"Soccer moms are the enemy of natural history and the full development of a child."

[Jane in NC]

So said eminent biologist E.O. Wilson at a recent environmental forum in Aspen. I read this comment on the PBS Nova website. Tonight's Nova program, "Lord of the Ants", focuses on Wilson, who bemoans that many children and adults have lost their connections with nature.

 

If anyone needs justification to tell the children to go outside, you can receive it from Wilson:

 

The thing about nature is it's so rich, and yet it's not owned by other people. I mean, your son sees the remarkable spectacle of a frog springing out and splashing in the water, and a water snake coursing along, and an odd flower growing up—all that doesn't belong to anybody. It's not claimed by somebody over there. And it's not forbidden to touch it. It's his. His!

 

Enjoy the day folks!

 

Jane

[Tracey in TX]

So said eminent biologist E.O. Wilson at a recent environmental forum in Aspen. I read this comment on the PBS Nova website. Tonight's Nova program, "Lord of the Ants", focuses on Wilson, who bemoans that many children and adults have lost their connections with nature.

 

If anyone needs justification to tell the children to go outside, you can receive it from Wilson:

 

The thing about nature is it's so rich, and yet it's not owned by other people. I mean, your son sees the remarkable spectacle of a frog springing out and splashing in the water, and a water snake coursing along, and an odd flower growing up—all that doesn't belong to anybody. It's not claimed by somebody over there. And it's not forbidden to touch it. It's his. His!

 

Enjoy the day folks!

 

Jane

 

That is a harsh and wholly untrue comment. I'm offended.

[Jane in NC]

That is a harsh and wholly untrue comment. I'm offended.

 

Sorry that it has offended you, particularly since I pulled the comment out of context. I do think that Wilson has a point on some children living highly structured lives without time to observe the phenomenon happening in their own backyards. (In fact, I have heard many biologists bemoan this.)

 

The book Last Child in the Woods makes a similar point.

 

In light of the end of school year fatigue faced by some on this board, I posted this for those looking for an excuse to toss the kids outside.

 

Jane

[Tracey in TX]

Thanks Jane. I'll have to read the book. Our kids do live very structured lives, but in any element of outside play (soccer, bike ridin, etc) there is an element of observing nature in the most unlikely manner. ie We did a cookout for our German exchange student's family this weekend and the kids chased fireflies and rubbed it on themselves.

 

fwiw, I'd say it's the parents whose kids are game-junkie couch potatoes instead of the soccer moms who miss on the natural events of life. But I'm a bit of a sports mom! LOL

[jazzdiva]

So said eminent biologist E.O. Wilson at a recent environmental forum in Aspen. I read this comment on the PBS Nova website. Tonight's Nova program, "Lord of the Ants", focuses on Wilson, who bemoans that many children and adults have lost their connections with nature.

 

If anyone needs justification to tell the children to go outside, you can receive it from Wilson:

 

The thing about nature is it's so rich, and yet it's not owned by other people. I mean, your son sees the remarkable spectacle of a frog springing out and splashing in the water, and a water snake coursing along, and an odd flower growing up—all that doesn't belong to anybody. It's not claimed by somebody over there. And it's not forbidden to touch it. It's his. His!

 

Enjoy the day folks!

 

Jane

And I would reply, "Overgeneralizations are the enemy of natural conversation and the full development of a lively debate."

 

That being said, I do agree with the OP that we modern beings (our kids, especially) need to reconnect with nature. I just wouldn't label soccer moms with such a limiting definition.

[Aubrey]

In light of the end of school year fatigue faced by some on this board, I posted this for those looking for an excuse to toss the kids outside.

 

 

Thanks for clarifying. I was trying to figure out what was going on!

[Jane in NC]

Well Tracey,

 

I cannot tell you how relieved I am that hockey season is over. So we too have structured sports in our lives which frankly my son needs.

 

And you make a valid point as well concerning kids who spend their time playing video games.

 

The key for all of us as parents seems to be finding a balance between structure and time to be a kid, i.e. time to get sneakers wet and hands dirty.

 

One other sports issue that I have a problem with concerns play for the sake of play. A few weeks ago, I dropped my son off at the rink for a pickup game, then took off to run errands. When I picked The Boy up, parents asked me where I had been. I said erranding. Well, you missed a great game. I immediately thought of the neighborhood boys who played baseball in the street after school when I was kid. The only times parents got involved was to move a car if it was in the way. It seems that sometimes kids need to be with kids, organize things without parents on the sidelines.

 

I'll be happy to substitute "hockey moms" in Wilson's quote. ;)

 

Jane

[Alenee]

I just wouldn't label soccer moms with such a limiting definition.

 

"Thank you!" said the coach of girls youth soccer.....

[dirty ethel rackham]

He is on NOVA tonight.

[Danestress]

I mean, it's always Mom's fault, and ultimately, aren't mother's always the enemy to the full development of their children?

 

Truly, I am sure his publishers understood why this was a jack-@ss thing to say, and they had him say it anyway because.....it's a great way to get talked about, to get on tv, to sell books.

 

I could not agree with him more than it's a sad sad thing that children are growing up without ample time to explore the outdoors. And I also think it's a pathetic thing that so many mothers believe that the outdoors is really something for Dad to do. Dad is busy working and traveling and playing golf, and Mom doesn't think *she* could lead a backpacking trip, so the kids stay home and play video games or participate in organized activities that Mom is comfortable with (not just sports, of course). And the kids are cheated.

[Stacy in NJ]

Just another Rousseau wannabe. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primitivism

[genie]

 

fwiw, I'd say it's the parents whose kids are game-junkie couch potatoes instead of the soccer moms who miss on the natural events of life.

 

Yikes. An equally harsh and wholly untrue comment. If you didn't like being pigeon-holed, does it really make sense to turn around and do the same in your own defense?

[mommaduck]

Don't blame the mothers...blame those that blame, accuse, teach, and legislate to the mother that their child has to do XYZ.

[battlemaiden]

And I would reply, "Overgeneralizations are the enemy of natural conversation and the full development of a lively debate."

 

 

 

:lol: witty.

[Melinda in VT]

Those of you who find the quote offensive, are you taking "soccer mom" to mean literally a woman whose kids play soccer? Or are you using the broader definition of "a middle- or upper-middle class woman who spends a significant amount of her time transporting her school-age children to activities such as soccer practice"?

 

I'm trying to figure out if you are defending soccer/organized sports specifically (which I don't think is what was being criticized) or if you are arguing that it is good for kids' lives to be highly structured.

[dragons in the flower bed]

I mean, it's always Mom's fault, and ultimately, aren't mother's always the enemy to the full development of their children?

 

Sing it, sister! I am really sick of everyone turning to me when my kids do something bad. Sometimes I feel like I should make my kids wear T-shirts that say, "Mom's working hard on making me better, but I won't be perfect until . . . oh, right, nobody's perfect."

 

(I don't mean to imply that I'm not responsible for them. I just mean there are many factors constantly at work and I am only one, and they're only kids, and I'm not done with them yet.)

[Valerie in Chicago]

So does this guy think that my city-dwelling kids are doomed......?:001_huh:

 

10-11 months out of the year, we're in the city. Our "backyard" is Lincoln Park. Getting there tends to be a "structured" activity, as in a grown-up must be involved.

[Tracey in TX]

Don't blame the mothers...blame those that blame, accuse, teach, and legislate to the mother that their child has to do XYZ.

 

Why blame legislators requiring specific knowledge? Not sure if I'm being oblivious or if it was meant to be tongue in cheek?

[Tracey in TX]

So does this guy think that my city-dwelling kids are doomed......?:001_huh:

 

10-11 months out of the year, we're in the city. Our "backyard" is Lincoln Park. Getting there tends to be a "structured" activity, as in a grown-up must be involved.

Love, love, love Chicago! DH would return in a heartbeat if I could tolerate snow again. Lincoln Park is hardly dooming your children :)

 

Fun question: do you know why Chicago is actually called the Windy City?

[Valerie in Chicago]

It's because the old-time journalists were full of hot air, right? Or perhaps it was the politicians.... or perhaps it should be TODAY'S local politicians?????

 

As much as I love raising our kids in the city, I have to confess that when the Notebaert Nature Museum opened, I was confused. Are we so urban that our "nature" has to have a museum??? It seemed so weird. I mean, would this fly in a rural area?

 

But it's free once a week and the butterfuly room is very cool!:)

[mommaduck]

My comment was meant in broader terms than education. I've lived in areas and a time when kids could be kids. I've also lived in areas where people always looked over your shoulder. People who thought a child shouldn't even be permitted to play in their own yard without mom standing right over them, etc. Where all play has to "structured" or your kid is going to hell in a hand basket. The legislation part is not what children should learn, but other areas that differing countries and states want to legislate. And yes, there are some things that people do want to legislate what a child learns and when they learn it that might go against someone's religious beliefs.

[j.griff]

Well gosh, I sure wanted to rep you for this Genie, but I can't rep you again yet. ;)

[Tracey in TX]

It's because the old-time journalists were full of hot air, right? Or perhaps it was the politicians.... or perhaps it should be TODAY'S local politicians?????

 

As much as I love raising our kids in the city, I have to confess that when the Notebaert Nature Museum opened, I was confused. Are we so urban that our "nature" has to have a museum??? It seemed so weird. I mean, would this fly in a rural area?

 

But it's free once a week and the butterfuly room is very cool!:)

 

Impressive! Yes, the journalists were advocating their city prior to the World's Fair. Now you have the Shedd Aquarium, Planetarium, and Water Tower Place :) Michigan Lake could be an experience in itself. Or watch nature in it's most unnatural state: students at NU!

Really hoping to take my kiddos home this summer to see family and hang out in the city again.

[j.griff]

ITA- right now we live in a military housing community (BAH! Community? THAT's a JOKE!) where we receive newletters with such wonderful tidbits included such as: our municipal code which states that children in an alternative education program (homeschoolers) are not allowed to be out in public without the presence of their parents, during the hours that they would normally be required to be in school, if they were in a "norma" school. BAH! So, I don't let my DC play outside during the day without me, and I am BUSY most of the day, so they don't play outside (except for playing in our "yard" which consists of a couple of landscaped plants, an A/C unit, a bunch of woodchips, and a slab of concrete). Everything we do is "organized", and I have a DS who is more interested in video games than any sports. Some kids are naturalists, some kids are athletes, some kids are electronic whizzes. It takes ALL kinds to make the world go round.

I personally resent the fact that my kids can't play out front unless I am out there with them. There's a park across the street, but they can't go there without me either. So, any time we go it is rather supervised. Then you have the "other" parents there that interefere with the child's play. So much overcaution, so much direction, let the kids be kids for crying out loud. ITU hovering with toddlers, but school-age kids who aren't bullying each other should be left to play without such interference. :)

[dragons in the flower bed]

Then you have the "other" parents there that interefere with the child's play. So much overcaution, so much direction, let the kids be kids for crying out loud. ITU hovering with toddlers, but school-age kids who aren't bullying each other should be left to play without such interference. :)

 

We were at a restaurant with a playplace last night and there was a dad who was micromanaging, from his seat, everything his kid did. The boy was playing air hockey with my 7yo, and occasionally forgetting to keep his arms off the table, or jumping up and down with excitement. The dad yelled across the room to correct his son every single time he did these things, and also told him his son when to compliment my son, and made him go back to shake hands when they were done. I'm all for teaching manners -- I explain to my kids to do these things -- but geez!

[Storm Bay]

Has anybody read about the life of E.O. Wilson? Odyssey Magazine featured him once (we find issues at the library.) I can see why he thinks the way he does based on his life's experience, although my kids don't spend enough time outdoors because they LOLLYGAG even when I'm right on top of them (figuratively speaking, of course). btw, his is quite an impressive story of perserverence in spite of difficulties and shows just how he got to studying ants.

 

At any rate, I think my kids could benefit from more time studying nature, but I'm not going to have them quit swimming for it. My kids love spiders and beetles, but have real issues with hornets, gnats, mosquitos and ticks. They don't even like to eat outside, although my 10 loves to pull weeds. That's my fault--I have too many allergies to eat supper outside much of the year. So, guess I'm ruining my kids, too;)

[Doran]

...That is, I have less problem with it, when the kids are old enough to truly benefit from the self discipline and social aspect of team sports. Having teen and near-teen children, I value outside activities more than I ever did before. They *need* that kind of stimulus -- that SOCIALIZATION (gasp!) at this age, and I find it to be a part of their natural development. I don't find that to be true of children who are barely potty trained, yet I see nearly as many organized activities for kids that age as I do for the older set. In truth, I think it is partly the fault of the mother/parents because it is they who feel compelled to enlist their small children in such activities, as they moan about "Johnny and Janey needing to stay busy or they just drive Mom crazy".

 

But, I can say the above, in part, because when they were much younger, and even quite a bit older, my children practically lived outdoors, their days filled with unstructured exploration and play. I had no time, but more importantly saw no need for my children to be invovled in playgroups, ball teams, and any manner of other activities to which the typical American parent hauls his/her kids every week. Indeed, we deliberately did NOT involve our kids in such activities, feeling that their worlds would be better expanded by self propelled activities.

 

I have a nephew whose parents are the model of which I write. He's four. Most of the children on his soccer team don't know which end of the field is the right one to run towards, and two thirds of them are standing in one place wailing for their parent(s) at any given moment. It's funny. But, not really. And, on some level, I have to agree wholeheartedly with Mr. Wilson, while not at all meaning to offend those who feel differently. This is just what has worked for me...for us.

 

Okay...so now I have to run off and haul my kids to piano, rowing, and karate, all of which take place on Tuesday afternoons! How's that for irony!! :D

[Andie]

ITA- right now we live in a military housing community (BAH! Community? THAT's a JOKE!) where we receive newletters with such wonderful tidbits included such as: our municipal code which states that children in an alternative education program (homeschoolers) are not allowed to be out in public without the presence of their parents, during the hours that they would normally be required to be in school, if they were in a "norma" school. BAH! So, I don't let my DC play outside during the day without me, and I am BUSY most of the day, so they don't play outside (except for playing in our "yard" which consists of a couple of landscaped plants, an A/C unit, a bunch of woodchips, and a slab of concrete). Everything we do is "organized", and I have a DS who is more interested in video games than any sports. Some kids are naturalists, some kids are athletes, some kids are electronic whizzes. It takes ALL kinds to make the world go round.

I personally resent the fact that my kids can't play out front unless I am out there with them. There's a park across the street, but they can't go there without me either. So, any time we go it is rather supervised. Then you have the "other" parents there that interefere with the child's play. So much overcaution, so much direction, let the kids be kids for crying out loud. ITU hovering with toddlers, but school-age kids who aren't bullying each other should be left to play without such interference. :)

 

 

Yuck! Will the situation be better wherever-you're-going?

[Mosaicmind]

I do take offense to this because he is putting everyone, who has their kids in some organized sport, in a box. Does he know what my kids do while they are waiting for another sybling's practice to end? They are out in the woods finding bugs, throwing rocks, and exploring NATURE!!!

 

Good Gosh!!! If I am not involving my children in organized sports than I am not socializing them and If I am involving them in organized sports than I am depriving them of nature and their development. Can't keep everyone happy. :glare:

[j.griff]

Oh it just HAS to be better. Doesn't it? We are NOT going to live in military housing again, where everything is so darn micromanaged. It drives my non-comformist self completely bonkers. Our oldest is 13, and according to military housing rules, if we were living in housing when she turns 18, and she decided not to go to college, she would not be "allowed" to live with us any longer. Puh-LEASE. Ain't nobody telling me if/when my kids can live with me. Honestly, I'm looking for a nice dumpy house to rent (maybe a double-wide even)(that isn't in pristine condition) with lots of outdoor space for the kids to play, when we move. :)

[Storm Bay]

...That is, I have less problem with it, when the kids are old enough to truly benefit from the self discipline and social aspect of team sports.

Okay...so now I have to run off and haul my kids to piano, rowing, and karate, all of which take place on Tuesday afternoons! How's that for irony!! :D

 

I loved & agreed with your post, but am out of rep to give. Just quoted enough so those of us who don't use threaded mode can see where it goes.

[Jenny in Atl]

I do take offense to this because he is putting everyone, who has their kids in some organized sport, in a box. Does he know what my kids do while they are waiting for another sybling's practice to end? They are out in the woods finding bugs, throwing rocks, and exploring NATURE!!!

 

Good Gosh!!! If I am not involving my children in organized sports than I am not socializing them and If I am involving them in organized sports than I am depriving them of nature and their development. Can't keep everyone happy. :glare:

 

Yup! No matter what you do... it's never good enough. As a psych major, I found it interesting than many of the researchers we studied were childless. I always wonder what this said of their ability to see the results clearly?

[Mamagistra]

We were at a restaurant with a playplace last night and there was a dad who was micromanaging, from his seat, everything his kid did. The boy was playing air hockey with my 7yo, and occasionally forgetting to keep his arms off the table, or jumping up and down with excitement. The dad yelled across the room to correct his son every single time he did these things, and also told him his son when to compliment my son, and made him go back to shake hands when they were done. I'm all for teaching manners -- I explain to my kids to do these things -- but geez!

 

Ugh! I think MFS has a term for this somewhere on her blog: parenting as performance art. :rolleyes:

[Storm Bay]

Yup! No matter what you do... it's never good enough. As a psych major, I found it interesting than many of the researchers we studied were childless. I always wonder what this said of their ability to see the results clearly?

 

I'm out of rep, but this is an EXCELLENT point!

[Tracey in TX]

...That is, I have less problem with it, when the kids are old enough to truly benefit from the self discipline and social aspect of team sports. Having teen and near-teen children, I value outside activities more than I ever did before. They *need* that kind of stimulus -- that SOCIALIZATION (gasp!) at this age, and I find it to be a part of their natural development. I don't find that to be true of children who are barely potty trained, yet I see nearly as many organized activities for kids that age as I do for the older set. In truth, I think it is partly the fault of the mother/parents because it is they who feel compelled to enlist their small children in such activities, as they moan about "Johnny and Janey needing to stay busy or they just drive Mom crazy".

 

But, I can say the above, in part, because when they were much younger, and even quite a bit older, my children practically lived outdoors, their days filled with unstructured exploration and play. I had no time, but more importantly saw no need for my children to be invovled in playgroups, ball teams, and any manner of other activities to which the typical American parent hauls his/her kids every week. Indeed, we deliberately did NOT involve our kids in such activities, feeling that their worlds would be better expanded by self propelled activities.

 

I have a nephew whose parents are the model of which I write. He's four. Most of the children on his soccer team don't know which end of the field is the right one to run towards, and two thirds of them are standing in one place wailing for their parent(s) at any given moment. It's funny. But, not really. And, on some level, I have to agree wholeheartedly with Mr. Wilson, while not at all meaning to offend those who feel differently. This is just what has worked for me...for us.

 

Okay...so now I have to run off and haul my kids to piano, rowing, and karate, all of which take place on Tuesday afternoons! How's that for irony!! :D

As I was reading your post two thoughts crossed my mind. One, for the most part you are correct. There are the exceptional kids who 'get' sports and thrive in the environment The other thought was the sports machine. We begin training our kids at age 4 in order to allow them compete at a higher level later. By age 9 if a kid isn't involved in a particular sport, there is virtually no hope in later participation. It's really TOO late. DCs are required to commit to a sport at NINE years old b/c of intensive training. If rec is the goal, then start 'em late and don't worry if they participate. Some coaches will actually observe parents to ensure correct body style, weight management, etc prior to acceptance. Guess this is nature in the 21st century?

Crazy Tuesday for us, too:

Soccer, soccer, gymnastics X2, dance, and choir--and I wouldn't trade this craziness for anything right now (except a nap, maybe):tongue_smilie:

[Michelle in MO]

So said eminent biologist E.O. Wilson at a recent environmental forum in Aspen. I read this comment on the PBS Nova website. Tonight's Nova program, "Lord of the Ants", focuses on Wilson, who bemoans that many children and adults have lost their connections with nature.

 

If anyone needs justification to tell the children to go outside, you can receive it from Wilson:

 

The thing about nature is it's so rich, and yet it's not owned by other people. I mean, your son sees the remarkable spectacle of a frog springing out and splashing in the water, and a water snake coursing along, and an odd flower growing up—all that doesn't belong to anybody. It's not claimed by somebody over there. And it's not forbidden to touch it. It's his. His!

 

Enjoy the day folks!

 

Jane

 

My kids don't get out enough. Dh and I had a long talk over dinner yesterday about the need to set limits on all of the indoor activities that the kids have. So, last night we "pulled the plug" on playing on the computer, etc., and set a definitive time limit.

 

My middle daughter asked, "Well, what are we supposed to do?" I said, "You know, when I was a kid, we had no computers and only four television channels. My brother claims (although I don't know if this is true) that my mom locked us out of the house every day. Go explore! We have a farm behind our house. Go do what I did as a kid---go explore the farmland! My best friend and I spent hours on the property behind our house, mapping it out into different 'zones' and we even wrote and illustrated kids' books about it. Go thou and do likewise!"

 

So---out she went! My oldest daughter, instead of wasting time on the computer endlessly, sat down and read The Merchant of Venice in an hour and a half. What a discovery!

 

Yes, there is life outside of the house, and a whole world to explore. Thanks for posting this, Jane!

[Jill- OK]

Those of you who find the quote offensive, are you taking "soccer mom" to mean literally a woman whose kids play soccer? Or are you using the broader definition of "a middle- or upper-middle class woman who spends a significant amount of her time transporting her school-age children to activities such as soccer practice"?

 

The fact that it's a gross overgeneralization means that it can probably be taken to mean several different types of women. And there's nothing inherently wrong with playing soccer, or organized sports. If he's using the term as a blanket reference to stay-at-home, middle/upper class moms (which is a popular usage), and meaning it in a derogatory way (also popular)...he's using vinegar when honey would work better, IMO.

 

I'm a mom who's kids don't play soccer, and spend a considerable amount of time outside, mucking about in nature. I love it when people encourage folks to reconsider lifestyle choices that cut kids off from the natural world...but there's no way I'm going to jump in line with someone who's quite possibly meaning to be divisive*.

 

(*If he meant "parents who overschedule their children", instead of soccer moms, he could easily have said it.)

[Jill- OK]

And I would reply, "Overgeneralizations are the enemy of natural conversation and the full development of a lively debate."

 

That being said, I do agree with the OP that we modern beings (our kids, especially) need to reconnect with nature. I just wouldn't label soccer moms with such a limiting definition.

 

Word up. :D

[Aunty Social]

I certainly agree kids need to be outside more, and have the freedom to explore. That said, my kids get limited time outside, and none of it is unsupervised, even for my 13 yo.

 

It's not because I'm some stifling, over scheduling mom....but we get AT LEAST 4 notices home during the school year that there are trucks driving around trying to pick up kids - last year they finally arrested one guy who was driving around...shall we say exposed?...and stopping kids to talk to them. On top of that, a bear followed my neighbor into her house yesterday. And we live in a good neighborhood, in an older, small development on a cul-de-sac.

 

So, while I desperately want my kids to have more time outside, just to be kids and explore, it's got to wait until we can get the heck out of dodge and find someplace a little more sane to live in.

[Michelle in MO]

I certainly agree kids need to be outside more, and have the freedom to explore. That said, my kids get limited time outside, and none of it is unsupervised, even for my 13 yo.

 

It's not because I'm some stifling, over scheduling mom....but we get AT LEAST 4 notices home during the school year that there are trucks driving around trying to pick up kids - last year they finally arrested one guy who was driving around...shall we say exposed?...and stopping kids to talk to them. On top of that, a bear followed my neighbor into her house yesterday. And we live in a good neighborhood, in an older, small development on a cul-de-sac.

 

So, while I desperately want my kids to have more time outside, just to be kids and explore, it's got to wait until we can get the heck out of dodge and find someplace a little more sane to live in.

 

and I'm frequently reminded by the news that the world our kids are being raised in today is a much different world than the one we grew up in.

 

Even though I have frustrations about where we live, one thing I'm thankful for is that we live in a fairly safe, small town, and we're a little ways outside of town, so my kids can take a walk down the street (with cell phones :) ) and go explore the farm behind our house without my worrying about them too much.

 

Yes, I understand your concern.

[Audrey]

"Soccer moms are the enemy of natural history and the full development of a child." So said eminent biologist E.O. Wilson at a recent environmental forum in Aspen. I read this comment on the PBS Nova website. Tonight's Nova program, "Lord of the Ants", focuses on Wilson, who bemoans that many children and adults have lost their connections with nature.

 

If anyone needs justification to tell the children to go outside, you can receive it from Wilson:

 

The thing about nature is it's so rich, and yet it's not owned by other people. I mean, your son sees the remarkable spectacle of a frog springing out and splashing in the water, and a water snake coursing along, and an odd flower growing up—all that doesn't belong to anybody. It's not claimed by somebody over there. And it's not forbidden to touch it. It's his. His!

 

Enjoy the day folks!

 

Jane

 

 

:smilielol5:Oh man! I've said a lot of things about soccer moms, but that.... that was classic quotable!

[Laura K (NC)]

The mentality that author condemns is the same one that dictates that 4-year-olds and younger NEED to go to preschool. Government preschool, preferably.

 

My own sons have lost the ability to manage their free time without the aid of electronic equipment. I have heard John Taylor Gatto speak and I think he would be one to shake me if he heard how my boys are turning out.

 

Next year, I've promised myself, things will be different. We're not doing co-ops. We're not doing outside classes. We're limiting the extracurriculars. It's not just because of gas. It's because of a serious burnout on my part, and until I read this, I thought that next year would be a rejuvenation for me but not necessarily for the kids. Hallelujah, the kids benefit too... probably more than me! It's really difficult to free-fall into the "unschooling" model of free time play. If there's one thing my kids need more of, besides a patient mother, :glare:, is free time to "pick their toes," as Pioneer Woman would say.

 

It is indeed a challenging thought, and probably the rhetoric did more harm than good on E.O. Wilson's part. No wonder it isn't being received well here.

 

FWIW, as far as natural history goes, I liked A Beka's Charlotte Mason- type approach to the high school biology labs. In fact, I think Charlotte Mason would wholeheartedly agree with the sentiments expressed by Wilson.

[Brigitte]

Those of you who find the quote offensive, are you taking "soccer mom" to mean literally a woman whose kids play soccer? Or are you using the broader definition of "a middle- or upper-middle class woman who spends a significant amount of her time transporting her school-age children to activities such as soccer practice"?

 

I'm trying to figure out if you are defending soccer/organized sports specifically (which I don't think is what was being criticized) or if you are arguing that it is good for kids' lives to be highly structured.

 

I think the term "soccer mom" has come to mean a family lifestyle where kids are in school all day, rushed to structured practices and games of various sorts until late in the evening (ie past dinner time) rushed home for a fast food meal, then homework and bed. All of which is starting earlier and earlier in a child's life. Many kids who go to school have very little time to just play, be creative, etc. I believe that is what E.O. Wilson is talking about.

 

Home schooled kids (yes, another sweeping generalization) are less likely to fall into E.O. Wilson's classification because so much of what we do with our kids is exploratory, creative, etc. be it in the back yard or inside the home.

[Brigitte]

I do take offense to this because he is putting everyone, who has their kids in some organized sport, in a box. Does he know what my kids do while they are waiting for another sybling's practice to end? They are out in the woods finding bugs, throwing rocks, and exploring NATURE!!!

 

Good Gosh!!! If I am not involving my children in organized sports than I am not socializing them and If I am involving them in organized sports than I am depriving them of nature and their development. Can't keep everyone happy. :glare:

 

Let's face it, generalizations have to be used to a certain extent to make a point. If you (and I don't mean you personally) don't fit the generalization, then the point isn't being made about you. I try not to get offended by generalizations because I know the person making them does not know me. Each person's situation is different.

 

I think that EO Wilson would say that if we all unleashed our kids on the great outdoors, they would get the socialization that has been deemed so great by interacting with each other outside in a more natural (meaning both nature and a non-contrived) environment.

 

Just my .02 and hoping that I didn't manage to offend in the process. :D

[Fourmother]

Home schooled kids (yes, another sweeping generalization) are less likely to fall into E.O. Wilson's classification because so much of what we do with our kids is exploratory, creative, etc. be it in the back yard or inside the home.

 

Thank you for posting this. I am perfectly happy being an urban mother whose kids' outdoor time is controlled and structured. I would never allow my kids to wander around in the woods or go to a park unsupervised. I detest nature walks, hiking and camping. I prefer to experience nature in my little vegetable garden, on the Discovery Channel or in the back yard. Yet to argue that they are stunted is absolutely false. My children have free reign to explore in so many ways. They use their imaginations through art and story telling, plus they expand their minds by reading everyday. When we want to learn about the great outdoors, we turn to the experts. You see, the good people of National Geographic do all the hiking, diving and exploring so I don't have to. That's what I pay them for. :D

 

I'm being a little tongue in cheek here, a very little, and I fully realize that not many people will share my view. I just don't think that my kids are missing out on anything by living an urban life, rather than one closer to nature. They can decide when they are older (and paying for their own medical bills) to live like Grizzly Adams or Bear Grylls. There will be plenty of time provided we haven't completely destroyed the environment before they grow up.