Help...WWYD?...tough love?

[Cheryl in NM]

UPDATE ON POST #33

 

Background:

We've had a rocky relationship with my step-daughter for years, her whole life really. Basically, her mother told her that her dad didn't love her or want her and then took every opportunity to violate court order and keep the kids from Dh. He didn't call the cops to enforce the order and when he brought it up in court she either denied it or had an excuse. Couple this with a difference of parenting styles and you have a troubled relationship. I think my dsd might have some mental issues as well. She seems to have cycles were she's very "down" and self-sabbatoging. I think she just entered another one of those. We kicked her out at 16, 1 month before she was supposed to move in with her step-dad because she had quit going to school, was doing drugs, stealing and driving drunk. So we view it as making her leave early, she views it as kicking her out, even though she was already supposed to move. Anyway, bad decision on our part. She didn't talk to us for 2 years. Then her brother died, they were 2 years and 3 weeks apart in age and very close. She started talking to us after the funeral and we've had a tenuous relationship. I've apologized broadly and specifically for things from her childhood. Her response is always, "oh I'm over that. I know I made it hard for you." to which I respond that I was the adult so I had greater responsibility. Okay, that's a whole bunch of history very condensed, feel free to ask further questions.

 

Current situation: In an effort to show her that we care about her and want to help her on the road to adult hood we began paying for her cell phone, then Dh bought her a used truck and we maintain the insurance on it. When Dh refused to upgrade her phone and add a data plan she got her own. Now the insurance found out that the truck doesn't reside with us, but in town and she has to have her own ins. policy; the rates went up $60/month. We told her that we would give her $100 per month and she should pay the $80/month ins. bill with it. We also gave her the truck for her 21st bday (2 weeks ago), but haven't been able to get together with her to transfer the title, for which we are also paying. that's the nuts and bolts. We invite her to ds's events, potlucks at church (she's not a believer), to the house, whatever we have going on. We call or text her regularly and she will participate, but she only calls or texts to ask for money, which we've never refused...until today. I had just given her $100. She knew it was earmarked for ins. and she needed cigarettes and gas so she wanted me to give her more. I told her to take some $ out of the 100 and put it back when she got paid. She completely flipped and accused me of trying to ruin her life, adding bills to her life, trying to keep her away from her dad and brother (Dh & my son). She really just lost it and for the first time in my life, I didn't return fire. I kept my cool and kept telling her that we were still paying for the ins. it was just in her name now. That I was happy she was having a relationship with her dad and bro and that i wanted that for her too. She called Dh and told him that she never wanted to see or talk to me again; that she would only come to the house if he was home. I showed him all the texts, mine and hers, oh yeah, this all took place on text. That's how she prefers to communicate. Dh said she was still coming out to the house on Thur. for him to work on her truck and get the title switched over. So he plans to talk to her, but if she doesn't apologize to me and admit that she flew off the handle he's cutting all money and not going to pay to switch the truck into her name. I think this makes me the one in the middle, but I'm glad that he's at least sticking up for me, something he rarely did when she was young and behaved in much the same manner.

 

Anyway, I want to show her how family love is supposed to work. How do I act on Thur. when she comes out? I know she owes me an apology and part of me wants to dis-engage completely until she at least admits how badly she behaved. But...I want to show her that i still love her without tolerating her bad behavior. Family love doesn't tolerate that kind of behavior right? How do I extend grace, but be firm? I'm really at a lost and have handled so many situations badly with her when she was young.

 

I really appreciate any help! TIA.

Edited May 20, 2011 by Cheryl in NM

[LittleIzumi]

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

Not much advice, just hugs. I wouldn't take back the truck he already gave her, though.

[Trish]

Hmm. Seems like everything revolves around money, when the relationship should be the thing. That's just my general sense of it, though.

 

Sorry no advice. Hugs!

[kalanamak]

 

I really appreciate any help! TIA.

 

Personally, I'd write a letter with hubby and both sign it. I would be kind and encouraging but firm.

 

I'd pay to get the truck in her name just to make sure it wasn't in mine. My radar is up, and I sense alcohol might be involved.

 

But, I am an old-fashioned letter writer, not a texter. Letters get to be reread later, when things are cooler.

 

:grouphug:

[Cheryl in NM]

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

Not much advice, just hugs. I wouldn't take back the truck he already gave her, though.

 

Thanks!

 

He's not talking about taking back the truck, just not paying to register it in her name. he would just sign over the title and give it to her. The current plans are to take her to the MVD and pay to title it in her name and register it for 2 years about $150.

[Harriet Vane]

Thanks!

 

He's not talking about taking back the truck, just not paying to register it in her name. he would just sign over the title and give it to her. The current plans are to take her to the MVD and pay to title it in her name and register it for 2 years about $150.

 

I'd still pay to put the title in her name--this way the record is clear.

 

Then I'd stop paying for everything else. She's an adult now.

[Cheryl in NM]

Hmm. Seems like everything revolves around money, when the relationship should be the thing. That's just my general sense of it, though.

 

Sorry no advice. Hugs!

 

I agree, money is the key to a relationship with this kid. She'll respond to conversations we initiate but won't initiate a conversation unless she needs something from us. So Dh has been hanging onto paying for things for her to keep in touch with her. She does sometimes ignore our texts and phone calls. She never calls when something important happens in her life. The only way we found out she had bronchitis was because she wanted to go to the doctor and didn't understand how the insurance worked (insurance that Dh still provides her). When I explained it she quit texting. her last text to me in that conversation was that she was vomiting blood. So when she didn't answer her phone or respond to my texts or her dad's I drove across town to check on her (Dh couldn't get away from work). She was watching a movie with her boyfriend. I convinced her to go to ER and then took her and got her medicine. She got what she wanted from me (info about the insurance) so she just ignored my other attempts at contact. We want so bad to be a part of her life and show her that we love her. So we've opted to communicate on a financial level. She can't afford to pay this or any ins. bill. She's living in an apt. she can't afford. doesn't get enough hours and work, but refuses to look for another job. She smokes cigs & weed and drinks. She drives all over creation without thought to how much she's spending on gas. But...she's finally going to college. She gets financial aid to pay for that. It's frustrating to keep funneling money to someone who manages what they earn so poorly! We really don't give her a ton of money, but have not refused her. I know her mom, aunt and ex-step-dad give her money as well.

 

So how do we change this dynamic? is it a lost cause? how can you even say that about your child?:confused:

[Cheryl in NM]

Personally, I'd write a letter with hubby and both sign it. I would be kind and encouraging but firm.

 

I'd pay to get the truck in her name just to make sure it wasn't in mine. My radar is up, and I sense alcohol might be involved.

 

But, I am an old-fashioned letter writer, not a texter. Letters get to be reread later, when things are cooler.

 

:grouphug:

 

Thanks! I thought about that. I'll see what dh says.

[Cheryl in NM]

I'd still pay to put the title in her name--this way the record is clear.

 

Then I'd stop paying for everything else. She's an adult now.

 

That's my thought as well, but Dh is having a hard time letting go. he's pretty sure we won't see or hear from her from years if we quit giving her money. She changes her phone number frequently, and especially after having it out with someone.

[Jean in Newcastle]

3 thoughts:

 

1. What is providing a step for her to go in the right direction (job, school, both of which need transportation) will become enabling as she is older. I don't know what the magic age is but at some point, you and your dh are going to have to cut off the financial help even if it means no contact from her. I don't think that immediately after your 21st birthday is that magic age, though.

 

2. I would either make the apology a requirement for future financial/material gifts or I would make sure that she knows beforehand that she will need to apologize. I don't think it is fair to have her show up and then say "I won't sign this unless you apologize." I would feel ambushed if that happened (don't know if that was what your dh planned) and would react big time - esp. at that age.

 

3. It would take huge acting skills, but I would try to act as always - greet her, talk to her but then let your dh ask for the apology. If she says "no", then your dh needs to say, "Ok - then this is the consequence." Matter of fact. Your reaction should be honest but matter of fact, "I'm so sorry that you won't apologize. I love you no matter what but this is what people need to do in a healthy family."

[Cheryl in NM]

3 thoughts:

 

1. What is providing a step for her to go in the right direction (job, school, both of which need transportation) will become enabling as she is older. I don't know what the magic age is but at some point, you and your dh are going to have to cut off the financial help even if it means no contact from her. I don't think that immediately after your 21st birthday is that magic age, though.

 

2. I would either make the apology a requirement for future financial/material gifts or I would make sure that she knows beforehand that she will need to apologize. I don't think it is fair to have her show up and then say "I won't sign this unless you apologize." I would feel ambushed if that happened (don't know if that was what your dh planned) and would react big time - esp. at that age.

 

3. It would take huge acting skills, but I would try to act as always - greet her, talk to her but then let your dh ask for the apology. If she says "no", then your dh needs to say, "Ok - then this is the consequence." Matter of fact. Your reaction should be honest but matter of fact, "I'm so sorry that you won't apologize. I love you no matter what but this is what people need to do in a healthy family."

 

Jean, what great words of wisdom! Thanks!

1. Agreed, I just don't know where that line is either. I feel it is still too soon to cut financial ties, but also feel pretty used.

2. That wasn't the plan. The truck is hers. Dh is thinking of hinging additional funds on the apology.

3. Agreed. That's what I thought too. It's just so hard! This is just breaking my heart. I really thought we were past this kind of stuff. I also feel funny being the catalyst in this situation. I finally didn't lose my cool with her and it didn't make any difference! Of course, this is the first time she's lost it with me since we've started talking again, 1.5 years.

 

This girl has humbled me and brought me to my knees more times than I can count! I have grown as a human so much in what I've learned dealing with her. I'm just not ready for such an encounter again!

 

Thanks so much for your advice! I think I'll try to get some sleep now.

[regentrude]

We want so bad to be a part of her life and show her that we love her. So we've opted to communicate on a financial level. She can't afford to pay this or any ins. bill. She's living in an apt. she can't afford. doesn't get enough hours and work, but refuses to look for another job. She smokes cigs & weed and drinks. She drives all over creation without thought to how much she's spending on gas. But...she's finally going to college. She gets financial aid to pay for that. It's frustrating to keep funneling money to someone who manages what they earn so poorly! We really don't give her a ton of money, but have not refused her. I know her mom, aunt and ex-step-dad give her money as well.

 

So how do we change this dynamic? is it a lost cause? how can you even say that about your child?:confused:

 

I think "communication on a financial level" is not communication.

Not what you want to hear: but you are enabling her irresponsible behavior. It won't change, it won't stop, the demands will only keep increasing. She needs to learn to manage her money - and she won't if the family keeps bailing her out.

My friend has similar issues with her 35 y/o stepdaughter. At 35, dad is STILL paying for her car insurance. She keeps driving recklessly, having accidents; dad gave her HIS car and she totaled it within a few weeks. Dad was still on the title. She owes money, the collectors now harrass her stepmom. Dad feels bad and keeps bailing her out - and consequently, she has not grown into a responsible adult.

 

I would not insist on an apology, because she will not mean it, only say the words to get what she wants. I would, however, make sure the truck gets switched in HER name, so that you are in the clear if stuff happens. But that's it.

[Joanne]

I agree, money is the key to a relationship with this kid. She'll respond to conversations we initiate but won't initiate a conversation unless she needs something from us. So Dh has been hanging onto paying for things for her to keep in touch with her. She does sometimes ignore our texts and phone calls. She never calls when something important happens in her life. The only way we found out she had bronchitis was because she wanted to go to the doctor and didn't understand how the insurance worked (insurance that Dh still provides her). When I explained it she quit texting. her last text to me in that conversation was that she was vomiting blood. So when she didn't answer her phone or respond to my texts or her dad's I drove across town to check on her (Dh couldn't get away from work). She was watching a movie with her boyfriend. I convinced her to go to ER and then took her and got her medicine. She got what she wanted from me (info about the insurance) so she just ignored my other attempts at contact. We want so bad to be a part of her life and show her that we love her. So we've opted to communicate on a financial level. She can't afford to pay this or any ins. bill. She's living in an apt. she can't afford. doesn't get enough hours and work, but refuses to look for another job. She smokes cigs & weed and drinks. She drives all over creation without thought to how much she's spending on gas. But...she's finally going to college. She gets financial aid to pay for that. It's frustrating to keep funneling money to someone who manages what they earn so poorly! We really don't give her a ton of money, but have not refused her. I know her mom, aunt and ex-step-dad give her money as well.So how do we change this dynamic? is it a lost cause? how can you even say that about your child?:confused:

 

The most loving thing you all can do is stop giving her money. She sounds like a young alcoholic, self-centered, immature, and selfish.

[RanchGirl]

As the step-mom, I would remove myself from the money/car/insurance and parenting type stuff and leave that up to your dh. Let your husband make the decisions and do all the communicating regarding these things. Make your relationship with her only one of support and nurturing and kindness. Do not make your husband choose between her and you. If she sees his financial support for her as love, and he makes it contingent on her apologizing to you, I would think that would be extremely painful for her.

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

I think "communication on a financial level" is not communication.

Not what you want to hear: but you are enabling her irresponsible behavior. It won't change, it won't stop, the demands will only keep increasing. She needs to learn to manage her money - and she won't if the family keeps bailing her out.

My friend has similar issues with her 35 y/o stepdaughter. At 35, dad is STILL paying for her car insurance. She keeps driving recklessly, having accidents; dad gave her HIS car and she totaled it within a few weeks. Dad was still on the title. She owes money, the collectors now harrass her stepmom. Dad feels bad and keeps bailing her out - and consequently, she has not grown into a responsible adult.

 

I would not insist on an apology, because she will not mean it, only say the words to get what she wants. I would, however, make sure the truck gets switched in HER name, so that you are in the clear if stuff happens. But that's it.

 

:iagree:

[Impish]

I think "communication on a financial level" is not communication.

Not what you want to hear: but you are enabling her irresponsible behavior. It won't change, it won't stop, the demands will only keep increasing. She needs to learn to manage her money - and she won't if the family keeps bailing her out.

*snip*

I would not insist on an apology, because she will not mean it, only say the words to get what she wants. I would, however, make sure the truck gets switched in HER name, so that you are in the clear if stuff happens. But that's it.

:iagree:

If she has $ for smokes and weed, then she has the money for her insurance. Giving her $ is allowing her to continue to squander it.

 

Honestly, she sounds like a toddler thats long figured out that temper tantrums work perfectly...only she has you guys paying for the privilidge of her behaving badly.

[Carol in Cal.]

I agree with Eliana.

If you want to cut her off, fine, but not this minute. Don't forswear yourself because of the actions of someone else. Be the one who keeps your word. But lay the groundwork for what the conditions will be in the future.

[Just Another Jen]

The most loving thing you all can do is stop giving her money. She sounds like a young alcoholic, self-centered, immature, and selfish.

 

 

Exactly. You'll be doing this forever if you don't stop soon. I have examples in 3 generations of our family right now.

[Scuff]

She has too many people interfering in her life for what you do to really have an impact on her growing up. More clearly, you need to cut off thefinances a little, so that she can grow up. But that won't happen when everyone else is giving her money instead. Get the title in her name. You need that protection. You don't want to be responsible for her in an accident. I'd probably continue her health insurance for awhile also. Just 'cause you care about her and want her to be able to go to the Dr. if she needs too. Aside from that, don't offer. If she comes to you for money, I'd probably give her a portion of what she needs, but not the whole thing. ie- she needs $100 for a phone bill, give her $50. That way she still needs to work or scrounge (or all the other parents) to earn some of it on her own, but you've helped by making it more doable. This would begin the process of weaning her off of you all while maintaining contact. Unfortunately, since she has others who give to her, I don't think it'll work. She'll just leach off them and stop talking to you. But in the future, she may decide she wants a relationship with you just to have a relationship with you.

 

Don't make your relationship depend on her apology, though. Her dad should talk to her about it. But you treat her the same whether you get the apology or not. Shunning her is just petty. And you're the parent. Love her without condition.

[Cheryl in NM]

Thank you all. You all have so much insight!

 

This whole Thur. talk wasn't sounding right but I was too emotional and hurt to figure out why. Of course, forced apologies aren't really apologies and I believe would hurt this situation.

 

I am only involved in the money end because she has a student debit card linked to my personal paypal account which is then linked to our joint checking account. It's been great to be able to transfer money to her whenever she asks. Of course, looking back, it has taken the human contact out of the situation.

 

I've been feeling the need to cut off financial support since the relationship became wholly about money. I was hoping if we stayed stable, continuing to contact her and invite her to share our lives that the relationship would rise above money. I'm fine helping her our financially, but I expect common decency like calling when she is breaking our plans, a polite request for money instead of demand with the emotional blackmail that she'll just ask her mom, again, nevermind, "you guys always bail on me anyway."

 

I thought, as she said, that she had really moved past our baggage. Hopefully, Thur. she'll be willing to talk about some of it and we can work it out.

 

She calls me for money, not her dad. She calls him when she needs a repair to her truck. But never does she call to just talk. She did when she was in Hawaii, so when she came back to town and we bought her the truck, we thought the relationship was on the upswing.

 

Dh is positive that if we cut off financial support she will not talk to us again. Who knows, she may have already changed her phone number and threatened to cut off any family member who gives it to us. Changing the insurance to her, but continuing to pay the bill sounded like a good way to baby step her into some more independence.

 

I understand that you should not give money to people who spend money on drinking and drugs. I haven't addressed that specifically with Dh, but since she's still functioning, going to school and work, he probably won't see it as a concern.

 

Anyway, thanks so much for all your words of wisdom! When I woke up this morning I wondered what the "day shift" would have to say! Please keep us in your prayers.

[Mom0012]

nt

Edited May 18, 2011 by LisaTheresa

[Scuff]

Thank you all. You all have so much insight!

 

This whole Thur. talk wasn't sounding right but I was too emotional and hurt to figure out why. Of course, forced apologies aren't really apologies and I believe would hurt this situation.

 

I am only involved in the money end because she has a student debit card linked to my personal paypal account which is then linked to our joint checking account. It's been great to be able to transfer money to her whenever she asks. Of course, looking back, it has taken the human contact out of the situation.

 

It sounds like you're starting to see your role in causing this.

 

 

I've been feeling the need to cut off financial support since the relationship became wholly about money. I was hoping if we stayed stable, continuing to contact her and invite her to share our lives that the relationship would rise above money.

 

Continue to invite her to be a part of your lives. even if she doesn;t and even if she stands you up. This is where you be the bigger person.

 

I'm fine helping her our financially, but I expect common decency like calling when she is breaking our plans, a polite request for money instead of demand with the emotional blackmail that she'll just ask her mom, again, nevermind, "you guys always bail on me anyway."

 

I thought, as she said, that she had really moved past our baggage. Hopefully, Thur. she'll be willing to talk about some of it and we can work it out.

 

She calls me for money, not her dad. She calls him when she needs a repair to her truck. But never does she call to just talk. She did when she was in Hawaii, so when she came back to town and we bought her the truck, we thought the relationship was on the upswing.

 

She related to you in a real way, and you took it back to money. You sabotaged the progress by giving her a truck. You never should have given it to her. Now that you have, you shouldn't take it back. But mending this relationship is going to require you redefining your behavior as well as her.

 

 

Dh is positive that if we cut off financial support she will not talk to us again. Who knows, she may have already changed her phone number and threatened to cut off any family member who gives it to us. Changing the insurance to her, but continuing to pay the bill sounded like a good way to baby step her into some more independence.

 

I understand that you should not give money to people who spend money on drinking and drugs. I haven't addressed that specifically with Dh, but since she's still functioning, going to school and work, he probably won't see it as a concern.

 

Anyway, thanks so much for all your words of wisdom! When I woke up this morning I wondered what the "day shift" would have to say! Please keep us in your prayers.

[Cheryl in NM]

It sounds like you're starting to see your role in causing this.

 

 

 

Continue to invite her to be a part of your lives. even if she doesn;t and even if she stands you up. This is where you be the bigger person.

 

 

She related to you in a real way, and you took it back to money. You sabotaged the progress by giving her a truck. You never should have given it to her. Now that you have, you shouldn't take it back. But mending this relationship is going to require you redefining your behavior as well as her.

 

Okay, I see. We were really trying to help; not trying to control her with financial gifts. She was walking to work during winter before sun-up. Of course, the bus was driving along side her and she refused to take it. that statement also makes me see that she has changed as well. She has gone down hill; she's not willing to work as hard as she did then. hmmm, wonder why? Everyone else is paying her way!

 

Of course, the refusal to use the bus is a red flag because it's way cheaper than buying gas. She also receives food stamps and so does her room mate so at least we don't have to worry about her starving!

 

I think it's definitely time to step back from this relationship. I'll let her dad handle all requests and just offer support as someone else mentioned. That's what i was doing before the truck.

 

Thanks so much!

[KS_]

1. What is providing a step for her to go in the right direction (job, school, both of which need transportation) will become enabling as she is older. I don't know what the magic age is but at some point, you and your dh are going to have to cut off the financial help even if it means no contact from her. I don't think that immediately after your 21st birthday is that magic age, though.

 

 

 

I agree. My stepdad continually enabled my stepsister when she was younger (she's 44 now) by "helping" her out when she needed money, needed a car, etc., and just couldn't seem to get her act together. He thought that by providing some help, she'd be able to get her feet under her and start doing well and taking responsibility for herself and her kids.

 

After years and years of helping when he could, she's still not that stable or responsible. I don't think he helps her out like that anymore, but he feels badly about it sometimes and doesn't understand why she just can't get it together. I don't know if all the enabling in her younger years played a major role in that or if it's just her personality, but the "helping" didn't help in the long term.

[Cheryl in NM]

Okay, thanks for all your advice! I think I'll advise Dh to not say anything about dsd and mine's relationship tomorrow. I think he should just proceed as planned. Work on her truck, register it to her for the 2 years. We told her we'd give her the money for insurance so maybe he needs to explain that a little better. That we are giving her the money but she is responsible for paying the bill. He was also supposed to tell her that if she caused the rates to rise by continuing to get tickets and having fender benders then she will be responsible for the overage amount, but that our gift to her of $100/month will continue. He really wants to help her as long as she's in school and we can afford. Dropping her from the health insurance was never in the plans. We've told her she can stay on until she's 24 as long as she's in school.

 

Knowing her, she won't be cooled down by tomorrow, so I think addressing the way she spoke to me and to Dh about me may cause more problems. I think continuing to fulfill our promises will go along way towards the continuing mending of this relationship. We will continue to be stable. However, I will refer all requests for money to her dad. I'll stay out of the business end of things and try to stay in the heart end of things.

 

Thank you all for helping me to work this out!

[Peela]

I think you are definitely on the right track. I have a stepdd22 and at present, she is not talking to dh or I because of what boils down to money issues, and alcohol abuse. I think it can be great that a dad provides money but when it becomes the sole cause for interaction it seems to backfire anyway, because there's not much respect there.

StepDd also hates me, and I cant say dh has always been great with her- but she is really off balance and has been very hysterical and abusive to both him and I, when we were trying to help. What to do. Its a relief not to have her around, personally, because of all the drama, yet I still wish her well.

I think she- and your stepdd- need to let go of the parent strings and the way they are behaving is just asking for that. Better they learn to stand alone and come back to form a healthy relationship not based just on what they can get. I have suffered guilt being a stepmum and actually wanting stepdd out of our house (when she lived with us) and our lives (when she creates so much horrible, poisonous drama), and that is eventually what has happened, but I am just human and the drama wasn't healthy for the rest of the family, either. My kids were glad to have their sister away too. So its not just me. But it is still a difficult position to be in. I leave it to dh now, but I send her quiet prayers and love from my heart. It can be tough and I myself had a tough ride those years.

[kalanamak]

 

Dh is positive that if we cut off financial support she will not talk to us again. Who knows, she may have already changed her phone number and threatened to cut off any family member who gives it to us.

 

Oh, do I know this situation. It sours every relationship. It is a really spiteful thing to do.

 

:grouphug: Hubby's girls both outgrew this, thank GOODness, but they were never a troubled as your SDD. I'm so sorry.

[Cheryl in NM]

I think you are definitely on the right track. I have a stepdd22 and at present, she is not talking to dh or I because of what boils down to money issues, and alcohol abuse. I think it can be great that a dad provides money but when it becomes the sole cause for interaction it seems to backfire anyway, because there's not much respect there.

StepDd also hates me, and I cant say dh has always been great with her- but she is really off balance and has been very hysterical and abusive to both him and I, when we were trying to help. What to do. Its a relief not to have her around, personally, because of all the drama, yet I still wish her well.

I think she- and your stepdd- need to let go of the parent strings and the way they are behaving is just asking for that. Better they learn to stand alone and come back to form a healthy relationship not based just on what they can get. I have suffered guilt being a stepmum and actually wanting stepdd out of our house (when she lived with us) and our lives (when she creates so much horrible, poisonous drama), and that is eventually what has happened, but I am just human and the drama wasn't healthy for the rest of the family, either. My kids were glad to have their sister away too. So its not just me. But it is still a difficult position to be in. I leave it to dh now, but I send her quiet prayers and love from my heart. It can be tough and I myself had a tough ride those years.

 

Thanks so much for sharing your personal experience. So often I only hear of "good" step-families and I end up feeling to blame for the whole mess. Your experience really resonates with me and my feelings over the years. Thanks

[Cheryl in NM]

Oh, do I know this situation. It sours every relationship. It is a really spiteful thing to do.

 

:grouphug: Hubby's girls both outgrew this, thank GOODness, but they were never a troubled as your SDD. I'm so sorry.

 

Thank you. I, also, behaved in a similar fashion. But I was respectful, just non-engaging and only there for what I could get. I'm hoping that time will heal this in the way that I want. :tongue_smilie:

[Cheryl in NM]

Well, dsd came to the house for Dh to work on her truck. She refused to come into the house. Ds went outside to greet her as he always does and she sent him in her for dad. Dh told ds to quit being a messenger and he'd be out as soon as the movie was over. She was 3 hours late so we started watching a movie. Dh told her she owed me an apology and when asked what I said that set her off, she checked her text msg and dh said she just put the phone down and started in baggage from the past. he spent alot of time talking to her and she DID come in the house to get her birthday cards. I was on the phone with my nurse though so I had to go into another room. When I came back in the room Dh started asking me questions about what she should do with the erroneous insurance bill and then relaying the the info to her (she was across the room) so I just started puttered in the kitchen and she went outside. She stayed outside the whole time (3 hours). I know I could have handled the situation better. :(:crying:

 

I'm grateful that she's still talking to her dad and that when he explained the reality of the baggage situations she became quiet.

I'm grateful that she didn't spew hateful words or physically attack me.

I'm grateful that at least it seems that there might be reconciliation in the future for the two of us.

 

Thank you all for your support and advice.

[missiemick]

As the step-mom, I would remove myself from the money/car/insurance and parenting type stuff and leave that up to your dh. Let your husband make the decisions and do all the communicating regarding these things. Make your relationship with her only one of support and nurturing and kindness. Do not make your husband choose between her and you. If she sees his financial support for her as love, and he makes it contingent on her apologizing to you, I would think that would be extremely painful for her.

 

Totally agree! My Dh and I both came from families that had yucky divorces -- sounds similar to what she went through. Growing up like that will do crazy things to you. I've seen this approach (from step-parents on both sides) be the most effective.

[Cheryl in NM]

Totally agree! My Dh and I both came from families that had yucky divorces -- sounds similar to what she went through. Growing up like that will do crazy things to you. I've seen this approach (from step-parents on both sides) be the most effective.

 

This is exactly my plan. I told Dh that any further requests for money or any "thing" from her will be forwarded to him, with a note to her that I did so.

 

I'm considering writing her a pen and paper letter apologizing for not beginning interaction with her yesterday and explaining that I still love her and am not mad at her, just hurt. I want to tell her that I'll be here when she's ready. I'm not sure, though, that she'll receive it in the way that I intend it. She was still insisting to her dad that I hate her and she hates me and that we'll never get along.

[Jean in Newcastle]

This is exactly my plan. I told Dh that any further requests for money or any "thing" from her will be forwarded to him, with a note to her that I did so.

 

I'm considering writing her a pen and paper letter apologizing for not beginning interaction with her yesterday and explaining that I still love her and am not mad at her, just hurt. I want to tell her that I'll be here when she's ready. I'm not sure, though, that she'll receive it in the way that I intend it. She was still insisting to her dad that I hate her and she hates me and that we'll never get along.

 

I don't think you did anything wrong yesterday. She was 3 hours late. She refused to come into the house. Then she did, you were on the phone. She was already confrontational - you kept things from escalating by maintaining some distance.

[Harriet Vane]

I don't think you did anything wrong yesterday. She was 3 hours late. She refused to come into the house. Then she did, you were on the phone. She was already confrontational - you kept things from escalating by maintaining some distance.

:iagree:

[Joanne]

I don't think you did anything wrong yesterday. She was 3 hours late. She refused to come into the house. Then she did, you were on the phone. She was already confrontational - you kept things from escalating by maintaining some distance.

 

This. You keep trying to engage with her as if she was mature and reasonable. :001_huh: She's not.

[Cheryl in NM]

Thanks Jean & Strider!

 

This. You keep trying to engage with her as if she was mature and reasonable. :001_huh: She's not.

 

But Joanne, isn't the bold part the "fake it till you make it" concept? Or does that not really apply to this situation?

 

I keep thinking if I treat her as a mature and reasonable person she will become one. Now even I think I sound like a big dummy!:glare: :001_huh: :)

Edited May 20, 2011 by Cheryl in NM

[DesertDweller]

I'd still pay to put the title in her name--this way the record is clear.

 

Then I'd stop paying for everything else. She's an adult now.

 

:iagree:

 

Time for her to grow up. You've done more than enough to help her. If the relationship is based on her getting money then it's fostering a sense of entitlement.

 

You may find she has little contact with both of you for awhile, but I would stand my ground and stop helping her. Love her. Give her time and hopefully she'll see that you care and come around.

Edited May 20, 2011 by DesertDweller

[Joanne]

Thanks Jean & Strider!

 

 

 

But Joanne, isn't the bold part the "fake it till you make it" concept? Or does that not really apply to this situation?

 

I keep thinking if I treat her as a mature and reasonable person she will become one. Now even I think I sound like a big dummy!:glare: :001_huh: :)

 

No. Fake it till you make it is a catchy phrase about how you can change your behavior and thinking, not someone elses. It does not apply to this situation. You can't "nice and polite" her into maturity (and out of dysfuntion).

 

:grouphug:

[Aelwydd]

I kind of want to cry for her, because she has lost so much. Her mother engaged in typical gate-keeping behavior, and sabotaged her relationship with her father. That loss is devastating, no matter how old she is. Adult or no, she is still very young and now grieving for her brother.

 

It sounds to me like she is quite overwhelmed with everything. She didn't have the stability of a good relationship with both parents, and before she knew it, she's become responsible for herself and doesn't even have her brother with her, possibly the only other person who could completely relate to her position. I'm not at all surprised that she got into drugs and other destructive behavior. Divorce and break-ups of families are so traumatizing to the children.

 

None of this is your fault, Cheryl. You are in a very difficult position, yourself. I think this girl needs an intervention of some sort, that involves counseling from a good therapist. And not merely for a few weeks or months -- something long-term. She needs that to heal from the damage done to her by her mother's assault on her relationship with her father, and from her brother's death. Otherwise, no matter what demands are put upon her, she will not be capable of meeting them. It is like demanding a young bird with a broken wing to fly out of the nest on threat of being kicked out. And yet, she is old enough to do damage to your other "nestlings" and to you. You need to protect your family as well.

 

It is an untenable situation for you and your family, as well as for her. That is why I really hope that your husband and his daughter may consider getting help from a neutral third party, and see a good therapist.

 

Whatever the final decision is, I really hope that your husband is able to preserve some sort of connection to her, for her sake.

[Cheryl in NM]

No. Fake it till you make it is a catchy phrase about how you can change your behavior and thinking, not someone elses. It does not apply to this situation. You can't "nice and polite" her into maturity (and out of dysfuntion).

 

:grouphug:

 

I had to laugh at this. But why can't I just fix this?! I want to so bad! I'm sure you are familiar with these feelings. It's hard to just have them sitting there.

 

I kind of want to cry for her, because she has lost so much. Her mother engaged in typical gate-keeping behavior, and sabotaged her relationship with her father. That loss is devastating, no matter how old she is. Adult or no, she is still very young and now grieving for her brother.

 

It sounds to me like she is quite overwhelmed with everything. She didn't have the stability of a good relationship with both parents, and before she knew it, she's become responsible for herself and doesn't even have her brother with her, possibly the only other person who could completely relate to her position. I'm not at all surprised that she got into drugs and other destructive behavior. Divorce and break-ups of families are so traumatizing to the children.

 

None of this is your fault, Cheryl. You are in a very difficult position, yourself. I think this girl needs an intervention of some sort, that involves counseling from a good therapist. And not merely for a few weeks or months -- something long-term. She needs that to heal from the damage done to her by her mother's assault on her relationship with her father, and from her brother's death. Otherwise, no matter what demands are put upon her, she will not be capable of meeting them. It is like demanding a young bird with a broken wing to fly out of the nest on threat of being kicked out. And yet, she is old enough to do damage to your other "nestlings" and to you. You need to protect your family as well.

 

It is an untenable situation for you and your family, as well as for her. That is why I really hope that your husband and his daughter may consider getting help from a neutral third party, and see a good therapist.

 

Whatever the final decision is, I really hope that your husband is able to preserve some sort of connection to her, for her sake.

 

I agree. We've tried counseling for years. She is adamantly opposed. She used to either go in and lie through her teeth or say nothing at all. I reminded Dh that she really needs help, but I don't know how he'll go about encouraging her to get it. I keep hoping that as she takes classes in college and comes across people in her life that she'll see that she has issues that are bigger than her and that she needs help. I don't know what else to do for her and neither does Dh. We've always been lost with this one. I really don't think she's dealt with her brother's death. There were like twins since they were only a year apart. I think she just pretends he's in the Marines and gone, but then when her birthday and other holiday's come around she has to face the truth temporarily. She insisted that she didn't want to be around anyone who knew her brother for her birthday. He's been gone 2 1/2 years. I know you can't put a time limit on grief, but I really think she needs to deal with this. I just don't know how to help her. I've been letting her make the first move; if she hugs me I hug her back, if she brings up something emotional I engage, if she shares a problem I comfort/advise/whatever is necessary. Then I worry that she sees this as rejection because she's always making the first move. I really feel like I can't do or say anything right with her or for her. Sometimes it paralyzes me, like yesterday when she walked in the house. Even though I was occupied with a phone call I started shaking and didn't stop for a half hour. My stomach turned and I'm sure I lost all color in my face. I just don't want to make a move that will cause her to write off her dad again. He's already lost one child to death, how can he handle losing a living one? Anyway, I digress, it's difficult for all involved. I just wish I could fix it. I pray alot, but God is not taking care of this on *my* time.

[Harriet Vane]

No. Fake it till you make it is a catchy phrase about how you can change your behavior and thinking, not someone elses. It does not apply to this situation. You can't "nice and polite" her into maturity (and out of dysfuntion).

 

:grouphug:

 

Oooooohhhhhhh . . . .Joanne, thank you for making this clear. Reading this simple post of your is actually an AHA moment for me.