Update on the Joshua Duggar conviction.

[KeriJ]

Waiting to hear soon hopefully!

[mommyoffive]

2 minutes ago, KeriJ said:

Waiting to hear soon hopefully!

Someone keep us posted on this ok???

[Faith-manor]

The proceedings started 41 minutes ago. A former federal prosecutor on the sub reddit forum said it would take roughly 90 minutes for the pre sentencing report to be read plus the arguments for and against enhancements from the prosecution and defense. If ghat holds true, I would expect the sentence to be pronounced between 11-11:30 CST (Arkansas) time. That is a guess.

I will list the verdict without comment if no on else does. Duggar threads tend to get vicious so I am not in the mood, after 19 children and 2 teachers dead on top of the ridiculous antics of Ethan Crumb let's parents practically in my own backyard so to speak, to get into any of the particulars.

[Scarlett]

I would like to hear the verdict.  I haven’t noticed JD threads getting vicious…..I thought we were all in agreement he deserves to be locked away for a long time.  Forever would be great, but I doubt that will happen.

[Catwoman]

55 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

The proceedings started 41 minutes ago. A former federal prosecutor on the sub reddit forum said it would take roughly 90 minutes for the pre sentencing report to be read plus the arguments for and against enhancements from the prosecution and defense. If ghat holds true, I would expect the sentence to be pronounced between 11-11:30 CST (Arkansas) time. That is a guess.

I will list the verdict without comment if no on else does. Duggar threads tend to get vicious so I am not in the mood, after 19 children and 2 teachers dead on top of the ridiculous antics of Ethan Crumb let's parents practically in my own backyard so to speak, to get into any of the particulars.

Thanks, Faith! I’m not watching, so any info anyone can post will be much appreciated!

[prairiewindmomma]

Court is on lunch break. Defense had a large number of objections this morning.

[prairiewindmomma]

Max sentence is 20 years and $250k, so there is no way he is going away for life. Minimum sentence is 5 years. This morning some of the objections to enhancement of the sentencing grid were sustained, others were overruled. 

[Faith-manor]

Most of the enhancements were sustained. One objection was sustained though it was a minor one in terms of sentencing, one was downgraded from a 5 to a 4. They are back from break.

cCMcandless with KNWA News is doing a fine job of reporting on this.

[mommyoffive]

One Count Against Josh Duggar Is Dropped amid Child Pornography Sentencing (yahoo.com)

[Faith-manor]

21 minutes ago, mommyoffive said:

One Count Against Josh Duggar Is Dropped amid Child Pornography Sentencing (yahoo.com)

This was the distribution charge, and the lesser one. It is related to the passive file sharing embedded in the software he used, and is related to a clarification of  a 2016 law. Essentially, he didn't knowingly distribute to another machine. The file sharing was a passive part of the software.

Enhancement downgraded was because a recount of the images on his drive was 590, and level 5 enhancement on this requires it to be 600. So it went from a 5 down to 4.

Trigger warning:

 

 

 

 

 

It is a +4 for sadistic nature, upheld by Judge.

+2 for the ages of victims

+2 for use of computer

+4 less than 600 images but more than 300

+5 for pattern of behavior

 

According to the formula, this gives him sentencing level of 35 when added to th severity of the charge itself. A 35 is an average of 14 - 17.5 years. The judge has discretion, though not a huge amount of leeway. So could be anything from 10-18 because he has not shown remorse or an admission of guilt which works against him big time in federal court. But, he can't admit guilt and still appeal. The judge did deny him a new trial. Appeal is his only option though the chances are ex optionally slim, and essentially, a waste of his money.

[Faith-manor]

Sentence still has not been announced.

[Heartstrings]

11 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

This was the distribution charge, and the lesser one. It is related to the passive file sharing embedded in the software he used, and is related to a clarification of  a 2016 law. Essentially, he didn't knowingly distribute to another machine. The file sharing was a passive part of the software.

Enhancement downgraded was because a recount of the images on his drive was 590, and level 5 enhancement on this requires it to be 600. So it went from a 5 down to 4.

Trigger warning:

 

 

 

 

 

It is a +4 for sadistic nature, upheld by Judge.

+2 for the ages of victims

+2 for use of computer

+4 less than 600 images but more than 300

+5 for pattern of behavior

 

According to the formula, this gives him sentencing level of 35 when added to th severity of the charge itself. A 35 is an average of 14 - 17.5 years. The judge has discretion, though not a huge amount of leeway. So could be anything from 10-18 because he has not shown remorse or an admission of guilt which works against him big time in federal court. But, he can't admit guilt and still appeal. The judge did deny him a new trial. Appeal is his only option though the chances are ex optionally slim, and essentially, a waste of his money.

Any thought on the + 4 for having between  300-600 items when I’ve seen the number of items 700+?  

[Faith-manor]

1 minute ago, Heartstrings said:

Any thought on the + 4 for having between  300-600 items when I’ve seen the number of items 700+?  

They had to do a recount. Images also mean each individual clip in a video. They had to do a forensics recount, and some clips got counted more than once.

[Catwoman]

14 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

Sentence still has not been announced.

This is so inconsiderate.

Don’t they know we’re waiting???

[Janeway]

12-13 years, not enough.

[freesia]

He got 151 months—between 12 and 13 years. 

[cbollin]

double posted.

Edited May 25, 2022 by cbollin

[Faith-manor]

151 months, 12.5 years.

Edited May 25, 2022 by Faith-manor

[QueenCat]

I wonder how much time he'll actually have to serve, once you consider "good behavior" and such. 

[Catwoman]

Ugh! That was nowhere near enough!!!

 

[freesia]

3 minutes ago, QueenCat said:

I wonder how much time he'll actually have to serve, once you consider "good behavior" and such. 

I just looked it up and it’s at least 85%. So just over 10 years. 

[KeriJ]

I wish it was longer! But 10+ years is better than getting away with it! Thankful he was caught and convicted!

[Heartstrings]

28 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

They had to do a recount. Images also mean each individual clip in a video. They had to do a forensics recount, and some clips got counted more than once.

Thanks! 

[Faith-manor]

10 minutes ago, QueenCat said:

I wonder how much time he'll actually have to serve, once you consider "good behavior" and such. 

In federal prison, 54 days per year (15%) is the maximum one can earn, and the rest has to be served supervised often with CSAM convicts, halfway house/treatment group home type thing. He will also be on the sex offender registry so some types of employment will not be an option for him.

[freesia]

10 plus years also gets Anna to 44 so it's less likely she'll have more babies with him.But I hope she leaves him.l

[Catwoman]

Does anyone know how Anna reacted?

I swear, if she cried and was sad, I hope somebody reserves a seat for her right next to Josh on the bus to Hell. Because he is a MONSTER.

And before anyone defends her because she's a poor, sweet, innocent cult member and she doesn't know any better than to love and support him, think about his horrific crimes and all of the absolute proof that was presented at the trial. If she wants to be willfully ignorant, that's going to be between her and God.

[Catwoman]

2 minutes ago, freesia said:

10 plus years also gets Anna to 44 so it's less likely she'll have more babies with him.But I hope she leaves him.l

I was doing that math in my head, too! 

But even if he serves the full sentence, his youngest daughter will still only be 13 when he gets out, right? 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Catwoman

[freesia]

Just now, Catwoman said:

Does anyone know how Anna reacted?

I swear, if she cried and was sad, I hope somebody reserves a seat for her right next to Josh on the bus to Hell. Because he is a MONSTER.

And before anyone defends her because she's a poor, sweet, innocent cult member and she doesn't know any better than to love and support him, think about his horrific crimes and all of the absolute proof that was presented at the trial. If she wants to be willfully ignorant, that's going to be between her and God.

The Sun says she did not show any reaction, nor did JB or Josh.  They have had long experience with hiding their true feelings for the camera.

[freesia]

Just now, Catwoman said:

I was doing that math in my head, too! 

But even if he serves the full sentence, his youngest daughter will still only be 13 when he gets out, right? 

Yes 😞  But if he has sex registry restrictions, can he even live with her?  I don't know how it works for family.

[Catwoman]

Hey, does anyone know if Josh will be able to have conjugal visits with Anna while he's in prison?

Someone PLEASE tell me that won't happen in Federal prison!

[Faith-manor]

Just now, freesia said:

Yes 😞  But if he has sex registry restrictions, can he even live with her?  I don't know how it works for family.

Many sex offenders are allowed to live with their own children. Not joking. Happens all the damn time.

[Catwoman]

1 minute ago, freesia said:

Yes 😞  But if he has sex registry restrictions, can he even live with her?  I don't know how it works for family.

Considering the Duggar family mentality, I'm sure he will have no problem having lots of alone time with her, even if he's not allowed to live with her. Because that's the Duggar way, and Anna certainly isn't going to protect her. 

[Grace Hopper]

13 minutes ago, freesia said:

I just looked it up and it’s at least 85%. So just over 10 years. 

 

6 minutes ago, freesia said:

10 plus years also gets Anna to 44 so it's less likely she'll have more babies with him.But I hope she leaves him.l

Any word on conjugal visits? [ETA I see I’m not the only one whose mind went there]

4 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

I was doing that math in my head, too! 

But even if he serves the full sentence, his youngest daughter will still only be 13 when he gets out, right? 

I hope by the time he gets out someone, some way, will have made arrangements so she is unavailable to him, at least no physical contact and separate living arrangements. 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Grace Hopper

[freesia]

1 minute ago, Catwoman said:

Hey, does anyone know if Josh will be able to have conjugal visits with Anna while he's in prison?

Someone PLEASE tell me that won't happen in Federal prison!

No, there are no conjugal visits in federal prison.

[Faith-manor]

Just now, Catwoman said:

Hey, does anyone know if Josh will be able to have conjugal visits with Anna while he's in prison?

Someone PLEASE tell me that won't happen in Federal prison!

Conjugal visits are not allowed in federal prison. 17 states allow them.

Signing off. Already violated my own "don't comment on this" rule. Sigh.

[prairiewindmomma]

1 minute ago, Catwoman said:

Hey, does anyone know if Josh will be able to have conjugal visits with Anna while he's in prison?

Someone PLEASE tell me that won't happen in Federal prison!

No conjugal in fed prisons.

[Catwoman]

Just now, freesia said:

No, there are no conjugal visits in federal prison.

Thank you! That is such a relief!

[prairiewindmomma]

Hugs, faith manor. I am off to go work in the garden.

[Catwoman]

Just now, Faith-manor said:

Conjugal visits are not allowed in federal prison. 17 states allow them.

Signing off. Already violated my own "don't comment on this" rule. Sigh.

I'm pretty sure we're all on the same page with this! 🙂 

[Catwoman]

1 minute ago, prairiewindmomma said:

No conjugal in fed prisons.

Thanks!!!

 

[Catwoman]

The worst thing about this is that when Josh is released from prison, he will still most likely have another 3 or 4 DECADES of his life to reoffend. And I don't have the slightest doubt that he will be just as big a pervert when he gets out of prison as he is right now, and he might even be worse.

Ugh. 

[QueenCat]

Just now, Catwoman said:

The worst thing about this is that when Josh is released from prison, he will still most likely have another 3 or 4 DECADES of his life to reoffend. And I don't have the slightest doubt that he will be just as big a pervert when he gets out of prison as he is right now, and he might even be worse.

Ugh. 

I need an "angry" button. 

[freesia]

Just now, Catwoman said:

The worst thing about this is that when Josh is released from prison, he will still most likely have another 3 or 4 DECADES of his life to reoffend. And I don't have the slightest doubt that he will be just as big a pervert when he gets out of prison as he is right now, and he might even be worse.

Ugh. 

Yes, I agree.  I hope that Anna realizes this.  But if her children could live with him after he's done if they are divorced, then that would be a motivation to stay.

[Scarlett]

Although we all hoped he would get more, I think him being locked up for 10 years is excellent.  It is 10 years he can’t hurt Anna, nor  impregnate her, nor harm their children. Or any others.  

[Catwoman]

11 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Although we all hoped he would get more, I think him being locked up for 10 years is excellent.  It is 10 years he can’t hurt Anna, nor  impregnate her, nor harm their children. Or any others.  

This is true -- he could have gotten less time than that. I was just hoping it would be more!

 

[cbollin]

I'm reading in addition to prison time, $50,100 in fines.

[mommyoffive]

I am another one that was hoping for more.  

[Heartstrings]

I'm seeing some lawyers say that after serving his 10 years he will have 20 years of supervised probation.  He will in theory be required to be supervised around his own children.  He also will be restricted from viewing any kind of pornography or from using a computer of any sort during that 20 years.    Some of that seems hard to enforce, but it does give him a a lot of chances to slip up and violate his probation. 

[YaelAldrich]

2 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

I'm seeing some lawyers say that after serving his 10 years he will have 20 years of supervised probation.  He will in theory be required to be supervised around his own children.  He also will be restricted from viewing any kind of pornography or from using a computer of any sort during that 20 years.    Some of that seems hard to enforce, but it does give him a a lot of chances to slip up and violate his probation. 

How will they enforce no porn or computer use?  What's a phone other than a computer writ small?

How do you do supervised life in your own home?  Will a LEO move in with them? Do all the people around him also have to be computer free?

[freesia]

3 minutes ago, Heartstrings said:

I'm seeing some lawyers say that after serving his 10 years he will have 20 years of supervised probation.  He will in theory be required to be supervised around his own children.  He also will be restricted from viewing any kind of pornography or from using a computer of any sort during that 20 years.    Some of that seems hard to enforce, but it does give him a a lot of chances to slip up and violate his probation. 

Hmmm ok, but if that means he could live with them bc Anna is around, that leaves A LOT of danger seeing what he did to his sisters while "supervised" by a very large family.  I know he wasn't accused of anything with his kids and presumably the forensic investigation would have picked something up, however, ack.