S/O Vaccinations, does anyone ever wonder

[mom31257]

If all the vaccinations will open a window for some mega-bugs & viruses to ravage the human race?

 

It has definitely crossed my mind since we know over-use of antibiotics can reduce their effectiveness. I've wondered if the flu keeps mutating because of the vaccines.

 

BTW, I don't watch The Walking Dead.

[chiguirre]

The flu mutates in its reservoir species and then spreads to and through the human population. Each year the vaccine developers have to guess what strains will emerge. Some years they guess better than others. Its the prevalence of strains in birds and pigs that determine which version(s) of the flu spread to humans.

[EmseB]

No. Antibiotics don't work on the same "mechanism" as vaccines.

[trulycrabby]

Here's an article that addresses your question:

 

http://m.livescience.com/3543-vaccines-fuel-killer-flu-mutation.html

[Elisabet1]

In some cases, it has been. I have read that there is a new strain of the whooping cough that is mutated. It will only get worse with time.

[Mergath]

Nope. Not worried.

[Ausmumof3]

It is true that strains of some strains of some illnesses are increasing instead of others because they are the strains not targeted by vaccines. These were a concern with whooping cough and polio. However the more people that vaccinate the less virus is floating around to mutate new strains. So the answer is actually increasing vaccination rates not decreasing them. The risk is that in countries with lower vaccination rates there are lots of copies of the virus round and a new variation could emerge that the vaccines won't handle and it could affect people in countries with higher rates.

 

Resistance happens with basically all things... Even rats and mice become resistant to poisons. But the solution isn't stopping the poisoning and letting them breed like crazy it's trying to make the poison coverage so thorough that there are less left to develop resistance and research new methods constantly in case the old ones stop working.

[Lady Florida.]

No, not at all. They're not the same thing.

[hornblower]

In some cases, it has been. I have read that there is a new strain of the whooping cough that is mutated. It will only get worse with time.

 

Alice talked about pertussis here

 

even if an infection agent mutates, it's not mutating as a result of being in contact with a vaccine - these would be spontaneous/random mutations, so it's not analogous to antibiotic resistance. The article linked above explains it well & is a fast read.

[bibiche]

No, I worry that people who don't vaccinate will cause diseases that were very nearly eradicated to make a deadly comeback. I worry that people who are unable to receive vaccines and rely on herd immunity to protect them from illnesses will die because people who can vaccinate don't because they are misinformed/misguided.

[redsquirrel]

I worry that poor vaccination rates will cause an outbreak of an easily prevented illness.

 

Antibiotics and vaccines don't work the same way. A vaccine isn't like a big does of antibiotics that lasts for a long time. A vaccine is a bit of the illness and it teaches your immune system how to fight off the disease.

 

Do bacteria etc evolve? Yes, of course they do. They are alive and living things evolve, that is their nature. But our bodies have also evolved to deal with that.

 

One thing I do worry about is what effect climate change will have on diseases. Last year I was seeing reports of new viruses being found in the soil because of the melting of the permafrost. What is being released? How much longer until diseases that used to be confined to warmer climes make their way via mosquito etc to formally cooler locations? Lyme disease is rampant around here in part due to several years of non-winters causing an explosion in the deer population. What else is going to become rampant due to warmer winters and hotter summers?

 

 

[SparklyUnicorn]

No.  I definitely think the antibiotic overuse is a far more concerning problem than vaccinations.  There are already some medical conditions in some people that are resistant to antibiotics.

 

Then again, I figure since these things were discovered in the first place so why wouldn't people be able to discover something else? 

[SparklyUnicorn]

 

One thing I do worry about is what effect climate change will have on diseases. Last year I was seeing reports of new viruses being found in the soil because of the melting of the permafrost. What is being released? How much longer until diseases that used to be confined to warmer climes make their way via mosquito etc to formally cooler locations? Lyme disease is rampant around here in part due to several years of non-winters causing an explosion in the deer population. What else is going to become rampant due to warmer winters and hotter summers?

 

Yeah.  Although I have to kinda laugh about this because the other day someone was going on and on about the increase in temperature meanwhile we are freezing our ass off here this winter.  I mean it's been colder than I've ever experienced in my life.

 

I know that's not what they are referring to.  I was just kinda at that moment wishing for some of that warmth!

[redsquirrel]

Yeah.  Although I have to kinda laugh about this because the other day someone was going on and on about the increase in temperature meanwhile we are freezing our ass off here this winter.  I mean it's been colder than I've ever experienced in my life.

 

I know that's not what they are referring to.  I was just kinda at that moment wishing for some of that warmth!

 

It's that instability that spurs big changes in things like bacteria.  In my local area every year is the 'most'. We've had the wettest summer on record followed by the driest on record. The warmest winter followed by the coldest etc.  The latest start to the growing season followed by the earliest. It just doesn't stop

 

That is the sort of thing that spurs mutation and evolution as much as overuse of antibiotics.

[Mergath]

Yeah.  Although I have to kinda laugh about this because the other day someone was going on and on about the increase in temperature meanwhile we are freezing our ass off here this winter.  I mean it's been colder than I've ever experienced in my life.

 

I know that's not what they are referring to.  I was just kinda at that moment wishing for some of that warmth!

 

We're having a weirdly warm winter here.  We're supposed to have a couple of days in the next week that will hit forty-one.  Forty-one ABOVE ZERO.  Which is bizarre for Minnesota in January.

[Guest]

You can all thank me for the warm winter. I bought DH a fancy new shovel, I stocked up on ice melt AND bought the kids new sleds. It will never snow again!

[katilac]

No. 

 

First, vaccines and antibiotics work differently. 

 

Second,  a potential ravaging of the human race is better than the certain ravaging we had when polio and other diseases were rampant.  

 

As far as antibiotics go, certainly we want to be aware of overuse, and work towards solutions. It's a critical issue that requires action. But, while resistant strains of bacteria are a problem, they are still a better problem to have than no antibiotics, imo. 

[ChocolateReignRemix]

We're having a weirdly warm winter here.  We're supposed to have a couple of days in the next week that will hit forty-one.  Forty-one ABOVE ZERO.  Which is bizarre for Minnesota in January.

 

I helped guarantee a mild winter by going over board with stockpiling supplies.

 

 

[SparklyUnicorn]

We're having a weirdly warm winter here.  We're supposed to have a couple of days in the next week that will hit forty-one.  Forty-one ABOVE ZERO.  Which is bizarre for Minnesota in January.

 

Yeah a few years ago we had the same thing.  It was like we had no winter that year.  I think it snowed once and it melted right away.  It was odd.  I enjoyed it.  LOL

[SparklyUnicorn]

I helped guarantee a mild winter by going over board with stockpiling supplies.

 

I need to try this.  LOL

[redsquirrel]

I grew up on the Canadian border. In the winter my mom used to feed us fish from the lake that was caught by ice fishermen. It was a cheap way to feed the family.  You drove past the lake and there would be lake perch all skinned and ready for sale for almost nothing. 

There is a ferry boat that goes across Lake Champlain and it used to only run in the warm months because the lake froze so solidly that the ferry could not keep a channel open. At some point (in the late 1980s, I think) the ferry company bought an ice breaker and it was a huge giant big deal that the ferry could run all year long.  It made the news because they had to buy it from the USSR.  Or at least that is my memory of the story.

 

 

Now that lake doesn't freeze for years at a time. :sad: It did last year and it was a big deal. My kids had never seen it frozen. They had never seen shanties out on the lake.

 

 

 

It makes me worry about what else is changing.

 

[creekland]

You can all thank me for the warm winter. I bought DH a fancy new shovel, I stocked up on ice melt AND bought the kids new sleds. It will never snow again!

 

Now you just need to move here.

 

I have two essential dates coming up in the near future - probably the only two I need to care about for the whole winter - and they're forecasting more than usual amounts (disrupting amounts) of snow for both.   :glare:  I'm not exactly sure what Plan B will be for the first.  I'm hopeful it's not needed.  I have some ideas for Plan B for the second, but that's because I can be more flexible with that one if we really have to.

[creekland]

I grew up on the Canadian border. In the winter my mom used to feed us fish from the lake that was caught by ice fishermen. It was a cheap way to feed the family.  You drove past the lake and there would be lake perch all skinned and ready for sale for almost nothing. 

There is a ferry boat that goes across Lake Champlain and it used to only run in the warm months because the lake froze so solidly that the ferry could not keep a channel open. At some point (in the late 1980s, I think) the ferry company bought an ice breaker and it was a huge giant big deal that the ferry could run all year long.  It made the news because they had to buy it from the USSR.  Or at least that is my memory of the story.

 

 

Now that lake doesn't freeze for years at a time. :sad: It did last year and it was a big deal. My kids had never seen it frozen. They had never seen shanties out on the lake.

 

 

Wow.  This makes me glad that I took hubby out on the ice back when we were early in our marriage.  We had gone to see my family and were headed back home across Lake Champlain (bridges).  He marveled at all the shanties and wondered what they were doing there.  I was amazed that my "southern boy" had never been on a body of water covered with ice.  I was driving.  ;)  We drove out on the ice, parked our car, got out and explored a little bit (not getting in the way of any of the fishermen, of course, but we did watch some).

 

I'm glad we took the time to do it!  (I'm still not sure how comfortable hubby was with driving on the lake, but it didn't bother me.  To me, ice fishing was normal and the only times to be wary are fall and spring when the ice isn't "certain.")

[LMV]

No, I worry that people who don't vaccinate will cause diseases that were very nearly eradicated to make a deadly comeback. I worry that people who are unable to receive vaccines and rely on herd immunity to protect them from illnesses will die because people who can vaccinate don't because they are misinformed/misguided.

 

Sadly, this. In reality, in the year 2015 and beyond, I'm afraid we have thinned the herd of herd immunity sufficiently that we will see an increasing number of vaccine preventable illness outbreaks. This concerns me as a mom with young children and as a physician. Our community has already buried children who have died from vaccine preventable illnesses (in the majority of these cases the children who died were too young to have been fully immunized).

[SparklyUnicorn]

No, I worry that people who don't vaccinate will cause diseases that were very nearly eradicated to make a deadly comeback. I worry that people who are unable to receive vaccines and rely on herd immunity to protect them from illnesses will die because people who can vaccinate don't because they are misinformed/misguided.

 

Yeah I really don't know why so many people have latched onto the anti vax idea.  Of course I understand it if there is any history of negative side affects, but I think things would be quite different without those vaccines.