Deciding Grade Level/Graduation Date

[pehp]

Has anyone here felt murky on their child's "grade level" once they're teenagers, or graduation date? 

My situation is as follows: my son is 14 and in 9th grade, on the youngish side for a freshman, but not really young. He's a smart kid.  Several years ago my husband had stage 4 cancer and during that year we plugged (limped) along with math and other things, but ultimately he's in pre-algebra in 9th grade. My husband decided that we should lay a strong/firm foundation in math and not try to rush him into algebra 1 for 9th grade, and I'm glad we did this, because he is very good at math.  (On his CAT last year, he missed one math question!) Anyhow.

We were surveying the future and decided to allow him to a shadow a kid at our local private Catholic school.  After a conversation with admissions, we mutually decided due to his math level that if we were to enroll him, we'd enroll him as a 9th grader *next* year. My son was totally cool with that idea.  In fact, he relished it.

When he got into the car after the shadow day my son was 100% sure it was not the fit for him, and we agreed after hearing what his day was like.  So that put the private school issue to rest for us.

However, it did begin a conversation with myself, in my own head, about what constitutes 9th grade...10th grade...how do you decide when a child is ready to graduate, and how does this play into making college choices as well as SAT/ACT test scheduling. I've always simply gone on chronology from when I said he began "kindergarten" at the age of 5. But does it make more sense to base it, for instance, on math?  He'll be in French 3 and Spanish 3 next year as a "sophomore," but algebra 1.  I appreciate the flexibility of homeschooling and the way it doesn't force us to cleave to The System, but obviously we work within The System when it comes to the technical aspects of graduating and going off to school!

I'm sure with some kids this is 100% straightforward.  Then there may be some who are ready to graduate at 15.  I was in college at 17.  But others may need an extra year or two to ripen.  I'm just curious as to whether anyone else has needed to make this analysis, and how you decided on "grade level" if it seemed a bit ambiguous.  I had never even thought of it until we decided to re-class him in light of the private school/math thing.

[Arcadia]

My teens decided on their grade levels. One is born the day before the public school birthday cutoff and one is born a few days after. My current senior (DS17) doesn’t want to be held back and he could do a gap year if he feels he is not ready for college life. My current junior (DS16) would rather moved on to community college and then transfer if he isn’t ready for college next fall. Neither of mine wants to spend five years in high school and we are only aiming for state universities. 
 

ETA:

To answer your other thread on college tours.

The FAFSA does take into account stock portfolios of the parents

https://studentaid.gov/2122/help/parent-investments

I ran some NPCs and they asked about home equity. They ask for estimate of home value and outstanding mortgage balance.

Edited March 7, 2022 by Arcadia
add ages

[Lori D.]

First, SO sorry about the stage 4 cancer, and so glad that DH is doing well now!

I don't think you need to make this decision right now. Kids will surprise you at how MUCH they change and mature during the teen years. So trying to decide now at a youngish age 14 whether or not to do a 5th year of high school, especially because it is NOT clear-cut, is not really necessary.

Where is he is his other work? Fully (and comfortably) at high school level? How many full-on high school credits is he comfortably carrying this year? How is his writing? Does he struggle with any of his high school level subjects? How are his high school peer interactions -- does he seem to fit in well with other high schoolers, or does he gravitate toward interactions with younger students?

Being at level 2 in TWO different Foreign Languages THIS year certainly does not sound like he's working below grade level. If math is the only thing that is "behind", then I would NOT be considering holding back a student.

Doing Pre-Algebra in 9th is not the end of the world, and is not what I would use as the sole deciding factor for whether or not to do another year of 9th grade. He may suddenly "spurt" with math, and cover Geometry over the same 2 years as doing Algebra 1 & 2, which still leaves 12th grade for Pre-Calc. Or, he may move along at the same pace, and be ready for dual enrollment and do a 4th year of math above Algebra 2 in 1 semester as dual enrollment. Just mentioning all of that to ease your mind about getting 4 credits of math for graduation.

I would wait and reassess at the end of next year, as the only time you really have to "declare" a grade in high school is when your student takes the PSAT -- their 11th grade score is what counts toward possible National Merit Scholarships.

Edited March 7, 2022 by Lori D.

[EKS]

29 minutes ago, pehp said:

Has anyone here felt murky on their child's "grade level" once they're teenagers, or graduation date? 

Yes, for both of them.  One of them had his graduation date adjusted to one year later than age peers and then in May of the year prior to that we decided to graduate him that June.  He did a gap year, which was a much better choice for him than staying in high school would have been.

The other completed eighth grade at a b&m school at age 12.  We then homeschooled at a high school level for the next two years.  He then decided to enter the public high school in ninth grade with age peers.  There was some question along the way whether he would jump ship and go to college early, but he ended up staying the course, and he graduated with his age peers four years later.

[kokotg]

I gave my current senior an extra year before high school (he has an end of May birthday, so late-ish, but not super late). I just saw with my oldest that high school is a lot of work and thought he could use an extra year. I also taught college freshmen when I was in grad school and remember thinking that there are very few boys, in particular, who couldn't use an extra year to mature before college. I've never regretted it. He's ended up deciding on a music performance major (on an instrument he didn't start until 9th grade), so between that and covid it's turned out to be the absolute best thing we could have done (there's no way he'd be ready for auditions this year otherwise, although he could always have done a gap year)...but even under more normal circumstances it would have been best. 

There are plenty of ways he can "catch up" with math (doubling up at some point, possibly by doing DE), so I don't know that I'd let that be the deciding factor...but it may be a contributing one if there are enough other reasons to give him that extra year. 

[pehp]

50 minutes ago, Lori D. said:

First, SO sorry about the stage 4 cancer, and so glad that DH is doing well now!

I don't think you need to make this decision right now. Kids will surprise you at how MUCH they change and mature during the teen years. So trying to decide now at a youngish age 14 whether or not to do a 5th year of high school, especially because it is NOT clear-cut, is not really necessary.

Where is he is his other work? Fully (and comfortably) at high school level? How many full-on high school credits is he comfortably carrying this year? How is his writing? Does he struggle with any of his high school level subjects? How are his high school peer interactions -- does he seem to fit in well with other high schoolers, or does he gravitate toward interactions with younger students?

Being at level 2 in TWO different Foreign Languages THIS year certainly does not sound like he's working below grade level. If math is the only thing that is "behind", then I would NOT be considering holding back a student.

Doing Pre-Algebra in 9th is not the end of the world, and is not what I would use as the sole deciding factor for whether or not to do another year of 9th grade. He may suddenly "spurt" with math, and cover Geometry over the same 2 years as doing Algebra 1 & 2, which still leaves 12th grade for Pre-Calc. Or, he may move along at the same pace, and be ready for dual enrollment and do a 4th year of math above Algebra 2 in 1 semester as dual enrollment. Just mentioning all of that to ease your mind about getting 4 credits of math for graduation.

I would wait and reassess at the end of next year, as the only time you really have to "declare" a grade in high school is when your student takes the PSAT -- their 11th grade score is what counts toward possible National Merit Scholarships.

Gosh, this is SO helpful--thanks so much.  I really appreciate the tip that the 11th grade score is what matters for the National Merit Scholarships.  I'm not far along in this journey through high school and that's useful info.

This year he's killing it in math (pre-Algebra), Spanish 2, and Honors French 2. All As, although math is a little lower--maybe A/A-, whereas he's hovering around 100 in languages. These are his "real" formal classes, and the others we do more casually. 

He's doing well with Biology, but he's pokey.  He's reading through some British-French literature for English--again, pokey, but enjoying it. A Tale of Two Cities right now! He devours his history books.  I wouldn't say he's working at a *high* level in these 3 classes, but part of that is ME, which is one reason I'm looking to outsource more next year--my son needs someone who isn't ME to supervise him!  My sweet dad was just diagnosed w/ incurable small cell lung carcinoma, so we are living part-time in Charleston, SC, and, frankly, I've been a little distracted for the past few months. 

He doesn't write enough--and again, that problem is maternal.  When he DOES write, he is a pretty decent writer, and with more practice, I am positive that his skills will improve. And he is literally the most interested, engaged human I have ever met. This might be his superpower.  He thinks deeply about everything, from math to French to politics to Pixar films. 

We hope to outsource basically everything next year. He seems to take outsourced classes very seriously and rise to the occasion well, whereas if I'm supervising, he's more "relaxed" in his expectations of himself and his work.  Ahem. 

I appreciate the assurance that this issue isn't quite ripe yet.  I'm sure that is true, and that it will become more clear as things unfold!

[pehp]

27 minutes ago, kokotg said:

I gave my current senior an extra year before high school (he has an end of May birthday, so late-ish, but not super late). I just saw with my oldest that high school is a lot of work and thought he could use an extra year. I also taught college freshmen when I was in grad school and remember thinking that there are very few boys, in particular, who couldn't use an extra year to mature before college. I've never regretted it. He's ended up deciding on a music performance major (on an instrument he didn't start until 9th grade), so between that and covid it's turned out to be the absolute best thing we could have done (there's no way he'd be ready for auditions this year otherwise, although he could always have done a gap year)...but even under more normal circumstances it would have been best. 

There are plenty of ways he can "catch up" with math (doubling up at some point, possibly by doing DE), so I don't know that I'd let that be the deciding factor...but it may be a contributing one if there are enough other reasons to give him that extra year. 

So cool! Thank you--wow to majoring on an instrument he started in 9th grade!!  That is so neat. I love to see how their lives develop and go--sometimes it's unexpected.  A friend of mine with a son in public school recently mentioned that she is glad her son is a year "older" than the other kids in his class....that extra year to mature, especially for boys, is a good point. 

[maize]

I have three summer birthday boys. I've opted to place each of them officially a grade lower than they would be by local school cutoffs.

There is some flexibility in this. You can count this year as 8th grade but keep records so you can include it on a transcript if, a couple of years from now, he decides he wants to graduate "early" after what would then be 11th grade.

[MamaSprout]

Our dd was grade skipped officially in elementary school (we didn't plan to homeschool). She had a bad health year in 8th/9th grade, so we un-gradeskipped her, but told her if she met certain benchmarks and it made sense, she could graduate a year early. She did and she is. 

[Farrar]

Mine met the kindy cutoff here by three days. I didn't think anything of it and registered them as homeschoolers and told them it was kindergarten.

Fast forward to freshman year and I would have said one could need another year of high school and the other probably wouldn't, but that I sort of wished they could have it.

But fast forward again to now, as they're graduating... One of them is ready ready to go away to college. Not like I've taught him everything, but he got into all the schools he wanted, he's going to be super happy, he's mature and responsible and just needs to be out of the house now after two years of pandemic life. And he's the one who I was sure would need more time. The other one - we talked about giving him another year because he needs it. But I just cannot. I have no patience for it. He's doing fine. He's taking a gap year to keep dancing and then maybe he'll just keep dancing or maybe not. I have no idea. He says now that he's going to college and leaving dance. But also, he fanboyed at the principal and got his shoes signed during Swan Lake and the whole company (this is a major, top tier American ballet) gathered around as the principal guy gave him and his three fellow bottom rung trainees a pep talk about how inspiring they all are and... I don't even know what he's going to do. Regardless, he's graduating. I'm done.

So this is just to say... you don't have to know NOW. You really just need to know before he applies to college so he can do that in the fall/winter the year before.

[pehp]

44 minutes ago, Farrar said:

Mine met the kindy cutoff here by three days. I didn't think anything of it and registered them as homeschoolers and told them it was kindergarten.

Fast forward to freshman year and I would have said one could need another year of high school and the other probably wouldn't, but that I sort of wished they could have it.

But fast forward again to now, as they're graduating... One of them is ready ready to go away to college. Not like I've taught him everything, but he got into all the schools he wanted, he's going to be super happy, he's mature and responsible and just needs to be out of the house now after two years of pandemic life. And he's the one who I was sure would need more time. The other one - we talked about giving him another year because he needs it. But I just cannot. I have no patience for it. He's doing fine. He's taking a gap year to keep dancing and then maybe he'll just keep dancing or maybe not. I have no idea. He says now that he's going to college and leaving dance. But also, he fanboyed at the principal and got his shoes signed during Swan Lake and the whole company (this is a major, top tier American ballet) gathered around as the principal guy gave him and his three fellow bottom rung trainees a pep talk about how inspiring they all are and... I don't even know what he's going to do. Regardless, he's graduating. I'm done.

So this is just to say... you don't have to know NOW. You really just need to know before he applies to college so he can do that in the fall/winter the year before.

So helpful! It is amazing how what we THINK might happen evolves and changes, even in the course of a few years.

As the mother of a ballet dancer, I totally get that excitement.  My daughter's dream is to dance the role of Odette/Odile in Swan Lake!  She's in her first year (at 11) of our local ballet company and in her sixth year of classical ballet instruction, with absolutely no signs of stopping.  I love that your son is taking his gap year to dance.  What a great idea. 

[BusyMom5]

My oldest was always ahead, and in 8th grade I used all curriculum that I could put on a transcript for 9th grade if necessary.  When the time came, we decided not to graduate early, and to just do DE, so she graduated at her correct age-time.  I'm really happy with that decision,  and she was emotionally more ready to go off on her own after she turned 18. 

Second kid I never thought she would be able to go to college, but she's getting ready and by the time she graduates her academics (slower math track) will be ready. 

College Algebra can usually be taken after Algebra 2, so you've still got plenty of time the next 3 years to prepare him.  Its kind of funny how its worked- some things are just clicking faster now- not just math, but also English and science, note-taking skills, even understanding things faster and drawing better conclusions.  The brain is such an amazing thing. I will never try to guess what a kid will do at age 14, bc 14-20 is such a huge jump in development!  Some jump fast, the slow down.  Others start slower and speed up.  And its not just academics, socially,  emotionally- just soooo much growth!

[Farrar]

1 hour ago, pehp said:

So helpful! It is amazing how what we THINK might happen evolves and changes, even in the course of a few years.

As the mother of a ballet dancer, I totally get that excitement.  My daughter's dream is to dance the role of Odette/Odile in Swan Lake!  She's in her first year (at 11) of our local ballet company and in her sixth year of classical ballet instruction, with absolutely no signs of stopping.  I love that your son is taking his gap year to dance.  What a great idea. 

Coincidentally, it was a performance of Swan Lake at the Kennedy Center. 😉 He was just in the background in a couple of scenes. He did the Pas de Trois in a student performance a few years ago and it was pretty nice watching that on stage with the pros, even if he was just in the back now. But if he kept going! Sigh. We'll see. It's so hard to predict what they'll do. Good to keep all the options as open as you can.

[theelfqueen]

My two homeschoolers will each have a 5 year high school program (one had already graduated)...we do three years of homeschooled high school.

Then we categorize them as a junior again and they attend two years of full time community college through a local school district's program. 

My oldest asked me if my youngest is a Junior or a Senior this year... I told him yes. He could be categorized as a Junior (he's in 11th grade, technically) or as a Senior (this is his last year of regular high school) or as a Sophomore (he has two more years to go). 

[Ellie]

If I were following a 12-year school plan, which is the model currently used by public schools, then 14yo is 9th; 15yo is 10th; 16yo is 11th; 17yo is 12th, and bam, graduation. (In most states, compulsory school age is 5yo by September 1 for kindergarten, 6yo by September 1 for 1st grade. Most children will be 6yo at the beginning of first grade, 7yo at the beginning of 2nd grade, and so on.) My goal was never to do 12 years just like school, because I don't believe it takes 12 years to provide a good education, such that young people can take the next step in adulthood, whatever that is. I think that if we're going to follow the school model and refer to our children as "freshmen" and "sophomores" and whatever then we shouldn't make up our own rules about what those terms mean, e.g., a 14yo is in 9th/a freshman; a 15yo is in 10th/a sophomore, etc. But also I don't think either a 12year model is necessary or referring to our children as freshmen or seniors is necessary.

On paper, when it was necessary to put a grade level label on my dc, it was always the grade they would have been in if they'd been in school. Practically, we just learned stuff, regardless of "grade level."

Both dc began taking classes at the community college when they were 14yo. I didn't push them to graduate in two years; I just let them take classes. I graduated each on her 16th birthday, as by then both were almost full time at the community college and I didn't see any reason not to graduate them. And I don't believe that maturity has anything to do with graduation, so I wasn't concerned with that. If we had not done community college, I would have had graduation criteria, and graduated them when they accomplished those things.

[Clemsondana]

My older is the kind of kid that I would have imagined graduating early - in late elementary, it seemed likely that kid would DE or AP a ton of stuff and maybe graduate early.  But, when we talked to kid they had no interest in graduating early.  They do a competitive science activity, are trying to earn an Eagle in scouts,  and play a sport, and those are likely to end when high school is over.  So, kid asked if I would make sure that there were always things to learn if they continued on a traditional 'graduate after 12th grade' plan.  Kid is now a sophomore and it's been fun.  They take 1-2 APs each year, and may do a DE next year.  But we also do fun homebrewed classes in things that they are interested in and design some classes around potential careers or lifestyle choices.  My younger, who is less academically interested, is now possibly more likely to do DE (but not AP) because they will be motivated by getting through college more quickly and being able to 'double count' things.  The point is that it's not just about years in school or what classes are taken - there are other issues that you might consider, like internships, summer programs, and what classes are available to you as a homeschooler. 

For your non-STEM kid, they may not need more math, or you might choose to do something in the summer, or do geometry and algebra simultaneously ir you need to get to a certain level for colleges or so that you can have both geometry and algebra before taking the SAT/ACT.  I also know several students who have chosen to do a 5th year - it's common enough that one of the umbrella schools has a plan for it, so if you feel like you need that after next year you an always add it or re-label them as a sophomore again.  

[GoodGrief3]

Personally, I've known few kids who I thought really benefited holistically from grade level acceleration, though I've known plenty who graduated "early".

It's generally simple enough to do advanced subjects even when one is technically at a lower grade level, though that becomes more complicated if one is using a building based school.

My quick read on your situation is that it would not necessarily be a bad thing to delay high school a year, but it will be fine, however you decide to proceed 🙂

[73349]

We are pondering 5 years of high school as well. My DS (newly 14) is currently in "8th." His mix of strengths and challenges has me thinking 5 years of high school might be really appropriate for him. And I started college at 17--could have done it at 16 if it had been easier to accelerate in a PS--but he's such a different person from me.