I finally got some Life of Fred Elementary books...

[BatmansWife]

I've debated about it ever since the first books came out. There have been such mixed reviews. Finally I decided I'd just have to give it a try for myself. I ordered A, B, C, and D. We just started Apples. We read 3 chapters before bed on Sunday and 3 chapters last night. So what do I think?? Well, it's still early....but my take on it is this: :001_huh: . It's ok. I don't think there's overly too much math in it. But, again...we are only 1/3 of the way through Apples. I definitely think they are too much money per book. At the rate we are reading we could finish a book in 1 week. What does my dd think? This: :w00t::thumbup::hurray::001_tt1::drool5::001_wub:. Seriously. She loves, loves, loves it! She can't wait to go to bed at night so we can read Fred. She thinks about it during the day. She literally BEGS me to read more than 3 chapters. She wants me to call her Kingie. She says the books are so interesting and she loves how there is math in the story. I haven't seen her this excited about something in a really long time. She thanks me all day and gives me hugs and kisses. She definitely wants me to get her all the books. I guess I'm not really sure why these books (or should I say book) are so exciting to her....but they sure are. It's been really great to see her so head over heels for these.....and I almost didn't give them a try. Just wanted to share in case anyone is on the fence about getting them. Of course...every kid is different.

Edited March 6, 2012 by ~AprilMay~

[Bula Mama]

Thanks for this! Am still on the fence a bit myself but I think my ds would love them, too!!! And since I've NEVER thought Math was fun maybe I should let him have the chance to think so. :001_smile:

[Halcyon]

We use them in conjunction with MM. He does 3 pages of MM and then reads a chapter of LOF. He really likes them, and I think they're a great supplement.

[2GAboys]

I do not know about the elementary series but I can tell you, from a mom who has taught math from day one to her 5th grader, that I do appreciate LOF fractions. I use ths as a supplement to RightStart G (weak on review). What I appreciate the most is not necessarily the teaching in each chapter (my son, of course loves), but the BRIDGES. These are a gold mine because the questions are a great assessment of his competency in all areas of elementary math. I have been able to find and correct weaknesses. Plus there is so much extra in these books, grammar lessons, cultural literacy, etc.

[Laughingmommy]

My daughter, 9, had been struggling with multiplication, just simple ones. So, I decided to get LOF, all of the elementary ones, and stop all other math programs for the time being. I know my daughter's really sensitive and needed gentle handling. So, we had fun reading about numbers in the first book. She told me all about the stories. And soon, she was reading the stories herself, 'cause I didn't have time to keep up. I noticed she started going through a book a day (she already knew the math). And then she started asking for my help. She was so teary-eyed, but she was only stuck on one problem here and there. The "Your Turn To Play"s are really short. And the explanations are really fun. So when my daughter got stuck, she wasn't faced with dozens of problems she was failing at. Just one problem. Well, it's only been a month of so since we got LOF Elementary, and a couple of days ago, she wrote a long division problem for herself to solve. I assisted, but she did it herself. And we've been doing "gifted" math stuff like Zarraco and math puzzles and "Math for the Gifted Child" (totally not like her!). It's like she sees herself differently now. I cringe at her not doing the math mechanics quickly (I'm not a narrating math kinda gal), but I gotta say, she thinks in math concepts. It's like LOF helped her integrate mathematical thinking into the very fabric of real life. So... yeah, I'm a fan. I love love love LOF. When you use it, you might have to bite your tongue and take a few extra deep breaths (it's just so different from what I think of as math), and you and your child might enjoy a fantastical ride at the end of which the world will dance in numbers.:001_smile:

Pei

[momtoamiracle]

hmmm, maybe I'll give them a try! thanks for your review!

[AnaShoo]

Now I'm more excited to get our books in the mail! I've been so on the fence about any math - but making it fun was a priority since math was nothing but drudgery for me when I was younger. I am thinking about doing some MEP alongside it, but will see how it goes first.

[JennHilger]

My girls are going through them for "fun" and love them so far! It's nice to have a break from worksheets! :001_smile:

[Tiberia]

Same thing happened with my dd8, 2nd grade. We were doing Saxon 3, and she was not enjoying it much. I got LoF Apples and she LOVES it. We're still doing Saxon, with LoF as a supplement, but dd now says she likes Saxon math too.

 

So, even though I'm not sure of the amount of math she's getting in Fred, it has completely changed her attitude about math. That is worth the money for me. I like Saxon and it has worked well for us, but I'm glad that Fred can transfer a love of math to the kiddo.

[LynnG in Arizona]

Thanks for the discussion!

 

So slight highjack . . . but when do you all recommend starting them (what grade?)?

 

And where is the best place to get the Life of Fred books?

[scrappyhappymama]

We love living math books, and that's the way we look at the LOF elementary books. We're halfway through Apples, just started a few weeks ago, and my boys beg to read more each time. It captivates their interest, from the nine year old down to the four year old.

[BatmansWife]

My daughter, 9, had been struggling with multiplication, just simple ones. So, I decided to get LOF, all of the elementary ones, and stop all other math programs for the time being. I know my daughter's really sensitive and needed gentle handling. So, we had fun reading about numbers in the first book. She told me all about the stories. And soon, she was reading the stories herself, 'cause I didn't have time to keep up. I noticed she started going through a book a day (she already knew the math). And then she started asking for my help. She was so teary-eyed, but she was only stuck on one problem here and there. The "Your Turn To Play"s are really short. And the explanations are really fun. So when my daughter got stuck, she wasn't faced with dozens of problems she was failing at. Just one problem. Well, it's only been a month of so since we got LOF Elementary, and a couple of days ago, she wrote a long division problem for herself to solve. I assisted, but she did it herself. And we've been doing "gifted" math stuff like Zarraco and math puzzles and "Math for the Gifted Child" (totally not like her!). It's like she sees herself differently now. I cringe at her not doing the math mechanics quickly (I'm not a narrating math kinda gal), but I gotta say, she thinks in math concepts. It's like LOF helped her integrate mathematical thinking into the very fabric of real life. So... yeah, I'm a fan. I love love love LOF. When you use it, you might have to bite your tongue and take a few extra deep breaths (it's just so different from what I think of as math), and you and your child might enjoy a fantastical ride at the end of which the world will dance in numbers.:001_smile:

Pei

 

I love this. :001_smile:

 

Thanks for the discussion!

 

So slight highjack . . . but when do you all recommend starting them (what grade?)?

 

And where is the best place to get the Life of Fred books?

 

I ordered mine from Rainbow Resource (I had a large order and got free shipping). But, you can order them from Z-Twist Books for free shipping and a guarantee. You could also check the for sale boards here. They were written for 1st through 4th and no matter what age you start with Apples. This might be helpful.

[2GAboys]

I love this. :001_smile:

 

 

 

They were written for 1st through 4th and no matter what age you start with Apples. This might be helpful.

 

Just to clarify-the elementary series just came out this year. The older grades were written first-LoF goes thru calculus.

[Elfknitter.#]

I too was a bit :001_huh: by the stories, but my monkeys love them. We've finished Apples where the focus continually returns to fact families/ number bonds of 7. So far in Butterflies it seems to review this and move to fact families/ number bonds for 9. I like all the outside little things things that he ties into the stories like days of the week or who Archimedes was. We'll keep going as long as it holds their interest. I'm just debating on keeping them for the littlest monkey who won't get to them for another 5-6 years or to sell them to fund purchasing E-H and then start all over again with used copies.

[BatmansWife]

I too was a bit :001_huh: by the stories, but my monkeys love them. We've finished Apples where the focus continually returns to fact families/ number bonds of 7. So far in Butterflies it seems to review this and move to fact families/ number bonds for 9. I like all the outside little things things that he ties into the stories like days of the week or who Archimedes was. We'll keep going as long as it holds their interest. I'm just debating on keeping them for the littlest monkey who won't get to them for another 5-6 years or to sell them to fund purchasing E-H and then start all over again with used copies.

 

I like all the extra interesting things added in too. My dd was so proud today when she reminded me, "Mom...remember what a 1 with 63 zeros after it is? A vegetillian". It's actually vigintillian. :001_smile:

[Mom-ninja.]

Well, now I have to get these. Stop enticing me to spend money!

[CaffeineDiary]

I can't speak to the more basic ones, but the Life of Fred calculus book was shockingly bad. Completely appalling.

[KAM]

Thanks for the review! I plan on getting the later ones for my rising 6th grader, but I've been on the fence too about getting the elementary ones for my 9 and 7 year olds. They sound fun.

[zoo_keeper]

Thanks for the discussion!

 

So slight highjack . . . but when do you all recommend starting them (what grade?)?

 

And where is the best place to get the Life of Fred books?

 

We buy ours at ztwistbooks, $16/each, free shipping. We started "Apples" when DD1 was 6 and DD2 was 4. Just ordered "Goldfish" tonight!

[Laughingmommy]

I can't speak to the more basic ones, but the Life of Fred calculus book was shockingly bad. Completely appalling.

 

Peter, is it the lack of a more substantive practical application (i.e. problems), insufficient topic coverage, or lack of depth in topics covered? Have you looked at the Art of Problem Solving? Do those books look comprehensive and interesting to you?

 

Pei

[miracleone]

Can you kindly tell me which books to buy for a fourth grader ?

Thank you.

[BatmansWife]

I can't speak to the more basic ones, but the Life of Fred calculus book was shockingly bad. Completely appalling.

 

Oh, that's too bad. I'd also be interested in knowing more about why you feel it was so bad. Do you think it had too many nonsense stories and not enough calculus??

 

We buy ours at ztwistbooks, $16/each, free shipping. We started "Apples" when DD1 was 6 and DD2 was 4. Just ordered "Goldfish" tonight!

 

Maybe somebody else will know. Here...they say everyone starts at Apples.

[CaffeineDiary]

Oh, that's too bad. I'd also be interested in knowing more about why you feel it was so bad. Do you think it had too many nonsense stories and not enough calculus??

 

There were a few problems. First, the density of the stories crowded out the descriptions of the subject. Second, what descriptions there were simply weren't that good. Third, the exercises (such as they were) were terrible. Fourth, the materials were light overall, in the sense that the entire book was, if I recall correctly, around 120 pages, which is barely large enough to give a high level overview of the topic, in my opinion.

 

But, there sure were lots of cute stories!

[zoo_keeper]

Peter, if your main complaints were that the story overshadowed the content and that the content included less-than-stellar explanations and insufficient exercises, then I think your use of the terms "shockingly bad" and "completely appalling" are a bit extremist. I'm sure we all have purchased materials (I know I have!) that we think were overpriced and lacking in depth, but I can't imagine applying those adjectives to even my worst curriculum mistakes. Your dire warnings made me think that Fred had engaged in inappropriate behavior or that the math was incorrect! I'm relieved to understand that this is not the case :)

[NittanyJen]

I have calc on order. My husband teaches all levels of math from calc through grad school at a university as a full professor of applied math, and I am waiting to see what he thinks. He loves the Trig book.

[CaffeineDiary]

I think it's appalling in the sense that if a student used LoF as their only preparation for the AP Calculus exam (which was the reason I was looking at them - someone had asked on this forum) they would come away from using them with the completely mistaken impression that they understood calculus.

 

That, to me, is a shockingly bad outcome. There is no shame in a book that doesn't address a topic in depth. The LoF calc book (at least) gives the impression that it is addressing the subject in depth while not actually doing so. So a student using it is going to end up thinking that they know more than they do. There is shame in a book that causes that to happen.

 

I have a related issue which is that the overuse of analogy in the LoF books becomes less and less useful as you get to higher math - at a certain point, the use of analogy is going to actively retard a student's understanding of the math. But since this is the k-8 forum, that can wait for another thread in a different forum.

Edited March 7, 2012 by peterb

[Excelsior! Academy]

I can't speak to the more basic ones, but the Life of Fred calculus book was shockingly bad. Completely appalling.

 

Really? The College Board lists it on it's website as a book to prep for the CLEP test. http://media.collegeboard.com/digitalServices/pdf/clep/calculus_fact_sheet.pdf

http://clep.collegeboard.org/exam/calculus/resources

[joyfulhomeschooler]

Do you have to start with the first book? Or could you start with fractions?

[Butter]

Older kids can definitely start with Fractions. Apples, Butterflies, etc. are for 1st-4th graders for basic math.

 

I think I'm going to get Apples for my 5 year old. My daughter used Fractions and it was just so fun. It's not really her style, though so we didn't continue. My 5 year old just gets math and loves it. We use Calvert and he's in 2nd grade math. I read the first chapter of Apples sample to him and he was laughing and just loved it. So I think I'm going to get the book for him just for fun.

[WhatLight]

Thanks for your review. I had been thinking about ordering the first book just to try it out after a friend of mine raved about it last week at the park. Last night I finally bit the bullet and ordered Apples. Hoping my daughter likes Fred just as much as your yours. :001_smile:

[Guest adjunctmom]

My son (6) has struggled with math because of the writing involved. He doesn't have the fine motor control for sustained writing yet, and that's fine, but has made math immensely frustrating. We tried several math programs before finding Life of Fred. We have A-D with E on the way. He adores Fred. Asks for more Fred and is finally, happily getting math.

 

The best part, my daughter (3), listens to the stories, too, and is picking up some of the math, and often answers the Your Turn To Play questions before her brother does (particularly the math facts questions).

 

I asked Dr. Schmidt about how one was to implement this and whether one was supposed to move on when finished with Jelly Beans. He said no. He said the idea is to read these books one a month for ten months, take a break, and then start over again with Apples. For a first grader, you could expect to do four cycles before the child has fully memorized all of the math facts that they learn in these books.

 

I actually joined WTM forums just to respond to this post. We love the books that much.

[SorrelZG]

My son (6) has struggled with math because of the writing involved. He doesn't have the fine motor control for sustained writing yet, and that's fine, but has made math immensely frustrating. We tried several math programs before finding Life of Fred. We have A-D with E on the way. He adores Fred. Asks for more Fred and is finally, happily getting math.

 

The best part, my daughter (3), listens to the stories, too, and is picking up some of the math, and often answers the Your Turn To Play questions before her brother does (particularly the math facts questions).

 

I asked Dr. Schmidt about how one was to implement this and whether one was supposed to move on when finished with Jelly Beans. He said no. He said the idea is to read these books one a month for ten months, take a break, and then start over again with Apples. For a first grader, you could expect to do four cycles before the child has fully memorized all of the math facts that they learn in these books.

 

I actually joined WTM forums just to respond to this post. We love the books that much.

 

Thank-you for doing so. I appreciate reading this and I had no idea he intended for them to be used that way. My own child is naturally strong in "getting" math but the curriculum we'd tried had him believing he hated it (I was starting to hate it too .. it was the kind of nightmarish experience that has a mother despairing the thought of getting up in the morning let alone facing 12 more years of homeschooling the child) but that has completely changed since we started LOF (combined with living/informal math) so I felt an appreciative joy when I read about your son. :001_smile:

[WhatLight]

I asked Dr. Schmidt about how one was to implement this and whether one was supposed to move on when finished with Jelly Beans. He said no. He said the idea is to read these books one a month for ten months, take a break, and then start over again with Apples. For a first grader, you could expect to do four cycles before the child has fully memorized all of the math facts that they learn in these books.

 

I actually joined WTM forums just to respond to this post. We love the books that much.

 

Thank you so much for posting that! I had no idea the books were intended to be used in that way. Good information to have. :001_smile:

[BatmansWife]

Thank you so much for posting that! I had no idea the books were intended to be used in that way. Good information to have. :001_smile:

 

:iagree:. I wonder why he doesn't say this on his website?? Hmmm....interesting info. Thanks adjunctmom...hope you stick around. :001_smile:

[petepie2]

:iagree:. I wonder why he doesn't say this on his website?? Hmmm....interesting info. Thanks adjunctmom...hope you stick around. :001_smile:

 

On the individual webpages of the elementary books, he mentions that each book should take one month to complete, but I haven't seen the "big picture" summarized anywhere.

[Butter]

I asked Dr. Schmidt about how one was to implement this and whether one was supposed to move on when finished with Jelly Beans. He said no. He said the idea is to read these books one a month for ten months, take a break, and then start over again with Apples. For a first grader, you could expect to do four cycles before the child has fully memorized all of the math facts that they learn in these books.

 

That's very interesting and not what he has on the FAQ on his website. Here's what the FAQ says: http://www.stanleyschmidt.com/FredGauss/21%20Questions/2010%20Elem%20Series.html - "It will take about 12-18 months to do the Elementary Series." (more at the link) I wonder if the difference would be if a child in 1st grade started with Apples vs. a child in 4th grade starting with Apples.

[mandymom]

if you are unsure about LoF, check your public library. Ours carries most of the LoF books. Of course, I own several of the books already (elementary-Algebra), but it helps for me when I haven't gotten my shipment of the new books yet and my ds wants to go ahead and start the next one :):001_smile:

[Guest Joe'sWife]

[quote I asked Dr. Schmidt about how one was to implement this and whether one was supposed to move on when finished with Jelly Beans. He said no. He said the idea is to read these books one a month for ten months, take a break, and then start over again with Apples. For a first grader, you could expect to do four cycles before the child has fully memorized all of the math facts that they learn in these books.

 

I actually joined WTM forums just to respond to this post. We love the books that much.

 

This is so good to know...THANKS!:001_smile:

[jenangelcat]

I wasn't entirely impressed with the first 4 but my daughter loves them so I bought the rest of the elementary series. The amount of math in them increases substantially after dogs.

[mjpeter]

We just purchased the first few books after my older sons had great success with the intermediate ones. (We supplemented Saxon with Fred) My youngest runs to the mailbox everyday to check for them, lol. I just told him about them and he's so excited. We'll be supplementing Horizon's 3 with Fred.

[boscopup]

I finally picked up Apples for DS2. He loves it! I do like how not only is there math in it, but there are random other facts for him to learn also. Yes, the math part is easy in this book, but I kind of expect it to be.

 

DS1 uses Fractions and will need Decimals soon, so I'll go ahead and order Butterflies along with that.

 

The books ARE kind of pricey, but at the same time, they're nicely bound hardback books. I got Apples used, and it looks brand new.

 

Oh, and DS1 enjoyed reading through Apples himself, though he's well beyond 3+4=7. :lol:

[Guest MsFrizz]

This has been a great thread to read. Question, I have a 4th grade math dd, do I need to start with Apples for her? We are using MUS, but as one person said, it can be dry:glare:. I was thinking I might start with Farming. Thoughts anyone?:confused: Thanks!

[ChristusG]

As someone else has asked....do we really begin with Apples? DD8 is using Abeka math and she's already been doing simple fractions, long division, and is beginning equations. I'm just afraid that Apples would be way below her level if it talks about adding, subtracting, etc. Although, I guess I could get Apples for my 5 year old.

[BatmansWife]

I wasn't entirely impressed with the first 4 but my daughter loves them so I bought the rest of the elementary series. The amount of math in them increases substantially after dogs.

 

This is good to know. We only have A - D and that's about where I was going to stop. Now I don't know. Maaaaaayyybe we'll go beyond Dogs next year (I'm broke now).

[besroma]

At the rate we are reading we could finish a book in 1 week. What does my dd think? This: :w00t::thumbup::hurray::001_tt1::drool5::001_wub:. Seriously. She loves, loves, loves it! She can't wait to go to bed at night so we can read Fred. She thinks about it during the day. She literally BEGS me to read more than 3 chapters. She wants me to call her Kingie. She says the books are so interesting and she loves how there is math in the story. I haven't seen her this excited about something in a really long time. She thanks me all day and gives me hugs and kisses. She definitely wants me to get her all the books.

 

My kids are the same!

[angelmama1209]

As someone else has asked....do we really begin with Apples? DD8 is using Abeka math and she's already been doing simple fractions, long division, and is beginning equations. I'm just afraid that Apples would be way below her level if it talks about adding, subtracting, etc. Although, I guess I could get Apples for my 5 year old.

 

I believe from reading several threads on this that it is recommended to start with Apples no matter the level to get the story from the beginning. Apparently each book builds on the one before. So even if she knows the math, she can whiz through them and get the story as well as review. :)

[angelmama1209]

if you are unsure about LoF, check your public library. Ours carries most of the LoF books. Of course, I own several of the books already (elementary-Algebra), but it helps for me when I haven't gotten my shipment of the new books yet and my ds wants to go ahead and start the next one :):001_smile:

 

LUCKY! Just checked my library system- nada. :glare:

[thebacabunch]

Just wanted to add my 2 cents. I always read my kids books before they do. I have been giggling my way through apples. My second grader is going to love it. I just finished decimals and percents. At first I was just reading through it. By the time I was 2/3rds of the way through it I was scrounging around for paper and pencil to try the problems myself. When I got to the last test which covers the whole book I aced the problems that I had actually practiced. The others I sort of forgot. I did very well in math when I was a student and I still learned and, ehem, re-learned so much. I use singapore math as well, so I can't say that I ONLY use life of Fred books, but I would not say that LOF is fluff. I can't believe how many math concepts I could do before, because I did pages and pages of it in traditional math classes, but didn't understand. I can clearly remember several "a-ha" moments while reading LoF.