Praying the sinner's prayer with a three year old - am I wrong here?

[Sarah CB]

So I go to pick my three year old up from Sunday school today (he turned three last week, btw) and one of the leaders says, "Guess what? LO heard the gospel today and prayed the sinner's prayer! Here's a booklet to take home, etc., etc."

 

I think I tuned out at some point and just smiled and took the booklet. Something just sat really wrong with me. Dh is confused as to what the problem is - it's not like he can never pray that again or that it's a bad thing - in fact, we want our children to become followers of Christ. So, what's my problem?

 

I find it disturbing. He's barely three for goodness sake and he doesn't "get" what he's parroting back. I asked him about praying at church today and he told me he prayed for God. I asked, "Oh, what did you pray to God about?" He answered, "Jesus". I said, "What did you ask Jesus?" And his answer was, "Nothing, but my teacher asked a lot of questions."

 

I have no issues with them being available or even encouraging kids to come to Christ but walking my three year old step by step through the process when he doesn't even understand what he's doing or why seems a bit much.

 

Am I totally out of line here? Or should I chill out and just be happy?

[Ria]

This kind of thing bothers me, too. You aren't alone.

 

Ria

[Soph the vet]

Hi Sarah,

I don't think you are out of line at all. Sure, it is great that a 3yr. old understands enough to love Jesus. But true conversion is repentance and faith. I don't think a 30yr. old much less a 3 yr. old should be asked to parrot back a sinner's prayer. When God convicts someone of sin they want to repent (sometimes they need an explanation of what that is exactly) and trust the Savior no matter how old they are, but I do not give anyone "assurance of salvation" anymore when I witness because the Holy Spirit will do that. My job (and I am a Sunday School teacher too) is to proclaim the gospel to these kids, not lead them in a prayer. Of course, if one of my 4th graders came to me and said I really am not sure if I am saved or not I would ask them questions to see where they are at and share the gospel and talk about repentance and faith. And then I would share that with their parents so they could be the ones to go before the Lord with their child and lead them through a time of repentance and what it means to trust the Lord for salvation.

There are so many false converts in the church today because they parroted some prayer and were never convicted of sin and their need for a Savior in the first place.

That's my two cents.

[Amy loves Bud]

So I go to pick my three year old up from Sunday school today (he turned three last week, btw) and one of the leaders says, "Guess what? LO heard the gospel today and prayed the sinner's prayer! Here's a booklet to take home, etc., etc."

 

I think I tuned out at some point and just smiled and took the booklet. Something just sat really wrong with me. Dh is confused as to what the problem is - it's not like he can never pray that again or that it's a bad thing - in fact, we want our children to become followers of Christ. So, what's my problem?

 

I find it disturbing. He's barely three for goodness sake and he doesn't "get" what he's parroting back. I asked him about praying at church today and he told me he prayed for God. I asked, "Oh, what did you pray to God about?" He answered, "Jesus". I said, "What did you ask Jesus?" And his answer was, "Nothing, but my teacher asked a lot of questions."

 

I have no issues with them being available or even encouraging kids to come to Christ but walking my three year old step by step through the process when he doesn't even understand what he's doing or why seems a bit much.

 

Am I totally out of line here? Or should I chill out and just be happy?

 

I'm also bothered by it. It feels almost like a numbers game - "At VBS we had 173 children accept Christ for the very first time!" I don't doubt that some children are being led to Christ in these environments, but it seems a little too...calculated for my comfort.

[momster]

Our older dd was 4 yo when she prayed the prayer at the end of the Jesus movie (after she had seen the movie two times), and I was grateful she was at home with me when that happened. I would have been sad in a way if she had been with another adult -- sad that it wasn't me, but not sad that she had prayed.

 

Your son, at 3 yo, is young and probably eager to please his teacher, so you might be wondering if what he heard was clear to him and if his response to it was sincere. While he certainly isn't going to understand the gospel message at the level that a 12 yo or 35 yo would, remember that the Lord is able to use His Word to touch your son's heart in an age-appropriate way, even unto salvation.

 

Maybe you could 'read' the Wordless Book with him from time to time so that he can 'see' a more understandable picture of sin and salvation. He might ask questions or share his thoughts, thus helping to put your mind at rest.

 

Wouldn't that be wonderful if he indeed became a believer at such a young age?!

[Sarah CB]

I'm also bothered by it. It feels almost like a numbers game - "At VBS we had 173 children accept Christ for the very first time!" I don't doubt that some children are being led to Christ in these environments, but it seems a little too...calculated for my comfort.

 

They prayed for the children's "special" service this morning - I wonder if they're going to mention numbers next week. If they do...I don't know if I'll be able to stop myself from walking out of the service.

[Sarah CB]

Hi Sarah,

I don't think you are out of line at all. Sure, it is great that a 3yr. old understands enough to love Jesus. But true conversion is repentance and faith. I don't think a 30yr. old much less a 3 yr. old should be asked to parrot back a sinner's prayer. When God convicts someone of sin they want to repent (sometimes they need an explanation of what that is exactly) and trust the Savior no matter how old they are, but I do not give anyone "assurance of salvation" anymore when I witness because the Holy Spirit will do that. My job (and I am a Sunday School teacher too) is to proclaim the gospel to these kids, not lead them in a prayer. Of course, if one of my 4th graders came to me and said I really am not sure if I am saved or not I would ask them questions to see where they are at and share the gospel and talk about repentance and faith. And then I would share that with their parents so they could be the ones to go before the Lord with their child and lead them through a time of repentance and what it means to trust the Lord for salvation.

There are so many false converts in the church today because they parroted some prayer and were never convicted of sin and their need for a Savior in the first place.

That's my two cents.

 

And that's what I would have been comfortable with. I wish that if his teacher really felt like he was convicted to go before the Lord that they would share that information with me so that I could pray with him at home.

 

I waffle between wanting to be the one involved with these kinds of things and wondering whether my parenting/homeschooling approach is too hands-on and whether I should loosen up and be thankful for other influences in our children's lives.

[Sarah CB]

This kind of thing bothers me, too. You aren't alone.

 

Ria

 

Thanks, I sometimes feel like a bit of a freak - especially because I think I'm often the only one at church who takes issue with stuff like this.

[Soph the vet]

Thanks, I sometimes feel like a bit of a freak - especially because I think I'm often the only one at church who takes issue with stuff like this.

Then I am a freak too!:lol:

From now on when I see one of your posts I am just going to post "Freak!"

[JudoMom]

The sinner's prayer isn't a ticket to salvation, and it drives me bonkers that it's often presented that way. I prayed that prayer just about every time I did something wrong growing up, but didn't come to saving faith until I was 20.

 

My boys profess faith, and I pray that it's a true faith, but only time will tell. They agree they are sinners in need of a savior, they agree that Jesus is that savior, and they ask Jesus for forgiveness for their sins, but I'm looking more for proof of their salvation in their actions than whether or not they've prayed a prayer.

 

Um, I'd be irked, too. Maybe even more irked than you.

[Jugglin'5]

This is what soured me on VBS. The last time I participated (before I had children as a young wife) it was such a manipulative numbers game. I kept wondering how many of those children would see through it as they grew older, and become cynical about Christianity in general. And fair or not, it was one of the factors that led to my not being a Baptist anymore. I know Baptists aren't the only ones with VBS, but they are the most visible in my area, so they got the brunt of my youthful disfavor. I feel this way about scheduled "revivals" too. "We've got the Holy Spirit booked for next week. Y'all be sure to come, and we'll see how many we can get to sign a card." Okay, I sound more cynical here than I actually am. After all, my Baptist grandmother was the one who took me to church, and she gets most of the earthly credit for my being a Christian.

 

 

I'm also bothered by it. It feels almost like a numbers game - "At VBS we had 173 children accept Christ for the very first time!" I don't doubt that some children are being led to Christ in these environments, but it seems a little too...calculated for my comfort.

[Sarah CB]

Then I am a freak too!:lol:

From now on when I see one of your posts I am just going to post "Freak!"

 

:lol: As long as I can do the same to you :D

[teachermom_7]

So I go to pick my three year old up from Sunday school today (he turned three last week, btw) and one of the leaders says, "Guess what? LO heard the gospel today and prayed the sinner's prayer! Here's a booklet to take home, etc., etc."

 

I think I tuned out at some point and just smiled and took the booklet. Something just sat really wrong with me. Dh is confused as to what the problem is - it's not like he can never pray that again or that it's a bad thing - in fact, we want our children to become followers of Christ. So, what's my problem?

 

I find it disturbing. He's barely three for goodness sake and he doesn't "get" what he's parroting back. I asked him about praying at church today and he told me he prayed for God. I asked, "Oh, what did you pray to God about?" He answered, "Jesus". I said, "What did you ask Jesus?" And his answer was, "Nothing, but my teacher asked a lot of questions."

 

I have no issues with them being available or even encouraging kids to come to Christ but walking my three year old step by step through the process when he doesn't even understand what he's doing or why seems a bit much.

 

Am I totally out of line here? Or should I chill out and just be happy?

 

Hi Sarah!

 

I don't think so. This is definitely something you and your dh husband need to talk about and know how to approach your son. Both of my children were "saved" young (ages 6 1/2 and 5), BUT neither just recited a prayer. They both brought up the matter to us (parents) away from the church service and were completely understanding of their sinful condition and their need for a Savior. They both asked Christ to forgive them of their sins and come into their heart on their own accord. THAT is the difference between just "praying the prayer" and true salvation.

 

Sometimes people think there's no way the sinner's prayer can be "it." That's a trap alot of people get into thinking there's more to it. The Bible is very clear that "whosoever shall CALL upon the name of the Lord SHALL be saved." It IS that easy, but as another person mentioned, they must also have an understanding of what's transpiring.

 

I'll be completely honest with you, our family is kind of on the "outside" of the "cliques" in our church because we don't encourage our children to go to alot of the children's ministries for this reason. There are alot of well meaning people who "jump" on the fact that a child is asking questions and immediately lead them into the plan of salvation. Both of my kids asked questions for awhile before they were truly ready. My son was teetering on the brink of salvation for weeks. As a parent, that was a very scary place for my son to be. Knowing that he had an understanding of his sinful condition and that if something happened to him before he got saved, he would spend an eternity away from Christ. But, we bathed him in prayer for weeks and God gave us discernment to know when to proceed to more than just answering his questions.

 

Pray about and talk with your dh about it. Many people (myself included!) grew up with a "false" sense of security where their salvation is concerned because of these exact type situations. There are MANY unsaved church members in our churches today due to this exact circumstance. If there is something wrong in your spirit about the situation, TRUST IT!! It could most likely be the Holy Spirit trying to show you the truth.

 

We'll be praying for you and your family. It's a tough place to be in. Hope you and your dh can come to an understanding that will help your son in the long run.

 

Tammie in LA

[Guest janainaz]

I'm also bothered by it. It feels almost like a numbers game - "At VBS we had 173 children accept Christ for the very first time!" I don't doubt that some children are being led to Christ in these environments, but it seems a little too...calculated for my comfort.

 

I agree (with the other comments, too). I don't like much of the agenda with the institutional church these days. It is my hot button.

[Soph the vet]

:lol: As long as I can do the same to you :D

Of course, I believe in equal opportunity for those who Freak out.

 

Freak!!:D

[Kathy in MD]

And that's what I would have been comfortable with. I wish that if his teacher really felt like he was convicted to go before the Lord that they would share that information with me so that I could pray with him at home.

 

I waffle between wanting to be the one involved with these kinds of things and wondering whether my parenting/homeschooling approach is too hands-on and whether I should loosen up and be thankful for other influences in our children's lives.

 

I'd introduce the SS teacher to the realities of the 3 year old mind and child development. I don't know of any denomination that says that a young child is condemned if he hasn't confessed his sins and repented! I believe Christ said "Let the children come unto me" I don't believe there were any restrictions that a child needs to do A,B,&C. From your post, undoubtly we're of different denominations, but I still wonder about any adult who thinks that a child has only accepted Christ if the child has done A,B,&C.

 

At that age, I only worry that the child knows that Jesus and God loves him and that he loves Jesus, God and others back (at least most of the time :) ) This is the time to introduce the Bible stories, especially those that stress God's love. An understanding of sin and repentance and other more complex subjects requires a much more mature mind. A three year-old is still at the stage of innocence and as you said, just parroting back the prayer.

 

Years ago, I went ballistic (added, quietly while there, verbally when home) when I went to a children's program at a relative's church and they turned it into a revival with asking children as young as 2&3 yrs old to accept Jesus and come down and confess their sins to TEN-TWELVE year olds. This was no more than teaching the children to go through the motions, mimicing the adults. I thought my 6 yo ds was was still too young at the time! (What doubly shocked me was that this was NOT typical of the denomination at almost any age! Acceptance of Christ is generally a more private affair.)

Edited October 12, 2008 by Kathy in MD

[SapphireStitch]

The sinner's prayer isn't a ticket to salvation, and it drives me bonkers that it's often presented that way. I prayed that prayer just about every time I did something wrong growing up, but didn't come to saving faith until I was 20.

 

My boys profess faith, and I pray that it's a true faith, but only time will tell. They agree they are sinners in need of a savior, they agree that Jesus is that savior, and they ask Jesus for forgiveness for their sins, but I'm looking more for proof of their salvation in their actions than whether or not they've prayed a prayer.

 

Um, I'd be irked, too. Maybe even more irked than you.

 

:iagree::iagree:

 

This is the same thing I experienced as a child. When I was 7 years old I started to realize that I was a sinner. My mom saw me crying during the "closing invitation" one Sunday and asked me if I wanted to "go forward". (As I'm typing this it's hitting me how we have this specialized vocabulary for salvation that doesn't come from Scripture.)

 

My Sunday School teacher prayed with me and had me pray the sinner's prayer, and then told me to go home and write the date in my Bible so I would always know on what day I was saved. For some reason, I didn't write it down, it just didn't seem right to me to do that.

 

Yes, over the years I prayed that prayer over and over during times of doubt. I spent a lot of time wondering if I had prayed it correctly, with the right amount of sincerity, etc.

 

As an adult I have been exposed to much better teaching on salvation and on what I bring to my salvation (nothing but my sin!) and who saves me and keeps me saved (it's all about Christ!). Now if someone asks me when I was saved I tell them the story above is the long version. The short version is Ephesians 1:4...God chose me in Christ before the foundation of the world!

[Jugglin'5]

:iagree::iagree:

 

This is the same thing I experienced as a child. When I was 7 years old I started to realize that I was a sinner. My mom saw me crying during the "closing invitation" one Sunday and asked me if I wanted to "go forward". (As I'm typing this it's hitting me how we have this specialized vocabulary for salvation that doesn't come from Scripture.)

 

My Sunday School teacher prayed with me and had me pray the sinner's prayer, and then told me to go home and write the date in my Bible so I would always know on what day I was saved. For some reason, I didn't write it down, it just didn't seem right to me to do that.

 

Yes, over the years I prayed that prayer over and over during times of doubt. I spent a lot of time wondering if I had prayed it correctly, with the right amount of sincerity, etc.

 

As an adult I have been exposed to much better teaching on salvation and on what I bring to my salvation (nothing but my sin!) and who saves me and keeps me saved (it's all about Christ!). Now if someone asks me when I was saved I tell them the story above is the long version. The short version is Ephesians 1:4...God chose me in Christ before the foundation of the world!

Yes, I agree, and think that the emphasis on a single point of time is misguided and even dangerous. For many people, myself included, it was a longer process, and I cannot answer exactly "when". This was a point of great angst for me for a long time, because I couldn't pinpoint it, and it caused me to obsess about the reality of my salvation. The emphasis was on what I did, rather than on whether I was a sheep who had heard His voice. For some children who grow up in a Christian home and can't remember a time when they didn't love Jesus, it can be devastating. There is great pressure for kids raised in a good Christian home to come up with an exciting testimony. Their testimony is that of John the Baptist and David. They may have gone through times of doubt and sin, but they have loved God from infancy. Some lambs are born in the flock and stay (dh), some wander and are called back (me), and some were outsiders from another flock called by the Good Shepherd into His flock.

[Scarlett]

What is the 'sinners prayer'?

[Nakia]

Hi Sarah. Those who have responded have been so open and well articulated, and I really can't add anything much. But, I honestly believe what you are feeling is very true and valid. It's called discernment! Good for you for listening. Talk to your DH, pray for your son (I know you already do!) and don't worry. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

[Nakia]

Yes' date=' I agree, and think that the emphasis on a single point of time is misguided and even dangerous. For many people, myself included, it was a longer process, and I cannot answer exactly "when". This was a point of great angst for me for a long time, because I couldn't pinpoint it, and it caused me to obsess about the reality of my salvation. The emphasis was on what I did, rather than on whether I was a sheep who had heard His voice. For some children who grow up in a Christian home and can't remember a time when they didn't love Jesus, it can be devastating. There is great pressure for kids raised in a good Christian home to come up with an exciting testimony. Their testimony is that of John the Baptist and David. They may have gone through times of doubt and sin, but they have loved God from infancy. Some lambs are born in the flock and stay (dh), some wander and are called back (me), and some were outsiders from another flock called by the Good Shepherd into His flock.[/quote']

 

WOW! That is a great post. I so wish I could rep you!

[WTMCassandra]

I think you are right to be concerned.

 

My DH accepted the Lord as his Savior at age 3--but this was at home with his father (a pastor) and he understood what he was doing.

 

That is obviously very different from your situation, where your poor son was just trying to please his teacher. I can also understand why you would like to be involved in this process, not just informed afterwards! I think your concerns are very legitimate. I don't think you are out of line at all.

 

This is one of the (many) reasons why we pulled out of the whole Sunday School system. We homechurched for many years and we are now attending a church with a family Sunday School.

 

The Sunday School will probably "not get it" if you try to explain your concerns. If you like this church and want to continue with it, I would just grin and bear it and continue to teach your son at home about salvation and look for a real change in his life when he is ready.

[kokotg]

I'm with Jugglin'5 in my views on salvation as necessarily being a single moment one can point to, but even if I weren't I would find the push for getting children saved younger and younger disturbing. The sense I get from listening to older people who grew up in the evangelical tradition is that it's a pretty recent phenomenon, and 50 years ago it would have been unheard of for a 3 year old to get saved.

[Jugglin'5]

I'm with Jugglin'5 in my views on salvation as necessarily being a single moment one can point to, but even if I weren't I would find the push for getting children saved younger and younger disturbing. The sense I get from listening to older people who grew up in the evangelical tradition is that it's a pretty recent phenomenon, and 50 years ago it would have been unheard of for a 3 year old to get saved.

 

It is the emphasis on "getting" them saved through manipulation that I find disturbing. I believe very young children as infants can be saved, but we might not necessarily recognize that as adults. I know parents who won't pray with their children as Christians, because they can't possibly be old enough for it to be real. I think it is just as dangerous to tell a child who says "I love Jesus" - "No, you don't really, because you are not old enough to really understand". I think people forget that we have to become, as Jesus put it, "little children", to enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Any thoughts?

[Sarah CB]

The Sunday School will probably "not get it" if you try to explain your concerns. If you like this church and want to continue with it, I would just grin and bear it and continue to teach your son at home about salvation and look for a real change in his life when he is ready.

 

Thanks for this. I agree that they likely will not get it and I don't think there's really a point in bringing it up. It certainly didn't hurt ds but it brings up questions for me. I think part of the problem is that I'm really drawn to the idea of a family integrated church so when stuff like this happens it *really* bugs me and I want to grab my kids and run away yelling, "Leave my kids alone!!!".

 

Then I wonder whether I'm just a radical homeschooling freak who can't possibly imagine that anyone else could positively impact her kids.

 

Then I come here and I don't feel quite so alone ;)

[Anna]

I find it disturbing. He's barely three for goodness sake and he doesn't "get" what he's parroting back. I asked him about praying at church today and he told me he prayed for God. I asked, "Oh, what did you pray to God about?" He answered, "Jesus". I said, "What did you ask Jesus?" And his answer was, "Nothing, but my teacher asked a lot of questions."

 

Well, there ya go!!! Your ds's answers are revealing. Go with your gut feelings on this. You should find it disturbing. What kind of a SS teacher would do that sort of thing? I would stay right on top of the class teachings and if for any reason you continue to find more disturbing incidences, I would have no problem yanking my kid out of the class.

[Slartibartfast]

I think young children are perfectly capable of loving and even worshiping Christ with true convictions.

 

However I don't think a child that young would understand the implications of turning their life over to Christ.

 

Some might, but that would take serious discussion on such matters...don't they sing songs in Sunday School anymore?

 

Zacchaeus was a wee little man? This Little Light of Mine?

 

I am just afraid that it could create a situation that could lead to complacency.

Edited October 12, 2008 by Sis

[kokotg]

It is the emphasis on "getting" them saved through manipulation that I find disturbing. I believe very young children as infants can be saved' date=' but we might not necessarily recognize that as adults. I know parents who won't pray with their children as Christians, because they can't possibly be old enough for it to be real. I think it is just as dangerous to tell a child who says "I love Jesus" - "No, you don't really, because you are not old enough to really understand". I think people forget that we have to become, as Jesus put it, "little children", to enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Any thoughts?[/quote']

 

If I'm following you right, I don't think I disagree with anything you've said. I guess I'm kind of looking at it as two separate issues. I don't personally believe that there needs to be a single moment that one can look back on and say "that's when I got saved" (though I know that for many people it IS that kind of experience). But that's a theological difference I have with evangelicalism, or at least with evangelicalism as it was taught to me. I have a different kind of concern about pressuring very young children to "get saved" not because that's a calling they feel for themselves but out of a desire to please parents or teachers or out of a sense of social pressure.

[6packofun]

So I go to pick my three year old up from Sunday school today (he turned three last week, btw) and one of the leaders says, "Guess what? LO heard the gospel today and prayed the sinner's prayer! Here's a booklet to take home, etc., etc."

 

I think I tuned out at some point and just smiled and took the booklet. Something just sat really wrong with me. Dh is confused as to what the problem is - it's not like he can never pray that again or that it's a bad thing - in fact, we want our children to become followers of Christ. So, what's my problem?

 

I find it disturbing. He's barely three for goodness sake and he doesn't "get" what he's parroting back. I asked him about praying at church today and he told me he prayed for God. I asked, "Oh, what did you pray to God about?" He answered, "Jesus". I said, "What did you ask Jesus?" And his answer was, "Nothing, but my teacher asked a lot of questions."

 

I have no issues with them being available or even encouraging kids to come to Christ but walking my three year old step by step through the process when he doesn't even understand what he's doing or why seems a bit much.

 

Am I totally out of line here? Or should I chill out and just be happy?

 

That's something that I feel strongly enough about that I would ask those questions of your ds in front of the teacher and then see what the response is. I'm all for making sure the gospel is presented on a consistent basis to the children, but in churches where there is a numbers game going on (how many kids can we convert this week??!!), there is usually a scary lack of depth to the whole process, including *discipleship* after conversion. And it also shows a lack of understanding about age appropriate teaching and discernment, IMO!

[Colleen in NS]

I waffle between wanting to be the one involved with these kinds of things and wondering whether my parenting/homeschooling approach is too hands-on and whether I should loosen up and be thankful for other influences in our children's lives.

 

Then I wonder whether I'm just a radical homeschooling freak who can't possibly imagine that anyone else could positively impact her kids.

 

The way I see these things is that you are the mother, you get to decide what is best for your child. We only get a few years to mold our children's hearts and minds the way we see fit, and if you want to be the major influence in their spiritual lives, then I say go for it and don't worry what others think about what kind of mother you are. Of course you can let others positively impact your kids - but you get to decide who can have that influence, too, by choosing where to put your kids and by making the major spiritual influence at home and letting Sunday School supplement YOUR teaching.

[Soph the vet]

What is the 'sinners prayer'?

 

It goes something like this:

Dear Lord Jesus,

I recognize that I am a sinner. Please forgive me for my sin. I know that You died for my sins on the cross and I want You to be my Savior. Please come into my heart today. I want to live my life for You.

 

There are many variations of the above prayer that can be found on tracts or in books, etc. from various ministries. Often times there will be Bible verses attached at various points to the prayer. The trouble is that some well-meaning Christians will push a person to "repeat after me" a prayer like the above and the person has had no real conviction of sin in their life, no realization that God's wrath abides upon them (John 3:36), that God is not just love but He is just and requires sin to be paid for, that Jesus was the perfect payment for sin on the cross poured out in His blood, that the resurrection was God's stamp of approval on Jesus' sacrifice and that those now trusting in His sacrifice, not their own, can have eternal life = salvation. They pray that prayer hoping that Jesus will make their life better when often times, in reality, following Jesus does just the opposite to this earthly life, it gets harder. When life gets hard for the false convert they walk away never understanding why the prayer didn't "stick".

More info than you probably wanted.

[Tracy in Ky]

Am I totally out of line here? Or should I chill out and just be happy?

 

I would be very upset. That should not have happened without your permission, presence and authority.

 

We keep our children with us in church; I do not trust other people with their religious education.

 

I'm sorry this happened. Can you remove them from the instruction and just keep them with you now?

[Alenee]

it goes something like this:

Dear lord jesus,

i recognize that i am a sinner. Please forgive me for my sin. I know that you died for my sins on the cross and i want you to be my savior. Please come into my heart today. I want to live my life for you.

 

There are many variations of the above prayer that can be found on tracts or in books, etc. From various ministries. Often times there will be bible verses attached at various points to the prayer. The trouble is that some well-meaning christians will push a person to "repeat after me" a prayer like the above and the person has had no real conviction of sin in their life, no realization that god's wrath abides upon them (john 3:36), that god is not just love but he is just and requires sin to be paid for, that jesus was the perfect payment for sin on the cross poured out in his blood, that the resurrection was god's stamp of approval on jesus' sacrifice and that those now trusting in his sacrifice, not their own, can have eternal life = salvation. They pray that prayer hoping that jesus will make their life better when often times, in reality, following jesus does just the opposite to this earthly life, it gets harder. When life gets hard for the false convert they walk away never understanding why the prayer didn't "stick".

More info than you probably wanted.

 

very well said!!!:)

[Cathy in IL]

I believe it is certainly possible for children to come to Christ young. I think it is also possible for them to desperately want to please their teachers. We teach them to do what the teacher says, so why wouldn't they raise their little hands or repeat a prayer if the teacher seems to want them to. I am the Cubbies director at our church. We have 39 little 3 and 4 year olds. We present the gospel to the children, but we never ask them to respond to the gospel in a group setting. When we talk to them in their small group time, there is time to talk to them as individuals. I have had children ask good questions or make comments that show the Holy Spirit is working in their hearts, but the only child that I have prayed with was my own son. In our Cubbies group the leaders tell the parents when their child has asked questions or made these comments. I think children's ministry exists to come alongside the parents, but not to replace the parents.

 

I wonder if this teacher is so concerned about the numbers that she has lost sight of the whole point. I don't know the personality of your church or the individuals involved, but if it were my church, I would talk to someone about what happened. I would speak with the teacher or maybe even the children's ministry director. I would tell them I appreciate their service and their heart for God and for children. I would then let them know that my child didn't actually understand what he was praying. I would ask questions about how they present things to the children. They may not respond positively, but maybe they would think about it. Who knows, maybe another child will get a better chance to understand things on an age appropriate level if the teacher takes time to think it all through a bit more.

[Erica in PA]

I think the most important thing is that you don't point back to this event, or any subsequent profession of faith, as "proof" of ds's salvation. So many people grow up with a false assurance of salvation, because their parents remind them of "that time when you were five and you prayed that prayer...." I would just keep on teaching your ds, praying for him, and not make a big deal about this interaction with his teacher. Eventually, hopefully he will accept Christ and follow him, but it's way too early to tell. All three of my children have understood the facts of the gospel since they were about three, but most bright, compliant children whose parents have taught them about the Lord will accept this. That's not proof of salvation, though. It takes time, and maturity, before we will really know where our children stand before God. Thankfully, we can entrust them to His care along the way!

 

Erica

[Twinmom]

You know, any time I've ever taught Sunday School or VBS, our policy has been to direct very young children back to their parents to pray the "sinner's prayer" or the like with them. Frankly, I am surprised to hear that any teacher would try to encourage this with one so small...it is too easy to lead them in something they cannot understand. I'm sure that there are some 3 yr olds who might be ready, but that's something only a parent can really know about a child.

 

IMO, a 3 yr old needs to know that God loves them and forgives them when they are wrong...that's about all they can understand at that age. They cannot nor should they be forced to try to understand about Christ dying for their sins. It's scary, too complex and too overwhelming. Telling them that God loves them very, very much and forgives them when they ask for forgiveness is all we ever did in VBS.

 

You are right to be concerned and to voice your concerns in your church. At the very least, you should have been notified that your child wished to pray and asked to join in.

[momofkhm]

For m, it's not that he's three. My ds came to faith at 3. No one who knows him doubts that he is in fact saved.

 

My issue is that the teacher took over for you as the parent. I'm in charge of SS at my church. I personally believe that a teacher can do everything to lead a child into saving faith, but it is the parents' responsibility for that final step. The teacher should not be leading your 3yo in the prayer. She should be meeting you at the door and saying "Sarah, littlest one was asking some very leading questions today. He may be ready to accept Christ. Here is a booklet that may help you both if you still have questions." You as his parent are the only one qualified to say if he has the mental capacity to understand what he is doing. (Well your dh as well!:) )

 

But yes, I would be upset with the teacher for this as well, just for a different reason as the first page of replies said.

[Peek a Boo]

when my second son was 5 in AWANA his leader announced to me w/ a big smile when i picked him up that he had accepted Christ. i smiled back and said "again?! great! he did that last night too!"

 

I do think there are many kids that have an intuitive relationship w/ Christ from the get go. I saw that pretty easily w/ my second ds --the Spirit seems strong in him. I personally can't recall any "day i was saved" --I've always had that relationship w/ God and Christ, it has just matured, like our relationship w/ our parents does.

 

but it looks like i'd be echoing the sentiments and thoughts of the other ladies as to what you experienced, so i'll stop here :)

[Rose in BC]

This kind of thing bothers me, too. You aren't alone.

 

Ria

 

:iagree:

[CLHCO]

Some lambs are born in the flock and stay (dh)' date=' some wander and are called back (me), and some were outsiders from another flock called by the Good Shepherd into His flock.[/quote']

 

Oh, good way of saying that! Testimony envy drives me batty. My goal is for my children to not have an over-dramatic testimony to share other than the idea that their mother raised them in the faith and they followed, hoping to extend that to many generations to come.

 

I have heard ministers say that you should be able to list a very specific date in your mind but that's not the case for all.

 

I am a bit torn on that sinner's prayer though. It's thrown around willy-nilly but sometimes it really strikes a person at the right moment. Dr. Dobson swears he was 3 when he was saved in tears over his sin. That doesn't match most 3 year olds I know, but I won't argue with an encounter by the Holy Spirit of another.

 

I guess I sort of "came to Christ" at 7 from a sinners prayer lead by a lady down the street, but wandered away a few times because my family was basically Christian in politics only so growing in the faith was not going to happen easily in that atmosphere. I still look at that date because the Christ I know today really was the one I desired so much at that age, even though I admit the "sin" part didn't hit as hard until I was older. Maybe I was saved in a 3 or 4 part program, spread over 25+ years. :tongue_smilie: The faith and understanding I had at 7 was a child's faith. I don't know if I was "saved" that day but I do believe I was claimed, if that makes sense. The Jesus I loved then is the Jesus I love today.

[Heather in Neverland]

I picked my ds up from Sunday School when he was about 4yo and his teacher told me with a big smile "Guess what? Kyle asked Jesus to be his forever friend today!!"

 

WHAT???? What in the cockadoodle is a "forever friend"? Could we possibly water down the gospel even more?

 

Last summer we were at a VBS and the youth pastor was doing the end of the night alter call and I felt like I was watching a high-pressure salesman. He actually said that they should accept Christ tonight because it might be their last chance! Yeah, I am pretty sure we want conversion by duress...I thought the crusades ended a long time ago...sheesh.

 

For me, salvation has been a process more than a moment and God is definitely not through with me yet.

 

I probably wouldn't get too upset about it though, because your child will probably not remember it by tomorrow. ;)

[Vida Winter]

Then I am a freak too!:lol:

From now on when I see one of your posts I am just going to post "Freak!"

 

I guess you can add me to the "Freak" list. I teach SS also. I would think that this prayer would be odd for a 3yo.

 

I have to teach a class with all ages. Is it possible that he is in a multi-age group? One of my biggest problems is to speak to multiple ages.

 

~D

[Amy loves Bud]

What in the cockadoodle is a "forever friend"?

 

I do believe you've captured everything I'm thinking right here. Thank you!