Moving overseas unexpectedly, WWYD?

[tiffany k]

Until this last week, we were scheduled to move to the East Coast in July. This worked out really well with our plan to study US history for the next two years. I had planned to buy SL3 for my oldest and WP AS1 for dd7 and ds5. Well, that fell through, so the AF has opened up a slot for my husband in Germany. This is a great surprise! I'm not sure what to do about our history plans though. What would you do?

 

Follow through with original plans.

 

Streamline US history and focus on world history more, ala SOTW 3 and ???

 

Plan nothing and work with what I find when I'm there.

 

Put the kids in school.

 

Sorry, it should have been a poll, but I'm not that savvy. I'd really appreciate any insight you can give me. I don't want to over-think this. I asked my husband for his opinion and he said to do what I think is best. What is that? He doesn't mind putting them in school, but I would rather not. I don't stress about curriculum much and we are pretty low-key, CM-ish, work hard--finish early--explore your world, etc.

 

Thanks for your help!

[Chris in VA]

I'd continue with Saxon, and do SOTW 3. There is actually some fascinating German history in the beginning of the book! And you will be right there! How cool. I would add in a little extra Am History, ala the wonderful resources in WP1 (the interactive map of Jamestown, the Mayflower website, etc.), and maybe read a few books on Colonial Am History--Johnny Tremain makes a good read aloud, so I've heard. THen, I'd just save the deeper stuff for logic stage, when you are back in the States.

If at all possible, I'd see if there was someone who could work with you and your kids on learning German.

[elegantlion]

IMO I would study world history. You will be in a wonderful place to "explore your world" as you stated. I think that will add a wonderful depth to your studies.

[readwithem]

At your children's ages, I would seriously consider putting them in school for language immersion. Other than that, I would also consider doing a German history study - HE Marshall (of Our Island Story fame) has a good book on German history, and I'm sure you can find other resources. Then go explore the places you've studied. :)

 

Congrats on a great assignment! I hope you enjoy your time overseas.

[LoveBaby]

Wow! What an amazing homeschooling opportunity! I absolutely wouldn't put them in school...no way, no how. You are going to be living in the middle of where so much history took place. I'd either plan nothing and wait and see when I got there, or I'd go with world history, especially european history and then plan a lot of weekend field trips to actually see the places you are studying about. Pompeii, Rome, Paris, London, not to mention the rich WWII history that will be right in your backyard. The opportunity to live somewhere else for a period of time to give my kids a first hand experience with the places that we are studying is one of my absolute dreams! (but unless we win the jazillion $ lottery, books are going to have to be our travel! LOL)

[Bula Mama]

I agree with those who suggest world history. Good opportunity!!!!!

[sagira]

Is it illegal to homeschool in Germany?

[LoveBaby]

Is it illegal to homeschool in Germany?

 

maybe for german citizens, but since she's military then I wouldn't think that the German laws would apply to U.S. citizen's.

[readwithem]

maybe for german citizens, but since she's military then I wouldn't think that the German laws would apply to U.S. citizen's.

 

Right, military are the only ones that are okay. Maybe something about being on "American" soil? I'm not sure. We were offered a transfer a few years ago and turned it down, we just couldn't go into it saying we would definitely NOT hs but we were already in high school. If I had younger children (elem age) I would use local schools for language immersion.

[In The Great White North]

Isn't this a three or four year tour? You should end up doing world and US. I wouldn't change right away unless they're really excited about learning German history.

 

Now geography would be one I wanted to do right away. And, of course, German.

[...................]

I personally would put the kids in school, if it's a German school and if they didn't have some kind of personal shyness or problem that would preclude that. I feel that my children learning a foreign language would be worth my missing them, and them having whatever other learning gaps they'd have.

 

I would try to find a Christian school though, if such a thing exists there, b/c as I understand it their schools trump even ours in liberalism and secular humanism.

 

My sister was in the Air Force and was stationed on the very base you are going to. She absolutely LOVED it. I would try to save every penny you have for travel. It looks like you're planning on buying some pretty expensive stuff this year. I would skip all of that, and save the thousand dollars...my sister took the Sound of Music tour, and also went to Paris and a few other countries, from Ramstein. You can go by train straight to any place in Europe for an overnight trip and you can take a day trip all over Germany...what an adventure!!! Many German ppl speak English, but you may want to spend the money RIGHT NOW on Rosetta Stone, to get you started with the basics.

 

I'm so excited for you...my sister absolutely loved Ramstein and she and her husband literally cried when they got stationed back in the states. The on-base schools there were very good, so I'm not sure if you can put your dc in German public school, or if you have to use the on-base school...I forget.

 

God Bless you and thank you for serving our country-you support your husband, and he is a hero.

[sagira]

maybe for german citizens, but since she's military then I wouldn't think that the German laws would apply to U.S. citizen's.

 

Ah, good to know :)

 

A friend of mine was hsing her ds moved to The Netherlands and he is now in public school there and learning Dutch and all the other languages he will be exposed to.

 

Nice opportunity you have there! I would indeed save for traveling within the country and in Europe, and concentrate now on learning about Germany, local customs, and definitely the language. The secular humanism wouldn't bother me, as parents are there to explain and help understand where it's coming from and if the parents differ in perspective they can say so.

[Matryoshka]

It might not be a bad idea to put them in a German school - they're at ages that they'll just soak up the language in no time. They'll be fully bilingual by the time you leave.

 

Even if you do that, a fun read-aloud for history could be Gombrich's A Little History of the World. Gombrich was German, so although it's World History, he's coming from the perspective of a German.

 

There's tons and tons of cultural stuff to do there. We went for just 5 weeks a couple of summers ago, and just that bit of time visted lots of medieval castles, palaces from the age of enlightenment, lots of different styles of cathedrals - rococco, Romanesque, gothic, even one from the Roman era built by Constantine. We also saw lots of other things left from the Romans - baths, a stadium, a city wall. One thing we intended to do but missed was visit a reconstructed fort from the Limes - a huge pallisade fence built by the Romans across the breadth of Europe to keep the barbarians tribes out.

 

And that's just what we got to in a short time in a farily small area. You'll have so much fun. I'm jealous. :tongue_smilie:

[Brindee]

My niece and her husband, who is in the AF, were stationed over there. They did lots of sight-seeing with their kids, but sent their kids to on-base schools, so the kids never learned the language. I agree with the others to try to at least find a german language class/tutor and take advantage of your children having the opportunity to learn German by immersion!

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

the AF has opened up a slot for my husband in Germany. This is a great surprise! I'm not sure what to do about our history plans though. What would you do?

 

Follow through with original plans.

 

Streamline US history and focus on world history more, ala SOTW 3 and ???

 

Plan nothing and work with what I find when I'm there.

 

Put the kids in school.

 

I don't stress about curriculum much and we are pretty low-key, CM-ish, work hard--finish early--explore your world, etc.

 

Ah, Germany! As an Army brat, I spent most of my childhood (born in Landstuhl) in Germany. I spent from 2002-2005 there as an Army wife. It is a wonderful opportunity for your family!

 

I would not put the kids in a German school for the purpose of language immersion unless German was the language you had planned for them to learn. If there is nothing to sustain interest and practice when you leave Germany after those three years, all gains will likely be lost. I wouldn't put the kids in school at all, actually, but that reflects my bias toward homeschooling.

 

I wouldn't worry too much about money. I don't know what the monthly COLA is now but you might want to ask your sponsor when you get one. It fluctuates monthly but when we were there it was quite substantial...and I do mean quite substantial! Since we didn't buy much on the economy, it was pretty much all bonus money to us. It is very cheap to travel within Europe. It's getting to and from Europe that costs a lot and the AF will have you covered there.

 

For the same reasons, I definitely wouldn't restrict curriculum purchases now based on funds. Also, you will have an APO address so anyone who mails things through the USPS will probably send to you. However, some refuse because the customs forms are a pain and boxes with customs forms have to actually be taken to the post office to mail, a big annoyance for businesses. Maybe some larger companies don't have to hand carry (Sonlight? Amazon for sure...) but smaller ones do. Anyone who sends things solely through UPS or FedEx won't be able to send to you so you can have things sent to family who can forward through the USPS. That gets expensive (and annoying) so if you know you want something from a smaller business or a company that doesn't use USPS, I would buy it before the move.

 

Having lived in Germany so many years, I would heartily recommend taking advantage of the travel opportunities. I would keep on the world history track you're on. I see you're in SOTW2 right now. So, you can visit the medieval sites and remember and refresh what you learned this year. I would start up with SOTW 3 next fall and continue from there. Additional sites can be visited to correlate with SOTW 3 and 4 ("when in Rome" and all that). :) You could try to make the last two years of world history stretch to the three years until the next PCS, stuffing it full with extra American history. There are a lot of American history connections in Germany, especially in relation to WWII. I mean, that's the reason we have military posts there at all. Of course, with the ages of your kids, I would hesitate to suggest the more intense experiences but you could definitely do the Berlin Wall, Neuschwanstein (built in the late 1800s and a must see!) and others that would not be too mature for your kids. Believe me, there are plenty!

 

Incidentally, our homeschool name, Alte Veste Academy, was chosen as a representation of one of my most wonderful memories of Germany. Alte Veste is a natural area in Furth (near Nurnberg) and a major battle site of the 100 Years War. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alte_Veste In the 6th grade (in a DoD school in Furth--that post is no longer there), I had the best teacher I've had in my life. In those days, we were still in one class with one teacher all day long. Well, he was big into nature study and took us on day hikes to Alte Veste. We each picked a tree at the beginning of the school year, measured it, studied it through the seasons, etc. We would take regular trips and stay all day on that hill, doing all our studies out in nature. That teacher is in the top 5 of my list of reasons for homeschooling.

 

You're going to love Germany!

 

Kristina

Edited December 22, 2008 by Alte Veste Academy

[tiffany k]

Thanks for all your helpful replies! We are really looking forward to this adventure. As for the schools, my husband is considering the base school, not a German school, although we could look into a German preschool for the littles. I feel better now to just put US history on the back burner and continue with SOTW and good literature. I'll look into the shipping policies for our favorite curriculums, thanks for that advice as well!

[MUJLBE]

I would consider the local German schools. One bonus is that for ages 6 and 7, German children only have school in the morning so you would still be with them every afternoon. I do not know at what age this ends. In the afternoon, German schools offer enrichment activities but it is not part of the official school day.

 

Susan

 

ds(7)

[herbalgirl]

I would not put the kids in a German school for the purpose of language immersion unless German was the language you had planned for them to learn. If there is nothing to sustain interest and practice when you leave Germany after those three years, all gains will likely be lost. I wouldn't put the kids in school at all, actually, but that reflects my bias toward homeschooling.

 

:iagree: As a former air force linguist, I totally agree with this. The language slips away if you don't practice it on a regular basis.

[herbalgirl]

I forgot to add, I see you are thinking about doing SL core 3. Did you read that SL charges shipping on APO/FPO addresses now? If you a serious about ordering it, you might want to order it now while the shipping is free! ;)

[tiffany k]

Thank you, Susan, I'll look into this! That would be an interesting opportunity indeed! I think I could bear to part with them for the morning... Has anyone here had any experience learning a foreign language through immersion? I have no idea what my kids would think, they might really like it. I think it would annoy me, but maybe it just really forces you to learn fast. Thanks for the info!

[Starr]

I would take advantage of your location. If you want the kids to learn German I would put them in school. They'll pick up the language in 6 weeks. It's been a while but in my day :) elementary school was only about a half day. The kids weren't gone all day. In "kindergarten" which is preschool they don't teach them to read or do academics so there is a lot of talking. On the other hand I would want to read about history and then pick up and go visit the site. Whatever you choose it will be great and I am most jealous. :cheers2:

[Matryoshka]

As for length of school day, they don't serve lunch in the schools there, so the kids have to come home for it - they should be home by 1 (my dd may attend for a month there this spring - my cousin confirmed that's the deal, even for older kids). The school day when they're little is even shorter, I believe. My relatives were horrified when I told them 1st grade here was a full 6 hours.

 

I don't know that I'd agree that all gains would be lost if they got fluent and then you left - I went over for just a couple of summers, didn't speak it for 6-7 years, then went back for a year and was fluent again within 2 weeks. It'd be better if you kept it up, though. :D You could always send them to a Saturday school to keep it up after you came back - they have them in many cities.

 

Young children learn language like breathing. They'll pick it up really, really fast. A post-adolescent would have a tougher time, but the littles just absorb it.

[JumpedIntoTheDeepEndFirst]

A very quick take on overseas posts....

 

First- Amazon, Rainbow Resource, Veritas Press, Memoria Press, Zaner-Bloser, Christian Book and Rosetta Stone ship to APO boxes with no problems. Just be sure to put a quick note on your order that notes you have an APO and to ship USPS. You may or may not find that the libraries on base support your needs so be flexible with your plans for library usage.

 

Second- Even if you homeschool, your children have access to the base schools for individual classes, library usage, sports teams, end of the year testing etc.

 

Third- MWR runs most of the sports leagues & lessons so you will have no problem with those.

 

Fourth-Check for any base homeschool groups-they often run support groups, social groups, field trips, gym classes, graduation ceremonies (for every grade), play groups, testing, etc.

 

Fifth- If you are inclined, the Women's groups through the chapel often run a group for homeschooled students during their meetings. This can be a play group, bible study, study hall, etc. Depends on the folks in charge.

 

Sixth-Brush up on DODEA homeschooling policy. Hopefully this link will get you started but always check for more updated information on their website. Basically, you are free of state regulations but remember that you will return to them someday.

 

Seventh- Once you have confirmed the quality of internet service you will have in your home look into a internet phone service such as Vonage or Skype. Your friends and family will appreciate the stateside phone number and you will appreciate the reduced phone bill.

 

Eighth- If it were me...I would continue all classes as you have planned them. Add German language as you see fit. With regards to history, if US history is your grand plan then stick to it. Personally I think I would find a way to focus on European history if you plan to travel to support those studies. There is much to see within driving distance and it is a fabulous opportunity. Alternatively you could continue your US history and then spend Friday doing a focus on what you will travel to see that weekend. Castle tours planned? Read about knights or the middle ages, listen to audio books during the drive (or read if you or the kids don't get car sick).

 

And yes, for Americans stationed overseas with the military, homeschooling is legal. They are covered by US laws and agreements for education not local laws. However, if you are out and about off base during school hours be prepared for the inevitable questions-people can be surprised to see that many kids in one place.

 

Have a great time!

[tiffany k]

Wow! Thank you for sharing this information! I had no idea that foreign schools could have such different schedules, that sounds much more family friendly and like a tremendous opportunity for my children. Thank you, Starr and Matroyshka for filling me in! Thank you, Jumped..., I will print off your list and look into those things. It's a relief to know that we can order from the curriculum suppliers we currently use. It sounds like the kids will have many more opportunities for enrichment than they have access to here. I suppose I should look into Rosetta Stone and give the kids a little head-start. Maybe buy some travel books, too! Thanks so much!

[momsquared]

I know you are overwhelmed, but how exciting! I lived in Austria, England and Mexico at various times during my childhood and never went to school. I learned more in those times than I probably ever did in school. Nothing is better than living history.

 

I fondly remember going to "The Eagle's Nest" in Germany. It was a hideout for Hitler during WWII. It was an absolutely beautiful location.

 

I think the other great thing about Europe is that everything is so close! You want to learn about the Romans - jump on the train and go to Italy! Its really amazing!

[Matryoshka]

Wow! Thank you for sharing this information! I had no idea that foreign schools could have such different schedules,

 

There's probably somewhere you can check what the actual schedules would be - I'm not sure how much it varies from school to school.

 

The vacation schedule is also very different in Germany. There's usually only 6 weeks in the summers (but working Germans get 6wks vacation, so families can do things together) - but there are also a number of 2-week holidays during the year, which weeks and which holidays differ based on what state you're in (they do this so everyone doesn't go on vacation at once).

 

I happen to have the school vacation (Schulferien) site bookmarked, as I was checking to make sure Pfingsten wasn't going to muck up my dd's planned 4-week time there, but it ends up that the state she'll be in doesn't have a Pfingsten vacation (where I lived it was 2 weeks).

 

http://www.schulferien.de/Uebersicht/Schulferien-Termine-2009

 

When looking at dates, it's day.month, instead of month/day.

[momof165]

Homeschooling is illegal in Germany - BUT only for German citizens. Homeschooling can get you some jailtime, huge fines, and you might loose custody of your children. However, as an American citizen, under the AF umbrella, you don't have to worry about homeschooling at all.

 

If I were you, I'd just study world history. As others have mentioned, it is very easy to travel in Europe due to a fabulous transportation system. You can travel with a Europass all around Europe from Germany, to Italy, to Greek, England, etc. by train. Just imagine all the wonderful places you and your family could visit. Talk about some cool memories. :001_smile:

 

Learning German will come naturally to children at this age when exposed to the language through immersion. If you don't want your kids enrolled in a German school (BTW, most of the time the kids are out of school by 13:00 or 1:00 pm - unless they attend a Ganztagsschule (can be compared to American schools) maybe you can find a German speaking playgroup.

 

Maybe, you can check out "Volkshochschulen" - they offer (at times) some cool courses for kids and adults.

 

I hope you'll have a great time in Germany.

 

Sonja

____________________________________________

Homeschooling JUST ONE - ds 9

[Terabith]

I don't know what sort of personality your 8 year old son has. If he is outgoing and unlikely to be daunted, I'd probably enroll him in the local German school as the equivalent to a grade behind here. If he's a child who would be devastated by not speaking the local language, or a shy, perfectionistic child, I'd homeschool HIM using SOTW 3. But I'd definitely enroll your then seven year old as a first grader in the local German school. It's just too great an opportunity to be passed up to both learn the language and to be starting off not behind academically. (I believe first grade starts there as a seven year old anyway. If not, it lets off the academic pressure while building language skills. It's a short day, which will allow you to work on English language arts in the afternoon if you choose. And I've known several American children who started as non German speakers in German first grades and did VERY well.) While they will lose their fluency if it is not kept up, if they do two or three years in a German immersion environment and then do something like Rosetta Stone, Learnables, or even watching German language television, they should be able to maintain those skills or improve upon them.

 

I think I would enroll your younger two children (your four and five year olds) in a local nature kindergarten, to learn language skills. And what fun, to go to school in the woods! It's supposed to be soooo wonderful for them, physically, cognitively, and socially, as well as building stupendous dramatic play. Or at least I'd try to find a social, imaginative play based kindergarten for them to begin to learn language skills.

 

DEFINITELY do lots of travel. What a great opportunity, coming at such a perfect time in the lives of your children and your family!

[tiffany k]

Terebith, I'm not familiar with nature kindergarten. Thanks for your suggestions. We will certainly take a look at the German schools and preschool programs for language immersion. My husband has talked to a few other military families that were stationed in Germany, but all of their kids went to the base school. It sounds like they weren't really part of the culture, just American tourists on a long trip. I suppose this is just something we'll have to see for ourselves. I see the benefits of what everyone has said here about local schools, but when we bring this up as an option with these families they seem wary. I like to have a plan, but I suppose this is one of those situations where we must just wait and see. Maybe I'll spend time planning trips... and figuring out how we're going to live without our stuff while it's in transit for such a long time. :001_smile:

[Terabith]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood_kindergarten

 

But, I don't know if there is one nearby the base. Or even how possible it would be for your kids to go to a local school. The base might be sort of a self contained world. I know it certainly *can* be, but not sure how easy it is to get involved in local German schools or such.

 

But it would be a great opportunity for all of you!

[JaniceO]

My husband has talked to a few other military families that were stationed in Germany, but all of their kids went to the base school. It sounds like they weren't really part of the culture, just American tourists on a long trip.

 

This sums up perfectly what it is like for a lot of military families stationed overseas. We are Navy and currently stationed in Italy. I am absolutely amazed with the number of people who live on base and only leave the base to go on vacation. Some of the people on base are absolutely terrified of leaving it for any other reason.

 

We live off base and LOVE it! We've been here for about 1.5 years and don't speak much Italian, but we understand/speak enough to get by. I didn't see much point in studying the language because it will be lost after we get back to the states. BUT, my kids do know the basics and my oldest DS can go to the corner store and buy things without any problems. It's funny because when we visit other countries like France and Germany, we find ourselves trying to speak Italian instead of the local language or English. We totally confuse ourselves, lol.

 

We started homeschooling this year because the local DoDDs school is terrible and I'm so glad we do! It is great to be able to travel on our schedule instead of the school schedule (when everyone else is traveling). The school was very supportive of travelling, but I felt bad taking them out. It's also great to spend a day pulling out books and studying up on a place before we hop in a car and go visit. I do know people who put there children in the local schools, but it's usually only for a year or two.

 

We just got back from visiting Germany for a week (literally, we just got back last night) and I absolutely fell in love! We stayed in Garmisch and visited Munich and Innsbruck, Austria. I am jealous of everyone that gets to be stationed there. I told my husband he needs to switch to the Army or Air Force.

 

Living overseas is a great opportunity and it is whatever you make of it. I personally prefer not to be what my husband refers to as a "base rat". I love living with the locals and experiencing it all to the fullest. It does lead to some interesting conversations at times (right now we have the police escorting the Italian Army around our town due to the Camorra, which I've had to explain to the kids). I wouldn't trade this time for anything though and it's going to be really difficult to leave in another 1.5 years.

 

If you have any questions about living overseas or whatever, feel free to drop me a message. I can't help specifically with Germany or Air Force stuff, but I may be able to answer other questions.

[dm379]

There's a place on post that should offer German classes for free if you want your ds to learn the language. It could be a fun thing for you two to do together. For Army it's MWR, I'm not sure if it's the same for AF. One of the major pros for homeschooling for us was that we are about to move overseas and we can travel whenever we want and not need to do it around the school's schedule. Most overseas DoDDS schools will work with you and let your kids take some classes there and participate in afterschool activities if you want to go that route. I know for Korea we're not allowed to send our kids to local schools, if you're considering doing that you may want to check the regulations.

[KJB]

My dh is USAF and we're stationed at Spangdahlem/Bitburg. Where will you be? Feel free to ask any questions. I'll help if I can!

 

Kate