Wanted to share some thoughts about MFW and TOG

[Woodland_Mom]

I've made some comparisons between MFW and TOG and wanted to share some of my thoughts. Maybe this long post (sorry) will help someone else! :D

 

MFW spends more time on the ancient time period and TOG spends more time on modern times. Here’s the breakdown of what they cover:

 

MFW :

Creation to Christ

Rome to the reformation (ancient Rome, middle ages, renaissance & reformation)

Explorers to 1850

1850 to modern

Countries & Cultures (a geography, cultures & missions tour around the world)

 

TOG:

Creation to the fall of Rome

Fall of Rome to US Constitution (450 AD – 1787 AD)

US Constitution review through 19th century

20th century to modern times

 

Observations and experiences with MFW:

 

Planning: I have enjoyed MFW RtoR and like that it is all planned out for me. That was just what I needed this year! MFW lesson plans include Bible, history, science, latin vocabulary (some years), read-alouds, art, and music appreciation. There are usually some missionary books and/or light church history woven into the plans. You have the flexibility to use your choice of math, spelling, grammar, and writing. This means that you need to plan how you would like to integrate your writing assignments into other subjects. Their book basket approach provides parents with plenty of flexibility on “extra readingâ€. Each week, there is a list of books in the appendix that relate to other things you’re studying. Sometimes my library doesn’t have some of the books, but it has been easy enough to find alternatives. MFW schedules activities such as maps, timeline, notebooking and hands-on activities. I don't have to spend time deciding which activity to do--it's just scheduled. This I like! IMO, it is not too much and not too little. All of the worksheets, maps and timeline figures are in one place which make implementation a snap. The notebooking is very open-ended, allowing parents and students to get creative!

 

Teacher Notes: MFW has minimal teacher notes and they usually explain how to implement the assignments. There are occasional brief background notes. For the younger ages, I feel this is sufficient. I usually get more than enough information from the reading that I do with my children to provide them with explanations and connections across other subjects. MFW combines Charlotte Mason and classical education methods using a unit study approach. Everything that you do in a week ties together beautifully. This, of course, makes it easy to discuss and explain deeper connections with my children (especially since they are still young). I must say that I have THOROUGHLY enjoyed experiencing the integration of Bible, art, music appreciation, history, read-alouds and sometimes even science that is part of MFW’s lesson plans.

 

Discussion Questions: The MFW Rome to the Reformation package does not have comprehension questions or discussion questions that are part of the curriculum. SOTW is assigned(almost in its entirety) during the second semester, so I have used the discussion questions from the Activity Guide. (SOTW is used for each year except for Creation to Christ.) I have often wished that I had more guidance in the area of literature. I don’t usually have time to read the books my boys read, which leaves me with the inability to talk intelligently with them about their readings.

 

Read Alouds: MFW schedules historical fiction for their read alouds, which I like very much. Some of the books have been wonderful, and others were not hits with us. I am a box checker, so I have a hard time giving myself the liberty to just switch books, but I’m coming around. J Since there are no assignments/discussion questions, etc. that relate to the read aloud books, it is okay to substitute.

 

My Observations and experiences with TOG:

 

Planning: TOG includes history, literature, composition, read-alouds, vocabulary, music appreciaiton, philosophy, and government. Depending on the year, TOG also includes Bible or church history. TOG requires planning. It is not open and go. IMO, there is good and bad about this. If you don’t have time to plan, then it makes “getting history done†a little more challenging. But . . . when YOU are the one putting the finishing touches on the plan, then you have the ability to select resources & assignments that fit your family's needs. (Mama knows best, right?) J At first, the idea of planning seems daunting. I like idea of having the ability to customize your own school plans without having to do it from scratch! I’m discovering that I’m a tweaker at heart, so in that regard, TOG is appealing.

 

TOG provides a nice list of books to choose from to flesh out your history topic for the week. In additon, TOG has its own writing program, the writing assignments are integrated with your other studies. Very nice! We’ve been using IEW, so it seems that we’ll be able to follow that model quite easily, while utilizing some of the TOG writing aids and assignment suggestions.

 

One special thing about their program, is that a Biblical worldview is woven throughout all of your studies AND spelled out in teacher notes. I appreciate this a great deal! I also like having the ability to see resources that are suggested at the dialectic and rhetoric levels, because they could be helpful for me! As I guide my children through LG and UG assignments, I can easily read some of the dialectic or rhetoric assignments to get more depth. Or . . . if I don’t have time I can consult the handy-dandy teacher notes that are part of each unit.

 

Teacher Notes/Tools: There are many tools to use from the TOG package: map assignment suggestions, map aids, evaluations, vocabulary lists, timeline lists, hands-on projects, dramatic conversations, discussion questions & notes, background information, and much more. The resources are seemingly endless. I don’t necessarily feel that I need to review the world book encyclopedia notes in order to present basic material to my 2nd grader . . . but I see a HUGE value in them for a couple of reasons:

1. Self education – I get great info from reading along with my children, but deep concepts and difficult-to-understand topics are usually not covered in children’s sources. At a very minimum, it seems that I can only benefit from having an awareness of the deeper concepts that are part of our past.

2. The notes contain commentariee that help me to flesh out and explore Biblical worldviews that I can, in turn, share with my children.

 

 

I also appreciate the one page literature worksheets that are part of the program. At the LG and UG level they include comprehension questions, light thought questions, and light literary element "stuff" such as character, plot, setting, etc. The upper levels are in more involved and include lots of nice literary analysis.

 

Discussion Questions: All of the discussion outlines have a Biblical foundation. This is absolutely wonderful. The discussion questions are for dialectic and rhetoric students, so this is not something I will use immediately, but I have enjoyed being able to read them. One tool that I may use for my UG son would be the evaluations. Rather than use them as a “pencil & paper†test, I may use them as comprehension/thought questions.

 

Read Alouds: TOG seems to schedule about 2-3 books per unit, and not all of them are historical fiction. I tend to like the historical fiction much better than non-fiction during our read aloud time. I’d rather use the non-fiction titles for some of the in-depth reading.

 

My bottom line: Both TOG and MFW are excellent programs. MFW is great for someone who wants to teach K-8th together, and moves the highschooler into more independent studies. For someone who doesn’t want to plan, MFW would be a great choice. MFW integrates Bible lessons, history, music, art and even some science together nicely. MFW does still have a little flexibility for customization in the areas of notebooking, book basket, writing, math, spelling, foreign language, and grammar. They also have a schedule that lends itself to 4 or 5 day scheduling. If you want more choices, detailed background information in the teacher notes, evaluations, or the ability to keep ALL of your children together (K-12th), then TOG may work for you. TOG may be a good fit for the person who doesn’t mind planning or for someone who wants lots of customization. They integrate a Biblical worldview into history, fine arts, philosophy, government and literature. TOG has more tools that you can use in your curriculum and MFW offers select assignments to help you to cover history. Both are great programs!

[JaneP]

Thanks so much for this !

 

Since you have used both MFW and TOG....

Which one required more trips to the library?

 

Which curriculum was more expensive overall?

 

Jane

[Amy in KS]

I noticed on your blog that you've used VP as well. Can you add that to your comparison list? I use CC and now have come to like the VP cards. I'm using MFW now and enjoy it, but find it wonderful at times and repetitive or lacking at other times. I'm also not a fan of mfw art or music. My daughter LOVES to read and devours all the bookbasket books. Yet, I feel the VP curriculum might add more depth to our learning. I don't know if this is "grass is greener syndrome" or a desire to simplify. Advice?

[Woodland_Mom]

Thanks so much for this !

 

Since you have used both MFW and TOG....

Which one required more trips to the library?

 

Which curriculum was more expensive overall?

 

Jane

 

Unless you chose to buy a large number of books for either MFW or TOG, you really need to go to the library at least every two weeks to get books. (This will require planning ahead a little, of course!)

 

TOG is more expensive, even if you purchase a minimal number of books and plan to use the library extensively. You can purchase a MFW package for about $250 - $350 and that includes your books! TOG digital lesson plans cost about $170, and that doesn't include books. You can opt to purchase one unit (9-10 weeks of study) at a time for about $40. Many of their materials are optional, such as mapaids, writing aids, evaluations, etc.

[xiri]

Thank you so much for this post. We are going into our third year using MFW, and I really do like it. However, TOG has been calling out to me. Your comparison of the 2 programs answers a lot of my questions. Very helpful.

[Woodland_Mom]

I noticed on your blog that you've used VP as well. Can you add that to your comparison list? I use CC and now have come to like the VP cards. I'm using MFW now and enjoy it, but find it wonderful at times and repetitive or lacking at other times. I'm also not a fan of mfw art or music. My daughter LOVES to read and devours all the bookbasket books. Yet, I feel the VP curriculum might add more depth to our learning. I don't know if this is "grass is greener syndrome" or a desire to simplify. Advice?

 

A couple of differences to note between VP and MFW: The VP cards takes you through the study of western cultures only. MFW incluses an entire year of countries and cultures and their "regular" history years includes information beyond just the western hemisphere. For the most part, MFW works through a history spine, so there is a story narrative feel to your studies. VP is entirely topical. You work through one cared each week, adding resources and activities such as mapwork, hands-on, etc. to flesh out your topic. My children seemed to retain a little more with VP because you spend an entire week on one topic, but they enjoy the narrative format of SOTW & MFW.

VP uses wonderful resources--I love their catalog.

 

One of the things that I do is pull out our VP cards whenever they relate to our MFW studies. I also try to review recent material about once a month, so my kids don't forget the things they're learning as we go through our MFW lesson plans.

 

VP has a very nice 16 minute video that shows you how they recommend you use the program. Here is a link: http://resource2.veritaspress.com/ViewMovie.php

[JaneP]

Unless you chose to buy a large number of books for either MFW or TOG, you really need to go to the library at least every two weeks to get books. (This will require planning ahead a little, of course!)

 

TOG is more expensive, even if you purchase a minimal number of books and plan to use the library extensively. You can purchase a MFW package for about $250 - $350 and that includes your books! TOG digital lesson plans cost about $170, and that doesn't include books. You can opt to purchase one unit (9-10 weeks of study) at a time for about $40. Many of their materials are optional, such as mapaids, writing aids, evaluations, etc.

 

Yes, I suspected TOG would be more expensive but I've always been too scared to look into that closely (Not suggesting that the $$ isn't justified of course :001_smile:)

[Woodland_Mom]

Yes, I suspected TOG would be more expensive but I've always been too scared to look into that closely (Not suggesting that the $$ isn't justified of course :001_smile:)

 

If you felt drawn to use TOG, I think you could choose a couple of spine resources that are used over multiple weeks or most of the year and then use the library. TOG book resources include the library call numbers, making it easy to find everyting you'll need. MFW uses a small number of resources than many "boxed" curriculum providers, which makes their packages more economical. I think many people feel that you need to purchase tons of TOG resources. I just don't think that's necessary--especially if you need to watch your purse. FYI--the MFW TM alone is about $100. TOG's year plan is $170.

[JaneP]

If you felt drawn to use TOG, I think you could choose a couple of spine resources that are used over multiple weeks or most of the year and then use the library. TOG book resources include the library call numbers, making it easy to find everyting you'll need. MFW uses a small number of resources than many "boxed" curriculum providers, which makes their packages more economical. I think many people feel that you need to purchase tons of TOG resources. I just don't think that's necessary--especially if you need to watch your purse. FYI--the MFW TM alone is about $100. TOG's year plan is $170.

 

That is all very helpful information - thanks !

[Amy+2]

Great comparisons, Angela!

 

Reading this was soooo much easier than searching endlessly through threads!:)

 

I, too, have always been drawn to ToG. When it boils down to it though, I cannot rely on my library, and I am one of those who pretty much feels I HAVE to have all of the resources on hand.:tongue_smilie: Therefore, to me ToG is much more expensive and almost unjustifiable. It isn't that I don't have the money to spend on it, I am just really a "frugal frannie" and cannot bring myself to purchase all that ToG would require. I must admit though, there are days when I think to myself, just BUY IT!!

 

Thank you for posting this!

[cocoabean]

Thanks so much for the review and typing all of that out. It was very helpful.

 

I have a question. How does MFW differ in high school than in the lower grades as for implementing the program?

 

 

~Cocoa

[cbollin]

I have a question. How does MFW differ in high school than in the lower grades as for implementing the program?

 

 

~Cocoa

 

I'm only in the 2nd week of MFW high school. But have done MFW for many years (since 2003). and I decided to use MFW as written with their recommendations.

 

 

At high school level, MFW still has all of the lessons planned for you. I love that.

You might take a look at the sample lesson online to see the daily lesson planner, but it doesn't show you the insides of the books used to see the rest where the questions are. High school includes a lot of deeper thinking discussion questions via several of the books, not the daily lesson planner. There are extra notes and thinking points in the daily lesson planner. (I don't want to call it a teacher's manual at this level b/c the program encourages the student to be more responsible for the learning rather than the parent for the teaching. I'm still very much involved in my child's schooling, but the role shifts. My daughter is not off in a corner all day independent of all of us. My dh and I just have roles in high school years than we do in K-8.)

 

In younger years in MFW we did a lot of comprehension and discussion via narration (think: narration cube), and as the "Spirit leads", and in one year using SOTW vol. 4 activity guide. and in some subjects there were discussion questions in the assigned books too.

 

High school, there are other books to use for the questions in Bible and history. I like that the Bible comprehension and thinking questions for old testament are "just the questions", so that my child has to think about the answer and may not come up with an answer either just like real life. In history section, there are discussion questions with answer key, quizzes, etc. The student is encouraged to write answers for those questions so that parent/teacher can check and discuss together. It's almost like having an accountability partner the way it is done. Student does the work, has to check it off, stay on syllabus, etc. Then we get together and discuss. The daily lesson planner encourages parents to do the Bible reading as their own "quiet time" and then we get to share with our children/young adult/teen. It really reminds me of the way that our church encourages adults to hold each other accountability in small groups and growth time. yeah, that's it. that's the subtle difference in MFW in k-8 vs. high school. It's like when as adult women we take a Bible study class and have a book to follow for 5 days and then once a week get together with someone else to go over it. That's what's it's like in MFW high school. and Marie (mfw author) has selected books to help with discussion and planned it all out. I like that in Bible, we aren't given answers all the time, so I get to talk with my daughter. Now in history, science, English, there are answer keys.

 

In high school MFW, the idea is to help the student take more charge of staying on syllabus and doing the reading on their own. Then, it takes me about 15 minutes a day to just spot check that she is doing her stuff on the lesson plan grid. Then once a week we have a longer time built into the schedule to discuss more. And there are notes in the high school lesson planner to help me know what to look for.

 

This past week we blended our "weekly conference" into smaller conferences each day. I'm guessing as the school year continues and I have the other kids to teach that it'll morph into the weekly thing. But so far, it's a lot of fun to hear my oldest come bouncing into the den to tell me something she has read or is thinking about. I'm glad we have those weekly conferences, but I'm more glad that we just talk throughout the day.

 

I really like the literature/composition book that is part of AHL (year 1 high school) program. The notes for parents and student are very clear. Clear rubrics for evaluating essays. Step by step instructions how to write one.

 

another difference between MFW before high school vs. high school:

library trips are different focus. Prior to high school, there's the whole book basket for enrichment reading. In high school years, you aren't going to need library trips as much except for extra readings in great books. Some are suggested in the AHL manual to go along with history. Or if you'd prefer, you can read other books not related to history stuff. In my case my oldest just read several of those history related books in 8th grade, so we'll grab a few extra books from classics sections. So high school needs fewer library books than non high school years.

 

mfw high school is definitely not the same level as the years before. but so far, the transition is easy. I feel like the mfw recommendations in language arts and math and science in jr. high have helped with this. Progeny Press guides in jr. high were great for reading and discussion on deeper level.

 

My daughter still seems excited to be able to take her books and go to another part of the house away from us to read and write on her own. Then come bubbling back into den and talking a bit, then onto FB to talk to her friends. All part of growing up.

 

I hope something in there helps to get a feel for how MFW is different in high school phase of homeschooling.

 

I'm sorry that was way too long. Angela did such a great job with bullet point comparisons on the younger years in MFW. And here I am rambling away about high school.

 

-crystal

[johnandtinagilbert]

What a great post! I'm sure many people will benefit from this. Way to go!

[Momma H]

What a great post! Thank you so much for all the information. I have also done both and have to agree with your insights.

 

 

I just wanted to add that with MFW, it is nice to be able to get the book basket books but I almost never do and it is completely............complete with out them. If you don't have a good library system:tongue_smilie: (like me) or don't have the time or desire to depend on your library in order to educate your kids then MFW is really great without the extra books.:D

 

Stacey

[northcoast]

This info is all so helpful! Thanks to both for taking the time to spell out TOG & MFW. It's good to hear from someone, too, who agrees with the assessment. This is great as I consider what we need for the future and what might work for my family.

 

northcoast

ds 11, dd 8

[jewel7123]

I just want to add that you don't have to purchase TOG brand new. If you want the print option, you can get it used for about half the cost either on this site, Homeschool Classifieds or Ebay. Just make sure you're getting the Loom cd included, because you can then send the cd to Lampstand and upgrade to their digital edition for only $35! That way you've got both the print and digital editions (which will constantly update for free!) at a discounted rate compared to purchasing the print/digital option directly from Lampstand.

[punkin]

Thank you. This information was very helpful.

[mama27]

I know you said TOG costs more than MFW but I wonder if it really does since you can use TOG again, if you have a lot of children.

Tammy

[johnandtinagilbert]

I know you said TOG costs more than MFW but I wonder if it really does since you can use TOG again, if you have a lot of children.

Tammy

I'm also thinking that government, philosophy, and the ability to "honors" subject content is worth some $$$ comparison, too.

[TracyP]

I know you said TOG costs more than MFW but I wonder if it really does since you can use TOG again, if you have a lot of children.

Tammy

 

TOG costs more initially than most programs, but I will never have to buy another history curriculum. All purchases after the first 4 years will be just books. It is cheaper in the long run every way I compared it - especially for large families who will use the resources again and again (and again:D).

[happygrrl]

I just want to add that you don't have to purchase TOG brand new. If you want the print option, you can get it used for about half the cost either on this site, Homeschool Classifieds or Ebay. Just make sure you're getting the Loom cd included, because you can then send the cd to Lampstand and upgrade to their digital edition for only $35! That way you've got both the print and digital editions (which will constantly update for free!) at a discounted rate compared to purchasing the print/digital option directly from Lampstand.

 

Do you have a link for this? I have heard about the upgrade program but can never find the details on the website. Thanks!

[jewel7123]

It's kind of hidden. I had to go to the bottom of the website and click on printable order forms under "Store". Then when you click on the year plan you have it states on the order form that it's $35 to upgrade. It used to be $85 but they have recently lowered the amount, which makes it a must do in my opinion. Keep in mind though, that once you upgrade, you can no longer sell your print version.

[happygrrl]

It's kind of hidden. I had to go to the bottom of the website and click on printable order forms under "Store". Then when you click on the year plan you have it states on the order form that it's $35 to upgrade. It used to be $85 but they have recently lowered the amount, which makes it a must do in my opinion. Keep in mind though, that once you upgrade, you can no longer sell your print version.

 

Thanks! I thought it was more, and I'm glad to find out about the new price! I will certainly do it now before it increases. It seems like it would help them out, getting all those sale-able print copies off the market ;). Works for me though.. we travel every year and I have been known to drag a HUGE binder with my page-protected unit across the country. Now all I need is for the teacher's notes to be available on Kindle.....:D

[Woodland_Mom]

Good point about the cost of TOG over the long run. I had not thought about that. MFW can be used again for all children through 8th grade, but the high school program would be a new purchase since it has a different format. Thank you, Crystal for all the info about MFW HS!

Edited June 9, 2010 by Pylegang

[H0MEFree]

THANK YOU!!!

[daughterofsarah77]

Thanks so much! I am definitly looking into TOG more. I am planning to do MFW Adventures and ECC, but unsure after that.

[babybryte]

Very good post!!!

 

One question: Does TOG have Bible study/scripture study, like MFW does? I know that TOG has church history and a Biblical worldview. Just wondering if I would have to add in Bible study to it.

 

Thanks!!

 

 

 

Blessings,

Jacquelyn

[Woodland_Mom]

I *think* TOG surveys the Bible during year one. The other years include church history, but not necessarily Bible/scripture study. MFW has Bible/scripture study and verse memorization as part of each of their years. This is certainly something else that differentiates the two programs. Maybe someone else who is more knowlegeable about TOG can comment about the Bible study/scripture part.

[jananc]

In TOG year 1, there is a full, in depth survey of the Bible, as the OP said earlier. In the later years, there's not a Bible study per se, but the Rhetoric & dialectic level kids have questions in many, if not almost every, week that ask them to take a stand on a particular topic or question and use scripture to back up their answer. If your student takes the time to really answer those questions well, they have IMHO done some in-depth Bible study. There is no scripture memory, however.

[profmom]

We liked both programs, however, I thought I would add another comparison -- I was surprised that the MFW bookbasket idea didn't work well for us! Instead, TOG schedules books for each level with page numbers for each week. For literature, TOG schedules books by level and includes a literature worksheet for each week and level.

[Woodland_Mom]

MFW categorizes the book basket book list by topic, i.e. history, science, etc. They also note a handful of books that they HIGHLY recommend. TOG groups the books by subject (literature, read-aloud, art, church history, etc. AND they also give the stage (LG, UG, D, R). This is helpful! One other thing . . . TOG includes library call numbers.

 

Book basket has worked very well for us. I love filling it with books for the week that we're studying. I agree that TOG's worksheets for the literature are very nice, but I also appreciate the flexibility that Book Basket allows.

 

Was Book basket just too open ended for you?

[profmom]

Was Book basket just too open ended for you?

 

Yes, I think so -- for me and my kids too. It worked better for us to have the specific assignments.

[Time for Chocolate]

Thanks for taking the time to post this thread. I am going to Convention tomorrow and now have a clearer picture of MFW and TOG.:001_smile:

[mom31257]

I wish MFW would have a four year cycle for elementary so that you could at least have your high schoolers and others studying the same topic each year. That will definitely push me toward TOG.

[jenL]

Thank you so much for all this information... I've been pondering these 2 programs for the future and searching past threads has been cumbersome. :)

[Annabel Lee]

Quick question about TOG's literature study: does it tie the literature to the history timeline in the way TWTM does? For instance, if you're studing people & events from the late 1600's in history, are you also studying literature written in the late 1600's (or studying authors from that era)? If it ties these together, how closey? I'm enjoying how the WTM method has us learning about what happened in history and reading authors of that time - what the people of the history topic du jour were likely reading. I'm just no good at real lit. study, and logic stage is looming ahead.

[MerryAtHope]

At high school level, MFW still has all of the lessons planned for you. I love that.

You might take a look at the sample lesson online to see the daily lesson planner, but it doesn't show you the insides of the books used to see the rest where the questions are. High school includes a lot of deeper thinking discussion questions via several of the books, not the daily lesson planner. There are extra notes and thinking points in the daily lesson planner. (I don't want to call it a teacher's manual at this level b/c the program encourages the student to be more responsible for the learning rather than the parent for the teaching. I'm still very much involved in my child's schooling, but the role shifts. My daughter is not off in a corner all day independent of all of us. My dh and I just have roles in high school years than we do in K-8.)

 

 

Hi Crystal--I know you wrote this awhile ago, just wanted to say it was a very helpful post for me, thanks!

[TracyP]

Quick question about TOG's literature study: does it tie the literature to the history timeline in the way TWTM does? For instance, if you're studing people & events from the late 1600's in history, are you also studying literature written in the late 1600's (or studying authors from that era)? If it ties these together, how closey? I'm enjoying how the WTM method has us learning about what happened in history and reading authors of that time - what the people of the history topic du jour were likely reading. I'm just no good at real lit. study, and logic stage is looming ahead.

 

Yes, you are either reading lit from each time period or historical fiction. It is very close to the WTM except that in the younger years there is more historical fiction. Have you seen this S&S chart? Each year plan has one. It only shows for rhetoric students but you can get the gist of it.

HTH!

[AngelBee]

Great comparison. Thanks :)

[BlsdMama]

I can't speak to the MFW review. But, for the TOG review, I think you are dead on. Thank you for writing the comparison. It's extraordinarily useful!

[RobinF]

Thank you for this review. I have been waivering between MFW and TOG and while I have used them both, I didn't have a good grasp of what I actually liked/disliked about each program. You have written a great review that has helped me consider what I like/dislike about each program and which one would be best for us.

[JadeOrchidSong]

This comparison is very helpful. I plan to use TOG when we finish SOTW for the first round.

[MyLittleBears]

Just wondering. I'm using MFW ECC this year and was looking into biblioplan for next year. The reason for this is that I don't want history to completely take over my homeschool. While I like MFW, I'm not crazy about the science in CtC, since science is a "big deal" at our house. Does TOG take 4 or 5 days per week, or can you tweek it to 3 days like biblioplan. Also, does it really require and extreme amount of planning. I tend to like picking and choosing what ciricula for each subject, so customizing appeals to me, but I have heard people say to start planning your TOG year in the summer. Yikes! :confused:Seem like a lot of planning.

[Oops, duplicate account :/]

Just wondering. I'm using MFW ECC this year and was looking into biblioplan for next year. The reason for this is that I don't want history to completely take over my homeschool. While I like MFW, I'm not crazy about the science in CtC, since science is a "big deal" at our house. Does TOG take 4 or 5 days per week, or can you tweek it to 3 days like biblioplan. Also, does it really require and extreme amount of planning. I tend to like picking and choosing what ciricula for each subject, so customizing appeals to me, but I have heard people say to start planning your TOG year in the summer. Yikes! :confused:Seem like a lot of planning.

 

Can't comment on TOG or Biblioplan, but I'm planning on/am just doing the first four levels of MFW: K, 1st, Adv., and ECC for similar reasons. We'll probably use MOH after that for history. "Bible" will be reading the bible!

[Oops, duplicate account :/]

BTW, I am in love with MFW so far. :001_wub: So precious!

[MyLittleBears]

BTW, I am in love with MFW so far. :001_wub: So precious!

 

It is sweet. Very spiritually uplifting also! Thanks for posting!

[Donna A.]

Can't comment on TOG or Biblioplan, but I'm planning on/am just doing the first four levels of MFW: K, 1st, Adv., and ECC for similar reasons. We'll probably use MOH after that for history. "Bible" will be reading the bible!

 

Just a thought.... You actually read a huge chunk of the OT (directly from the Bible) when doing CTG, and then a huge chunk of the NT (directly from the Bible) when doing RTR. The Bible is lined up with the time period chronologically. MOH is more of a "summary" of the Bible stories and some secular events, and it sort of bops back and forth between the two.

 

And if you do MOH, you'll have to add your own science anyway, whereas if you went with CTG, you could either do the science they have scheduled (which fits chronologically... the beginning ;) ), or you could do science separately and just follow the history and Bible components of MFW.

[Donna A.]

Some quick comments from the OP:

 

MFW spends more time on the ancient time period and TOG spends more time on modern times. Here’s the breakdown of what they cover:

 

Actually, I think they're about the same?

 

MFW: Creation to Christ

Should read "Creation to the Greeks". The life of Christ is covered during Rome to Reformation since Christ lived during the height of power of Rome, along with the spread of the Gospel, Paul's epistles, and the growth of the NT church.

 

Rome to the reformation (ancient Rome, middle ages, renaissance & reformation)

Early America is touched on here, too, since America was discovered and settled during the Reformation period.

 

Planning: I have enjoyed MFW RtoR and like that it is all planned out for me. That was just what I needed this year! MFW lesson plans include Bible, history, science, latin vocabulary (some years),

Greek vocab during Creation to the Greeks, and Latin vocab during Rome to Reformation. So the vocab roots are taught chronologically with history.

 

read-alouds, art, and music appreciation.

As well as the 3 R's, extra Reading time and Book Basket.

 

There are usually some missionary books and/or light church history woven into the plans.

I actually think church history is pretty heavy during RTR, since that's a huge part of what history WAS at that time. I'm not sure what was missing from this to consider it "light"?

 

You have the flexibility to use your choice of math, spelling, grammar, and writing. This means that you need to plan how you would like to integrate your writing assignments into other subjects.

MFW primarily uses the Charlotte Mason approach to language arts in the younger years. Their LA recommendations are based partly on that philosophy, as well as the need for simplicity, efficiency, and cost effectiveness. While Marie has included instructions and teaching tips for all this at the front of the TMs, she intentionally left those spots blank on the weekly grid so that you can use whatever you want here, and then personalize assignments for each child at their own level. It makes it very flexible, IMO, and I love that!

 

Their book basket approach provides parents with plenty of flexibility on “extra reading”. Each week, there is a list of books in the appendix that relate to other things you’re studying. Sometimes my library doesn’t have some of the books, but it has been easy enough to find alternatives.

Also, the list is broken down into week # and topic (there are about 400 titles on the list, give or take, all of which have been pre-read by the MFW author), so it makes it easy for you find what you want for upcoming weeks. Also, Marie asterisked some titles that she recommends for purchase, which is really nice if you don't have a good library system and need to make an extra book purchase instead. There are also some topic-related videos on the list.

 

MFW schedules activities such as maps, timeline, notebooking and hands-on activities. I don't have to spend time deciding which activity to do--it's just scheduled. This I like! IMO, it is not too much and not too little. All of the worksheets, maps and timeline figures are in one place which make implementation a snap. The notebooking is very open-ended, allowing parents and students to get creative!

Love this! I tried another curriculum whose pre-planned notebook pages required my student to write XYZ in this box and ABC in that box, which actually encouraged me to go right back to MFW. :tongue_smilie: Having that bit of open-endedness (though I'm not sure "open-ended" is the right description... it's more like "flexible" because open-ended implies that you don't know what to do with it) allows for more personalization by the student.

 

Teacher Notes: MFW has minimal teacher notes and they usually explain how to implement the assignments. There are occasional brief background notes. For the younger ages, I feel this is sufficient. I usually get more than enough information from the reading that I do with my children to provide them with explanations and connections across other subjects. MFW combines Charlotte Mason and classical education methods using a unit study approach. Everything that you do in a week ties together beautifully. This, of course, makes it easy to discuss and explain deeper connections with my children (especially since they are still young). I must say that I have THOROUGHLY enjoyed experiencing the integration of Bible, art, music appreciation, history, read-alouds and sometimes even science that is part of MFW’s lesson plans.

Me too! Obviously since we've been with MFW for several years, also doing it with a high schooler now. :001_smile: The way Marie has formatted the lessons, the weekly grid, the teacher notes, Book Basket... makes me feel like *I* am the one teaching my kids, rather than having scripted notes to follow. ("Say this, and now say that.") Marie has just given me some really great tools to be able to teach my children the kind of education I wish I'd had!

 

Discussion Questions: The MFW Rome to the Reformation package does not have comprehension questions or discussion questions that are part of the curriculum. SOTW is assigned(almost in its entirety) during the second semester, so I have used the discussion questions from the Activity Guide. (SOTW is used for each year except for Creation to Christ.) I have often wished that I had more guidance in the area of literature. I don’t usually have time to read the books my boys read, which leaves me with the inability to talk intelligently with them about their readings.

We do everything that's scheduled (which is everything you see on the website in their packages) out loud together. All the readers in our family take turns reading aloud from whatever is scheduled (with the exception of one or two books from which I do all the reading aloud), and we therefore have lots and lots of out-loud discussion going on all the time... including more of it after Daddy gets home. :001_smile: Thus, I haven't found a need to pre-read the books my girls read in MFW. Book Basket titles are chosen with Marie's commentary in mind, so I never feel that I have to "worry" about what my girls are reading from the "free" Book Basket list. And if we're implementing the CM method of language arts and literature study (narrations, either written or oral), then comprehension is evident, and discussion is ongoing.

 

Overall, great review! I came close to trying TOG once, but the pre-planning... :001_huh: And since MFW provides such a strong biblical foundation and worldview all the way through from K-12th, is laid out so nicely and is very efficient to use, it's here to stay. :D

 

Just curious, Pylegang.... how long have you been using MFW?

Edited February 14, 2011 by Donna A.
Edited to fix formatting errors.

[Woodland_Mom]

Just curious, Pylegang.... how long have you been using MFW?

 

We are in our second year of MFW, so I am by no means an expert. :D We started with RtoR and now we're on week 6 of Exp. to 1850. Thanks for your added thoughts/comments, Donna A. Very helpful!

Edited February 14, 2011 by Pylegang

[boscopup]

Just wondering. I'm using MFW ECC this year and was looking into biblioplan for next year. The reason for this is that I don't want history to completely take over my homeschool. While I like MFW, I'm not crazy about the science in CtC, since science is a "big deal" at our house. Does TOG take 4 or 5 days per week, or can you tweek it to 3 days like biblioplan. Also, does it really require and extreme amount of planning. I tend to like picking and choosing what ciricula for each subject, so customizing appeals to me, but I have heard people say to start planning your TOG year in the summer. Yikes! :confused:Seem like a lot of planning.

 

I'm also curious if people can fit TOG into a 3-day week. I am using Biblioplan right now, and we're actually doing history just 2 days a week just fine so far (we've done 5 weeks). Though I'm not doing the read-alouds (I'll hit them next time around... right now, reading aloud is too difficult to do because of age of children, so we do a lot of audio books in the van instead).

 

I LOVE the looks of TOG, and I feel like I understand how to use it, after going through the samples with a fine tooth comb. For a good month of my curriculum research, I was firmly settled on using TOG as my history. Why did I change to Biblioplan? Because I was afraid that TOG would take over my homeschool, and I really didn't want history to be 90% of the focus. I was also looking at the book list and thinking "$2000 a year when all my kids are in school? :001_huh:", though it probably wouldn't be THAT much, as some things are available at the library and some could be purchased used. But over time, I was going to need 3 levels of each year (I actually mapped out which level my kids would likely be each year). I don't have a problem with spending $2000 for homeschool stuff in one year. I do have a problem spending that much just on history, when everything else is sooooooooo much less. I mean, next year's curriculum (all of it!) is under $400 while using SOTW + AG. And since we are a math/science focus family, I just have a hard time putting that much money toward history, when I'd rather put that much money toward science.

 

But at the same time, I still drool over TOG. And maybe Y2-Y4 have more books available at my library. My library was severely lacking in Y1 books. :tongue_smilie:

 

I'll probably seriously consider TOG again as we get closer to Dialectic stage. For now, Biblioplan (basically SOTW + Bible) is working for us ok. I don't feel like it's helping me merge the Bible with the secular history as well as TOG would, but for our first time through, I'm fine with what we're doing.