Rebecca Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 I have been using Living Books Curriculum this year- which I have truly adored. I finally felt like I found something that was "us" and I found my "groove." I was so drawn to this program because of the dual history focus: american and world. I felt that it had a christian worldview at its base. I love the CM method. I love the Living Books method! I really don't have one bad thing to say about the curriculum. The pace of the lessons has been great. My oldest has been doing wonderful learning recorder, story telling, etc. However, through recent discussions with my husband, and listening to some of my children's narrations... I have realized that the program is not meeting some of our more important goals... and through direction from my DH and discussions... I realized that we do NOT want to teach our children the ancient cultures at a young age... we don't want them to learn "how" to mummify or look at illustrations with egyptian gods on them. I was feeling uneasy with some of the history readings and the narrations confirmed it- then the talk with my husband! I am so.... I don't know- stressed, frustrated! I can't "write" my own/ design my own because I don't have time nor the "ability" with the older children- i.e. I wouldn't know what all to do with my would-be third grader... I wish I could... I love books so much... I AM SO NOT UNIT STUDY! I tried MFW- in fact, I am using the phonics with two of my children right now- but the complete program is so not for me. TOG follows the classical history schedule- plus I wanted literature, music,art, etc. to all be a part of our school but not NECESSARILY related to history. I have been looking at Heart of Dakota... I am SO SAD. I love our school. Any thoughts? Especially from women who have followed direction from husband/Lord even when it was challenging? I am sorry to say that I feel like I have "lost" my edge with screening stuff for my children- as that has always been a big priority for us... but I guess I have "so much on the brain" with all the children and other issues... I can't imagine schooling all textbooks... It is so hard to find literature that doesn't have stuff we don't want in it... Plus there is the: I buy a book only to have to take it back because "such and such" was in it. Please no flames- we are conservative christians, Rebecca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trivium Academy Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 Maybe instead of doing both World and American, just edit the World out and only do American? Substitute fables and folklore for world history at this time? There are tons of stories that you can do for each country, most of which have wonderful moral lessons. William Bennett's A Book of Virtues would or the child's version would be wonderful to read from. I would also contact Living Books to see if they have any recommendations before you look to replace something you love. I hope you find your answer, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alana in Canada Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 We too are Christain, even though we are not as conservative. But I do understand your concerns: I have recently been pulling togather a Canadian History course for my children and I have elected NOT to use certain materials--even though they are "living books" and wonderfully appropriate for the children at their age--simply because they use language concerning Native people which is highly objectionable to us. I figured I could explain it as "just an old-fashioned" attitude--but I really, really can't. They are young. They are impressionable. When they get older and have the mental skills to understand, then, perhaps, we can use it--but it'll be as a text on world view, not History. You are going to have to design your own curriculuum. There's no way around it. But, from all I've seen of Truthquest it can help you pull together the resources you need--as well as help you screen out those you don't. Also, how about a course on "world-view"? Check out Cathy Duffy's website for curriculum suggestions. As for "losing" your homeschool, I know. It's hard. It's really too bad. But you can create something better and more in tune with what you and your husband both want for your children--and that will be a treasure beyond all measure. Blessings, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue G in PA Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 She, too, is very against teaching young children Egyptian gods/goddesses, Greek gods/goddesses, etc. She doesn't include it in her curriculum. Yes, her curriculum is geared more toward the 4th - high school age dc, but it is adaptable for youngers. I'm just starting to do it now with my youngers. Diana is such a wonderful person and her curriculum really shows her heart for God and leading our children into an understanding that History is God's story. As for literature, she offers some terrific reading suggestions for all ages. We are conservative Christians as well and I, too, am very disappointed sometimes by the books I get from the library. I can only edit so much. I pray often that God will shield my children from any unwanted information, close their eyes and ears to it and will only allow that material in that HE wants them to know. God can supercede any questionable material that inadvertantly slips in, KWIM? Try Diana...she is awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TolleLegeAcademy Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 I would second what Jessica said. Perhaps follow only the American History strand right now or see if you can edit out the things that are causing concern. Are you using the first grade year? Could you possibly just follow the schedule for Old Testament Days and then leave the remainder of the books off? I have been going in circles for months (well, an in town friend of mine laughed at me the other day when we were talking history and said it's been more like years...) on this very issue. History is not my strong point and I have been thinking that if we followed a chronological study (with possibly two strands like LBC or Lindafay's) that it would help introduce dd to things that she would later learn about more in depth and that would make a big difference in her comfort with history later. BUT my dd is also very sensitive and so I have not found anything already made to use with her "as is". (Ancient history or not.....even Ambleside's suggested Year 1 of An/Our Island Story has much that I would need to edit out.) So, I will be editing out things if we do follow anything for ancient history at this time. But I do think that she can still learn some basic concepts of people that lived long ago without going into as much detail while she is young. Saying all of this to say, "I hear you" on having to make these decisions and how hard it is to navigate sometimes. I have just started studying Simply Charlotte Mason's curriculum guide and recommendations for literature for young ones, but I do believe they tend to leave out some of the topics that you mentioned. You might take a look there too to perhaps keep following LBC sequence and just substitute some books. I think in the end that is what I will do. Pick a time sequence to follow and then try to find the books that are the best fit for us right now. (And so far LBC's double strands and sequence are my favorite followed closely by LindaFay's.) I hope that you find something that works for your family. Edited to add: Here is a direct link to the time period for first grade (if that's the year you are on) in the SCM guide http://simplycharlottemason.com/planning/scmguide/hgboverview/hgb2/ I also had the thought that Heart of Wisdom's recommendations for this time period/age might be helpful for you. I will look over the site to see if any are online, but I have the HOW Teaching Approach book and there is a very detailed list of books in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prairiegirl Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 I agree with editing out the things that make you uncomfortable. Just don't do it. If this doesn't work for you, you could look at Ambleside Online They don't do ancient history until Gr. 6. They may have some books during their years that deal with myths but, again, if you aren't comfortable with it, don't do it. Julia mom of 3 (8,7,5) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneRoomHomeSchool Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 Our family has the same convictions as you and your Dh does...I am going to PM you. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca Posted February 7, 2008 Author Share Posted February 7, 2008 Thank you so much for these replies. I have thought seriously about talking/emailing Sheila Carroll about it as she is wonderful... maybe I will go that route. I appreciate all the thoughts... I am concerned that I am "not on my game" to screen all the books and keep out the content. This happened already as I added Pyramid by McCauley(not even scheduled in the curriculum) and did not preview it and was caught off guard by some things. Overall, we enjoyed it- but also "dabbled" in the KA, etc. of the egyptians:( Thank you for the Simply CM links... I was studying their modules earlier too! I was looking at the grade 3 history books for LBC. I think their spines are okay... On the Shores of the Great Sea and The Discovery of the New Worlds... it would just mean avoiding some other things... Later, I am going to read through the replies again and all the suggestions. For those who are familiar with LBC I am actually teaching both grade one and grade two this year. The grade one is UNREVISED using Greenleaf's OT guide. I have no problem with Grade One. Hey, Listen to this has exposed us to some literature I probably would have avoided but it hasn't been damaging-I don't think. We don't "shelter" from the Bible at all so that hasn't been a problem. Grade two is a study of the American Revolution (Johnny Tremain) and Ancient Egypt. It is Grade Two where I have run into more of the trouble. Hope this makes sense, I appreciate the remarks, Rebecca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca Posted February 7, 2008 Author Share Posted February 7, 2008 Had to add: I guess First Grade has been more of a problem: it was my first grader's narration of Leif the Lucky that also stirred some "alarm" bells as his whole narration was full of the "false gods." He is a visual child and the pictures affected him! Didn't even mention Leif became a Christian or even the fact that he found North America!!!! Sigh. Rebecca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenora in MD Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 Looking at the list of books for first grade, it looks like Leif the Lucky would really be the only objectionable one. I would just be careful to edit out what is objectionable to you for the rest of the year and then really think about what you want for next year. Second grade really gets in ancient egypt, so it may not be practicable to get the curriculum and have to edit out so much. You may want to check out ambleside online. In the early years, the books are excellent. I also think that Truthquest is excellent. They have three books for elementary age that focus on American History. And they have a wonderful biblical world view. We are actually using their ancient history book for my middle schooler this year, and they have a very biblical and cautious philosophy about teaching ancient history. Whatever you use, you will have to have your radar up. And when you do miss something, discuss it with the children and ultimately pray and trust the Lord with your children. We are not perfect, that's why God gives us mercy (and grace too!). :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Another Lynn Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 I would 2nd Diana Waring. There was just a post recently on her yahoo group about this same issue - how much to expose little ones to false gods, etc. I haven't used her whole curriculum yet, but I'm looking into next year for my 4th grader. He already loves her cds. The year we did ancients I started with Mystery of History and while I don't remember anything objectionable we just didn't enjoy it, so I ended up just following the Greenleaf guide to the OT. We didn't spend much time on Egypt except for Israel's interaction with it. We also used many selections from AO for read alouds that year. (Again, there are probably some you wouldn't want to use). As for grade 2 - I would just ignore the whole Egypt study all together and either focus on the OT or something else entirely. Hope you can find a simple way to keep what you like and edit out the rest, or else find something new that meets your needs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SandraDumas Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 real sticking point for me was that my dh wanted a full curriculum, specifically from a Reformed perspective! I spun my wheels *a lot* trying other things and trying to convince him and making justifications for not following my husband's lead! But now I am going back to the curriculum he originally chose, and I want to! I desire from my heart of hearts to actually use this curriculum and God has been so good as to make me excited about it. Please honor your husband, you know you will be blessed. But in the meantime, pray that the Lord would change your heart to actually delight in your husband's direction, and also to be of one mind! I think it's probably more likely that you can tweak than you think. Or, what about My father's world? Do they teach other gods early on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaChristina Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 we are conservative Christians as well. I have recently been looking at Beautiful Feet just for that reason. The author doesn't believe in teaching the ancients to young children either. So far, I think it looks pretty good. She seems more careful than some in her book selections. I did notice that you had mentioned Leif the Lucky and that is in the first pack. I don't have that one, but the one on Abraham Lincoln is okay. I like that it is quite a bit cheaper than most of the other living book curriculums out there. I looked at some of the guide samples and was pleased with the questions and commentary there. I don't know...it's just a thought that is floating around in my head right now as I don't have time to write my own curriculum with six small children either. Blessings on your search and if you find something great please share!!:) His Blessings, Christina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narrow Gate Academy Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 TruthQuest American History for Young Students. The commentary in the guide is Christian. With 3 guides that could easily be your elementary program. If there is something that might be objectionable in a book, there is usually a note about it in the book list. I have found the grade recommendations to be right on. The book lists are excellent so it's easy to find things at the library. I've found some wonderful older books on the list that we've truly enjoyed this year. We did ancient history in first, but I put it together myself specifically to limit my children's exposure to a lot of content that I didn't feel was appropriate at the time. Since time is a consideration for you, I would stick with American history. HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhonda@LivingWater Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 We have used Mystery of History and have been very happy with its content and we,too, are conservative Christians. It is always best to follow your own heart and convictions.:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malenki Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 We're the same way: DH is adamant that we not introduce Egypt, Greece, Rome, etc. too early. We have discussed ad nauseum just using textbooks and adding living books to that. For now, we're not but it's still in the back of our minds as the backup plan. What we have done is gone with TruthQuest American History. It took a bit to get rolling but now we both absolutely love it. Our discussions are really wonderful and we've not been upset with any book she recommends. We definitely edit extensively; I may check out 5 books for a topic and keep only one. (Sometimes our library doesn't have any she recommends so I grab what I can on the topic.) A couple of times we've just dropped the topic altogether and moved on. She saves Egypt/Greece for 5th grade. Our plan is to do the American History guides for 1st - 3rd and then do a year of Old Testament history and bible geography in 4th. Oh, and probably some state history/geography that year as well. TruthQuest *has* taken time for me every few weeks to flip through the new books and decide what we will or won't use. That may not be the best fit for you because of the time spent picking. I think My Father's World would definitely be something to look at as well as other's have recommended. They also save ancient history for later (4th grade). Their program is complete with the books they sell in the kit; you don't have to ever check out or buy an extra book. They're also on my "backup" plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca Posted February 8, 2008 Author Share Posted February 8, 2008 Thanks again, for these new responses. I have a lot to think about! We are expecting a new baby in May- and so will have a little one for the new school year along with our five ages 8 down to 2... that is one reason why my time is so limited. It is encouraging to read of other moms who are working through this. I have been drawn to Truthquest history... I like the Christian "commentary" included in the guides. Pondering, Rebecca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaLisa Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 Rebecca, I would second the recommendation to start your study of Ancient history with the Bible. Our cycle through the Ancients is rooted in the Bible. I want my dc to learn the ancient cultures but not to celebrate them. I want them to see God's hand in all of history and how He has worked with all man. It's not only fascinating but so very faith-building to see God's hand at work through all the great civilations, from Sumer and Mesopotamia, to Egypt, Babylon, Persia, Greece, Rome and the early church. I would highly recommend two sources. The first is Greenleaf Guide to the Old Testament. You can purchase it from many sources; I use http://www.rocksolidinc.com for the best discounted prices. Greenleaf is, in many ways, a pick-up-and-go guide. It starts with Genesis and breaks the reading into manageable portions. I remember when my dc were the ages of your children, with all of them sitting on my bed as we studied the Bible and ancient history together. These are some of my best home-school memories. Greenleaf has no hands-on projects, though there are some instructions to figure the ages of Adam through Noah (and be surprised at how long they lived and could pass on their first-hand accounts). There is also wonderful information about how the plagues in Exodus were directed against specific Egyptian gods. The second recommendation may be more for you: Streams of Civilization, Vol. I. It's draws the thread of history from Creation through all the civilizations from a Biblical worldview. While you may not want to mummify a chicken :), my dc loved making salt-dough maps of Egypt. If you want hands-on activities, I believe Laurie Carlson has a book called "Old Testament Days" or something similar. We do very simple hands-on here: made and tasted lentil stew to see if selling Esau's birthright was "worth it", wrote hieroglyphics on papyrus, celebrated a Sedar for Passover, documented all the influences of Greek culture today with our camera driving around town one day. Some books we've enjoyed with Ancients: (which affirm a Biblical world-view) Victor Journey Through the Bible God King (during the days of King Hezekiah which deals with Egyptian culture) Hittite Warrior (set during the period of Judges) Tizrah (not read but on our list; biblical fiction in Egypt) The Bronze Bow (thought I'd save it until your dc are at least 6th grade) a book on Judas Maccabees Little Miriam of Galilee (not read but on our list) Twice Freed (based on book of Philemon) Martyr of the Catacombs (early church) I understand your heart. But the study of history is really the study of God's working with mankind and revealing Himself to every generation. In the midst of man's rebellion through idol worship, God (Yahweh) continually chose to work and reveal Himself -- calling Abraham out of the pagan worship of Chaldea, delivering his people from Egypt, using Daniel to testify to two Babylonian kings. Talk this over with your husband. I too am picky about how we approach ancient history. Even some of the *Christian* materials on the market don't sit well with me. I've been very happy with Greenleaf. Truly, ancients for us is like a huge one-year Bible study, with a couple detours to visit the cultures in which Moses or Abraham or the Judges lived. Hope that helps. Many blessings, Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BizyPenguin Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 Don't give up a curriculum you love so much. Call and talk to the author for suggestions...I remember your posts from the old boards about how much you enjoy this program. Don't ditch it, Rebecca. Just tweak it a little. I'd try TruthQuest if nothing else works b/c it's living books with Christian commentary. All the best! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie in GA Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 I'm not familiar with Living Books curriculum, but could you just skip ancients (or use the Bible for a year) and then pick it back up at middle ages? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXClassicalMommy Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 Have you looked at The Mystery of History curriculum. http://www.themysteryofhistory.com/ It is classical, chronilogical and Bible based. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca Posted February 8, 2008 Author Share Posted February 8, 2008 Thank you for these replies. I am considering different options. One being continuiing with the method I love but changing the book selections... Also, maybe taking a year off or skipping a year... I have MOH, I have the Story of the Ancient World. I don't think they are quite what we are wanting for our young children... still pondering, Thank you, You ladies have really helped me. Rebecca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LlamaMama Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 Thank you, Lisa, for those details. It was a very helpful post for me. While I love the idea of 4-year history cycles, I've also had misgivings about reading SOTW 1 with young children. I would love to focus on biblical history and learn about other cultures through their interactions with the Israelites. I want them to be grounded in godly truth before I introduce the beliefs of other religions. By the time the second history cycle comes up, I think my children will be fine in learning the SOTW 1 (or similar) material. Does anyone know if the Veritas Press Bible history would work well along-side the Greenleaf guide? This would be for K/1st grade. I was just hoping to read good stories to my oldest daughter in chronological order. Reading from the Greenleaf guide and showing them the history cards sounds like it would be more than enough for this age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ELaurie Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 I think it's of utmost importance that you honor your convictions and those of your dh, and do what you believe is best for your dc. We are conservative Christians as well, and I appreciate your concerns. However, I also wanted to share our experience with you, as you consider these important questions about how to approach ancient history with your dc. Last year, while using SOTW with my dc, we read through the entire Bible, using an excellent children's story Bible, that remains true to the Scripture. What was amazing to me is that as we read about the false gods and goddesses in Egypt, Greece and Rome throughout the year, along side of God's repeated prohibitions against idolatry of any kind, the contrast between these cultures and God's Word was very striking. Though I had read these propositions in the Scripture many times myself, I saw even more clearly the cultural context within which God Word was revealed, and understood even more clearly why He kept His people separate and Holy unto Himself. My dc were also able to see, in very concrete terms, what kind of false gods God was referring to when He forbade idolatry. Previously, idolatry had been a very abstract concept for them. I think the contrast made a deep impression on them, and served to reinforce the Truth of God's Word. However, I also deeply respect the fact that only you and your dh know the wisest course for your dc. Blessings, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca Posted February 8, 2008 Author Share Posted February 8, 2008 Lisa, I appreciate those details too and LOVE the book list! :) I want to teach history as the study of God's Hand... just feel unsure sometimes how to do it! I am not sure how I would use Streams with 3rd graders and under? Thanks for your post! Rebecca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca Posted February 8, 2008 Author Share Posted February 8, 2008 JJ's blessings: I am considering HOD... thanks for the "testimony"... I am not sure if it is for me... but I am considering it... Still really thinking about trying to use the Living Books method just with different books.... Thanks for your input, We definitely want something with Christian nurture. Rebecca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassenach Posted February 8, 2008 Share Posted February 8, 2008 Just a few thoughts- Beautiful feet, Sonlight, or Winter's Promise... Good luck, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaLisa Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Does anyone know if the Veritas Press Bible history would work well along-side the Greenleaf guide? This would be for K/1st grade. Absolutely. That's exactly what we did actually when my dc were grammar age and younger. The VP cards dovetail verywell with Greenleaf and/or Streams of Civ. HTH, Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaLisa Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 I am not sure how I would use Streams with 3rd graders and under? No, I wouldn't use it for dc 3rd grade and younger. I was suggesting it for you. It's a great overview of the thread of history from Creation through ancients, the early church and up to today. It's written at a middle-school level, so it would be an easy read for you. Vol. I would cover ancients. HTH -- Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybear Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Rebecca, I also was going to reccomend Winterpromise for American History. However, I do not know if all the books would be appropriate. And I certainly understand about not being able to pre-read every book. It is very frustrating! Good luck with your choice. Kim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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