s/o HSLDA and Can you be a Christian: What is a Conservative Christian?

[simka2]

This forum has totally messed me up!!! :D I just realized I have no idea what this term means anymore.

 

Is it political affiliation? Devout Christian living? Fundamentalism? Evangelical?

Do you have to be some combo of the above?

 

What if you are trying to live according to biblical principles in your own life, but are politically liberal? :001_huh:

[Onceuponatime]

It is confusing. I'm sure it means different things to different people.

 

I consider myself conservative because of the way I choose to live, conserving values that are important to me. However, I'm old Earth, slightly libertarian, slightly crunchy, I listen to NPR, I'm willing to question doctrinal issues, and very slow to embrace new technology. That makes me odd in my world.

 

Here conservative often means young Earth, Fox News, Republican, visible patriotism, etc.

 

 

And I think Ron Paul is a true conservative.

Edited September 9, 2011 by Onceuponatime

[....]

I'm trying to look thru our Lutheranism 101 book to see if there is a definition. We're Lutheran and I would categorize our denomination as Conservative Christian. Our denomination recognizes the Sacraments, we agree with the Nicene and Apostles' Creed...our service is traditional...

 

I don't know. I try not to get too worried about what category we fit into... That, and I'm definitely not a theologian. :D I do have a really good recipe for chili, tho. THAT I can do...make chili...

[justamouse]

to maintain my sanity, I stopped asking myself these questions.

[twoforjoy]

In general, most people I know who would identify with "conservative Christian" are both theologically and politically conservative. I have friend who are theologically conservative but politically moderate or liberal, and they would not call themselves "conservative Christians."

 

I'm pretty theologically moderate but really politically liberal. (I'm also really personally morally conservative, in terms of how I live my own life, but that's just my nature and not because I think the things I'm not doing are necessarily wrong.) I wouldn't really identify as a "liberal Christian" because to me that means being on the same page theologically as somebody like John Shelby Spong, and I'm not there. But, I'm certainly a politically liberal Christian, and more theologically liberal than many folks (definitely more theologically liberal than most homeschoolers), even though in my own denomination I'd be very moderate-perhaps-leaning-a-bit-toward-conservative theologically.

 

It's tricky to label people.

[simka2]

It is confusing. I'm sure it means different things to different people.

 

I consider myself conservative because of the way I choose to live, conserving values that are important to me. However, I'm old Earth, slightly libertarian, slightly crunchy, I listen to NPR, I'm willing to question doctrinal issues, and very slow to embrace new technology. That makes me odd in my world.

 

Here conservative often means young Earth, Fox News, Republican, visible patriotism, etc.

 

 

And I think Ron Paul is a true conservative.

 

This is where it gets confusing!!!

[simka2]

Here is where I am coming from. I stopped considering myself a Conservative Christian a few years ago. Mainly, because my political leanings were shifting and I was questioning so many of my own beliefs about Christianity.

 

Now, I am a little more confident in my own belief system (as I learn more about EO), but that is where it ends. Politically, I am leaning more and more to the left and have great appreciation for EO's stance on the enviroment.

 

Socially, I love the concept of "keep your eyes on your own plate." (EO fasting humor ;))

 

Soooooooo.....enter the confusion. :D

[simka2]

to maintain my sanity, I stopped asking myself these questions.

 

That's my problem!!! ;)

[....]

Here is where I am coming from. I stopped considering myself a Conservative Christian a few years ago. Mainly, because my political leanings were shifting and I was questioning so many of my own beliefs about Christianity.

 

Now, I am a little more confident in my own belief system (as I learn more about EO), but that is where it ends. Politically, I am leaning more and more to the left and have great appreciation for EO's stance on the enviroment.

 

Socially, I love the concept of "keep your eyes on your own plate." (EO fasting humor ;))

 

Soooooooo.....enter the confusion. :D

 

See, I would categorize EO and RC as Conservative Christian, too... Maybe when I think Conservative Christian, I'm thinking theology and tradition.

[twoforjoy]

See, I would categorize EO and RC as Conservative Christian, too... Maybe when I think Conservative Christian, I'm thinking theology and tradition.

 

I see the EOC and RCC as having so much theological and political diversity that they need their own categories. There are liberal Catholics, moderate Catholics, conservative Catholics, etc.

[DawnM]

Here is means Bible thumping, Republican, America is the only nation truly blessed by God and who cares about the rest of the world, and a good band on Sunday mornings.

 

I am a bit cynical on the whole "religious right" thing these days.

[Parrothead]

I really think it depends on the issue at hand. Very few people are going to be politically, socially and religiously all the way to the right or to the left.

 

I know personally I'm kind of middle-of-the-road to right, middle-of-the-road to left, what I would consider far right for my church.

[forty-two]

I'm trying to look thru our Lutheranism 101 book to see if there is a definition. We're Lutheran and I would categorize our denomination as Conservative Christian. Our denomination recognizes the Sacraments, we agree with the Nicene and Apostles' Creed...our service is traditional...

See, I'm a member of the same denomination (the one that put out Lutheranism 101, anyway ;)), and I *don't* consider us to be conservative Christian. I think of "conservative Christian" as being both theologically and politically conservative, often with overtones of one's theology requiring conservative politics. We're theologically conservative, but not really politically conservative - at least, our theological position doesn't require conservative politics. I know a *very* theologically conservative Lutheran who is politically very liberal, and I feel I have a lot more in common with him than the majority of self-described "conservative Christians".

[GailV]

In general, most people I know who would identify with "conservative Christian" are both theologically and politically conservative. I have friend who are theologically conservative but politically moderate or liberal, and they would not call themselves "conservative Christians."

 

I'm pretty theologically moderate but really politically liberal. (I'm also really personally morally conservative, in terms of how I live my own life, but that's just my nature and not because I think the things I'm not doing are necessarily wrong.) I wouldn't really identify as a "liberal Christian" because to me that means being on the same page theologically as somebody like John Shelby Spong, and I'm not there. But, I'm certainly a politically liberal Christian, and more theologically liberal than many folks (definitely more theologically liberal than most homeschoolers), even though in my own denomination I'd be very moderate-perhaps-leaning-a-bit-toward-conservative theologically.

 

It's tricky to label people.

 

:iagree: with the differentiation between theology and politics. It's possible to be theologically liberal/moderate/conservative; it's also possible to be politically liberal/moderate/conservative. Hmm, does "political" mean the same as "social"? My brain isn't yet fully engaged this morning ....

 

Anyway, my knee-jerk reaction to the phrase "Conservative Christian" is that it means theologically conservative, but I'm aware that plenty of people are actually talking about political conservatism among Christians. So then I have to go back and re-read everything with that in mind. Then I decide I don't want to think so hard this early in the morning, give up, and go look for posts about men in kilts.

[Heather in Neverland]

to maintain my sanity, I stopped asking myself these questions.

 

Amen to that. :D

[Orthodox6]

The media have their own "working definition" of "conservative Christian", the specificity of which prevents me from coupling the two words together in describing myself.

 

I am a traditionalist (but NOT a "zealot") Orthodox Christian. I hold no political party affiliation because they each include plank elements that I reject. Politics, like morals, must be compatible with the teachings of the Holy Fathers and of the contemporary [Orthodox] elders.

[Ipsey]

To me, it's related to believing in Biblical inerrancy as its basis. If one goes to the Bible to determine all of their answers, that's Conservative Christian.

 

But, in the US, I think the other aspects mentioned in this thread are become part of the package--Fox news, politically right, anti-evolution, do not believe in human created climate change.

 

They don't necessarily go hand-in-hand, but if I find a person who typically believes all of these secondary things I've listed--I typically find they meet my first qualification too.

 

Only my observations, for whatever they're worth.

[forty-two]

The media have their own "working definition" of "conservative Christian", the specificity of which prevents me from coupling the two words together in describing myself.

 

I am a traditionalist (but NOT a "zealot") Orthodox Christian. I hold no political party affiliation because they each include plank elements that I reject. Politics, like morals, must be compatible with the teachings of the Holy Fathers and of the contemporary [Orthodox] elders.

:iagree: (Except I'm a confessional Lutheran ;).)

[justamouse]

Here is where I am coming from. I stopped considering myself a Conservative Christian a few years ago. Mainly, because my political leanings were shifting and I was questioning so many of my own beliefs about Christianity.

 

Now, I am a little more confident in my own belief system (as I learn more about EO), but that is where it ends. Politically, I am leaning more and more to the left and have great appreciation for EO's stance on the enviroment.

 

Socially, I love the concept of "keep your eyes on your own plate." (EO fasting humor ;))

 

Soooooooo.....enter the confusion. :D

 

:D For Catholics, you have St. Francis, who was a *total* environmentalist.

The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops who oppose the death penalty, are pro life (see death penalty :001_smile:), support welfare, support universal healthcare, including for migrants, says that being gay is NOT a sin (acting on those inclinations is) and even ordained gay priests ETA: that as of 2005 they will no longer be ordained.

 

No red or blue there--pretty much purple, and some would say blue.

 

So, like I said, I can't think like that anymore. Makes me nutso.

Edited September 9, 2011 by justamouse

[simka2]

I am starting to think we are all working from various definitions ;). It can really make some threads confusing (hence this one!)

 

So, I might be theologically conservative, but politically liberal...and call myself conservative christian.

 

I might be theologically liberal, politcally conservative....and call myself conservative christian.

 

Or, if you are not both are you REALLY a conservative christian?

[justamouse]

See, I would categorize EO and RC as Conservative Christian, too... Maybe when I think Conservative Christian, I'm thinking theology and tradition.

 

See, you would *think* that because of the highly liturgical worship, and seeming 'rules'. But then you get to the politics of the RCC and they seem pretty much blue (apart from a die hard pro life stance and being against birth control (which is NOT saying they are against planning a family)).

[simka2]

See, I would categorize EO and RC as Conservative Christian, too... Maybe when I think Conservative Christian, I'm thinking theology and tradition.

 

I am starting to define this more as "Liturgical Christian or Traditonalist."

 

Hmmmmm.....

[zenjenn]

These labels are also so relative. For example, in California I had come to a point where I considered myself pretty darn conservative.

 

Now I live in Alabama, and listening to some folks I think "Hmm.. I guess I'm more.. moderate?"

 

Yet at the same time, the Jewish community in California in my experience leaned more conservative in practice. I was quite comfortable in a Reform congregation in California. Here in Alabama, the Reform movement is WAY too nontraditional for my taste.

[simka2]

These labels are also so relative. For example, in California I had come to a point where I considered myself pretty darn conservative.

 

Now I live in Alabama, and listening to some folks I think "Hmm.. I guess I'm more.. moderate?"

 

ooooooh! That is an entirely different point. So is someone truly a Conservative Christian or are they just conservative for their geographic area.

 

Now my head hurts.

[forty-two]

I am starting to think we are all working from various definitions ;). It can really make some threads confusing (hence this one!)

 

So, I might be theologically conservative, but politically liberal...and call myself conservative christian.

 

I might be theologically liberal, politcally conservative....and call myself conservative christian.

 

Or, if you are not both are you REALLY a conservative christian?

 

I'd only call myself a conservative Christian if I were both theologically and politically conservative. And honestly, even though I am both (more or less), I *still* don't call myself one b/c to me the connotation of "conservative Christian" is one whose theology kinda *requires* being politically conservative. Liberal Christian says likewise to me - both theologically and politically liberal, implying that one's liberal theology led to one's liberal politics. That's how I see those terms used most, anyway - I don't care who claims them, but if you don't fit the above, you might be misunderstood :tongue_smilie:.

 

Anyway, I'm a confessional Lutheran, which says zero about my politics ;), and I'm good with that.

[Mrs Mungo]

ooooooh! That is an entirely different point. So is someone truly a Conservative Christian or are they just conservative for their geographic area.

 

Now my head hurts.

 

I have a good friend who considers himself super-conservative. But, that is because he is from NYC.

[forty-two]

I am starting to define this more as "Liturgical Christian or Traditonalist."

 

Hmmmmm.....

I see that more as confessional than liturgical - says the church has certain explicitly defined beliefs, and they are not up for debate or change.

[pdalley]

to maintain my sanity, I stopped asking myself these questions.

:iagree:

 

I don't - and I suspect most people don't - fit in some neat little box or under some banner. I'm me and I'm made up of a lot of ideas and viewpoints.

[Ellesmere]

I know not everyone looks at it this way, and I have a lot of maturing to do in my thoughts, but I do (for now) tend to look at it more politically or socially for my sanity.

 

This is going back many, many years ago, and does not reflect what I know now, but I remember being troubled by a "conservative" group. They self-identified as Conservative Christian. It was made up of Christians from a variety of groups, including Baptist, Catholic, and others.

 

It's helped me to remember that these were people who happened to identify as either Baptist or Catholic (or something else) and they also happened to have a political/social agenda that is not held by all members of that particular denomination. But that's just me. Maybe being excluded from a particular Christian group based on my agreement with the Catholic church in what is mentioned below and in theology has made me a tad weird about that conservative label.

:D For Catholics, you have St. Francis, who was a *total* environmentalist.

The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops who oppose the death penalty, are pro life (see death penalty :001_smile:), support welfare, support universal healthcare, including for migrants, says that being gay is NOT a sin (acting on those inclinations is) and even ordains gay priests (take that, Episcopalians :001_smile:).

 

No red or blue there--pretty much purple, and some would say blue.

 

So, like I said, I can't think like that anymore. Makes me nutso.

 

Interesting.

Thanks for posting that.

[forty-two]

Oddly enough, I just read an article that discusses the evangelical (theologically/politically conservative) and mainline (theologically/politically liberal) divide, along with a blog post that discussed a third category, that of confessional Protestant, who usually gets ignored b/c their defined religious beliefs *don't* lead to defined political positions (so they aren't politically active as a church body). It also pointed out that evangelicals and mainliners are actually very similar in that they both hold that their religious beliefs necessarily imply specific political positions - their arguments are over which beliefs and which positions, not whether their religious beliefs do (or should) lead to specific political beliefs in the first place.

[angela in ohio]

Here is means Bible thumping, Republican, America is the only nation truly blessed by God and who cares about the rest of the world, and a good band on Sunday mornings.

 

I am a bit cynical on the whole "religious right" thing these days.

 

Here (in the local Christian homeschool circles) it means don't you dare have a band on Sunday mornings, and the Republicans are way too liberal anymore. :lol:

[zenjenn]

I have a good friend who considers himself super-conservative. But, that is because he is from NYC.

 

Yeah, see, living in NYC he probably hardly KNOWS anyone conservative!

 

When I was in California, I lived in a college town. In most social situations, my husband couldn't even mention that he worked for a defense contractor without causing some sort of shrieking monologue about the American imperial war machine. He had an employee start wearing BUCK FUSH t-shirts to work and ultimately quit because he couldn't work for a company that was funded by the DoD in good conscience (nevermind the fact that the company he worked for did not actually make weapons. It researched ANTI-missile technology for helicopters and tanks.)

 

The MOMS Club I was a member of in California basically drove away my participation because they became a super-zealous breastfeeding activist group. (And I breastfed my babes, but being a lactivist was not my thing.)

 

I listened to some non-hyperbolic conservative talk radio, as well as NPR. I used cloth diapers and cloth grocery bags, I support Israel. I believe in civil unions, understand the reservations about socially reconstructing what marriage is for the first time in human history, but I also don't presume gay marriage is the downfall of civilization. I feel nascent human life should be protected, but I do not believe destroying it is identical to murder. I'm a "humans first" environmental conservationist, and support economic and personal freedoms ahead of government regulation more often than not.

 

I considered that pretty gosh darn conservative.

 

But then I'm here and I hear people talking about "the gays" are "out to destroy marriage", that liberals are murdering babies", and I spoke to a congressional Republican candidate that looked me in the eye and told me about how Obama is a Muslim who was born in Kenya. :001_huh:

 

Of course my favorite presidential candidate right now is Jon Huntsman. (Yes, I know. No hope.) He's a Republican, and he's Mormon. In my mind that makes him a "conservative Christian" but at the same time I'd guess most self-described Conservative Christians wouldn't. That's the crux of the matter, right?

[angela in ohio]

It really depends on who is saying it.

 

I use the term conservative Christian here to identify myself as politically conservative (pro-life, pro-capitalism, anti-big-government, etc.) and a conservative Christian (Biblical inerrancy and so forth.) My friends of many denominations fit the bill: Presbyterians, Catholics, Baptists, etc.

 

I also think there is a group of Conservative Christians that the media and others identify as "THE Conservative Christians." I disagree with them on quite a few issues (mostly because I'm Reformed, but also because I am anti-legalism.) That's the HSLDA group, etc.

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

I think many saints and Jesus were liberals so to speak:D I think one can be conservative in the sense that one strives to uphold one's religious ideals and be liberal in the sense of believing in not letting people fall through the cracks and caring for our environment. One can be liberal and still believe in being responsible in life as well.

[simka2]

It really depends on who is saying it.

 

I use the term conservative Christian here to identify myself as politically conservative (pro-life, pro-capitalism, anti-big-government, etc.) and a conservative Christian (Biblical inerrancy and so forth.) My friends of many denominations fit the bill: Presbyterians, Catholics, Baptists, etc.

 

I also think there is a group of Conservative Christians that the media and others identify as "THE Conservative Christians." I disagree with them on quite a few issues (mostly because I'm Reformed, but also because I am anti-legalism.) That's the HSLDA group, etc.

 

Does this mean that someone who believes in Biblical inerrancy, but is politcally liberal, is not a Conservative Christian?

 

I think that is my question...not sure anymore :D.

[justamouse]

I have a good friend who considers himself super-conservative. But, that is because he is from NYC.

:lol::lol:

[DawnM]

Oh dear, yes, that is a whole other definition! I haven't had many of those around lately.

 

Dawn

 

Here (in the local Christian homeschool circles) it means don't you dare have a band on Sunday mornings, and the Republicans are way too liberal anymore. :lol:

[forty-two]

I also think there is a group of Conservative Christians that the media and others identify as "THE Conservative Christians." I disagree with them on quite a few issues (mostly because I'm Reformed, but also because I am anti-legalism.) That's the HSLDA group, etc.

This is part of the reason why I don't call myself a conservative Christian - I don't fit their definition of "Christian" well - but I realized that also I don't want to be defined by my political positions. I'm a proud confessional Lutheran :), but I don't know *what* I think about most political issues anymore. I *do* know, however, that I don't want to be associated with any major political group out there right now :glare:. And conservative Christian implies a specific political party.

[angela in ohio]

Does this mean that someone who believes in Biblical inerrancy, but is politcally liberal, is not a Conservative Christian?

 

I think that is my question...not sure anymore :D.

 

Not the capitalized, card-carrying kind. You could still be a conservative Christian in your own terms, though. :001_smile: I assume others will automatically assume the political part of it, as well, though, so maybe qualify it if you want to be clear to the majority of people.

 

I can actually see the argument for a liberal political view from a conservative Christian. It's not my belief, but I can easily see where you can believe the Bible and come to those views instead. So I guess the polical views mean less to me than the actual beliefs about Christianity itself.

[forty-two]

Does this mean that someone who believes in Biblical inerrancy, but is politcally liberal, is not a Conservative Christian?

 

I think that is my question...not sure anymore :D.

Well, I'd never consider them a conservative Christian, and if I fit the bill, I'd not call myself one (I wouldn't *want* to call myself one ;)). Theologically conservative, politically liberal is what I'd call that.

[angela in ohio]

Theologically conservative, politically liberal is what I'd call that.

 

I think that would be the clearest way to describe it.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

This forum has totally messed me up!!! :D I just realized I have no idea what this term means anymore.

 

Is it political affiliation? Devout Christian living? Fundamentalism? Evangelical?

Do you have to be some combo of the above?

 

What if you are trying to live according to biblical principles in your own life, but are politically liberal? :001_huh:

 

I think sometimes the labels get very slippery because a word can mean one thing to one person and something else to another.

 

Just as an example, when I was much younger, I once described myself as a fundamentalist Christian. An older Christian acquaintance (a long time missionary) heard me say this and probed a little bit. She pointed out that there was a specific Christian meaning to "fundamentalist" that related to a series of essays titled "The Fundamentals," and was much more specific in beliefs than I had realized. When I finally read a comparison of Fundamentalist and Evangelical, I realized that the first wasn't what I'd assumed nor what I believed. But by the usage in newspapers and popular news and opinion magazines, there was little difference between the two (and they were both scary).

 

I just wanted to throw out the possibility that words were used sloppily both by outsiders and by people who would be expected to know better.

[simka2]

Well, I'd never consider them a conservative Christian, and if I fit the bill, I'd not call myself one (I wouldn't *want* to call myself one ;)). Theologically conservative, politically liberal is what I'd call that.

 

Okay, I am relugating the term Conservative Christian to those Christians that are BOTH theologically and politically conservative. (Now, if everyone will just get the memo and stop confusing me on other threads by calling yourself a Conservative Christian!!!! ;))

 

-Simka, who really wants the world to be simple today :D

[Little Nyssa]

For EO I think this term is confusing, because in some ways we are Archconservative, but in other ways we are very flexible. So, how I use this term depends on what company I am in.

Sometimes I just use it to mean: "we are really serious about our faith."

[Laurie4b]

Reading this thread is interesting and makes me rethink how I might label myself. I would have said I am a conservative Christian, but I would then only be speaking about being theologically conservative. In our congregation, we have people far to the right and far to the left politically. Facebook can get kinda interesting, but for the most part, that stuff is set aside with respect to church. I had no idea that "conservative Christian" implied anything political. I'll go for grammar here--the adjective conservative modifies the term Christian, which to me is a religious theological term. A Christian conservative would, on the other hand, be using the word Christian as an adjective to modify the political term conservtive. I actually do know at least one person who is a theologically liberal Christian who is also politically conservative, so I don't think the two "conservatives" need necessarily go together.

 

I am such a mixture of political opinion that I couldn't say that I was across-the-board conservative or liberal anything. But if I would use the term politically conservative to describe someone's political beliefs. (and a conservative Democrat would be different creature from a conservative Republican.)

 

Henceforth, I'll not label myself the way I used to! It's obviously misleading to many listeners!

[Sputterduck]

I consider myself conservative because I think things like sex before marriage is bad.

 

I never use that term "conservative Christian" and mean politically conservative. To me it means I'm not with the latest trends on lowering moral standards.

Edited September 9, 2011 by Sputterduck

[leeannpal]

Here is means Bible thumping, Republican, America is the only nation truly blessed by God and who cares about the rest of the world, and a good band on Sunday mornings.

 

I am a bit cynical on the whole "religious right" thing these days.

 

I wholeheartedly agree!