What do you want in a Science Curriculum?

[Happy Scientist]

And I love your science picture of the day, even though I haven't been able to answer the ones I've looked at. Is there a recommended way to find the answers myself, besides just google? (Since I'm already good at using Google.)

 

Different people use it different ways. It is great practice for researching on the internet, but others resist that urge and try to reason out the answers. There are also quite a few folks that just enjoy reading the answers and thinking about things they never thought about before. It started as a fun lark, a way to use a few of my photos, and has turned into an exciting challenge for me to keep coming up with new photos and questions.

[Happy Scientist]

Thank you for being patient. I had a marvelous time with the science teachers, and managed to squeeze in some birding and nature photography too. I'll scan back through your responses, and try to answer them all. If I miss something that you asked, don't hesitate to ask again.

 

I had a chance to get my hands on the 3rd, 4th, and 5th grade science textbooks from National Geographic, and so far, I am VERY impressed. This is the first school textbook I have seen that recognizes that there are quite a few rocks that do not contain any minerals! That is one of my "test questions" for evaluating science books, and I was very pleased to see correct information in a public school textbook.

[quark]

Does that sound useful as a first step? Is BFSU a good starting spine? If so, I will buy a copy and get to work. It would be wonderful to have you critique it as it is built, to help me spot anything that could be improved.

 

Again, thank you for your kind help with this.

 

Dr K, we had a bit of a difficult journey homeschooling science in the beginning because no curriculum has ever fit the bill for my son, ever. Someone pointed us to your website 3 years ago and we've been fans ever since. Thanks to you, our own brand of cobbled-together science, and lots of reading, my son achieved exceptional results in an above-grade level test and is now ready and eager to begin high school science.

 

We don't use BFSU anymore but I think your idea is super and will be so helpful to the multitude of homeschoolers who really need a quality curriculum that is not dumbed-down.

 

Thank you so much for doing this. We plan to keep subscribing to your site because my son adores your experiment ideas and perhaps more so, your bloopers. :)

 

ETA:

4. Make all the above multi-level. EX: Photosynthesis: Level A (primary), Level B (middle) , Level C (high)

I love this idea from Heather in PNW!

Edited January 12, 2012 by quark

[jhockley]

I would love to see something that had a good spine, with a list of optional suggested reading, links to videos, something hands on with a scientific process layout to it AND an option to buy a kit that included materials for all the experiments/projects. As people have mentioned doing the trivium levels would be great.

 

Currently we are using Elemental Science. I don't like having to hunt down a ton of supplemental books every week, the hands on projects are very weak (we're doing Biology) and it seems at the end of the week dd and I both have trouble even remembering the 3 animals we studied. Obviously not a lot of retention. If I had to re-do it I'd choose only 1/3 of the animals and study deeper.

 

I was looking at Intelligo unit studies for next year and not having a book in hand is one of my biggest concerns. If you did something based on National Geographic you'd have me hooked right there!

[tammyw]

BFSU scares me. We've used RSO (Real Science Odyssey) for Chemistry and it's been pretty successful.

 

I'm not a science-y person, but I'd love to see something easy to implement. For each topic, a list of several resources that can be easily implemented - books, dvds, topics for discussion, experiments.

[Tigger]

I just bought the Kindle version of BFSU, vol 2. I have only skimmed a few chapters, but while it has tons of marvelous information, but it is very different from what I expected.

 

He seems to demand a lot more work from you as the teacher than I was expecting, especially if you don't have a strong science background. On one hand, that seems like a great education for you, because explaining science to children is like explaining it to your grandmother. You REALLY have to UNDERSTAND it. On the other hand, where do you find the time? I was expecting content directed towards the student, not towards making you enough of an expert in each area of science to let you present the material effectively to your dc.

 

Both my DH and I are very science-grounded and one of my biggest complaints about existing material for the grammar stage is that it lacks meatiness, especially for kids who know the basics already - yet the material for older students is too much reading and writing for a kid who is 7, yet their understanding of the material isn't a problem.

 

For example, RS4K pre-level 1 is supposed to be for early grammar, but to me, it totally lacks depth, so we moved right to level 1 - yet it too wasn't enough, so I had to heavily supplement last year, we breezed through all the books (bio, chem and physics) and this year I started using BFSU as the base outline, but don't really like the book itself - it has some good material in it, but I bring together the materials myself, create worksheets as needed, decide the experiments, field trips, and video supplements. What I think would be great is a repository of materials to consider for each area within each discipline. As it is right now, since DS loves science and has no issues with retaining the material, I spend an inordinate amount of time preparing and gathering information and materials, then we're using resources from so many different levels to keep him challenged, that I've had to go looking for, modify to his reading-writing capabilities, and preview in advance. I'd love to be able to go online, click through to a section, look at the options out there and pick those that match our needs quickly!

 

The other surprise was his expectations for equipment, and again I may have been underestimating the homeschool community. Do most of you really have microscopes, triple beam balances, and other lab gear readily available?

 

We're outliers - DH has a lab within his practice, so we have access to that and the equipment if we want to do something really neat - basics at home, two microscopes, assorted magnifying glasses, a full slide making station, good assortment of chemistry equipment, a life size skeleton, tons of life-size models (human and animal), etc. I don't think it should be considered normal to expect most homeschoolers to have this type of equipment in-home, at least not in the grammar stage.

[Happy Scientist]

OK, I got a mixed response to BFSU. What spine are most of you using right now? The best way for me to do this right is to start with a spine that you are currently using, and with a unit that you will be starting in the next few weeks. That way, I can hit that unit first, and get pretty much immediate feedback on what I am doing right, and what needs a different approach.

 

So to boil it down, what spine and which topic will you be using during February?

[Aurelia]

OK, I got a mixed response to BFSU. What spine are most of you using right now? The best way for me to do this right is to start with a spine that you are currently using, and with a unit that you will be starting in the next few weeks. That way, I can hit that unit first, and get pretty much immediate feedback on what I am doing right, and what needs a different approach.

 

So to boil it down, what spine and which topic will you be using during February?

 

 

I haven't been able to find a spine I really like (including BFSU, it was too much work for the amount of time I have), so to answer your second question, we will be using Intellego 3rd-5th grade astronomy in February.

[Halcyon]

I just bought the Kindle version of BFSU, vol 2. I have only skimmed a few chapters, but while it has tons of marvelous information, but it is very different from what I expected.

 

He seems to demand a lot more work from you as the teacher than I was expecting, especially if you don't have a strong science background. On one hand, that seems like a great education for you, because explaining science to children is like explaining it to your grandmother. You REALLY have to UNDERSTAND it. On the other hand, where do you find the time? I was expecting content directed towards the student, not towards making you enough of an expert in each area of science to let you present the material effectively to your dc.

 

The other surprise was his expectations for equipment, and again I may have been underestimating the homeschool community. Do most of you really have microscopes, triple beam balances, and other lab gear readily available?

 

On the up side, I don't think it will be difficult to integrate my materials with BFSU. I have already seen quite a few places where videos or activities would fit nicely.

 

I am heading out to present a teacher training workshop in Titusville, FL, but will be back tomorrow. I'll try to check in later, but hotel internet can be tricky, so don't think that I have abandoned you. Thanks again for all the help.

 

We're using BFSU Vol 2 and we really like it here. BFSU Vol 1 didn't work as well for us, perhaps because some of the concepts were already understood by my child?

 

I do think it is geared towards the adult, as the teacher. Nebel expects the teacher to guide the student, explain concepts to the student, adn then expects the student to keep a science journal in which to put notes, drawings, observations etc.

 

Anything BFSU Vol 2 requires, in terms of equipment, we have or plan to acquire soon. I think Science is one of those subjects that just costs a lot, plain and simple, to be done right.

 

Regarding finding the time: you'll find many parents on these boards who spend their evenings and weekends self-educating so as to better teach their children. I usually read BFSU over the weekend, and then find websites or books that will complement the upcoming lesson. I have yet to find a mid to upper level elementary science program that allows the parent to be hands-off, yet still teaches the child a lot.

[Halcyon]

OK, I got a mixed response to BFSU. What spine are most of you using right now? The best way for me to do this right is to start with a spine that you are currently using, and with a unit that you will be starting in the next few weeks. That way, I can hit that unit first, and get pretty much immediate feedback on what I am doing right, and what needs a different approach.

 

So to boil it down, what spine and which topic will you be using during February?

 

You'll find a range of answers here. BFSU is very popular, and I think it's the spine that can most benefit from some added clarification and supplements. However, I think you're going to get many answers and the best idea I can give you is to find a spine that resonates with YOU, as a scientist, and to which you think you can add the most, and begin.

 

As to which topic students are studying in February...good luck finding a consensus on that one ;)

[FairProspects]

So to boil it down, what spine and which topic will you be using during February?

 

Well, I can't find a spine with good science, which can be implemented by a non-scientist, and that is sufficiently engaging for elementary age, so we will be studying "Energy, Part 1" on the Supercharged Science website, using the videos themselves as our spine and filling in the gaps with Let's-Read-And-Find-Out books (for lack of anything better).

 

Maybe you could write a spine at some point? :D

[Scrub Jay]

However, I think you're going to get many answers and the best idea I can give you is to find a spine that resonates with YOU, as a scientist, and to which you think you can add the most, and begin.

 

:iagree:

[dragons in the flower bed]

What I MOST want from a science program is for it to be open and go. I don't want to print things out! I don't want to collect supplies, but if I have to, I want to have a list and I want nothing biodegradable on it so I can do all the shopping at once in the beginning of the year. I will not even consider buying a science program that does not provide a kit for the supplies. Needing to collect doodads is what makes science not happen. I think Home Science Tools might work with you to provide a kit.

 

I would like it if I could have all my children on the same topic despite their grade level differences. (Broad spectrum sounds great.)

 

I'd also prefer a program that goes in depth on one area rather than something that flits about from topic to topic.

 

Right now I'm using MAKE magazine's electronics book and kit. I find myself moving more towards products that are made for the non-homeschooling market because 1) they really contain everything you need, 2) they are higher level and specific, aiming to give expertise in an area, not an overview, 3) they are never creationist in any small way. I like "MAKE: Electronics" for all those reasons. I also like that it's only one book (only one website sounds great, although I'd use lists of books on different levels for supplementary reading). I like that there's a whole community of people using this resource and an ethic of "making", DIY, behind it.

[dragons in the flower bed]

OK, I got a mixed response to BFSU. What spine are most of you using right now?

 

 

I strongly dislike BFSU. We use The Usborne Internet-Linked Science Encyclopedia and/or The Kingfisher Science Encyclopedia.

[lewelma]

Happy Scientist,

 

Have you looked at MSNucleus? It is a inquiry-based curriculum developed for California using an NSF grant, and is available free on line. The main problem with it is that the supplies must be bought piecemeal, and there is often overlap in the kits. I used it for a year, and my children really liked it, but in the end I gave up because the supplies were such an annoyance. I agree with the previous poster, kits are key.

 

http://msnucleus.org/curriculum/curriculum.html

 

Ruth in NZ

[tammyw]

What I MOST want from a science program is for it to be open and go. I don't want to print things out! I don't want to collect supplies, but if I have to, I want to have a list and I want nothing biodegradable on it so I can do all the shopping at once in the beginning of the year. I will not even consider buying a science program that does not provide a kit for the supplies. Needing to collect doodads is what makes science not happen. I think Home Science Tools might work with you to provide a kit.

 

I would like it if I could have all my children on the same topic despite their grade level differences. (Broad spectrum sounds great.)

 

I'd also prefer a program that goes in depth on one area rather than something that flits about from topic to topic.

 

Right now I'm using MAKE magazine's electronics book and kit. I find myself moving more towards products that are made for the non-homeschooling market because 1) they really contain everything you need, 2) they are higher level and specific, aiming to give expertise in an area, not an overview, 3) they are never creationist in any small way. I like "MAKE: Electronics" for all those reasons. I also like that it's only one book (only one website sounds great, although I'd use lists of books on different levels for supplementary reading). I like that there's a whole community of people using this resource and an ethic of "making", DIY, behind it.

 

You sound like me. I was curious about Make: Electronics, so I found this on amazon which is cheaper compared to their site - http://www.amazon.com/Make-Electronics-Discovery-Charles-Platt/dp/0596153740/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1326397966&sr=8-1

 

What age range would you say it is good for? Are there kits you bought to do this? Would love more information!

[Ellesmere]

 

I will just add my totally eager enthusiasm to the idea of keying to BFSU, though! That would earn my lifelong devotion!!!! :D

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

Watching with great interest, Happy Scientist. We are just starting out with homeschool and are eager to see where this goes! The only other thing I can say is that I also would want something secular.

[woolybear]

I never thought I'd say this, but tests would be a welcome addition here. My son recently said he wants tests in all subjects and I am trying to comply.

[delaney]

I think Tara has some nice ideas. Some of my thoughts (other than what I already posted on another thread) secular is definitely important. I am not a BFSU fan. Why? Hmmm...thinking this over, because perhaps BFSU combined with what your are doing might be something I would like. I found BFSU to be dry. Yes, I could pull in living books, dvds etc, but that's more work than I had time for when I tried to use it. I also found the layout of their program a little confusing. If I'm going to use a program, then I want it to be more linear. Have you looked into Tapestry of Grace as a model? I still like the idea of the buffet, multilevel, strong teacher's notes, all blended with core readings, experiments and video suggestions.

OMG!!! A Tapestry type model for science!!!! love that idea. ALso, as far as losing people because you address evolution and such is silly. I don't buy young earth but I sure as heck want my kids to know that theory because they need to see all viewpoints. No sense hiding your head under a rock! It would be the same as learning about Judaism and Islam. You can't discuss or defend your stance if you don't know both sides.

[delaney]

OK, I got a mixed response to BFSU. What spine are most of you using right now? The best way for me to do this right is to start with a spine that you are currently using, and with a unit that you will be starting in the next few weeks. That way, I can hit that unit first, and get pretty much immediate feedback on what I am doing right, and what needs a different approach.

 

So to boil it down, what spine and which topic will you be using during February?

Anything but BFSU for me. I had it and hated it. My kids like the look of RS4K and Apologia(although we don't use a religious bent). Apologia is thorough and my older DD is comfy with texts since she was in public for 5 years. My younger is more interested in living books. That is why I would love a TOG style science.

[Tigger]

OK, I got a mixed response to BFSU. What spine are most of you using right now? The best way for me to do this right is to start with a spine that you are currently using, and with a unit that you will be starting in the next few weeks. That way, I can hit that unit first, and get pretty much immediate feedback on what I am doing right, and what needs a different approach.

 

So to boil it down, what spine and which topic will you be using during February?

 

Starting in February we're taking a stab at Singapore MPH for the rest of the year....next year I'm looking at the Science Explorer's series since CPO Science is still a bit too advanced to be useful.

 

That said, I do use the Usborne Encyclopedia of Science and have (use less often) the Kingfisher Science Encyclopedia. I think either of those are good starting points and would have a broader base of folks able to have them already and use them if they're well laid out with materials to integrate into the content.

[Amy Jo]

For February we are planning:

 

Just my 7 and 9yos: BFSU vol 1, strand D (lessons 5,6,7): land forms, biomes, the earth's turning, and seasons. I'm hoping to squeeze in the lesson on magnets (A-5A).

 

With my 5yo: BFSU vol 1, strand D (lessons 2, 3 and 3a): day night, earth's rotation, maps, compass directions.

 

I have a Child's Guide to the Night Sky, and a cool compass book (I think the title is Green Beret Compass Course - I don't have it in hand) so far. We might make a moon diary. And I'll be praying for clear skies in February in Montana.

 

And I have a subscription to your site on my to-buy list. The boys were working on the 'cups' experiment from the free video section. Thank you for such a fine resource, it's so nice to find a gem on the internet.

Edited January 12, 2012 by mtcougar832
Wrong quote? I thought I quoted HappyScientist? Oops.

[kiana]

I really like the idea of Apologia's younger programs, but ... I can't handle the amount of religion in there. Something similar to that -- botany, bugs, astronomy, etc. would be really neat.

[NittanyJen]

You have had lots of great ideas here (and they inspired me to get the $9 download of BFSU from Amazon as a supplement to our NOEO/Science Wiz/Happy Scientist/Thames and Kosmos/RS4K/etc that we are doing for chemistry already this year).

 

I would love to see math activities included in any experiments-- things for the kids to measure and calculate, so that the experiments can be more than just demonstrations, and to give them an applied use of their up and coming math skills.

 

So many parents in this forum state that their 8, 9, and 10 year olds are doing pre-algebra, have mastered fractions and decimals, have started algebra, etc, that basic calculations in chemistry, physics, and biology for this age group should be a snap; perhaps the math activities could be made "optional" somehow as an additional observation to make (such as we did with weighing/measuring our product when we made your butter, then figuring out whether we came out ahead or behind compared to buying butter directly at the store).

 

One of the biggest weaknesses I have found in most "labs" for the K-8 age group is the lack of quantitative measure, or discussion of precision and accuracy, or application of calculation. I have been able to tweak many labs to make them quantitative, but many parents don't know how to do that, and I think a lot of kids would really benefit from using their math "outside of math class."

 

It would probably have to be done as an optional part, as kids are really all over the map in terms of math skills, and parents have different availability of measuring equipment, but it could be a very welcome addition to some.

[NittanyJen]

OK, I got a mixed response to BFSU. What spine are most of you using right now? The best way for me to do this right is to start with a spine that you are currently using, and with a unit that you will be starting in the next few weeks. That way, I can hit that unit first, and get pretty much immediate feedback on what I am doing right, and what needs a different approach.

 

So to boil it down, what spine and which topic will you be using during February?

 

 

I was a bench scientist before coming home to school my kids, so I tweak everything heavily.

 

Our spine is NOEO chemistry-- level 1 for my 8YO, level 2 for my 10YO. My 8YO struggles to write very much in quantity per day as he has dysgraphia and it takes enormous effort, though he can draw, so we use a combination of his writing, drawing, and dictating to me.

 

We also work in appropriate chapters of Real Science for Kids, Ellen McHenry's chem program, the Science Wiz lab kits, Happy Scientist, experiments and material I come up with on my own, and library books as they fit into the NOEO program or we have extra time. But our main "spine" is NOEO for organization, to make the logic of it all hang together.

 

DS10 and DS8 will be on polymers in February (including DNA), and Geology in March.

 

FYI, we do NOT hook into a 36 week school year; as homeschoolers we do not attempt to imitate the public school system, but many here seem to do so. We just keep on trucking until we decide we have done what we need to do :). For example, after we finish NOEO, there are a few more topics and plenty more experiments I want us to do, so we'll spend another maybe 4--6 weeks goofing around with chemistry and balancing equations and things and having fun before we close it out and move into biology.

[WishboneDawn]

I strongly dislike BFSU. We use The Usborne Internet-Linked Science Encyclopedia and/or The Kingfisher Science Encyclopedia.

 

Add in Joy Hakim's books and this post now contains pretty much the most popular spines in secular homeschooling. I've got the BFSU books and the first Joy Hakim book myself so using either as a spine would make me happy.

 

I suppose part of the question is, which one of those spines fits the Happy Scientist style the best?

[brehon]

As a PP mentioned something keyed to an upper grammar/middle school level would be wonderful. My eldest is fast approaching this level (he's already 4th/5th grade) and finding a good upper level secular science program is frustrating me. I would love to have some materials on evolution, too.

 

I have a fairly strong science background (although I've never worked as a scientist) and would find it easier to step a program down to the lower grammar years than to enhance one for middle school.

 

We're currently using 3 Singapore science programs and that's a lot.

[pgr]

I will just add my totally eager enthusiasm to the idea of keying to BFSU, though! That would earn my lifelong devotion!!!! :D

 

I will also add my enthusiastic vote for BFSU. Yes, it is a LOT of work. No, it does not flow smoothly - especially vol 1, it seems.

 

I've been using it as a spine because I love that it's not dumbed down, and that it integrates the different sciences. I've also tried to incorporate other, friendlier, materials (such as Real Science Oddysey) when they tie in with the topic.

 

Unfortunately, science is currently dreaded in our home... :(

 

I applaude and appreciate your enthusiasm - this thread gives me hope!

We've subscribed to your site - thank you as well for all the work put into it.

[mystika1]

I think that I will start a new thread that may help by asking everyone what their current favorite science spine is. This may guide you a bit better as to what is most popular.

 

I am thinking of using BFSU with my girls but I am a bit intimidated by the statements indicating how difficult it is to put it all together. I used Konos so I do know how to plan but I am no scientist and I don't have five hours a week for planning science. I do like to at least have a basic understanding of what I am teaching. I am not a fan of scripted programs because they require no knowledge of the material on the teachers part. I know that my kids will end up asking me a question that is not planned in the script and I would stand there pretty much clueless. In that case... the internet is my friend, but it is just easier if I know what I am doing. :D

 

Penny

[mytwomonkeys]

honestly, what trumps anything else is a curriculum that i can easily "open & go". if it requires a ton of prep from me it just won't end up being a good fit for us.

[dragons in the flower bed]

What age range would you say it is good for? Are there kits you bought to do this? Would love more information!

 

I'd say eleven and up, ten or nine with the ability to focus, a high interest level, and good reading and fine motor skills.

 

There are three kits: the toolkit, the supplies for the first half of the experiments, and the supplies for the second half of the book.

 

MAKE magazine and their webstore have been great resources for us.

[mystika1]

If BFSU would be more open and go..I would not even hesitate to use it.

 

I see so many home schoolers here that have science degrees state that they refuse to use home school science programs because they are not "real" science. I don't have money to burn and would rather get this right the first time. I am at a standstill trying to figure out what to use that is "real." BFSU seems to be highly recommended so I have been leaning towards this.

 

Penny

[Happy Scientist]

I think that I will start a new thread that may help by asking everyone what their current favorite science spine is. This may guide you a bit better as to what is most popular.

 

I am thinking of using BFSU with my girls but I am a bit intimidated by the statements indicating how difficult it is to put it all together. I used Konos so I do know how to plan but I am no scientist and I don't have five hours a week for planning science. I do like to at least have a basic understanding of what I am teaching. I am not a fan of scripted programs because they require no knowledge of the material on the teachers part. I know that my kids will end up asking me a question that is not planned in the script and I would stand there pretty much clueless. In that case... the internet is my friend, but it is just easier if I know what I am doing. :D

 

Penny

 

A thread on favorite science spines would be wonderful! I am trying to carefully walk the tightrope of finding out as much as I can about what this curriculum needs, without crossing the line into advertising or promoting my site.

 

As for having your kids ask a question that is not in the planned script, that is actually a wonderful thing. It shows that you are doing a good job of stimulating scientific thought. I would be much more worried if they were not asking creative, unexpected questions. If you run into questions that don't pop up on a Google search, you are always welcome to email them to me. Between my site, the videos I post on YouTube, my free newsletter, and the Science Photo of the Day on Facebook, I usually get 50 - 250 science questions a day. Most of them are questions I have answered before, so it is simply a matter of cut and paste. The true gems are the ones that I have not had before, because they are often a source for new videos, investigations, etc.

[Pen]

I think it would depend a lot on the child and the child's age and stage and proclivities and interests. Our "curriculum" officially is RS4K. But I think he is learning more from Nat. Geog., BBC, and Nova DVDs, and also from science "toys" like Snap Circuits, a book/game called something like "Simple Machines" which had text plus parts that came out to build a (fairly flat) model of wedge/inclined plane, pulleys, rack and pinion, etc. I'm not at home, so I don't have the exact title available right now, but after building a rack and pinion, it is really understood better than if he just heard, read, or saw pictures about something.

 

I wish there were something like "Things of Science" kits available still. I think my particular child might get a lot out of something like that. I also wish there were a good science museum locally. We saw a model Archimedes screw in one once. It helped to cement a lot of ideas that came later. Oh, yeah, Archimedes, he said when that came up in Life of Fred Apples: he invented the screw that can lift water, yeah, I used that. I know about it.

[mystika1]

I posted the thread this morning

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=338663

that seems to be getting buried...

 

and someone else posted a poll to select a few choices choices here

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=338717

 

So between the two threads you should have a basic idea. Hope it helped. I think that I will go ahead and try BFSU as it seems to be more meaty and I can tweak it the best.

 

Penny

Edited January 13, 2012 by mystika1

[mystika1]

I noticed that the ebook version of BFSU can't be printed. Can the Kindle version be printed? I have an ereader but I like to print some things out also.

 

Thanks,

Penny

[WishboneDawn]

I think that I will start a new thread that may help by asking everyone what their current favorite science spine is. This may guide you a bit better as to what is most popular.

 

I am thinking of using BFSU with my girls but I am a bit intimidated by the statements indicating how difficult it is to put it all together. I used Konos so I do know how to plan but I am no scientist and I don't have five hours a week for planning science. I do like to at least have a basic understanding of what I am teaching. I am not a fan of scripted programs because they require no knowledge of the material on the teachers part. I know that my kids will end up asking me a question that is not planned in the script and I would stand there pretty much clueless. In that case... the internet is my friend, but it is just easier if I know what I am doing. :D

 

Penny

 

I've never seen that as a limitation in scripted programs. If the question isn't covered, as the Happy Scientist said (we need a first name :D) there are other ways to get the answer. With a script at least I have a foundation to start from. :)

[nmoira]

What I don't want is WTM-style science of a single discrete topic per year, or something that avoids the phrases "millions of years" and "billions of years."

 

I'd like to see an integrated approach across all major branches of science. Singapore does something like this with MPH Science, organizing around themes such as energy transfer and cycles.

 

Wishlist:

 

- pick-up-and-go, but with a parent/teacher directed introduction and "grown up" explanation of the content, goals, and methodology for each activity

- no canned "experiments," but demonstrations and hands on activities galore

- pre-assembled equipment packs for those of us who don't want to visit 20 stores to pick up supplies

- core unit with lots of optional additional recommended readings geared to a variety of reading levels, videos, etc. for kids who wish to further explore a particular topic

- interactive online activities

[Sebastian (a lady)]

OK, I got a mixed response to BFSU. What spine are most of you using right now? The best way for me to do this right is to start with a spine that you are currently using, and with a unit that you will be starting in the next few weeks. That way, I can hit that unit first, and get pretty much immediate feedback on what I am doing right, and what needs a different approach.

 

So to boil it down, what spine and which topic will you be using during February?

 

This is a little like trying to figure out what a large group of people will be eating for dinner or where they will be vacationing this summer.

 

There isn't anything like that much concensus in the homeschooling community, especially on a board like this, which is very diverse. There are plenty of pretty good books that will get more than a handful of objections that it's too this, or not enough that or hopelessly this other thing, or secretly something else.

 

It happens with all types of curriculum.

 

I think you'd do better to pick something you think does a good job on the topic and just go from there.

[Happy Scientist]

I've never seen that as a limitation in scripted programs. If the question isn't covered, as the Happy Scientist said (we need a first name :D) there are other ways to get the answer. With a script at least I have a foundation to start from. :)

 

Oops! I'm Robert Krampf, Rob to my friends, everyone here included. Should have been posting that.

[NittanyJen]

This is a little like trying to figure out what a large group of people will be eating for dinner or where they will be vacationing this summer.

 

There isn't anything like that much concensus in the homeschooling community, especially on a board like this, which is very diverse. There are plenty of pretty good books that will get more than a handful of objections that it's too this, or not enough that or hopelessly this other thing, or secretly something else.

 

It happens with all types of curriculum.

 

I think you'd do better to pick something you think does a good job on the topic and just go from there.

 

:iagree:

 

There is no magic curriculum that makes the majority of people happy. Homeschoolers are like that :). We're a rather eclectic mix of everything in the spectrum. There are folks here who won't order it unless there is a scripture verse printed on it and folks who won't order it if it does have a verse printed even on the publisher's website; folks who are die hard in their belief that the universe is either 6,000 or billions of years old; folks who want every word they need to speak spelled out for them and/or every toothpick they need for an experiment delivered in a box, and people who want just an outline and a book/video list and clear experiment protocols and reasonable equipment lists with a reasonable schedule.

 

I agree with the PP that your best success might come from taking the suggestions here that ring the most true to you as the author, and make the most sense to what you wish to accomplish as a science educator.

 

As long as you incorporate my suggestions, of course ;D

[Pen]

I agree. Open and go is a huge huge huge draw for me. I especially hate looking for supplies.

 

:iagree:

 

I've been thinking about this question more. Open and Go. Also--for us as for some other homeschoolers, we live in a rural area and don't have easy access to stores to "just run out and get a _______ " that might be needed for an experiment.

 

Also we don't have easy access to high speed connections, so, for example, cannot access youtube info.

 

And I am wary of social media like facebook, especially for children.

 

Thus, things that can be ordered and will arrive and can be used at home are a great help.

 

Things my child can use without me are even better. Not because I don't want to be involved or take the time, etc., but because when he comes and shows me or tells me what he is learning, it belongs to him. When I tell him...well, that is not as good. For us too, things that don't require the subject to become reading intensive helps (dyslexia-ish issues). Much science seems to be reading comprehension on a science theme.

 

to be ctd.

Edited January 14, 2012 by Pen

[Pen]

I would like to see films that deal with biology and chemistry the way there seem to be for space and universe and earth themes. Where is Iain Stewart and Earth the Biography for chemistry, for example? Can't we voyage into the world through an electron microscope on DVD as we can up a telescope?

 

Oh, and another limitation, we have Apple computer. Some virtual labs and such seem to only be for PC Windows.

 

I'd also like science that deals with WHY something MATTERS. Hmmmm. Life of Fred for science...what is the relevance of _____ ? How do we use _____ . RS4K does that to some degree, but not really enough.

 

I like the std. textbook Campbell and Reese Biology, but have not found something equivalent in other science subjects suited to homeschooling.

 

And I'd like something that deals with environmental issues, and some of the problems of "science" also. Not rah, rah, rah! isn't all this that can be done fantastic. Well... Some of it causes pollution. Global changes. Sickness. Type 1 errors. I'd like to see science that can help these next generations lead the world to a truly better way of living on this planet and in this universe, not just blindly forward in a dubious march of "progress".

 

PM me if you have achieved that, I realize you aren't allowed to advertise, but if you have, I'd like to know!

[Happy Scientist]

:iagree:

 

There is no magic curriculum that makes the majority of people happy. Homeschoolers are like that :). We're a rather eclectic mix of everything in the spectrum.

 

:) Yes, I have had experience with homeschoolers for a LONG time (since my museum education days the early 70's), and I know that trying to get a consensus is like herding cats. With that said, this discussion is helping me tremendously. In a time when so many textbooks are being watered down, I am delighted to hear so many of you asking for more "meat."

 

I have considered "kits" in the past, but have always felt bad about charging $30 for the things anyone could get at the grocery for $5. And when you add in the extra time on my end, postage, packaging, etc., that $30 would not include any profit. Instead, I have always focused on activities that use common, household items (and ice cream of course.) This has worked well for students at home, and for school teachers that often buy the materials with their own money.

 

So far, BFSU does not click for me, so I will order copies of a couple of the other popular spines, to see if they are a better fit. I'll keep you all informed of what I find. And again, thank you for all of the help.

 

Rob

[Jen500]

I really want a secular science program for middle schoolers. I can find plenty of fun science stuff to do for elementary.

I love the content of BFSU but by the third volume I might as well hand the book over to the kids to read.

[Halcyon]

Oops! I'm Robert Krampf, Rob to my friends, everyone here included. Should have been posting that.

 

Wait, are you the one who sends out the Krampf science emails??? We've been getting those FOREVER and they're fantastic!! I don't know why I didn't put 2 and 2 together....

[Happy Scientist]

Wait, are you the one who sends out the Krampf science emails??? We've been getting those FOREVER and they're fantastic!! I don't know why I didn't put 2 and 2 together....

 

Yes, that's me. Thanks!

[Tawlas]

What is BFSU? :lol:

 

I use RS4K and ScienceWorks. I also enjoy Handbook of Nature Study and the outdoor challenge website and want to incorporate that somehow.

 

I prefer a unit study approach to science. I don't want a few chapters about this and a few chapters about that with a experiment/activity. I want to stay with a topic for 6-10 weeks. And a month for other things. We did a month of environmental awareness for example.

 

I also don't want to have to read too much but I also want the reading to be well written and engaging. I want it to respect learning styles so my kiddo who gets a glazed look in his eyes if he has to listen for too long and not have something to DO will enjoy it. Something like SOTW but not chronological but divided into major science branches and sub subjects (say a biology book with a unit on anatomy for example) with an activity guide. I would prefer to have some video and literature suggestions to expand on a topic (fiction/nonfiction/biographic) and some sort of worksheet type pages to evaluate mastery. It would also have to be colorful or at least point to books that are colorful. I think science works best if you can see lava flowing down a mountain. I would like it to incorporate art projects, history, writing, music, and a just a bit of busywork (crosswords, fill in the blanks) but not too much.

 

I would want it multilevel like SOTW. I want my 3rd grader to get something from it and I want to be able to adapt it easily for a Kinder. It would also help to be cyclical--that a child could cycle through it again and learn more each time---basically a la science recs in the Well Trained Mind. And I would want it written at a level a 4th-5th grade child could read on their own as well as it being engaging as a read aloud.

 

Easy to find materials. Easy to purchase equipment, but I don't want to absence of a telescope to hinder progress through it. (We have a microscope--yep don't underestimate homeschoolers).

 

Also I want it to be secular. I don't mind evolutionary or old earth/universe material because I accept them but I don't want any hint of an agenda to try to persuade me one way or the other. I feel those topics are best left in the realm of theology/philosophy.

 

I wouldn't mind a website component but wouldn't want it to be necessary for the curr to work. I don't like going to a website too often unless it's to print out something or watch a video and I don't like kids doing a bulk of learning time on a computer.

 

teacher's materials that give teaching tips, troubleshooting, answers and rabbit trails or enrichment activities.

 

Wow. Perfect! Please?

[tammyw]

Squeeee.. that makes me giddy..lol I wanted soooo bad to love BFSU' date=' but I just can't. It's way too much work for me.

 

I will say once again.. I would love to see more of your Study Units. I can easily use them as my spine, line up things in our Usborne Science Encyclopedia, a few living books, let the kids make some sort of a mess and know that they have pulled a lot from it.[/quote']

 

Makes me happy too. Though I've not used BFSU myself, after everything I read from people who struggled to make it work, I just couldn't bring myself to buy it. I know my limitations.

 

I would love, love, LOVE for Rob to come up with something fantastic. I'd pay big dollars for it in fact, though I suspect that isn't Rob's intention - he seems like such a good guy who just wants others to have the joy in science like he clearly does :) As it is, we're already fans for life. In fact, after we made butter, I sent the video along to a bunch of non homeschooling friends and they all went crazy for it. There were several comments of "why couldn't we have learned science from a guy like that when we were growing up" lol (I have to agree - my science teachers were pretty uninspiring, which is possibly why I never became a science person. Seriously though, Rob and his videos are awesome.

 

Rob - I'm so glad you are here, and SO glad that you are working on putting this together. This could really and truly be the thing we've been waiting for, science-wise. I'm really excited!

 

On a related side note, after reading through half of The Magic of Reality, I'm finding several concepts FINALLY clicking for me. I love how easy of a read it is, but how comprehensive it is! After I finish, I'm going to have dd9 read it.

 

It's the first time I've actually felt excited about science!

 

ETA: I fixed Bob to Rob (sorry - I was confused!)

Edited January 15, 2012 by tammyw

[Happy Scientist]

I also feel so relieved that he is down to earth in what to expect from us as far as what we can afford. .......... Being realistic is one of the fastest ways to win me spending my small school budget with someone.

 

Thank you for your kind words. My price is one of the places where I have held the line, in spite of advice to bump it "way up" from every business and marketing person I have ever talked to. I wish I could afford to make it free, without filling the site with annoying ads for things you don't want anyway.

 

I am still looking at the various spines that folks here use, but I am starting to agree with your earlier comment that I should jump into the Study Units, and become my own spine.

 

What would REALLY help is to get constructive criticism along the way, to help me keep on track of what you want and need. Would any of you be interested in following along "live" as I develop the units, making suggestions, asking questions, telling me what didn't work for you, and generally giving me a live audience to work with?

 

Rob