Ausmumof3 Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Any chance your mum has undiagnosed add? Either way you absolutely need your bit of space. It might be time to just let that intj we don't do feelings kick in for a bit. Otherwise send her on a holiday like someone else suggested and have one yourselves at the same time... Or see if she has some understanding friends that urgently need her assistance or a visit for a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmseB Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Yeah, I think she sort of gets it, but not fully. We do all withdraw and do our own things on evenings and weekends. If I could sum up the conflict, it's that her expression of happiness causes us stress. When she's happy, she's singing and dancing and interrupting, wanting to share that with everyone... and it drives us bonkers. It would be a problem even if we didn't live together. We need a break from that. I expect giddy-goofy-happy from my children because they are children and occasionally from DH. I'm out of "head room" to deal with that from another adult. Especially daily. And it sounds bad when I put it like that. I have to echo redsquirrel on this. No, it doesn't sound bad. It sounds reasonable. I think your mindset about her happiness and what is reasonable have been skewed by living with her for so long. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbecueMom Posted March 11, 2015 Author Share Posted March 11, 2015 Any chance your mum has undiagnosed add? . Yup. I would put money on it. She was a solid C student as a kid, and remembers she spent a lot of time not realizing she was talking and not listening and subsequently spending time in the hall. And I'm certain the financial problems come from that as well. For the record, forgot to mention this, the vacation was booked and deposited and time off approved before today. There was never a question of not going, just the feet-dragging on the conversation part of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne in CA Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 I feel for you, because the whole situation does sound rough. Your mom is not crazy, she is immature with a difficult personality type. I don't know that she sounds manipulative, she sounds like she has no way to screen her feelings. You can't be a hostage to that, and you are going to have to tell her about the vacation, but probably not tell her that dh must have it or he will explode with frustration with her, lol. There is only so many boundaries and so much honesty that are worthwhile to have because she doesn't sound like she will be able to correctly process those things anyway. I think you need to get creative with your own boundaries. The duplex probably is important even if it makes her cry for years. Your dh needs it. But I don't think it would be wise to move her out and deal with the whole situation later when there the health and money issues will be worse. I think you should look at creative ways to get away inexpensively. A camp trailer that you and dh can park at a local state park for the summer and get away to? That could make great memories for the kiddos too. It might be cheap if you could be a park host. Even tent camping locally for a night here or a night there to get away might help your dh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KungFuPanda Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 The duplex situation sounds nice. You and your family on one side and your mom and brother on the other. I'm all for close family ties, but living with each other is different. We could happily live with my mom, but not his. Right now my grandmother lives with my mom. She's driving mom nuts. My mom gets along with everyone, and really enjoyed it when my grandfather moved in at the end of his life, but his personality wasn't attention seeking at all. It's my grandmother who told me "No house is big enough for two women." I agree with the others. Your mom is TOO young for this situation. Heck, she's young enough to take some classes and improve her marketability. She'll likely live another 30-50 years. She really should hold out until her final decade to crash with you. I know the conversation will be uncomfortable, but it won't be more uncomfortable than living like this indefinitely. Tell her she's intense. Tell her she's a force of nature. Ride out the tears and get your life back. Make a one or two year plan now and help her take steps toward independence and include therapy if necessary. At this point she's like an adult child who is reluctant to leave because the amenities she can afford aren't as good as what her parents have. 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 FWIW, some of the people talking to you about this are your mother's age, or very nearly. She is as young as people who still have kids at home yet is emotionally manipulating you into taking care of her on a daily, live-in basis. Yes. I'm 51 and Husband is 58. My mother is ninety and lives alone (from choice). We expect to be working until we are seventy (we hope) and allowing our children to live their lives seeing as much of us as they like. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TammyS Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 I could be projecting a bit here, but it may also be that your mother would be better off financially living on her own. I was tempted to move my own mother in with us last fall (who is plenty young enough to work and support herself) because her house is falling apart (down, would be more accurate) and I wanted to give her time to save money (to fix the house or whatever) by living with us rather than renting an apt. But, as my dh and a good friend pointed out, she had lived in her (paid for) inherited house for over a decade without doing the work. If she lived with us, she wouldn't save her money, she'd just keep spending as she always had. And then I would be crazy and then it would be ON. My mother will never save the money to fix her house, and that's too bad, but for the first time in her life she is fully self supported, and that is better for her. The necessity of paying her rent and utilities will keep her working, which will keep her stable. So, like I said, I'm probably projecting. But if your mother has the luxury of not worrying about rent, it may be that she also isn't motivated to work as hard on her financial situation as she should. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 He lives in a tiny apartment with a roommate, although he's welcome to stay here for that week and crash on the couch. It's a farther drive to his work though. Honestly *he* would benefit from them getting an apartment together, so he could spend his money getting through school instead of all the living expenses. Bringing this rather valid point up equals, "You are throwing me out!" in her mind, which confuses me because I see problems and solutions and the feelings about it are hard for me to wrap my head around. I hate to say this, but your mother is behaving like a spoiled teenager and you are letting her get away with it. Seriously, read some of the threads about overly emotional teen girls and see if it feels like you are reading about your mom. Obviously you are the mature person in the relationship, but you aren't doing your mom any favors by letting her play Peter Pan and live in your house as though she is the silly, giddy child and you're her mom. Your dh must be a saint. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrincessMommy Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 oh dear... that would be a difficult conversation. But, I agree with others...it's not your job to make her happy. It sounds like she's crossed some boundaries already and you and DH may want to have a heart-to-heart about what he see's happening in the near future. One way to look at this conversation is to think of how disappointed your dh would be if you caved to your mom. It really wouldn't be fair to him. Good luck 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbecueMom Posted March 11, 2015 Author Share Posted March 11, 2015 oh dear... that would be a difficult conversation. But, I agree with others...it's not your job to make her happy. It sounds like she's crossed some boundaries already and you and DH may want to have a heart-to-heart about what he see's happening in the near future. One way to look at this conversation is to think of how disappointed your dh would be if you caved to your mom. It really wouldn't be fair to him. Good luck Caving on the vacation was never going to happen. Trip is set and partially paid for. It's more like, "How do I talk about this without doing the feelings thing?" And trust me, DH and I talk about this a lot. He knows I'm PMSing when I bring it up nonstop. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Tell her as soon as possible and get it off your mind. If she reacts like a drama queen, tell her you will discuss it with her when she is ready to act like an adult. I'm usually pretty sympathetic to moms and MILs, possibly because I am often close to their age (I'm 51,) but in this case, I have no excuses or sympathy for the way she acts, because she does it because she knows she can get away with it and because it helps her manipulate you into letting her have her way. And that is just plain wrong. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Caving on the vacation was never going to happen. Trip is set and partially paid for. It's more like, "How do I talk about this without doing the feelings thing?" And trust me, DH and I talk about this a lot. He knows I'm PMSing when I bring it up nonstop. Again, you can't control her feelings. She is going to feel what she is going to feel. You also can't control her reactions. That is going to be what it is going to be. You can control you own reactions to her. That is all you can do, all any of us can do. So, make a script and stick to it. Make it something you feel comfortable with BUT not too wordy. Don't explain, don't apologize. Don't hedge or leave an opening for her to come along. If you do any of that you are allowed to backtrack and say "I am sorry, I wasn't being clear. Let me rephrase that, even if XXYY were to happen, you still cannot come with us." or something like that. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 TammyS, on 11 Mar 2015 - 12:04 PM, said:TammyS, on 11 Mar 2015 - 12:04 PM, said:TammyS, on 11 Mar 2015 - 12:04 PM, said: Also, I'm wondering, what was the conversation when she moved in? Was it envisioned to be a permanent solution? Was there a goal for her to become independent again? She's too young to be living off of you. My HUSBAND is her age. His parents still live independently. His father works full time! *I'M* her age!!! I have a 10yo! she needs to be out of your immediate family home. do not feel guilty putting YOUR marriage and children first. a house with a mil apartment, or her moving in with your brother are valid choices. do NOT feel guilty because she made bad life choices and wants you to bail her out - because that is what you are doing, and what she wants. don't expect her to be cheery you are going on vacation without her. tough cookies. you can explain things in as reasonable of terms as possible - and all she'll see is abandonment. so, do not try to justify going anywhere without her. be matter of fact. "mom, we're going to __, in ___. please get the mail, water the plants, etc. we'll see you when we come back". do NOT apologize for going with out her. your mother is not emotionally healthy. she needs to get HER OWN life - not piggy back on yours. eta: would it be possible to encourage her to sign up for an evening class at least once a week? anything she's always wanted to learn how to do? pottery? art? garden club? etc. volunteer somewhere? it would benefit everyone. she'd get out into her own life, and you'd all get a break. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Your mom is only 7 years older than me. In just about 7 years, I will have my youngest in 11th grade and I will be planning the next stage of my life. It sure won't involve living with my kids. This is supposed to be the time of her life that is hers. Her kids are grown and occupied, she only has herself to worry about, she is healthy and young with maybe 30 years of life ahead of her. She needs a nudge out of the nest. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alicia64 Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 You are describing narcissism or borderline personality disorder. A couple can have a trip alone. Period. Parents don't get to be "hurt" because they're not invited. That's completely ridiculous -- and that you're "going along with her" feelings is a sign that she's hauled you along for her mentally unstable trip. I don't mean this cruelly in the least, but you need assistance in how to deal w/ a difficult person who is using "hurt" as a tool for manipulation. Alley 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in Australia Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Also, I'm wondering, what was the conversation when she moved in? Was it envisioned to be a permanent solution? Was there a goal for her to become independent again? She's too young to be living off of you. My HUSBAND is her age. His parents still live independently. His father works full time! My husband is older 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in Australia Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 FWIW, some of the people talking to you about this are your mother's age, or very nearly. She is as young as people who still have kids at home yet is emotionally manipulating you into taking care of her on a daily, live-in basis. Your DH is on the edge of a breakdown from not being able to call his soul his own in his own house, and you are afraid to tell her you want a few days out of her company! That's not right. She and your brother could join forces, or she could get a second job to save for retirement...these are actually her problems and not yours... a year with your family was very generous of you and your DH but she could wreck your home this way, if you keep allowing it. I agree with the poster who said you can choose to weather her tears. "You don't need your mother's constant Approval." If you have to embroider that phrase on a pillowcase or repeat it before the bathroom mirror ten times every morning, you won't be the first grown daughter to do it. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottakee Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Yup. I would put money on it. She was a solid C student as a kid, and remembers she spent a lot of time not realizing she was talking and not listening and subsequently spending time in the hall. And I'm certain the financial problems come from that as well. For the record, forgot to mention this, the vacation was booked and deposited and time off approved before today. There was never a question of not going, just the feet-dragging on the conversation part of it. Maybe between now and then you could get her to the doctor and started on ADD meds. Seriously, they can be a HUGE HUGE help........even if it just helps her deal with the fact that you are going without her. It might even help her in her job situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbecueMom Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 You are describing narcissism or borderline personality disorder. A couple can have a trip alone. Period. Parents don't get to be "hurt" because they're not invited. That's completely ridiculous -- and that you're "going along with her" feelings is a sign that she's hauled you along for her mentally unstable trip. I don't mean this cruelly in the least, but you need assistance in how to deal w/ a difficult person who is using "hurt" as a tool for manipulation. Alley I really don't think this is it, honestly. I don't think she ever intends for us to make decisions based on how she feels. We've had this discussion about having feelings without expressing them, and it's a foreign concept to her. She has no poker face. Every feeling comes out verbally, good and bad. And for two people who aren't feeling-type people, it's frustrating to have to "share" those thoughts. For example, when I say we're going somewhere with the kids, she'll almost always say, "Oh, I want to go!" About half the time we'll ask if she wants to go, and sometimes she accepts and other times she says, "Oh no, you guys take the kids and have fun!" She never asks first. It's that original "I want to go!" that grates on our nerves, because even if we felt that way when someone told us their plans, we'd never actually say it. She's going to say, "I want to go on vacation," because... she wants to go on a vacation. So does everyone! But most people just think it. And then it snowballs into other quirks that start to bother me. She's been telling me tonight about this conversation between her and some friends that is funny to them, apparently. Had to be there sort of thing. After listening and nodding at my kids and DH and their stories every day, I want to start running around screaming and pulling my hair out instead of politely listening to one more story about people I don't know or work I don't do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in Australia Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 quoteFor the record, forgot to mention this, the vacation was booked and deposited and time off approved before today. There was never a question of not going, just the feet-dragging on the conversation part of it. quote :hurray: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbecueMom Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 Be tough with your mom--her feelings are her business, not yours. And start looking for a duplex. I know it's hard. We went through this with my mil. She wanted to move in with us, only she wanted us to totally rearrange our lives around HER. Didn't happen. Funny thing--none of the in-laws were willing to do that either. About the duplex, oh no! I was actually kidding when I mentioned that. We bought this house because we would have plenty of room to grow into it and keep our housing costs low until the kids are grown. If we decide to move it will be to benefit the kids. Definitely not derailing our finances for this situation. Plus I hate moving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbecueMom Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 Another "reason how we got here" is that I have been chronically ill since my youngest was born. The "morning sickness" intensified after birth, I was on anti-nausea meds for months, and just started being able to eat after 4pm last fall. I'm still unable to read aloud in the evenings, get queasy when nursing, and the "I think I have a stomach virus" feeling is my normal. My mom took over the dishes and dinner cleanup in the evening so I could rest and DH could manage the kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbecueMom Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 Well, would it be cheaper to hire a 14yo mother's helped for the evening rather that support your mom? Not really, since she does pitch in financially. She's not living here rent free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ausmumof3 Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Another "reason how we got here" is that I have been chronically ill since my youngest was born. The "morning sickness" intensified after birth, I was on anti-nausea meds for months, and just started being able to eat after 4pm last fall. I'm still unable to read aloud in the evenings, get queasy when nursing, and the "I think I have a stomach virus" feeling is my normal. My mom took over the dishes and dinner cleanup in the evening so I could rest and DH could manage the kids. I have one friend similar to this who has been better since doing gluten and dairy free... I know that seems to be the answer to everything right now but just thought I'd put it there in case it helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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