Not Sure About CLE

[Paige]

I switched some of my kids to CLE for Language Arts and one to CLE for math. For the most part, they like it, but I'm not impressed so far. I've heard CLE is rigorous and advanced but it seems very easy to me and I think that's why my kids like it. In the phonics sections, for example, it will have a box with example words illustrating the phoneme, and then directly under that, the example words are used in the questions asking which words have that phoneme! Stuff like this happens repeatedly. The sentences are not challenging and borderline on extremely obvious- like you'd have to try to get stuff wrong. My kids are in the levels they tested into and are learning appropriate information, but I am suspicious that a good performance will not necessarily indicate real learning because of how easy it seems to me. In math, I have yet to see anything that looks designed to be challenging. It's all very straight forward. We are only in the 2nd light units. Does it get better? I'm so torn because my kids like it and are apparently doing well and overall CLE gets good reviews, so maybe I should trust their method. On the other hand, it's not at all what I'm used to and I fear that it is not challenging enough and can lead to false confidence.

 

We had been using MM for math for the one child and MCT and KISS for LA/Grammar. I like them and still use them for some of my kids but others were not doing well. Please reassure me! Or not...

[OneStepAtATime]

The beauty of CLE (and the curse if students are in material that is too basic) is that it builds up in steps with lots of review so it starts out with lots of review, builds a few steps, more review, etc. until it has ramped up quite a bit.  The goal is to make sure the student is really solid on each thing as they continue progressing in each thing, so they aren't guessing and developing bad habits.  You can cut out some things if you feel it is too basic for them.  We started with a level that was really a bit basic, so I consolidated the early light units, and we pushed through pretty quickly but it did ramp up into things that we had to slow down on fairly quickly.  Now I cut out stuff as needed and add in additional practice where needed.  

[3girls4me]

What grades? I like cle math for all grades but don't like language arts until 3rd. We just ditched the language arts and reading level 1 are doing rod and staff English 2. And bju reading 3. we will likely return to cle at least for reading in 3rd grade. But I like rod and staff better for grammar I think.

[Meadowlark]

After our switch from Singapore to CLE math, I felt the same way. I saw my son going from really thinking, analyzing and problem solving, to easily writing down the obvious answers. He loved it because it was so straightforward and easy compared to Singapore. We eventually left CLE for our main program (still searching for that perfect math place!) but we use the LU's for the speed drills and review/flashcard stuff. I wondered too about the higher levels but the 200's unimpressed me.

[Korrale]

What grades are you using?

Thus far we have done grade one and some grade two. This is specifically pertaining to math. Each grade starts off super easy. I actually skip the first light unit in math as it is just review of the previous year after the summer break. But even the first few units past that are pretty simple. But half way through the year it is really quite rigorous. I know quite a few children start CLE Math100 in kinder and then don't finish it until the end of first grade.

What we were able to do was do 2 lessons a day. We completed first grade in about 3 months. We also did Singapore Math 1a, 1b, 2a and 2b in that time. I found CLE math much more rigorous.

[Paige]

We're doing LA 2nd, Math 3rd, and Reading 5th. The 5th grade seems ok, but I still feel the questions are leading. My kids aren't savvy enough to pick up on it yet, but I see it and don't like it. The 3rd grade is LA and Math. I didn't buy the first LU of any subject because I read they were reviews. I'll pull out the last Math LU and see what the last word problems look like. But seriously, I think my 2nd grader could easily have done the word problems I've seen in the 3rd grade math light units last year. 

[Korrale]

If you do feel that it is all too easy you could just bump them up to the first light unit of the next grade. They would then review everything and move on.

 

The reason they also have all the boxed information first is that is the lesson. It is often a spelling rule. The child is to read the lesson, as short as it is, and then apply the knowledge. The things in the box are reinforced 5 times before they are quizzed or tested on them. Which inherently makes the quizzes and tests a breeze. Eventually the boxed information is removed, but by then the child should know the rule.

[MeAndTheBoys]

**ETA--ONLY the Math first lightunits are review.  Don't skip the first lightunits in Reading, LA, Bible, Science or Social Studies :)  And my boys love to do the first math lightunits because it eases them into a new year with all "old stuff"--but you can skip the Math first lightunits.**

 

CLE gets harder, at least in my opinion.  We have used Math since level 100; one child finished 700 last year and moved into Saxon Algebra; one is in Math 500 and one in 100 now.  The math ramps up in Grade 4, but it does still kind of "fool" you a bit because it teaches things in such tiny bits that it seems very easy, and then it reviews in tiny chunks.

 

The word problems get more complex in about 5th grade.

 

We have used Reading from 100 up through 500- and 700 this year.  Again, it was easy through about 500--and now the questions are very complex.  My boys used to love reading because it was so easy; now they complain that they have to "think too hard"--and sometimes I struggle with the questions.  But when I read the answer key and see where they were going, I am impressed with the analysis they are working through.  Not leading questions at all.

 

We have only used their LA for 1 1/2 years--my older boys started in 400 and 500, and are in 500 and 600 now.  It is a very traditional, challenging program--I am having to review all kinds of things I only learned in high school grammar, like participles and antecedents and all the technical work of diagramming.  They like LA though; it is fairly logical like math, so it goes well.  And the spelling is easy to use and they like the way it is divided into subject categories.  I am using LA 100 with my youngest, and I haven't used 100, 200 or 300 before--and I will say, it is VERY simplified.  It is kicked up in 400, but I don't know where the change happens since I haven't done the younger levels--but 100 is kind of a joke--but my 6 year old loves it because he can do so well in it without a lot of effort.  And really, he has learned a lot in the 2 months we've done it--consonants and vowels, capitals and periods, double "ll", "ss", "zz" and "ff" at the end of words--it has been taught gently and easily, but it has covered interesting things.

 

My opinion on CLE, having used it for 8 years, is that they start out slow and gentle and sweet, from 100-300 levels.  But it is thorough, just not intense and overly challenging.  Starting in about late 200 or 300, it becomes more independent--  And then in 400, it becomes somewhat advanced.  It does not seem to be advanced in 100-300.  But always, even in the upper levels we have done, it is sweet and tries to make it seem friendly and gentle.

 

But obviously, it isn't for everyone--it doesn't push the feeling of intensity and intellectualism of Singapore or other programs. 

 

We do standardized tests every year, and my boys have done VERY well on them every time.  So the material is being covered on a comparable level to whatever the supposed "standard" level is.

 

JMO--

B

[SnMomof7]

CLE LA 6 is killing me! I don't know enough grammar MYSELF to help DD with it. She did great for 4 and 5 though.

[MeAndTheBoys]

CLE LA 6 is killing me! I don't know enough grammar MYSELF to help DD with it. She did great for 4 and 5 though.

 

Yeah, 6 is tough--my oldest is in that.  I'm pretty sure we will stop after LA 800.  We use My Father's World for our "core" and they do a lot of literature and writing in high school, so I don't think we will do any/much additional grammar (CLE has some kind of "English" in high school).

 

I know my CLE 600 is covering the same stuff I covered in high school grammar--

 

B--

[Storygirl]

For people using LA 600, take heart. Those sections where they have to mark up sentences a million different ways (put parentheses around the prepositions, label all the adjectives, underline the subject once and verb twice, etc.) were a bear, but there is less of that in level 700. And the sections like that in 700 seem to have fewer simultaneous things to do.

 

I'm not saying that 700 is easier in other ways, but these particular problems seem to be less of an issue in seventh grade. I thought we were going to have to ditch CLE and switch to something else, but things seem to have turned a corner this year.

[JessReplanted]

CLE LA 6 is killing me! I don't know enough grammar MYSELF to help DD with it. She did great for 4 and 5 though.

 

I am so relieved that I'm not the only one who feels this way. We are muddling our way through it.

[Jasperstone]

Oh no. I thought LA Grade 5 was hard! I loved it until then.

 

Still love their maths though.

[SnMomof7]

LA 5 had some tricky places, but 6!

 

I'm ordering a copy of the course today for ME to do (along with the extra diagramming worksheets), maybe DD and I can muddle through, together.

 

For reference, she was pulling low 90s in the 500s, low 80s in the 600s.

[SnMomof7]

I l

[SnMomof7]

Whoops! I love all the math we've done, and Bible is really good as well, particularly in 3rd -6th, but the lower grades are sweet as well.

[Punks in Ontario]

You guys are making me feel better.  My youngest ds's marks have dropped 10-15% in level 6.  I've just decided to slow down a bit and do more oral review with him.  He's finally gotten over 80% two quizzes in a row.

 

And we enjoy the Bible as well.

[JessReplanted]

LA 5 had some tricky places, but 6!

 

I'm ordering a copy of the course today for ME to do (along with the extra diagramming worksheets), maybe DD and I can muddle through, together.

 

For reference, she was pulling low 90s in the 500s, low 80s in the 600s.

 

I have had to learn alongside of my 6th grader. And this is our first year using CLE for Language, which I think really put us behind.

 

I also printed him out an Adverb paper (saying how they are used), and a list of prepositions, and I let him use these sheets for tests and quizzes. It's not ideal, but it's where we are, and I know that he's learning.

 

[KeriJ]

I have had to learn alongside of my 6th grader. And this is our first year using CLE for Language, which I think really put us behind.

 

I also printed him out an Adverb paper (saying how they are used), and a list of prepositions, and I let him use these sheets for tests and quizzes. It's not ideal, but it's where we are, and I know that he's learning.

 

 

Jess, did you feel that there was difficulty going from R&S to CLE?  I can't remember if you used something else in between or what level of R&S you used.

[abrightmom]

:lurk5:  Listening in. Looking at CLE LA. CtGE is so-so for us (layout is the pits and bogs me down) but I think CLE LA 6 looks way too tough and I don't want to slog. Blah blah blah. Mostly, I just want to hear answers to Keri's questions. Hushing now. 

[Whereneverever]

CLE felt like it started really slowly and gently and has significantly ramped up. I like it. 

[Veritaserum]

We've only used the math extensively (100 to 700). It gets more advanced as you move through the levels. CLE works beautifully for my kids who need something introduced in small, bite-sized, and friendly pieces. It's not a good fit for my intuitive leapers. :)

[Mommy22alyns]

The early grades of math might seem easy, but the girls have always tested well when I give them diagnostic tests for other curricula.  I have used 100-currently in 600.  I plan to switch Rebecca to Saxon Algebra 1/2 next year, but I love CLE so much I wish I didn't have to switch.  I just don't want 2 years of pre-algebra.  I should also say that CLE saved math for Rebecca.  She went from hating math and thinking she was horrible at it, to loving it and feeling confident.  We switched partway through 2nd grade from RS and had previously used Singapore (which was a bomb here).

 

I used LA 100 with Sylvia and didn't really care for it much, so I went to R&S for her as well as Rebecca.

 

Reading 2-3, I didn't love, but I think it teaches a lot of valuable skills in 4 and up.

 

Haven't used anything else.

[mom31257]

Ds is in LA 5, so you all are making me nervous about LA 6! 

 

I switched ds to LA, math, and reading this year, and I am really liking it. I feel he is accomplishing so much. I plan to continue reading through 8th, LA through 9th, and math through 7th or 8th. I haven't picked which high school math series I want to use with ds.

 

I tried a little of it in lower grades, but I didn't like it nearly as much for those grades as these now. 

 

 

 

[Veritaserum]

The early grades of math might seem easy, but the girls have always tested well when I give them diagnostic tests for other curricula. I have used 100-currently in 600. I plan to switch Rebecca to Saxon Algebra 1/2 next year, but I love CLE so much I wish I didn't have to switch. I just don't want 2 years of pre-algebra. I should also say that CLE saved math for Rebecca. She went from hating math and thinking she was horrible at it, to loving it and feeling confident. We switched partway through 2nd grade from RS and had previously used Singapore (which was a bomb here).

 

I used LA 100 with Sylvia and didn't really care for it much, so I went to R&S for her as well as Rebecca.

 

Reading 2-3, I didn't love, but I think it teaches a lot of valuable skills in 4 and up.

 

Haven't used anything else.

I looked at the scope and sequence and decided that dd12 needed 700. I plan to test her for Saxon placement after this level of CLE. I think she will be ready for regular algebra. I wish Sunrise math continued all the way through calculus. The format is so perfect for her.