MIL trying to convince ds he needs real school...

[jonnia]

... so he won't be "socially awkward." She had this little talk (he called it a lecture) with him in the car while taking two nephews and him to dinner. Of course, he interpreted her comments as "She thinks I am socially awkward." He is almost 12 and at that critical, pre-teen place in defining his own self-image.

 

He called me into his room at midnight to talk through all of the self-doubt stirred up by that one comment. I spent an hour listening and encouraging him to see all the ways he is perfectly wonderful. I am pleased that he remained respectful to his grandmother and did not respond much. (He couldn't think of a way to respond in the moment, he was so flabbergasted at the conversation coming out of nowhere and in front of his cousins.) I reminded him that she really has no idea how he is in social situations; she doesn't see him with his friends or when meeting other people. Her comments were based entirely on assumptions. I am sure she held the best intentions, but... ugh.

 

We have people comment all the time on his ability to meet and greet with a warm smile and a bit of conversation. He can be initially nervous when going into a group of people he doesn't know, but he always interacts well and comes out of it with a handful of new friends. But last night, all he could think about was how he is less than he should be somehow.

 

It's disappointing to me especially because I was so sure that her initial reservations and concerns when we first began homeschooling him in kindergarten had long since been resolved and that she saw the benefits that have been so obvious to my husband and me.

 

My husband will speak to her about it. I'm just praying for my son to be able to let it go and for any family fall-out to be minimal.

 

Thanks for letting me vent.

 

[jonnia]

My husband is angry enough for both of us. I am mostly sad and seriously disappointed.

[Momof3littles]

I'd set the boundary that if she is compelled to express her concerns, she should address them with you in the future.  And if you don't really want or need to hear it from her directly (I would not, frankly, especially if this was already something you've discussed with her, or if she has a history of overstepping), then it is okay to set a boundary that it is not up for discussion with you either.  I would give it a pass this time, address it with her, and if she does it again, perhaps she doesn't spend time with him alone.  I dealt with IL issues for years that were only fixed by boundary setting.  It caused some tension and unhappiness for a period of time, but in the end, long-term it has helped our relationship tremendously. I have had a very good relationship with MIL for years now.  FIL passed away last year, but we had a solid, much-improved relationship in recent years as well.

 

[Ellie]

:grouphug:

 

Kudos to Mr. Jonnia for being willing to talk to her about this. :hurray:

 

I had to have a conversation with my mil about how it was not necessary for her to drill my dds with math flash cards and whatnot when they were visiting her. I also had the discussion with my dds about how if that continued, they might not get to spend time with her alone. In general, we loved her, but that was the limit.

[elegantlion]

Geez, there are socially awkward kids in public school. My son is 16 and slow to warm up to situations. I was the same way as a kid. He would be no different if he were in public school. Ironically he was in private school for prek and K, where he more than once got in trouble for, wait for it.... socializing during school. Yup, he'd get done with his work and try to talk to the person next to him. 

 

I'm glad your dh is addressing it, and  :grouphug: to your son. 12 is hard enough without judgmental comments from grandma.  :cursing:

[topquark]

Sounds to me like your MIL is the one that is socially awkward. Stunning lack of tack. No 'time and place' judgment...just sayin'. Now, for my 'sweeping generalization o' the day': Most home-schooled kids I've been exposed to don't have social issues. They just don't. The one's that were a bit awkward would have been regardless of their schooling situation. GL and hang in  :001_smile:

[Mandy in TN]

Yeah, my MIL doesn't speak English and lives in another country, and my mother is very supportive of homeschooling.

 

However, I agree that "12 is hard enough without judgemental comments from grandma" who you assume loves you unconditionally. Bad grandma, bad grandma! Good dh for wanting to handle it, good dh!

 

(((Hugs))) to you and your little man-

Mandy

[Moxie]

I have a socially awkward child. I also have a very outgoing social child. I can't take credit for either personality. I think we are born the way we are and there is very little that can change that.

[OneStepAtATime]

That was such a horrible thing for her to do, especially in front of the cousins, even though she really was probably trying to help.  Ugh!  I wonder how she would feel if her mother had done the same thing to her in front of her cousins?

 

Glad that your husband is going to talk with her but I hope they have a really good relationship.  Just yelling won't fix this issue and if the relationship is not really strong this could get ugly.   Maybe if he is willing to sit down with her, listen to her concerns first so she doesn't feel like she is being dismissed out of hand, then try to point out how humiliating and disturbing it would be to a 12 year old boy to basically say he is socially awkward and in front of his cousins no less.  Then maybe give some clearer boundaries on what she can and cannot discuss with your son without parental involvement.

 

Is there anything he is involved in, like sports or something else where she could attend and see him interacting with his friends?

 

So sorry. 

[Walking-Iris]

Sounds to me like your MIL is the one that is socially awkward. Stunning lack of tack. No 'time and place' judgment...just sayin'. Now, for my 'sweeping generalization o' the day': Most home-schooled kids I've been exposed to don't have social issues. They just don't. The one's that were a bit awkward would have been regardless of their schooling situation. GL and hang in  :001_smile:

 

 

I have a socially awkward child. I also have a very outgoing social child. I can't take credit for either personality. I think we are born the way we are and there is very little that can change that.

 

 

Yep! My oldest has Asperger's and social situations would be difficult for him regardless of his school environment. I feel that he is better served by homeschooling because he can matur esocially with quality interactions rather than the rush and noise of hundreds of kids in the school building.

 

And personality is a big point as well. My two youngest are very social and talkative. Although they can be shy at first with new people.

 

I personally wouldn't even bother trying to prove to the MIL that there isn't a problem. The problem is she over stepped her bounds, and what is worse IMHO, made your ds feel bad about himself, in front of children his own age.

 

A child should feel safe around a grandparent, and if there are going to be lectures like that, then it;s not a safe place, emotionally.

 

Also that strikes me as a thinly veiled attack on your choice to homeschool. Nothing bothers me more than people who use passive aggression by talking at children about things that they really mean to direct towards adults. 

 

Trying to undermine your parenting and decision to homeschool by placing doubts in his head. Not cool! 

[momto2Cs]

It's disappointing to me especially because I was so sure that her initial reservations and concerns when we first began homeschooling him in kindergarten had long since been resolved and that she saw the benefits that have been so obvious to my husband and me.

 

 

I thought the same thing about my own mother until last week, when my kids were attending an 8th grade graduation with her (for a family friend), and she said something to them about "missing out on all this" and "how it is a little sad".

[pmaria80]

I'd set the boundary that if she is compelled to express her concerns, she should address them with you in the future.  And if you don't really want or need to hear it from her directly (I would not, frankly, especially if this was already something you've discussed with her, or if she has a history of overstepping), then it is okay to set a boundary that it is not up for discussion with you either.  I would give it a pass this time, address it with her, and if she does it again, perhaps she doesn't spend time with him alone.  I dealt with IL issues for years that were only fixed by boundary setting.  It caused some tension and unhappiness for a period of time, but in the end, long-term it has helped our relationship tremendously. I have had a very good relationship with MIL for years now.  FIL passed away last year, but we had a solid, much-improved relationship in recent years as well.

 

:iagree: We've run into several boundary issues with my in-laws this year and sometimes they just have a hard time viewing us as "adults" instead of "their children".  So far, homeschooling has not come up yet, but when it does (because I'm sure it will) they will be politely corrected by my husband.  And, just as in previous issues, if not respected, then they lose time with us and their grandchildren.  Because, honestly, I will not sacrifice my child's mental health to appease family.  In other words, there will be no criticisms of our choices in raising our children or their development without consequences.  It's sad that that has to be the case, but until my kids are adults and can make their own choices, I will protect them as much as possible.

However, I think it is awesome that he talked to you about it and you had a dialog going because that age can be so difficult and so many kids shut down around their parents.  So bravo for talking with him and setting grandma straight!  I hope I have an open dialog like that with my children as pre-teens and teens! You are obviously doing something right ;)

[momacacia]

Yes, a lot nicer than I would have been. But, I'm getting old and just don't have time or patience for people like this who are unpleasant and disrespectful to me or my kids. And, it doesn't matter if they're a family member or from Mars, we don't have to associate with them unless they straighten up and fly right.

[PachiSusan]

OOOOO, that would burn my hide. I'm so glad that your husband is willing to talk to your MIL about it. 

[In2why]

I thought the same thing about my own mother until last week, when my kids were attending an 8th grade graduation with her (for a family friend), and she said something to them about "missing out on all this" and "how it is a little sad".

 

 

But isn't it okay for her to be a little sad without it meaning she doesn't support your family homeschooling?   Graduations pomp and circumstances are a normal milestone and our extended families probably do miss those experiences.  Especially if these are the only grandchildren.  Even if we do a celebration for our Homeschooling graduates it isn't really the same.  I compare it to a large wedding and eloping. Both are married and both are celebrations but the trappings are not the same, and neither is better or worse. 

[momto2Cs]

But isn't it okay for her to be a little sad without it meaning she doesn't support your family homeschooling?   Graduations pomp and circumstances are a normal milestone and our extended families probably do miss those experiences.  Especially if these are the only grandchildren.  Even if we do a celebration for our Homeschooling graduates it isn't really the same.  I compare it to a large wedding and eloping. Both are married and both are celebrations but the trappings are not the same, and neither is better or worse. 

 

I didn't think of it that way. :blushing:

 

And yes, they are the only grandchildren. Maybe they'll have college graduations she can attend.

[Desert Strawberry]

I would be enraged. I would ensure that she had no contact/ no unsupervised contact. And DH should make it very clear why. 

 

My MIL asked my oldest some pointed questions during an overnight. It turned out ok, in that she said only supportive things about him being home schooled. She still put a lot of doubts into his head about not being "on grade level". I was tipping on the edge with that one. 

 

I cannot fathom what she might have been trying to accomplish by talking to your ds that way about a topic he has no control over. How could this possible have benefited him?

[Harriet Vane]

Totally inappropriate, and not something to be "nice" about. Not saying to be rude either. Rather, I would not talk around this or finesse it along. This is a situation that needs strong boundaries and plain speaking.

 

Your husband needs to tell his mom, in no uncertain terms, that it was wrong for her to speak that way to your son and that if she has concerns about him she needs to discuss it with you or your dh.

 

Also tell her that the topic of education is absolutely forbidden. It's inappropriate for her to undermine his education and self-esteem in that way.

[In2why]

I would be enraged. I would ensure that she had no contact/ no unsupervised contact. And DH should make it very clear why. 

 

My MIL asked my oldest some pointed questions during an overnight. It turned out ok, in that she said only supportive things about him being home schooled. She still put a lot of doubts into his head about not being "on grade level". I was tipping on the edge with that one. 

 

I cannot fathom what she might have been trying to accomplish by talking to your ds that way about a topic he has no control over. How could this possible have benefited him?

 

 

You would actually cut contact over this instance?  Couldn't she have been thoughtless and insensitive without meaning to be malicious.  Haven't you ever stuck your foot in your mouth?   I find the thought of cutting contact with grandparents without it being well thought out and a last resort, manipulative and hurtful to everyone.  It would also likely escalate and cause the child to lose or limit his access to the rest of the extended family and be really, really sad for everyone involved.  

[Kelly1730]

I thought the same thing about my own mother until last week, when my kids were attending an 8th grade graduation with her (for a family friend), and she said something to them about "missing out on all this" and "how it is a little sad".

 

 

What is it with mothers? We have homeschooled the twins since the beginning (rising 7th graders) and she's never said too much about it. I wouldn't necessarily call it supportive but thought she just accepted it even if she didn't totally agree with it. Last week she made a comment about them "not going to college".  There was a lot going on around us at the time so I really couldn't deal with it right then. The more I thought about the comment, the more it started to bug me. Why would she think they couldn't go to college? They may and they may not but homeschooling really has nothing to do with that. Ugh! 

[Desert Strawberry]

You would actually cut contact over this instance?  Couldn't she have been thoughtless and insensitive without meaning to be malicious.  Haven't you ever stuck your foot in your mouth?   I find the thought of cutting contact with grandparents without it being well thought out and a last resort, manipulative and hurtful to everyone.  It would also likely escalate and cause the child to lose or limit his access to the rest of the extended family and be really, really sad for everyone involved.  

Ime this is rarely a one time occurrence. No, I don't think it was thoughtless and insensitive. I think it was cruel and underhanded.  Humiliating a child and undermining a parental decision so blatantly is not a little slip of the tongue. It's an unforgivable act. 

 

Seeing how upset OP's son was, I'm not exaggerating about being enraged. My trust would be broken. 

I would protect my child. I would not allow someone to harm him to spare their feelings and keep the peace.

 

My husband and I come from difficult backgrounds. We don't have close, trusting relationships with our parents. I'm sure that taints my view of this. If there is manipulation in our families, we aren't the ones handing it out. Perhaps if there were more trust, I would not feel so strongly.

[Harriet Vane]

Ime this is rarely a one time occurrence. No, I don't think it was thoughtless and insensitive. I think it was cruel and underhanded.  Humiliating a child and undermining a parental decision so blatantly is not a little slip of the tongue. It's an unforgivable act. 

 

Seeing how upset OP's son was, I'm not exaggerating about being enraged. My trust would be broken. 

I would protect my child. I would not allow someone to harm him to spare their feelings and keep the peace.

 

My husband and I come from difficult backgrounds. We don't have close, trusting relationships with our parents. I'm sure that taints my view of this. If there is manipulation in our families, we aren't the ones handing it out. Perhaps if there were more trust, I would not feel so strongly.

 

These are really strong words.

 

I had a deeply unhappy family growing up. As an adult I have chosen limited contact at times, and no contact with certain ones who are too deeply dysfunctional. I have also advised others to limit or stop contact under certain conditions.

 

Stopping all contact really is an option only in two situations:

 

--If there is a persistent pattern of abusive or deeply inappropriate behavior. Mildly inappropriate may be distasteful but does not mean that no contact is warranted.

 

--If the offensive action is particularly egregious or criminal.

 

What the OP describes, in and of itself, is offensive, but may not necessarily be cruel or underhanded. It really might be simply insensitive or overstepping boundaries. When living in community with others, whether family or otherwise, sometimes people overstep. It's a fact of life, and is better handled with honesty as well as grace.

 

[jonnia]

 

What the OP describes, in and of itself, is offensive, but may not necessarily be cruel or underhanded. It really might be simply insensitive or overstepping boundaries. When living in community with others, whether family or otherwise, sometimes people overstep. It's a fact of life, and is better handled with honesty as well as grace.

 

 

You have understood the situation correctly, I think. As extended family, we all have strong, loving bonds - far from perfect, of course. She has a history of being blunt and blissfully ignorant of the effects of her "advice" and holds the view that her children and their families still require her input and direction to manage our lives. I personally am seeing more of this behavior lately and can't help but wonder if aging is playing a part in the lack of filtering which thoughts should just remain unspoken.

 

There will be no yelling, but there must be a conversation. She will have her feelings hurt, I'm sure, and I think she will be very upset to learn that her comments caused hurt to our son. She does need to know this, though. I am pretty sure she will not bring up the subject with him in the future at all. If something like this happens again, it will be a whole new issue. :crying:

 

We've taken the opportunity to point out to ds that adults can be really wrong sometimes, but that when you consider the heart of the person who has hurt you, it's much easier to give them a little grace.

[Elisabet1]

Take this as a teaching moment. Explain to him that there will always be people who are just insulting. There are people who just have agendas and will say whatever to get what they want. Politicians do it all the time, commercials do it all the time, etc. His grandma wants to twist things to try to convince her to put him in to public school.

 

Also...home school IS real school. Make sure he knows that. I am unsure if you used the term "real school" because that is what MIL called it. But home school is most definitely "real school." You can call the other place "brick and mortar school" or even "public school" assuming it is public that is being referred to. Make sure he knows he is in real school too.

 

Stay strong! Oh, and he can spend less time around grandma. Your son needs to learn how to put up boundaries with toxic people.

 

By the way, someone who had the best of intentions would not have brought it up in front of him. My grandma was concerned. But she waited until we were in private to bring up the social awkwardness issue. In our case, her argument was quickly shot down. She said my son should go back to public school because he seems to awkward around other kids. I asked her how she thought my daughter was doing. She said my daughter was doing fine. So I was happy to answer...my son is the one in public school, my daughter is home schooled. Some kids are just awkward, others are not. Which school they attend does not change that. But the point is, she brought it up in private, not in front of my children. It would have been hurtful if she brought it up in front of them.

[reign]

I can see this happening in our future. I hope we handle it as well as you!

[Ecclecticmum]

If a person is not pleased with a certain thing, I find that they tend to use any method available to prove its not a prudent idea.

 

If a person had two similar boy in front of them, two similar ages and personalities, one homeschool, and one at public school, both acted the same way in a similar situation, highly likely it would be responded to in a fashion as stating one boy is socially awkward and the other child is just at that "pre-teen stage, boys will be boys" etc..

 

Same as if you put your child in public school and your family wanted him in private school. They'd comment on the manners and disrespect of the child "dirty habits being picked up from public school", but if that same child was transferred to private, that same attitude would either be ignored "boys will be boys" or they would just speak to them about it, and tell them it wasn't acceptable, no hint of "dirty habits picked up from private school" because that's not what they believe.

 

and unfortunately parents & parents in law seem to find crossing the line some sort of achievement. I've had my PIL several years ago come over, and the knew we were co-sleeping (at that time anyway), rather than take the discussion up with me (as would of been appropriate), they decided to take it further down the chain and manevour my daughter. When they were alone with her, they told her it wasn't normal to ever share a bed....blah blah blah....that she HAS to sleep on her own, by herself, in the dark....plus a whole lot of conversation I have no idea about. This was at a pivotal moment where we were slowly weaning her off co-sleeping. It scared the heck out of her and set her back several YEARS. She came to me in tears, utterly terrified she was going to be locked up in the dark. I don't scare my kids to get them to do things. I explain it on their level and let them see about it, and usually they make a good choice. She couldn't even make the choice, and only recently have we been able to start weaning her off (slowly) being in the same room whilst she's asleep. Now we're working on her going to sleep by herself without an adult in the room. All of this could of been avoided had they come to me instead of giving her night terrors.

 

The kids would also just be drinking water instead of cordial. My eldest was happily drinking water till she was  3, then PIL ignored my instructions and gave her juice. In combination with the fact I was very sick and pregnant, it ended up being a long and horrible road. I've got all the kids now on cordial, and eldest will drink water if I tell her to, so will others (sort of) but again, could of been avoided if they came to me.

 

I have found if you are not in complete agreement with friends and family on certain subjects, to draw thick black lines on what is and isn't appropriate behaviour and conversation. And if they disagree with something, come to ME/YOU not the children.

 

Otherwise you are the one at the end of the day trying to bolster their courage and raise their self-esteem all over again for something that is not their fault.

 

Some people also like to nitpick about everything, and it doesn't matter what it is, if that hindrance is removed, their is a new hindrance. Hubby is this way, the one fault he has that drives me absolutely insane (really insane). First it was harping on about the cigarettes, so I gave those up, then it was the energy drinks (I don't drink coffee), so I gave those up too, then it was the sugar, so gave that up, then the amount of food i eat, so I go on a shake diet & start exercising, now he's harping on and on about the cat litter being my problem not his (its been his responsibility for the past 3 years, and he hasn't really complained about it before), I'm sure if I take over the Litter, he would start harping on about something else. He's like the seagulls on nemo instead of "mine" its "nag, nag nag, harp harp harp" rofl. Unfortunately without the carbs & sugar I have less patience to deal with it, lol. It also makes it harder to get stuff done, which makes for fun school days......

 

With my kids, I usually go get upset at something else (the tree outside for instance) to get rid of any negativity, then go speak to the child as honestly and succinctly as I can about the whole of the situation. We sometimes ponder why the person may have said what they did, and turn it into a discussion, at the end of the day though, I let them know it wasn't really appropriate for the person to say that to them, and then explain to the child the truth of the situation (they are the way that they are and that its beautiful and I love them just the way they are.....if that makes sense, lol). I was socially awkward too, but at the same time had a lot of friends. I'm still socially awkward now, but the ones that stick around and talk to me end up being really good friends, so I end up with a smaller, but more select group. No "Fair weather" friends, but friends who are around through it all. I'm also just not interested in most social events. I find them tedious and boring, when my mum asked why I don't have more girl friends, I think I explained something like "because all they talk about are clothes are shoes, hair and stupid stuff, nothing that matters, people die every day and all they care about is the color of their nail polish, and what boy is cute, its boring" the so-called popular girls were such snobs I ended up joining and leaving their group within a week. But my heap of guy friends and the few girl friends I had? Were my friends for years and years, and in fact a lot of them are still on my Facebook from school. And I would still hang out with them except several years ago I moved states.

 

Socially awkward doesn't necessarily mean something that needs to be fixed. I had wonderful manners, I was always willing to help somebody out that needed it, I befriended everyone, I just didn't get the point of small talk or stuff that wasn't actually important, I was a girly-girl and an adventurous girl, loved dressing up, but wasn't interested in yakking about it, I just wanted to have fun and make people happy. But at the end of the day I found more interest in reading or playing on the computer than being "socially fit". If my mum had pushed me through to try and make me more "socially acceptable" it would of made my teenage years more confusing and rotten.

 

Whats more inportant is that he's happy and has resources at his disposal to use should he need to. If he's not happy where he's currently at, then putting the materials and supplies he needs to get to a point where he can be happy.

[RanchGirl]

For her to bring this up to your son, not to mention in front of your son's cousins is really atrocious.  And while he was trapped as a captive audience in the car?!?  Sheesh!!  If she had real concerns and respected you as parents, she would have spoken directly to you. 

 

In my experience, this is not a one time thing; people who try to manipulate like this will not stop.  It's nice that your dh is going to talk to her about her lack of social skills, but I sincerely doubt it will do any good.  I would definitely not let her have unsupervised contact with my children.

[Jean in Newcastle]

It would be the last alone time that MIL had with my child (even with all the cousins along) for a long long time.  This isn't about her having her own opinion.  Of course, she is entitled to that.  It is about her crossing a huge boundary in addressing something with a child that he  has limited control over with respect to his education and even less control over with respect to his own social awkwardness and development.  She has damaged her relationship with your son.  She's damaged (at least temporarily) his view of  himself.  And she could have damaged his relationship with you because of your educational choices.