2nd grade math woes. Is this just how it is?

[staceyobu]

I switched DD from Singapore 1a to Math Mammoth 1 first semester last year. Singapore seemed to be frustrating her to know end. I felt like she needed something with more repetition.

 

She is doing well now with Math Mammoth 2. I really feel like it is the right amount of review for her. She usually gets most all the problems correct (except for the whole past/till clocks thing... but I'm not worrying about that right now!).

 

She just hates it, though. She does 1-2 pages a day. She can finish in 20 minutes if she is really motivated. She can also drag it out for an hour or more when she is wasting time. I think, in part, she is bored by math. She is very strong verbally and is sort of a creative sort. She says math is a boring black and white page and you do problem after problem.

 

Is there a fix to this? Different curriculum? Supplemental curriculum? Or does she just need to suck it up and do it? Because it does seem to be getting the job done for the most part. However, I don't want her hating math, either.

[Arcadia]

She is very strong verbally and is sort of a creative sort. ... However, I don't want her hating math, either.

 

How about asking your daughter to give you math problems instead after she is done with her 1-2 pages. As in create her own math problems for you to solve based on any of the topics she has recently finished.

[briansmama]

Have you looked at Life of Fred? My oldest (3rd grade) is creative and very verbal. He loves LoF. I also have the MM worksheets to supplement but we haven't needed them everyday.

[staceyobu]

Have you looked at Life of Fred? My oldest (3rd grade) is creative and very verbal. He loves LoF. I also have the MM worksheets to supplement but we haven't needed them everyday.

 

We have the apples book. She seems to like it when I read it, but always complains when I get it out.

[OrdinaryTime]

I second maybe trying out Life of Fred as a supplement. My kids are very verbal and love Fred.

 

Also, if she hates tons of worksheets, maybe do more of the drilling of facts and review via games or apps. I only use paper to introduce new topics, show a concept in an interesting visual way, do word problems, and cement any difficult areas. Everything else we cover through games using cards and c-rods or iPad apps.

 

If my kids viewed math as just a set of worksheets each day, they would hate it, too!

[Chelli]

My verbal daughter really resonated with MEP math.

 

I think she enjoys that I am with her for the entire lesson, talking over problems, figuring out strategies, etc.

 

She also loves the puzzle/challenging type aspect. It is definitely not a page of doing the same thing over and over again!!!

[lea1]

I tried Singapore and MM also. My sons hated MM and said the same thing your daughter has said. I finally decided to try something spiral for the first time and chose CLE Math and my sons really love it.

 

Switching to spiral was definitely what made the difference for my guys. Since it has a little of this and a little of that (coins, add, subtract, story problems, time lines, etc. in one lesson, along with drills and flash cards, they don't feel that they just sit and do work sheet after work sheet. There is a bit more interaction with me and there is more variety in the problems they are doing, which they like. They have both said they never want to see another MM worksheet again, which was a bummer because I had already purchased the materials for 2nd grade. But I would rather they enjoy math as much as possible and we are definitely more there now than ever before.

 

Good luck!

[staceyobu]

I tried Singapore and MM also. My sons hated MM and said the same thing your daughter has said. I finally decided to try something spiral for the first time and chose CLE Math and my sons really love it.

 

Switching to spiral was definitely what made the difference for my guys. Since it has a little of this and a little of that (coins, add, subtract, story problems, time lines, etc. in one lesson, along with drills and flash cards, they don't feel that they just sit and do work sheet after work sheet. There is a bit more interaction with me and there is more variety in the problems they are doing, which they like. They have both said they never want to see another MM worksheet again, which was a bummer because I had already purchased the materials for 2nd grade. But I would rather they enjoy math as much as possible and we are definitely more there now than ever before.

 

Good luck!

 

Hmmm... what other spiral options are there?

 

I did just purchase math mammoth 1-6. :glare:

[Alte Veste Academy]

 

She usually gets most all the problems correct

 

She just hates it...

 

She can finish in 20 minutes if she is really motivated. She can also drag it out for an hour or more when she is wasting time. I think, in part, she is bored by math. She is very strong verbally and is sort of a creative sort. She says math is a boring black and white page and you do problem after problem.

 

Is there a fix to this? Different curriculum? Supplemental curriculum? Or does she just need to suck it up and do it? Because it does seem to be getting the job done for the most part. However, I don't want her hating math, either.

 

I vote that she is a bright girl who is bored by codes she's already cracked. :tongue_smilie:

 

No, no, no to the sucking up and doing it. Not at 7. I have been there with DS9 and what he needed to see is the beauty of math. He's a puzzler by nature. He wanted to solve problems, not work algorithms. I have learned (over the past 3.5 years with him :willy_nilly::lol:) that the curriculum matters less than presentation. If I turn things around with him, ask him questions to get him to figure out the lesson instead of me teaching him the lesson, we were golden. Math Mammoth was the MOST hated because it broke everything down so much and spoon fed it. He didn't get to puzzle anything out with MM. Except puzzle corner itself. He thought that was alright. :tongue_smilie: It took a long time for me to figure this out though.

 

With him, I stopped math for a time because he was good at it, really good at it and I did not want him to hate it. I told him that, using those exact words, very frankly. I told him that he was a born puzzler and a natural mathematician. I explained to him the difference between mathematics (beautiful) and arithmetic (drudgery...to him at least...I quite like it :lol:). I told him that we were going to take a break from math while Mom figured out how to teach it properly to a natural born mathematician. This built him up and decreased his disdain for the subject immediately. :tongue_smilie: I supplement the heck out of math for him. Still. When he works on a concept, I see that he understands it and give him very few problems to work, for practice.

 

The thing about not making the kids suck it up from the early years is that the dislike can be fixed. It is just going to take some work. Life of Fred, Kitchen Table Math, Beast Academy (heck, everything AoPS), games, videos, books--anything and everything besides working formulas--were able to win over DS9 in the end. Now he would tell you that he enjoys math but doesn't like arithmetic. I'll take it! :D

[lea1]

Hmmm... what other spiral options are there?

 

I did just purchase math mammoth 1-6. :glare:

 

I'm not really sure, except I have read that Saxon is spiral and I think I have read that R&S has a spiral math program also. I'm sure there are probably others but, for some reason, CLE just caught my eye....meaning I had seen a lot of threads/posts of people using it with success and their children really liking it. If you do a search on spiral math or maybe just the word spiral, you will likely find a lot of threads on it.

[SnowWhite]

We like BJU Math- it's colorful and arranged in mastery style so you can skip chapters if she already knows the concept.

 

Another option would be Teaching Textbooks- I am sure she could start with Gr. 3 in that program (scope and sequence is a bit behind all other programs), and it's colorful with lots of review, and it's got little animations which are fun (it's a computer program).

[*Lulu*]

Saxon is spiral.

 

We use Saxon here, but until they start intermediate 3 we try to avoid pen and paper. We cover the lesson, (supplementing with pertinent pages of Miquon), and do the practice and exercise problems using white boards, counters, magnetic pattern blocks, c-rods, stamps, stickers, or other manipulative items.

[dereksurfs]

I tried Singapore and MM also. My sons hated MM and said the same thing your daughter has said. I finally decided to try something spiral for the first time and chose CLE Math and my sons really love it.

 

Switching to spiral was definitely what made the difference for my guys. Since it has a little of this and a little of that (coins, add, subtract, story problems, time lines, etc. in one lesson, along with drills and flash cards, they don't feel that they just sit and do work sheet after work sheet. There is a bit more interaction with me and there is more variety in the problems they are doing, which they like. They have both said they never want to see another MM worksheet again, which was a bummer because I had already purchased the materials for 2nd grade. But I would rather they enjoy math as much as possible and we are definitely more there now than ever before.

 

Good luck!

 

We also tried mastery programs first using both MUS and MM (purchased the full 1st-6th as well) and had similar experiences with our daughters. Then we switched to CLE which is more of a spiral approach and they liked the variety much more. CLE presents a single concept using multiple approaches. We also like the way CLE introduces more advanced topics in gentle ways earlier on. CLE is one of the most affordable programs to test out with the light unit booklets.

Edited October 30, 2012 by dereksurfs

[wapiti]

I vote that she is a bright girl who is bored by codes she's already cracked.

....

 

The thing about not making the kids suck it up from the early years is that the dislike can be fixed. It is just going to take some work. Life of Fred, Kitchen Table Math, Beast Academy (heck, everything AoPS), games, videos, books:D

 

:iagree: I'd be willing to bet this is the case. First, are you assigning all the problems? Is that too many? (For pages with lots of problems, the author recommends assigning some fraction.) Second, I'd be willing to see if she can accelerate through to a level/place more appropriate for her current skills. MM is easily tweakable, and I'd even consider using a white board and consolidating lessons if MM is too incremental for her. Another option might be to switch back to SM. And/or, as described above, really mix it up with Kitchen Table Math, Beast Academy, etc. There are a lot of ways to skin this cat, and it may not be necessary to throw the baby out with the bathwater, i.e., you may still find plenty of use for your MM 1-6 even if you don't use it straight through.

[mom31257]

Another vote for BJU Math here! It has bright pages and fun, colorful manipulatives to use with many of the lessons. Each books has characters that have a story for each chapter. The younger grades even have stick puppets of those characters. The CD-Rom is full of extra practice pages, enrichment pages, etc. I would not buy any older editions, though. You only want the current editions.

[blakereese]

I vote that she is a bright girl who is bored by codes she's already cracked. :tongue_smilie:

 

 

 

:iagree: And I agree with a lot Alte Veste mentioned.

 

This was sort of how my son was late last year and early this year. I put aside our regular curriculum (also MM) and we have been doing Beast Academy and Life of Fred. My son loves it! I think he just needed to see how math can be fun and how everyday it is, iykwim. It isn't just worksheets and getting through the next chapter or section, it is real and live and breathing.

 

Also, anytime something comes up that has to do with some sort of math, we talk about it and work on it. Like when I have a 40% off coupon at Michael's...what can we buy? How much will it be after the discount? Or today we were baking and making double recipes, so I asked him to help figure out measurements. Gas prices and what it costs to fill our tanks. Etc. I like to show him how I use math in my every day activities and how mental math is important. He likes the challenges and is proud to come up with the answers, more than he would be on a worksheet.

 

I am planning to go back to MM in a bit and sort of pick up where we left off and continue with the other supplements as well. I think there is value in MM (and many other math programs) but sometimes it is nice to go in another direction to get the same (or even better!) results.

[crazyforlatin]

I did just purchase math mammoth 1-6. :glare:

 

Don't think you've wasted money. I agree with wapiti. MM still has value for an accelerated child or one who grasps concepts quickly. It sounds like your DD may need something in addition to MM, and Alte has already given some great ideas.

[Alte Veste Academy]

We have the apples book. She seems to like it when I read it, but always complains when I get it out.

 

I meant to address this too. When DD9 was not liking math, he didn't like any math, by association. :lol: Stepping back and then reintroducing the subject in a fun, puzzley, real-life way fixed him up. He now loves Fred.

 

:iagree: I'd be willing to bet this is the case. First, are you assigning all the problems? Is that too many? (For pages with lots of problems, the author recommends assigning some fraction.) Second, I'd be willing to see if she can accelerate through to a level/place more appropriate for her current skills. MM is easily tweakable, and I'd even consider using a white board and consolidating lessons if MM is too incremental for her. Another option might be to switch back to SM. And/or, as described above, really mix it up with Kitchen Table Math, Beast Academy, etc. There are a lot of ways to skin this cat, and it may not be necessary to throw the baby out with the bathwater, i.e., you may still find plenty of use for your MM 1-6 even if you don't use it straight through.

 

Yes, you have 2 more kids. And I have occasionally pulled out MM even for DS9 when I feel a topic's coverage is better.

 

:iagree: And I agree with a lot Alte Veste mentioned.

 

This was sort of how my son was late last year and early this year. I put aside our regular curriculum (also MM) and we have been doing Beast Academy and Life of Fred. My son loves it! I think he just needed to see how math can be fun and how everyday it is, iykwim. It isn't just worksheets and getting through the next chapter or section, it is real and live and breathing.

 

Also, anytime something comes up that has to do with some sort of math, we talk about it and work on it. Like when I have a 40% off coupon at Michael's...what can we buy? How much will it be after the discount? Or today we were baking and making double recipes, so I asked him to help figure out measurements. Gas prices and what it costs to fill our tanks. Etc. I like to show him how I use math in my every day activities and how mental math is important. He likes the challenges and is proud to come up with the answers, more than he would be on a worksheet.

 

I am planning to go back to MM in a bit and sort of pick up where we left off and continue with the other supplements as well. I think there is value in MM (and many other math programs) but sometimes it is nice to go in another direction to get the same (or even better!) results.

 

Yes, real life uses for math was what brought DS back. He needs to see the point.

[kristinannie]

She would love Right Start B.

[staceyobu]

Thanks for the suggestions. I'm not sure exactly what the issue is with her.

 

She struggled with singapore because it seemed to leap ahead too quickly. She got extremely frustrated (crying) because she didn't know what to do. Sometimes with math mammoth, she really loses it if she doesn't immediately know the answer. Reading and writing come extremely easy to her. Part of me thinks that she struggles with having to work hard at something and would rather just not do it. When she does 20 problems, she seems to enjoy being able to easily get the answers to some. When we do less problems, then it seems like she stays constantly frustrated at trying to work so hard.

 

I've thought she might like more creative... so I ordered a LOF book to try. But, she complains if we read a chapter of that for math time too. (Her five year old brother loves it, though.)

 

We do supplement with computer math games and she enjoys that. I used to do more on the white board but haven't done as much of that kind of stuff recently. Maybe we'll try that tomorrow and see how it goes.

[LittleIzumi]

My verbal daughter really resonated with MEP math.

 

I think she enjoys that I am with her for the entire lesson, talking over problems, figuring out strategies, etc.

 

She also loves the puzzle/challenging type aspect. It is definitely not a page of doing the same thing over and over again!!!

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree: It is spiral as well, and something different every day. My dd also struggled with Singapore's jumps and MM worked but dragged. MEP is golden for her.

Edited October 30, 2012 by LittleIzumi

[campmom]

Did you buy the download of MM if so print it out in color, it doesn't have to be black and white. Also the author says that you can skip around somewhat to break things up if a chapter is to long or drawn out on the same thing go to a different chapter like time or money or measurement and letter her do some fun math to break up the other basic stuff. You will still eventually cover it all.

[mom@shiloh]

True confession: I can never figure out what approach my kids need. The discussions about incremental vs. spiral vs. mastery give me a headache. Another true confession: I have ten children and have been homeschooling forever and have never had a child tell me they love math until now. I switched my 9 yo dd to CLE and she's told me three times -- in one day. She begs to do more. Good 'nuf.