Sonlight alternatives

[Whereneverever]

With all the talk about the problems I though I'd start a thread for people who love the idea and hate the direction.

 

I have an old IG for core a I am doing next year for my k student and I am finishing at some point core d&e with my older.

 

I now have no idea where to go from here, though.

 

Anyone else in a similar boat?

 

Ideas?:confused:

[Kathryn]

I'm planning on going to Tapestry of Grace (about 90% sure). I have three IRL friends who are leaving Sonlight this year too. One is going to My Father's World, one is going to Story of the World with a co-op, and one is doing Prairie Primer next year while deciding where to go after that.

[WeeBeaks]

I left SL last year for a year of state/American history combo on my own and have now been using TOG for about 10 weeks. TOG is going well, and I add in some of our favorites from SL corresponding to the time period being studied.

[Whereneverever]

With tog I'm concerned that by the time I'd use it for a future rotation books would be hard to find or out of print. Do they offer updates?

[SebastianCat]

We took a year off from SL this year and studied state history with a curriculum I put together myself. We had done cores P4/5 through C, and my 7 year old just wasn't quite ready for D. I'm SO glad I did it!

 

In our year away from SL, I realized that I really like putting my own stuff together and not being so pressured by the SL schedule. And my kids really love doing more hands-on activities.

 

So in the fall we will begin a hybrid of SL's Core D (using a previous year's IG that I purchased used) with HSITW's Time Travelers CDs. I *think* I'll use HSITW as my spine, and just add the SL books as they fit. If that goes well, we'll do the same thing for the time period that Core E covers the following year.

 

After that, I don't know what we'll do. I'm considering TOG as well.

[amyable]

With tog I'm concerned that by the time I'd use it for a future rotation books would be hard to find or out of print. Do they offer updates?

 

I know if you buy the digital version you get free updates (although you can't re-sell the DE, a drawback). We are new to TOG so I don't know about any other way to get updates.

 

To answer the OP, we are going with TOG as well. I just bought year 1 and am reading through the introductory material.

[amayla]

I am in the same situation. I want to switch but can't decide what to use.

[Kathryn]

With tog I'm concerned that by the time I'd use it for a future rotation books would be hard to find or out of print. Do they offer updates?

 

If you buy from them, and you want print, the DE is only $20 more, You not only get free updates, you can choose whether to use the updates, OR go through the archives and choose pages that have older book selections that you may have access to (at least that's what I read on their forums).

[razorbackmama]

I'm in the same boat. At THIS point I'm planning to buy my next year's Cores before the switch, provided I get my tax refund in time. But after that...I have no idea.

 

I have used TOG in the past, so switching to that from SL is not an option. I know that some don't like how uber-scheduled the readings are in SL, but that is one thing I love about it and hated about TOG. I need something that has a daily schedule, not just a weekly schedule.

 

We have also used MFW and Biblioplan. FINALLY, after almost 11 years of homeschooling, I have found Our Curriculum (SL), just in time for them to change it all up.

 

I looked briefly at the new IG sample, and I am already annoyed with it. I DO NOT LIKE the combo 4 & 5 day schedule. I like the way is NOW, with one on one side and one on the other. And that's not even mentioning the lame-brained idea to include the LA in with the younger cores.:glare:

 

So all that to say...I have NO CLUE what we're going to do.:confused:

[HappyCrazyMama]

I'll go back to TOG, it is always a great war within myself anyway and SL is just making the choice easier. I used TOG (mostly classic) for 5 years with my oldest 2 but started #3 with MFW and then SL.(we have a 9 year age gap) #3 and #4 didn't combine into their core this year as well as I had hoped anyway, but I already have core C so we'll do that first before any final decision is made.:)

[tuzor]

I'm in the same boat. At THIS point I'm planning to buy my next year's Cores before the switch, provided I get my tax refund in time. But after that...I have no idea.

 

I have used TOG in the past, so switching to that from SL is not an option. I know that some don't like how uber-scheduled the readings are in SL, but that is one thing I love about it and hated about TOG. I need something that has a daily schedule, not just a weekly schedule.

 

We have also used MFW and Biblioplan. FINALLY, after almost 11 years of homeschooling, I have found Our Curriculum (SL), just in time for them to change it all up.

 

I looked briefly at the new IG sample, and I am already annoyed with it. I DO NOT LIKE the combo 4 & 5 day schedule. I like the way is NOW, with one on one side and one on the other. And that's not even mentioning the lame-brained idea to include the LA in with the younger cores.:glare:

 

So all that to say...I have NO CLUE what we're going to do.:confused:

 

Well if it helps any, SL loves to hear from its users. If I were a user I would complie a nice list of all the things I love and hate with the new layout and send it to someone within the organiztion. Perhaps if they hear from enough people they will change things agian but more in line with what their customer base likes. In the mean time is there a way you could skip over the parts you don't like? I am not sure about the new schedule but is there a way you could look at it with new eyes so to speak and see how you could make it work for you. Compare it with the old style and see how you could adjust the new to make it work for you. If you really like SL, I would invest the time to see how I could make it work for my family rather than switching. Unfortunately there is no perfect curriculum. So if you don't have an issue with their educational philosphy there may still be hope.

 

Personally, I was seriously considering SL but decided agianst it for several reasons that don't include the changes in the new format. Best wishes to you.

Edited March 15, 2012 by tuzor

[Kathryn]

So if you don't have an issue with their educational philosphy there may still be hope.

 

Therein lies the problem. We're not quite sure what their educational philosophy is at this point. :confused:

[razorbackmama]

Well if it helps any, SL loves to hear from its users. If I were a user I would complie a nice list of all the things I love and hate with the new layout and send it to someone within the organiztion. Perhaps if they hear from enough people they will change things agian but more in line with what their customer base likes. In the mean time is there a way you could skip over the parts you don't like? I am not sure about the new schedule but is there a way you could look at it with new eyes so to speak and see how you could make it work for you. Compare it with the old style and see how you could adjust the new to make it work for you. If you really like SL, I would invest the time to see how I could make it work for my family rather than switching. Unfortunately there is no perfect curriculum. So if you don't have an issue with their educational philosphy there may still be hope.

 

Personally, I was seriously considering SL but decided agianst it for several reasons that don't include the changes in the new format. Best wishes to you.

That's a good idea. Maybe I can go ahead and get the cores for next year now like I had planned, and then spend next year trying to get used to the new format and hearing how others are using it. And maybe by the time buying time rolls around next year, they'll realize what a dumb idea all this was.:lol:

[razorbackmama]

Therein lies the problem. We're not quite sure what their educational philosophy is at this point. :confused:

Could you expound on this?

[mom2hunangirls]

I'm sure I'm going to regret asking this, and I'm going to seem like an uneducated idiot for doing so, but I really am trying to understand some of the issues and I'm just not getting something (I guess).

 

It seems some of the issue is the LA being included. But without seeing how much this increases the price I don't understand why people just don't do that part. If it does increase the price significantly, well, that I can understand somewhat. But, we don't know until 4/2, right? And doesn't TOG (since that's where most are looking to go...even I'm looking.) include LA too? So I'm just not getting that part exactly, as a reason to be really upset with them. Because there doesn't seem to be the same uproar over Bible being included. Or is there something else?

 

Then there is The Light and Glory and other book issue. Ok, I went back and researched John's blog. Got it, I see why people took issue with it.

But again, this seems like an issue that might be a bit early. It's scheduled as a Day 5 book, so optional. (I'm a 4 day user so maybe it's a perception thing. Since I do 4 days I would have no problem not doing that book anyway. So, maybe 5 day folks are upset that soemthing like this is being added to them? They maybe don't see it as optional as I do?) I am assuming the book won't be read in totality so maybe some of the selections are ok? Don't hit me!! Really, I just don't know and I'm sorting it out. I thought the "warning" with SL all along was that different ideas would be present but that notes would be there. And John's notes will be there right? Well, we guess. But won't know until April 2.

 

I do understand that the view of history presented is slanted or even wrong (in TLaG). But can't that be said of almost any history book? Or several? I am NO history buff at all. I look at the history of my voting years and I know that both sides are rarely shared in a single reporting or book. So I admit, that I take most history books with a grain of salt.

Is the issue with them including any of it, because it's all wrong? How do you know that opposing views won't be included in later weeks? (Until we see the whole schedule?)

 

I guess I've never seen any curriculum not have something included that someone didn't want or like, and changes make everyone crazy...but SL is a business like any other and most try to streamline and have continuity across the brand. I like the way the notes were (2011)...I had a great system. :) And this new way will certainly yank that out from under me. But most curriculum I've used since 2008 have had significant changes.

 

So, could April 2nd change the degree of these issues?

 

And regarding the direction of the educational philosophy...is this related to The Light and Glory issue? Or is there something else in what they have done? This is something I really can't find anything on and would like to know as I'm only doing 3rd grade right now and want to know what I'm looking out for.

[Kathryn]

Could you expound on this?

 

They're refusing to answer questions about what customers should infer about the addition of the three American providentialist Peter Marshall books. It's become very clear that since John retired in 2009, Sartia is steering the comapny in a new direction. And the inclusion of materials that he announced were inaccurate, misleading, and embarrassing is a huge deal that they're essentially refusing to address. The party line is that they suddenly found "gaps" in the coverage of Cores D and E that they are filling in with these books and that we should all just stop talking about it, trust them, and buy it and then find out why they chose to use these books again instead of asking.

[Upward Journey]

I'm sure I'm going to regret asking this, and I'm going to seem like an uneducated idiot for doing so, but I really am trying to understand some of the issues and I'm just not getting something (I guess).

 

It seems some of the issue is the LA being included. But without seeing how much this increases the price I don't understand why people just don't do that part. If it does increase the price significantly, well, that I can understand somewhat. But, we don't know until 4/2, right? And doesn't TOG (since that's where most are looking to go...even I'm looking.) include LA too? So I'm just not getting that part exactly, as a reason to be really upset with them. Because there doesn't seem to be the same uproar over Bible being included. Or is there something else?

 

Then there is The Light and Glory and other book issue. Ok, I went back and researched John's blog. Got it, I see why people took issue with it.

But again, this seems like an issue that might be a bit early. It's scheduled as a Day 5 book, so optional. (I'm a 4 day user so maybe it's a perception thing. Since I do 4 days I would have no problem not doing that book anyway. So, maybe 5 day folks are upset that soemthing like this is being added to them? They maybe don't see it as optional as I do?) I am assuming the book won't be read in totality so maybe some of the selections are ok? Don't hit me!! Really, I just don't know and I'm sorting it out. I thought the "warning" with SL all along was that different ideas would be present but that notes would be there. And John's notes will be there right? Well, we guess. But won't know until April 2.

 

I do understand that the view of history presented is slanted or even wrong (in TLaG). But can't that be said of almost any history book? Or several? I am NO history buff at all. I look at the history of my voting years and I know that both sides are rarely shared in a single reporting or book. So I admit, that I take most history books with a grain of salt.

Is the issue with them including any of it, because it's all wrong? How do you know that opposing views won't be included in later weeks? (Until we see the whole schedule?)

 

I guess I've never seen any curriculum not have something included that someone didn't want or like, and changes make everyone crazy...but SL is a business like any other and most try to streamline and have continuity across the brand. I like the way the notes were (2011)...I had a great system. :) And this new way will certainly yank that out from under me. But most curriculum I've used since 2008 have had significant changes.

 

So, could April 2nd change the degree of these issues?

 

And regarding the direction of the educational philosophy...is this related to The Light and Glory issue? Or is there something else in what they have done? This is something I really can't find anything on and would like to know as I'm only doing 3rd grade right now and want to know what I'm looking out for.

 

TOG does not include LA, only writing instruction.

 

ETA: they do suggest using Easy Grammar and they do give a suggestion as to when to start the book. But other than that, no TOG doesn't include LA. Another difference would be that you don't have to purchase anything from them except an IG in order to enjoy the full benefits of using their materials, and they even go as far as to transfer those benefits to a new purchaser if you buy used. SL on the other hand insists that you buy "a full core" i.e. as of April 2nd that will be the IG, all the history books, the bible books, the readers & the LA from them all at the same time.

Edited March 15, 2012 by Upward Journey

[kardamom]

Therein lies the problem. We're not quite sure what their educational philosophy is at this point. :confused:

 

Although a promise was made of more information to come when the thread I was following was locked, I'm not sure I need more info at this point. If it was a flap about a completely new book, I might hold judgment. The complete about face after John's eloquent assessment is remarkable. I really don't want to support sales of books like that for a child under 10, no matter what notes they may include in the new IG.

 

I had my box day today of my selections from the 2011 D+E. I didn't get the IG. It may be my last SL box day.

 

I'll be using SL's lit that I just got, that I'll schedule in with WinterPromise's American Crossing. WP's shipping isn't anything like SL's, but I can plan around it and I actually like what I've gotten from them in a couple other programs.

[Mom0012]

TOG does not include LA, only writing instruction.

 

ETA: they do suggest using Easy Grammar and they do give a suggestion as to when to start the book. But other than that, no TOG doesn't include LA. Another difference would be that you don't have to purchase anything from them except an IG in order to enjoy the full benefits of using their materials, and they even go as far as to transfer those benefits to a new purchaser if you buy used. SL on the other hand insists that you buy "a full core" i.e. as of April 2nd that will be the IG, all the history books, the bible books, the readers & the LA from them all at the same time.

 

Are you saying you can no longer buy just an IG from SL after April 2nd? Unless that's the case, I don't really think it is different than TOG, though I am not a TOG expert by any means. I'm thinking you now have to buy the books for bible and LA if you want to buy a core, but surely, you can still just buy an IG and the books you can't find elsewhere?

 

Lisa

[Kathryn]

Are you saying you can no longer buy just an IG from SL after April 2nd? Unless that's the case, I don't really think it is different than TOG, though I am not a TOG expert by any means. I'm thinking you now have to buy the books for bible and LA if you want to buy a core, but surely, you can still just buy an IG and the books you can't find elsewhere?

 

Lisa

 

You are correct. You can buy just an IG or just books or whatever from Sonlight, though they HEAVILY push buying full cores (which will now include LA and Bible).

[razorbackmama]

Where might I find out more (or as much as possible) about this whole Peter Marshall book thing? To say I cannot stand those books is an understatement.:glare:

 

We're doing Core D now, and Core E was the one that I was planning to buy here in the next couple of weeks. Looks like I have all the more reason to.

 

Re: the LA...TOG includes writing assignments, but it includes all levels in one fell swoop. My beef with the LA being included in the Cores is that it's that level's LA. Not so great when you have multiple ages using a Core.

[simka2]

I'm sure I'm going to regret asking this, and I'm going to seem like an uneducated idiot for doing so, but I really am trying to understand some of the issues and I'm just not getting something (I guess).

 

It seems some of the issue is the LA being included. But without seeing how much this increases the price I don't understand why people just don't do that part. If it does increase the price significantly, well, that I can understand somewhat. But, we don't know until 4/2, right? And doesn't TOG (since that's where most are looking to go...even I'm looking.) include LA too? So I'm just not getting that part exactly, as a reason to be really upset with them. Because there doesn't seem to be the same uproar over Bible being included. Or is there something else?

 

Then there is The Light and Glory and other book issue. Ok, I went back and researched John's blog. Got it, I see why people took issue with it.

But again, this seems like an issue that might be a bit early. It's scheduled as a Day 5 book, so optional. (I'm a 4 day user so maybe it's a perception thing. Since I do 4 days I would have no problem not doing that book anyway. So, maybe 5 day folks are upset that soemthing like this is being added to them? They maybe don't see it as optional as I do?) I am assuming the book won't be read in totality so maybe some of the selections are ok? Don't hit me!! Really, I just don't know and I'm sorting it out. I thought the "warning" with SL all along was that different ideas would be present but that notes would be there. And John's notes will be there right? Well, we guess. But won't know until April 2.

 

I do understand that the view of history presented is slanted or even wrong (in TLaG). But can't that be said of almost any history book? Or several? I am NO history buff at all. I look at the history of my voting years and I know that both sides are rarely shared in a single reporting or book. So I admit, that I take most history books with a grain of salt.

Is the issue with them including any of it, because it's all wrong? How do you know that opposing views won't be included in later weeks? (Until we see the whole schedule?)

 

I guess I've never seen any curriculum not have something included that someone didn't want or like, and changes make everyone crazy...but SL is a business like any other and most try to streamline and have continuity across the brand. I like the way the notes were (2011)...I had a great system. :) And this new way will certainly yank that out from under me. But most curriculum I've used since 2008 have had significant changes.

 

So, could April 2nd change the degree of these issues?

 

And regarding the direction of the educational philosophy...is this related to The Light and Glory issue? Or is there something else in what they have done? This is something I really can't find anything on and would like to know as I'm only doing 3rd grade right now and want to know what I'm looking out for.

 

Someone has already answered the LA issue.

 

I was looking strongly at either TOG or Sonlight a little while ago. I decided to go with TOG. The reason boiled down to the changes in "attitude" Sonlight was displaying. They are moving in a direction towards only wanting a "certain" type of Christian as a customer. I started a thread a couple weeks ago asking for information about Sonlight. I received quite a few pm's from people who had directly received insulting emails. Not a smart business decision if you ask me. ;)

 

This was before the most recent book issue.

 

OTOH, TOG has gone out of it's way to be more accessible to a more general Christian clientele. I had looked into TOG a couple years ago and it was too "Reformish" for me to use. It is still put out my Christians from a Reformed backgrounds, but I have found it easily adaptable to my theology. (we shall see what the future holds though)

 

Also, with the DE version of TOG I get future updates included and have found the early years easy to substitute books I have on hand. Hope that helps someone.

Edited March 15, 2012 by simka2

[razorbackmama]

Someone has already answered the LA issue.

 

I was looking strongly at either TOG or Sonlight a little while ago. I decided to go with TOG. The reason boiled down to the changes in "attitude" Sonlight was displaying. They are moving in a direction towards only wanting a "certain" type of Christian as a customer. I started a thread a couple weeks ago asking for information about Sonlight. I received quite a few pm's from people who had directly received insulting emails. Not a smart business decision if you ask me. ;)

This is rather surprising to me, since they have been accused of being "not Christian enough." Goodness, that's why our state's convention (and Sonlight's home state!!!) won't even allow them to have a booth at our convention!

[simka2]

This is rather surprising to me, since they have been accused of being "not Christian enough." Goodness, that's why our state's convention (and Sonlight's home state!!!) won't even allow them to have a booth at our convention!

I wonder if that is part of what this is about. Are they trying to become "christian enough?"

 

It was really sad to me as well. It was also something that makes no business sense to me at all, but I have seen it happen quite a few times with religious companies that have undergone a change in leadership.

 

 

There have been quite a few threads recently that mention these issues. I know a few, that have experienced this, can be contacted via pm.

 

I considered just going with an older IG and piecing the books together, but this is an issue that really rubs me wrong.

[melmichigan]

This is rather surprising to me, since they have been accused of being "not Christian enough." Goodness, that's why our state's convention (and Sonlight's home state!!!) won't even allow them to have a booth at our convention!

 

I thought that had more to do with their science program, which they have now revamped to more of an intelligent design track? I can't find John's blog posts about it right now...someone help me out.

[Mom0012]

You are correct. You can buy just an IG or just books or whatever from Sonlight, though they HEAVILY push buying full cores (which will now include LA and Bible).

 

Well, I guess I won't feel the pressure since I'm not going to even look at their new catalog without the book descriptions in it.:tongue_smilie:

 

Honestly, I love SL. The day I saw their booth at a convention years ago was the best thing that ever happened to our little homeschool. I usually buy an IG guide used and buy most of my books on Amazon utilizing their 4-for-3 deal. I am not going to let the changes they make bother me. I was kind of excited about the new format. I never use the notes now, but I was thinking I would utilize them more if they put them right with the weekly schedule. If there is something in there that I don't agree with, I'll just skip it. We do some of the mapping, but I really think we'd do more with their new improved laminated maps. I never use the maps they include now. I have my own map, but their new ones look better.

 

The only thing I am waiting to see is what book changes have been made to Core G and how I feel about them. I guess I need to get over to the SL boards and see if they've posted that yet. That is the main thing I care about -- the books. So, I can see why some people are upset about the changes to Cores D and E if they heavily rely on 3 books people hate.

 

Lisa

[Mom0012]

Okay, so I just went to the boards and nothing new is posted in the "What's New for Core G" section except to "be sure to watch their videos". How did people find out about the Light and the Glory being included again in Core 3? Was it in the sample of the IG? Or is the info somewhere that I'm missing.

 

Thanks!

Lisa

[Whereneverever]

Okay, so I just went to the boards and nothing new is posted in the "What's New for Core G" section except to "be sure to watch their videos". How did people find out about the Light and the Glory being included again in Core 3? Was it in the sample of the IG? Or is the info somewhere that I'm missing.

 

Thanks!

Lisa

 

It's right in the IG sample.

[8circles]

I posted about this a few weeks ago as well, looking for SL alternatives. At first, I was leaving the door open, ready to hear all about the changes & decide how to proceed, possibly buying used if I didn't like it. Now, not-so-much. SL is no longer an option for me due to the addition of the Peter Marshall books. There is no explanation that would satisfy me. The only way (IMO) one could justify using these books would be as an exercise in inaccurate history & messed-up theology. That isn't appropriate for an eight-year-old IMO. I no longer trust their judgement which is a big part of why I chose them this year. Until now I was a very happy SL customer.

 

At this point I'll be putting together my own plan using SOTW as our spine.

[razorbackmama]

I thought that had more to do with their science program, which they have now revamped to more of an intelligent design track? I can't find John's blog posts about it right now...someone help me out.

Yes, probably, but in general CHEC has given the impression that SL isn't Christian enough because they aren't dogmatic enough about young earthism. I wouldn't be surprised though if history played a role too since CHEC is BIG TIME into Providential history. I've gotten flyers at the CHEC convention before for books that tell about the "divine inspiration" behind the Constitution.:001_huh:

[Upward Journey]

Are you saying you can no longer buy just an IG from SL after April 2nd? Unless that's the case, I don't really think it is different than TOG, though I am not a TOG expert by any means. I'm thinking you now have to buy the books for bible and LA if you want to buy a core, but surely, you can still just buy an IG and the books you can't find elsewhere?

 

Lisa

 

No. That's not what I'm saying. My original answer was simply to point out that in regards to language arts (i.e. what they cover in the grammar stage) TOG & SL are quite different.

[swellmomma]

For dd4 I am thinking going to go with oak meadow for next year for K though she could go through the core K version ds is currently going through, for ds8 I bought the next core already but he wasn't ready for it then. So we will do that next year. The bigs I have a really old edition of core E so we may or may not use it. We have been doing a lot with Time travelers Cd-Roms and history pockets so we may just finish with that series and then loop back to the Ancient history text by susan for high school next for them. WIth the younger 2 well dd. After ds does this next core I may search for a core C old version used to use and then he can use the old versions of D & E that we have.

 

I had considered switching them all over to TOG so I could teach them all at once and still might, but since I already own a few future cores it makes sense to stick with them kwim. I just know I will not buy a new core from them with the planned changes.

[Abbeygurl4]

Therein lies the problem. We're not quite sure what their educational philosophy is at this point. :confused:

 

:iagree:

 

EXACTLY!

[ZooRho]

I wonder if that is part of what this is about. Are they trying to become "christian enough?"

 

It was really sad to me as well. It was also something that makes no business sense to me at all, but I have seen it happen quite a few times with religious companies that have undergone a change in leadership.

 

 

There have been quite a few threads recently that mention these issues. I know a few, that have experienced this, can be contacted via pm.

 

I considered just going with an older IG and piecing the books together, but this is an issue that really rubs me wrong.

 

This is my take.

Sarita is trying to make it the "RIGHT" kind of Christian to get back into the convention

[razorbackmama]

This is my take.

Sarita is trying to make it the "RIGHT" kind of Christian to get back into the convention

Sadly, I wonder if you're right. I've actually talked to someone who discounted Sonlight totally simply because they'd been booted from CHEC. She said that she was glad that as a new homeschooler she could count on CHEC for weeding out the unbiblical curriculum (or something along those lines...not an exact quote). Honestly I don't like to go to the CHEC convention because of all the unbiblical stuff taught there!:tongue_smilie:

 

But anyway, so even someone who wasn't super familiar with Sonlight OR CHEC was taking CHEC's word for it that there was something "wrong" with Sonlight. :(

[tuzor]

This is rather surprising to me, since they have been accused of being "not Christian enough." Goodness, that's why our state's convention (and Sonlight's home state!!!) won't even allow them to have a booth at our convention!

This is discrimination! All Christians do not look the same. If I were the creator of an educational product I probably would stay clear of this type of venue anyway. Some people/organizations can be so judgemental it makes me ill. That is not the true essence of Christianity anyway. But I digress. I'm getting really heated. :mad:

I thought that had more to do with their science program, which they have now revamped to more of an intelligent design track? I can't find John's blog posts about it right now...someone help me out.

I think someone listed a link in this thread or was it another thread yesterday. But if you can't find it here I believe you can search The Light and The Glory on the SL forum and find his post

 

This is my take.

Sarita is trying to make it the "RIGHT" kind of Christian to get back into the convention

I can't understand this. :confused: There are many of us who would prefer to teach our children the Bible our own way rather than have it intergrated in every part of our curriculum. Part of what I originally liked about their program was at least they attempted to show different perspective and I did not feel that their program was soo preachy. We are all different so what one likes another frowns upon. But I would not change my educational philosophy to get into a curriculum fair. Perhaps if they felt that the cores D and E were lacking they could have make certain suggestions that covers particular time periods better. They could even suggest the book TLaG along with others suggestions and allow the buyer to choose. Becuase their are some people out there that agree with Marshall's writing, hook line and sinker.

I am sure there are other books out there that would serve the same purpose. This really feels like SL is drawing their line in the sand. Sad really.

[Whereneverever]

Sadly, I wonder if you're right. I've actually talked to someone who discounted Sonlight totally simply because they'd been booted from CHEC. She said that she was glad that as a new homeschooler she could count on CHEC for weeding out the unbiblical curriculum (or something along those lines...not an exact quote). Honestly I don't like to go to the CHEC convention because of all the unbiblical stuff taught there!:tongue_smilie:

 

But anyway, so even someone who wasn't super familiar with Sonlight OR CHEC was taking CHEC's word for it that there was something "wrong" with Sonlight. :(

 

Oh, how sad.

[danybug]

I'm sure I'm going to regret asking this, and I'm going to seem like an uneducated idiot for doing so, but I really am trying to understand some of the issues and I'm just not getting something (I guess).

 

It seems some of the issue is the LA being included. But without seeing how much this increases the price I don't understand why people just don't do that part. If it does increase the price significantly, well, that I can understand somewhat. But, we don't know until 4/2, right? And doesn't TOG (since that's where most are looking to go...even I'm looking.) include LA too? So I'm just not getting that part exactly, as a reason to be really upset with them. Because there doesn't seem to be the same uproar over Bible being included. Or is there something else?

 

Then there is The Light and Glory and other book issue. Ok, I went back and researched John's blog. Got it, I see why people took issue with it.

But again, this seems like an issue that might be a bit early. It's scheduled as a Day 5 book, so optional. (I'm a 4 day user so maybe it's a perception thing. Since I do 4 days I would have no problem not doing that book anyway. So, maybe 5 day folks are upset that soemthing like this is being added to them? They maybe don't see it as optional as I do?) I am assuming the book won't be read in totality so maybe some of the selections are ok? Don't hit me!! Really, I just don't know and I'm sorting it out. I thought the "warning" with SL all along was that different ideas would be present but that notes would be there. And John's notes will be there right? Well, we guess. But won't know until April 2.

 

I do understand that the view of history presented is slanted or even wrong (in TLaG). But can't that be said of almost any history book? Or several? I am NO history buff at all. I look at the history of my voting years and I know that both sides are rarely shared in a single reporting or book. So I admit, that I take most history books with a grain of salt.

Is the issue with them including any of it, because it's all wrong? How do you know that opposing views won't be included in later weeks? (Until we see the whole schedule?)

 

I guess I've never seen any curriculum not have something included that someone didn't want or like, and changes make everyone crazy...but SL is a business like any other and most try to streamline and have continuity across the brand. I like the way the notes were (2011)...I had a great system. :) And this new way will certainly yank that out from under me. But most curriculum I've used since 2008 have had significant changes.

 

So, could April 2nd change the degree of these issues?

 

And regarding the direction of the educational philosophy...is this related to The Light and Glory issue? Or is there something else in what they have done? This is something I really can't find anything on and would like to know as I'm only doing 3rd grade right now and want to know what I'm looking out for.

 

:iagree:

[curriculumhoarder]

I agree about CHEC being a big reason for SL to add in the Marshal books. I can't stand CHEC, they mock anyone who claims to be Christian but does not follow Ken Hamm. I've never been to a CHEC convention, they are incredibly expensive AND lock out most of the companies that I'd want to see.

 

I have been worried about SL making more substantial curriculum changes for a couple of years and sadly, it looks like that is precisely what's happening. I wonder if there will be more and more of these books, and a further circling of the wagons around Evangelistic homeschoolers. SL used to be the one Christian curriculum that could be used by a wide variety of faiths/nonfaiths, but it's looking more and more Bob Jones-y.

 

I really must research Pandia Press and other options. I have ToG Year 1 and it's ok, but not quite our style. I do find it very easy to sub out many of their religious beliefs and sub in our own! The books they recommend are also really good, and I love the extras like philosophy, art history, architecture, etc that you can do, and the books for those. That is really nice. I might have to change how we do ToG to make it fit our family for high school, IDK. I LOVE the format of VP Omnibus (the background material, the quality of the binding, the use of various authors for the articles and the various assignments). But, I can't STAND the Reformed view that permeates everything. Even my dd is getting annoyed with the POV.

 

Right now, as peeved as I am with SL, we'll be doing Core 6 and some of 7 and possibly 100 (I really have to see an IG to make that determination). My dc love SL and adore the books. The way SL is scheduled and done in the lower Cores matches well for our family. I am very glad that I don't have to worry about the new Marshal books, those Cores are done and we won't be revisiting them.

[razorbackmama]

What I have to wonder...OK we know about the Marshall books being included in Core D...what else will be changing? What might be more subtle and not quite so obvious?

 

Sigh.

 

If I had the money I'd buy up all the cores now and be done with it LOL.

 

And I won't even mention the absolutely idiotic layout of the IG, with the notes to the books behind the schedules. I won't be able to find ANYTHING anymore!:thumbdown::thumbdown::thumbdown:

 

I FULLY intend to share my reasons behind ordering NOW rather than later, too.

[LisaMarie6]

If I had the money I'd buy up all the cores now and be done with it LOL.

 

This is what I wish I could do. Thankfully, I've got all the lower cores except H. I'll purchase the Core H IG before the changes go live next year. Then I should be set accept for highschool.

[3peasinapod]

I'm in the same boat. At THIS point I'm planning to buy my next year's Cores before the switch, provided I get my tax refund in time. But after that...I have no idea.

 

I have used TOG in the past, so switching to that from SL is not an option. I know that some don't like how uber-scheduled the readings are in SL, but that is one thing I love about it and hated about TOG. I need something that has a daily schedule, not just a weekly schedule.

 

We have also used MFW and Biblioplan. FINALLY, after almost 11 years of homeschooling, I have found Our Curriculum (SL), just in time for them to change it all up.

 

I looked briefly at the new IG sample, and I am already annoyed with it. I DO NOT LIKE the combo 4 & 5 day schedule. I like the way is NOW, with one on one side and one on the other. And that's not even mentioning the lame-brained idea to include the LA in with the younger cores.:glare:

 

So all that to say...I have NO CLUE what we're going to do.:confused:

 

I just wanted to clarify that the LA in the younger cores is not included in the core IG, just a core purchase. The LA is included in the core IG in Cores D and up.

 

I am in the same boat. I was all set to do SL, and now I just don't know what I'm going to do. I don't want SL LA either, my girls learn well with what we have. I don't like to be forced to have something just so I can get one portion of it either. :glare: I'm thinking SOTW with SL books added in. So disheartening.

 

I agree with previous posts about things being "snuck in" that I'll have to extensively research every book? Not cool.

[Made Unfit]

I'm thinking SOTW with SL books added in.

 

I'm leaning towards this also.

 

Also, just wanted to say we are also doing Core B (with Readers 2 & 3), Science C, WWE, FLL, and SOTW!

 

I've been drooling over the Memoria Press products and am now thinking I may look a little closer...

Edited March 16, 2012 by Made Unfit
Additional information

[ZooRho]

What I have to wonder...OK we know about the Marshall books being included in Core D...what else will be changing? What might be more subtle and not quite so obvious?

 

Ah isn't that the truth. THAT is the burning question right.

 

Sigh.

 

If I had the money I'd buy up all the cores now and be done with it LOL.

we are in our last 2.5 years of school, and I am sure that I have what I'll use, although I had been updating things but I don't think I'll do that, I also looked for newly added books that were interesting to buy can't do that with the new catalog now so that won't happen either.

 

 

And I won't even mention the absolutely idiotic layout of the IG, with the notes to the books behind the schedules. I won't be able to find ANYTHING anymore!:thumbdown::thumbdown::thumbdown:

 

I FULLY intend to share my reasons behind ordering NOW rather than later, too.

yeah I love the way it is now, I have always pulled out about 6 weeks worth of the IG and put it into a managable folder.

[curriculumhoarder]

yeah I love the way it is now, I have always pulled out about 6 weeks worth of the IG and put it into a managable folder.

 

I never found it that hard to deal with - even as a new hser. Yeah, that big honking binder is way too big for me to manage easily (I dropped it several times before I decided that a broken foot was not what I wanted, lol). I do a week at a time in a small binder, just because I like to look at each new week to get any new books ready, etc. Then I have everything 'right behind the schedule page' anyhow.

 

I'm worried about how the notes will change, as well as the format. The linking of Bible to history (which the providential book may be a part of). IDK, but I worry that the notes are going to be a lot more like the Marshal books. Or, if not now, then soon.

 

I do like the new maps, however. I'm thinking of getting the new Core G IG at 50% off and seeing what I think side-by-side to the 2010 IG I own. I really need that side-by-side comparison on paper. There's something about reading on a computer screen that makes my mind wander...

[abacus2]

I'm planning to use Classical House of Learning Literature next year instead of Core B. I like the layout, and it's free! It's secular, but I feel confident discussing our beliefs in context. I'm not switching in response to what Sonlight is doing; CHOLL just looks great and as a bonus will be inexpensive. Right now I'm kind of thinking I might use CHOLL for two years and then go to SL Cores D and then E.

[CatholicMom]

I'm in the same boat. I love the idea of Sonlight but hate the execution. I start out loving the IG and then end up hating it half way through the year. It's just too much for me and it's too scattered-feeling. I don't have a clear idea of where we are or where we're going. I wish it was a little more unit-study-ish so it was more pulled together. I love a lot of the books (dislike some because I think they put too-mature books in younger-kid Cores).

 

I'm leaving because I don't use half the IG and because the books aren't always appropriate for the age / maturity of my kids, and it's too protestant (we are probably joining the Catholic Church).

 

Sooo I am looking at Connecting With History which I feel narrows down the book list to what is really interesting, really good, really worth the time, instead of 100 good books that I will struggle to get through and some of which will upset my kids. So I'm leading more toward nonfiction with a few historical fiction stories, and getting our literature from the library.

 

However, I haven't found a better place for Reader packages! So I am going to probably buy the whole Reader package before my Core discount runs out! And I am also looking at Heart of Dakota.

 

You might want to look at Heart of Dakota... still protestant, a little more honed, book list overlaps with Sonlight but I think there aren't so many emotional books, IG is WAY, WAY more intuitive and easy to look at.

 

I get very boggled and overwhelmed by tons of notes and flipping here and there. I can't take it. :lol:

[3peasinapod]

I'm leaning towards this also.

 

Also, just wanted to say we are also doing Core B (with Readers 2 & 3), Science C, WWE, FLL, and SOTW!

 

I've been drooling over the Memoria Press products and am now thinking I may look a little closer...

 

We would have a lot to talk about, wouldn't we! :001_smile: I haven't heard of Memoria Press.

[Down_the_Rabbit_Hole]

We took a year off from SL this year and studied state history with a curriculum I put together myself. We had done cores P4/5 through C, and my 7 year old just wasn't quite ready for D. I'm SO glad I did it!

 

In our year away from SL, I realized that I really like putting my own stuff together and not being so pressured by the SL schedule. And my kids really love doing more hands-on activities.

 

So in the fall we will begin a hybrid of SL's Core D (using a previous year's IG that I purchased used) with HSITW's Time Travelers CDs. I *think* I'll use HSITW as my spine, and just add the SL books as they fit. If that goes well, we'll do the same thing for the time period that Core E covers the following year.

 

After that, I don't know what we'll do. I'm considering TOG as well.

This is my tentative plan for dd's 4th grade year. I did the New World Explorers years ago with my ds and he loved it.. Add in some historical readers and you have a full year of American history with hands on projects, time line, mapping and more.

[3peasinapod]

This is my tentative plan for dd's 4th grade year. I did the New World Explorers years ago with my ds and he loved it.. Add in some historical readers and you have a full year of American history with hands on projects, time line, mapping and more.

 

I am thinking of using this even if I stay with SL. I shy away a bit because of all the printing involved. WinterPromise, though, has a Time Traveler's Student Pack. If you purchase the CDs from HSITW, you can show proof of purchase to WP, and then purchase this set. It has most of the activities and pages printed on different types of paper recommended by the HSITW CDs. It looks like a time saver. It is 60 dollars, but with different types of papers and 200+ pages already printed, I think it may be worth it. The set from WP includes printed pages from the first 4 CDs of HSITW program. I was very excited about this, as all that printing is daunting.

 

Also, WP sells the CDs (28.95 at HSITW) plus all the teaching pages from the Time Traveler CDs printed out for those who prefer printed pages instead of reading from a computer. That is 150 dollars for all 4 CDs plus the printed teaching pages from CDs.

 

I hope it helps someone! Make sure to order ahead of the time you need it, though, because of WPs slow shipping.