How do you keep the drudgery out of teaching classically?

[In2why]

I love the idea of teaching classically, yet I find that a lot of what we do is just bringing school home and not much fun. I went to a homeschooling convention this past weekend and it really helped me see that my initial goals are not in sync. I want the kids to have a solid education, but I want them to love learning as well. It seems that we have lost most of the joy in learning.

 

When I see what the WTM suggests or what others are doing, it doesn't seem like too much, but we spend a lot of our time, just getting from one thing to another.

 

I would appreciate thoughts and ideas. I am not ready to chuck classical education, but I need to find more balance.

[TracyP]

Have you listened to Susan's MP3 The Joy of Classical Learning? I just listened yesterday and WOW! It really addresses this. The classical path may not be for everyone but I do not think it needs to be a joyless path.

[redsquirrel]

We haven't noticed any drudgery. Into each education a certain amount of hard work must fall. Dividing fractions is NOT our idea of a hot time, but we manage because there is a larger goal, numerical literacy, at stake. But, for the most part, we enjoy all we learn together. Even when the math or logic gets 'slog-y' the pride of mastery seems to trump. But my kids enjoy being able to do 'weird' things like chant latin endings.

[poetic license]

:bigear:

 

Good question, I'd love to hear from more experienced parents...

[krisandpaula]

:lurk5:

[Researcher]

:bigear:

 

I really enjoy listening to The Joy of Classical Education but I still sometimes feel the drudgery in our house. DS just told me this morning that he's tired of doing the same thing for math everyday.:001_huh: It's not really the same thing, but it's clear he feels that way.

[happyhomemaker25]

I don't know how much help I can be, but I so totally relate to what you are saying. Five years ago I jumped into Classical education with both feet. I used EVERY recommendation in TWTM for my then K'er and 2nd grader. We burned out hard the first year. I started looking elsewhere to make learning more enjoyable.

Here I sit five years later realizing that I sacrificed teaching my kids good solid foundational skills. We bounced around different curriculum and methods. Guess what? My kids did not have develop the joy of learning. They developed bad habits and frustrations.

I am committing a portion of our day from here on out to skills. We will work at them over and over again. Just for part of our day. After that we will move on to something more enjoyable. They will still have opportunities to read from what interests them, to develop hobbies, to run around outside and play. I consider all of those things part of learning.

I am hoping that I can help my kids discover the joy in learning through mastery of skills. I feel like if I can give them a good foundation they can then receive the most out of their education. They can pursue subjects that interest them in a better way and have more success.

Those are just the thoughts I have come up with after some intensive soul searching over the past few days.

[ChrissySC]

I am not a purist. This is my second time homeschooling. My oldest is 20. When I say that I am not a purist, I mean that I do not complete things in the exact manner as explained in the WTM.

 

Perhaps you are trying to implement the same need across too many subjects? For example, we narrate or outline only in history. We summarize or list facts only in science. We rewrite in English.

 

You say no fun? Well, I was never allowed to go outside and study or go to work with my mom. :)

 

Do you have specific questions about appilcation or adjusting to fit you? You do not have to keep every aspect to have similar results and accomplish your goals.

[In2why]

I am downloading "The Joy of Classical Education" as I am typing and I am sure that I will get something from it.

I am also considering what I find important and what I don't. The "3R's" are non negotiable but I am rethinking some of our other subjects and whether they should be quite as intense. For example we are lucky enough to live close to a few different science museums, and I thinking that instead doing every chapter in each science book we can skip some or even most of that for the early grades and concentrate on the hands on opportunities an real life sciences. Same thing with History. This year we are studying US history and I decided to stay with the Revolutionary War time period for even longer and got seasons passes to Colonial Williamsburg. So instead of going on field trips once a month we are spending more time hands on and going at least once a week. I guess I am just trying to think through what it is I want the kids to get from home educating more than just the facts and only the facts. I have a tendency to get bogged down in that.

[In2why]

I am not a purist. This is my second time homeschooling. My oldest is 20. When I say that I am not a purist, I mean that I do not complete things in the exact manner as explained in the WTM.

 

Perhaps you are trying to implement the same need across too many subjects? For example, we narrate or outline only in history. We summarize or list facts only in science. We rewrite in English.

 

You say no fun? Well, I was never allowed to go outside and study or go to work with my mom. :)

 

Do you have specific questions about appilcation or adjusting to fit you? You do not have to keep every aspect to have similar results and accomplish your goals.

 

I don't think I need anything specific yet, but just needed to 'say' it outloud to see how it fit. I like your use of the word purist. I don't think I am going to be a WTM purist anymore. :001_huh: I pulled out all of our materials today and went through them, looking to see what we have left, what I want to really concentrate on over the next 9 weeks, and where it is repetitive. We are basically on schedule and should finish in the beginning of June, and because we school year round, I wanted to rethink this all a bit before I commit to next year materials.

 

Oh one thing I think we are dropping is poetry memorization. It looks good for the Grandparents, but I would prefer just reading more poetry. I am also going to push Latin off at least another year, instead of starting next year.

[prairiewindmomma]

We decided not to do Latin.

 

We also love to watch movies on Netflix or do craft projects as we march through history. :)

[VBoulden]

I know exactly what you mean. I usually go strong with my classical plans for several weeks/ months and then take a week or two to do interest based study, nature study, crafts, art, read alouds, narrations, etc. and we read alot of books from Five in a Row, Sonlight, etc. (These breaks usually coincide with vacations where we will be able to see new ecosystems and places that have a unique history that we want to focus on while we are there or right after we went...) Then, I get back on the wagon and start up with our formal plans. This works for me. :D

[Critterfixer]

Teaching classical education just doesn't feel like drudgery to me. Endless worksheets, stupid jingles to remember rules, basic readers in place of re-telling of great stories--now those would be drudgery!

Right up there with sorting laundry.

 

I think what I like best about the classical education approach is finding out things that I never knew. I like poking around in libraries and used bookstores for resources. And I'm not shy about changing from the recommendations in TWTM if I find a version of a classical story that I think works better.

 

Oh one thing I think we are dropping is poetry memorization. It looks good for the Grandparents, but I would prefer just reading more poetry.

 

I will be keeping poetry memory work for both my boys (7 yrs). They memorize so well, and it seems to be a matter of deep pride for them that they can rattle off their poems for me once a day. I also enjoy picking poetry--I seldom use all of the suggestions in FLL. That is one of the things that my children like about classical educations. They also seem to like the copywork. I think it's seeing the job well done that appeals to them.

[robsiew]

We follow many of the WTM recommendations. Some of school is "git er dun", but we enjoy our science experiments and history projects (although we haven't done many history projects lately). We enjoy reading good books together. My older two have really enjoyed learning Latin. I would have to say the most fun my kids have is when their studies are done and they have 1/2 a day and all evening to do whatever they want! I love that by following WTM I don't feel like I have to "do it all". We focus hard on building a good foundation, good basic skills and then we can call it a day! I am more relaxed as their teacher because I know what we are building today will stand firm years to come. I can enjoy the journey instead of wondering at every turn if I'm doing enough or too much... if we're missing this or that... :001_smile:

[LibraryLover]

For little kids, I would drop writing before I dropped poetry 'memorization'. Fine motor skills take time, but the brain is ripe for poems and songs at a very young age. My kids have loved it, although we never make it 'work'. It comes so naturally and happily to littles. It puts so much 'good stuff' into their heads.

[sewpeaceful]

MY kids love plenty of activities, science experiments, etc. They love finding out for history that day, yes we are doing the reading, but then we are making Indian food for dinner or pulling out our Playmobile castle or making a Ming bowl. I used to DREAD, I mean really DREAD, crafty stuff. But my kids LOVE it and keeps school interesting. I get the most inspiration from http://satorismiles.com/ She is in the same year of history as us and is constantly doing fun stuff with her little one. Okay, so she only has 1 child, but still, it is inspiring to me. Too often I can get wrapped up in my own day and just want to check, check, check, get it done instead of enjoy the learning itself. That blog helps me to slow down a little and make time in my day for the fun stuff. I don't do it daily, but I DO TRY to do 1 fun project a week whether it is art, history, or whatever. It has turned this year around from last year and I am more at peace with our homeschool because of it.

 

HTH

[birchbark]

We have found Charlotte Mason a nice mesh of classical skill-building and joyful learning.

[dhudson]

One easy way is to find cook books that match what you are learning in school. We make a meal based on shared are learning in school at least once week. It could be a food from history, like Johnny Cakes or from a place - we are studying Japan so we are going for sushi. Have a craft or hands-on activity everyday whether it be science, art or history. Sotw has great student sheets and activity guide or look into their coloring pages.

 

I think adding some Charlotte Mason is a great idea, she was a classical educator too. SWB has a great article about Classical and Charlotte Mason.

 

I had to learn that school can be fun and rigorous. :001_smile: my twins are having a much more fun school experience than my oldest did initially and they are academically thriving. My oldest is too, but it was a lot less fun.

[angela in ohio]

Honestly, I really reject the notion that classical education is drudgery.

 

Classical education, as opposed to a school-in-a-box or traditional school education, is much more conducive to a love of learning, imho.

 

There is more interaction, more discussion, less workbook work, more understanding of the skills and process, more real books, etc.

 

I do think you need to find more balance, though. You have a lot of programs listed for a 7 and 4 yo. :001_smile: We built a love of learning by focusing on the basics, building a good work ethic in those, and spending the rest of the "grammar years" in observation, exploration, and side-by-side discovery: field trips, reading, etc. THAT is classical education to me.

[Nan in Mass]

You can do it more easily IF you don't have a child who has a brain wiring that struggles with academics. If you do, then you might have to spend more time on the parts that are boring and hard work.

 

In either case, what you try to do is keep the boring hard work bits short and consistant, and make the reading, history, and science fun. Don't spend 45 minutes on dictation. Shorten the assignment until it takes 5 minutes to write, 5 minutes to discuss, and another 5 minutes to rewrite (or whatever your dictation routine looks like). Let them read something that interests them for reading, and let them do that for a long time each day. Then take history and literature and science and do it TWTM way, which involves a story-based history and hands-on based science and read-aloud-together literature. Let them spend a month investigating Greek ship design or whatever has caught their interest. Let them read fun library books, design their own experiments, and go on walks with their nature journals and guides for science. The exception to the short-skills is math - I think most people should choose a math program, try to stick with the same math program from year to year, and spend however long it takes each day to finish a math lesson so that they finish a math book each year.

 

That is what worked for us, anyway. I did manage to hang onto that love of learning, despite none of us being particularly academic-minded and all of us, including me, dreading the boring part.

 

-Nan

[boscopup]

Classical education, as opposed to a school-in-a-box or traditional school education, is much more conducive to a love of learning, imho.

 

 

:iagree:My son is enjoying his "classical education" a lot more than his private school education, even though I'm making him work harder. Do we love every single subject? No. He doesn't particularly like copywork. But I have picked programs that we can get done each day in a joyful manner, for the most part, and we are loving homeschooling! Because of this "classical education", my son is now reading for fun. I often find his nose in a book. He wasn't like that while in school (he was starting to be like that before starting school, but school killed it!).

 

I try to stay away from made-for-school curricula that have a lot of boring busywork. I started out using a couple, and I switched to different methods. We've both been happy with my current choices (ok, FLL isn't DS's favorite, but I think as we get into "new" material, he's enjoying it more... often when he's bored with a subject, it means the material is too easy).

[ChrissySC]

Time is a common theme. Perhaps smaller parts of the whole each day. I aim to reach each classical skill and complete at least one item for each area of classical development a week. This does not always happen. We get lost in history, but HO has helped some. Again, I am not a purist.

 

Also, I school all year. We get lost too often in what we are learning, which is why I always suggest to others not to omit a spine. You can deviate too much and the effectiveness and learning are stunted. Spending and entire year on the Civil War would only hinder us at this point. So, we move on after a month or so. I set limits. I have too. However, if you don't deviate and you only use the spine, you encounter another set of problems. One is boredom.

 

I believe that Charlotte Mason and Andrew Kern have very valid and pointed comments. If you read, you can't help but learn. WTM brings the skills and development on the academic level that I like and desire. I enjoy the interest driven approaches and reading-led methods too.

 

I suggest you get a big bag, insert all of them, shake, and pull out what you want and need. :)

[Crimson Wife]

I don't think it's drudgery but when I look at some of the recommendations in TWTM, those particular curricula would be drudgery for *MY* kids. Saxon math, R&S grammar, SWO, etc. would not work well for them. I use TWTM as more of an overall framework and look for programs that are a better "fit" for my particular children.

[TXMary2]

I don't think it is drudgery, but I think anyone can get burned out on anything that is over done. I know my 7 yo ds and what his limits are, so I pick carefully what I ask him to do. He does not like the physical act of writing - his hand gets tired. Because of that I do most of the writing when we do math. That way when I want him to do a little copywork he doesn't balk because he's already done too much writing.

 

I love the Classical Education methods and I wish I had known better when I first started homeschooling. I am trying to play catch up with some things, with my 14 yo ds. Things would be different if I had followed the Classical methods when I first brought him home from school.

[angela in ohio]

For little kids, I would drop writing before I dropped poetry 'memorization'. Fine motor skills take time, but the brain is ripe for poems and songs at a very young age. My kids have loved it, although we never make it 'work'. It comes so naturally and happily to littles. It puts so much 'good stuff' into their heads.

 

:iagree:

 

I think that classical eduction is enjoyable because it goes "with the grain" of the child. When they are young, they love to memorize, explore, discover. If you capitalize on this, they will be exicted by learning.

 

OP, one more thought: WTM is one interpretation of classical education. It works for some, and some of it works for some. But there is a much bigger classical education movement out there. You may want to explore some other resources. We have had many threads here before about learning more about classical education, like this thread.

[In2why]

Honestly, I really reject the notion that classical education is drudgery.

 

Classical education, as opposed to a school-in-a-box or traditional school education, is much more conducive to a love of learning, imho.

 

There is more interaction, more discussion, less workbook work, more understanding of the skills and process, more real books, etc.

 

I do think you need to find more balance, though. You have a lot of programs listed for a 7 and 4 yo. :001_smile: We built a love of learning by focusing on the basics, building a good work ethic in those, and spending the rest of the "grammar years" in observation, exploration, and side-by-side discovery: field trips, reading, etc. THAT is classical education to me.

 

I didn't mean to imply that Classical Education was drudgery, but that *I* am teaching it in a way that feels like drudgery!

I am happy to see the ways that you guys have made it more fun, so I can find that happy medium.

[Poke Salad Annie]

I use TWTM as more of an overall framework and look for programs that are a better "fit" for my particular children.

 

Exactly. That's why I love the first edition for planning our path. It really helps me to see the forest for the trees.

[mommy4ever]

I think every child is different. What classical looks like with one child may be very different with another, even within the same family.

 

I hear "workbooks are boring" from lots of moms, here and locally, for their children. Yet with mine, they LOVE a good workbook. We just received CLE reading, which I plan to use over summer with dd7 since she'll be done OPGTR and I want to keep it up. She was so excited. Jumping up and down at the sight of 2 new readers and the 10 booklets. "OH MOMMA! Thank you for getting me workbooks!" She is working in CLE LA, it is the first thing she wants to do in the morning. She loves everything about it. We make notes of the new vocabulary, she is building a dictionary in a small binder. Every so often we need to recopy and alphabetize(2 skills here..lol). I am thinking of using photo albums with index cards instead then we can shuffle instead, still have to alphabetize.

 

Don't be afraid to be a little goofy with them. One mom here suggested getting them to recite while standing on one foot, in childs pose, in downward-facing-dog. However makes it silly and fun!

 

Adding more physical activity to the day, also helps to get through the boring sections. My girls started karate in January. I drill them. We use their new Japanese vocabulary to test their knowledge of movement and their understanding of the words.They will be learning katas this next session, we'll be working on those too. I actually will video the Sensei so that they can watch it too. This is a great to do for 10 or 15 minutes prior to doing copywork or dictation... or anything that requires a little more attention. I remember reading, but not sure where, that their boys would do the heavy chores prior to starting school, so they were appreciative of the opportunity to sit still. They loaded the wood box, chopped wood, mowed lawns etc before school. This was great for the family as the boys were relaxed enough and paid attention to their studies, rather than antsy.

 

To make it fun, we need to see what makes the child tick.

 

DD11 was thrilled to get a big thick science book (Apologia general science) that has 50+ experiments to do. She aims to do each one. But will do a lab report for each. Because she enjoys it, she is also not fussing about outlining from the book either.

 

 

DD14 is anxiously awaiting to start grammar(she's been in school and they offered no actual grammar!) over the summer as this is a step closer to being able to do The One Year Adventure Novel program. She is impatiently waiting to start Algebra 1 so that she can start Chemistry next winter.

 

I'm pulling out history projects for the SOTW AG for the older kids too. They love to craft still, what does it matter that they are in grade 7 and 9 next year? They do most of the projects we do with dd7. They gather round when she does her science experiments, they offer feedback after dd7 offers hers. In turn, dd7 watches them do their experiments and learns a little more with them.

 

They are each others audiences for 'speeches', recitations. (rules are positive feedback from siblings, criticisms are left to mom and dad).

 

Field trips, hands on workshops. We did a science olympics that was set up by local homeschoolers. There were 32 tables of experiments to do. Cost was $25 for all 3 to go, and around here, that is a steal.

 

Now no matter what you do, not everything will be fun and exciting. Learning isn't always that way. But anything that can be fun, should be!

 

We found it hard to do science a la WTM, we just weren't doing it. One area of science for the year for dd7 wasn't happening. I tried a few different programs, it didn't do it for us. However, recently we ordered McRuffy Science, and she loves it! It is short lessons, easy to do. Ironically, despite the 'lightness' of it, she remembers it too. Since we started late, we have been doing multiple experiments a week. She LOVES science now. We'll definitely use McRuffy's again next year. It isn't WTM, and it isn't quite interest based, but she looks through her book and asks questions about different things we've done or will be, so we add books to it. So it is kinda there, it is being built up by interests. WAY more than it would be if I had to try and pull it all together myself. This is more important, it's introduced AND being done.

 

So, there is no 'perfect' way to do Classical Education. WTM offers suggestions, and SWB has stated, these are suggestions/guidelines, ones that she has found to be solid, and she has also stated, she hasn't seen all the curricula out there.

 

There are basics that need to be covered, reading, writing, math. Within that is copywork, dictation, outlining, note taking and grammar. With that skill set, one can learn ANYTHING.

 

I think once a child is old enough to start to see how the puzzle fits together(and that can be tricky, I am still learning how it all works), they might be able to see past the drudgery of some of the work.

 

Algebra will lead to being able to do Chemistry.

 

Grammar is a stepping stone to her novel course

 

Well done copywork will lead to learning cursive.

 

Learning to read well, and all it's 'silly' rules, means a whole world of books will be available to read(dd7 sees this and it DRIVES her). Having several books at home tempting her, has been a huge motivator in getting her to sit and learn to read.

 

Using a topic of interest has made teaching dd11 to outline easier. She is noting how much more she is remembering. We don't outline ALL the time, 2x a week, I don't offer much criticism, she is very sensitive. I read the passage read the outline, and only point out huge omissions, as we move to the 3 level outline, there will be more concise information. I saw this when we moved from 1 to 2.

 

Learning to outline now will make high school and college so much easier. (dd11 is seeing this as her brother in 11th struggles with writing and tells her how important it is). So she is putting a decent effort.

[momto3innc]

I don't think it's drudgery but when I look at some of the recommendations in TWTM, those particular curricula would be drudgery for *MY* kids. Saxon math, R&S grammar, SWO, etc. would not work well for them. I use TWTM as more of an overall framework and look for programs that are a better "fit" for my particular children.

 

 

:iagree: I love the concepts and we are doing narration and copywork faithfully. However some of the curriculums mentioned just would not work for us and would be a bust. Others (FLL, WWE, SOTW) have been wonderful. You just have to keep a good balance of knowing where you're going and knowing your child.

[Karen in CO]

:bigear:

 

I really enjoy listening to The Joy of Classical Education but I still sometimes feel the drudgery in our house. DS just told me this morning that he's tired of doing the same thing for math everyday.:001_huh: It's not really the same thing, but it's clear he feels that way.

 

On this point - try adding a project day, living math day, or library day instead of one of your math days. It helps to liven up math and is recommended in the WTM.

[lakotajm]

Right up there with sorting laundry.

 

Teaching classical education just doesn't feel like drudgery to me.

And I'm not shy about changing from the recommendations in TWTM if I find a version of a classical story that I think works better.

 

 

 

I will be keeping poetry memory work for both my boys (7 yrs). They memorize so well, and it seems to be a matter of deep pride for them that they can rattle off their poems for me once a day. I also enjoy picking poetry--I seldom use all of the suggestions in FLL. That is one of the things that my children like about classical educations. They also seem to like the copywork. I think it's seeing the job well done that appeals to them.

 

I happen to like sorting laundry and have to force myself to teach school!When I read the WTM, it did seem to me that a lot of it was repititious-therin the drudgery. While we do some copywork, my kids do not much like it-the 7 yo mostly. It is a difference in personality I reckon. But she struggles to write one sentence. It is a battle. So we do not do it every day nor even week. Narration is very informal for us most of the time. When I make it more than just a fun trivia quiz time, they resist. They like to memorize poetry (the youngers). But it is new for them. We have kept them quite short so far and stuck with fun topics. We use Dover's Favorite Poems of Childhood, recommeneded by SL (which is the curric we used last year.) They have learned The Everlasting Cat and so forth. The longer ones we have avoided for now. I remember with absolute hatred having to learn The Village Smithy (or whatever it was called) in 6th grade.I think having to memorize or even read stuff that some silly stuffed shirt decided is a classic for no other reason than, well-THAT-is just absurd. I hated it in PS and I don't intend to repeat it in hs. So if I am told it is a classic, I preview it or try it out with them, but chuck it if it seems not to be as good as legend holds. I will never ever force them to read The Old Man and the Sea-what a piece of tripe! Just my 2 cents.SO I think it is good to teach them some of the skills in WTM, but you can choose to adjust the frequency, material, etc. and, I think, come up with good results.Lakota

[FO4UR]

We have found Charlotte Mason a nice mesh of classical skill-building and joyful learning.

:iagree:

 

 

I don't think it's drudgery but when I look at some of the recommendations in TWTM, those particular curricula would be drudgery for *MY* kids. Saxon math, R&S grammar, SWO, etc. would not work well for them. I use TWTM as more of an overall framework and look for programs that are a better "fit" for my particular children.

 

:iagree:

 

 

For my little ones, keeping lessons short and sweet and varied (but consistent) is the key. It's taken (taking) time to find my groove, especially as I approach having 3dc doing schoolish things.

 

I try to never have one lesson go over about 20min...never one school session over an hour. We do a lesson with writing, then a read aloud, then some math, then more writing, and then a break while I do the same with a sibling...

 

The skills are mainly done in the morning here. The rest of the day is real life and reading and playing and building/planting/making/doing/going....SLEEPING if I'm lucky.:tongue_smilie:

[mommy4ever]

While we do some copywork, my kids do not much like it-the 7 yo mostly. It is a difference in personality I reckon.

 

Can you find a topic she loves? So that her copy work gives her interesting facts on that topic?

 

The best copywork I've gotten from dd11 was when it was about her beloved Geckos. No it's not GREAT writing. However, it got us over the hump. Now she is more willing. We also look for passages from books that she'd like. Not everything in WWE is interesting for her. However sometimes, there's a passage that REALLY tickles her fancy, so I'll get the book and take more passages from that book.

 

Yes, she is still doing copywork because she is resisting dictation, big time. We're working on it. One day at a time.

[Critterfixer]

I happen to like sorting laundry and have to force myself to teach school!

The only thing I have ever learned while sorting laundry was that red shirts and white socks equal pink socks. My soothing routine is bread-making and baking. I've got nothing against laundry as an exercise in entropy.:001_smile:

 

While we do some copywork, my kids do not much like it-the 7 yo mostly. It is a difference in personality I reckon. But she struggles to write one sentence. It is a battle. So we do not do it every day nor even week.

My 7 ds twins did not like copywork either. They also don't like to try new foods. It helped when I told them that the copywork makes their hands stronger. It also got one to eat spinach and the other to eat carrots. Anything that is new is hard. Anything that causes discomfort is logically to be avoided. However, both spinach and carrots are useful in creating healthy eating habits in life, and copywork is useful for building good penmanship and acquainting a young person with proper punctuation, spelling and capitalization rules.

I think all things in moderation. It takes time to build hand strength and coordination, just as it takes time to encourage the eating of new foods.

 

I remember with absolute hatred having to learn The Village Smithy (or whatever it was called) in 6th grade.

And yet after reading and enjoying The Cremation of Sam McGee, which is not great literature, I ended up memorizing it because I liked it. I think by the time a child is in sixth grade several pieces could be given as a choice for memorization. There's a mountain of good poetry out there to pick and choose.

 

I think having to memorize or even read stuff that some silly stuffed shirt decided is a classic for no other reason than, well-THAT-is just absurd. I hated it in PS and I don't intend to repeat it in hs. So if I am told it is a classic, I preview it or try it out with them, but chuck it if it seems not to be as good as legend holds. I will never ever force them to read The Old Man and the Sea-what a piece of tripe!

 

My introduction to George Orwell was to write an essay on "Shooting an Elephant." After shooting that elephant full of holes I would have sworn off Orwell for life! Then I read Animal Farm. The point being that it's sort of like discovering that something you hated when you were a child actually tastes good as an adult. I agree with you that some "Great Works" are a real struggle to get through, but you may find other writings by the authors that are more interesting.

Also, there are some works of literature that are to be held up less for what the content and more for the style, which is indicative of a particular period in the history of literature.

Stream of consciousness thought for example. An absolute bear to read, requiring a large cup of tea and aspirin to be taken in advance. Ironically it's sort of fun to write.:001_smile: So temper James Joyce by brief excerpts and have the children create stream of consciousness narratives to inflict on each-other. There are so many ways to make things more interesting.

[In2why]

I happen to like sorting laundry and have to force myself to teach school!When I read the WTM, it did seem to me that a lot of it was repititious-therin the drudgery. While we do some copywork, my kids do not much like it-the 7 yo mostly. It is a difference in personality I reckon. But she struggles to write one sentence. It is a battle. So we do not do it every day nor even week. Narration is very informal for us most of the time. When I make it more than just a fun trivia quiz time, they resist. They like to memorize poetry (the youngers). But it is new for them. We have kept them quite short so far and stuck with fun topics. We use Dover's Favorite Poems of Childhood, recommeneded by SL (which is the curric we used last year.) They have learned The Everlasting Cat and so forth. The longer ones we have avoided for now. I remember with absolute hatred having to learn The Village Smithy (or whatever it was called) in 6th grade.I think having to memorize or even read stuff that some silly stuffed shirt decided is a classic for no other reason than, well-THAT-is just absurd. I hated it in PS and I don't intend to repeat it in hs. So if I am told it is a classic, I preview it or try it out with them, but chuck it if it seems not to be as good as legend holds. I will never ever force them to read The Old Man and the Sea-what a piece of tripe! Just my 2 cents.SO I think it is good to teach them some of the skills in WTM, but you can choose to adjust the frequency, material, etc. and, I think, come up with good results.Lakota

 

 

It is so funny to me how we are all so different. I loved "The Old man and the Sea" and listening to it on tape was a moving experience for me, much better then reading it. :tongue_smilie: And laundry is my least favorite chore!

[Ester Maria]

The concept of "drudgery" evokes, to me, images of mechanically learning bits and pieces of unrelated information devoid of the context and the meaning, education for demagogy and ranglists of the infamous standardized tests, poverty of thought promoted through teaching as for a trivia contest where the information is stripped of its genesis and treated outside of a larger process, then as an opposite - lopsised education in which one cannot see the wood from trees (another form of drudgery, on the long run), in an epoch obsessed with "quantifying" the knowledge after having it dumbed down this way and severely handicapped intellectual growth.

 

Classical education? Its total opposite. Built on completely different premises. Not having given in to "economization" and "mass-modernization" and fits of culturally self-oblivious and ever more barbaric time. As it still focuses on the origins, the actual text, the context of knowledge, it cannot possibly compete in drudgery with an average school experience in our times as it provides a meaningful education, rather than a trivia contest or a specific focus on what you like at the exclusion of most everything else (two CRUCIAL mistakes that schools tend to do). Not drudgery. But we are so used to (well, I am not, but from what I saw during my time in the US...) the modern pedagogy that it sounds "weird" to many, almost unnatural, especially for young children.

 

As for the method, things are pretty much the way you make them be. I do not have an imperative of "fun" - I have an imperative of concrete set of knowledges and particular ways of thinking each field bends itself to as something I wish my daughters to learn. If it is not fun, well, it will be a "get it done" area. I am very happy for my own "get it done" areas from my own schooling which, in hindsight, were very important parts of my education whether or not I understood it back then.

 

But even then, you have a freedom in HOW to go about what you wish to learn, and this is where the beauties of homeschooling step in - while ex cathedra approach is the only one which really works for big classrooms (unless you want to waste a lot of time), educating your children you can combine activities they like and which help them to learn by tieing them to the content. So, some kids like creative work, some like a mix of activities rather than focusing on one, some like to tackle their work in an "abstract" way rather than through concrete activities (we are mostly in this group)... It is up to you and knowing your kids to tailor that for them. If learning is not compromised by having fun, everything you do to help kids master the content in a particular way they need will be good.

 

Personally, my kids thrive on minimal distractions, plain text, they have good attention spans for actual lectures, and on various kinds of written expositions and oral presentations of what they learn - a very traditional model of school, the one I swear by :D, even if considered outdated by some, but I can see palpably better results with that than with approaches of modern pedagogy. We were not really artsy or hands-on even when they were little. YMMV, as long as they learn to the best of their abilities.

[momma aimee]

:lurk5:

[SnMomof7]

Adding content subjects that my children are excited about added the joy of learning back into our home. For a time we had pared down to just the basics, and it killed the love.

[MelissaMom]

I want to read all this later :bigear: I've been very eclectic for years, but the classical spark was lit when the giant thread with Nan from Mass went viral here on WTM. I've really been thinking deeply on some of these points and hoping to make some adjustments in our homeschool.

[Joyofsixreboot]

First, this thread finally made me download SWB on the Joy of Classical Education. It made for good listening while ds did his scout meeting:D. My kids and I don't like " fun " projects. No salt dough maps or mummified chickens for us. Classical (or our version) education let's us focus on skills efficiently so we have time for being outdoors, reading or being with friends.

[poetic license]

My kids and I don't like " fun " projects. No salt dough maps or mummified chickens for us. Classical (or our version) education let's us focus on skills efficiently so we have time for being outdoors, reading or being with friends.

 

I don't like those types of kitschy projects either, although I'm sure my DS would. :lol: I'd rather him just be out there doing "real" stuff rather than me slaving away at a pre-fab project (really, isn't most of the prep work in this stuff done by mom?)

 

For me, even though I am on the beginning of the HS journey, I mentally balance myself by reading books from all different approaches. I've been drawing a lot of inspiration these days from David Albert's memoirs of his kids unschooling years. It gives me a sense of mental balance--before considering a workbook purchase, I think, "How can we learn this in a real-life, meaningful fashion?"