Everyday Math is Like Singapore!

[Paige]

I shared my concerns about Everyday Math with my son's teacher (afterschoolers this year), and I was dumbfounded when she said that she'd been told Everyday Math was like Singapore. :001_huh: I have no idea what I said immediately after because I was so shocked that this is the line that teachers are being fed. We use MM at home, which I've heard is similar to Singapore in many ways, and EM is nothing like that.

 

Has anyone else heard the story that Everyday Math is like Singapore? In what way could this be true? In my experience, EM is at least a year behind MM, and even the teacher said my DS, who I don't consider mathematically gifted, is far ahead of the other students in her class.

 

This came up because I am trying to find a way for my kids to attend school this year but not be subjected to EM. In this discussion, I shared why it bothered me, and suggested Singapore as an alternative because it has just been started by other schools in our district. His teacher has not been using EM math long and is a very math oriented and loving person. I can tell that, although she couldn't speak freely, she shares some of my frustrations with the program, and she teaches and allows kids to use normal math algorithms. She's even going to let me send MM in for him to use during their study hall type of period and said she'd be happy to help him with it and would make special tests for him that incorporate MM type questions. I'm not faulting her at all- she's never seen Singapore Math or MM. I'd like to speak to the principal too and see if I can get any exception for the math for all my kids and possibly spark a desire in them to switch to a different curriculum for the benefit of all the kids. It would be nice if I could find some reputable sources showing the real differences between EM and Singapore or MM.

[wapiti]

I don't have any sources to point to, but I bet the misunderstanding involves the supposed focus on concepts with both EM and SM. Simplisticly, I would describe the difference as EM on the concept end of a spectrum, traditional math on the other, algorithm end, and SM in the middle. That doesn't get anywhere close to describing all my objections to EM, but that would be where I'd start with a teacher (in fact, that's what I discussed with a teacher recently).

 

It sounds like you have quite a google search in front of you, but it might be out there someplace - there are lots of articles on EM. Here's a start (LOL, ehow) http://www.ehow.com/about_5489946_everyday-mathematics-vs-singapore-mathematics.html

 

FWIW, my ds used MM in his classroom last year with his teacher's blessing, and lo and behold, the school bought it and will be using it for three grade levels this school year. For this school, MM is both logistically more convenient and much less expensive than SM.

 

eta, here http://kitchentablemath.blogspot.com/2007/12/singapore-math-v-everyday-math-you-be.html

http://blog.coreknowledge.org/2010/10/06/singapore-math-is-our-dirty-little-secret/

http://oilf.blogspot.com/2010/10/how-to-make-singapore-math-sound-like.html

Edited August 24, 2012 by wapiti

[brett_ashley]

I don't have any sources to point to, but I bet the misunderstanding involves the supposed focus on concepts with both EM and SM.

 

:iagree: Both curricula claim strong number-sense development as their biggest strength.

[Paige]

FWIW, my ds used MM in his classroom last year with his teacher's blessing, and lo and behold, the school bought it and will be using it for three grade levels this school year. For this school, MM is both logistically more convenient and much less expensive than SM.

 

Thanks for the links!

 

I am so happy to hear that your school switched to MM. Did you suggest it or did they see how well it worked for your son and look into it on their own? I'd love for my school to do that. The teacher was very interested in the samples I gave her- especially when I said my DS was just working on grade level and not accelerated.

 

I think you are right about why they think Singapore and EM are similar. She was talking about how they taught different ways of finding the answers. I think the difference is in the spiral and (IMO) random ways EM introduces topics and in the level of mastery expected. I told her that MM was more similar to Singapore and she was surprised when she looked at DS's pages which are nothing like those in EM. My poor DS is so, so, so bored and frustrated during math class. My poor girls are worse- they are completely overwhelmed with 9- 9!!!- different concepts on 1 page. Their old school used Harcourt before we pulled them out and that had too many concepts at one time for them. The EM has even more concepts at once than Harcourt! And- it is covering things in 3rd that they should have mastered in 1st.

[plansrme]

She means "similar" like "Satan" and "Gabriel" are similar. EM/Satan= evil; SM=perfect, but they're both angels, I mean math programs. That must be what she means...

 

Terri

[Impish]

She means "similar" like "Satan" and "Gabriel" are similar. EM/Satan= evil; SM=perfect, but they're both angels, I mean math programs. That must be what she means...

 

Terri

I was gonna go w/, "They have numbers"

[Kathryn]

I was gonna go w/, "They have numbers"

 

Me too!

[Dmmetler]

I expect it has more to do with some of the strategies taught and maybe mental math. But I have to say that I would take a traditional, algorithm-based math program over EM and ADD the conceptual stuff rather than try to deal with EM, which seems to do a poor job of actually teaching math for almost every kid who isn't completely math intuitive.

[plansrme]

I was gonna go w/, "They have numbers"

 

Well, yeah, but EM hates numbers, and sees them as a necessary evil; SM loves numbers, embraces them in fact. If EM could get schools to buy into a math program without numbers, say if they only used rainbows and leprechauns and hippies singing, "He's Got the Whole World in His Hands," they would.

 

Terri

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

If I'm not wrong, I think they are both considered "spiral" programs rather than mastery programs.

 

My kids had EM at school. Ds1's first grade teacher told me the teachers didn't like it and were documenting how it doesn't work well. But, as far as I know (based on seeing the neighbor kid's math homework last year) they are still using EM. One of the many reasons I'm glad we're out of there.

[wapiti]

If I'm not wrong, I think they are both considered "spiral" programs rather than mastery

 

SM is mastery.

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

SM is mastery.

 

Well, then, I guess I have no idea how they could be considered the same! :D

[Sahamamama]

I was gonna go w/, "They have numbers"

 

:iagree:Me, too.

 

She means "similar" like "Satan" and "Gabriel" are similar. EM/Satan= evil; SM=perfect, but they're both angels, I mean math programs. That must be what she means...

 

Terri

 

But I like the evil/good angel analogy better. And, EM doesn't exactly think numbers matter, does it?

[Farrar]

I was gonna go w/, "They have numbers"

 

They both have textbooks. Both printed on paper. Both in color. Both have the word "math" in the title...

 

They can both be taught... no wait, that's only true of one of them...

[Matryoshka]

My mom, a retired 2nd-grade teacher, has fed me that line.

 

She says Chicago University (who originated EM) went out and studied the "best" of all the international math programs (of which Singapore is arguably the best), and consolidated what they learned into EM.

 

Something got lost in translation...

[Twilight Woods]

My mom, a retired 2nd-grade teacher, has fed me that line.

 

She says Chicago University (who originated EM) went out and studied the "best" of all the international math programs (of which Singapore is arguably the best), and consolidated what they learned into EM.

 

Something got lost in translation...

 

:iagree:

[Perry]

She says Chicago University (who originated EM) went out and studied the "best" of all the international math programs (of which Singapore is arguably the best), and consolidated what they learned into EM.

 

Something got lost in translation...

I've heard that too. Wonder why they felt the need to improve on the best?

[ErinE]

Our school district used EM for the regular track and Singapore for the gifted. I think the argument for EM being similar to Singapore is if trained teachers teach it properly it is conceptual. Unfortunately, I think it's used like most math programs, emphasizing algorithm over concepts. EM, like many things, is good in theory, a disaster in practice.

[Perry]

I don't recall dancing as part of the SM curriculum.

[Ghee]

I don't recall dancing as part of the SM curriculum.

 

Wait...this is part of a MATH curriculum? Our elementary school has been teaching it to Kindergarten students every year for....um, I don't know, a minimum of 9 years. It is taught by the music teacher, though. I hate that song. H-A-T-E it! Probably because I watched it in the K program EVERY year that my kids went through, and always felt embarassed for the poor music teacher who did it with the students (only she faced toward the stage, away from the audience, meaning she was doing the "pee pee" dance with her rump shaking in our faces...) I had no idea it was supposed to be part of a math curriculum.

 

Where can I find samples of EM? I'd love to see what looking like you have a bathroom emergency while singing non-sense words has to do with math. I'm not math-y, at all!, so maybe it will make sense to me? LOL

[Paige]

I don't recall dancing as part of the SM curriculum.

 

I had no idea that was EM! My kids did that song all through preschool and in their K at their old school. That district had just switched to Harcourt. I wonder if they did EM before that and had recently switched but kept the tootie ta? I hate the tootie ta! The kids, of course, love it, but I'd rather stick with the hokey pokey if they're going to do something like that.

[Perry]

Wait...this is part of a MATH curriculum?

Yes, and you have to spend a day at an inservice to learn it.

 

I don't have a problem with kindergartners learning chants and dances, but this particular one is insipid and boring. And it's got nothing to do with math.

 

Plus, you just can't beat the Hokey Pokey.

[Perry]

 

Where can I find samples of EM? I'd love to see what looking like you have a bathroom emergency while singing non-sense words has to do with math. I'm not math-y, at all!, so maybe it will make sense to me? LOL

 

5th grade:

 

A. If math were a color, it would be –, because –.

B. If it were a food, it would be –, because –.

C. If it were weather, it would be –, because –.

[snowbeltmom]

5th grade:

 

A. If math were a color, it would be –, because –.

B. If it were a food, it would be –, because –.

C. If it were weather, it would be –, because –.

 

You saved me from typing out the questions. Everyday Math is a train wreck.

[angela in ohio]

She means "similar" like "Satan" and "Gabriel" are similar. EM/Satan= evil; SM=perfect, but they're both angels, I mean math programs. That must be what she means...

 

Terri

 

I was gonna go w/, "They have numbers"

 

Well, yeah, but EM hates numbers, and sees them as a necessary evil; SM loves numbers, embraces them in fact. If EM could get schools to buy into a math program without numbers, say if they only used rainbows and leprechauns and hippies singing, "He's Got the Whole World in His Hands," they would.

 

Terri

 

:lol: You guys are awesome.

 

I was going to say because the high-priced marketing rep for EM says so.

 

My sil, no math scholar herself, is a 4th grade teacher *freaking out* because their school si switching to EM. All of the teachers have looked at it and said that it is awful, but the one teacher who makes this decision is all wrapped up in the EM rah-rah and can't be reasoned with.

 

Whenever my dds are having a rough time with their math, we joke about journaling how they feel about the number 3 instead. :D

[ondreeuh]

I had no idea that was EM! My kids did that song all through preschool and in their K at their old school. That district had just switched to Harcourt. I wonder if they did EM before that and had recently switched but kept the tootie ta? I hate the tootie ta! The kids, of course, love it, but I'd rather stick with the hokey pokey if they're going to do something like that.

 

My preschooler did that last year at a "camp" with a woman who is absolutely not an EM math teacher. She sang "Roo-sta-ta." I think it must be a camp song. The kids did love it, but they were PK-3.

[Paige]

My 3rd graders math last night said, "Write an essay on why it is important to save money." :confused: I told them they were absolutely not going to do that. Of course, I think saving money is important but they are beginning 3rd grade and I do not want to suffer through them trying to "write an essay," especially for their math homework.

[MrsBasil]

5th grade:

 

A. If math were a color, it would be –, because –.

B. If it were a food, it would be –, because –.

C. If it were weather, it would be –, because –.

 

:eek::svengo:

 

That's asinine.

 

This is the math program our local schools use.

[Dmmetler]

That's a Dr. Jean song, and it theoretically teaches phonemic awareness. She has math ones, too, but that's not one of them. One of the most embarrassing in-services I ever went to was ALL that sort of stuff, being taught to adults as though we were four years old.

[StephanieZ]

If I'm not wrong, I think they are both considered "spiral" programs rather than mastery programs.

 

My kids had EM at school. Ds1's first grade teacher told me the teachers didn't like it and were documenting how it doesn't work well. But, as far as I know (based on seeing the neighbor kid's math homework last year) they are still using EM. One of the many reasons I'm glad we're out of there.

 

SM is definitely a mastery program. Not spiral. (Like any arithmetic program, it repeats concepts at various levels over the years, of course.)