ISIS--what heroic things are we supposed to do?

[Garga]

During WWII, we read of heroes who got Jewish people out of the hands of the Nazis at great personal risk.

 

During slavery, we read of heroes who helped slaves on the underground railroad.

 

During any time of severe crisis against evil, there are those who stand and commit heroic acts and we read about them. When we do, we ask ourselves, "What would I have done? Would I have been a stop on the railroad? Would I have smuggled out Jewish children?"

 

We hope our answer is yes.

 

We may think, "If I had been alive during WWII in America, I would have wanted to help in some way."

 

And now we have ISIS. It doesn't take much to find out that these people are doing things that roll WWII and slavery and all the other atrocities of the ages into one big ball. They sell little girls as sex slaves, they kill little boys, they saw off people's heads.

 

And I sit here with no clue what any of us can do about it.

 

Is there anything at all that we can do about it? It feels as if ISIS is this generations' WWII or slavery or what have you. And I feel like I'm sitting back and letting it happen, but I don't have a clue what to do.

 

Does anyone know of a reputable organization that I can at least send some money to??

[Cammie]

Gosh, I have been thinking along these SAME lines.

 

I would hope I would have been the type of person to work to get Jews out of Germany or to help Slaves cross into the North.  And yet...here we are with a huge evil lurking in the world and I have NO idea what to do.

[Slache]

Many have gone to fight. There are those out there who will train people like you and me.

 

Spread the word. Don't stop.

 

Aid a refugee.

 

Fund the good guys as many are not well funded.

 

Comfort those who have lost.

[Onceuponatime]

Promote fundamental human rights, the rights of women and minorities, and the separation of church and state. All these things are the antithesis of ISIS. We need to safeguard them diligently.

[3 ladybugs]

Support Israel and hold politicans accountable that don't. The Middle East needs a country that friendly to Christians and Jews and they are that. Many that flee can't get on a boat or plane and come here. However if they can they should get instant refuge status. This is a political war without a nation behind it. So we need to pray that our politicians make the right decisions.

[Slache]

I'll ask my husband where we sent money. It was for a militia or military.

 

Also, know that when this is over it won't be fixed. You can build houses and grow food overseas, or send money to do so. Contact the red cross. They will have information on what organizations are out there.

[Orthodox6]

Support Israel and hold politicans accountable that don't.

Friendly feelings toward one of the monotheistic religions do not mandate support for a country's government.

[Slache]

Peshmerga.

[Amy in NH]

Support Israel and hold politicans accountable that don't. The Middle East needs a country that friendly to Christians and Jews and they are that. Many that flee can't get on a boat or plane and come here. However if they can they should get instant refuge status. This is a political war without a nation behind it. So we need to pray that our politicians make the right decisions.

 

I disagree.  It is our political, financial, and military support for Israel that fuels groups like ISIS in the Middle East.

[KrissiK]

I feel the same way. I feel so helpless at times, and I want to help, but I don't know what to do. As a Christian, I've been praying for the people in harm's way daily. I've felt a real burden for Africa what with all the violence going on there with ISIS and Boko Haram. We support two orphans through an organization called Rafiki Foundation, which is/was affiliated with Bible Study Fellowship. Each compound has a classical Christian school that serves not only the orphans but children in the surrounding communities. It looks like an excellent program, and their mission is to raise these children and educate them so they can make a difference in their countries. We've been increasing our giving to that organization lately. I know this doesn't help the immediate need, but we believe it is important in the long term fight.

[JoJosMom]

We support Voice of the Martyrs.

[Orthodox6]

Consider acting locally. ISIS is recruiting unwanted teens and young adults.....many communities could do better in helping them not be marginalized.

 

:iagree:

 

Maybe there are community outreach programs to area youth from the mosque(s) where you live?  Maybe they would welcome additional volunteers, even if they are not adherents to their religion?

 

[3 ladybugs]

I disagree.  It is our political, financial, and military support for Israel that fuels groups like ISIS in the Middle East.

Israel has a right to exist.

 

"Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us" - Golda Meir

 

I think that until we change the attitude of those involved we have to support Israel. I came to christianity late in life. I was 26 when I was baptized a Lutheran and as such, I see things a bit differently. I see NO way of being a christian and NOT supporting Israel. I just don't. Jesus was a Jew. To turn back on the jewish people is to turn one's back on Jesus (in my mind). I also don't see Israel as just one single religion state. I know personally, people that have taught christianity in Israel and they were not in fear for their lives other then the possible strikes from arab states into Israel. 

 

This is a religious war and one that isn't likely to be solved in our lifetime as it has been going on for 1000+ years. So again, Golda Meir said it better then I could have. :)

[Onceuponatime]

Israel has a right to exist.

 

)

The only justification for Israel's existence is from an ancient book that says once upon a time this guy (Moses) told his relatives a story about a long ago ancestor (Abraham) who had a personal revelation (no one else was a witness) that the whole land of Canaan would belong to his descendants. The oldest copies of this story in existence today were written at least 1000 years after the supposed revelation actually took place. That's pretty slim justification, no matter how you look at it.

[EmmaNZ]

Not long now until the thread is dead..... :lurk5:

[Slache]

Everyone relax. This is a great thread.

[Liz CA]

Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but Anne Voskamp had a fundraiser to help rescue people from ISIS.

There are several specifics I don't recall but here is a link:

 

http://www.aholyexperience.com/2015/05/how-you-all-crushed-it-waged-love-defied-isis-and-livestream-from-iraq/

[AnnE-girl]

I did not expect this to devolve so quickly. I'm not sure how anger at the protection of Israel justifies the systematic genocide of Christians and Muslim groups that don't agree with ISIS.

[WagsWife]

There's enough hatred from all groups, including those who are Jewish, Christian and Palestinian. As someone said, support groups who are working towards freedom, education, healthy living conditions for ALL.

Here is a question. If all the countries/ groups who hate Israel decided to put down their weapons, stop aiming their rockets at Israeli cities, and stopped bombing their markets. What would happen? What would Israel do?

 

Now, if tomorrow Israel decided to put down their weapons and turn off their defense system...what would their enemies do?

 

Israel has a right to protect themselves. When they are attacked, they have a right to confiscate land that was used for the attack (that is war 101...cant handle the consequences...don't attack a sovereign nation.).

 

Now, as for the OP...what can we do from over here? Encourage our leaders to not pander to these groups and play word games--while they pretend that extremist Islam is not a problem. With every city ISIS takes over they get bigger and stronger...we saw what happened when a country allows them free reign on Sept 11, how much worse will it be when they actually control an entire country?

[Onceuponatime]

I did not expect this to devolve so quickly. I'm not sure how anger at the protection of Israel justifies the systematic genocide of Christians and Muslim groups that don't agree with ISIS.

This is confusing, I don't see any justification of systematic genocide of anyone.

 

(And just in case this applied to my post on Israel, I'm not angry in any way either. I was just presenting a legitimate alternate point of view on whether it is necessary to actively support Israel to combat ISIS. For many people, this should not be made into a religious issue, but a human one.)

[Kathryn]

What on earth does Israel have to do with the OP, or are you just trying to get the thread shut down?

 

OP, I know how you feel. I feel very impotent over here in my middle class American life.

[Onceuponatime]

What on earth does Israel have to do with the OP, or are you just trying to get the thread shut down?

 

OP, I know how you feel. I feel very impotent over here in my middle class American life.

Sigh.

 

Have you read the whole thread? No one is trying to shut it down., least of all me. I'm not allowed to disagree with a particular point that was originally brought up by someone else?

 

And yes, it does have to do with the OP. This conversation should be about what all human beings can and should do. Bringing a religious element into it was someone else's choice, one that I disagree with.

[Kathryn]

Sigh.

 

Have you read the whole thread? No one is trying to shut it down., least of all me. I'm not allowed to disagree with a particular point that was originally brought up by someone else?

 

And yes, it does have to do with the OP. This conversation should be about what all human beings can and should do. Bringing a religious element into it was someone else's choice, one that I disagree with.

I realize that my post was after yours and I didn't quote, but it was NOT directed at you. I agree with your posts 😉

[Onceuponatime]

I realize that my post was after yours and I didn't quote, but it was NOT directed at you. I agree with your posts 😉

Whew! I thought I was in trouble. 😉

[Petrichor]

:iagree:

 

Maybe there are community outreach programs to area youth from the mosque(s) where you live?  Maybe they would welcome additional volunteers, even if they are not adherents to their religion?

 

 

There are many mosques throughout the west that don't see the need to include the youth. And of course, one of the problems is, these young men and women want to do something to help, and many end up going to fight for ISIS. But my understanding is that it starts from wanting to be religious/good, and not knowing how.

 

For non-muslims to go and work with these youth probably wouldn't be too helpful, as they may be seen as "the enemy" BUT, having social workers, or even youth leaders from other organizations (eg. churches, sports teams) work with the board of these mosques to encourage them to incorporate the youth into the mosque - holding lectures in english, welcoming young people though they may not "respect the mosque" in the same way that the immigrants do, and encouraging the youth to hold their own programs (eg. lock-ins, 5k runs, bake sales) would help in many communities.    

 

There are many muslim communities that do have these kinds of programs, but many that do not. And it makes the youth (especially converts and children of immigrants) feel cut off. They feel like they don't quite fit in to mainstream society, but at the same time, they aren't welcome at the mosque. :(

 

 

 

 

 

And of course, if certain, large groups of people stopped calling muslims terrorists, the youth might not feel so isolated from the community, or the need/desire to fight back.

[swellmomma]

WHat my teens and I have decided to do, and my daughter and I began last weekend as participants in the Freedom Relay, is fight against human trafficking.  We are focusing on a local level at this time, the rally and relay last saturday were for 2 causes, to bring attention to the human trafficking/sex trade in the city, and to petition the prime minister to fund a formal inquiry into the missing aboriginal women in the western provinces.  It's not doing anything to fight ISIS directly, or even specifically to help those directly affected, but I do believe that if we can succeed in protecting those human rights and prevent women and girls being bought and sold here at home we can help further out as well. 

[MercyA]

The Mennonite Central Committee does good work in Iraq and Syria. They provide blankets, heaters, fuel, food and rent vouchers, and relief and hygiene kits to displaced people.  If anyone is interested, you can read more here:

http://mcc.org/stories/mcc-calls-donations-iraqi-syrian-people

[MercyA]

I see NO way of being a christian and NOT supporting Israel. I just don't. 

 

If I'm not a Christian, that's news to me.   ;)

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

Promote fundamental human rights, the rights of women and minorities, and the separation of church and state. All these things are the antithesis of ISIS. We need to safeguard them diligently.

 

This.

 

 

The Isreal debate is a distraction.

[SparrowsNest]

This.

 

 

The Isreal debate is a distraction.

 

That's how I see it, too.  Right now, ISIS isn't primarily killing Americans.  I mean, they'd be happy to do so, but they're limited geographically and of course right now they're busy ridding their areas of influence of anyone who doesn't subscribe to their particular interpretation of Islam, whether that person be Jewish, Christian, atheist, or just-not-Muslim-enough-to-suit-them.   We could cut off all ties to Israel tomorrow and the result would not be ISIS becoming our buddies.

[3 ladybugs]

I didn't intend for this to be about Israel. The original question asked about Isis and to me I think of the middle east and beheading of Christians and Jews, when I think of Isis. For me the biggest way to help them is to support the free country in the middle east. Just like it would have been very good to support Switzerland in WWII if they were willing to take any jewish refugees. I can't remember if we supported them much if all on this issue. However they were in the middle of it (or close to the middle of it) and neutral so it would have been nice if they could have helped the jews, gays, jehovah witnesses, gypsies and so on. 

 

I know not all of Isis though is in the middle east, it is just where I think of when I think them. To that end we should also be working with other countries to combat ISIS from getting in, or growing in other countries. A global terror watch list and such would be nice. Though there could already be one. 

 

Individually the best we can do is be nice to our neighbors and welcome them if they need help. I think as a society we have got away from getting to know our neighbors. I know I have. I remember as a kid we knew everyone who lived on our street. Now I have neighbors that I barely talk to and the neighbors on the other side I don't talk to (language barrier but still). It may seem pointless but honestly if we all knew each other people would not be isolated and where that is, things like this or gangs can start up. If you are afraid that mom is going to be told that you are hanging with the wrong element if so and so sees you, you are less likely to do that. 

[Tanaqui]

Look, we can talk for the next several decades about Israel. Suffice to say, great wrongs have been committed by all sides (think it's just Israel and Palestine? Hah! Think again) when it comes to the situation with Israel.

 

But maybe "What about Israel?" should be a separate thread? (And for the record, if we're going to say "Israel has no right to exist" then we really have to take a good long look at other colonial legacies, like the US, Canada, Australia.... Like it or not, Israel isn't going anywhere. There's absolutely no point with that argument, because it's rather extreme and also never going to happen.)

 

Wrt: ISIS, we can absolutely take in more refugees. Do you realize that there are more refugees and displaced persons today than at any other point since the end of the second world war? And if you want to talk about WWII heroics, great harm was done by governments all over the world refusing to take in Jewish (and other) refugees.

[hornblower]

I didn't intend for this to be about Israel. The original question asked about Isis and to me I think of the middle east and beheading of Christians and Jews, when I think of Isis.

 

They behead Muslims too. wiki (no pictures, just text info)

 

I don't agree with framing it as ISIS beheading Christians & Jews.

[hornblower]

I completely agree with Onceuponatime

 

Promote fundamental human rights, the rights of women and minorities, and the separation of church and state.

 

 

& I'd say concrete things would be to help the refugees.

"So far, the US has accepted only tiny numbers of Syrians: 105 in the year to October 2014 and just 36 in the year before that, although it has stepped up admissions with 350 refugees in the past four months."
source

The UNHCR has almost 4 MILLION Syrian refugees registered. many of these people see no hope of ever returning and are hoping for resettlement.

Help people come to North America. Sponsor a refugee. Volunteer for resettlement groups. Volunteer with language training for newcomers. Donate to resettlement groups. Donate to those running the camps. Donate to Doctors Without Borders which is helping in several camps.

[Guest]

I support apologetics ministries for training believers in how to witness to Muslims without inaccuracies, insults, and fear. James White is doing amazing work on this point.

 

Voice of the Martys.

 

Generally supporting missionaries seeking to preach the gospel in some of the worst hotbeds. Fear is the enemy of truth, especially in dealing with ISIS. These men need the hope of Christ, not more violence aimed against them.

 

/THAT kind of Christian.

[Guest]

And yes, I also agree with everyone who is supporting refugee efforts. It's a bandaid, not a solution to the root problem, but there is a real need for safety for those fleeing the affected areas that isn't being met like it could.

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

They behead Muslims too. wiki (no pictures, just text info)

 

I don't agree with framing it as ISIS beheading Christians & Jews.

Exactly.

 

 

They are beheading people, many people.

[Amy in NH]

I support apologetics ministries for training believers in how to witness to Muslims without inaccuracies, insults, and fear. James White is doing amazing work on this point.

 

Voice of the Martys.

 

Generally supporting missionaries seeking to preach the gospel in some of the worst hotbeds. Fear is the enemy of truth, especially in dealing with ISIS. These men need the hope of Christ, not more violence aimed against them.

 

/THAT kind of Christian.

 

So you think going to the Middle East and telling violent, irrational religious extremists that their religion is wrong will help the situation?

 

How well do you think it would go over if a group of Muslim-missionaries came to the Bible belt of the US to convert Christian extremists?  Would that de-escalate the hate, or promote peace and understanding?

 

[Orthodox6]

 

 

For non-muslims to go and work with these youth probably wouldn't be too helpful, as they may be seen as "the enemy" BUT, having social workers, or even youth leaders from other organizations (eg. churches, sports teams) work with the board of these mosques to encourage them to incorporate the youth into the mosque - holding lectures in english, welcoming young people though they may not "respect the mosque" in the same way that the immigrants do, and encouraging the youth to hold their own programs (eg. lock-ins, 5k runs, bake sales) would help in many communities.    

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh dear!  :001_smile:  Direct intervention was NOT at all what I meant!   :001_smile:   Rather, I loosely was thinking that those of us with Muslim friends -- (I have one at present, and have had others in the past) -- might offer to help at the administrative end with any useful tasks.  Mailers, phone calls on behalf of the [mosque] community, general brainstorming because we all have teenagers with similar needs and thought patterns, etc. 

[Guest]

So you think going to the Middle East and telling violent, irrational religious extremists that their religion is wrong will help the situation?

 

How well do you think it would go over if a group of Muslim-missionaries came to the Bible belt of the US to convert Christian extremists? Would that de-escalate the hate, or promote peace and understanding?

 

Amy, I'm not charged with the ends of teaching the word of God, just the means. I think scripture is extremely clear on this point, and that the 'cure' for hearts filled with hate isn't humanitarian efforts, but divine regeneration. And I think so many Christians, including myself, have been failing on this point out of fear of death or even just fear of 'other', rather than seeing the clear need of the souls of those caught up in and driving the ideology of ISIS.

 

You don't have to agree, but I believe th testimony of the Bible is very clear on this point, and I strongly support those who are called to dangerous mission fields such as these, and the apologetic efforts stateside in educating people on the real theology of Islam, not the fantastical bogeyman nonsense that is so often peddled in the media. There is a lot there, and much to study and understand. It's a worthwhile pursuit if we have any hope of witnessing to either the militants or the refugees.

[Rosie_0801]

Israel has a right to exist.

 

"Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us" - Golda Meir

 

I think that until we change the attitude of those involved we have to support Israel. I came to christianity late in life. I was 26 when I was baptized a Lutheran and as such, I see things a bit differently. I see NO way of being a christian and NOT supporting Israel. I just don't. Jesus was a Jew. To turn back on the jewish people is to turn one's back on Jesus (in my mind). I also don't see Israel as just one single religion state. I know personally, people that have taught christianity in Israel and they were not in fear for their lives other then the possible strikes from arab states into Israel. 

 

This is a religious war and one that isn't likely to be solved in our lifetime as it has been going on for 1000+ years. So again, Golda Meir said it better then I could have. :)

 

You can look at it the other way. The Muslims honour Jesus as one of their most important prophets and name their kids after him. The Jews pay him no attention at all.

 

 

Anyway, I'm enjoying Waleed Aly's book, which is addressing the sorts of things the OP is thinking about. 

[EmmaNZ]

You can look at it the other way. The Muslims honour Jesus as one of their most important prophets and name their kids after him. The Jews pay him no attention at all.

 

 

Anyway, I'm enjoying Waleed Aly's book, which is addressing the sorts of things the OP is thinking about. 

Rosie, you are awesome. I would like your post many more times if it would let me.

[Petrichor]

Oh dear!  :001_smile:  Direct intervention was NOT at all what I meant!   :001_smile:   Rather, I loosely was thinking that those of us with Muslim friends -- (I have one at present, and have had others in the past) -- might offer to help at the administrative end with any useful tasks.  Mailers, phone calls on behalf of the [mosque] community, general brainstorming because we all have teenagers with similar needs and thought patterns, etc. 

 

General brainstorming would be great too. :)