What was the "old" Girl Scouts like?

[pitterpatter]

We just signed up DD to be a Daisy (she's six, so second year, although it's her first). Now that I've read through the guide and the animals Journey book, I'm wondering what the "old" Girl Scouts was like. I remember there being an uproar a couple of years ago when they changed things. How is it different now?

 

Thanks!

 

PS - If anyone is blogging about your child's experience in Girl Scouting, please post your blog link.

[dancingmama]

Before the Journeys came out they had "Try-its".  Basically it was a book of different things the girls could "try" and earn a badge.  There were 100's of Try-its they could earn.  Now the Journey is supposed to be the central thing with the coordinating try-it like badges as supplements.  I'm not fond of how they did it although I like the idea.  We just tweaked the Journeys to fit our girls.  If you google the Journey with your child's level you will find people who have tweaked it and blogged about it.  

[pitterpatter]

So, they just completed a "Try-It" task and earned a badge? What kind of things would they have tried?

 

I've tried searching for blogs, but have come up short. I'll try being more specific in my searching. I don't think I've tried the full title of the Journey yet.

 

Since the troop is focusing on earning petals this year, I'm spearheading a subgroup for the girls interested in the Tell It! animals journey. I have the facilitator guide. I'm tweaking the program for home study. The girls will be working on their portion of the crafts, etc. at home and bringing them to the troop meeting where they will share and come together as a group to complete the mural, birdbath, etc. We'll also be using Facebook to share aspects of the Journey.

 

Anyway, I've had a hard time finding examples online. Can't seem to churn up a Daisy Team Animal Mural for nothing.

 

 

Before the Journeys came out they had "Try-its".  Basically it was a book of different things the girls could "try" and earn a badge.  There were 100's of Try-its they could earn.  Now the Journey is supposed to be the central thing with the coordinating try-it like badges as supplements.  I'm not fond of how they did it although I like the idea.  We just tweaked the Journeys to fit our girls.  If you google the Journey with your child's level you will find people who have tweaked it and blogged about it.  

 

[City Mouse]

I think the biggest changes are at the middle school level (cadettes) and up. Although there was a big stink with the most recent program change because it was a big change to the Journeys, there had already been a change to more touchy-feely stuff with the addition do the Studio 2B program which went away quickly.

[Dmmetler]

I was a GS back when it was still earning Badges, more like boy scouts, where there were a series of activities that earned a specific badge. What I didn't like was the focus on crafts and homemaking and so on that my troop seemed to do, so I did all the math, computer, and science-related stuff at home. I ended up earning a TON of badges. In retrospect, I think my mom used the GS badges as a way to afterschool ;).

 

 

[dancingmama]

The Try-its were similar to the badges they have now.  The legacy badges would be very similar to the Try-its before in particular. I remember doing First Aid, Sewing, Singing, a variety of crafts (so.many.crafts).  Every year you would learn something (sometimes again) that was age appropriate and that continues in a somewhat smaller scale now.  

 

As for Journeys, if you are creative, I'd just tweak as you see fit.  I'm not creative at all so I depending on other people's plans.  :)

 

Try this one...http://daisy-scout-journeys.blogspot.com/2012/07/ideas-to-tie-in-to-3-cheers-for-animals.html

 

and on pinterest...http://www.pinterest.com/kjstora/girl-scout-it-s-your-story-journey-ideas/

 

I search typically the level (daisy), the word "girl scout", the word "journey" and then the important part of the name of the journey "animal" (sometimes I leave this last part out too).

 

HTH

[Paige]

I don't think we can generalize too much as every troop is different. I was a GS from daisies through maybe 9th grade or so and was in the same troop the whole time. I recall camping, crafts, field trips, selling cookies, etc. I do not recall much at all about badges. I mean, we got badges, but they were not a big goal in our troop. I could not guess about what kind of badges I had or how many I had. We did a lot of camping and most badges we earned were earned during our camping trips. I think we had to complete 3-4 tasks and then everyone who was there would get the badge.

 

Our troop was low stress. There was no push to sell more cookies- we sold what we felt like and those of us who sold more would get more prizes and credits but there was no big contest. We had cookie booths, and most of us participated, but it was more about the fun than about "sell these cookies!" In our troop, our leaders were more focused on teaching us to be good friends and teaching us to be self sufficient. Or, maybe I was oblivious and our troop leaders were really stressed out about the badges while I was busy eating s'mores and playing with worms.

[In The Great White North]

Girl Scouts has changed several times.  Older GS manuals are available online and at garage sales.  Over the years, the activities have changed from "skill" building (badges like the BSA) to more touchy-feely, all-inclusive  badges (you cuold get one of the travel interest projects without leaving your living room) to touchy-feely, service oriented Journeys (with as many service hour required for each as the old Silver Award).

 

"Old" GS started at Juniors and looked essentially like BSA for girls.  Badges were practical houehold, farming, camping and first aid skills.

 

"Medium -old" GS (1970's) didn't have Daisies, Brownies didn't have badges of any sort and weren't allowed to sell cookies. Juniors and up earned badges.  Interest Projects didn't exist yet.  Badges were still practical skills but farming skills had disappeared.

 

Sometime between my GS experience and my dd's, Daisies were invented, Brownies got Try-Its (mini-badges), Interest Projects were invented, badges were limited to Juniors.  Badge - type things switched their focus from useful skills to hobbies (redecorate your room, add sequins to your blue jeans, etc), publicity (write an article for the newspaper appeared in most of them) and talking about things.

 

Then Cadettes and Seniors morphed in "Older GIrls" and Studio 2B came (and went). Interest Projects weren't phased out so many leader (and girls) ignored Studio 2B. Camping almost entirely disappeared from Girl Scouting.   Studio 2B didn't last long.

 

Then came Journeys.

 

All of it was supposedly based on "girl surveys".  Turns out the girls they surveyed weren't even in Girl Scouts and were mostly city girls. :confused1:

 

Through all of this, leaders did have some flexibility and were able to focus on their troops interests, but you had to do at least some of the official program if you wanted to earn the Bronze, Silver, or Gold Award.

 

 

[pitterpatter]

Well, huh. Thanks for all of the background info and links. I think I'm glad we missed the in-between years. I don't understand not being able to earn patches/badges. Isn't that half the point? Although I haven't read the guides cover-to-cover, I think I'm okay with what the Daisies are doing. Earning petals to learn the Girl Scout Law makes okay sense to me. I'm okay with most of the "5 Flowers..." Journey stuff, I think. There are things here and there that I'm kind of "eh" about. Will be tweaking them. Not so fond of the touchy-feely stuff, but there seems to be alternative activities you can do.

 

Hopefully, it all works and seems worthwhile in the end. We were planning to jump in with both feet. When we commit to something, we like to go all out.

[ThatHomeschoolDad]

I am not a fan of the new journeys as compared to the old badge system -- it seems watered down.  DD has been a Juliette (independent) GS since Juniors, and as such, we can go into more depth than her old troop was wiling to (sounds like HSing).  

[Doodle]

Was anyone else a mini-brownie? The mini-brownie troop was brand new that year (fall 1974) as there previously were no troops for Kindergarten age. I am guessing it was some time later that they were renamed Daisies.

[In The Great White North]

 

As I told her I feel like I am the GS. I'm selling cookies (not like I'm letting her go door to door alone where we live and of course sending the paper with dad to work doesn't involve her) and earning patches, not her. She "earned" one for Hurricane Relief and I corrected her and said no, mom bought the ribbon (to send to a troop that was flooded) and turned it in. YOU didn't do anything. Not in a mean way, but in a way that I want HER to have to do something to earn the patch.

That's why Brownies didn't have badges, back in the day.

 

FWIW, I think a lot of their activities are not age appropriate  (ie. the average girl of the target age is unlikely to be able to accomplish it on her own).

[pitterpatter]

LOL! This is what I'm afraid is going to happen with my virtual/home study Journey group. I'm afraid the other moms will feel it's too much like homework and say forget it even though it doesn't seem like much to me.

 

 

I am not a fan of the new journeys as compared to the old badge system -- it seems watered down.  DD has been a Juliette (independent) GS since Juniors, and as such, we can go into more depth than her old troop was wiling to (sounds like HSing).  

 

[pitterpatter]

For some reason, I keep thinking there was a kindergarten group during my time called Pixies (sp?). Not sure where the whole elf theme came from. Never heard of Mini Brownies, but I went to early elementary school during the early eighties.

 

 

Was anyone else a mini-brownie? The mini-brownie troop was brand new that year (fall 1974) as there previously were no troops for Kindergarten age. I am guessing it was some time later that they were renamed Daisies.

 

[pitterpatter]

That's what I kind of thought about some of Journey stuff. Paper mache for 5- and 6-year-olds. Uhm...I don't know. Don't really see them being able to start a Team Mural, make a Team Birdbath (out of paper mache), make a paper mache robin (with extra supplies and time), and also do all of the discussion, reading, workbook, etc. activities is an hour's time. I came up with quicker alternative crafts of the same theme.

 

I do think they should "earn" the patches and not in five-minutes time, but some of it doesn't seem quite age-appropriate.

 

 

That's why Brownies didn't have badges, back in the day.

 

FWIW, I think a lot of their activities are not age appropriate  (ie. the average girl of the target age is unlikely to be able to accomplish it on her own).

 

[Paige]

LOL! This is what I'm afraid is going to happen with my virtual/home study Journey group. I'm afraid the other moms will feel it's too much like homework and say forget it even though it doesn't seem like much to me.

In my troop, when I was a child, we never had homework from girl scouts when we were little. All of our badges were earned during our girl scout meetings. Is that not possible anymore? I was not crafty or woodsy so when I got towards late middle school and high school when it was more independent I dropped it.

[sillymommy]

All remember of my Girl Scouts experience in the early '80's was that the troop leader smoked like a chimney & one girl got picked on a lot. I was a Brownie for one year and didn't go back.

 

I'm now troop leader for my daughter's brownie troop. We're having fun! There's no smoking & no teasing. Already the "new" Girl Scouts is better than the "old." :)

[...................]

It's also very liberal. Our local Girl Scouts choosier has several vocal transgender members and one of the troops marched in the gay pride parade in their uniforms and holding the banner, at 12 years old.

 

The manuals themselves are a strange spiritual bent about finding truth inside and some other odd things I disagreed with.

 

Even the women they choose as women of the year are extremely vocal pro abortion supporters and such.

 

It's not that I am against all diversity. However, it's bent so far left that I think a Christian with traditional values and worldview would be totally out of place.

 

We will be looking into 4h instead.

[srs]

Just an aside, but if you are looking for the old style practical skills building, is 4H the way to go, or are there other alternatives? I have been reluctant to do sign up my DD for scouts for many of the reasons listed upthread.

[Dmmetler]

I was a DS starting in the late 1970s/early 1980s, and as I recall, Brownies did one badge, towards the end before bridging up, and usually with the help of girls working on their Junior Aide patch (which I got-it worked out well because one of my close neighbors was bridging up that year, so we walked to the church for her brownie meetings together, then walked home). The badge book I had also had badges for both Juniors and Cadettes (I think Juniors had green borders and ones for Cadettes had gold) so there was no expectation that you'd be able to do all of them now.

 

I didn't go on into seniors.

[pitterpatter]

That would be ideal, but there's not enough time. Our troop meets every other week. Daisies is two years...kindergarten and first grade. Last year, the troop worked on Journeys (we were not part of Girl Scouts then) during meeting time. They completed one of the three Journeys the entire year. I assume the other two Journeys take ten sessions each to complete like ours does. So, when you have a meeting every two weeks, that's 20 weeks worth of time for one Journey patch. Each Journey patch has three smaller patches that go on top of it (for Daisies).

 

 

The bird, birdbath and tulip are the three smaller patches that fit on top of the bigger background patch.

 

 

This is what the girls are working on during troop time this year. Each part (petal) is one meeting's time, so again it will take 11 meetings/22 weeks to earn it all, plus there are four leaves that go with it. So, add four to eight more weeks to that.

 

Plus, there are some other awards, pins, badges that can be earned as a Daisy as well (safety award, etc.). Those pretty much will have to be earned on our own as well.

 

Now, I understand we do not have to earn all of the badges/awards/etc., but I'm hoping to foster a love of Girl Scouts with DD. We live in a small town and do not have much available to us, especially since we homeschool. I'm hoping Girl Scouts will help DD develop her character, teach her to follow-through with projects, etc. Ultimately, I hope she likes it enough that she'll want to keep with it through her teen years and have something a little bit special to put on college applications, etc. (I.e. completed all levels of Girls Scouts...earned this special award and that one.) So far, she has not proven to be particularly interested in sports, so we need something. And, 4-H isn't our thing...it's all about cows, chickens and pigs for the fair here. The 4-H group we would join doesn't have many kids DD's age and most are boys.

 

 

In my troop, when I was a child, we never had homework from girl scouts when we were little. All of our badges were earned during our girl scout meetings. Is that not possible anymore? I was not crafty or woodsy so when I got towards late middle school and high school when it was more independent I dropped it.

 

[pitterpatter]

We are Christian but not conservatively so. Our family is very diverse (multi-racial, many adopted kids, gay) as well, so...

 

Having said that, DD won't be marching in any politically hot parades. That's not our thing. Doubt what would even occur around here...we are small, rural and live in the Bible Belt.

 

 

It's also very liberal. Our local Girl Scouts choosier has several vocal transgender members and one of the troops marched in the gay pride parade in their uniforms and holding the banner, at 12 years old.

The manuals themselves are a strange spiritual bent about finding truth inside and some other odd things I disagreed with.

Even the women they choose as women of the year are extremely vocal pro abortion supporters and such.

It's not that I am against all diversity. However, it's bent so far left that I think a Christian with traditional values and worldview would be totally out of place.

We will be looking into 4h instead.

 

[In The Great White North]

How back in the day? We had badges. That was end of the 70s early 80s.

 

I would have been a Brownie in 71-72, with orange paperback manual and the dark brown dress. There were no badges. When you got close to Juniors, you could work on getting your "flying up" wings. That was it.

[2_girls_mommy]

We have been in scouting for 7 yrs now.  The badge books just went away completely in the last 2 yrs.  Before that they were phasing them out, trying to get people to do the journeys, but you could still do the old try its and badges (for the older girls.)   The daisy petals are still fun and appropriate and not much different than the daisy program was a few years ago.  I have no problem doing daisies and never touching a journey book. 

 

There are enough Legacy Brownie badges in the Brownie handbook that you can fill a year or two w/them and never have to touch the stupid journeys, once you mix in field trips, parties, and a sleepover or campout somewhere.

 

But once they hit Junior (4th grade) they have to complete a journey to begin work on a bronze award and in each level up to earn the subsequent silver and gold awards.  These awards at this point are the main reason we stay with scouts since all of the changes, besides our friendships in our troop of course.   The gold award does really mean something like a boy scout eagle project.  Very few girls go all of the way and earn it.

 

The journeys are just wishy washy fluff.  There is nothing to them.  They aim to  teach about feelings, peer pressure and junk like that, but the teaching actually only happens through girl discussion.  There are no real skills in the T.Ms to teach them.  Just talk about it and let them tell their experiences and make some posters and silly stuff along the way.  There are some that teach about the environment and you can work some science badges into it if you can make it work.  Figuring out how the badges fit into the journeys is not easy either.  The books are just hard to follow.

 

It is just FLUFF.  There is no learning real life skills.  There is no learning camping and such, at least in the main curriculum which is the legacy badges listed in the girls' books and the journey that they want everyone to do.  There are some hiking and skills badges that you can work into the programs.  Of course, now you have to buy those pages separately and one for every girls' handbook.  Before in the large try it books all of the badges were listed in one book that you had to buy.  Now everything is separate, making it harder to find them and much more expensive.

 

I am pretty negative about the journeys.  I went to GSU at our council this summer and EVERYONE is negative about them.  No leaders of any troop liked them.  Seriously, it was all us asking questions about how to make them work and why we have to do them.  The GS paid employees running the GSU were just totally being apologetic and alternately trying to get us to be excited about them.  But experienced leaders that have been doing this for a few years realize what a crummy curriculum it really is. 

[...................]

So sad!  When I was in Brownies, (this would be 1986), there were tons and tons of badges and we had to EARN them ourselves, with the help of parents of course.  The ONLY projects we earned badges for together were camping and field trip stuff.  I used to pick a project, go home, work on it myself, and then go back and get a badge. My mom was a great mom in that she helped me but she NEVER did it FOR me.  I had less badges than some of the other girls but I was very proud of my badges. What a shame.

 

About 4H, I am trying to get on the wait list for my local chapter.  4H works like this- you may want to start a new thread...but basically you go there to the meeting and you sign up for a project.  Then, as a team, you work on a project.  You can be involved in several projects.  Our local 4H even has a pygmy goat project and an agreement with a mini ranch on a public park site that you can board your goat at!  THey do bunnies, LEGO robotics and many other projects.  Public speaking and leadership are very much encouraged.  They have uniforms and march in parades and get involved with the community.  There are not a lot of badges.  There are pins, but the kids aren't about earning pins and badges.  It's more of very long term goals and efforts, not tons of badges and pins.  This is my limited understanding.

 

 

[tabinfl]

My fuzzy recollection of Girl Scouts involved a lot of crafts as a Brownie, then badges (most very similar to the Boy Scouts I knew) and lots of outdoor activities. My Junior(?) troop was led by my best friend's mother, and we had meetings at her house. They were very outdoors-y people, and we learned knot tying, building campfilres, hiking, camping, orienteering (in the snow!), and so on. I remember working on some badge activities outside of troop meetings, others as a group. I got about halfway to the "First Class" award, which at the time required us to earn 4 little buttons with different colored paths on them. I don't remember what they stood for, haha. I do recall one of our bigger projects was planning, preparing, hosting, and serving a fancy tea for our mothers. Setting a formal table was apparently considered a crucial life skill for girls in the 70s. :) To be fair, we learned plenty of more practical skills as well; I distincly reccall my partner and I winning a campfire-building contest where we had to get a fire started with only materials we could find around our campsite and two wooden matches. I remember doing a first aid badge, a stamp collecting badge, and some kind or writing badge.

 

I just started a Girl Scout troop for my daughters, as there is a waiting list in my area due to a shortage of volunteers. We have Daisies & Brownies, and it is very different from what I remember, though some of the badges don't seem to have changed much. The leader information is a bit confusing, but in the training we were encouraged to use the books as a guideline and modify things to fit our troop, and that is what I was doing.

 

The materials don't seem very well thought-out, IMO, and there is a lot of fluff. With some thought and effort on the leaders' part, though, I think there are some really good themes in there. If we focus on the badges as they have always been intended -- as a demonstration of things we have learned well enough to give service to others -- instead of on who can fill up their vest the fastest, I believe it has a lot of potential to fill in some of the life skills that are not taught in school (and which, sadly, many kids don't get at home either). There are connections from level to leve, so each of the journeys and badges (except the Daisy petals, which focus only on the GS Law) can be stepping stones to higher levels of knowlegde and achievment in each subject area. This is all a huge difference from my GS days, when there was no real continuity or "big picture" thinking.

 

Another nice change is that community service projects have taken on a new dimension with the "Take Action" projects that are to be not only a benefit to others, but also at least minimally sustainable in some way. Conducting a food drive is great, but even better is also collecting recipes that are both healthy and can be made woith low-cost foods. Cleaning up litter in a park could become a clean-up day plus letters to the city asking for more trash cans to be installed in the areas that have the worst mess.

 

Even the fundraising has been expanded from simply a way to earn money for troop activities to a whole financial literacy and business skills program. I love this part, and I intend to make the most of it for my girls (my own daughters, and our eniire troop). We kicked off our fall product sale with earning one of the money "leaves" ofr the Daisies -- going over the different coins and bills (these are K & 1st graders), how much different fun things cost (e.g. going to the movies vs. Disney World), and what things they can do for fun that don't ccost anything. We also discussed different ways they can approach people to ask them to buy the candy, setting sales goals, and thinking about what they will have to do to reach those goal (for example, a girl who wants to earn the 50-item prize will have to do more than just ask a few friends & relatives).

 

There are some who are upset that GS sems to be embracing traditionally "liberal" values like helping the environment, others who don't like the policy decisions about religion and homosexuality (some who believe they've gone too far, others who think they haven't gone far enough), some who (IMO) don't like the idea of women being empowered to begin with so find ways to tear down Girl Scouts and push girls into conservative, usually religious groups that focus on homemaking skills rather than changing the world, and a few who oppose any change at all just because it's different.

 

Personally, I'm willing to give it a chance, despite its flaws, because I believe Girl Scouting has something fairly unique to offer and I want my girls to have every opportunity to learn, experience, and grow into strong, confident, successful women.

[2_girls_mommy]

We are staying with it too.  And we have been able to modify their stuff and keep busy w/badgework and service projects too.  I agree.  But I will never be positive about the new curriculum.  I hope that they will take our comments and repeated complaints seriously enough to rethink when they do the next round of rewrites and deciding the next phase and direction of scouting.

[In The Great White North]

 

Another nice change is that community service projects have taken on a new dimension with the "Take Action" projects that are to be not only a benefit to others, but also at least minimally sustainable in some way. Conducting a food drive is great, but even better is also collecting recipes that are both healthy and can be made woith low-cost foods. Cleaning up litter in a park could become a clean-up day plus letters to the city asking for more trash cans to be installed in the areas that have the worst mess.

 

I disagree.

 

"Sustainable" has been a requirement for Bronze/Silver/Gold Award projects for some time and is a problem.  Essentially, a girl cannot complete a service project.  It has to continue AFTER she is gone.  IOW, she has to make up a project FOR SOMEONE ELSE TO DO.  (Who is going to empty those trash cans for the next 20 years?  Not her!)  This has led to organizations being unwilling to sponsor Gold Projects (yes, they have to be sponsored by an outside, nonprofit organization.)

 

That this requirement has worked its way down to Journeys is an inhibiter to "girl accomplishment" of any service project.

[2_girls_mommy]

We ran into that in a gold award for a girl in our troop.  That was one of the reasons they say they rejected hers.

[Library Momma]

I think a lot of regional differences come into play.  When I was both a brownie and Junior (mid 70s) we definitely earned badges. Some we worked on with the troop and some we could complete on our own.  In my town of about 10,000 people there was one troop at each level, so maybe 4 troops total.

 

My daughter just bridged to Cadettes and has been in GS since she was a Daisy.  Our town of around 10,000 people has 35 troops and there are many activities on the Service Unit (entire town) level not just the troop level.  She has been able to earn badges (or try-its) all along the way in addition to working on the journeys.  The badges she has earned are very similar to the ones I earned as a kid.  Camping, cooking,archery, photography etc.  I haven't really seen touchy feely type activities aside from those discussing anti-bullying.  They also participate in STEM related events and First Lego League which is something we never did back in the day.  I think though that the focus, direction and success of the troop depends greatly on the leader.

[2_girls_mommy]

Yes,  Those are the 8 or 10 legacy badges that are available in the girl handbooks.  They are awesome.  There are much fewer actual badges available to earn now than there used to be, much, much fewer.

 

Then there are "fun patches" for archery and camping skills and the like.  That is different from the old try its and current badges.  Fun patches have no requirements.  They go on the back of the vest or sash.   They just show that you participated in an event that did that.  They are different from a badge that has specific steps they had to complete.  We have all kinds of things at the Service Unit and at the Council too (for all Service Units) where the kids can pay extra and earn those types of things too.   I filled whole years for my daisies and Brownies (I was daisy and Brownie leader for the last 5 yrs) doing petals, tryits (when they had them,) fun patches, legacy badges (since the change,) service projects, selling cookies, parties, camp outs, sleepovers, etc.  We did all of the kinds of things you are talking about as well for the kids whose parents wanted to bring them to the council and SU events.   We did pool parties and planned trips w/our cookie $ we earned, etc.  We were able to leave the silly journeys out completely at that level.

 

But, we are talking more about the curriculum for the leaders in the every day meetings in this discussion. 

 

And again, the "touchy feeling" wishy washy journeys are not required until you are junior to begin earning the Silver award.  We are working on the Amaze for Cadettes and the AMuse for juniors concurrently right now.  We have also done the "media" and I wasn't any more impressed with it.    I have glanced at the others.  There are some with a more science ( Or actually more save the environment) focus.  I haven't done those yet, but the format for them all is the same and unattractice and fluffy.

 

Anyway, I agree that there are many good things about scouting. That is why we stay.  But the journeys aren't one of them LOL

[Library Momma]

Yes,  Those are the 8 or 10 legacy badges that are available in the girl handbooks.  They are awesome.  There are much fewer actual badges available to earn now than there used to be, much, much fewer.

 

Then there are "fun patches" for archery and camping skills and the like.  That is different from the old try its and current badges.  Fun patches have no requirements.  They go on the back of the vest or sash.   They just show that you participated in an event that did that.  They are different from a badge that has specific steps they had to complete.  We have all kinds of things at the Service Unit and at the Council too (for all Service Units) where the kids can pay extra and earn those types of things too.   I filled whole years for my daisies and Brownies (I was daisy and Brownie leader for the last 5 yrs) doing petals, tryits (when they had them,) fun patches, legacy badges (since the change,) service projects, selling cookies, parties, camp outs, sleepovers, etc.  We did all of the kinds of things you are talking about as well for the kids whose parents wanted to bring them to the council and SU events.   We did pool parties and planned trips w/our cookie $ we earned, etc.  We were able to leave the silly journeys out completely at that level.

 

But, we are talking more about the curriculum for the leaders in the every day meetings in this discussion. 

 

And again, the "touchy feeling" wishy washy journeys are not required until you are junior to begin earning the Silver award.  We are working on the Amaze for Cadettes and the AMuse for juniors concurrently right now.  We have also done the "media" and I wasn't any more impressed with it.    I have glanced at the others.  There are some with a more science ( Or actually more save the environment) focus.  I haven't done those yet, but the format for them all is the same and unattractice and fluffy.

 

Anyway, I agree that there are many good things about scouting. That is why we stay.  But the journeys aren't one of them LOL

 

 

Ahh - I am only the cookie mom so mostly everything I see directed at the leaders is financial

[tabinfl]

"Sustainable" has been a requirement for Bronze/Silver/Gold Award projects for some time and is a problem. Essentially, a girl cannot complete a service project. It has to continue AFTER she is gone. IOW, she has to make up a project FOR SOMEONE ELSE TO DO. (Who is going to empty those trash cans for the next 20 years? Not her!) This has led to organizations being unwilling to sponsor Gold Projects (yes, they have to be sponsored by an outside, nonprofit organization.)

 

That this requirement has worked its way down to Journeys is an inhibiter to "girl accomplishment" of any service project.

Well, it wasn't even a consideration when I was a Girl Scout (before there was a Gold Award), so it's new to me.

 

Girls are still achieving Gold Awards, so apparently it's do-able. The journey projects don't have to be sustainable forever, just something beyond a one-time project. To me, this is a good thing. A food or clothing drive helps (and the girls in this area, at least, are still doing such things, just not as Take Action Projects), but doesn't make any lasting change. Getting even the younger girls to think about the future is a big step in a good direction.

 

Using the trash can example, presumably the emptying would be done by whoever empties the existing trash cans at the park. So the girls would have to learn something about how the city budget works and that additional funding is required to have the workers empty more trash cans, and they would have to show that the benefits outweight the costs in their proposal.

 

This would certainly make such a project more challenging, but would also make it far more meaningful. It also gets girls thinking at a higher level, which is exactly the sort of thinking they will need if they are going to become leaders in the world -- the people who decide where the trash cans go and how to get them emptied within the current municipal budget, for example. The world does need both leaders and followers, but the goal of Girl Scouts is to set girls up with the skills they need to be leaders if they so choose. This seems consistent with that mission.

[ThatHomeschoolDad]

"Sustainable" has been a requirement for Bronze/Silver/Gold Award projects for some time and is a problem.  Essentially, a girl cannot complete a service project.  It has to continue AFTER she is gone.  IOW, she has to make up a project FOR SOMEONE ELSE TO DO.  (Who is going to empty those trash cans for the next 20 years?  Not her!)  This has led to organizations being unwilling to sponsor Gold Projects (yes, they have to be sponsored by an outside, nonprofit organization.)

 

That this requirement has worked its way down to Journeys is an inhibiter to "girl accomplishment" of any service project.

 

That was not our experience with DD's Bronze project, which involved running art sessions at the local family shelter.  She did several weekly sessions, and once it was done, it was done.  The project was approved by council.

[2_girls_mommy]

Bronze and silver awards don't have to be approved by council though they sometimes try to make it seem as if they do, but when you push for answers, they actually don't.  They do encourage it to get them ready for the process of gold awards.  Our bronze awards and silver awards were awarded through council (and not pre approved ) last year and they were one time projects following the bronze guidelines too.  But we did have a gold award project not approved last year for one girl because there wasn't sustainability.  

[shawthorne44]

The sustainability thing seems odd.  My husband's Eagle Scout project is still going on but that is extremely extremely rare.  It is something that an old hippy took over after him.  It is a yearly cleaning of the lake in a major city.  But, sustainability requires community support and how many projects can a certain area support?

 

I plan on being a troop leader when my daughter is old enough.  I picked up a 70's manual at a used book store, and my husband asked why? I said, it will be more fun.  I hadn't realized, though, quite how bad it had gotten.  I loved summer camp but I never had a good troop. 

[2_girls_mommy]

I know.  It is hard to come up w/project ideas.  When I look at the 9 Gold awards that were presented last year in our council, I am not sure how many of them are sustainable.  It was odd that ours was rejected.  I think it is a goal, but it is up to the particular committee as to how serious they take it.

 

None of the many bronze awards were sustainable.  They were things like big school supply and backpack drives, you know?

[SMRB]

I would have been a Brownie in 71-72, with orange paperback manual and the dark brown dress. There were no badges. When you got close to Juniors, you could work on getting your "flying up" wings. That was it.

 

Oh boy, do I remember my flying up ceremony. White gloves, full dress uniform, breaking out of the circle of friends and then walking over the bridge, the whole bit. It was the mid 70's. Three fingers on the floor in front of you if you wanted to talk during a meeting, singing "Day is Done" to close the meetings, learning how to make a plan for the whole troop to earn one of the big patches for the back of the sash. And that was just Brownies.

 

I did 2 years of Brownies (I was always sad that I couldn't have all 3 of the triangle pixie badges on my sash!), stayed in for all of Juniors and left during Cadets because we moved and it was much too crafty and got boring. I liked the uniforms and doing real projects rather than just singing and sewing (I was a tomboy), and my Cadet troop didn't even do uniforms, never mind work on earning badges. I wanted to be an Explorer, but we moved again and there was no troop. Explorers were awesome! In Juniors, we had to keep a notebook and write up everything we did to earn a badge, and then we had to do a presentation at the troop meeting and turn in the writeup. The leaders would decide based on the presentation whether we had earned the badge (and yes, they sent kids back to do more work). I also have vivid memories of earning "I Live My Faith" and going for a special Mass with the Bishop to get the award from him.

 

Even in the 70's, it varied tremendously by state and troop, which I learned the hard way. I wanted to keep going, but the troops in our new town were terrible. Boy I wish I could recreate what I had for my daughter. I still have my full uniforms and those white gloves!

[pitterpatter]

Darn. I wish I would have known how negative the vibe was about Journeys before talking with our troop leader about spearheading a Journeys group. I've put in a lot of time preparing the first session's packet to take home, etc. DD and I plan to do them regardless because we want to do them. I thought it would be nice to include the other girls since this might be their only chance to earn those patches. Even though I wasn't impressed with everything, I think there is still good stuff to learn at the Daisy level. And, being a homeschooling mom, I'm used to beefing up curriculum that lacks here and there. I just naturally did it with the first session without thinking much about it. Now, I'm losing my confidence a bit. If everyone hates the Journeys, then my pitch to get other girls involved this week isn't going to go over well. Oh, well...I'm still going to make it work for us. We're not afraid of a little extra effort. I mean, we're homeschoolers...we live, breathe, eat extra effort.

[KungFuPanda]

I led Daisies when my 16-year-old was 5. We've been out of scouting since just before the big changes, but I do have a soft spot for that year.

 

The Daisies were kindergarteners and it lasted one year. (We got special permission to include 4-year-olds and let them be two-year Daisies, but I never heard of another troupe doing it. I had to write a ceremony for them, The Garden Ceremony, because none existed.) Daisies did not sell cookies at all and were entirely funded by dues. I thought it was nice to ease into scouts with no cookie pressure. They wore tunics instead of vests and earned petals. I loved those tunics. The pockets were so handy. How they earned those petals was entirely up to the troupe.

 

It was nice. I remember day camping with them to learn camping skills. I remember teaching them to fold a flag. They put together a Thinking Day booth. It was a decade ago, so I'd have to really think to remember more.

[pitterpatter]

While we're talking Girl Scouts, anyone do Forever Green or SWAPS?

 

http://girlscouts.org/gsforevergreen/

 

http://girlscouts.org/who_we_are/facts/swaps/

[In The Great White North]

The only place I ever saw SWAPS was at the Leader Training Weekend at a GS camp, when all the "old" Girl Scouts got together.

 

That was always a fun weekend.  We stayed in cabins or platform tents, had a polar bear swim, a campfire, a singalong, some crafts, got all the necessary certifications done, did some maintenance on the camp, etc.  No Journeys, sustainable projects, or "how do you feel about..."  Kind of reminded me of what GS used to be.

\

[chelsmm]

Just because others don't like the journey option doesn't mean that you can't make it great. :)

[tabinfl]

I've put in a lot of time preparing the first session's packet to take home, etc. DD and I plan to do them regardless because we want to do them. I thought it would be nice to include the other girls since this might be their only chance to earn those patches. Even though I wasn't impressed with everything, I think there is still good stuff to learn at the Daisy level. And, being a homeschooling mom, I'm used to beefing up curriculum that lacks here and there. I just naturally did it with the first session without thinking much about it. Now, I'm losing my confidence a bit. If everyone hates the Journeys, then my pitch to get other girls involved this week isn't going to go over well. Oh, well...I'm still going to make it work for us. We're not afraid of a little extra effort. I mean, we're homeschoolers...we live, breathe, eat extra effort.

 

This is my feeling exactly! I am glad, now, that we are a brand new troop with no "baggage" from the old way of doing things. The one Brownie who was in a Daisy troop last year is just happy to be in a troop that does more than arts & crafts every meeting and then hand out a pile of badges. I hope you continue, I think the journeys have a lot to offer -- with a little work on the leader's part -- once people get over the resistance to change. As I said before, they do seem to have a lot of fluff; on the other hand my Daisies are really into the garden story so far... they can't wait to find out what happens next! We're definitely making the journeys our own and focusing on the things that are (IMO) the core material for the "Discover, Connect, and Take Action" steps.

 

It's not easy trying to make the journeys & badges work together, or to plan for two levels at the same time, but it really isn't much different than planning homeschool. We've been given permission to alter the "suggested" sessions to meet our needs, and to interpret the badge requirements liberally, as long as we are meeting the spirit of the requirement (and after seeing some of the things that pass for fulfilling requirements at a council event, I don't think I have to worry about shortchanging the girls with my version of reading between the lines!)

 

While we're talking Girl Scouts, anyone do Forever Green or SWAPS?

 

http://girlscouts.org/gsforevergreen/

 

http://girlscouts.org/who_we_are/facts/swaps/

 

We're doing SWAPS this week as our community is having a big SWAPS event at a park in a couple of weeks -- just girls at all levels from the local area getting together to exchange SWPS and have some fun getting to know each other. Fortunately one of my co-leaders is a young lady who is a life member & not that far out of her own troop days, so she has come up with some great SWAPS for our girls to make.

[MollyAnn]

It's also very liberal. Our local Girl Scouts choosier has several vocal transgender members and one of the troops marched in the gay pride parade in their uniforms and holding the banner, at 12 years old.

 

The manuals themselves are a strange spiritual bent about finding truth inside and some other odd things I disagreed with.

 

Even the women they choose as women of the year are extremely vocal pro abortion supporters and such.

 

It's not that I am against all diversity. However, it's bent so far left that I think a Christian with traditional values and worldview would be totally out of place.

 

We will be looking into 4h instead.

I haven't read through everything, I got to this post and had to stop.

If this actually happened, the leader could have (and should have) her leadership pulled and lose her troop. Girl Scouts are not allowed to do anything remotely political or controversial (no matter what end of the spectrum) while in uniform. If you want to do it on your own time, fine. NEVER in uniform, never as a troop.

[MollyAnn]

When DD was a Daisy it was only a one year program and they only earned their petals. The Journeys for Daisies allowed it to go to a two year program and I think the Daisy Journeys are a good addition to the program.

 

For every other level they suck. They are nothing more than boring busy work for Girl Scouts.

The new handbooks/badge books are a joke. My daughter is a Cadette, age 13. I am the leader of her troop. At the meeting today she and the other girls did every requirement for two badges in the new book. This was mostly done as a joke because my girls think the new program is a joke.

Thankfully, any Girl Scout book/badges/awards are still considered official. We work mostly out of older books. When they earn an older badge we look through the new book to see if there is a dumbed down similar one so we can purchase that one for the vest. Which is why we were in the new book at the meeting. If there isn't, I use the Create Your Own Badge website.

We do a glance at the Journey to meet the requirement for the bronze/silver/gold awards, but that is all.

We are a multi-level troop, Daisy through Cadette. Brownie and up work out of older books.

 

I love Girl Scouts. With all that is available, I think it is still the best program for girls. Hopefully Journeys will go the way of Studio 2B.

[2_girls_mommy]

I don't know that parents and girls will notice and not like the journeys, honestly.  The girls have fun getting together.  WE are working on two journeys concurrently now. (Just got back from meeting.) Just because leaders don't like them, and I liked leading the old way better, doesn't mean the girls notice. They had fun because we had games including a beach ball, crafts, talking about their feelings, etc.  

 

We have had some drop out when they realize there isn't as much emphasis on camping and outdoors as they had hoped scouting would be about.  We just can't get in a lot of it with doing a journey a year, cookie sales, and then the big service project awards (Take Action, Bronze, Silver, and Golds).  But the girls have fun w/the journeys.  The parents that just drop off their kids just want their kids to have fun and make friends, you know?  We still do trips and sleepovers and fun stuff together.  And especially at your young daisy and brownie levels, they are fun.  Everything is fun when the kids get together and do activities :)  I don't think your parents are going to come in not wanting to do journeys.  Don't sweat it.

[2_girls_mommy]

MollyAnn, but how do you purchase the old tryits?  Are you ordering them online somewhere official?

[2_girls_mommy]

Oh, and SWAPS.  We see and do these mostly at Council sponsored events like camps and recruiting events.  They are fun to make, but you can't put your own on you.  You have to swap them with another troop to be official.

[MomtoCandJ]

Ugh, now I don't even want to sign dd up for Girl Scouts. She wants all the outdoorsy stuff that I remember doing in the '90s. I know our local troop isn't outdoorsy :( Are there any alternatives that are more outdoorsy? I don't mind going it alone if I have to.