Just a stage - or would preschool help?

[Linz1084]

Hello all - I don't think I've posted here before.  I have a boy who will be 4 in March, another boy who is 2.5, and will be adopting a child, probably to bring her home late summer, early fall.

 

All that said - my oldest is (and always has been) VERY clingy.  Like, at almost 4, still cries when I drop him off in his class at church (where he has gone every week of his life).  I signed him up for a sports sampler class and he refused to participate, but was basically clinging to my leg.  He refused to obey the teacher.  He would only participate if I basically did the same thing alongside him and coaxed him to do it.  I even bribed him!!  It was driving me mad.  This set off all sorts of warnings in my mind.  He won't obey another authority figure if I'm there.  I haven't figured out if this is an area that I need to push him in, or if this is an area where I need to just wait and let him mature in.  

 

My 2-year-old is complete opposite.  He was begging to join in the sports class and participated on his own more than his brother, despite the fact that he really wasn't supposed to be.  He's rarely cried in church, from the get-go.  Just very different kid and seeming much more secure and confident than my 3-year-old in new situations.

 

Not to mention, age 3 has me feeling insane.  I've been trying to work on the habits of attention and obedience, but the struggles I have with my 3-year-old in this area just baffle me.  I swear, the past 2 months or so, his disobedience skyrocketed and I'm wondering if I'm doing this parenting thing horribly wrong.  Which, even though we have planned it from the beginning, has me questioning if I should even attempt homeschooling next year.

 

So, all of this has be wondering if a two-day-a-week preschool would be good for him.  5 hours a week to be in a class with other kids, another adult?  My hubby isn't convinced.  He is very pro-homeschooling for a number of reasons, but he is not the one who is home, doing all of it.  I think I would push the idea of preschool a little bit - because I think it might be good for both of us and 5 hours isn't all that long... except for the possibility of bringing home a new (toddler) sibling in the fall.  I am concerned the combination of new sibling and leaving mom for the first time to go to school may not go over well... but I could also be over-thinking it.  I could also send BOTH boys to preschool (they will then be 3 and 4) and they could go together while I have alone time with the new girl, but I never thought I'd send a 3-year-old to preschool, even though I'm sure he would totally rock it.

 

I guess I'm looking for someone who has maybe been-there-done-that... if you had an especially clingy child - did it help or hurt?  Any other advice?  Is there another answer to my problem aside from sending him to preschool?  Is this a stage?  I somewhat doubt that it is... it is just he way he is.  He can hardly stand to be away from me for an hour during "quiet time".  He is just all a Mama's boy.  But I haven't even REALLY started homeschooling (aside from reading through all the booklists for preK) and I already feel exhausted.

 

Help?  

[Kiara.I]

I think a preschool would be very BAD for him, actually.

Clingy children aren't usually helped by being *pushed* to be not-clingy.  It usually works better to (as far as you're able) meet the need for staying close, and through the need being met, they outgrow it.  It just takes time...

 

As to obeying another authority figure, why should he?  You ARE the authority figure in his life.  With you there, why would he or should he do what someone else tells him?  Perfectly reasonable that he didn't, and I'm not sure what warning bells it's setting off for you?
 

Then there's obedience.  Three is an interesting age.  But I have NEVER met a fully obedient Three.  It's not really age-expected.  And of course there's the half-year disequilibrium that throws things for a loop, which may be what you're experiencing now.

[Kiara.I]

Oh, and don't worry about being exhausted and not even "really" homeschooling.  You don't need to really homeschool for another 2-3 years yet.  By which time your children will be in completely different stages, and it will be a very different dynamic.

[Lori D.]

Totally agree with Kiara, both about NOT pushing re: clinginess, and to NOT worry about starting ANY formal homeschooling until your oldest is age 5-6. Really, you will have enough on your plate next year with the adoption and everyone adapting to that huge change!! Just keep reading aloud, going on nature walks, doing some fun in-the-moment discovery and learning. It will give both DSs more time to mature and be developmentally ready for actual academics by waiting.

 

Our clingy firstborn (son) did not start to turn the corner some time after turning 5, and by age 6 was mostly beyond it. I stayed in Sunday school every week up until DS was about 5, and I don't regret it at all; it did NOT make DS more clingy, but rather gave him confidence having me there so that instead of having to use all of his emotional energies just trying to cope with being left, instead, he had emotional ability to reach out and play with the other children. Gentle, loving reassurance and encouragement in trying new things while mom or dad was there in the background was what seemed to best help him.

 

I have since read that sometimes clinginess in pre-school ages comes from high levels of intelligence, or a hyper-awareness  of all the possibilities of "what might happened", but that these children are too young to have the balancing factor of life experience to be able to learn coping skills. Take that or leave it, as you will. :)

 

JMO: especially since what is "normal" for your DS is about to turn upside down with the adoption, I would NOT force DS into situations to make him cope solo, but instead, really make him feel secure by including him and helping him see all the wonderful things he can do and how helpful he is as Big Brother to the 2yo and to the new DD.

 

Congratulations on the soon-to-be new family member! And enjoy your sweet almost 4yo; they grow up SO fast and then are gone and out on their own… Warmest regards, Lori D.

[OneStepAtATime]

Agree with the others.  Totally.  My clingy one is far more independent now.  She just needed more time.  Pushing her into pre-k didn't help.  Time and maturity did.  Same with disobedience/defiance.  Consistency, clearly laid out parameters and lots of patience, love and support got us through.  There were tough days (and sometimes still happen) but definitely time and maturity were a HUGE help.

 

But if you are exhausted and burned out, maybe you can have a homeschooled teen come over during the day a couple of times a week to spell you?  You could still be around and give lots of love and support but it wouldn't all be on your shoulders and if your other kids get used to her or him, then when the adoption goes through you would have someone else they (and you) trust to turn to on tough days, KWIM?  It is much easier to be loving, understanding and supportive of a clingy, "disobedient" 3 year old when you are not burned out and exhausted.

[Aiden]

No advice, just hugs. It sounds like your 3yo ds is similar to my 4yo dd. We considered sending her to preschool for the social aspects but decided against it; we think it would be more harmful than helpful for her, and when I ask her if she'd like to go, she's adamantly against the idea. She gets too upset at being away from us, and she seems to have some social anxiety as well--even when we're there, she clings to us rather than playing with the other kids unless she's had a long time to watch them and get to "know" them without being vulnerable. Unless a child is very extroverted and pursues her attention, she'll sit on the sidelines for a full year and watch before finally deciding that one or two kids are nice and are her friends.

 

It is exhausting. I get a break during the day by insisting on quiet rest time in her room--and she's mostly ok with that because it's such a familiar place and because I've proven to her that I can see and hear her through the video baby monitor--but I don't have younger children.

 

I'm hoping with you that our children mature out of it like previous posters' kids did!

[kiwik]

I was that clingy child. We went to a counselor , I hated it, my mother explained what I had to do, I did it and the counselor pronounced me cured. I learnt how to pretend but not how to deal with whatever the problem was or what it was. I developed anxiety then later depression (no proof of causation).

 

Institute a quiet time but don't force him into a situation he can't cope with. Send the younger one if you think he would enjoy it though. Kids are not natuarally obedient - if it is a major problem maybe you have too many rules or your management style doesn't work for him. (Have you ever had a boss who was good for others but drove you crazy?).

[Tanikit]

He's your oldest and everything and every stage will be new with him. My eldest was clingy too - she did go to preschool for about 9 months (she was 3) and she cried every morning I left her there though she did make friends. She remained clingy through the 4s (would not attend any outside classes without me remaining in the room with her, though we did eventually get Sunday School right) and started improving at 5 and by 6 she was quite happy to leave me and now at 7 loves to be independent. My youngest is now nearly 4 and I know better how to handle some of the things that were more difficult with my older child.

 

Hang in there. Each stage will come with its own challenges. I would say just wait - you are his security right now. He needs to feel secure in your love and know you will always be there for him and then it will become easier to listen to other authority. If you are there just say: that person is in charge - he said you/we must.... so we must do what he/she says. Even if you have to repeat everything its fine. He is not facing a future of defying all authority - if he listens to you he is listening to the greatest authority in his life right now. 

 

I don't think sending him to school would necessarily help. Maybe getting him into an activity where there are other children and you can be there too might be useful - preferably an activity where he gets to move around a lot since the enjoyment of these activities can foster some amount of independence even if you have to be right there with him. 

 

 

[wintermom]

Agreeing as well with the others regarding clingy children. My dd need more time. What worked well for us was to wait until the next sibling was old enough, then put them into structured classes together. 

[ktgrok]

I would NOT put him in preschool, and would stop making him go to the church class if he cries. Have him sit with you and color, play with a small felt board, etc. My oldest was the same way, and it was totally developmental. By the time he was 6 he went to kindergarten with zero tears. Before that you couldn't peel him off of me. I just had to be patient. My second is the opposite, and loves strangers, loves to go play, etc. My third is inbetween. 

 

Please don't force him. He's only a baby still. There is nothing that important he has to be away from you for. And it isn't your parenting, it's him. 

[Garga]

Don't send him to preschool.  There's no need to make him miserable.  I made my oldest go to preschool for 2 years. Each and every morning he was miserable.  When I picked him up, he was laughing and happy.  The next morning I'd remind him how happy he was at the end of class, but he'd still be miserable each and every morning that he went.  It was so draining to force him to go to something when he was clearly miserable to go.  And then it was confusing for him to be so happy by the time preschool was over.  

 

With my next son, we went through it all over again.  Each and every morning he'd beg me not to go, tears and all, but when I picked him up he was fine, but still the begging not to go the next day.  I was worn out and gave up.  After only 2 months of listening to my second son cry about preschool, I stopped making him go.  Nothing bad happened.  They're 9 and 12 now and not clingy.  I wish I'd stopped making them both go right away instead of putting us all through the wringer over preschool.  Ugh.

 

He'll outgrow the clinginess.  No one cares that he's clingy, so don't feel embarrassed by it.  There's nothing wrong with him.  Some are clingy, some aren't.  He won't be hiding behind your leg when he enters high school.  He won't.  It's just a stage.

 

Don't worry about how you'll possibly homeschool yet.  You've got a long ways to go.  Sure, you may do preschool activities at home soon, but that's not like full-on homeschool doing chemistry and geometry.  You build up to that.  If you're careful, at this age he'll barely register that it's "school."  It'll just be games and activities with mom.  (Be careful not to push reading.  There are a bazillion kids who read early and an equally bazillion who don't get it until the middle of 1st grade--that's at 6.5 or 7 years old.  Don't push the reading.  That's the one thing that many homeschoolers try to do early and it frustrates everyone.  If he's ready, fine.  If not, fine.)

 

Disobedience?  Check.  I remember those days.  People talked about the terrible twos, but they were the terrible threes for me.  For my oldest I can remember going months and months where we rarely had a positive interaction.  Each and every interaction was a fight in some way.  He just did NOT want to do what I asked of him, and it seemed that nothing I did made a difference.  I didn't expect perfect first-time obedience or anything like that.  He was bent and determined to do the exact opposite of anything I said no matter what it was.  "That's a nice red wagon!"  "It's not red!  It's not nice!  Wagons are yucky!"  Ay yi yi.  

 

(ETA:  My defiant little 3 year old is 12 now and is respectful and kind and listens to what I say even when he clearly doesn't want to, but knows it's important.  It was just a stage.  He's past it now.  He's a great kid.  No troubles with him being defiant and terrorizing the house.  I mean, I did work with him and try my best to mold him into a decent human and it worked.  It's not like I just let him be horrible to everyone, so there's hope for you.  With some working on him and working on me, he's a great kid now.  Back then, I was pretty worried!)

 

You can start another thread for advice about teaching attention and how to listen to his mom because that's a huuuugely complex topic!

[73349]

Some really good parenting advice I once heard was, "When your kids cling to you, cling right back."

 

Let him mature. He will do it sooner if he feels more secure. Keep quiet time interesting (rotate books/toys) and praise him for his efforts.

[Alice]

Agree with the others. My oldest was that clingy child. I started teaching Sunday School weekly because that was the only way he would go to class. He loved to swim so I signed him up for swim lessons when he was three because I thought it would be good for him to try having a teacher other than me.  He refused to participate the first week and the second week calmly told me "I don't know why you are putting my swimsuit on. I'm not getting in the water." 

 

Now? He's eleven. He's our most independent child. He went to camp at age 8 knowing no one, totally on his own (and by his own choice). He went on a week-long trip last year to Puerto Rico with his aunt and didn't miss us a bit (by all accounts). And he's a year round swimmer. :)

 

He's an introvert still and takes time to warm up to people. He doesn't love public speaking (neither do I) and has a small circle of close buddies instead of being really social. But he also loves the Acting class at our co-op and has the major speaking role in his Odyssey of the Mind team performance. 

 

All that said, I think there is something for letting kids take their own time to get to where they need to be. I think the years of being allowed to be clingy and knowing that he had a secure base made it easier for him to launch when he was ready. Not to say, it wasn't frustrating at times. I can remember feeling like maybe I was a failure or somehow harming him (and there are all the people making snide comments about Mama's boys to deal with). 

 

I'll also add that for both my boys age three was way worse than two. I hear the same thing from lots of parents. Three is all about saying no. You say the sky is blue, they swear it's not. You say ice cream is yummy, they counter that it is gross. Etc. It gets better at four. :)

[AHASRADA]

It may sound simplistic, but the old adage, "He won't still be in diapers in high school, will he?" told to the parent of a late potty trainer, or something similar applies to many aspects of childhood. Kids will outgrow all of their childhood behaviors at some point. You can try to hurry the process along if the fallout is worth the perceived benefit, but really, its best and easiest to let these things work themselves out naturally, with guidance and support, of course. I Assure you he won't be clinging to your leg as a teen :)

[SarahW]

Are the brothers close? Do they play together? Watch out for eachother?

 

 

My 8yo was very clingy at 3. But when I dropped him off at preschool with a cousin he was close to, he couldn't wait to kiss me bye and make a beeline for the rug where he and his cousin played.

 

 

Your boys may love the chance to hang out together and play with different toys. Just a thought.

[barnwife]

I don't post often, but here goes...Our oldest is 4.5. He was very, very clingy as a baby. I remember when he was almost 2, FIL came to visit for a long weekend. At the end of the visit, just before he got in the car to go home, DS finally allowed FIL to hold him long enough for FIL to walk halfway around the outside of our house before he started to scream for me. So he way away from me for about 1-2 minutes before he started screaming...and that was amazing progress for him.

Now at 4.5, he is no longer that clingy. I am so glad he was our first and I was able to give him that constant attention. However, I will be the first to admit that it was hard, really, really hard. 

I don't think that putting in in preschool would have helped. In some ways, I think it would have backfired. 

I don't know why people talk about terrible twos. Around here it's trying threes and fearsome fours. (And DD is about to turn 3 - yikes!)

Basically, I agree with pp. Keep him at home. He will mature and not be so clingy on his own schedule.

As far as obedience, that's a work in progress here. So all I can say is that when I am consistent, there is more obedience in our household. And, reiterating a pp, mom/dad are the authority figures at this age. 

[Rachel]

Joining the chorus here. My 7 year old was and is quite clingy sometimes even in very familiar situations. He is starting to outgrow it now but he doesn't like to try new things at all. I don't think preschool would help, I think it would just add more frustration to your life when you drop him off each time.

 

One thing that has helped us some is role playing before new situations. My son LOVES to sing and we knew would enjoy being in choir that required an audition. We practiced what the audition might be like many, many times. I also had my husband take him to the audition. While our son is clingy with both of us, I am more sensitive to it because I have a similar personality. Much to our surprise, he did that audition like he did them every day. I fully expected him to cry and hold onto my husband's leg and refuse to sing. The role playing really helped. It might not help with Sunday school but it might help in other situations. Hang in there, I suspect your son will start to outgrow this soon.

[bolt.]

With kids who have higher a need for touch, comfort and presence of parents, most ideas that aim to 'reduce the need' tend to backfire because the need remains the same, it's just that you would be 'reducing' how well it gets met. When you reduce how well a need gets met, what usually happens is that the feeling-of-need becomes more intense -- so the behaviours become more intense.

 

Waiting works, but if you want a strategy that might help you could try:

 

Think of it in baby steps. See how long he can (currently) go between being 'totally topped up' with affection, and his return to seek more affection. Or the amount of time you can step out of a room or turn your back, while he is home and comfortable.

 

Begin to consciously time that, then, strategically 'stretch' the times just a little, and conclude it with a big snuggle fest. Create the pattern of cozy - fine alone - a little lonely - but a great reconnection.

 

Do not create a pattern that 'a little lonely' usually leads to 'catastrophically lonely' or he will panic at 'a little lonely'. Convince him instead that 'a little lonely' will probably be fine in a moment. Then he will be calm through the 'a little lonely' phase because he is expecting it to end soon and well.

 

Meet his needs pro-actively and regularly because *you* anticipate them -- not because he needs to be 'in charge' of using his own skills to keep things feeling ok. His skills include whining and clinging as primary strategies. Those are not fun. Hug and cuddle him because you choose to, not because he demands it. This will lead to him using those 'demand' strategies less often (because he doesn't need them) and hopefully getting him out if the habit. It encourages him to relax and trust that he doesn't need to be so watchful, so worried that he will find himself 'catastrophically lonely' -- the stress and worry are what leads a child to not want the parent to even step a foot away from them.

 

Also, please realize/notice that 'catastrophically lonely' is a very real and very intense feeling. Just because he is small doesn't mean his feelings are small in proportion. The opposite is true. Because he is so small and has so few coping skills, intense feelings are incredibly overwhelming.

 

It's not that he feels it every time you step away, it's that he anticipates the possibility that if 'the first step' happens, the whole situation might indeed snowball to that level. The anticipation can make his reaction to small triggers much worse -- a sort of pre-feeling the feeling that he fears.

 

That's why there is strategy in convincing him that it isn't so.

[kiwik]

I just wanted to add. Neither of my kids are clingy - financial necessity meant daycare from 6 months. Both still needed me to do new activities with them for several weeks every time. Ds5 didn't get on the soccer field until 30 seconds before the end of the first game this year. He also claimed he wasn't going in the Christmas play right up until the last moment. Pushing makes it worse. I find if I don't push or stress, just reassure and accept they are far more likely to give something a try.

[duckens]

 

  People talked about the terrible twos, but they were the terrible threes for me.

 

 

I'll also add that for both my boys age three was way worse than two.

As my neighbor lady used to say, "Three is just Terrible Twos with a year of practice."  :)