Lessons Learned

[Teachin'Mine]

I did a quick search but can't find the thread I'm looking for, so if there is a current one, please just add this post to that. 

 

Thought it might be good to share some of our insights to help those applying this year.  These may or may not apply to other students in their particular application situations ...

 

When writing the guidance letter don't worry about "bragging" and state the accomplishments even if you think it's obvious from transcripts, letters of rec., etc..  I think I tried to point out any flaws to help the reader understand that all info given was honest and accurate, but in so doing neglected to highlight the obvious accomplishments.

 

I remember reading here that having test scores in the 75% plus was helpful for merit aid. What we found is that for highly selective colleges, it's a good rule of thumb just for gaining admission.  For schools which admit a high percentage of applicants this would likely be less critical.

 

If there's anything which you think would have the reader questioning, give an explanation.  You don't want to be thinking latter "Why didn't I mention ..."   Ugh.

 

Run the net price calculators on all colleges before applying!  'Nuf said.  lol

 

Some colleges which look like safeties may not be because they may assume you will get into more selective colleges and they are in fact a safety and admitting you will hurt their yield.   Many of these colleges need the student to show honest interest.  Obviously if the student isn't honestly interested, then it isn't a true safety.

 

Help the recommendation writers with getting the thing through the darn common application.  I thought they'd have worked out the kinks by now, but I see this year's applicants are having some of the same problems.

 

Those are the ones I can think of now.   Please post what you learned whether it was last year or several years ago. 

 

Wishing this year's applicants all the best!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[bugs]

Thank you! Do I say "great" list?

[Teachin'Mine]

Thank you, but it's a rather short list.  I was hoping others would contribute their own experiences.  I don't think it's possible to do homeschooling or the role of a guidance counselor perfectly, so I'm sure I'm not the only one who became aware of things which could have been done better or differently.  Any honest high school counselor would admit the same as each student is so different and they can't possibly give the total attention they'd like to each one.  I suppose that if we had aimed lower and dd had been accepted everywhere she applied, then I wouldn't have second guessed what I did.  But for my student and our needs, that would not have been the right approach.  

 

Still hoping others will share what they've learned. 

[Kareni]

Other things I can recall learning along the way:

 

Some schools will not give merit aid if the FAFSA has not been submitted.

 

Don't forget to submit the mid-year report to the colleges to which your child has applied.

 

Some schools will decrease their own aid to a student if the student wins an outside scholarship.

 

Regards,

Kareni

[elegantlion]

My lesson learned (still learning) is that if you have any hint that your dc may graduate early, keep detailed records of 8th grade work. Because of our unique life situation, ds will probably graduate this year instead of next. Thankfully, his 8th grade work was enough to call high school level, but I had to go back and figure grades for two of the classes. That was fun, at least all of the work was in one box. 

[regentrude]

The one thing that surprised me was how little merit aid some public schools give even if the student has great stats that places the student at the upper end of the test scores for this school and is a National Merit scholar. Even with winning the highest scholarship offered by the institution, a certain out of state public university ended up being more expensive than several top tier highly selective private schools who do not give any merit aid at all.

 

And National Merit was totally overrated.. looks great on the transcript, but was not the huge financial advantage some people claim it is.The school gave 2k, and in turn cut the subsidized Stafford loans by that amount.

 

 

 

[8filltheheart]

We learned to look closely at schools' merit awards and honors programs. We also found that most schools were willing to accept Ds's DE credit from regional universities.

[Hoggirl]

The one thing that surprised me was how little merit aid some public schools give even if the student has great stats that places the student at the upper end of the test scores for this school and is a National Merit scholar. Even with winning the highest scholarship offered by the institution, a certain out of state public university ended up being more expensive than several top tier highly selective private schools who do not give any merit aid at all.

 

And National Merit was totally overrated.. looks great on the transcript, but was not the huge financial advantage some people claim it is.The school gave 2k, and in turn cut the subsidized Stafford loans by that amount.

I will just say that this depends on the schools one is considering. National Merit would have reaped large merit rewards at all of ds's safeties (all SEC schools). I know some folks have issues with attending schools in the South, but several of these *do* reward National Merit in a substantial way. Ds did not choose one of those, but that opportunity *was* there. He did receive a NM Scholar award of $2,500 directly from the National Merit Scholarship Corporation. So, like Regentrude, it didn't amount to much based on his ultimate decision. But it *could* have had he chosen differently.

[Hoggirl]

Other things I can recall learning along the way:

 

Some schools will not give merit aid if the FAFSA has not been submitted.

 

Don't forget to submit the mid-year report to the colleges to which your child has applied.

 

Some schools will decrease their own aid to a student if the student wins an outside scholarship.

 

Regards,

Kareni

This was not the case at ANY of the schools (some private, some public) where ds received merit aid. The point being - call and find out!!! Interestingly, we needed to file the FAFSA for our state's $2,000 lottery scholarship, but it was NOT required for the the large $10,000 per year scholarship from our state's department of higher ed. Go figure.

[creekland]

Agreed on National Merit.  Whether or not it gives one great financial benefits totally depends upon the school one will be attending.  Some will give free tuition  (sometimes more), others nothing.  Then there are tons in between.  It can definitely help with acceptance.

 

Schools differ in their aid.  Some are well known for meeting need (usually including basic federal loans, but not always).  Some are well known for good merit aid for high stats.  It can pay off to do research on any school one is interested in.

 

And for some states (PA tends to be one of them), high stat students can often get as good or better deals from private schools than our "big" public schools.  It's worth trying some (do check on how they do with aid as some are not so good with any aid).

 

School A is NOT equal to School B in content even if the class or major name is the same.  It's worth it to see where recent grads in the desired major have gone or gotten employment.  Some schools turn employers OFF and some turn them ON.  Which do which is not necessarily connected to any Top Whatever list.

 

If heading pre-med, be certain NOT to be overmatched at a school.  This is not a time where one wants to go to their reach school if they are barely getting in.  (It's ok if the reach school is a "lottery" (highly selective) school where the student's stats match everyone else.)  One can get into med school from pretty much any accredited college, but one needs a high GPA.  It's helpful to be in the top 75% stats wise for this.  I've seen many (from our school) get discouraged when they get overmatched.  Those who go where they fit do quite well.  Don't feel the student needs to be undermatched either.  If they go to a school where they are way higher than stats, kids often get really bored and wonder what all the hype of college is all about.

[Catherine]

This won't help many of you, but it might reach someone out there. When my ds took the PSAT, he did not indicate that he was not going to college the following year. He was spending the year between junior and senior year in Germany as an exchange student. For that reason, he was not able to use his qualifying score to apply to be a NM finalist. You must be attending college the following year if you are going to apply. He actually registered and took the PSAT again in Germany, but the qualifying cutoff is a bit higher for European students than in our home state, and he only received a commended letter. I didn't realize there was a way for students to indicate on the PSAT forms that they were deferring a year.

[Teachin'Mine]

Catherine that must have been so frustrating for both of you.  I've never seen this issue addressed before and hopefully you've helped another gap year student.  Thank you to all for sharing what you've learned.

[8filltheheart]

I can't believe I forgot to post this, but a HUGE thing we learned was to interview depts. Make appts to talk with the dean and the undergrad advisor in a dept. Ask to sit in on some classes. If you are interested in research, ask about undergrad opportunities. If interested in grad school, ask where their undergrads have gone to grad school.

 

We were horrified by one dept. Neither the dean nor the undergrad advisor knew where any students went to grad school and it was a small dept (40 students total, 10/yr.). The undergrad advisor said his,profs were too busy to take on undergrads for research. And, the undergrad advisor went off on a unprofessional rant about AP Scholars and NMS who were a dime a dozen and didn't know how to think and ranted that ds needed to slow down and learn material. (He didn't know anything about ds.)

 

Anyway, dept interviews can really be eye opening and give a completely different perspective than simple reading of websites or general campus tours.

 

Another one I forgot to mention is to check and see if a dept has special scholarships. Some depts do offer entering freshman scholarships. Some have competitions for high school sr's to earn scholarship $$, etc. Which leads to one other idea, stacking of scholarships. Some universities let student stack scholarships and some don't. Some scholarship money simply reduces institutional aid/grants which means that there is no net gain. Others do allow stacking.

 

Oh and that leads to one other thought. Some scholarships are worded cost of tuition and some are worded as fixed amts. pay attention to how much their tuition has increased per yr over the last decade bc those costs will end up being yours. Also pay attention to the GPA requirements for maintaining th scholarship money.

[Teachin'Mine]

8 you reminded me of a college visit we had done.  It was one of those open house days with the opportunity to visit specific departments and speak with the faculty.  After one of the students, a senior majoring in the department, spoke and was clearly not thrilled with the lack of attention he was receiving from his advisor in his department, the dean or chair of the department suggested that he speak with his advisor.  The student reminded him that he was his advisor.  lol  I wonder how many of those in attendance followed through with their applications. 

[Hoggirl]

This won't help many of you, but it might reach someone out there. When my ds took the PSAT, he did not indicate that he was not going to college the following year. He was spending the year between junior and senior year in Germany as an exchange student. For that reason, he was not able to use his qualifying score to apply to be a NM finalist. You must be attending college the following year if you are going to apply. He actually registered and took the PSAT again in Germany, but the qualifying cutoff is a bit higher for European students than in our home state, and he only received a commended letter. I didn't realize there was a way for students to indicate on the PSAT forms that they were deferring a year.

Ugh. I have a friend who I fear was unaware of this. I don't even know if her son knew he was going to take the gap year (he's in a Rotary exchange program in Japan) at the time he took it. I have no idea what the timeline is for that program. Gosh. Now I'm afraid to even ask her. Hope the GC at the school knew to do this.

[regentrude]

I will just say that this depends on the schools one is considering. National Merit would have reaped large merit rewards at all of ds's safeties (all SEC schools). I know some folks have issues with attending schools in the South, but several of these *do* reward National Merit in a substantial way. Ds did not choose one of those, but that opportunity *was* there. He did receive a NM Scholar award of $2,500 directly from the National Merit Scholarship Corporation. So, like Regentrude, it didn't amount to much based on his ultimate decision. But it *could* have had he chosen differently.

 

If my memory serves me right, the information about the exact amount of the National Merit scholarship was available not until after the choice of school had been made - except for generic info from schools who have blanket policies like in state tuition for every finalist, or something like this.

[Hoggirl]

If my memory serves me right, the information about the exact amount of the National Merit scholarship was available not until after the choice of school had been made - except for generic info from schools who have blanket policies like in state tuition for every finalist, or something like this.

Sorry, I am not understanding what you are saying??? The generic info/blanket policies are the ones that yield the most money. Arkansas awards $10,000 per year for National Merit Finalists. You have a deadline by which you have to choose them (or any other school as your first choice school), but it is a known amount. Alabama provided full out-of-state tuition for five years, housing for the freshman year, an iPad, a stipend, and $2,000 for study abroad. Ole Miss' was a bit more convoluted to figure out (had to call a couple of time before I "got" it), but worked out to full tuition and housing (not meals) for four years.

 

There is a cap on the "official" National Merit Scholarship award - I *think* it's that one-time $2,500? Or the schools can set it at an amount of maybe $2,000 per year? I really dont' remember!! Old and crazy! But there is a limit as to what is "official." The rest is deemed by the schools who give large awards to be an "unofficial" National Merit award. Most schools will label whatever that capped amount is as the "official" part. This is so that students can be named National Merit Scholars. The only way one gets that label is to receive that one-time award from the National Merit Corporation itself, a corporate-sponsored award, or through an "official" scholarship given by a university. So, most school designate a portion of the award (if it is > the cap) as "official" so students can claim that title. Perhaps you are saying that some schools do not advertise National Merit awards? Probably because if they are not significant.

 

Anyway, it is those blanket awards that CAN add up to significant dollar amounts for National Merit Finalists. A lot of the higher ranked schools give nothing for National Merit. Ds's doesn't. So, if he had not received that one-time award from the National Merit Scholarship Corporation itself, you are 100% correct - it would have yielded him nothing. But I do think it is incorrect to state that obtaining National Merit Finalist doesn't amount to much of anything or that it is overrated. It certainly can if one is willing to attend a less prestigious school. That is the goal of those schools, IME - to poach top students away from higher-priced alternativies.

 

I should also add that my perspective comes from a place of not qualifying for ANY financial aid. So for US, there was a HUGE difference in cost for one of those "lesser" schools that offered a large National Merit package and those for which we had to pay full freight because no merit aid of any type was offered.

[Teachin'Mine]

Another thing we learned is that "required" items for admission may become optional with a simple phone call.  I should have called schools, as the guidance counselor, but didn't as I felt strongly that contact should be made by the student.  Unfortunately said student was extremely busy with a very heavy academic load, ECs, etc. and on top of that applications to colleges and scholarship programs.   The number of essays she wrote was staggering.   Definitely in contrast to students who wrote a dozen or so and polished them over weeks of writing, analyzing and professional critiquing.  So maybe the lesson learned is that less is more?  But if she hadn't applied so broadly she'd never have ended up with the great options she had.  So not sure what we could have done differently except maybe have gone with a lighter academic schedule to allow more time for the whole getting into college process.  But she was already in college and loving it and working towards her own goals.  It's funny that they want students who are invested in learning, but penalize those who are and therefore don't give all the application hoops the attention they feel they deserve.  lol

[Okra]

There is a cap on the "official" National Merit Scholarship award - I *think* it's that one-time $2,500? Or the schools can set it at an amount of maybe $2,000 per year? I really dont' remember!! Old and crazy! But there is a limit as to what is "official." The rest is deemed by the schools who give large awards to be an "unofficial" National Merit award. Most schools will label whatever that capped amount is as the "official" part. This is so that students can be named National Merit Scholars. The only way one gets that label is to receive that one-time award from the National Merit Corporation itself, a corporate-sponsored award, or through an "official" scholarship given by a university. So, most school designate a portion of the award (if it is > the cap) as "official" so students can claim that title. Perhaps you are saying that some schools do not advertise National Merit awards? Probably because if they are not significant.

 

 

Thanks so much for explaining this to me!  I was wondering how shools had so mnay "national merit scholars" vs finalists.  It didn't make sense to me.  Now, I understand better.

[Tokyomarie]

I should also add that my perspective comes from a place of not qualifying for ANY financial aid. So for US, there was a HUGE difference in cost for one of those "lesser" schools that offered a large National Merit package and those for which we had to pay full freight because no merit aid of any type was offered.

 

This was our position. We absolutely did not qualify for any financial aid except for an 8.5% Parent PLUS loan. My dh and I were not willing to take out any loans ourselves for our children's college education, let alone pay 8.5%. No way on earth are we putting ourselves in a position to have to work until we are 80 years old to pay off loans! Nor are we willing to encourage our children to take on $100,000 or more of debt over a course of 4 years.

 

My oldest daughter was a National Merit Scholar. She chose a school on the "Colleges That Change Lives" list that offers major scholarship dollars to any NMF who chooses to attend. That scholarship allowed her to attend a private college for far less than total in-state university costs.

 

She was the only one of our children who qualified. Our next child had some very good test scores and we looked carefully at scholarship opportunities offered for those test scores, even though she didn't make NM.

[Tokyomarie]

I learned to keep checking and/or have the student check up on the status of the application- which parts have been documented as received by the admissions office and which ones are still outstanding. Nothing is more disconcerting than to find out a transcript for outside courses, a recommendation, or even the application itself as not been documented as received by the admissions office. Yes, making sure the student has hit submit once the application has been finalized is important!

[Teachin'Mine]

FAFSA is much easier than the common app, but it's not without its own glitches.  Colleges can see which other colleges your student has applied to on each FAFSA submission.  Some consider this important enough to put on only two comparable colleges and make multiple submissions.  If you wait until too close to the submission deadline, this isn't possible.  There's also a maximum of 8 or 10 colleges per submission and you can't submit more until the first batch has gone through which can take up to a few days.  If applying to many colleges, you need to allow time for this.  Similar to CA and others you have to make sure you've actually submitted the form as it may seem that you're done, but you may not be.  Late submissions may affect financial aid offers.

[Hoggirl]

FAFSA is much easier than the common app, but it's not without its own glitches. Colleges can see which other colleges your student has applied to on each FAFSA submission. Some consider this important enough to put on only two comparable colleges and make multiple submissions. If you wait until too close to the submission deadline, this isn't possible. There's also a maximum of 8 or 10 colleges per submission and you can't submit more until the first batch has gone through which can take up to a few days. If applying to many colleges, you need to allow time for this. Similar to CA and others you have to make sure you've actually submitted the form as it may seem that you're done, but you may not be. Late submissions may affect financial aid offers.

I have seen it suggested that one list schools alphabetically on the FAFSA so as not to tip one's hat as to "favorites."

[Teachin'Mine]

Yes, alphabetical listhting is good, but it's still obvious which might be considered safeties and which are likely the favorites.  That's why some only list say Harvard and Yale on one, and Bates and Colby on another and two state schools on another.

[Penguin]

If your child will be studying outside of the USA, find out how much money the host country requires you to provide your student.  This number never showed up on any of my son's paperwork until he applied for a residency visa.  And it was a big number!!!!!!!

[Susan in TN]

Tip: do not feel you are being overbearing if you double-check the S.S. number your child has entered on the application (BEFORE submitting). It could save you an enormous amount of confusion and headache later on!

[Hoggirl]

Tip: do not feel you are being overbearing if you double-check the S.S. number your child has entered on the application (BEFORE submitting). It could save you an enormous amount of confusion and headache later on!

Yep. One of ds's friends did this.

[RootAnn]

And National Merit was totally overrated.. looks great on the transcript, but was not the huge financial advantage some people claim it is.

 

Agreeing with several PP & respectfully disagreeing with the overall sentiment of this one. While my #1 school only ponied up a pittance, my safety offered me a full ride. Since I already had another full ride scholarship from them, the safety added $1k each year (auto-renewing) for the NMF title. It absolutely can make a difference financially, depending on the school.

 

Also, I had a weird experience later in life WRT National Merit. We had just finished interviewing a lackluster school-experience-only candidate for a job at my major manufacturing company. I gave him a thumbs down because I didn't think he'd do a good job in our environment. My boss, however, couldn't stop saying he'd be great. I questioned him on this and his reply was that this guy was a NATIONAL MERIT FINALIST and WOW, to have one of THOSE working HERE! (That's actually how it sounded - very loud & emphatic.) I told him he already had one and this guy wasn't worth hiring. So, someone thought it was impressive enough to hire on for - and they did.

[dirty ethel rackham]

If my memory serves me right, the information about the exact amount of the National Merit scholarship was available not until after the choice of school had been made - except for generic info from schools who have blanket policies like in state tuition for every finalist, or something like this.

It depends.  My oldest's college is a sponsor school for NMS, so they listed the amount right on their financial aid website. 

 

 

 

My oldest daughter was a National Merit Scholar. She chose a school on the "Colleges That Change Lives" list that offers major scholarship dollars to any NMF who chooses to attend. That scholarship allowed her to attend a private college for far less than total in-state university costs.

 

She was the only one of our children who qualified. Our next child had some very good test scores and we looked carefully at scholarship opportunities offered for those test scores, even though she didn't make NM.

Same here.  Oldest earned a large National Merit Scholarship from a Colleges that Change Lives school that made it cheaper to attend than our state universities.   Our second had an off-day on the PSAT, but had similar stats.  He got a great scholarship at a different CTCL school that made his cost of attendance less than our state schools. 

[regentrude]

Sorry, I am not understanding what you are saying??? The generic info/blanket policies are the ones that yield the most money.

 

What I am saying is that aside from the generic/blanket statements on some schools' websites like "in state tuition for NM Finalists" or the like, we did not have timely information that the student actually won a scholarship, or how much that amount was. (Some students win larger scholarships from corporations, and amounts vary widely. )

 

The revised financial aid offer from the first choice university stating the amount of money offered for national Merit is dated April 23.

The official letter from National Merit that she won a scholarship (from the university, and for what amount) is dated May 1st.

 

That is too late to use this information in the choice of the school.

[FaithManor]

The one thing that surprised me was how little merit aid some public schools give even if the student has great stats that places the student at the upper end of the test scores for this school and is a National Merit scholar. Even with winning the highest scholarship offered by the institution, a certain out of state public university ended up being more expensive than several top tier highly selective private schools who do not give any merit aid at all.

 

And National Merit was totally overrated.. looks great on the transcript, but was not the huge financial advantage some people claim it is.The school gave 2k, and in turn cut the subsidized Stafford loans by that amount.

 

This! We jumped big time hoops for dd only to have institutional aid drop due to private scholarships. I do have to wonder if this isn't due to some sort of underhanded, unethical mafia system whereby the private student loan industry possibly pays commissions to financial aid departments for the number and amounts of loans they "sell" to the students and parents, parent plus loans in particular. I can't prove it, but I really do suspect something like this is going on behind the scenes at some colleges.

 

I learned a lot from the process, one of which was that if merit aid is needed because income is too middle class to write a check for full freight, but EFC is going to be high and the stock market crash tanks your 529 the year you have to dip into it, then you need to find schools that allow scholarships to stack. Northern Michigan U does for what it's worth though we didn't know it back then, and their nursing and chemistry programs may not have been as strong seven years ago as it is now, sigh.... You can stack institutional and private scholarships up to 100% of tuition, room/board, books, and fees at NMU. Only after you hit 100% will they lower an institutional scholarship if more private money comes trickling in.

 

I wish we had possessed a better understanding of this when dd was applying. It might have greatly adjusted her college list. She won the one time $2500.00 county 4-H scholarship and every single school but U of MI reduced her institutional merit scholarships by that amount. On top of which, because they reduced it for the freshman year, even though she could not renew the county scholarship - it's a one time thing - those same schools would not bump up the amount for sophomore year back to what had been originally awarded. She was from then forward only eligible for the reduced amount so it hurt her for all four years. Thus, though U of MI was her third choice institution, she ended up landing there.

[Hoggirl]

I am copying and pasting in an article I found since we have had much discussion about National Merit on this thread. This article talks about those who do NOT qualify for financial aid but who are looking for/expecting large amounts for National Merit. I am adding it because there is a specific section on the Colleges That Change Lives as well as a short (very short) mention toward the end of some schools that do grant a lot for National Merit.

 

I hope it is helpful for someone.

http://www.thecollegesolution.com/different-scholarship-results-for-national-merit-finalists/

[Teachin'Mine]

FaithManor I know that schools can apply outside scholarships however they choose, but that was incredibly wrong for them not to honor the original scholarship amount for the remaining three years.  Unfortunately this is the type of information which usually isn't known until the actual financial aid offer is given or perhaps not even until the next year's offer is received. 

[8filltheheart]

Margaret I know that schools can apply outside scholarships however they choose, but that was incredibly wrong for them not to honor the original scholarship amount for the remaining three years.  Unfortunately this is the type of information which usually isn't known until the actual financial aid offer is given or perhaps not even until the next year's offer is received. 

 

You can call financial aid depts and ask their policy toward stacking scholarships.   We definitely called.   Our ds received 2 different scholarships equal to the equivalent of tuition.   One was a dept scholarship and one was through the admissions office.  We were able to verify that only admission scholarships could not be stacked (like the NMF scholarship and the presidential could not be stacked.)   All dept scholarships could be.   Ds ended up with 2 different types of 4 yr scholarships from a single dept with a total of 5 stacking 4 yr scholarships covering all expenses.

 

At another school, he was told that any additional scholarship $$ would reduce his merit award from that institution.   At another, merit $$ reduced grant $$.   In both of these scenarios, there was zero net gain.  I completely fail to understand this logic.

[Teachin'Mine]

You can call financial aid depts and ask their policy toward stacking scholarships.   We definitely called.   Our ds received 2 different scholarships equal to the equivalent of tuition.   One was a dept scholarship and one was through the admissions office.  We were able to verify that only admission scholarships could not be stacked (like the NMF scholarship and the presidential could not be stacked.)   All dept scholarships could be.   Ds ended up with 2 different types of 4 yr scholarships from a single dept with a total of 5 stacking 4 yr scholarships covering all expenses.

 

At another school, he was told that any additional scholarship $$ would reduce his merit award from that institution.   At another, merit $$ reduced grant $$.   In both of these scenarios, there was zero net gain.  I completely fail to understand this logic.

 

 

8 I doubt that many would ask the college if years 2, 3, and 4 would have the original scholarship amount applied.  Most would assume that the one year outside scholarship would be applied for the first year, and when it wasn't applied the second year the original scholarship amount would be honored.  I would never have thought a college would stoop so low as to "permanently" reduce their scholarship offer based on a one year outside scholarship.

 

Yes, when comparing schools and merit aid it would make sense to ask whether scholarships can be stacked.  Your son ended up with great scholarships!

[8filltheheart]

8 I doubt that many would ask the college if years 2, 3, and 4 would have the original scholarship amount applied. Most would assume that the one year outside scholarship would be applied for the first year, and when it wasn't applied the second year the original scholarship amount would be honored. I would never have thought a college would stoop so low as to "permanently" reduce their scholarship offer based on a one year outside scholarship.

 

Yes, when comparing schools and merit aid it would make sense to ask whether scholarships can be stacked. Your son ended up with great scholarships!

Actually, I have read on CC similar stories to what FaithManor described. Students have asked how to return merit $$ awarded bc of exactly what she shared. You know those offering the merit $$ have no idea they are hurting the recipients. It is a completely reprehensible scenario, but unfortunately it is not uncommon, either. There are many posters on CC who warn students against searching out 1 time awards bc of the reduction in institution awards. It was an eye opening experience learning the ins and outs last year.

[Teachin'Mine]

Actually, I have read on CC similar stories to what FaithManor described. Students have asked how to return merit $$ awarded bc of exactly what she shared. You know those offering the merit $$ have no idea they are hurting the recipients. It is a completely reprehensible scenario, but unfortunately it is not uncommon, either. There are many posters on CC who warn students against searching out 1 time awards bc of the reduction in institution awards. It was an eye opening experience learning the ins and outs last year.

 

Yes I've read a lot about how one time awards reduce the institution awards, I just haven't read about a situation similar to FM's.  I also haven't read widely on merit scholarships as most of the colleges dd applied to do not award any.  Most of the scholarships she pursued would have been for all four years.  Where she attends one time awards would help by reducing work study and student contributions and would not affect her financial aid unless the amount of the award was greater than those amounts.

[FaithManor]

FaithManor I know that schools can apply outside scholarships however they choose, but that was incredibly wrong for them not to honor the original scholarship amount for the remaining three years.  Unfortunately this is the type of information which usually isn't known until the actual financial aid offer is given or perhaps not even until the next year's offer is received. 

 

Yes, very true. I'm wiser now. Every college we have toured, I've put that question directly to a financial aid rep and required them to print and sign a statement concerning the policy. This way if they claim they WON'T reduce institutional aid due to private scholarships, I have something that says "you lied to me". It might not help. But, at least they can't be sneaky. Somehow, LOL, that makes me feel better.

 

Local, crappy, unbelievably awful regional, unranked no standards state U down the road also has a snarky little policy of making their top scholarship winners register LAST for classes, and when I say last, I mean about two weeks before classes begin. Registration goes first to kids getting no merit aid, followed by a little bit, followed by a medium amount, followed by generous. This way, the classes are filled that their top scholars need. Either they have to defer entry for one semester and the school then docks their scholarship for not starting on time, or they end up taking electives NOT prerequisites to their intended majors, thus many having to take a 5th year in order to graduate on time, and of course the merit aid does not extend to the 4th year. GRRRRR.....I could right a book about their underhanded practices. As a matter of fact, so could a couple of local attorneys who have been engaged by parents to go after the school for MANY unethical financial practices.

 

Ask very specific questions at both admissions and financial aid interviews folks. Do not be afraid to ask the tough questions. You need this information! Also, ask around the alumni if you can find some. You'd surprised what you can learn.

[Myra]

Before your kid goes to freshman orientation sit down with them and make sure they completely understand the registration process, the general required core classes, and if they have a major then what pre-reqs courses should freshman take the first semester.   Send your child armed with a list of exact courses from the college's course catalog and even a potential schedule for those classes. My son was undecided in a major so the advisor at summer orientation had him sign up for random courses -none of which met even core requirements!  Luckily, a later phone call to the Dean's department and my son's schedule was completely changed plus a new advisor assigned.  Now this wasn't the same scenario for my oldest as his advisors were patient and understanding and knew what they were doing;so hopefully, this disasterous orientation is not the norm!  

 

Myra

[Teachin'Mine]

Yes, very true. I'm wiser now. Every college we have toured, I've put that question directly to a financial aid rep and required them to print and sign a statement concerning the policy. This way if they claim they WON'T reduce institutional aid due to private scholarships, I have something that says "you lied to me". It might not help. But, at least they can't be sneaky. Somehow, LOL, that makes me feel better.

 

Local, crappy, unbelievably awful regional, unranked no standards state U down the road also has a snarky little policy of making their top scholarship winners register LAST for classes, and when I say last, I mean about two weeks before classes begin. Registration goes first to kids getting no merit aid, followed by a little bit, followed by a medium amount, followed by generous. This way, the classes are filled that their top scholars need. Either they have to defer entry for one semester and the school then docks their scholarship for not starting on time, or they end up taking electives NOT prerequisites to their intended majors, thus many having to take a 5th year in order to graduate on time, and of course the merit aid does not extend to the 4th year. GRRRRR.....I could right a book about their underhanded practices. As a matter of fact, so could a couple of local attorneys who have been engaged by parents to go after the school for MANY unethical financial practices.

 

Ask very specific questions at both admissions and financial aid interviews folks. Do not be afraid to ask the tough questions. You need this information! Also, ask around the alumni if you can find some. You'd surprised what you can learn.

 

 

Oh my.  That's horrendous.  I've never heard of schools forcing scholarship winners to register last.  In many colleges the honors students get to register before all others, not last.  Considering your description of the college involved, it's likely not discussed often on CC.  If there's a forum for that specific college, I'd suggest you post your info there to warn others.  Shame on them!

 

I know that you've learned the hard way, which is apparently my go to method, but even in searching now for info on CC regarding one year scholarships reducing grants or other institutional aid for all four years, I couldn't find anything.  I'm sure there is mention of it somewhere, but I doubt it's a common scenario.   Thanks for posting here so others can benefit.

 

[Penguin]

Thought of another leason learned: The first semester dorm contract literally only covered the first semseter. In order to keep his stuff in the dorm room over Christmas break, we had to pay a ridiculous amount of money. December surprise!

[8filltheheart]

Trying searching outside scholarships.

[Teachin'Mine]

Thought of another lesson learned: The first semester dorm contract literally only covered the first semester. In order to keep his stuff in the dorm room over Christmas break, we had to pay a ridiculous amount of money. December surprise!

 

Oh no.  Not a good surprise by any means.  And I can't imagine many students would want the hassle of packing up while in the midst of finals.   

[Teachin'Mine]

Trying searching outside scholarships.

 

If you have any links to share, it might be helpful for others. 

[FaithManor]

Thought of another leason learned: The first semester dorm contract literally only covered the first semseter. In order to keep his stuff in the dorm room over Christmas break, we had to pay a ridiculous amount of money. December surprise!

 

That kind of thing makes me so mad. Dorms are a huge money maker for schools. Would it kill them to allow students who are coming back to the same room to leave their things? Really? Urgh.....I have heard of this before and will be asking about it in the future. There is no way if middle ds ends up 7-13 hours away (24 hrs. if he ended up at Eckerd), that I want to move him in and out every semester. That's crazy.

[8filltheheart]

If you have any links to share, it might be helpful for others. 

 

I don't have time to search for specific threads.  But there are pages of posts about outside scholarships and how they impact FA.

[Teachin'Mine]

I don't have time to search for specific threads.  But there are pages of posts about outside scholarships and how they impact FA.

 

I have searched some, but it really doesn't apply to us so I'm lacking motivation.  lol   As I said earlier, I've read lots about how a one year only outside scholarship will reduce the grants or scholarships offered for that one year, but I haven't read where it reduced it for all four years.  I guess my point is that FM shouldn't feel badly about not having that info ahead of time as I think it's a very unusual situation and one not often mentioned even on boards such as CC.   We're sharing some less than positive stuff and I think that it's important to be supportive of each other.  We're all only human and doing the best we can with each of our students.  We can't possibly know it all.  When someone shares something that I didn't have a problem with I'm not thinking that they should have known, I'm thinking that I was lucky that it didn't come up in our situation as I wouldn't have been aware of it ahead of time either.

[Vida Winter]

If the Honors College has a "meet and greet" night for locals, it is worth it to travel and attend. Often this is not advertised (except to local high schools) so you need to check frequently to find out if and when they hold the event.

[8filltheheart]

. I guess my point is that FM shouldn't feel badly about not having that info ahead of time as I think it's a very unusual situation and one not often mentioned even on boards such as CC. We're sharing some less than positive stuff and I think that it's important to be supportive of each other. We're all only human and doing the best we can with each of our students. We can't possibly know it all. When someone shares something that I didn't have a problem with I'm not thinking that they should have known, I'm thinking that I was lucky that it didn't come up in our situation as I wouldn't have been aware of it ahead of time either.

??? I wasn't making a personal comment one way or the other. I simply shared that I had read about several similar situations on CC.

 

Fwiw, I know exactly how FM feels BC of not knowing something. Our oldest missed out on a 4 yr university scholarship bc the university required the FAFSA to be filled out even for merit only scholarships. We knew he wouldn't qualify for any aid, so we didn't fill it out. We didn't realize our mistake until too late.

[Angie in VA]

That kind of thing makes me so mad. Dorms are a huge money maker for schools. Would it kill them to allow students who are coming back to the same room to leave their things? Really? Urgh.....I have heard of this before and will be asking about it in the future. There is no way if middle ds ends up 7-13 hours away (24 hrs. if he ended up at Eckerd), that I want to move him in and out every semester. That's crazy.

 

I hope you find an affordable solution. Storage unit? Maybe your dc can share a unit w/ friends?

 

It is not uncommon for schools to have camps during the summers, so kids are staying in the dorms, so I can see why they would need some rooms cleared out.