DIY masks in light of Omicron

[heartlikealion]

For those of us that would prefer not to invest in N95 (or whatever model is recommended) or prefer not to wear the disposable types as a general rule... 

this thread is to discuss DIY options. 

 

I'm reading that you need a non woven, synthetic layer, but I don't think felt counts in this scenario. Only certain types of felt are synthetic and I haven't read it as a suggested choice. 

I'm reading about spunbond polypropylene but I'm not sure how practical that is to buy it, cut it, and wash/hang dry it between uses as a filter in between two cotton mask layers. It can't go in the dryer so you have to hang dry it and I don't think that would work as a sewn-in item so you'd have to keep it separate. 

What are you guys, that typically wear cloth masks, deciding to do now? 

[KSera]

5 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

I'm reading about spunbond polypropylene but I'm not sure how practical that is to buy it, cut it, and wash/hang dry it between uses as a filter in between two cotton mask layers. It can't go in the dryer so you have to hang dry it and I don't think that would work as a sewn-in item so you'd have to keep it separate. 

This is what I did for all of 2020, before I switched to KF94 masks early 2021. I bought non woven polypropylene medical cloth and initially used it as an insertable filter, but I didn't like that air could travel around the filter rather than through it that way, so then I just started making it my third, middle layer, sewn in. All my masks had a strong nose wire and tie behind the head straps. I think they were probably quite effective as far as a cloth mask goes, though I expect the air resistance was higher than is desirable. All that said, when Alpha arrived, I switched to KF94 masks after looking at various data. And now with omicron, I am wearing N95 if I am going to be somewhere that puts me in am enclosed space with anyone outside my household. I would feel fine still in my KF94s if I'm in a larger and/or ventilated space. The N95 has the advantage of an even tighter seal on me with the behind the head straps.

On thought I have on polypropylene layers is that it doesn't seem much different to me then than using a disposable mask. It's the same material, it's just inside a cloth covering rather than by itself. (And I'm saying that as someone *very* committed to minimizing waste who avoids disposable things whenever possible (including using cloth wipes for all ages in the house, fwiw).) A hopsital stay uses far, far more disposable waste than some masks that can be rotated through until they wear out.

[heartlikealion]

5 minutes ago, KSera said:

This is what I did for all of 2020, before I switched to KF94 masks early 2021. I bought non woven polypropylene medical cloth and initially used it as an insertable filter, but I didn't like that air could travel around the filter rather than through it that way, so then I just started making it my third, middle layer, sewn in. All my masks had a strong nose wire and tie behind the head straps. I think they were probably quite effective as far as a cloth mask goes, though I expect the air resistance was higher than is desirable. All that said, when Alpha arrived, I switched to KF94 masks after looking at various data. And now with omicron, I am wearing N95 if I am going to be somewhere that puts me in am enclosed space with anyone outside my household. I would feel fine still in my KF94s if I'm in a larger and/or ventilated space. The N95 has the advantage of an even tighter seal on me with the behind the head straps.

On thought I have on polypropylene layers is that it doesn't seem much different to me then than using a disposable mask. It's the same material, it's just inside a cloth covering rather than by itself. (And I'm saying that as someone *very* committed to minimizing waste who avoids disposable things whenever possible (including using cloth wipes for all ages in the house, fwiw).) A hopsital stay uses far, far more disposable waste than some masks that can be rotated through until they wear out.

I'm talking about reusable pieces vs throw away. The average disposable mask is one-time use only. The material referenced in my first post is washable, whereas a typical disposable mask is not washable. 

Currently I wash my masks with other items (I used to only wash on hot and/or alone) so it seems like stocking up on boxes of masks would cost more in the long run? Although the hassle of dealing with the filter may outweigh the pros of saving a little money. 

When I worked at the public library we had spare masks at the desk. On one or two occasions I had to use them because I forgot my mask. They were awful. They stunk and bothered me my whole shift. But I have since worn a disposable mask that didn't have an odor. I don't recall if the seal was good on my face, though. I notice a lot of the disposable masks pucker on the sides or top. I do own metal nose pieces, but after sewing into one mask I gave up on those. They were too stiff, hard to manipulate the shape and painful on the nose. I've made and wear both masks that go behind my head and that go behind the ear with adjustable straps.  At one point I made filter pockets but I never used them. I kind of feel like I'm wearing a muzzle when I wear the behind the head ones, but I do wear them sometimes. 

On a light-hearted note, it's just more fun to wear printed masks lol I know, I know... not important. 

[Ali in OR]

I've been using my homemade 2-layer tie masks working in a high school classroom with masked students and open windows (and also fully vaccinated and boosted since October). I've been contact-traced a few times after students have tested positive--one I had been working with one-on-one for about 15 minutes on his last day in school--I never got it. But when I go back in January I'm going to be wearing N95's or KN95's, at least until Omicron dies down.

[heartlikealion]

What is mask use like where you live? I went to the store today thinking "my mask may not be as useful right now..." only to see tons of people not wearing one at all. 

[Ali in OR]

Masks have been mandated in Oregon since August (Delta surge) whenever you're inside any public building. Were mandated outside too for awhile but that was dropped later in the fall. They are mandated in schools too. Good compliance where I live. The only time masks weren't required were the first few months of the pandemic and then June 30-Aug 12 this year.

[Ausmumof3]

11 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

I'm talking about reusable pieces vs throw away. The average disposable mask is one-time use only. The material referenced in my first post is washable, whereas a typical disposable mask is not washable. 

Currently I wash my masks with other items (I used to only wash on hot and/or alone) so it seems like stocking up on boxes of masks would cost more in the long run? Although the hassle of dealing with the filter may outweigh the pros of saving a little money. 

When I worked at the public library we had spare masks at the desk. On one or two occasions I had to use them because I forgot my mask. They were awful. They stunk and bothered me my whole shift. But I have since worn a disposable mask that didn't have an odor. I don't recall if the seal was good on my face, though. I notice a lot of the disposable masks pucker on the sides or top. I do own metal nose pieces, but after sewing into one mask I gave up on those. They were too stiff, hard to manipulate the shape and painful on the nose. I've made and wear both masks that go behind my head and that go behind the ear with adjustable straps.  At one point I made filter pockets but I never used them. I kind of feel like I'm wearing a muzzle when I wear the behind the head ones, but I do wear them sometimes. 

On a light-hearted note, it's just more fun to wear printed masks lol I know, I know... not important. 

I thought this but was encouraged by others on the forum to try n95.  You don’t have to throw them away every use - they are good for ages. I’ve had almost as much wear from mine now as my cloth ones.  You do need a couple to rotate though.

[KSera]

50 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

I'm talking about reusable pieces vs throw away. The average disposable mask is one-time use only. The material referenced in my first post is washable, whereas a typical disposable mask is not washable. 

Currently I wash my masks with other items (I used to only wash on hot and/or alone) so it seems like stocking up on boxes of masks would cost more in the long run? Although the hassle of dealing with the filter may outweigh the pros of saving a little money. 

When I worked at the public library we had spare masks at the desk. On one or two occasions I had to use them because I forgot my mask. They were awful. They stunk and bothered me my whole shift. But I have since worn a disposable mask that didn't have an odor. I don't recall if the seal was good on my face, though. I notice a lot of the disposable masks pucker on the sides or top. I do own metal nose pieces, but after sewing into one mask I gave up on those. They were too stiff, hard to manipulate the shape and painful on the nose. I've made and wear both masks that go behind my head and that go behind the ear with adjustable straps.  At one point I made filter pockets but I never used them. I kind of feel like I'm wearing a muzzle when I wear the behind the head ones, but I do wear them sometimes. 

On a light-hearted note, it's just more fun to wear printed masks lol I know, I know... not important. 

Like Ausmum said, you actually don't need to throw them away after each use. Only if soiled or if the ear/headstraps break or loosen too much. After heavy wear (40-80 hours, depending who you ask) it may be a good idea to use a new one (though HCW certainly used theirs much longer than that early in the pandemic, by necessity). Honestly, I can't imagine a mask without a nose wire that would be adequate for inward protection right now. The 3M Aura N95s have a very chushy foam nosepiece that you might find comfortable. I haven't found anything the least bit uncomfortable about KF94 nose wires, though. Mine are all very easy to shape to my face. The library masks you speak of sound like pleated medical (often called surgical) masks. You are right they gap a lot, though there are tricks to make them fit better if they are your only option.

I totally get the printed mask factor, though. After making my initial masks with whatever I had on hand, I bought cute, fun prints, and it was a bummer to have to move on to plain masks! There are a decent selection of fun printed KF94s out there, now, though.

49 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

What is mask use like where you live? I went to the store today thinking "my mask may not be as useful right now..." only to see tons of people not wearing one at all. 

I'd say that if you're somewhere where few people are masking, that's the situation I would be most concerned about wearing the best mask possible. The poorer functioning masks are better source control than they are self protection, thought they certainly do help decrease exposure as well. Somewhere I have a good chart comparing the different kinds and how much each protects compared to the others...

[heartlikealion]

I didn’t know you could rewear the N95 

I was mostly referring to the pleated surgical masks when I thought of buying a box of masks (figuring they are adequate and cheaper than the other models?). Yes, that’s what the library had. 

Edited December 30, 2021 by heartlikealion

[Spryte]

We rewear our N95s over and over. 
 

We hang them up and try to wait a few days between uses, so it’s best to have several to rotate through.

[easypeasy]

When I made masks, I used iron-in interfacing as that middle, non-woven layer. Worked great.

Then we switched to disposable masks (my environmental self haaaaaated doing that, but I was growing really resentful of masks and Covid at that time and washing them all the time and hanging them to dry so they didn't wad up into little balls was not helping my mental state, so we switched).

For this cycle, I bought a bunch of KF94s (I think that's what they're called) and DH bought some N95s and we're just going to rotate them a few times each (one for each day for 7 days) as they're clean looking.

[wathe]

Well-fitting cloth mask worn over a pleated disposable ear-looper is a reasonable option.  Much easier than trying to sew in a melt-blown polypropylene layer, and would probably work better too (no needle holes, for one thing).  The cheapest way to get ahold of melt-blown polypro is probably to buy a box of disposable earloopers and take them apart.  Easier just to wear the intact mask under your current cloth one, though, I should think.

I do know that disposable ear-loopers do hold up well to washing.  We hand washed them early int he pandemic when PPE was scarce. (whether this changes how they work or not is another story - I don't know how well melt-blown polypro works after washing.  Part of the mechanism is the electrostatic charge in the fabric, and I suspect that washing might ruin that property.)

Edited December 30, 2021 by wathe

[wathe]

RE washing melt blown polypro:  A very quick google shows me a team in NZ has checked.  After 10 washed, decrease from blocking 98% of particles to only 50% of particles.  Still better than a cloth only mask, though.

Edited December 30, 2021 by wathe

[heartlikealion]

Yeah sounds like I have a couple of options 

wear 2 masks 

buy masks and rotate them 

leaning toward these: KF94 Mask LARGE Disposable Dust Protection Premium Face Mask - Individually Wrapped , 4-Layers Breathable Filter Protection https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09H23BWRW/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_AA95XYE9VT6JVGE88NE5?psc=1

[heartlikealion]

1 minute ago, wathe said:

RE washing melt blown polypro:  A very quick google shows me a team in NZ has checked.  After 10 washed, decrease from blocking 98% of particles to only 50% of particles.  Still better than a cloth only mask, though.

The product I looked at was not melt blown? 

[wathe]

3 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

The product I looked at was not melt blown? 

I think they are very similar fabrics. Found this:

The key difference between the spunbonded process and melt-blowing is in the die assembly. In the melt-blown process hot air converges with the fiber as it emerges from the die, whereas in the spunbond process the hot air flow is at a cross flow to the emerging fiber. The converging flow of the melt-blown process, diagrammed in Figure 5.27, serves to attenuate and draw the fibers so that the resulting web is composed of finer fibers than the fibers of spunbonded webs. The melt-blown web is softer, bulkier, and weaker. It has a smaller pore size and provides for better filtration efficiency. 

It would seem that MB is better for filtration than SB.  I think that likely depend on electrostatic charge to work properly to filter the very smallest particles.

 

[heartlikealion]

Just now, wathe said:

I think they are very similar fabrics. Found this:

The key difference between the spunbonded process and melt-blowing is in the die assembly. In the melt-blown process hot air converges with the fiber as it emerges from the die, whereas in the spunbond process the hot air flow is at a cross flow to the emerging fiber. The converging flow of the melt-blown process, diagrammed in Figure 5.27, serves to attenuate and draw the fibers so that the resulting web is composed of finer fibers than the fibers of spunbonded webs. The melt-blown web is softer, bulkier, and weaker. It has a smaller pore size and provides for better filtration efficiency. 

It would seem that MB is better for filtration than SB.  I think that likely depend on electrostatic charge to work properly to filter the very smallest particles.

 

I’m referencing the article in my first post. It was recommended to use certain spunbond material (I think there are 2 kinds mentioned) as a filter. 

[heartlikealion]

“lightweight medical-grade spunbond polypropylene, found in the outer layers of three-layer certified medical masks, has been tailored for medical uses. But as a single-use material, it is not designed to be washed. 

Washable spunbond polypropylene is used in the clothing and furniture industry. It is one of several materials used as interfacing, to give structure to waistbands and collars, and around zippers. It is also used to seal the bottom of couches and chairs. It is readily available from fabric distributors and is not currently in short supply since it is not part of the supply chain for personal protective equipment. This material likely aligns with public health recommendations.“

the one referenced in the second paragraph is what I was considering buying if I went the filter route 

[wathe]

adding:  I don't think that there's any reason to believe that spunbond (ETA because did not finish sentence!  I don't think that there's any reason to believe that spunbond works differently than meltblown from a physics POV, other than the obvious difference in pore size.  I think SB still relies on electrostatic charge to filter properly.)

47 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

I’m referencing the article in my first post. It was recommended to use certain spunbond material (I think there are 2 kinds mentioned) as a filter. 

I think that "washable" in the article you link means won't physically breakdown - as in won't tear.  I don't think they mean it will still filter as well after washing.  They say "This material likely aligns with public health recommendations." (italics mine)

There is no reason to think that this stuff filters any differently (mechanistically, I mean, not pore size) than melt blown, I don't think.  Or that its electrostatic properties wouldn't be affected by washing.

Edited December 30, 2021 by wathe

[wathe]

Someone would have to do the science and find out.  I don't know if that's been done or not.

[heartlikealion]

Just now, wathe said:

adding:  I don't think that there's any reason to believe that spunbond 

I think that washable in the article you link means won't physically breakdown - as in won't tear.  I don't think they mean it will still filter as well after washing.  They say "This material likely aligns with public health recommendations." (italics mine)

There is no reason to think that this stuff filters any differently (mechanistically, I mean, not pore size) than melt blown, I don't think.  And that it's electrostatic properties wouldn't be affected by washing.

Yeah I missed the word likely the first time I read the article! 
 

my impression was washing didn’t affect filter  effectiveness but heat does so that’s why they said don’t sew it in. With that logic I figured they had considered filter effectiveness not just physically breaking down in a washing machine.  

[wathe]

Also, I'm pretty sure that some reusable grocery bags are made of spunbond polypro.  That might be an inexpensive way to get your hands on some to test out.

[heartlikealion]

It does seem there’s not enough testing to know yet 

[heartlikealion]

Just now, wathe said:

Also, I'm pretty sure that some reusable grocery bags are made of spunbond polypro.  That might be an inexpensive way to get your hands on some to test out.

The article references those and said not to use them (coating or other reasons). 

[wathe]

Just now, heartlikealion said:

Yeah I missed the word likely the first time I read the article! 
 

my impression was washing didn’t affect filter  effectiveness but heat does so that’s why they said don’t sew it in. With that logic I figured they had considered filter effectiveness not just physically breaking down in a washing machine.  

I doubt it.  I'd need to see the study.

[wathe]

Disposable pleated mask under cloth really might be a good middle ground.  You know that the disposable mask  filters as intended.  You can re-use (air between uses, or wash if you must, understanding that washing might decrease efficacy).  Rather than guessing with untested spunbond.

[heartlikealion]

3 minutes ago, wathe said:

Disposable pleated mask under cloth really might be a good middle ground.  You know that the disposable mask  filters as intended.  You can re-use (air between uses, or wash if you must, understanding that washing might decrease efficacy).  Rather than guessing with untested spunbond.

The pleated can be reused too? I didn’t know. 

[wathe]

OK, I've had a good google and learned some stuff.

Detailed article on materials aimed at mask makers.

Very detailed article on mask materials and decontamination methods.  Soap and detergents remove the electrostatic charge.

Also, learned that medical masks are both spunbond and meltblown.  Meltblown inner layer, sandwiched between spunbond outer layers.   MB for the best filtration possible, but buried in the middle bc its fibers are so small that breathing them in is bad for you.  SB outlayers are more durable and more stable fibres not likely to get sucked into ones respiratory tract with breathing, so they go on the outside.

[wathe]

3 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

The pleated can be reused too? I didn’t know. 

Well, there's can, and there's as per manufacturers instructions.

They are officially single use products.  But, yes, they can be re-used.  We proved that in hospitals in 2020, LOL.

Edited December 30, 2021 by wathe

[itsheresomewhere]

I use a tripled layer cloth mask with a filter. They are tight fitting with no gaps.  I wash mine and hang dry after each use.  I have been exposed multiple times along with the most recent direct exposure the first two weeks of December and they have worked fine.  I am very happy and will continue to use them.  

[Hilltopmom]

I’m trying to decide what to do too. Teacher here in a state where masking is required BUT my students eat breakfast, snack, & lunch in the room, and so many  water bottle breaks, so masks are off often during the day. I eat my breakfast and coffee in the room too. Sigh. They al wear cloth or surgical that constantly fall down.

I have some kf94s they are not as comfy as cloth. I used an n95 when cleaning last year and don’t think I can teach all day in it- not projecting my voice at the volume I need to all day long. 
I might try cloth over surgical, I do have 2 boxes of those. I did that a few times in the past but it was hot and stuffy, and again- hard to open my mouth wide enough and project my voice to the back of the room all day without getting a mouth full of mask.
My youngest just got over covid and I feel lucky the rest of us didn’t catch it.

my oldest who gets sick a lot is trying to find a new job- she will wear kf94s when she finds something. Even though she loves her old navy masks.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Hilltopmom

[Pippen]

Post removed as it was about disposables.

 

Edited December 30, 2021 by Pippen

[Carrie12345]

8 hours ago, heartlikealion said:

What are you guys, that typically wear cloth masks, deciding to do now? 

I moved to KN95s, and I rotate.

Honestly, I’m not sure what route I’d take if I needed to mask for, say, a full time job where few people mask.  As it stands, I am only briefly in public a couple of times a week, if that.
The other day, I went furniture shopping and my 2nd stop had unmasked employees. At least it was a warehouse sized space with few people.  Then I went next door and found myself in a crowded store with ZERO masked people. I turned around at about 50’ and left, and then threw my mask away because I felt like it was crawling with disease and didn’t want it near me.
Frankly, I’m used to the vast majority of people masking in the places I normally stop, so I don’t think too much about air particle density in my regular travels.

I just emptied my front door basket of cloth masks, which bums the boys out. I will keep them on hand for any potential future use. Who knows what late 2022 will look like?

[ktgrok]

2 hours ago, Hilltopmom said:

I’m trying to decide what to do too. Teacher here in a state where masking is required BUT my students eat breakfast, snack, & lunch in the room, and so many  water bottle breaks, so masks are off often during the day. I eat my breakfast and coffee in the room too. Sigh. They al wear cloth or surgical that constantly fall down.

I have some kf94s they are not as comfy as cloth. I used an n95 when cleaning last year and don’t think I can teach all day in it- not projecting my voice at the volume I need to all day long. 
I might try cloth over surgical, I do have 2 boxes of those. I did that a few times in the past but it was hot and stuffy, and again- hard to open my mouth wide enough and project my voice to the back of the room all day without getting a mouth full of mask.
My youngest just got over covid and I feel lucky the rest of us didn’t catch it.

my oldest who gets sick a lot is trying to find a new job- she will wear kf94s when she finds something. Even though she loves her old navy masks.

These are the KF94 brand that we found the most comfortable. We tried a few other brands but these really fit the best for most of us, and were easiest to breathe in, don't suck down on my mouth/nose when breathing, etc. Very light, very easy on the ears as well. https://amzn.to/3pEY9Uv

They come in kid and adult sizes. 

[heartlikealion]

3 hours ago, Pippen said:

Post removed as it was about disposables.

 

all comments are welcome as far as I'm concerned. At this point I'm not sure if I'll be using the cloth much or not. 

[heartlikealion]

Does anyone have any info on filters you buy and stuff in the mask? Like these.

Some of my cloth masks were sewn with a pocket for a filter, but I just never used a filter. 

[heartlikealion]

3 hours ago, Hilltopmom said:

I’m trying to decide what to do too. Teacher here in a state where masking is required BUT my students eat breakfast, snack, & lunch in the room, and so many  water bottle breaks, so masks are off often during the day. I eat my breakfast and coffee in the room too. Sigh. They al wear cloth or surgical that constantly fall down.

I have some kf94s they are not as comfy as cloth. I used an n95 when cleaning last year and don’t think I can teach all day in it- not projecting my voice at the volume I need to all day long. 
I might try cloth over surgical, I do have 2 boxes of those. I did that a few times in the past but it was hot and stuffy, and again- hard to open my mouth wide enough and project my voice to the back of the room all day without getting a mouth full of mask.
My youngest just got over covid and I feel lucky the rest of us didn’t catch it.

my oldest who gets sick a lot is trying to find a new job- she will wear kf94s when she finds something. Even though she loves her old navy masks.

We have a couple of those, but they barely fit my kids now (child size is too small for my 13 yo and barely fits my 7 yr old). They are 3-layer which is nice. Though since all layers are cloth it seems less effective for now. 

I can't even get my 13 yr old to WEAR a mask. With omicron maybe he'll change his tune. But so far he seems to think he's invincible since he avoided it when his sister and dad got it (he knows his aunt and uncle got Covid, probably omicron, despite vaccines and boosters). I hope he starts masking again. He doesn't have great role models at his school (headmaster and several others don't seem to mask anymore).  

[Hilltopmom]

1 minute ago, heartlikealion said:

We have a couple of those, but they barely fit my kids now (child size is too small for my 13 yo and barely fits my 7 yr old). They are 3-layer which is nice. Though since all layers are cloth it seems less effective for now. 

I can't even get my 13 yr old to WEAR a mask. With omicron maybe he'll change his tune. But so far he seems to think he's invincible since he avoided it when his sister and dad got it (he knows his aunt and uncle got Covid, probably omicron, despite vaccines and boosters). I hope he starts masking again. He doesn't have great role models at his school (headmaster and several others don't seem to mask anymore).  

Yeah I have a bunch of the old navy ones too- I do like them for fit and use, but I guess we should use something other than cloth now…

the child size really only fits kids about 6 and under I’ve found. My students (4th grade) keep trying to wear them but they’re the same size that our preK kids wear! They shouldve r made tween sized ones for middle elementary kids! I moved my 8 year old to adult ones but many of those are too big- she’s wearing the Athleta exercise ones. She has not tolerated any paper or 94 masks I’ve tried and with ASD, I’m just happy she’ll wear a cloth one. 
I can’t imagine being in a school that’s not wearing masks- it’s crazy how different things are in different states!

[heartlikealion]

8 minutes ago, Hilltopmom said:

Yeah I have a bunch of the old navy ones too- I do like them for fit and use, but I guess we should use something other than cloth now…

the child size really only fits kids about 6 and under I’ve found. My students (4th grade) keep trying to wear them but they’re the same size that our preK kids wear! They shouldve r made tween sized ones for middle elementary kids! I moved my 8 year old to adult ones but many of those are too big- she’s wearing the Athleta exercise ones. She has not tolerated any paper or 94 masks I’ve tried and with ASD, I’m just happy she’ll wear a cloth one. 
I can’t imagine being in a school that’s not wearing masks- it’s crazy how different things are in different states!

They're at a private school but I think the public schools are still masking. In the early elem. classes they literally remove the masks and put them in the cubby during the day. Dd is in first grade and had a cold one day. I insisted she wear a mask to class that day (this was pre omicron) and made one for her along with a lanyard. Because of the court order I didn't have the kids after drop off time or else I would have just let her stay home that day. I specifically told her don't let your teacher take the mask off and put in the cubby... you're sick. You need to wear it. I know for sure the K put them in the cubby and I think the first graders do the same. The kids ride a van to school (when they aren't with me) and most of the riders don't mask anymore which bothers me, but now how can I complain when my kids are doing the same! Ugh. 

Edited December 30, 2021 by heartlikealion

[heartlikealion]

1 minute ago, heartlikealion said:

 

oops double post

Edited December 30, 2021 by heartlikealion

[Kanin]

10 hours ago, heartlikealion said:

Yeah sounds like I have a couple of options 

wear 2 masks 

buy masks and rotate them 

leaning toward these: KF94 Mask LARGE Disposable Dust Protection Premium Face Mask - Individually Wrapped , 4-Layers Breathable Filter Protection https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09H23BWRW/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_AA95XYE9VT6JVGE88NE5?psc=1

I have some like this and I like them a lot. The ones I like are called "Posh" by BeHealthy. I wear for a day at school, then let it sit for a few days before wearing again. They're lasting a long time! The kids' patterns are really cute. https://behealthyusa.net/apps/bundles/bundle/73906

[Hilltopmom]

19 minutes ago, heartlikealion said:

They're at a private school but I think the public schools are still masking. In the early elem. classes they literally remove the masks and put them in the cubby during the day. Dd is in first grade and had a cold one day. I insisted she wear a mask to class that day (this was pre omicron) and made one for her along with a lanyard. Because of the court order I didn't have the kids after drop off time or else I would have just let her stay home that day. I specifically told her don't let your teacher take the mask off and put in the cubby... you're sick. You need to wear it. I know for sure the K put them in the cubby and I think the first graders do the same. The kids ride a van to school (when they aren't with me) and most of the riders don't mask anymore which bothers me, but now how can I complain when my kids are doing the same! Ugh. 

Wow, sorry. Anyone with ANY cold symptoms here gets sent home immediately & can’t return without a negative test.

 

sorry to derail the OP’s thread , carry on 

[ktgrok]

27 minutes ago, Hilltopmom said:

Yeah I have a bunch of the old navy ones too- I do like them for fit and use, but I guess we should use something other than cloth now…

the child size really only fits kids about 6 and under I’ve found. My students (4th grade) keep trying to wear them but they’re the same size that our preK kids wear! They shouldve r made tween sized ones for middle elementary kids! I moved my 8 year old to adult ones but many of those are too big- she’s wearing the Athleta exercise ones. She has not tolerated any paper or 94 masks I’ve tried and with ASD, I’m just happy she’ll wear a cloth one. 
I can’t imagine being in a school that’s not wearing masks- it’s crazy how different things are in different states!

FYI one of the brands of KF94 has both small and medium kid sizes. 

[Pippen]

1 hour ago, heartlikealion said:

all comments are welcome as far as I'm concerned. At this point I'm not sure if I'll be using the cloth much or not. 

I had written that I'm a teacher and have been in person every day with full classes since fall 2020. I have been wearing doubled up disposable masks the whole time, but the key is that they fit well. I shopped around until I found some that were the right fit and have a good metal nose wire. I wear a mask extender to keep the ear loops in place and so the sides are snug along my cheeks. I also turn up the bottom like a narrow cuff at the bottom of my chin. As a bonus, my glasses don't fog up. 

I haven't looked into masks for awhile but my supply has run out so I had to shop again. I also just saw double layers of surgical masks aren't recommended by the CDC due to the fit, but it's worked well for me so I'll probably stick with it. The new masks I just ordered fit better along the cheeks than any mask I've tried before so companies must be stepping up fit. I'm in them at least 9 hours most days with only a short break to eat lunch so it has to be right. 

Ironically, all of the pricier masks I've bought--medical grade surgical masks and Happy Masks--didn't fit me well and I gave them to my kids. 

 

Edited December 30, 2021 by Pippen

[KSera]

1 hour ago, heartlikealion said:

Does anyone have any info on filters you buy and stuff in the mask? Like these.

Some of my cloth masks were sewn with a pocket for a filter, but I just never used a filter. 

When masks with those type of filters have been tested, they have significantly lower filtration rates than masks made completely of polypropylene--the air tends to go around the edges of the filter, as that's the path of least resistance. That's why I stopped making my masks with insertable filters and switched to sewing them edge to edge (before switching to KF94).

56 minutes ago, Kanin said:

I have some like this and I like them a lot. The ones I like are called "Posh" by BeHealthy. I wear for a day at school, then let it sit for a few days before wearing again. They're lasting a long time! The kids' patterns are really cute. https://behealthyusa.net/apps/bundles/bundle/73906

I love the Posh KF94s and so do my kids. They are the lightest weight ones we have and there are now so many patterns for both adults and kids. They are pricier, but they last a long time for us because we don't need to go inside places very often. I do wish they would redesign their ear loop adjustment. I only buy masks with earloop adjusters (if it's an earloop mask), and these are my least favorite adjustment method.

eta: I wanted to add that KF94s come in two styles--the trifold "boat" shaped masks, and a bifold mask that is shaped similarly to a KN95. The boat shaped masks seem to have a much better fit for a wider variety of faces than the bifold masks do. None of us wear the bifold KF94s because of the chin fit not being great. The boat shaped masks fit great and are the same shape as the 3M Aura N95s I wear.

Edited December 30, 2021 by KSera

[Clarita]

I found these reusable masks any thoughts? Face masks and face mask filters for your protection | AirPop (airpophealth.com) See FAQ (FAQ - English : AirPop (airpophealth.com)) seems like it's a KN95 mask that is reusable.

I really don't want to use the disposables either. Reusing disposable masks... for me leads to the question of why were they labeled disposable in the first place. 

[KSera]

14 minutes ago, Clarita said:

I found these reusable masks any thoughts? Face masks and face mask filters for your protection | AirPop (airpophealth.com) See FAQ (FAQ - English : AirPop (airpophealth.com)) seems like it's a KN95 mask that is reusable.

I really don't want to use the disposables either. Reusing disposable masks... for me leads to the question of why were they labeled disposable in the first place. 

It doesn’t appear that there would be any advantage to these masks over using an actual certified mask for 40 hours, given that these are only good for 40 hours as well and are made of a non-recyclable material that will also need to be disposed of after 40 hours, plus have no outside testing. It does look like it might have an effective nose seal design, but their pictures aren’t very good to show exactly how that works. I can’t tell if it has a silicone type seal similar to on an elastomeric respirator.

 

eta: regarding why they are labeled disposable, in the hospital, most PPE that is used with patients is disposed of, but being labeled that way doesn’t mean they have to be. Does anybody actually dispose of those take and toss “disposable” plastic containers after each use? (I sure hope not!) Heck, we wash and reuse disposable plastic utensils if they come into the house.

Edited December 30, 2021 by KSera

[wathe]

12 minutes ago, Clarita said:

 

I really don't want to use the disposables either. Reusing disposable masks... for me leads to the question of why were they labeled disposable in the first place. 

I think because disposable is the general trend in healthcare.  It's cheaper to make disposable products and toss than it is to reprocess and track.  Even if many of these products actually could be re-used (and historically were re-used).  It's a real problem.  Driven by both profit and liability.

Things I've seen transition from re-usable to disposable during my career:  Vaginal specula, surgical drapes, suture sets (I'm talking instruments - needle drivers, scissors, forceps), eye-protection. And now stethoscopes in this pandemic.   Many of these products could easily be re-used many times, but they are cheaper to toss and replace.  And less risky medico-legally to use new each time, I think.   It's just become the standard.

[wathe]

@KSera that's a good point about elastomeric respirators.  They are very sustainable.

The industrial style are ugly, and most have an exhalation valve that would have to be blocked (at work we wear a disposable mask over top.  You could, in theory, use the same disposable mask forever, for this purpose).( *ETA - back when we were wearing elastomeric respirators for AGMP's because n95's were in critically short supply)

There are some non-industrial styles like Castlegrade that are less scary looking, and non-disposable.  Filters would need to be changed periodically.

Edited December 30, 2021 by wathe

[wathe]

I think, the key issue is that:

1. Polypropylene filter layers, be they spunbond of meltblown, rely on electrostatic charge to filter properly
2. Washing with soap or detergent will degrade the electrostatic charge.

So it doesn't matter whether it's a commercial "washable" mask, a home-sewn mask with a SB polypro layer, or a disposable medical grade mask - the polypro filter material all works the same way and will be made less efficacious by washing.

I would rather re-use a commercial mask that I know meets PPE standards than a home-sewn mask made with non-medical SB polypro that may or may not do what it's supposed to do.  Washing either of them will degrade the performance.  If I felt very strongly about having a very long-life, sustainable mask, I'd choose an elastomeric respirator similar to Castlegrade.