Trigger warning re sexual assault: Is this rape culture in the medical prof? ( journal article)

[Laurie4b]

http://commonhealth.wbur.org/2015/08/doctor-behavior-essay

 

 

 There is so much wrong here--even in the article which is supposed to be a fix.

 

First, it's good that they are open about the fact that some on the board didn't want to publish it because it might damage the reputation of the profession. That is Penn State thinking. The doctors who sexualize medical acts damage the reputation to the profession not people who bring it to light.. Worrying about the reputation of the profession damages the reputation to the profession.

 

Secondly, there is the statement:: "So, the doctor saves Mrs. Lopez’s life. And she likely knows nothing of the  [sexualized ] event. Why would that matter? If a guy sexually assaults a drunk (anesthetized) woman, does that fact that she likely knew nothing of the event legally exonerate him? The medical profession is buying into that. (Bill Cosby's atty take note.)  

 

And does anyone think there might be an increased chance that a physician that would say/do what is described in this article would escalate to even worse forms of sexual violation? . 

 

And then there is what they believe is the remedy for people who have done such things: "Feel bad about it and resolve to never do it again." Wow. I must say though that is consistent with the way the medical profession handled someone we knew who was criminally convicted of 2 accounts of sexual assault on patients. After some "counseling" he was allowed to practice again. They were much more concerned with "rehabilitating" the doctor than of protecting future patients. Reminds me exactly of what the Catholic Church did wrong. Only this is NOW and this is the medical profession. 

 

Patients allow physicians to touch them in ways they would allow no one else to touch them because of an implicit contract that there is sexual disinterest on the part of the doctor. Once the doctor breaks that contract--if even by his words (they were all males in the examples cited), the patient has not given informed consent and imo the act is no longer a purely medical act. It becomes an act on the continuum of sexual assault.

 

And I'm not even going to get into the "forgiveness" part. You don't forgive someone for what they did to someone else. You report it.

 

If you found out any of these events happened to you, would you feel that you had been sexually violated? 

 

Am I just biased or is this rape culture?  Their tip-toeing around sickens me. It is what allows the offenses to occur. 

 

I can cognitively understand that the intersection of one's sexual feelings with what one must do professionally might be difficult for some people. You know what though? There are other professions. 

 

 

 

[maize]

It is sickening. I read that article a few days back; you are completely right about the lukewarm condemnation, this is not a "say you're sorry and don't do it again" kinda thing.

 

I am glad that the decision was made to publish this. I think there needs to be much more emphasis in medical school on medical ethics and respect at all times for the patient. I can see that a profession that regularly cuts into people would not naturally foster a strong concept of personal autonomy and bodily integrity. A great deal of objectification of the patient is probably inevitable, even necessary. Therefor doctors need to be thoughtful and vigilant to maintain appropriate boundaries and respect.

[PrincessMommy]

I absolutely would feel like I was sexually assaulted.   This from the article:

 

 

 

So, the doctor saves Mrs. Lopez’s life. And she likely knows nothing of the event. But the entire essay begs the question: How many of us are being mocked and crudely taunted when we’re at our most vulnerable — exposed, under anesthesia or not watching what the doctor is doing?

 

I see it as no different than when a bunch of frat boys take advantage of a drunk girl at a party.  It makes me very angry. Probably more angry than the girl at a frat party scenario, if I'm honest with myself.

[goldberry]

Wow.  This article was not something to be read before coffee.  I agree that is horrible.  It should be reported, not forgiven.

 

Edited because IT should be reported... not I ;)  Thanks for not reporting me!

[Murphy101]

I absolutely would feel like I was sexually assaulted. This from the article:

 

 

I see it as no different than when a bunch of frat boys take advantage of a drunk girl at a party. It makes me very angry. Probably more angry than the girl at a frat party scenario, if I'm honest with myself.

It makes me want to throw up. And I'm not even slightly surprised. When doctors ask why I don't seek medical advice/treatment more often or am skeptical of providers - I look them in the eye and tell them point blank that their profession has made me this way. I have never once had a dr react in any manner other than:

 

Disbelief

And or

Shrug it off and basicly act as though I'm one of those over sensitive women

 

The article attitude reflects that and quite frankly is part of the problem.

[Ottakee]

Sadly a doctor we used for our children was convicted of just such a thing.  This was in another country and he was sedating and then abusing young female patients.  He was caught, "disciplined" but no record of it was made on his American Medical license so he came back to the states to practice and did so for many years.  Thankfully I was always in the room with him with the kids and he didn't have that level of contact with them.  It was rediscovered here in the states and he was immediately dismissed from that practice.

[Murphy101]

I don't know if it is rape culture per ce.

 

It is not a woman vs male dr problem. It's an asshole Drs on ego God trips problem regardless of the sex of the patient. As the article notes, a man getting a colonoscopy for example illustrated the problem too.

 

That said, assholes with god complex ego problems also tend to be assholes who think assault and harassment are just people not respecting them and their better judgement and being too sensitive.

 

I use that particular word bc of the wonderful anesthesiologist the article references. Big puffy heart love for him/her.💜

 

It's infuriating to think they aren't sanctioned or fired. No other profession would get away with that. The litmus is simple. If they weren't wearing a lab coat, would they be fired or do time in jail? If so, take away their labcoat.

[LucyStoner]

And this would be part of why I am reluctant to see male doctors and switched from an OBGyn to a nurse midwife for my regular women's healthcare. I also have my husband with me at appointments for specialists or anyone, male or female I don't know and trust.

 

I won't go into the details but I've had more than a few personal experiences to lead me to this decision.

[ktgrok]

I don't know if it is rape culture per ce.

 

It is not a woman vs male dr problem. It's an asshole Drs on ego God trips problem regardless of the sex of the patient. As the article notes, a man getting a colonoscopy for example illustrated the problem too.

 

 

I'd still call it rape if it happens to a man. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

I have so much to say about this.  I won't.  Really I just can't. 

 

But anyway, I believe it.  One of my many attempts at figuring out what I wanted to "do" in my life is I went to school for medical assisting.  Part of that I had to practice working in various doctor's offices.  Some doctors really are a-holes. No doubt about it.  Surgeons often think they are gods.  One orthopedic doctor I worked with used to comment on the underwear of various patients.  Barf.  Luckily my time working with him was short.  What a jackarse. 

 

I'm reluctant to see doctors at all and people think "I" am nuts. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

To be fair, there are good doctors out there.  I just seem to have a knack for running into the bad ones. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

Although I admit these 2 scenarios don't bother me all that much.  The "I bet she is enjoying this" strikes me as immature nonsense.  The second scenario feels like a reaction to diffuse a very intense situation. 

 

I'm talking doctors who literally violate someone's body and not just react in a less than ideal way.

 

 

[DesertBlossom]

Appalling.

 

There's also a lot of women out there who felt violated/assaulted/raped during their births when the drs forced procedures on them. Their stories are so heartbreaking. There is a culture that drs always know best and women need to shut up, lay down and be compliant.

[Laurie4b]

And this would be part of why I am reluctant to see male doctors and switched from an OBGyn to a nurse midwife for my regular women's healthcare. I also have my husband with me at appointments for specialists or anyone, male or female I don't know and trust.

 

I won't go into the details but I've had more than a few personal experiences to lead me to this decision.

 

Me, too. And when I thought I would talk with some friends to "work it through" because surely, it was just bad luck, I found about 1/3 of them had had experiences in the same vein. Some not as bad; some worse. That made me decide that it wasn't an anomaly to be 'worked through" but a predictable risk to be avoided. 

 

If I have any choice ahead of time (ie anything but ER), I will only see a female physician. 

[PrincessMommy]

I'd still call it rape if it happens to a man. 

 

Yes, and rape isn't about sex...it's about power and abuse. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

Regarding male doctors if you are a female.  Ya know what my mother had said to me more than once?  She preferred a male gynecologist because what if a female doctors was a lesbian, insinuating that any female who went into that must be one.  Granted, my mother was not normal.  I just thought that line of reasoning was quite bizarre.

 

 

[SparklyUnicorn]

My mom said preferring a female gyno made you gay. Moms are fir fun!

 

I hope I'm not going around saying dumb shi* all the time.  LOL

[SparklyUnicorn]

:lol: No kidding!

 

But I have come to terms with the fact I will screw my kids up because I'm the mother.  So it is what it is.  I can't help being "the mother" and all.

[Murphy101]

I'd still call it rape if it happens to a man.

No, I think you misunderstood me. My point was that many of these incidences are not sexual in nature or location, tho those get more outrage.

 

For example, derogatory and unprofessional comments or conduct during a gallbladder surgery.

[Murphy101]

I think it is an error to presume a female physician just wouldn't do that bc of course women would never speak in a derogatory, unprofessional or sexual manner about a patient.

 

Women can be assholes too. Sometimes they seem especially vicious to other women.

[mommaduck]

My mom said preferring a female gyno made you gay. Moms are fir fun!

 

And, unfortunately, I known women that refuse to see an OB/GYN for an issue, because they don't want a male (modesty issue?) and they don't want males in the operating room (you don't usually get to know who is in the operating room).

[mommaduck]

I think it is an error to presume a female physician just wouldn't do that bc of course women would never speak in a derogatory, unprofessional or sexual manner about a patient.

 

Women can be assholes too. Sometimes they seem especially vicious to other women.

 

I've seen a mix from both genders. 

[LucyStoner]

I think it is an error to presume a female physician just wouldn't do that bc of course women would never speak in a derogatory, unprofessional or sexual manner about a patient.

 

Women can be assholes too. Sometimes they seem especially vicious to other women.

I agree. I've had two female doctors who were especially crappy in their attitude and behavior towards me. That said, I prefer a female HCP for my exams and such. I have had better, more comfortable experiences hiring women HCPs.

[rose]

That's nasty. My dh is an MD. I don't know if he's ever witnessed this kind of nastiness but he has told me about doctors joking about people's weight while they are unconscious. I think that doctors probably just feel like the patients aren't there and say the sorts of things that they might say to each other in the staff room. 

 

One thing to remember with doctors is that they are utterly human. In my dh's graduating class of about 120 people two were smokers and quite a few were alcoholics. A number of them were already divorced. For some reason our society seems to still elevate doctors to a higher status. I wonder how many doctors going into their professions seeking this respect. Obviously money is another draw. Not all doctors are jerks (like my dh  :wub: )  but the profession sure does seem to hold high percentage of them.

 

Editted to add: I don't want to sound like I'm condoning any of this bad behaviour, just giving some thoughts and possible explanations.

[Laurie4b]

I think it is an error to presume a female physician just wouldn't do that bc of course women would never speak in a derogatory, unprofessional or sexual manner about a patient.

 

Women can be assholes too. Sometimes they seem especially vicious to other women.

 

I agree that female physicians are not less likely to be arrogant jerks than men, but they are much less likely to sexualize a patient encounter.  I can handle an arrogant jerk. I don't want to be anywhere near a sexual predator when I am vulnerable. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

No, I think you misunderstood me. My point was that many of these incidences are not sexual in nature or location, tho those get more outrage.

 

For example, derogatory and unprofessional comments or conduct during a gallbladder surgery.

 

I don't even think the two examples given in the article are sexual in nature.  The first one is just stupid.  The second one...I don't know.  I really think having to do what that guy did is so intense and quite uncomfortable for all involved that I can imagine reacting in kind of a silly way to diffuse the situation.  It might be weird, but he is human. 

[mommaduck]

Yes, they may be human. Yes, they may be assholes. However, they can and should keep it to the staff room or areas where patients are not. Patients have been able to overhear these doctors, even if they were technically "under". Lord knows what is in our subconscious from these occurrences.  

[SparklyUnicorn]

The doctor who talked about women's underwear.  Ugh what a jerk.  And was well liked by the patients.  I thought it bordered on harassment for me to even have to listen to his stupid comments. 

[rose]

Yes, they may be human. Yes, they may be assholes. However, they can and should keep it to the staff room or areas where patients are not. Patients have been able to overhear these doctors, even if they were technically "under". Lord knows what is in our subconscious from these occurrences.  

I agree. I didn't mean to imply that I thought that it was OK. It was more an explanation. Really, people should refrain from making rude remarks even in the staff room.

[Laurie4b]

That's nasty. My dh is an MD. I don't know if he's ever witnessed this kind of nastiness but he has told me about doctors joking about people's weight while they are unconscious. I think that doctors probably just feel like the patients aren't there and say the sorts of things that they might say to each other in the staff room. 

 

One thing to remember with doctors is that they are utterly human. In my dh's graduating class of about 120 people two were smokers and quite a few were alcoholics. A number of them were already divorced. For some reason our society seems to still elevate doctors to a higher status. I wonder how many doctors going into their professions seeking this respect. Obviously money is another draw. Not all doctors are jerks (like my dh  :wub: )  but the profession sure does seem to hold high percentage of them.

 

As the wife of a physician who is not a jerk, I have some questions:

 

1) Why would there be a distinction between doctors talking disrespectfully about any patient characteristic or to talk sexually about a patient in the staff room vs. operating room? Is it okay in some settings? Where? 

 

2) I don't really understand the relevance of comments about doctors being "utterly human."  Can you explain? Do you mean that they should not be held to a certain ethical standard that would preclude sexual remarks or fat-shaming in their professional interactions? 

 

3) If the profession attracts a high percentage of jerks, what can the nonjerks do to protect patients?  

[momacacia]

Clearly these folks needed a good deal more medical ethics training and continuing education than they've gotten. <eye roll> This is really just part of the god-complex which shows up in the medical profession, along with a host of other issues that need to be corrected in medical care--particularly in obstetrics and gynecology.

 

But on the whole, I think the medical profession has forgotten who is paying the bills.

[kroe1]

Ah, another doctor bashing post. My favorite.

[Laurie4b]

I don't even think the two examples given in the article are sexual in nature.  The first one is just stupid.  The second one...I don't know.  I really think having to do what that guy did is so intense and quite uncomfortable for all involved that I can imagine reacting in kind of a silly way to diffuse the situation.  It might be weird, but he is human. 

 

 To refer to the woman's pleasure in his cleaning her labia is to sexualize a medical procedure. How do women who are conscious feel? I don't know anyone who would enjoy it. Most of us are embarrassed, but console ourselves that the doctor is a professional and that it is not sexual to him. I am acquainted with a physician who thought his female patients would understand that he was just "having some fun" with them. Patients don't "sexually enjoy" medical procedures. 

 

Do you agree that people submit to medical personnel handling their private parts because they perceive that it is a professional, not sexual act? 

 

I understand that what the guy had to do was intense. However, he needs another way to relieve the tension. The woman was Latina. The doctor sang a derogatory Mexican song about cockroaches  while his arm was in her vagina. To be ethnically insulted  while a doctor is physically handling one's private parts is a double whammy. Just so disgusting.  Maybe if he sang, "Stayin' alive" which has no racial connotations while doing a disco dance of celebration, I could say, "Weird but..." I agree the primary insult was not sexual but ethnic, but the fact that one is racially insulted while a hand is in one's private parts does make it sexual in my opinion. If his hand was pressing down on a wound to stop the bleeding and he sang that, it wouldn't be sexual, but it would be a slur. JMO. 

[rose]

I'll embed my answers in red.

As the wife of a physician who is not a jerk, I have some questions:

 

1) Why would there be a distinction between doctors talking disrespectfully about any patient characteristic or to talk sexually about a patient in the staff room vs. operating room? Is it okay in some settings? Where? 

 

No, I don't think that it's OK anywhere. Sexual comments are particularly nasty and I find that true anywhere in society. "Wow, she's fat" is just slightly less nasty to me then, "Wow, she's a slut." Both are gross and inappropriate but if one were to be said of me I'd rather it be the former then the latter. These are shade of grey. Sexual comments just seem darker to me. Maybe others would judge things another way though.

 

I honestly don't know that I see a difference between what's being said in front of unconscious people or people rather than behind their back in another room. Both couldn't be unintentionally overheard and are harmful.
 

2) I don't really understand the relevance of comments about doctors being "utterly human."  Can you explain? Do you mean that they should not be held to a certain ethical standard that would preclude sexual remarks or fat-shaming in their professional interactions? 

 

I think that they should be held to a high standard. Their position of respect means that people will be more hurt by their offensive behaviour then by others in society. If your car mechanic does something sexual you can probably more easily brush it off then if your doctor does so. Neither is justifiable but the damage is greater when it come from a doctor.

 

My comments were more meant to say that we shouldn't be surprised to find bad behaviour among doctors. One thing that perpetuates this is that doctors are usually regulated by other doctors and who they tend to protect their own. This is necessary though because patients make all sorts of unfair accusations against doctors when they don't understand the system. A third party doctor needs to be a part of the evaluation of accusations because only another doctor can really evaluate whether another doctor made an appropriate medical decision. Maybe non-doctors could be a part of any accusations of sexual misconduct.

 

3) If the profession attracts a high percentage of jerks, what can the nonjerks do to protect patients?  

 

Calling out the jerks like the anaesthetist  in the article would be a good start. Sexual assault should be reported to someone higher up like the chief of staff.

 

[SparklyUnicorn]

 To refer to the woman's pleasure in his cleaning her labia is to sexualize a medical procedure. How do women who are conscious feel? I don't know anyone who would enjoy it. Most of us are embarrassed, but console ourselves that the doctor is a professional and that it is not sexual to him. I am acquainted with a physician who thought his female patients would understand that he was just "having some fun" with them. Patients don't "sexually enjoy" medical procedures. 

 

Do you agree that people submit to medical personnel handling their private parts because they perceive that it is a professional, not sexual act? 

 

I understand that what the guy had to do was intense. However, he needs another way to relieve the tension. The woman was Latina. The doctor sang a derogatory Mexican song about cockroaches  while his arm was in her vagina. To be ethnically insulted  while a doctor is physically handling one's private parts is a double whammy. Just so disgusting.  Maybe if he sang, "Stayin' alive" which has no racial connotations while doing a disco dance of celebration, I could say, "Weird but..." I agree the primary insult was not sexual but ethnic, but the fact that one is racially insulted while a hand is in one's private parts does make it sexual in my opinion. If his hand was pressing down on a wound to stop the bleeding and he sang that, it wouldn't be sexual, but it would be a slur. JMO. 

 

It's better to keep those thoughts to one's self for sure, but really this doesn't register on my rage meter at all.  If someone wants to have weird thoughts about my labia while operating on it, what the hell ever. 

 

I hate to sound so insensitive, but i sometimes think we go a little overboard on expecting perfection in people all the time. 

 

I've had far worse experiences than these comments.  I thought that is what the article was going to be about. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

I definitely would forever feel weirded out to actually hear the doctor say that though! 

[LucyStoner]

And, unfortunately, I known women that refuse to see an OB/GYN for an issue, because they don't want a male (modesty issue?) and they don't want males in the operating room (you don't usually get to know who is in the operating room).

There are plenty of female OBGyns, it's a specialty with a high number of women practitioners. I certainly don't refuse to see a doctor but like when choosing to hire any other service, I'm allowed to have preferences as a customer. Obviously emergency medical care and such is different but fortunately I have not needed emergency care or any surgery that my husband couldn't be there with me the whole time. I've also had some great male doctors but as a matter of course, if someone is going to be examining my cervix, I'd really prefer they had been born with one of their own.

[mommaduck]

There are plenty of female OBGyns, it's a specialty with a high number of women practitioners. I certainly don't refuse to see a doctor but like when choosing to hire any other service, I'm allowed to have preferences as a customer. Obviously emergency medical care and such is different but fortunately I have not needed emergency care or any surgery that my husband couldn't be there with me the whole time. I've also had some great male doctors but as a matter of course, if someone is going to be examining my cervix, I'd really prefer they had been born with one of their own.

 

Not disagreeing. I have some concerns for those that would go so far as to place their lives at risk though over it. 

[LucyStoner]

Part of my decision is very much due to being a sexual assault survivor. Unfortunately, I found laying down on a table with my feet in stirrups and letting anyone touch me to be physically impossible. Other things have at times presented a challenge as well. Some providers have responded with sensitivity and kindness, others have been unkind or even nasty about it. It is actually my physical reaction to my first pelvic exam that prompted a HCP to refer me for sexual assault recovery counseling. I have managed to arrange my healthcare in such a way that it's more relaxed and I have sought out HCPs who don't require me to use stirrups or be in a gown or any number of other standard but not really necessary things. Experience in treating sexual assault survivors is one of the questions I ask right up front now when seeking certain kinds of care.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Part of my decision is very much due to being a sexual assault survivor. Unfortunately, I found laying down on a table with my feet in stirrups and letting anyone touch me to be physically impossible. Other things have at times presented a challenge as well. Some providers have responded with sensitivity and kindness, others have been unkind or even nasty about it. It is actually my physical reaction to my first pelvic exam that prompted a HCP to refer me for sexual assault recovery counseling. I have managed to arrange my healthcare in such a way that it's more relaxed and I have sought out HCPs who don't require me to use stirrups or be in a gown or any number of other standard but not really necessary things. Experience in treating sexual assault survivors is one of the questions I ask right up front now when seeking certain kinds of care.

 

I have a very hard time with these exams.  I tense all up.  I now know why, but I had doctors say stuff to me like, "Why are you so tense, my goodness you had 2 children."  Talk about freaking insensitive.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Not disagreeing. I have some concerns for those that would go so far as to place their lives at risk though over it. 

 

What do you mean by this? 

[mommaduck]

What do you mean by this? 

 

Some people place themselves at risk by refusing to seek the medical attention they need because of fear. Such as the article above adds to this fear.

[goldberry]

Do you agree that people submit to medical personnel handling their private parts because they perceive that it is a professional, not sexual act? 

 

 

This is the whole point, right here.  For a doctor to make a remark about sexual enjoyment during a procedure indicates he is not keeping the proper level of professional detachment.  That is even more disturbing to me than just mean comments about fat or whatever, although I think that's awful as well.

 

I was a massage therapist for several years.  When I was in school we were given intense ethical instruction about what the boundaries were. It was recommended that if we couldn't detach a sexual reaction or attraction to a person, we owed it to that person and to the profession not to continue to treat that person (in a professional environment).  It was about *respect* for the client and *respect* for the profession.

 

The medical profession should feel that exponentially.

 

 

[goldberry]

I also want to add that I do understand about stress relief in intense situations.  I work with a bunch of firefighters and EMTs, and I've heard them say less than nice things once they are back at the station.  I don't hold it against them, but it is typically brief and not encouraged by the others or egged on.  If it went on or became extreme, I would not hesitate to say something.  And that is with the person NOT in the room (unconscious or not, I don't think that matters.)  With the person present, a whole other level of disrespect is present.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Some people place themselves at risk by refusing to seek the medical attention they need because of fear. Such as the article above adds to this fear.

 

Yes, this would be me.  I haven't not gotten needed medical attention, but I have not been to a doctor in a very long time.  It's going to take something quite special to get me there. LOL

 

The fear is very real, is what I am saying.

[mommaduck]

Yes, this would be me.  I haven't not gotten needed medical attention, but I have not been to a doctor in a very long time.  It's going to take something quite special to get me there. LOL

 

The fear is very real, is what I am saying.

 

And I can understand that. As a friend and relative to some that have such fears, it's concerning because I naturally want people close to me to be healthy and alive.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I also want to add that I do understand about stress relief in intense situations.  I work with a bunch of firefighters and EMTs, and I've heard them say less than nice things once they are back at the station.  I don't hold it against them, but it is typically brief and not encouraged by the others or egged on.  If it went on or became extreme, I would not hesitate to say something.  And that is with the person NOT in the room (unconscious or not, I don't think that matters.)  With the person present, a whole other level of disrespect is present.

 

he did knock it off when told to

 

Not saying his actions were ideal, but I can kinda imagine saying really weird shi* in that circumstance.

 

I've had people sticking their hands way up there.  TMI.  I was awake and I cracked jokes at them about it because that helped me diffuse the situation.  Of course it's different if "I" am cracking the jokes.

[Sneezyone]

I think it's more an issue of the desensitization of medical providers than rape culture. I have a college friend who's a forensic pathologist. She told a story at a gathering of old friends about how they laughed and joked at some of the people during autopsies, particularly gunshot victims. Never mind that my own brother was killed just that way three years prior. When I spoke up about the insensitivity of it, there was silence in the room and half-hearted attempts at blaming me for being oversensitive. I will never forget it though and it changed my view of them all. People should be treated humanely, even in death.

[SparklyUnicorn]

And I can understand that. As a friend and relative to some that have such fears, it's concerning because I naturally want people close to me to be healthy and alive.

 

Well I am open to suggestions.  At least now I can articulate my issues which has been a huge step for me, but I'm still not feeling all that excited about going there. 

[mommaduck]

Well I am open to suggestions.  At least now I can articulate my issues which has been a huge step for me, but I'm still not feeling all that exited about going there. 

 

I have none :( My concern was purely personal. It wasn't meant as derogatory at all. I go with my sister sometimes because of it. She absolutely abhors going to the doctor or being at a hospital. It doesn't bother me like it does her. But I understand why it's hard for her. I'm not good at the advice part. I end up more in the support and encouragement role.