More venting about inlaws

[saraha]

Mil got released from hospital Saturday with a severe gallbladder infection that is being treated with oral antibiotics. They were told to put her on a special diet. She is on the way to the emergency room after calling her doctor with blood in her stool. I am heading over to clean up all the diarrhea and sil asked me to do an inventory and make/plan meals for mil and fil that will be better for her to have.

Apparently, Mil went from a liquid diet at the hospital to eating regular food as soon as she got home, so I am completely not surprised by this turn of events 🤬 Sil wants me to make and prep a menu plan so that when she gets out fil and the home health aid can make her the appropriate foods.

Low fat, no dairy, right? I have no idea what the orders were or even where to find them. But if they do let her come home tonight or tomorrow, I want at least her food to be ready

Thanks!

Edited September 21, 2023 by saraha

[Starr]

Are they going to remove her gallbladder?

[saraha]

Not as of Saturday. She has a dnr and the doctors felt like the surgery would be very risky for whatever reason at that point.

[cjzimmer1]

When my mom's gallbladder went bad and she was not able to have surgery immediately her diet was very low fat.  Like she only ate white fish and boneless skinless chicken breast for meat, no pork or beef of any kind.  Plain baked potato with no butter/sour cream.  Steamed veggies (again no sauces) In other words the most boring diet imaginable.  But she was able to stave off any further problems for several months (at which point surgery was possible).

Edited September 13, 2023 by cjzimmer1

[Starr]

It sounds like no fat is all she will probably tolerate. Before my surgery I had a lot of home made chicken soup with as much fat skimmed off as i could. Baked chicken and rice  it’s so hard to change their diet. 

[Faith-manor]

At this point with a dnr and so many health problems, it might be wise to consult hospice. If they aren't going to take her gall bladder out due to risk of surgery, I think you will see her spiral rapidly. Bananas, applesauce, no fat broth to start, and some rice. This could be days of Brat diet, even weeks.

As for SIL, I think since she is so hardcore no nursing home, no hospice facility, she can do most of this planning and execution herself. I wouldn't commit to much because you just descend into the nightmare you had with her before. But you can buy or make a bunch of applesauce, put a bunch of bananas over there, and several purchased quarts of no fat chicken broth, and make up a big rice cooker batch, and then put is in single servings in the freezer. Then just step back and say that this is all you can do at this time. It would be easy to put a lot over there so they get several days of meals for her.

[saraha]

Ok, so I got here and found a note on fridge from sil that said mom gets bananas, rice, applesauce and toast with an extra note that said fruits and vegetables, natural peanut butter, applesauce, canola oil, low fat dairy, boneless skinless chicken breast.

Am I incorrectly thinking that going from a liquid diet to regular food is what probably put her back on the hospital? I cleaned out the fridge while she was in last week and in the fridge just now I found leftover (which means she’s eaten since Saturday) chicken salad, meatloaf, mashed potatoes, a new package of yogurt cups, bacon and taco meat 🙄

[klmama]

All full of fat.  Yes, that probably did it.  

[saraha]

In other words, fil and I guess my nephew are the ones not following the directions. Sil texted and said the home health aid hasn’t been here since Friday as she is now sick. And my nephew came to sit with her. I guess he’s the one who made meatloaf, mashed potatoes and steamed broccoli. Dh and I have not been involved in daily care after the last blow up, though he did get rides to see mil everyday on the hospital and ride back at night with fil. Apparently fil is now at hospital throwing a fit because he doesn’t want her transferred 🙄

Edited September 13, 2023 by saraha

[prairiewindmomma]

Same song, different verse re: the family.

How is her chewing and swallowing? Does she still have good motor control?

[saraha]

She eats whatever she wants, no trouble with that. Oh, and I guess she had stopped drinking water and will only drink coffee or Pepsi, but that was before she went into the hospital, don’t know about after she came out. The tricky part is going to be she won’t eat off her own plate. She will only eat food and drink drinks out of fil’s plate or cups and she knows if he tries to trick her.

[saraha]

So what should I make? Chicken soup? She has mashed potatoes. With the no sugar comment, does that mean no hello either? I’m at a loss of what to make for a menu plan

[prairiewindmomma]

I think the real question is what FIL is willing to eat regularly. He’s not likely to stay on plan if he isn’t happy about it, and MIL eats off FIL’s plate.

[prairiewindmomma]

You are pretty much stuck with poultry and fish, which is hard with farmers who like beef and pork.

Turkey sandwiches: whole wheat bread, lettuce, no cheese, no mayo

chicken breast and microwaved mixed veggies

baked fish and veggies

banana bread (substitute applesauce for the oil, cut the sugar to 1/3)

scrambled eggs and toast with low sugar jam

 

[Harriet Vane]

I'm so sorry. FIL needs to pretend he's eating (or nibble off his plate a little) so she eats, then get in a real meal later and preferably hidden. 

And yeah, stick to soups for the first week or so. Pureed veg in no-fat chicken broth with chicken bits or rice to feel full. Eat it with plain toast that can be dipped into the soup. Try egg-drop soup also. I used to make it in broth just by swirling beaten eggs into the hot broth with a fork. 

Beyond that, I think prairiewindmomma's meal plan is spot on.

 

[cjzimmer1]

14 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

 

scrambled eggs and toast with low sugar jam

 

I'd be worried the yolks might be too much for a sensitive system.  if I did eggs, I would probably do whites only and see how they are tolerated before doing the whole egg.

[saraha]

Omgosh, so I found the list she had printed from the hospital with do’s and don’t s and now I see why we are in this trouble. The print out from the hospital is like, trim the fat off your beef, low fat dairy. Which does not sound like what you should jump in to when literally just discharged from the hospital.

And now we are having a text “discussion “ about how the hospital said so just do what the hospital says instead of ok, her system is not handling what the hospital said would be ok, so we should readjust. The paper said she can have that so she can have that by goodness. And I’m supposed to put a chuck roast in the crockpot for their dinner…When they come home from the hospital…where she is because of a bunch of blood on her stool…

[prairiewindmomma]

Yup, same song, different verse.

This has never been about what MIL needs, it’s about control of others for SIL and FIL’s benefit. 

[prairiewindmomma]

Sarah, my general advice is to make what you want. You can’t control what they do on the longer term, and honestly they may ignore what you do now. Do what you want, and that includes not doing anything if that is what you choose. There’s no fixing this, and it’s not worth bending yourself in knots over when there are so many other stressors in your life. ❤️❤️❤️

[saraha]

Ok, I don’t have time to go into town to go to the store. I threw away the worst offenders. I told sil I would make soup and then come back over with a menu plan for the home health aid who doesn’t know how to cook and literally makes hamburger helper every day for their lunch.

For soup, there’s  no rice here, but there is shell pasta. If I make a soup, it would have to use chicken bouillon. I have boneless skinless chicken breasts, onions, carrots, celery, green pepper, apples. 
If they insist on real food would soup and cooked apples be good?

[prairiewindmomma]

That’s a decent choice.

If the ER is smart, they will put her on a liquid diet for a few days for things to settle down. But, I suspect they won’t be, and that’s a decent meal option.

[saraha]

8 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Sarah, my general advice is to make what you want. You can’t control what they do on the longer term, and honestly they may ignore what you do now. Do what you want, and that includes not doing anything if that is what you choose. There’s no fixing this, and it’s not worth bending yourself in knots over when there are so many other stressors in your life. ❤️❤️❤️

I hear this, and it is why dh and I have stayed out of it so much. But now she’s asked for my help and I love my mil. I think I’m going to make soup, the menu plan and leave it at that.

Any links to any easy to make things that this hha who only makes hamburger helper would be greatly appreciated!

[Grace Hopper]

1 hour ago, Faith-manor said:

At this point with a dnr and so many health problems, it might be wise to consult hospice. If they aren't going to take her gall bladder out due to risk of surgery, I think you will see her spiral rapidly. Bananas, applesauce, no fat broth to start, and some rice. This could be days of Brat diet, even weeks.

As for SIL, I think since she is so hardcore no nursing home, no hospice facility, she can do most of this planning and execution herself. I wouldn't commit to much because you just descend into the nightmare you had with her before. But you can buy or make a bunch of applesauce, put a bunch of bananas over there, and several purchased quarts of no fat chicken broth, and make up a big rice cooker batch, and then put is in single servings in the freezer. Then just step back and say that this is all you can do at this time. It would be easy to put a lot over there so they get several days of meals for her.

100% and why oh why are clean up and this meal plan your responsibility?

Seems like the only way to do this at home is for MIl to have separate meal times and food accessibility from anyone else in the house. I believe there will be continual issues and unless you want to be the one on perpetual cleanup, you need to draw a line now. 

[Grace Hopper]

2 minutes ago, saraha said:

I hear this, and it is why dh and I have stayed out of it so much. But now she’s asked for my help and I love my mil. I think I’m going to make soup, the menu plan and leave it at that.

Any links to any easy to make things that this hha who only makes hamburger helper would be greatly appreciated!

I hear you. But I would limit my involvement to making soup and pleasant conversation. 

[saraha]

5 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

That’s a decent choice.

If the ER is smart, they will put her on a liquid diet for a few days for things to settle down. But, I suspect they won’t be, and that’s a decent meal option.

If they were smart they would have put her on a liquid diet Saturday since she’s been on one for a week in the hospital 🙄common sense does not run deep here…

[saraha]

So with the gallbladder, it’s about fat, not hard to digest? Do spices fit in somewhere? You guys are giving me a crash course

So putting onion i soup is fine, but no cream?

Edited September 13, 2023 by saraha

[prairiewindmomma]

Spices are generally fine, if blends are low in sodium, but this may vary by individual.
 

https://www.healthline.com/health/gallbladder-diet#foods-to-avoid
https://www.webmd.com/digestive-disorders/features/gallbladder-diet-foods-for-gallbadder-problems
 

 

[saraha]

And how do we feel about Jellos?

[prairiewindmomma]

Of the three family members I have had to make jello for with gall bladder issues, two needed the sugar free variety. Can they avoid putting cool whip on top of it? Or will the temptation be too great?

[knitgrl]

Jello cups come without cool whip. Might help avoid that particular issue.

[saraha]

4 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Of the three family members I have had to make jello for with gall bladder issues, two needed the sugar free variety. Can they avoid putting cool whip on top of it? Or will the temptation be too great?

I would hope so, they only have the sugar kind here, is it worth making?

[knitgrl]

I think it's worth a try. When I had gallbladder issues, Jello wouldn't have been a problem. It seems like it would also work with being relatively easy on the stomach.

[Starr]

Do what you can today and try not to stress. If she’s okay for a day or two they are bound to change her diet no matter what you fix. 

[saraha]

@knitgrl @prairiewindmomma

coffee, tea and Pepsi after coming home?

[BusyMom5]

What about apple crisp?  Sort-of like apple sauce,  but feels more homemade and like a dessert. Do a crisp, no crust.  Maybe just sprinkle cinnamon sugar on top.  

Chicken soup is great.  I had gallbladder issues for a while and the only meat I could handle was chicken breast.  Can you grill some and the HHA can just heat it in the microwave?  I kept some in the fridge at all times, just for me.  (Hubby wasn't handling no red meat, lol).  

[Tiberia]

Sarah, I'm sorry you're having to deal with this issue again, but I appreciate your heart to help. Just make sure to draw firm boundaries on what you're willing to do and not do.

If I were you, I would make the soup, leave a simple meal plan and maybe a shopping list, and then let SIL and FIL do what they do. You can't force someone to eat the right stuff; you can only provide good options, then bow out of the situation knowing that you tried. I would not make or provide anything that a violates the hospital list of approved foods (get a list online if hospital is not helpful). Maybe post a list of acceptable food on the fridge so they can look at it before shopping. 

It is super frustrating when people don't follow the meal plan/food list, but that's out of your control. MIL is making choices, maybe bad choices or uninformed choices, but she still gets to choose. It is sad that it's making her sicker, and that she probably doesn't understand everything that's going on. FIL and SIL are adults and can make choices also. You get to choose your level of participation in the dysfunction. You're a good person for trying to help. 

[Starr]

Also she may well be back on a liquid diet when she gets home. 

[prairiewindmomma]

23 minutes ago, saraha said:

@knitgrl @prairiewindmomma

coffee, tea and Pepsi after coming home?

I don’t think you can control what they drink. They are going to do what they are going to do. My dad sabotages himself left and right on the regular with re: to diet. Black coffee and tea have been fine, but I also know they will never drink that in my family.

I used to make meals that fit dietary needs only to have those trashed and they would pick up restaurant food instead. As you said, common sense doesn’t factor in here. Food is an emotional thing for most, and most people are very hesitant to give up what they like in favor of what is good for them.

SIL needs to be in control of others when she feels out of control emotionally. I think she will do what she wants, directing nephew to do as she wants despite whatever you plan. 
 

 

 

[Spryte]

7 minutes ago, Tiberia said:

Sarah, I'm sorry you're having to deal with this issue again, but I appreciate your heart to help. Just make sure to draw firm boundaries on what you're willing to do and not do.

If I were you, I would make the soup, leave a simple meal plan and maybe a shopping list, and then let SIL and FIL do what they do. You can't force someone to eat the right stuff; you can only provide good options, then bow out of the situation knowing that you tried. I would not make or provide anything that a violates the hospital list of approved foods (get a list online if hospital is not helpful). Maybe post a list of acceptable food on the fridge so they can look at it before shopping. 

It is super frustrating when people don't follow the meal plan/food list, but that's out of your control. MIL is making choices, maybe bad choices or uninformed choices, but she still gets to choose. It is sad that it's making her sicker, and that she probably doesn't understand everything that's going on. FIL and SIL are adults and can make choices also. You get to choose your level of participation in the dysfunction. You're a good person for trying to help. 

This.

If you make recipes, I would only include ingredients from her meal plan. So no butter, cream, etc in the recipes — that can add fat and be painful with GB issues. I would buy bananas, make rice, provide applesauce and bread for toast. Make a note not to butter the toast. Maybe some broth or soup.

But really, I would not obligate myself to cleaning out, shopping and planning for meals. They need to manage this, since they have the better info.

Take MIL a pretty bouquet of flowers, and do some minimal food care today, and then consider bowing out. That’s my take, anyway.
 

 

[saraha]

So here is what I did. I made a clear veggie broth, a chicken and veggie soup, two kinds of jello and cooked apples with no added sugar. Put all that in the fridge (blocking view of the full fat yogurt she loves) with applesauce cups. I made a three day meal plan for mil only using what I made, fil can have whatever he wants. I wrote no coffee or pepsi or dairy for now on it and stuck to fridge. I found the paperwork the hospital did send home under a stack of stuff and stick it to fridge too. Then texted sil and told her what I did and if they want more help menu planning next week I can absolutely do that. 🤷🏼‍♀️
Sil said her blood work was fine so they are sending her home. No new instructions except try to follow diet. 🤦‍♀️

[saraha]

Mil has no agency, she is like a potted plant. She sits where you tell her to til you tell her to move, goes to the bathroom when you take her and smiles sometimes. Her only opinions come out when she sees her meal on a plate, but she can’t actually get food for herself.

[cintinative]

OP, I didn't read the responses but is it possible the C-diff is back? Isn't this the same family member?

[BusyMom5]

Trying to think of things that would seem like a meal, but still fit low low to no fat

Sweet potatoes- you don't need to add butter or milk, and I've used coconut milk when DF

Wild Rice and chicken- lots of recipes but I'd stick with a more bland one

Homemade bread, rolls make a simple meal feel more homey and soup more filling

 

[knitgrl]

1 hour ago, saraha said:

@knitgrl @prairiewindmomma

coffee, tea and Pepsi after coming home?

I saw you made a note about no coffee or Pepsi, but if she has those, I don't think it will aggravate the gallbladder. Not sure how the caffeine might set after a liquid diet, though.

[Spryte]

Just throwing this out there: if she’s on oral antibiotics, she should be on Florastor. She’s at high risk of another round of C Diff.

[saraha]

1 hour ago, cintinative said:

OP, I didn't read the responses but is it possible the C-diff is back? Isn't this the same family member?

Same family member. She is on an oral antibiotic and florastor 

12 minutes ago, knitgrl said:

I saw you made a note about no coffee or Pepsi, but if she has those, I don't think it will aggravate the gallbladder. Not sure how the caffeine might set after a liquid diet, though.

I was thinking caffeine would exacerbate diarrhea and water would help rehydrate

3 minutes ago, Spryte said:

Just throwing this out there: if she’s on oral antibiotics, she should be on Florastor. She’s at high risk of another round of C Diff.

She is.

Shes home now, said her blood work was fine and suggested a colonoscopy. Sil is against but is going  talk to bil and dh. Dh said today that apparently bil watched a YouTube video and is convinced that the hospital is wrong and that mil should be on a high fat diet. He put himself on like a paleo diet and has lost some weight and is now convinced all humans should eat like this. Mil does not need to lose another ounce of weight and if fat is what is giving her bloody stools… then I think she should avoid that but dh says he’s convinced the low fat diet is not in her best interest. I didn’t know all of that til today. Dh’s response was of he can find a doctor to take her too, pay the bill, and a DOCTOR says yup, this is the way to go, then he’ll support it, until then he is not getting medical advice from YouTube.

These people are nuts.

Sil and I exchanged heated words when they got back from the hospital. I had intended to be gone but wasn’t through cleaning yet. In the end, she saw what I was saying made sense and said she still wants me to go ahead and meal plan and make how tos for the hha because in the end what I want to try won’t hurt anything. 🙄😆 and if the hha has been doing most of the cooking and she follows the menu plan with everything already there for her, I think it will be a good thing.

[cintinative]

I'm by no means an expert, but a friend of mine had C-diff, had just gotten over it, got a blood infection, and then as a result of the antibiotic they used for the blood infection, the C-diff returned. I am just wondering out loud if the C-diff is out of control somehow.  

[knitgrl]

2 minutes ago, saraha said:

Shes home now, said her blood work was fine and suggested a colonoscopy. Sil is against but is going  talk to bil and dh. Dh said today that apparently bil watched a YouTube video and is convinced that the hospital is wrong and that mil should be on a high fat diet. He put himself on like a paleo diet and has lost some weight and is now convinced all humans should eat like this. Mil does not need to lose another ounce of weight and if fat is what is giving her bloody stools… then I think she should avoid that but dh says he’s convinced the low fat diet is not in her best interest. I didn’t know all of that til today. Dh’s response was of he can find a doctor to take her too, pay the bill, and a DOCTOR says yup, this is the way to go, then he’ll support it, until then he is not getting medical advice from YouTube.

Good Lord, no. Eating high fat with gall bladder issues has the potential to put her in so much pain. Like fetal position, excruciating pain.

[saraha]

Just now, knitgrl said:

Good Lord, no. Eating high fat with gall bladder issues has the potential to put her in so much pain. Like fetal position, excruciating pain.

I know right?!? Dh said sil told bil if he got fil to try that, from now on he’s going over to clean up after mil is sick. She does it all the time and he has never helped in that way. His response was, well I don’t work from home like you do. I don’t think bil has the energy to try to make it happen, he’s more likely to gripe about it.

[saraha]

13 minutes ago, cintinative said:

I'm by no means an expert, but a friend of mine had C-diff, had just gotten over it, got a blood infection, and then as a result of the antibiotic they used for the blood infection, the C-diff returned. I am just wondering out loud if the C-diff is out of control somehow.  

The hospital didn’t seem to think that’s the case. They were leaning towards what she had been eating or a reoccurrence of diverticulitis