How to identify twaddle?

[athomeontheprairie]

Before this year, it was easy to pick up a book at the library and quickly determine its value. then it was picture books and short easy chapter books. Now, dd reads much longer chapter books! And so many I don't have the time or inclination to read them all.

when we go to the library, I want her to be able to find good books. Certainty I can make recommendations based off good book lists. But, how do you teach book selection while in the library? It's disappointing when you come home only to realize you have a pile of trash. I don't need recommendations of books that are good, we can find those (and have and are very thankful for inter library loan!)

What tips do you have for book selection? (I find this difficult even for me when I go to the library, since most books I read are recommended to me via friends or off a booklist.)

[Violet Crown]

If you can access the internet, the Kirkus Review site I find to be quite reliable for children's books.

[Farrar]

Well, if your kids are getting good books via recommendations and reading them, either for pleasure or school and you're reading such books aloud, then I wouldn't worry about what else they read in addition.  Not every book has to be of the highest caliber.  Kids get something out of reading light books just like most adults.  So I wouldn't worry about it.

[PeterPan]

You might find it easier if you just took the 8 yo.  There's no reason you still can't pick up the book, scan a page, and tell if it's worth reading or not.  Good lit is not hard to identify.  The problem is probably that you have multiple kids in tow.  So take one and start through the shelves together, with her pulling things she thinks might be good and you quickly approving or disapproving.  That's how I did it with my dd at that stage.  Now she can find the good stuff for herself, but at that age she needed supervision.  

 

Btw, our experience was that the junior fiction section will be 80-90% junk, with just a small amount acceptable.  

[athomeontheprairie]

You might find it easier if you just took the 8 yo. There's no reason you still can't pick up the book, scan a page, and tell if it's worth reading or not. Good lit is not hard to identify. The problem is probably that you have multiple kids in tow. So take one and start through the shelves together, with her pulling things she thinks might be good and you quickly approving or disapproving. That's how I did it with my dd at that stage. Now she can find the good stuff for herself, but at that age she needed supervision.

 

Btw, our experience was that the junior fiction section will be 80-90% junk, with just a small amount acceptable.

The problem isI have multiple kids! Oh my yes! previously we have used a rather small library, and well over 95 percent of our material has been checked out through interlibrary loan. now that we are attending another library, that isn't kid friendly, we ate g having problems. Part of that is my Littles aren't welcome in the main part of the library, and the chapter books are stored on the opposite end of the library from the picture book.

It doesn't really matter to me what she brings home, but it is frustrating to find when we've gotten home all she has is junk. frustrating for her, not me (well me too, but only because it makes her sad).

[Farrar]

If she's not happy with what she's finding, then I would ask the librarian to help her.  Or I would request more books in advance and have her look at book lists.  Or just ask for rec's here.

 

I can't fathom a library where 90% of the middle grades novels are beneath the average reader for some reason, or don't meet the approval process of the parents.  I wouldn't bother with such a crummy library.  Or I would reconsider my standards to match reality.  But I love children's books and I dislike when people make these sweeping overgeneralizations about children's literature.

[PachiSusan]

I'm thrilled my child reads. I don't care much if it's "twaddle" or not.  I skim for scariness, blood, violence, and anti-"what our family believes" thought processes. 

 

If it's that important to you to avoid the "fun" reading, maybe find the lexile numbers on the books and make sure your kids don't take out anything under their level. 

 

Also, they have lists of the award winning books - Newberry, Caldecott Awards - stick to those. 

 

You can also simply stick to the classics. :)

[Mommy22alyns]

I generally look at lists of good kids' lit online and then find those books at the library. But I also agree with farrarwilliams - a little junk won't hurt.  I make my girls alternate things like Dork Diaries and Magic Puppies (ugh) with quality books.

[73349]

I would say once she's found a few good authors and read everything of theirs the library has, and then have her ask the librarian to show her another author who is like ____________.

[FriedClams]

I was (and try to remain) very anti twaddle. I sit on the CM bandwagon that emerging readers need quality words, stories, and characters. I look at it like food - what they eat when they are young determines what they'll eat when they're old so it's important to start with veggies when they're young. I've lightened up a bit since my kids are fairly self regulating. :-)

 

When mine were younger I used the Read Aloud Handbook, Sally Clarkson's Read for the Heart, the 1000 Good Books List (from Classical Christian Home Educators website), Sonlight readers lists, and other book lists to get books for my kids. I let my kids pick out books, but I'd refuse to bring home any junk. They could read it and leave it.

 

Other matrix- no movie/character books that ever came out after a movie (Mary Poppins - OK, Mater's Big Tow - not a chance), no ugly attitudes in characters, no bad grammar...

 

Yes, they read some kid "beach reads" but they do not make up the main base of their reading diet. HTH!

[8filltheheart]

I readily admit I am a book snob. Last night I had to read 2 books that my mil sent our dd for her b-day (she will be 4 on the 22nd).   I was ready to poke my eyes out by the end of them.   One was a Fancy Nancy book and the other was Pinkalicious.   I was so sick of Nancy defining every multiple syllable word that she used that I was ready to throw the book in the garbage before I even got to the end.  (Seriously people, they learn the vocabulary from hearing it in context....you do not need to define every word!  Yuck!  and we wonder why kids today can't think.)   The Pinkalicious book had zero in it to make it publish worthy.   If that is all it takes to get a children's book published, we need to up our standards!

 

So, how do I identify twaddle?   Books that the content isn't worth the time it took to read!  

[Farrar]

Can I just say...  I loathe Pinkalicious.  Fancy Nancy was funny sometimes.  At least she has a personality - she likes fancy things, especially fancy clothes and words.  But Pickalicious is nothing more than a girl who likes pink.  She must die.  (Yes, I am advocating the death of a preschooler.)

 

Then again, the kids were always welcome to read her themselves and let her be resurrected.  I get that it's pretty easy to pick up Pinkalicious and see within a page that it's not an FIAR or Caldecott worthy title or even a Dork Diaries and realize it's not about to win an Eisner award or anything while it's harder to pick up a long book and know.  But, aside from cheezy licensed character and film tie ins, I would argue that it also becomes much more subjective.  Most of the standalone titles in the middle grades section will range in quality but are decidedly not twaddle.  So just avoid the series.  Many series aren't either, of course, but if you need a litmus test and can't bring a list, that's the best one I know of.

[KathyJo]

I can't fathom a library where 90% of the middle grades novels are beneath the average reader for some reason, or don't meet the approval process of the parents.  I wouldn't bother with such a crummy library.  Or I would reconsider my standards to match reality.  But I love children's books and I dislike when people make these sweeping overgeneralizations about children's literature.

 

I love children's literature, too, which is not the same as children's fiction. As for libraries, not all of us have a choice. We live in a very small town, which happens to be the largest "city" in our county. There are no other libraries within easy driving distance. We check out history sometimes, lots of science books, and some picture books and early readers. My children bring me fiction books that we've checked out and explain that they're not worth reading. I've kept the twaddle to a minimum over the years, and they recognize the lower quality when they see it. And they see a lot of it at our library. 

[FO4UR]

I like placing holds on books online at home. 

[Mergath]

I let my dd read what she wants.  Twaddle, not-twaddle, everything in-between.  I grew up on a steady diet of Sweet Valley Twins, Choose-Your-Own-Adventure, and Goosebumps books.  In high school I read exclusively SF/Fantasy, and the vast majority of it was the twaddliest twaddle you can imagine.  In college I majored in literature and was such a good writer I was invited to study writing under a Pulitzer Prize-winning author.  So growing up with twaddle does not mean your child will be doomed to an adulthood of reading Nicholas Sparks novels or watching reality TV.

[happypamama]

You might also type in books you have liked at amazon, and see what pops up for other suggestions. That might get you similar books.

[athomeontheprairie]

I love children's literature, too, which is not the same as children's fiction. As for libraries, not all of us have a choice. We live in a very small town, which happens to be the largest "city" in our county. There are no other libraries within easy driving distance. We check out history sometimes, lots of science books, and some picture books and early readers. My children bring me fiction books that we've checked out and explain that they're not worth reading. I've kept the twaddle to a minimum over the years, and they recognize the lower quality when they see it. And they see a lot of it at our library.

I'm glad it isn't just me! Our preferred library's ENTIRE children's/YA/non-fic section is aground 500 books. But, they have amazing service and an even better ILL system. I just don't understand the new library we are using. It's a though they want to separate picture books

from everything else (NOISY TODDLERS!) Why

the easy chapter boss been in this section? there is bi other choice

[PachiSusan]

I let my dd read what she wants.  Twaddle, not-twaddle, everything in-between.  I grew up on a steady diet of Sweet Valley Twins, Choose-Your-Own-Adventure, and Goosebumps books.  In high school I read exclusively SF/Fantasy, and the vast majority of it was the twaddliest twaddle you can imagine.  In college I majored in literature and was such a good writer I was invited to study writing under a Pulitzer Prize-winning author.  So growing up with twaddle does not mean your child will be doomed to an adulthood of reading Nicholas Sparks novels or watching reality TV.

 

I double like this! I grew up on a steady diet of Nancy Drew, Judy Blume,  Beverly Cleary, and any horse book I can find. I survived and am a very good reader and love all kinds of books. 

[stripe]

I let my dd read what she wants.  Twaddle, not-twaddle, everything in-between.  I grew up on a steady diet of Sweet Valley Twins, Choose-Your-Own-Adventure, and Goosebumps books.  In high school I read exclusively SF/Fantasy, and the vast majority of it was the twaddliest twaddle you can imagine.  In college I majored in literature and was such a good writer I was invited to study writing under a Pulitzer Prize-winning author.  So growing up with twaddle does not mean your child will be doomed to an adulthood of reading Nicholas Sparks novels or watching reality TV.

Not to mention, there are some artists / writers who were considered pathetic and low-brow during most or all their lifetime (Rousseau, Van Gogh, Schubert, Vermeer, Oscar Wilde, Edgar Allan Poe,  ...) yet are now considered masters. And there is not unanimity of quality. I believe I read a quite nasty comment about Margaret Atwood by Andrew Kern/someone at the Circe Institute, or, if not them, someone else in "classical" circles, that said her writing was virtually incoherent, yet she has been nominated for and won multiple prizes for literature [eta: and she was homeschooled! so she must be a genius ;) ]. So different people have different views of quality.

 

And I don't think Beverly Cleary is twaddle. There is a middle ground between great literature and total garbage.

[PeterPan]

The problem isI have multiple kids! Oh my yes! previously we have used a rather small library, and well over 95 percent of our material has been checked out through interlibrary loan. now that we are attending another library, that isn't kid friendly, we ate g having problems. Part of that is my Littles aren't welcome in the main part of the library, and the chapter books are stored on the opposite end of the library from the picture book.

It doesn't really matter to me what she brings home, but it is frustrating to find when we've gotten home all she has is junk. frustrating for her, not me (well me too, but only because it makes her sad).

Get on the library board!  You'd be surprised how much influence the library board has on the way the library is run, and you'll be even more intrigued to know the library can MOVE the library around and rearrange!  Our library has had a couple new directors in the past how many years, and they've rearranged the library.  Sometimes it's necessary to bring the library up to date with how patrons use the library.  The stats have changed on what gets checked out, etc.  Our library has done some RADICAL rearranging to make it work better.  Yours can too.  Start talking with people, make an appointment to talk with the director, try to get on the board.  DO something about it.  :)

[Walking-Iris]

I agree with PP. Unless the book is just plain inappropriate I try not to dictate what my children bring home from the library. How are they going to learn what they like and dislike or how to choose a book to read if they have an adult over the shoulder all the time saying "not that---it's no good?"

 

I have fond memories of the BookMobile that came through my neighborhood as a kid and checking out stacks of Sweet Valley Twins/High, Babysitter's Club, and things of that sort.

 

I honestly believe that if I had a mom who constantly said it was "junk" I would have been discouraged. I read good stuff as a kid too. George MacDonald tales and LOTR.

 

I buy good literature to keep in my home. If my kids pull a book off our shelves to read it's guaranteed to be something I'm 100% fine with them reading. I'm pretty sure we own books others would consider twaddle, but I call them just plain fun. Free choice at the library is another matter however. I'm pretty confident my kids will decide what interests them or not. We have brought home plenty of books that just sat there unread. Usually they're not checked out again. And some have become favorites and checked out often. 

 

Some free reading books to look for next time you're at the library. Beverly Cleary, CatWings, Time Travel Trio, Series of Unfortunate Events, Harry Potter, Asterix comics, Mysterious Benedict Society, Berenstein Bear chapter books, Encyclopedia Brown, Lloyd Alexander books, Eragon books, Judy Blume, Nate the Great, Magic Tree House books, American Girl books, Royal Diaries, Redwall, and so on....

 

Sometimes series are great because if a kid likes them they can check out the next one. I try not to assume something is twaddle because someone said it was so. Something someone considers junk just may be a favorite thing. And something someone considers great may be someone else's junk. 

 

[Farrar]

I love children's literature, too, which is not the same as children's fiction. As for libraries, not all of us have a choice. We live in a very small town, which happens to be the largest "city" in our county. There are no other libraries within easy driving distance. We check out history sometimes, lots of science books, and some picture books and early readers. My children bring me fiction books that we've checked out and explain that they're not worth reading. I've kept the twaddle to a minimum over the years, and they recognize the lower quality when they see it. And they see a lot of it at our library. 

 

Sorry, I should have been clearer.  I dislike when people make such sweeping generalizations about children's fiction as well.  I think most middle grades novels that aren't series books are decent.  And I dislike the idea that everything out there is terrible.  I find it insulting to children's novelists.

 

Sigh.  It's always the book threads that make everyone hate me.

[PeterPan]

Sorry, I should have been clearer.  I dislike when people make such sweeping generalizations about children's fiction as well.  I think most middle grades novels that aren't series books are decent.  And I dislike the idea that everything out there is terrible.  I find it insulting to children's novelists.

 

Sigh.  It's always the book threads that make everyone hate me.

The bolded we can agree on.  What differs with libraries is what's on the shelves.  When I said we had to skip a lot at our library, well there was a lot of stuff in that "series" category that it sounds like you would have skipped too.   ;)  

[Violet Crown]

Sigh. It's always the book threads that make everyone hate me.

No! Much better to have an exciting discussion with someone who loves books and has strong opinions than a feeble talk with someone who just doesn't care. :)

 

So - I disagree with you here. I think good prose writing is uncommon in books intended for an adult audience, and rarer still in books for a juvenile audience. On the other hand, the great ocean of children's literature means that "rare" still leaves theoretical shelves full of good quality books. Libraries lean toward stocking the popular over the worthy - which is why Middle Girl could find plenty of Captain Underpants in our neighborhood branch last time we went, but not the Tennyson she wanted. Popular and recent are poor proxies for well-written, and so one should expect the children's shelves to be packed with the new, the serial, and the manga/graphic novel format. Like ours is.

 

No compunction about insulting children's novelists. If writers are offended by negative reviews of poorly written work, they got into the wrong business.

[Farrar]

No! Much better to have an exciting discussion with someone who loves books and has strong opinions than a feeble talk with someone who just doesn't care. :)

 

So - I disagree with you here. I think good prose writing is uncommon in books intended for an adult audience, and rarer still in books for a juvenile audience. On the other hand, the great ocean of children's literature means that "rare" still leaves theoretical shelves full of good quality books. Libraries lean toward stocking the popular over the worthy - which is why Middle Girl could find plenty of Captain Underpants in our neighborhood branch last time we went, but not the Tennyson she wanted. Popular and recent are poor proxies for well-written, and so one should expect the children's shelves to be packed with the new, the serial, and the manga/graphic novel format. Like ours is.

 

No compunction about insulting children's novelists. If writers are offended by negative reviews of poorly written work, they got into the wrong business.

 

I think children's books should be judged with the audience in mind.  That doesn't mean poor writing, just that the rubric is different.  I also think one has to judge genre fiction by a different rubric as well.  To hear some people talk, you'd think there were a few dozen children's books worth reading in the world.  I don't buy it.

 

Of course, Captain Underpants isn't great literature.  And maybe I'm skewed by our own decent library system (which shelves series books like 39 Clues or Babysitters Club or Animorphs or whatever separately anyway), but when I look at the middle grades fiction shelves, I see mostly Newbery winning authors, popular recent short series like Ember and Septimus Heap, older classics like Freddy the Detective or Wizard of Oz, and lots of lesser known stand alone titles.  I would even wager a guess that in a library like ours, even with such a big collection, that a good third or more of the middle grades books are by authors who have received a Newbery or Newbery honor award for at least one book.  I also find that while I don't love every book that's issued, I read a lot of new middle grades fiction and I find most of it is well-constructed and not "twaddle" even if it's not all going to be remembered for the ages.

[Violet Crown]

Yes, I think much of it really is a difference in local libraries. Our system made the policy decision years ago that holdings would be primarily guided by majority patron preference. Thus we have a computer game console in the children's section, but no Baum or Freddy.

 

On the other hand, the university library, which we can access, has a massive juvenile collection with two centuries worth of literature, and nearly everything that ever won an award. That's where we go.

[stripe]

Sigh.  It's always the book threads that make everyone hate me.

Not hardly!

 

 

I think children's books should be judged with the audience in mind.  That doesn't mean poor writing, just that the rubric is different.

 

Also it's the only genre where virtually none to none of the authors represent their audience: I have yet to see a toddler-authored board book, for example. So adults are interpreting and creating the concept of childhood in literature, and their view is retrospective. Surely this makes a difference as well.

[AimeeM]

I double like this! I grew up on a steady diet of Nancy Drew, Judy Blume,  Beverly Cleary, and any horse book I can find. I survived and am a very good reader and love all kinds of books. 

 

Same! Babysitter's Club too :P

 

We are a pro-whatever-has-words family. I'm not super picky about the books my children read, so long as they are appropriate, content wise. We have everything on our shelves, from Mark Twain to Harry Potter; Lois Lowry to James Patterson.

[Farrar]

Also it's the only genre where virtually none to none of the authors represent their audience: I have yet to see a toddler-authored board book, for example. So adults are interpreting and creating the concept of childhood in literature, and their view is retrospective. Surely this makes a difference as well.

 

Okay, now I need to see a toddler-authored board book.  It would probably seem really dada.  There are teen-authored books in YA and child-authored books in the picture book sections, but not many.

[MistyMountain]

I just avoid books where kids behave bratty and treat other people bad. My girls pick out total fluff or twaddle at times. I balance it out with books I get from advice from here, classics, best book lists and award winners but I still let my kids pick what they want to read. I don't seek out bad books but sometimes my kids pick out cheesy books on Rainbow Fairies or Magic Kitties or Fancy Nancy and Pinkalicious. I am not crazy about these books myself but since Fancy Nancy doesn't make fun of people, hurt people or call people smelly I let them read it. The books are not well written but hey I spend time reading fluff at times too and read lots and lots of fluff as a kid like goosebumps or the babysitters club and VC Andrews. ;)

[PachiSusan]

Twaddle me this, Batman:

 

I LOVE "The 39 Clues"... I'm reading them now. LOLOLOL   :lol:  :lol:

[stripe]

Okay, now I need to see a toddler-authored board book.  It would probably seem really dada.  There are teen-authored books in YA and child-authored books in the picture book sections, but not many.

And even fewer in the full-length novel category!

 

The only picture book by a kid that springs to mind for me, for kids (not teens) is I Lost My Tooth In Africa. I don't know if that is a twaddle-ish title because it's about losing a tooth as opposed to something more high-brow like, I don't know, rescuing a lost animal or pulling oneself out of poverty or whatever.

 

Well I guess SE Hinton and Mary Shelley, but sheesh.

[Farrar]

And even fewer in the full-length novel category!

 

The only picture book by a kid that springs to mind for me, for kids (not teens) is I Lost My Tooth In Africa. I don't know if that is a twaddle-ish title because it's about losing a tooth as opposed to something more high-brow like, I don't know, rescuing a lost animal or pulling oneself out of poverty or whatever.

 

Well I guess SE Hinton and Mary Shelley, but sheesh.

 

Hey, I've actually read that book!  It's not as good as some of the picture books we read for our Africa unit study, but was very cute.  I wouldn't call it twaddle, but I have already established myself as someone who doesn't call things twaddle with much abandon.

 

We had a book about birds when we were studying animals that was by some young girl who had started a bird saving project.  She had done the illustrations too.  It was kind of adorable.

 

In the novels, Christopher Paolini...  but those books are just... ugh.  I won't use the dreaded "t" word, but they're so derivative.

[jetzmama]

A friend shared her simple solution to this some years ago: For every book doc reads for self, one must be read for mom, too. Some twaddle was in there, but eventually, became less so as dc began appreciating better lit.

[stripe]

Hey, I've actually read that book!  It's not as good as some of the picture books we read for our Africa unit study, but was very cute.  I wouldn't call it twaddle, but I have already established myself as someone who doesn't call things twaddle with much abandon.

Oh, I thought the tooth book sounded cute - I don't think I've actually read it, but I have a book by her father (a reinterpretation of Hats for Sale). I wouldn't call any children's writing twaddle, I don't think, but I perhaps should establish myself as someone who doesn't calls things "twaddle." I have no such hesitation about "dumb" or "boring."

 

My kids like to read, and read often, so I don't really worry if every book is a paragon of excellence. Reasonably good, and not promoting idiocy, work for me, most of the time.

[8filltheheart]

Oh, I thought the tooth book sounded cute - I don't think I've actually read it, but I have a book by her father (a reinterpretation of Hats for Sale). I wouldn't call any children's writing twaddle, I don't think, but I perhaps should establish myself as someone who doesn't calls things "twaddle." I have no such hesitation about "dumb" or "boring."

.

Then it would definitely classify Pinkalicious as dumb and boring. ;). That book was so bad that if I had had an elementary age child turn it in as a story I would have worked with them on how to improve it. Fancy nancy, otoh, fell into the category of purely annoying. ;)

 

When I read my children picture books ( which both of those were) I like to have a broad range of vocabulary ( I definitely appreciate skilled use of language), a plot the moves the story, and something that connects with the child to make it memorable. It doesn't have to be great literature. My dd's favorite picture book right now is Cowardly Clyde, not a book I would have guessed for my 100% girly girl. But, she loves it. Bill Peet writes engaging and interesting stories. I don't think one is one of his best, but at least there is a story. Pinkalicicious is completely inane.

[leeannpal]

Sorry, I should have been clearer.  I dislike when people make such sweeping generalizations about children's fiction as well.  I think most middle grades novels that aren't series books are decent.  And I dislike the idea that everything out there is terrible.  I find it insulting to children's novelists.

 

Sigh.  It's always the book threads that make everyone hate me.

I am a high school English teacher, and I agree with you. Obviously, there are differences in the quality of children's books, but, I do believe there is nothing wrong with a child enjoying a book for entertainment and light-hearted fun. My 11 year old reads all kinds of books from Dork Diaries to MySide of the Mountain and The Chronicles of Narnia to Mythbusters and other non-fiction books. I really want her to read across genres, so we are working on that. In the mean time, I do let her choose books that she enjoys as well. I can certainly recognize good literature and quality writing, but I read novels and magazine articles for my own enjoyment too. I think my daughter can learn to appreciate good literature without having to give up fun books.

[stripe]

 engaging and interesting stories

is a much more inviting description than "not twaddle."

[Violet Crown]

I think my daughter can learn to appreciate good literature without having to give up fun books.

But this encapsulates my concerns. I don't think there's a tension between "good literature" and "fun books." I do think the broad mass of published works for children are written poorly, and I believe that a child accustomed to prose that ranges from the competent to the extraordinary will find more enjoyment and satisfaction in a well-written book.

 

I suppose the deeper question here is, what do we mean by "good literature"? If we mean "good" like eating our vegetables, we'll be smuggling in the connotations of "not fun, difficult, necessary but not what I really enjoy." To the contrary, I want poorly and quickly written, churned-out mass-market books to be something my children aren't accustomed to and eventually find not fun but boring and distasteful.

[PachiSusan]

 

 

edited out for clarity that I was not responding to her specifically. 

 

 

 

Doesn't anyone ever read "quickly written, churned-out mass-market books "? Doesn't anyone ever watch a mindless tV show? It's equally important to have down time - off time to just BE.  Our children need that too. Not everything is Rhodes Scholar time in their lives.

 

I see so many kids at the library wanting to read, but their parents saying "NO!!!! That's not at your Lexile number!!! It's too babyish for you!!! You can read a higher level than that! I'm not going to have you reading about fairies and Princesses your whole life...get a GOOD book". (All real comments and interactions I have witnessed recently)

 

I also see the kid's faces fall and reluctantly take the book their Mom is foisting on them. I'm seeing it played out Tuesday by Tuesday (our library day) children's love of reading being taken away. I've seen some of these kids over a year's time lose their zeal for even looking for a book because it will get shot down. 

 

(I'm not saying this is what you or anyone else is doing - just a general observation of what I'm seeing in our library.)

 

Isn't the point for them to READ...to learn the skill and to immerse themselves in another world or POV? I guess my perspective is different in that my goals for my daughter and her reading is for her to be good at it, have a good ability to comprehend it, and infer from the words if she doesn't know a word what they mean. I also want her to use her imagination and be introduced to many ideas and different worlds. 

 

I don't think "twaddle" denies her any of the above. Does she ready it exclusively? No, of course not. However, she's learning many life lessons and good morals from her twaddle too.  She reads "good books", award winning books, classic literature, and Disney Fairies, Chapter Books, and what other people call twaddle, my daughter and I call "fun". 

[Violet Crown]

Don't you ever read "quickly written, churned-out mass-market books "?

Well, no. I don't enjoy bad writing. It bores and annoys me.

 

[edited]

[PachiSusan]

Well, no. I don't enjoy bad writing. It bores and annoys me.

 

I worry that I see you equating good writing - which of its nature is interesting and engaging (to borrow a phrase from upthread) - with "Rhodes Scholar time," and the denial of "down-time" and "time to just be." I think we may have a fundamental point of philosophical disagreement here, and I'm not sure how to get past it.

 

Well-written books need not be above a child's comfortable reading level. Much quality writing features fairies and princesses (Lang, Colum, and MacDonald spring to mind). There's no need to worry that I'm plucking books out of my children's hands and forcing them to read books they hate ... and I have to say that, despite the caveat, I found those scenarios a little offensive. If you don't think that's what I or the other discutants here are doing, I don't see why you would bring it up.

 

I brought it up as a point of reference to what I see in my life. If it doesn't apply to you, don't take it in. I never said you were plucking books out of your children's hands. :(

 

Read my words. 

(I'm not saying this is what you or anyone else is doing - just a general observation of what I'm seeing in our library.)

 

 

 

 

Again, they were about those SPECIFIC people I saw at a SPECIFIC library. No need to personalize it. I answered to you because the quote I took is what I was springing off of. 

 

It seems that you are offended, and for that I am very sorry. It was not my intention - that particular comment was not aimed at you. 

 

So that no one else might get that impression, I will edit and take your quote out.

[LaughingCat]

My DD picked based on cover and thickness for a long time.    She still has a hard time getting past the cover (and heck, I've picked up books to look at just based on the cover often enough - that's the whole point of it ).   And even at my age/experience if my only method of finding a book were just browsing the shelves looking for fiction to read, I'd probably check out quite a few books I didn't find all that interesting  (although when I was a kid and doing it this way - I would read practically anything once!).

 

My suggestions -

Teach the child to read a few paragraphs from a couple of different pages in the middle to see if they still find it interesting (and back cover/inside cover if they aren't already doing that)

Give them a list of authors to look for that they have liked or you think they will like

Have her bring books to you half way through the visit and go over why she's picked them - what's interesting about them, what she could look for -personally, I'm ok with 'twaddle' but that irrelevant - my purpose when I do this is to teach her to pick books she will actually read. Like, DD has been picking a lot of Andrew Clements books lately but... she doesn't actually like Andrew Clements books. So I say something like "I see you picked out another Andrew Clements book, but you didn't read the ones you've checked out before. Are you sure you want to get this book?What was it you didn't like about the others? What do you think will make this one different from that?"

 

(edit: to remove a remark I meant to be funny but later realized could be taken the wrong way)

[Violet Crown]

Nm

[Mommy22alyns]

Is the world really going to end if our kids read a little Dork Diaries?

[nmoira]

Is the world really going to end if our kids read a little Dork Diaries?

Ours hasn't... though Diary of A Wimpy Kid was more popular here.

 

I collect good books -- our house is quite literally filled with them. The kids e-readers are filled with them. We read them out loud; the kids read them for pleasure. But we also have (or have had) Pokémon and Link manga, Baby Mouse, The Creature From My Closet, etc. I prefer to get these from the library as they have to go back.

 

There was a time I'd vehemently sworn we would never have books from cross licenced properties in the house, *ever*. That lasted until Pokémon, though that's the one line I still usually redraw. Let's just say I'm willing to make exceptions. :)

[Violet Crown]

.

[Mommy22alyns]

LOL, show me where I said that.  You're jumping to a lot of conclusions here, aren't you?

[Violet Crown]

Nm

 

[Redacted for flu-induced peevishness.]

[Mommy22alyns]

I sincerely hope you feel better soon then.  :)