EmilyK Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 I realize this is pretty random, but I'm hoping someone here can give me some ideas. My dad died this week. He did not want to be buried in a military cemetery (his ashes are going to be interred in my parents' church), so we are not looking to "qualify" for any of that. He was in the Air Force for 5 years, and was a navigator in Korea, serving as a lieutenant and captain. I'm sure he was honorably discharged and have a vague memory of him showing me the papers years ago. He never really liked to talk about Korea when I was young. In recent years, my sons have been really interested (I am an only child and my kids are his only grandkids) and he put together a shadow box for them of his medals and badges, and scanned a bunch of photos he had. He had Parkinson's and a few years ago I urged my folks to go to the VA and see if he could qualify for any physical therapy and the like. At first they said my parents couldn't find the records and then they said they did, but when they went to the VA they found out they had a bit too much pension income to qualify for anything. As it turns out, my parents didn't really discuss his death and things he'd like to happen. And of course, my fault for not bringing issues up and assuming my mom would know what he would want. My dad's records are from an era that the federal records were burned in a warehouse fire. After his death, someone brought up that his family would be entitled to a flag, and that it would be a memorable keepsake for his grandsons. My mom has been looking for the paperwork. I need to go get it from her, but we've all been recovering, and I've been trying to comfort my kids, and get over missed sleep from all-nighters at the hospital, so she and I have been communicating by email and phone about this. I can post a follow up when I have the papers in hand. Her last email to me says that "the time frame for the application for discharge has expired". I don't know what that means. She also told me that after they went to the VA a few years ago, they got a letter asking for more documentation and they didn't follow up because at that time they realized he wasn't eligible for income reasons for PT at the VA. Sorry this is so long, but any thoughts welcome. Maybe I just go to a flag store, but I hate to lie to my kids about the origin of the flag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 (edited) Usually, you can request a colorguard from a local base or National Guard unit. But, you do need a little bit of proof. All you need is the DD form 214, which would be his discharge papers. The *easiest thing*? Is if your mom can find *any* of the forms listed on the first link. Otherwise, the process might take too long to receive it in time for the funeral. I'm sorry about your dad. :grouphug: http://themilitarywallet.com/documents-required-for-military-funeral-honors/ http://www.archives.gov/veterans/military-service-records/ http://www.archives.com/experts/brandt-kathleen/military-records-destroyed.html Edited August 4, 2012 by Mrs Mungo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMamaBird Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 I don't know the answer to your question, but I wanted to say :grouphug: Also, it's not your fault for not finding out his wishes. Some people just don't want to talk about after death arrangements, you didn't do anything wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuirkyKidAcademy Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 (((hugs))) I'm sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 :grouphug::grouphug: I am sorry for your loss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucyStoner Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 I would assume he did not toss those papers you recall seeing. There is certainly a chance they are in his house. We found my FIL's at the bottom of his box of ancient tax returns with his old, expired passport. It's worth digging around for it a bit if you want a colorgaurd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckymama Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 :grouphug: I lost my dad last year and my mom two years before that. It really stinks. Please be gentle on yourself in the next months :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joker Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 When my dad died, we didn't have a color guard, but the funeral director did place a flag on his casket. It was folded and handed to my mom at the cemetary. Maybe they weren't supposed to do that? We could have provided his papers, but no one asked and we weren't really thinking about it at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyK Posted August 4, 2012 Author Share Posted August 4, 2012 When my dad died, we didn't have a color guard, but the funeral director did place a flag on his casket. It was folded and handed to my mom at the cemetary. Maybe they weren't supposed to do that? We could have provided his papers, but no one asked and we weren't really thinking about it at the time. Thanks everyone for your kind advice. My kids would love all the military pageantry they can get, but I'm not sure my mom will go for that, and that's fine. Re the above, the funeral home guy said he needed the papers to do the flag. He said we could arrange it on our own, but we'd need the papers. I think I've got to see if she has the form Mrs. Mungo kindly provided information about. Later on, we plan a trip to the midwest to see where his parents are buried, and the family farm. I know his father has some sort of designation on his grave (he was in the Army in WWI). As a kid, I liked seeing the graves with flowers on them (was that Memorial Day when that happened?) My father won't have a gravestone so I guess that's N/A here. Thanks for all the good thoughts and advice. I'm not doing my best problem solving these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 Thanks everyone for your kind advice. My kids would love all the military pageantry they can get, but I'm not sure my mom will go for that, and that's fine. Re the above, the funeral home guy said he needed the papers to do the flag. He said we could arrange it on our own, but we'd need the papers. I think I've got to see if she has the form Mrs. Mungo kindly provided information about. Just so you know, it is not a ton of pageantry, and it partly depends upon the military presence in your area. The color guard removes the flag from the casket, folds it, gives it to the widow (or parent, or child, depending upon circumstances) and says, "this flag is presented on behalf of a grateful nation and the United States Army as a token of appreciation for your loved one's honorable and faithful service." At least, that is what an Army representative would say, each service is a little bit different. Then, they will play taps. So, it is not overwhelming, it doesn't take over the service, nothing like that. Back when he was a LT my husband did funeral details and considered it a real honor to serve those veterans. He attended funerals all over Southern California. They ranged from having nobody but a pastor in attendance to having over a thousand people in attendance. They attend all sorts of services. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BugsMama Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 My husband used to serve on the honor guard and do funerals. Find whatever the closest military base is, they only need 24 notice, and hopefully if you explain the situation they could send out a detail. He says ask base information for "mortuary affairs" or "the honor guard". They should be able to help and work with your situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 My husband used to serve on the honor guard and do funerals. Find whatever the closest military base is, they only need 24 notice, and hopefully if you explain the situation they could send out a detail. He says ask base information for "mortuary affairs" or "the honor guard". They should be able to help and work with your situation. The numbers to call are listed on the DoD site. Usually, that is something that the funeral director arranges. http://www.militaryfuneralhonors.osd.mil/hnrs/owa/director.show_results Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyK Posted August 4, 2012 Author Share Posted August 4, 2012 Thanks, everyone. I think he had misplaced his DD214 but had a bunch of other papers in a file. I bet he pulled out the DD 214 at some point over the years, but still has the file with lots of other papers. Sounds like the VA sent a letter to him after he visited giving him 30 days to provide other paperwork, but closed the file when he didn't respond. I'm going to talk to my mom and see how she's comfortable having me proceed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyK Posted August 4, 2012 Author Share Posted August 4, 2012 Just wanted to follow up and thank you all. It has been a morning of minor miracles thanks to you all, and I appreciate it. I talked to my mom using the info and lingo you all gave me. Suddenly she had a lightbulb moment -- after them not being able to figure it out when they went to VA last year -- and went to look at the paper bag she used to clean out their safe deposit box a few months ago. In a move that makes perfect sense, my dad had put the DD 214 in their safe deposit box, so she's now located it. My husband put in a call to the funeral director. Second wonderful moment was that, in talking to my mom, she decided she would actually be happy to have someone be there to present it. I read to her what was said here about it not overwhelming the religious service, and she said "Oh, your dad would love that. I want to do it. His service was so important to him and he was glad of your and your boys' interest. He loved it when they honored veterans at church." I never thought she'd feel that way, and I wanted to do things according to her wishes, but I'm thrilled she's up for having that happen. Thanks everybody! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 I am glad that it is working out. I am sure that it is a huge relief to feel that everyone is on the same page. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyK Posted August 4, 2012 Author Share Posted August 4, 2012 I am glad that it is working out. I am sure that it is a huge relief to feel that everyone is on the same page. :grouphug: Thanks, yes. Luckily we get along great with both my family and my husband's, but it is amazing how many opportunities there would be to have miscommunications and hard feelings if that underlying good relationship weren't there. It blew my mind how many things I was asked about in my dad's last few days, and right after his death, that I didn't know how to answer. It makes me understand anew some of the difficulties people have posted here about with illness, death and funerals among family members. This has gone as well as possible, and it is still hard to navigate. thanks again for your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fraidycat Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 I'm glad things worked out and the DD214 was found. I'm sorry for your loss. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KungFuPanda Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 I'm so glad you found it! I spent a month on funeral detail all over south GA when I was enlisted. It was an amazing experience and one every veteran's family deserves if they/their loved one desire it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoriK Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 I am so sorry for your loss. I am glad that you found the papers and will get to have the flag at his service. My Dad served in WWII and the Korean War. We lost him in 2009 and the presentation of the flag at his service was very moving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommaduck Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in Australia Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 so sorry for your loss :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlebug42 Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 I am so sorry for your loss. I am glad that you found what was necessary to make all of this happen for your Dad and your kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibbygirl Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 I'm so sorry for your loss. :( :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyK Posted August 5, 2012 Author Share Posted August 5, 2012 Thanks so much, everyone, for your support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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