How do people get ahead in Singapore?

[idnib]

I'm trying to figure out how people get ahead in Singapore. My son has not struggled with the concepts except for "Time" in 1st grade.

 

But by the time I teach the lesson, do the textbook, the workbook, CWP, Extra Practice, the reviews, take the tests, and do some occasional enrichment/math facts, we don't get ahead doing about an hour/day. We just keep up, and that's with doing some work in the summer.

 

Are we:

 

--Doing things too slowly?

 

--Doing too many things?

 

--Not spending as much time as other people?

 

:confused1: 

[lmrich]

Summer.

[idnib]

No, this includes the summer. We don't have set breaks, but in a given year we take off about 6-7 weeks. The local school takes off 14.

[amsunshine]

Yes, I would say summer is one of the ways we got ahead.  We also school year round.  

[EKS]

I dropped what my son didn't need.  So we used the textbook, workbook, and CWP, and that's it.  I broke up the reviews and he did a few problems with the regular lesson each day.  After a while, the workbook became superfluous as well, so we omitted it.  He started a year ahead (doing the 1st grade books in K) and he finished 6A in 3rd grade (we never did 6B).  We then did Derek Owens Prealgebra to cement things and he moved into Algebra I at a b&m school with no problems.

 

 

 

 

[Ethel Mertz]

But by the time I teach the lesson, do the textbook, the workbook, CWP, Extra Practice, the reviews, take the tests, and do some occasional enrichment/math facts, we don't get ahead doing about an hour/day. We just keep up, and that's with doing some work in the summer.

 

 

 

We do the textbook and the workbook, do Extra Practice occasionally, do most of the reviews, play math games, and do some math fact drill as needed. I always feel like we're behind where I want us to be. We also work through the summer. I try to be ok with the fact that DS is making steady progress (math is not his favorite subject) and we are where we need to be. Laying a strong math foundation is too important to rush it (or so I tell myself). 

[k8c]

This is how we are too.  We do all the bells and whistles, and it takes about 40 minutes to an hour each day.  We do the EP behind as a "review" warm-up, then do the lesson from the HIG, then textbook orally (this is usually very fast), then workbook, then do some CWP problems (also behind), and occasionally add in some Process Skills problems (though this usually gets left out because unless it is a review day, she is ready for something else by the time we do everything else).  

 

However, she is working about a year ahead, so I am not worried.  In fact, I feel like doing all the practice is helping to solidify the math concepts.  I don't feel like we are doing "drill" per se because we only do a few pages of each thing, and a lot of it is done orally or she likes to work the problems on the white board.  We do plan to school through the summer (this is our first year, going from "year 1" to "year 2" over this summer), and I plan on just moving straight into 2A when she is done with 1B rather than taking time off.

[a27mom]

We don't do as much as you do. If my dd demonstrates mastery we move on. I don't use the CWP. Though I do make some word problems up. We generally only use the textbook, workbook and other things I make up.

[pitterpatter]

We school year-around and we also started a year ahead age-wise. DD was kindergarten age when she started SM1 (she completed Earlybird at preschool age). Having said that, things are slowing down a bit. We are only a half year plus a bit ahead now. We don't do absolutely everything either. No tests for us...just reviews in the other SM books. Not all of the IP, CWP or EP either. 

[73349]

We started a bit early, work year-round (i.e., not just through summer, but we take very few breaks at any time) and don't do all the books, so DS is about to start 2A. I'm not sure he'll get any more than a year ahead, though.

[idnib]

It's interesting that it doesn't seem anyone here has gotten ahead by only working during the school year, doing all the problems and components, and starting at a typical level. 

 

I don't really mind  that we're not ahead as I feel we've got a really solid base, but somehow it sticks in my craw that we work all summer just to keep up. I like year-round school but it would be nice to do something advanced or different for summer math instead of continuing the same pattern all the time. I'd also like to be a bit ahead in case we do run into a topic that takes more of our time. Right now we're only caught up because DS hasn't really struggled with anything too much. If he did we would fall behind. There's no cushion, kwim?

 

We do BA on weekends and I guess that will have to be enough for something different.

[Crimson Wife]

It's interesting that it doesn't seem anyone here has gotten ahead by only working during the school year, doing all the problems and components, and starting at a typical level.

Singapore was never designed to use ALL the components. It's designed to be mix-and-match depending on the individual child. The main program is Textbook, workbook, and HIG. Struggling students add EP. Bright students add IP (perhaps in lieu of the regular workbook).

[boscopup]

I only gave end of book tests, not all those tests mentioned in the HIG schedule. I didn't use CWP or IP at that level (never used EP). In later levels, I used CWP some, but didn't worry about finishing it. Reviews sometimes got skipped if we had just done one. And some topics were skimmed through.

 

We do school through the summer, but our total days per year is not that much more than a regular school year, so that doesn't really affect us accelerating that much. Skipping things the kid already knows like the back of his hand is how we accelerate.

 

I also started first grade level in K with my younger two, but my oldest didn't start accelerating (or homeschooling) until mid-first grade. He did Singapore 4 and 5 in a calendar year. We did CWP sometimes, but not all the time. He certainly didn't work an hour a day on math at that age. Singapore lessons never took him that long. We'd go over the topic orally, so some textbook problems orally, then he'd do the workbook on his own.

[lewelma]

I'm trying to figure out how people get ahead in Singapore. My son has not struggled with the concepts except for "Time" in 1st grade.

 

But by the time I teach the lesson, do the textbook, the workbook, CWP, Extra Practice, the reviews, take the tests, and do some occasional enrichment/math facts, we don't get ahead doing about an hour/day. We just keep up, and that's with doing some work in the summer.

Obviously it depends on the child. This is how I accelerated each of my boys and the resulting math level:

 

My older:

Started at age 6.5, did review pages of grade 2 and finished in 2 months

Skipped grade 3 completely

Did ONLY the Intensive practice for Grades 4 and 5 (did not even use the textbook)

Started AoPS Intro Algebra

 

Younger:

Started at age 5.5, skipped grade 1

I explained with the textbook, and he did the workbook and word problems in Intensive practice for grades 2, 3, 4, 5

Moved to AoPS prealgebra for 1 month.  This was a huge mistake because he was not ready and had not mastered the concepts in SM.  I thought he had. :o

So we backtracked and did Life of Fred, MEP(free on line), Pizzazz math game sheets, grade 6 Singapore math (this mishmash of programs took 1.5 years)

And finally moved to SM Discovering Maths grade 7

 

My point it, THINK before you decided to accelerate, because it depends on the child. You don't want to accelerate too fast and then have to go back and clean up the mess! Ask me how I know!

 

Ruth in NZ

[Dramorellis]

What is the value in them being accelerated? They are where they are, correct? If it's the appropriate level for their development and skill then what does it matter what book they are in. I'm just curious. 

[Nan in Mass]

We did Singapore.  I started later with my children, when they were a bit older, and started with 2A and 3B respectively.  We only did some of the CW books and we tended to use last year's level.  We did the textbook orally and they did the workbook on their own, after school, as "homework".  That way, the lessons didn't get too long, since as you say, by the time you correct the old excersize, rework any missed problems, run over any math facts you are working on, and go over the new lesson, you've used up quite a bit of time, even with an older child.  I think the reason you are taking so long to do math compared to the public school is that the public school is not doing nearly as many word problems.  Word problems take time and thinking.  That's good. : )  You are doing a better job with the math than the public school.  Unless your children are gifted, you probably don't really want to accelerate SM, anyway, or you'll wind up in algebra before your children are really ready.  Going slowly and doing lots of word problems will probably stand you in better stead than going fast and doing more computing and less problem solving. : )

Nan 

[boscopup]

What is the value in them being accelerated? They are where they are, correct? If it's the appropriate level for their development and skill then what does it matter what book they are in. I'm just curious. 

 

Accelerating is done for kids that learn the material quickly and get bored going the pace laid out in the book. Their appropriate level IS higher because of their advanced development, and thus you accelerate those kids to get them to where they really are. Sometimes they're developmentally ready to learn something but haven't been taught a few things at a lower level, so you zip through those things to make sure you don't have holes.

 

I would not recommend accelerating all kids in math. That would be silly. Those of us answering how we accelerated Singapore have kids who are naturally good at math, so they learn the material quicker.

 

[idnib]

Singapore was never designed to use ALL the components. It's designed to be mix-and-match depending on the individual child. The main program is Textbook, workbook, and HIG. Struggling students add EP. Bright students add IP (perhaps in lieu of the regular workbook).

 

I see. After I read your post I went to the Singapore web site and they say the same thing in the FAQ. I guess I got a different impression because the grid (TOC by week) in the front of the HIG includes the EP problems and the tests and where they belong in the sequence. I guess I took it very literally....

[MotherGoose]

If you follow Singapore by grade level they are already accelerated compared to their peers.

[idnib]

What is the value in them being accelerated? They are where they are, correct? If it's the appropriate level for their development and skill then what does it matter what book they are in. I'm just curious. 

 

 

Hmmm. Good question. Let me preface by saying I was coming at the question from 2 angles.

 

--More personally, as I've watched my kid enjoy BA, I've wondered if we are moving too slowly though Singapore. He's not a math whiz, but I do think we could go possibly go faster. Right now it feels like we're running to stand still by doing 1.0-1.25/day,~ 225 days/year so we can keep pace with the program using what I thought were necessary components. I guess it's the difference between being where we are because that's where he needs to be, or if we're where we are because I'm doing something incorrect/unusual. 

 

--More generally, I am simply curious if people who are ahead are doing fewer things, working faster, working longer, or some combination. Given our pace/workload it seemed incredible to me that people have done 5 or 6 years' worth in the same time we've taken to do 4. 

[brownie]

My kids are ahead doing an hour a day because we rarely do IP or CWP.  We hardly even touch the text for certain levels.  My kids

are strong in math so we just keep forging ahead, and if we need to revisit concepts, I use unused text problems, or buy a supplementary book, or print my own problems online.  Sometimes we do enrichment topics...chess, LOF, etc...But really...this only works because my kids are really naturally strong in math.  Regardess of how many problems they did and whether they worked all year round, they could not accelerate if they were not ready for it. 

 

My 3rd grader has just begun 5A, but we had to go back and do every level 4 textbook problem and then some after finishing the workbook.  Plus I bought the Harcourt level 4 workbook which runs a similar scope for review.  We are maybe 1/2 way through that.  We're doing Khan Academy grade 4 mission math as a review too.  We're just starting 5A because the 1st chapter or 2 are easy, but if some maturity doesn't kick in over the summer, we will be trying something else for awhile next year.  He just can't remember the math "vocabulary" and he can always do a problem...once I show him.  But it's not sticking in his memory.  While he is ready to understand 5th grade math, he is not really ready to do it without me at his elbow.  I can try to strengthen his weakpoints, but that's about it.

[zarabellesmom]

Accelerating is done for kids that learn the material quickly and get bored going the pace laid out in the book. Their appropriate level IS higher because of their advanced development, and thus you accelerate those kids to get them to where they really are. Sometimes they're developmentally ready to learn something but haven't been taught a few things at a lower level, so you zip through those things to make sure you don't have holes.

 

I would not recommend accelerating all kids in math. That would be silly. Those of us answering how we accelerated Singapore have kids who are naturally good at math, so they learn the material quicker.

 

We did all of 1A and 1B, using only the text and workbooks. Started 2A about 1/3 of the way through first grade. I added CWP to slow her down. She was bored and unchallenged. We did a few problems from each chapter, just enough to prove mastery and started Beast 3A in the spring of her 1st grade year. Finally found something that slowed her down and made her think. Now she is in 3rd grade and only halfway through Beast 4A. Honestly, I would skip the extra practice book if your child doesn't really need it.

[zarabellesmom]

Hmmm. Good question. Let me preface by saying I was coming at the question from 2 angles.

 

--More personally, as I've watched my kid enjoy BA, I've wondered if we are moving too slowly though Singapore. He's not a math whiz, but I do think we could go possibly go faster. Right now it feels like we're running to stand still by doing 1.0-1.25/day,~ 225 days/year so we can keep pace with the program using what I thought were necessary components. I guess it's the difference between being where we are because that's where he needs to be, or if we're where we are because I'm doing something incorrect/unusual.

 

--More generally, I am simply curious if people who are ahead are doing fewer things, working faster, working longer, or some combination. Given our pace/workload it seemed incredible to me that people have done 5 or 6 years' worth in the same time we've taken to do 4.

We definitely didn't work longer. And she certainly wasn't working hard, which was the reason we accelerated. I think that working too long or at the wrong level--either above or below--would sap the joy out of math and that would be sad because it's my daughter's favorite part of the day. But maybe ask yourself if you really need two math programs. Both are very thorough on their own.

[k8c]

So I have a question to those who have accelerated and what you consider mastery.  Do you give them the problems and if they can do them "the Singapore way" then it is mastered and you move on, or if they just get the correct answer?  For example, we are close to the end of 1A right now and while my DD5 (almost 6) can get all the correct answers if given the problems (right now we are in addition and subtraction to 20), but that is because she is counting up or down in her head, not because she is making 10 in some form or fashion, which is what the HIG has me teaching.  Should I move on because she is getting the correct answers, or push her to do it "the Singapore way?"  I am worried if she doesn't understand the concepts they teach and just does it her own way, when we get to larger numbers she will be lost.

[zarabellesmom]

So I have a question to those who have accelerated and what you consider mastery. Do you give them the problems and if they can do them "the Singapore way" then it is mastered and you move on, or if they just get the correct answer? For example, we are close to the end of 1A right now and while my DD5 (almost 6) can get all the correct answers if given the problems (right now we are in addition and subtraction to 20), but that is because she is counting up or down in her head, not because she is making 10 in some form or fashion, which is what the HIG has me teaching. Should I move on because she is getting the correct answers, or push her to do it "the Singapore way?" I am worried if she doesn't understand the concepts they teach and just does it her own way, when we get to larger numbers she will be lost.

That might be a judgement call, but honestly, the making 10 thing is a really useful skill. That's one I wouldn't skip. Bar models though... Well, I already started a thread on that.

 

ETA I think a lot of the Singapore mental math skills are very important. Some students might get to them intuitively, but they probably shouldn't be missed.

[idnib]

We definitely didn't work longer. I think that would sap the joy out of math and that would be sad because it's my daughter's favorite part of the day. But maybe ask yourself if you really need two math programs. Both are very thorough on their own.

 

 

I wish we could just use BA but we would catch up to the predicted publishing schedule. My DD is in Singapore 1 and I may only do BA 3 with her when she gets there rather than both. 

 

DS enjoys BA and doesn't want to give it up. We're not doing it full speed. The lagging helps as deeper review of Singapore and also with the slow release schedule.

[zarabellesmom]

We'll run out too, but I'm going to cross that bridge when I come to it. I'm planning Zaccaro Upper Elementary Challenge Math and then Real World Algebra. She was so over Singapore when we gave it up I know there is no going back. :(

[Gil]

I'm trying to figure out how people get ahead in Singapore. My son has not struggled with the concepts except for "Time" in 1st grade.

 

But by the time I teach the lesson, do the textbook, the workbook, CWP, Extra Practice, the reviews, take the tests, and do some occasional enrichment/math facts, we don't get ahead doing about an hour/day. We just keep up, and that's with doing some work in the summer.

 

Are we:

 

--Doing things too slowly?

 

--Doing too many things?

It could be this, or it could be none of the above.

I have 2 suggestions: First, do a 2nd math block, each one 45min. and secondly maybe for 2nd just do the textbook, workbook and CWP. Only add in the EP if your boy struggles in a spot and see how that works. We did our math virtually every day often 2-3x a day. We slowed down a lot this year and only get in 2 math blocks, but we are math-fiends here and we didn't have a 'well rounded curriculum' with a bunch of courses for 1st grade so there's that.

 

--Not spending as much time as other people?

 

:confused1:

 

[zarabellesmom]

 

We are math fiends too. Is there a club...or maybe a self help group?

[Chelli]

I jump chapters at a time because I know my dd's strengths and understanding of the material. For example last year we skipped three chapters in Math Focus. They were on time, money, and adding/subtracting thousands. I had her take the chapter tests and told her if she scored above 95% she didn't have to do it. She met my cut off, and we skipped those chapters. She's always been great with time and money from a young age, and adding/subtracting thousands was not any different than the same methods used to add/subtract hundreds which she already had mastered. That was three chapters out of the way and we moved on to other things. No point in covering it just because it's in the book when my dd doesn't NEED to spend a week or two on something that she already knows. I also do the IP and CWP with our program, but those are done on her own as independent work.

[Crimson Wife]

I see. After I read your post I went to the Singapore web site and they say the same thing in the FAQ. I guess I got a different impression because the grid (TOC by week) in the front of the HIG includes the EP problems and the tests and where they belong in the sequence. I guess I took it very literally....

That grid is there to let users know where those components go IF they decide to use them with their student. They are totally optional and IMHO using them all would be overkill.

[Crimson Wife]

--More personally, as I've watched my kid enjoy BA, I've wondered if we are moving too slowly though Singapore. He's not a math whiz, but I do think we could go possibly go faster.

If your kid is able to handle BA, I would definitely dump the EP, and possibly the regular workbook as well.

 

My DS who is also finishing up BA 3 is doing Singapore 4A text + IP + CWP. He does Singapore M/W, BA T/Th, and then the end-of-chapter reviews from Singapore 3B on Fridays.

[hellen]

Accelerating is done for kids that learn the material quickly and get bored going the pace laid out in the book. Their appropriate level IS higher because of their advanced development, and thus you accelerate those kids to get them to where they really are. Sometimes they're developmentally ready to learn something but haven't been taught a few things at a lower level, so you zip through those things to make sure you don't have holes.

 

I would not recommend accelerating all kids in math. That would be silly. Those of us answering how we accelerated Singapore have kids who are naturally good at math, so they learn the material quicker.

 

I agree.

 

I have two kids doing Singapore. One is accelerated and one is behind. The one who is accelerated learns quickly. He spends maybe 15 minutes per day on math. He does two math programs, IP, and CWP. My other child learns a lot slower and needs lots and lots of review and practice. She hasn't done any of the supplemental material yet. She spends more time on math than her brother but she has to work much harder to learn every concept.

[Targhee]

We use mainly the workbook (and the textbook).  We accelerate through stuff they get (no need to do every little thing - why practice what they already know), and we slow down for things that they don't get.  At that point I may add in other things (since I don't use IP or CWP or anything).  We do use mental math strips starting in Singapore 3.  I have used this speed-up-slow-down method for 2 of my kids with great success, and they both love math and do well with it.  They are also both working a grade or two ahead in it.

[Nan in Mass]

So I have a question to those who have accelerated and what you consider mastery.  Do you give them the problems and if they can do them "the Singapore way" then it is mastered and you move on, or if they just get the correct answer?  For example, we are close to the end of 1A right now and while my DD5 (almost 6) can get all the correct answers if given the problems (right now we are in addition and subtraction to 20), but that is because she is counting up or down in her head, not because she is making 10 in some form or fashion, which is what the HIG has me teaching.  Should I move on because she is getting the correct answers, or push her to do it "the Singapore way?"  I am worried if she doesn't understand the concepts they teach and just does it her own way, when we get to larger numbers she will be lost.

 

I'm not sure how I wound up on this thread, since where I really belong now is the college board or the self-education board GRIN.  I think I was aiming for the general education board and my finger missed and I landed in elementary school instead.  But since I'm here, and since I took two children, one quicker at math and one slower, through PM and NEM (up to pre-calculus) and then watched what happened when they hit college (youngest just finished differential equations, having gotten through calculus), I have an opinion about this. : )  And about those bar diagrams.  The simple answer is MAKE YOUR CHILDREN DO THEM THE SINGAPORE WAY and DO NOT SKIP THE BAR DIAGRAMS.

 

My children started when they were older (7 and 11?) and skipped 1A and possibly 1B (hard to remember), so I don't know how this works with a very young child.  I can tell you that counting up and down is a very appropriate way to get the answers, a very necessary stage to go through.  I think with the making ten thing, Singapore is trying to help children move past simply counting up and down.  I didn't start written math until mine could do quite complicated math in his head, since the stages for math learning go from concrete to mental to written -  something like moving concrete objects around, moving pictures of concrete objects around in your head, using verbal numbers to represent groups of objects, being able to move those labeled groups around in your head, using written numbers to represent the verbal numbers that represent the groups of objects.  It seemed easier to me not to move on to the written part until after my child was able to do math in his head easily.  I wasn't in any hurry with youngest.  Oldest was pulled out of public school in 5th grade and needed to start over with math.  PM worked really well to straighten out his tangled math thinking.

 

SINGAPORE TEACHES NEW CONCEPTS BY GIVING STUDENTS EASY PROBLEMS, ONES THEY KNOW THE ANSWER TO, AND THEN HAVING THEM DO THEM IN A NEW WAY. This helps prevent them from just memorizing the steps without understanding why they are doing what they are doing.  They have to understand why in order to use the knowledge later, when they get to algebra.  (I know that seems a long way off when you are in 1A, but having had to take an 11yo and back him way up to straighten out his thinking enough that he had half a chance at being able to juggle numbers enough to do algebra in a few years, I can tell you that the foundation for algebra and then calculus and geometry and other maths begins way earlier than you'd think.)  The danger with this system for homeschoolers is that it is easy to focus on getting the correct answer and miss the real purpose of the lesson.  If you do this, you may hit a wall later.  I suspect that some of people who say Singapore didn't work for them have done this.  It is really important to have your child do the problems the Singapore way.  I started to make this mistake but fortunately caught it early enough that I could correct it.  I explained this to my children over and over, especially when they began algebra and it began to be very important that they write out their work, even if they could do the problem in their head.

 

Bars - Algebra starts with a whole lot of problems that can be solved two ways - the Singapore non-algebra way using bars or the "goes to" arrow, and the new algebra way.  You are doing the same thing each way, but one is a more pictoral way and one uses algebra variables.  Using the bars allows younger children to solve problems that most adults need algebra to solve, and then (even more importantly) allows students to see how to set up their algebra word problems later.  When my children took chemistry at the community college (in high school), they had to teach their friends how to use the "goes to" arrow before their friends understood how to do the chemical solutions problems, even the simple ones.  The bars are great for the math-bright children who need the challenge of solving difficult word problems before they've learned algebra, and also for the math-slow children who are going to struggle with algebra unless they can see a picture of how the different parts of a problem are related.  (The concrete version of the bars is Cuisinaire rods.  If you have a really slow one or a really young one, they might need to use the rods before switching to the paper bar diagrams.)

 

HTH,

Nan

[zarabellesmom]

I'm not sure how I wound up on this thread, since where I really belong now is the college board or the self-education board GRIN. I think I was aiming for the general education board and my finger missed and I landed in elementary school instead. But since I'm here, and since I took two children, one quicker at math and one slower, through PM and NEM (up to pre-calculus) and then watched what happened when they hit college (youngest just finished differential equations, having gotten through calculus), I have an opinion about this. : ) And about those bar diagrams. The simple answer is MAKE YOUR CHILDREN DO THEM THE SINGAPORE WAY and DO NOT SKIP THE BAR DIAGRAMS.

 

My children started when they were older (7 and 11?) and skipped 1A and possibly 1B (hard to remember), so I don't know how this works with a very young child. I can tell you that counting up and down is a very appropriate way to get the answers, a very necessary stage to go through. I think with the making ten thing, Singapore is trying to help children move past simply counting up and down. I didn't start written math until mine could do quite complicated math in his head, since the stages for math learning go from concrete to mental to written - something like moving concrete objects around, moving pictures of concrete objects around in your head, using verbal numbers to represent groups of objects, being able to move those labeled groups around in your head, using written numbers to represent the verbal numbers that represent the groups of objects. It seemed easier to me not to move on to the written part until after my child was able to do math in his head easily. I wasn't in any hurry with youngest. Oldest was pulled out of public school in 5th grade and needed to start over with math. PM worked really well to straighten out his tangled math thinking.

 

SINGAPORE TEACHES NEW CONCEPTS BY GIVING STUDENTS EASY PROBLEMS, ONES THEY KNOW THE ANSWER TO, AND THEN HAVING THEM DO THEM IN A NEW WAY. This helps prevent them from just memorizing the steps without understanding why they are doing what they are doing. They have to understand why in order to use the knowledge later, when they get to algebra. (I know that seems a long way off when you are in 1A, but having had to take an 11yo and back him way up to straighten out his thinking enough that he had half a chance at being able to juggle numbers enough to do algebra in a few years, I can tell you that the foundation for algebra and then calculus and geometry and other maths begins way earlier than you'd think.) The danger with this system for homeschoolers is that it is easy to focus on getting the correct answer and miss the real purpose of the lesson. If you do this, you may hit a wall later. I suspect that some of people who say Singapore didn't work for them have done this. It is really important to have your child do the problems the Singapore way. I started to make this mistake but fortunately caught it early enough that I could correct it. I explained this to my children over and over, especially when they began algebra and it began to be very important that they write out their work, even if they could do the problem in their head.

 

Bars - Algebra starts with a whole lot of problems that can be solved two ways - the Singapore non-algebra way using bars or the "goes to" arrow, and the new algebra way. You are doing the same thing each way, but one is a more pictoral way and one uses algebra variables. Using the bars allows younger children to solve problems that most adults need algebra to solve, and then (even more importantly) allows students to see how to set up their algebra word problems later. When my children took chemistry at the community college (in high school), they had to teach their friends how to use the "goes to" arrow before their friends understood how to do the chemical solutions problems, even the simple ones. The bars are great for the math-bright children who need the challenge of solving difficult word problems before they've learned algebra, and also for the math-slow children who are going to struggle with algebra unless they can see a picture of how the different parts of a problem are related. (The concrete version of the bars is Cuisinaire rods. If you have a really slow one or a really young one, they might need to use the rods before switching to the paper bar diagrams.)

 

HTH,

Nan

I both agree and disagree. I think it's very important to understand the why of things, and not just blindly carry out an algorithm. If the bar models help a particular student fully grasp the concept then I'm all for it. I did not and still have not taught my daughter how to do those problems algebraically but she had no problem reasoning her way to answers. To each their own. But as an aside, I never learned the bar model (as I suspect most of us did not) and I never struggled in chemistry either in school or working as a chemist before quitting that gig to chase children instead. There are certainly other valid methods besides the Singapore way. The important part is a deep understanding, I would say.

[Nan in Mass]

I both agree and disagree. I think it's very important to understand the why of things, and not just blindly carry out an algorithm. If the bar models help a particular student fully grasp the concept then I'm all for it. I did not and still have not taught my daughter how to do those problems algebraically but she had no problem reasoning her way to answers. To each their own. But as an aside, I never learned the bar model (as I suspect most of us did not) and I never struggled in chemistry either in school or working as a chemist before quitting that gig to chase children instead. There are certainly other valid methods besides the Singapore way. The important part is a deep understanding, I would say.

 

I never had any trouble with chemistry, either.  I was taught something very like the bar diagrams by my father.  He had learned to solve problem that way in engineering school and used them to show me how to set up some of the word problems in high school.  There certainly are other ways, especially for the math-bright ones.  I just know that it is helpful to have things to do, like draw a picture, when you are faced with a problem you can't see how to solve.  They make it awfully easy to see what is going on.  I don't think my math-slow one could have made the transition to algebra without them.  With my math-bright one, we often wound up solving the word problems several different ways.  He'd do it his way, then I'd suggest he do it the Singapore way, then I'd show him the way I would have approached it, since sometimes that was different as well.

 

Nan

[Gil]

We are math fiends too. Is there a club...or maybe a self help group?

Well, no need for a self-help group. We aren't addicted, we can stop any time. Yessirree, there is no problem here! :lol:

 

Thanks to the boys we do have our own little "math club" (sort of) It was not really a club, until the boys made membership cards for all of my friends who were coming to my place to study for the GRE Math subject test, themselves and me. Now we are a 'club' (though who is going to be President and who is on the board is still hotly debated.) A couple of my friends would often spend a little time humoring the boys with their own math work or showing them something and its lit a fire for them: my boys started learning Algebra more in-depthly and Pal has been working on his 1st real proof...he's getting closer now. He might even get it today.

 

 

 

 

 

[sarasue7272]

I'm trying to figure out how people get ahead in Singapore. My son has not struggled with the concepts except for "Time" in 1st grade.

 

But by the time I teach the lesson, do the textbook, the workbook, CWP, Extra Practice, the reviews, take the tests, and do some occasional enrichment/math facts, we don't get ahead doing about an hour/day. We just keep up, and that's with doing some work in the summer.

 

Are we:

 

--Doing things too slowly?

 

--Doing too many things?

 

--Not spending as much time as other people?

 

 

I have a 1st grader and we just start 2A about a week ago. I have been pretty lax about doing school every single day, although reading and math happen almost to everyday.

 

Here's what we do:

lesson from the HIG

textbook

workbook

occasionally a few problems from CWP

 

To get a little ahead, the first few chapters went really quick. I combine two lessons from the HIG or skip outright and explain with the textbook. He did all problems in the workbook. I didn't skip many lessons from the HIG, usually just combined two. A couple of times I let him continue working in the workbook beyond what was assigned, but only if he wanted to. Occasionally we play a math game and he does the mental maths strips, too. I did not follow the HIGs recommendation to wait until all math facts were memorized. The only tests we have done were from the singapore website, after completing the book. It does not take an hour, unless he decides to mosey along with the workbook. I was reading the workbook instructions to him for most of the year, so that kept things on track. Now he is mostly reading the instructions himself. A few times I had to slow down, and think up some extra practice or reteach a different way.

 

 

About doing things the Singapore way, I do think this is important. The point of teaching math is to teach my son how to think differently about math concepts, what he already knows or comes up with in his head may or may not work in a few years. There are multiple ways of doing the problems in your head, and he needs to be familiar with those ways and know that they exist. You have to stretch beyond what you already know, otherwise what is the point?

[k8c]

 

SINGAPORE TEACHES NEW CONCEPTS BY GIVING STUDENTS EASY PROBLEMS, ONES THEY KNOW THE ANSWER TO, AND THEN HAVING THEM DO THEM IN A NEW WAY. 

 

I tried to explain this to DD5 as a reason to do it the Singapore way, but she didn't appreciate my logic. :-)

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

We got ahead a few ways:

 

- We did a K level math in pre-k (ds and dd were both ready for this)

 

- dd is now beginning SM1 at 5, ds began SM1 at 5.5 or so.  We go at the pace they need, which corresponds pretty well to the natural pace of SM.

 

- During the "school year", we use TB, WB, mental math probs from HIG, and that's it.  After finishing a year, we do about 10 CWP and 10 mental math or calculation type problems each day for a few weeks as a "break" from new material.

 

- Separate from SM, facts are done using Xtramath and BigBrainz on the computer.  The kids think computer time is "fun", so this doesn't really count as math time.

 

- Sometimes, we double up- For example, the graph/chart chapter and the time chapter, or shapes and graphs, that sort of thing.  These chapters are pretty easy to race through, but by doing two chapters at once, the kid is exposed to each concept for longer (sticks in brain better), but 2 chapters are still done in the time it takes to do 1.  

 

- Our breaks are pretty short.  I'm amazed at how quickly math seems to leak out of brains!  I don't want to spend 2 months off, then spend ANOTHER month re-learning everything we worked so hard to learn before!  

 

Our SM lessons tend to go the same way:

- 10 probs form the mental math section of the HIG as warmup.  I mix these up so they might have some addition, some subtraction, some money...  I skip the multiplication probs because ds is solid on those facts. 

- the lesson from the TB plus any necessary manipulatives

- WB done semi-independently, then checked and corrected. 

After a WB review, I use the TB review in lieu of a separate test.  I give the TB review as a test, then we correct together. 

 

 

[Crimson Wife]

Well, no need for a self-help group. We aren't addicted, we can stop any time. Yessirree, there is no problem here! :lol:

 

I have forced myself to put a moratorium on any more pre-algebra or algebra 1 books until my DS is at that stage. I have waaaaaaaay too many on my bookshelf already. And if I do decide to purchase ones for him, they will need to be sufficiently different enough from what I already have (Art of Problem Solving would fit into that category as would the Arbor Center books).

[chicagoshannon]

We don't do the tests. I just use the reviews as "tests" to see what she needs more practice in. We also don't do all of the problems in the text book. If she gets a concept right away we just skip to the workbook. We don't do EP, Ip, or CWP at this time. Right now we are taking some time off for intensive fact review.

[Gil]

I have forced myself to put a moratorium on any more pre-algebra or algebra 1 books until my DS is at that stage. I have waaaaaaaay too many on my bookshelf already. And if I do decide to purchase ones for him, they will need to be sufficiently different enough from what I already have (Art of Problem Solving would fit into that category as would the Arbor Center books).

I've got 99 problems but excessive curriculum ain't one! :lol: I'm just coasting along on all the stuff we have here already while I figure out how I feel about homeschooling and trying to develop some sort of education manifesto or something so that I can make HS work for us long term which is what the boys say that they want. I don't have a bunch of curriculum but I have a few dozen or so interesting supplements on the 4th-8th grade level. I'm a big proponent of the the old depression era mentality that says "use it up, wear it out, make do or do without." So we believe in using what we have.

 

:)

[Tanikit]

My DD would be finishing K now if she lived in most states in America (but she would be one of the oldest in her class) - here she is in first grade. I did K level math at 4 years old with her, Singapore 1a and 1b at 5 years old and she is now doing 2b. We have also moved very quickly through LOF to get to a point where the basic arithmetic is new (we are not there yet). I know how long she can concentrate on something and assign as much for that day as will take that length of time (and that is about 2 sessions of 20 min) using whichever curriculum I choose for that day. It just moves fast - I am not sure why. Teaching time is incredibly short with my DD - she just seems to know it with very little explanation - obviously she is being taught the Singapore method, but that does not take much time (yet). The ONLY thing that is slowing her down right now is that I insist she writes her answers down and handwriting is still a little slow for her.

[zarabellesmom]

I've got 99 problems but excessive curriculum ain't one! :lol: I'm just coasting along on all the stuff we have here already while I figure out how I feel about homeschooling and trying to develop some sort of education manifesto or something so that I can make HS work for us long term which is what the boys say that they want. I don't have a bunch of curriculum but I have a few dozen or so interesting supplements on the 4th-8th grade level. I'm a big proponent of the the old depression era mentality that says "use it up, wear it out, make do or do without." So we believe in using what we have.

 

:)

I love this, I just wish I could make it work. Everything is so appealing..........

[idnib]

If you follow Singapore by grade level they are already accelerated compared to their peers.

 

I've heard this but I've never managed to find anything confirming it. I don't feel like we've covered topics a year ahead but I'm not super familiar with the local public school topics except by asking my neighbor.

[Gil]

I love this, I just wish I could make it work. Everything is so appealing..........

 

It is tremendously helpful to be broke already. Spur of the moment purchases are not possible. :p. Every purchase over a buck has to be premeditated and approved in advance because every penny counts!

[Crimson Wife]

I've heard this but I've never managed to find anything confirming it. I don't feel like we've covered topics a year ahead but I'm not super familiar with the local public school topics except by asking my neighbor.

 

Singapore is ahead of Common Core, and that was a big reason why it got denied recently by the CA Department of Education. http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/502152-common-core-math-textbook/?p=5441759

[chiguirre]

We weren't ahead in SM until this year, but SM US Edition 6A and 6B only have a few new topics in them and a whole boat load of review which you really don't need to do if you just finished SM5. I tore out the new material from the workbook and I was left with half of the pages that were review sections. It's not worth skipping entirely if you're going to stay with SM in the upper grades, but if you're not, I'd stop after 5B and start pre-algebra. Even if you do stick with Discovering Mathematics, I wouldn't expect to spend more than a few months in 6A and 6B unless the Standards edition is very different than the US edition.

 

I think it took us about a full calendar year for each level of SM using US Ed textbook (but not doing all exercises, just the presentation and sample problems), workbook (this we did use in its entirety until 5th grade when I implemented an incentive plan to encourage attention to details so T only did half the problems), IP (everything until 5th grade and then just the incentive plan) and CWP over the summer. We occasionally went off on rabbit trails with other curricula. For 1st-3rd grade, T did all of Miquon in addition to SM. Later she played around with Math Doesn't Suck and the other Danica McKellar books.

 

The incentive plan I implemented cut down on the work load and speeded things up, but I found T did better work when she knew that if she got all the problems right she'd be done. If she got one wrong, she'd have to redo it and one more like it. This focused her practice on things she needed to work on and did improve her attention to detail. I'm planning to continue this method going forward.