Uh oh. Bb gun and neighbor dogs.

[UnsinkableKristen]

And you know, little boys with BB guns graduate to a .22 at some point.

 

astrid

 

 

That is a bit of a sweeping generalization, you know.

[laundrycrisis]

Ds11 just got caught by the neighbor shooting their dog with his bb gun. She came over and confronted me. It wasn't pretty. I told her I would tell ds to not do that again.

 

She wanted more I think. She kept saying how big of a problem she had with it. I said, 'I'm sorry. I will tell him not to do it again. Your dogs drive us crazy with the barking.' She said there wasn't any kind of rule about barking dogs' I said, 'I wasn't really looking to enforce some sort of rule...I just would like to be able to go in my back yard or side front without dogs barking at me constantly. She said, 'dogs bark.' I said, 'yes they do. But if I had a dog that barked constantly at the neighbors I would get rid of them.'

 

She looked like I had suggested she sell her firstborn. :glare: She said, 'they are part of my family and I won't be getting rid of them because they bark.' I shrugged and said, 'I'm just saying that is what I would do.'

 

So am I the worst neighbor in the world? How serious do you think a barking dog gets shot with bbs?

 

 

This reads to me like you have told her it is okay for your child to shoot at her dogs because their barking annoys you.

 

IMO the only acceptable response by you as a parent is to remove the BB guns from the house for years and force your child to do volunteer work with a dog rescue.

 

Neighbors have dogs. Dogs bark. Deal with it. Shooting at the dogs is not okay !!!!

 

I would call the police on you if it happened again.

[annandatje]

We typically do not do punishment here, but we do indeed take character issues very seriously. I would be absolutely devastated to hear that my child did something like this.

 

Intentionally and unnecessarily inflicting pain upon a lesser being, animal or human, is an issue to be dealt with promptly. Has your son had a pet? If not, it may be worthwhile for him to develop a bond with an animal of his own to gain more empathy for critters.

 

I assume the dog was not threatening your child so the fact that it is a nuisance barker is irrelevant in regards to the cruelty displayed by the boy. Lodging a complaint with animal control is the appropriate action if the dog is violating an ordinance.

 

Honestly if I were your neighbor, I would have had a far stronger reaction than what she did. I would have called law enforcement on your son.

[simka2]

Personally, I would be really upset by this, but.....I read your post to dh and he busted out laughing!!!!!! His exact words were, "More dogs in this world need to be shot by a BB gun" :tongue_smilie:

 

He also suggested buying them a shock collar and putting it on their doorstep. ;)

[higginszoo]

I have a question here. I have already responded to the issue at hand, however, several people say the boy (10 years old) could be charged? I am just curious how this could happen. I can see that his parents may be held responsible in some way but what would the police do after they charge him? Are we talking juvenile detention center and loss of custody? This does not seem warranted in this particular case.

 

Yes, children have been taken into custody in the juvenile system, and the parents have faced loss of custody. I haven't heard of things going as far as convictions going through, but it did involve parents having to pay for lawyers, the kid actually spending time in custody, etc. There have been cases in CO, CT and WA that I know of. All of the cases seemed to be easily avoidable by just providing adult supervision when playing with the guns, as kids this age just don't always show the best judgement.

[Audrey]

[

Or as one of my better instructors would say, it was an excuse.

 

 

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

 

 

"yeah, but . . . " is not an apology. It's an attempt at justification.

 

 

 

:lol::smilielol5::lol:

 

and it was the kid's mom who expressed, at least to herself, she wanted to shoot the dog.

 

 

Not surprising that the child would pick up on the idea that shooting at the dog would be just fine, then. :glare:

 

It seems nearly unanimous that no one thinks shooting the dog was an acceptable act. The lack of concern from the OP is equally troubling, IMO.

[Heather in Neverland]

OK, my iPad is freaking out. I typed this long response then it got all messed up when i tried to fix a typo...ugh... so here is the gist:

 

 

So here's how I see it:

- 10yo boy with a new BB gun, probably needed to be taught some rules before handling it

- beloved mother stressed out by constant barking and a neighbor who did nothing about it

- precedent in that he saw/knows that his father has handled a similar circumstance in a similar way

- 10 yo boy decides to "man up" and help his mom

 

Misguided? Yes. But he is a 10yo boy. So take his gun away until he has time to learn how to use it safely. Tell him you appreciate his intentions (trying to help you) but that was not the best way to handle it because most people do not find it socially acceptable to shoot a dog AND because it causes bad feelings between neighbors.

 

What happens in addition to that really depends on whether or not you care if your neighbor hates you. It doesn't sound like she has any intention of making her dogs stop being so obnoxious so you may have to write this one off as a loss.

 

And FWIW I do NOT think your child is a sociopath or that someone needs to call CPS on you. I, too, have been brought to the brink of insanity by an thoughtless neighbor who allowed her dog to stand outside barking all day long.

Edited September 3, 2011 by Heather in NC

[annandatje]

Not surprising that the child would pick up on the idea that shooting at the dog would be just fine, then. :glare:

 

It seems nearly unanimous that no one thinks shooting the dog was an acceptable act. The lack of concern from the OP is equally troubling, IMO.

 

 

I guess there is a valid reason to read subsequent posts before replying to the original post. If the act of casual cruelty was condoned or tolerated by one or more parents, I take back my suggestion to get a pet for the boy.

[8circles]

I'm with the shocked and horrified (by the OP's attitude).

...

After all, we are all different, with different levels of drive, ability, priorities, and focus. I just hope that we are all humane.

:leaving:

 

I don't think the OP has gotten it yet. I'm not an animal lover at all. Without making any judgements about the character of the boy, his behavior was cruel. OP, regardless what words you've said, your attitude is condoning his behavior.

 

Why is the 10yo not apologizing for himself? Even my 3 year-old apologizes to the neighbors when he does something wrong.

[SKL]

"Got smote the dog"

 

I really think the last thing Ms. Scarlett should be praying for is the death of the dog(s) any time soon. The kid would be accused of murdering the dog.

 

I do not believe the child is a psychopath either. I got the impression that the OP (and her kid) did not realize how it actually feels to be shot with a BB gun. That's why I suggested that they both go out back and get shot with one. Then they could go to the neighbor and say, "gosh, I thought it was just a toy gun the kid's dad got - I didn't realize it could hurt, but now I do and we're sorry and we want to make it up to you."

 

It would be a long time before I'd dare to complain about the barking to anyone after this.

[ThatCyndiGirl]

Um, little boys with BB guns graduating to .22s is NOT a sweeping generalization......or are a lot of your dh's (the ones who hunt!) out there hunting with BB guns? :001_huh:

 

Saying that users of BB guns eventually graduate to .22s does NOT imply that this kid would graduate to using a .22 on the neighbour's dog, it means that in gun-owning homes it does seem to be a normal progression from BB guns in younger years to .22s and other guns in older, more mature years.

 

Or perhaps my dh is the only one who uses a gun OTHER than the BB type? :confused:

[didadeewiththree]

Personally, I would be really upset by this, but.....I read your post to dh and he busted out laughing!!!!!! His exact words were, "More dogs in this world need to be shot by a BB gun" :tongue_smilie:

 

He also suggested buying them a shock collar and putting it on their doorstep. ;)

 

My hubby found this funny too, although I also frown upon the use of bb guns on animals. He would also add stray cats to the list. :tongue_smilie:

[Heather in Neverland]

Um, little boys with BB guns graduating to .22s is NOT a sweeping generalization......or are a lot of your dh's (the ones who hunt!) out there hunting with BB guns? :001_huh:

 

Saying that users of BB guns eventually graduate to .22s does NOT imply that this kid would graduate to using a .22 on the neighbour's dog, it means that in gun-owning homes it does seem to be a normal progression from BB guns in younger years to .22s and other guns in older, more mature years.

 

Or perhaps my dh is the only one who uses a gun OTHER than the BB type? :confused:

 

I don't think it was the mere "ownership" of a .22 that was in question. It was the meaning behind the words i.e. right now he's shooting at dogs with a BB gun... next he will graduate to shooting OTHER things with a .22. The intent was clear and, I agree, a pretty big generalization.

 

He made a mistake. Once. He was imitating his father. I do not think that makes him a sociopath. He is not out ripping limbs off kittens one at a time and keeping their remains in an icebox. Let's be realistic.

 

My brother at around age 12 shot a bird with a BB gun and killed it. Why? Who knows? He was a 12yo boy trying to be cool in front of his friends. It traumatized him and he has never touched a gun since.

 

So let's pull back on this slippery slope idea just a bit. We do not know how this will affect her son one way or the other REGARDLESS of her feelings on the matter.

[UnsinkableKristen]

I don't think it was the mere "ownership" of a .22 that was in question. It was the meaning behind the words i.e. right now he's shooting at dogs with a BB gun... next he will graduate to shooting OTHER things with a .22.

 

 

This.

 

My DH shot BB guns as a boy and doesn't own or shoot .22's (or BB guns) as a man. I'm just saying that one thing does not ALWAYS lead to the other.

[Haiku]

So am I the worst neighbor in the world? How serious do you think a barking dog gets shot with bbs?

 

I don't think it was the greatest idea in the world to turn the situation around on her dogs. Your son shot someone's pet. That is very, very serious, in my book, and if my neighbor said, basically, "I'll tell him not to do it again but your dogs are annoying," I would honestly think that neighbor needed to be hit with a clue-by-4, to borrow a phrase I learned here at TWTM. I would make your son apologize, and, were it my son, he would be severely punished for shooting an animal.

 

Tara

[gardenmom5]

"Got smote the dog"

 

I really think the last thing Ms. Scarlett should be praying for is the death of the dog(s) any time soon. The kid would be accused of murdering the dog.

.

 

I don't remember who shared the story of the dog - she wasn't praying for God to smite it. She was praying for God to help her before *she* did something totally out of line towards the dog. the dog promptly died.

Edited September 3, 2011 by gardenmom5

[Scarlett]

Thank you. I can do this.

 

 

 

 

:D For the record, I don't think you or your son are doomed or horrible folk. I just think your past issues with the dogs have drained you of empathy for your neighbour on this one. It happens. I once had a neighbour with a beagle that was never leashed and came over to our house to tip over our compost and bay at our dog when she was on her chain. When it was finally hit and killed by car I had not a bit of remorse.

 

So you've just got to take my word for this and fake it. :D Apologize to the neighbours for not taking it seriously and assure her that your son will be punished. Not that he won't do it again, but that he will be punished. She just needs to feel you take her feelings seriously and will do something about it. That's generally what people are looking for in this situation.

 

ETA: I get that your son won't do it again, it's just that the neighbour needs to be assured that you're taking steps to make sure that doesn't happen, that's all.

:grouphug:

[lovelaughs_times_three]

God smote the dog.

 

Honest. I kid you not. The very next day the neighbor's child came over and told my kids that her dog had fallen over dead. I attribute it all to God. He wanted to save me from prison.

 

 

:smilielol5::smilielol5::smilielol5:

 

 

Still not done reading, but this was just too funny to pass up!!! Hilarious!

 

Scarlett, are you sorry you asked yet???? :D

 

For the record, I do agree with everyone here. But I'm feeling kinda sorry for my friend, Scarlett. You take the criticism very well. It's hard when it comes from so many voices all at once!

 

I know you will do the right thing for you and your son.

 

I'm guessing my avatar gives away how I'd feel about a BB bullet aimed at my sweet puppy. But 'nuf said already!!!!!!!! :tongue_smilie:

[Scarlett]

That sounds reasonable. Also drums or trumpet lessons for your son sounds reasonable. You might also get him a didgeridoo, but only as an outside toy.

:grouphug:

 

LOL. Thank you.

[Heather in Neverland]

GREAT IDEA about the drum set. I would add BAGPIPES!!!

[Scarlett]

I think Scarlett needs one for sure.

 

I think she has cloudy brain today. :) We all have at one time or another.

 

You should poor a double expresso double shot of Bailey's for her.:lol:

 

Yes I will have that. Thank you.

[lovelaughs_times_three]

Everyone think maybe she's heard enough? She can work it out from here. :grouphug:

 

:iagree:

[snipsnsnailsx5]

As a mother to five boys - I've seen what boys (or most boys, some boys...I don't want to make a generalization lol) are capable of. Once my 7 yr old put the cat in the dryer to make his friends laugh. Thankfully the friends didn't think it was very funny and I was told right away before the cat got hurt. uggh!

 

BB guns can be dangerous - they do hurt, to people and to animals. A child should never use a BB gun without adult supervision. It says that right on the package. Even if the XH got him the gun, he shouldn't be using it out in the backyard alone. If my sons' got a BB gun as a gift, it would be put up and they'd have to ask permission to use it in which I'd have to supervise them at that time. We do have a BB gun actually. We take it camping with us. The boys are only allowed to use it when DH is right there with them, and my oldest is 12. They are taught right away proper gun safety and respect for it. My sons are also in Scouts and to get their shooting badge they had to show proper use of a BB gun. They were even required to wear eye protection and follow all the safe techniques such as not pointing it towards people (always towards the ground when not aiming), keeping the safety on when not aiming, etc.

 

Anyway, my point is (long time getting there lol) a BB gun is not just a toy. It really should be treated as a weapon and the child should learn proper safety rules.

 

For the whole dog issue, it was totally unacceptable to shoot the neighbor's dog...but we have big rules here that NO animal (from a chipmunk to a bird and so on) should be shot with a gun (unless they plan on eating it!). You bet I have my sons watch episodes of Animal Cops to show them what animal cruelty looks like and how animals hurt and suffer just like we do. :(

 

The best course of action here I think would be to have your son apologize himself to the neighbor (he's the one that did it afterall), and you should apologize for your initial reaction as well and let the neighbor know what your son's consequence would be. For me I would be taking the gun away - not sending it back to dad's house ,but taking it away. Maybe its special to him because his dad got it for him, fine you don't have to destroy it. But I'd be putting it up, hiding it, until he's a few years older and shows more responsibility. I really like the idea of another poster's that he should volunteer to help at an animal shelter, or walking dogs, scooping dog poop...something with animals.

 

I hope this doesn't come off as attacking...I really do just want to help.

[gardenmom5]

GREAT IDEA about the drum set. I would add BAGPIPES!!!

 

I like bagpipes. (and yes, I have a family friend who plays them.)

however, playing (any instrument) off key . . . . screech!

[Scarlett]

Wow. I think this thread topic needs to be added to the burning questions thread!

 

Dh came home. I told him the story. He rolled his eyes. BTW, I was right earlier when I said it wasnt a real bb gun. It has little plastic 'bullets'. No force to speak of. I wish my neighbor knew this.

 

Thanks for all your thought on this. Thanks for all of you who admitted you don't think it is the worse thing ever.....on the thread and pms.

 

My apologies to the rest of you for my failure to see it your way.

[SKL]

Dh came home. I told him the story. He rolled his eyes. BTW, I was right earlier when I said it wasnt a real bb gun. It has little plastic 'bullets'. No force to speak of. I wish my neighbor knew this.

 

I still think you should try it out on yourself just to make sure.

 

If it is not painful at all to you, then at least you know your child was not cruel to an animal.

 

I still think you need to enforce a policy of never pointing a toy or real gun at anything you don't intend to shoot and kill.

[Natalieclare]

I was one of the first responders to this thread' date=' but now I feel icky that I did. I feel like I was part of a mob that I didn't mean to be part of.

 

I don't think the situation calls for the *shocked* and *horrified* responses. He's a 10 year old kid. Maybe an argument can be made that it was animal cruelty.....but it's a far cry from nailing a cat's paws to a board and throwing the board in a river. (an example that I know of boys being cruel to animals) THAT'S shocking and horrifying.

 

I also think that if this board were comprised of mostly men instead of women, we'd have much different responses. In this situation, I have no doubt that my dh would be upset with our son and would take the gun away. But I don't think it would be *shocking and horrifying* it would simply be matter of fact.

 

There were some things in this thread that were really, really uncalled for.[/quote']

 

 

Yes. The correlation with torturing animals and criminals is more like what you suggested. Or instead of simply squishing a spider, pulling it's legs off one by one. Taking a pot shot with a gun (which is likely used to shoot at friends) in a misguided attempt to stop an extremely aggravating situation is a far far cry from twisted.