:

[Mom-ninja.]

So, if I am having a bad day, I can just tell my kids to sit on the couch all day and read, and we are set? Check that off as a day of school?

 

Absolutely!

 

A nice stepping stone between readers and chapter books are picture books meant to be read by an adult to a child. The sentence structure is more complex and the vocabulary is at a higher level than early chapter books. They are often more interesting. Yet they can be read in one sitting and younger children don't find them as intimidating.

 

"What good is a book without pictures?" -Alice in Wonderland

 

That's a good idea. My first grader balks at chapter books even though he can read them. They are too long and have too few pictures so he declares that they are "too hard." He is a very good reader but doesn't have confidence yet.

 

Truthfully...Yes!! My ds is in college now . When we homeschooled, we did occasionally(especially in the younger years before high school) take days off and just read. Now, guess what the stuff he most rememeber is? The books he read on his days off>:001_smile:

 

So sweet.

 

 

Are the book lists on Sonlight considered level readers?

 

 

Oh, this is a good place to put this. A few days ago I posted about reading The Swiss Family Robinson aloud to the boys. I was frustrated and wondering if I should continue. I had to explain every other word, and my 7 yr old especially was complaining. I asked them if they wanted me to read something else. My 10 yr old said no, and I convinced my 7 yr old to just go along. Well, I'm happy to say that they are actually liking the book now. My oldest asks me to read from it every day. Even my middle ds has stopped complaining. I still stop and explain words, and I've noticed that my oldest can usually figure out what a word means. I'm glad that I continued reading it. Although at this pace it will take a long time to complete. :001_smile:

[ElizabethB]

Ha ha! I always thought my dad was wrong when he said I read too much.

 

:D

 

Rosie

 

:D I knew you were a kindred spirit!

 

I was an avid reader growing up and I think my ds is leaning that direction. I was just thinking about switching him to more "chapter book" style reading instead of readers. I'm so glad you posted this! It has given me some things to think about. I LOVE BOOKS!! :D

:iagree:

Me, too. That's why I got started tutoring and what led to me homeschooling at first. (Seeing all those poor children who couldn't read because of the way they were being taught in most schools.)

 

A nice stepping stone between readers and chapter books are picture books meant to be read by an adult to a child. The sentence structure is more complex and the vocabulary is at a higher level than early chapter books. They are often more interesting. Yet they can be read in one sitting and younger children don't find them as intimidating.

 

:iagree:

They don't bother controlling vocabulary for most picture books.

 

Seriously, I read the links, very interesting stuff...sad, too. The question is, do I send this on to my neighbor who is a reading specialist in the schools? She came over once to test my son, just to make sure I'm doing a good job with the homeschooling, you know. HA!

 

I would try.

 

She's not likely to listen, but you never know. It is sad. From my testing of hundreds of students in my 17 years of tutoring, most schools fail to teach about 30% of their students to read well, homeschoolers fall around 5% or less, and many of those have underlying difficulties and would have made even less progress in a school that taught with balanced literacy.

[ElizabethB]

Would this apply to reading abridged texts? For example, I wanted DS to read Robinson Crusoe. I checked out the original text book and it was a struggle for me to get through, no way could DS7 read it. So I gave him a children's classic version. I do read more challenging books as read alouds but not for him to read by himself.

 

Some of them are more rigidly dumbed down than others. For a 7 year old, an abridged classic to read on their own is fine, though.

 

 

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing this. :D

 

You're welcome!

 

Are the book lists on Sonlight considered level readers?

 

 

The readers section looks to be. They mention controlled vocabulary and have little numbers on the books. I haven't personally seen them, though, I would have to look at them to tell.

 

Oh, this is a good place to put this. A few days ago I posted about reading The Swiss Family Robinson aloud to the boys. I was frustrated and wondering if I should continue. I had to explain every other word, and my 7 yr old especially was complaining. I asked them if they wanted me to read something else. My 10 yr old said no, and I convinced my 7 yr old to just go along. Well, I'm happy to say that they are actually liking the book now. My oldest asks me to read from it every day. Even my middle ds has stopped complaining. I still stop and explain words, and I've noticed that my oldest can usually figure out what a word means. I'm glad that I continued reading it. Although at this pace it will take a long time to complete. :001_smile:

 

Cool!! I'm glad you persevered and it's working.

 

Slow and steady wins the race, you'll get there.

 

I had read an abridged version many years ago and didn't like it much. A few years ago I read the original, I can't wait until my 5 year old is a bit older so he can enjoy it, it is so much richer in the original. (Well, they are all translations, but the original unabridged translation before they starting dumbing down translations.)

[Isabella]

Totally agree with this thread...interesting in the light of Peela's thread about her son's observations of his beginning high school, and the lack of interest/ability in reading.

 

I think the best term of school that we ever had was when I was suffering a bit of burn-out, and we just read...(the book was A Girl Called Disaster). We read for hours, then looked at the map to see where Nhamo was at at that point in the book - and had endless conversations about all sorts of issues that were raised. I got over my burn-out, and the kids learnt so much! Reading was not a waste of time at all.

[unsinkable]

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing this. :D

 

Welcome to the boards!

[angela in ohio]

Real books, I completely agree. But I'm frustrated, because I worry that few recently published books for younger readers are real. I suspect they all have controlled vocabulary and grammatical complexity.

 

Yep. Our motto is to "read real books, real OLD books." :D

[kathkath]

I learned about this while working on my masters degree. The take-home here is to get children to choose to read, to love to read. Make it fun, don't push them too hard early. Tempt them with good books. Give them choices. Let them stay up late to read. If controlled readers are what they need early on to feel successful, so be it. You can always lead them to greener pastures when they are hooked.

[melissel]

Oh, this is a good place to put this. A few days ago I posted about reading The Swiss Family Robinson aloud to the boys. I was frustrated and wondering if I should continue. I had to explain every other word, and my 7 yr old especially was complaining. I asked them if they wanted me to read something else. My 10 yr old said no, and I convinced my 7 yr old to just go along. Well, I'm happy to say that they are actually liking the book now. My oldest asks me to read from it every day. Even my middle ds has stopped complaining. I still stop and explain words, and I've noticed that my oldest can usually figure out what a word means. I'm glad that I continued reading it. Although at this pace it will take a long time to complete. :001_smile:

 

I'm not hugely fond of Jim Weiss, but DD8 and I listened to his version of The Swiss Family Robinson and really enjoyed it. His accent is great, and while I feel he reads too fast on the SOTW CDs, for this he goes at a more appropriate pace. Just in case you get tired of reading it... :D

[love2read]

Thanks for the links!

[jplain]

A nice stepping stone between readers and chapter books are picture books meant to be read by an adult to a child. The sentence structure is more complex and the vocabulary is at a higher level than early chapter books. They are often more interesting. Yet they can be read in one sitting and younger children don't find them as intimidating.

:iagree:

They don't bother controlling vocabulary for most picture books.

This is such a great idea. I need to incorporate this more deliberately in my planning.

 

We've been doing this accidentally for a few months. My 7yo will pick up picture books that I was planning to read aloud for SOTW, and reads them to herself. For example, she loved The Hero and the Minotaur (Lexile AD1050L), and needed help only with pronouncing the Greek names and a few words she knows but hadn't seen in print before (like abyss). I was amazed, as her usual reading material is in the range of 500L-600L, but those books tend to be chapter books. I had no idea that she was ready to tackle text as challenging as The Hero and the Minotaur. I guess it makes sense that the shorter length and illustrations helped keep her attention.

 

ElizabethB: Out of curiosity, what do you think of Lexile scores? I haven't researched the methodology behind the scoring, but I've found the numbers useful at times....

Edited February 11, 2011 by jplain

[ElizabethB]

ElizabethB: Out of curiosity, what do you think of Lexile scores? I haven't researched the methodology behind the scoring, but I've found the numbers useful at times....

 

I'd heard of them, but never used them. I like the "find a book" feature, my daughter likes animals and mysteries, it's fun to see what pops up in different lexile levels.

 

That being said, they are designed more for people trained with balanced literacy methods. A well taught phonics child, even when young, should be able to read any lexile level as long as it is in their interest area and there is not too much small print and too many words on the page.

 

You just need to teach some sort of syllable division (megawords, my syllable division rules, Webster's Speller, etc.) and keep working on having them read aloud from challenging books so you can catch exceptions.

 

I also like syllable divided books, they are a good bridge between easy readers and real books. The Lives of the Presidents is especially good because the stories are short.

[Mom-ninja.]

I'm not hugely fond of Jim Weiss, but DD8 and I listened to his version of The Swiss Family Robinson and really enjoyed it. His accent is great, and while I feel he reads too fast on the SOTW CDs, for this he goes at a more appropriate pace. Just in case you get tired of reading it... :D

 

Oh, I forgot he has a CD for the story. I loved Jim Weiss and bought several CDs. However, now that I've discovered Jim Dale.....swoon. I love love love him. We are listening to everything we can performed by him.

[ondreeuh]

Well, it seems that early on, you have to choose-

 

1) Readers with limited vocabulary that can be sounded out phonetically.

 

2) "Real Books" with grown-up vocabulary that are generally too complex to be sounded out by a fledgling reader, and thus are read as whole-word readers.

 

I thought the whole point of teaching phonics and avoiding teaching words by sight was to develop a strong ability to sound out words. If you give your emerging reader a book full of words they can't yet sound out, then aren't you going backwards? That is why leveled readers are even created! To give kids words that they have the phonetic tools to read, so they do not have to resort to guessing.

 

I cringe at some of the dumb books geared for young kids, but the answer isn't to choose books without any control over the vocabulary. There are plenty of kids, like my own middle child, who took a long time to learn to read. He has greatly benefited from reading so-called leveled readers. His word bank grew gradually, not overnight!

[ElizabethB]

Well, it seems that early on, you have to choose-

 

1) Readers with limited vocabulary that can be sounded out phonetically.

 

2) "Real Books" with grown-up vocabulary that are generally too complex to be sounded out by a fledgling reader, and thus are read as whole-word readers.

 

I thought the whole point of teaching phonics and avoiding teaching words by sight was to develop a strong ability to sound out words. If you give your emerging reader a book full of words they can't yet sound out, then aren't you going backwards? That is why leveled readers are even created! To give kids words that they have the phonetic tools to read, so they do not have to resort to guessing.

 

I cringe at some of the dumb books geared for young kids, but the answer isn't to choose books without any control over the vocabulary. There are plenty of kids, like my own middle child, who took a long time to learn to read. He has greatly benefited from reading so-called leveled readers. His word bank grew gradually, not overnight!

 

There are 2 types of early reader books: decodable and leveled. Decodable are a way to build up decoding skills with sounds already learned. They are actually not based on limited vocabulary, but limited sounds, although, especially at early levels, that does result in a limited number of words. Leveled readers are based on high-frequency Dolch words and will contain many more words that an early phonics taught child cannot sound out than a decodable reader. They are used in the schools to build up sight word vocabulary and make the guessing situation worse.

 

There are also two types of situations:

 

learning to read and reading.

 

Once you learn to read well, it is important to be able to figure out which books have leveled vocabulary and try to choose as many books as possible that are not leveled so that you can learn new vocabulary and be exposed to a variety of sentence structures.

 

When you are learning to read, you should focus on sounding out words and an occasional decodable reader.

 

I personally don't use even many decodable readers, I just keep working on words and syllables until my children and students can sound out anything.

 

There are also syllable divided books, which are real books divided up into syllables for a beginning reader.

[ElizabethB]

Is there a list of book that are not leveled designed for new readers?

 

What are good beginning readers?

 

Decodable readers are good beginning readers.

 

Here are a few:

 

This list from Phonics Pathways.

 

The new AAR books and the Nora Gaydos books.

 

These books, all, however, are decodable based on teaching CVC words first.

 

If you use a different phonics sequence, your decodable readers will be different.

 

For example, the I See Sam series teaches CVC words along with I and me, he, and ee at first. So, their decodable sequence is different but you are still reading only things you have learned to sound out.

 

The old Open Court was decodable based on teaching long vowels first, their stories are great, you can make a much better story with long vowels.

 

Some of the people that wrote the Open Court series wrote School Phonics. Their decodable stories are also based on long vowels first and are better than the usual fare but are nowhere near as good as the old Open Court stories.