I want to teach phyics AND chemistry in 8th grade.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

8th grade science is the hardest thing I've tried to decide on. It is what will launch us into high school science. This science year stands to help us tremendously in high school. It can lay a very pivatol foundation to help us understand chemistry and physics. I really am trying to narrow my options down and make a final decision...You all have been so helpful, and I hope it's ok to ask another question...

 

If I wanted to do a semester of physics and a semester of chemistry for 8th grade, could you all tell me what to look at? We will be taking Alg. I at the same time.

 

I know there is RS4Kids Chemistry Level 2 that lasts a semester, but I've read old threads that mentioned errors. Does anyone have updated information about this?

 

There is Conceptual Physics/Conceptual Chemistry, but each lasts a year. I wouldn't think you would pick some topics and leave others out.

 

I've read about GEMS and Ellen McHenry's Elements and Carbon Chemistry.... these either seem too expensive or not quite on grade level.

 

BJU has a 9th grade physical science that is like what I'm looking for, but this is WAAAYYYYY harder than I want to do.

 

The best fit might still be the CPO physical science I've been looking at... it has more physics than chemistry. What about CPO physics 1st semester and the balance of CPO with RS4Kids Chemistry Level 2 in 2nd semester?

 

I love the CPO..... the downside is being able to adjust the experiments so that I use common products and avoid buying their super-expensive lab supplies.

 

I'm not looking for rigor..... I really want something that explains and lays a foundation for high school chem and physics. My dd will have other subjects that will be rigorous for her. We need to "minor" on science next year. The Conceptual books seem to be what I'm looking for, but I want to teach both physics and chemistry.

 

I really hope this thread will help others as well as myself. Can you all make any suggestions?

Edited November 8, 2010 by Sweet Home Alabama
corrected a mistake

[Pam in MA]

I guess I would go with the CPO book. We're using it now and there is plenty of chemistry in it. We haven't had too much trouble adapting the labs either.

[Luckymama]

CPO fan here :D

[HollyDay]

Honestly, I'd look at Noeo Chem 3 and Physics 2. I know the level 2 program is for a younger age, but it is still a lot of material. Other than that, have you looked at Rainbow?

[EKS]

You could use Conceptual Physical Science-Explorations. It is a 9th grade physical science book and contains material on physics, chemistry, and earth science, but you could skip the earth science. The physics part is written by the Conceptual Physics guy, and the chemistry part is written by the Conceptual Chemistry guy.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

You could use Conceptual Physical Science-Explorations. It is a 9th grade physical science book and contains material on physics, chemistry, and earth science, but you could skip the earth science. The physics part is written by the Conceptual Physics guy, and the chemistry part is written by the Conceptual Chemistry guy.

 

Kai,

This looks like a good possibility. I read the first chapter on Pearson, and saw comments about Christians as extremists.... within the context of religious views on science. This seemed unnecessary and kind of unfortunate. I don't mind studying pure science.....and therefore secular science. I am a Christian, and I'm fine with the fact that God's creation points to Him. It's not necessary for a text book to point that out... Anyway, what about the rest of the text? Does he continue with comments like "extremists Christians"? Or, it is more pure science?

 

Also, what kind of experiments are done?

 

I see a plus in that there are on-line videoes of Hewitt explaining topics. There is also something called The Physics Place. I can't see anything online since you have to be a member, but I think I read that it is on-line help for physics....

 

Can you fill in these blanks for me?

 

Thanks so much for your help!

[Jane Elliot]

Have you looked at Rainbow Science? It's a two-year middle school science that lays a good foundation in Physics, Chemistry, and Biology. The first two sections are Physics and Chemistry and could easily be completed in one year. We are really enjoying it this year.

http://beginningspublishing.com/version2/rainbow.htm

[sagira]

I know Singapore Interactive Science combines topics, but I don't remember if It was Physics and Chemistry together. You can check it out on their website here: http://www.singaporemath.com/Interactive_Science_for_Inquiring_Minds_Textbook_A_p/isimt1.htm

 

Okay, I took a second look and 7th is Chemistry and Biology, but you could buy book A and B, and just do Chemistry and Physics if you're so inclined.

Edited November 8, 2010 by sagira

[Sweet Home Alabama]

Thanks, everyone!

 

I have considered Rainbow..... yet it is more than I want... I don't need the biology. We're doing BJU Life Science this year.

 

I've only briefly considered Singapore. Maybe I'm wrong, but since we've not used Singapore for math, I thought it might be more difficult to do. I can certainly look again!!:001_smile:

 

I truly am so thankfu for all your responses!

[Carol in Cal.]

Science Explorer would be worth checking.

It's a collection of middle school topics in fairly small books. You could focus pretty hard on it and do physics and chemistry books in parallel. They are independent of each other.

 

I do like RS4K Chemistry Level II very much, but don't know of any comparable program for physics.

[EKS]

Kai,

This looks like a good possibility. I read the first chapter on Pearson, and saw comments about Christians as extremists.... within the context of religious views on science. This seemed unnecessary and kind of unfortunate. I don't mind studying pure science.....and therefore secular science. I am a Christian, and I'm fine with the fact that God's creation points to Him. It's not necessary for a text book to point that out... Anyway, what about the rest of the text? Does he continue with comments like "extremists Christians"? Or, it is more pure science?

 

Also, what kind of experiments are done?

 

I see a plus in that there are on-line videoes of Hewitt explaining topics. There is also something called The Physics Place. I can't see anything online since you have to be a member, but I think I read that it is on-line help for physics....

 

Can you fill in these blanks for me?

 

Thanks so much for your help!

 

There is nothing that I remember about religion mentioned anywhere else in the book. That first chapter is fairly worthless anyway, so you could easily skip it.

 

I had absolutely no memory of the text saying anything about Christianity at all, and certainly nothing about "extremist Christians," so I dug my copy out of the box it has been living in, and lo and behold, I found it in a footnote. Just so others can know what we're talking about I'll provide the relevant paragraphs from the text as well as the footnote:

 

Science and religion have similarities also, but they are basically different. Science is concerned with physical things, while religion is concerned with spiritual matters. Simply put, science asks how; religion asks why. The practices of science and religion are also different. Whereas scientists experiment to find nature's secrets, many religious practitioners worship God and work to build human community. In these respects, science and religion are as different as apples and oranges and do not contradict each other. Science and religion are two different yet complementary fields of human activity.

 

When we study the nature of light later in this book, we will treat light first as a wave and then as a particle. To the person who knows a little bit about science, waves and particles are contradictory. Light can be only one or the other, and we have to choose between them. But to the enlightened person, waves and particles complement each other and provide a deeper understanding of light. In a similar way, it is mainly people who are either uninformed or misinformed about the deeper natures of both science and religion who feel that they must choose between believing in religion and believing in science. Unless one has a shallow understanding of either or both, there is not contradiction in being religious and being scientific in one's thinking.*

 

Many people are troubled about not knowing the answers to religious and philosophical questions. Some avoid uncertainty by eagerly accepting any comforting answer. An important message from science, however, is that uncertainty is acceptable...

 

*Of course this doesn't apply to certain extremists, Christian, Muslim, or otherwise, who steadfastly assert that one cannot embrace both their brand of religion and science.

 

As for experiments, we didn't use the experiment book that goes with the text. I pieced together various kits from Home Science Tools for the physics part. We used Conceptual Chemistry for chemistry and used a LabPaq kit for that (I highly recommend the LabPaq kits).

 

Our book came with a disk that had videos and tutorials (interactive activities) on it and it is probably the same thing as what you'll get at The Physics Place. The videos are short segments (usually really short) of Paul Hewitt talking about physics. I have to say that his lecture style rubbed me the wrong way, but my son thought he was fabulous. I preferred Suchocki's style, but my son couldn't stand him because he reminded him of the guy on Blue's Clues and he felt like he was in a preschool class while watching him. The tutorials were quite good, though I think they were actually designed for Conceptual Physics, because they were at a much higher level than what we got in the book.

 

I hope this helps. I'd be happy to answer any other questions you may have.

Edited November 8, 2010 by EKS

[Sweet Home Alabama]

From Kai:

 

As for experiments, we didn't use the experiment book that goes with the text. I pieced together various kits from Home Science Tools for the physics part. We used Conceptual Chemistry for chemistry and used a LabPaq kit for that (I highly recommend the LabPaq kits).

 

Our book came with a disk that had videos and tutorials (interactive activities) on it and it is probably the same thing as what you'll get at The Physics Place. The videos are short segments (usually really short) of Paul Hewitt talking about physics.

 

 

 

 

From Sweet Home Alabama:

 

Kai, just need clarification.

 

Did you use the Explorations book for BOTH physics (with Home Science Tools kits and chemistry (with LabPaq)? Or.... Explorations for physics and Conceptual Chemistry for chemistry? IOW, did you use one curriculua for both subjects or did you use two?

 

I think the Hewitt videoes will be good for us since they are short. We're watching Mrs. Vick on BJU Life Science, and each day we spend at least 30-45 minutes (depending on rewinding for note-taking) watching her. That is kind of long.

 

I know about Home Science Tools, but I don't know anything about LabPaq. If you get a chance, could you tell me which experiments you used from these sources? I'm trying to piece together what you did just to get a better feel for what I could do.

 

Thanks so much!!!

Edited November 8, 2010 by Sweet Home Alabama

[Tammyla]

I'll second throwing this one out there. (My ds loves it btw.)

 

The Rainbow

[Mom22ns]

We're doing Prentice Hall Physical Science Concepts In Action. It is their 9th grade physical science book and is chemistry and physics. It is tough, similar to the BJU - only secular, so it may not be what you are looking for, but it is a great intro to physics and chem. We initially were doing it on our own using the syllabus found here: http://scecinachemistry.net/1ScecinaICP/

Lately, I have been having health issues so I picked up the DIVE dvd and we've done the last two chapters that way. Both ways worked for us. DIVE made it more independent. I love teaching science, so I don't usually want independent, but right now it is necessary.

[EKS]

 

Kai, just need clarification.

 

Did you use the Explorations book for BOTH physics (with Home Science Tools kits and chemistry (with LabPaq)? Or.... Explorations for physics and Conceptual Chemistry for chemistry? IOW, did you use one curriculua for both subjects or did you use two?

 

I think the Hewitt videoes will be good for us since they are short. We're watching Mrs. Vick on BJU Life Science, and each day we spend at least 30-45 minutes (depending on rewinding for note-taking) watching her. That is kind of long.

 

I know about Home Science Tools, but I don't know anything about LabPaq. If you get a chance, could you tell me which experiments you used from these sources? I'm trying to piece together what you did just to get a better feel for what I could do.

 

Thanks so much!!!

 

I used Physical Science Explorations for physics when my son was in 7th grade. Then I used Conceptual Chemistry for chemistry when he was in 8th grade.

 

As for experiements, we used CK-101 from LabPaq for chemistry and if I had to do it over again I would use LabPaq for physics as well. The Home Science Tools kits were anything but secular, so I ended up retyping all of the instructions to remove the religious parts.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

I used Physical Science Explorations for physics when my son was in 7th grade. Then I used Conceptual Chemistry for chemistry when he was in 8th grade.

 

As for experiements, we used CK-101 from LabPaq for chemistry and if I had to do it over again I would use LabPaq for physics as well. The Home Science Tools kits were anything but secular, so I ended up retyping all of the instructions to remove the religious parts.

 

 

Kai, how could I do BOTH of these in the same year? I'm SO sorry for asking this many questions. Maybe I misunderstood something.

[melmichigan]

Kai, please correct me if I'm wrong but I was under the impression that the Physical Science Exploration physics portion was the same or extremely similar to the Conceptual Physics the High School Program. Did you find this to be the case?

[Sweet Home Alabama]

I guess I would go with the CPO book. We're using it now and there is plenty of chemistry in it. We haven't had too much trouble adapting the labs either.

 

 

Pam, could you describe how you use CPO? Are you using the middle school text? I've always liked CPO.

 

What are you using instead of the expensive CPO lab supplies? Do you feel like CPO is preparing your child for high school science? What is the math like?

 

I would love to know what your schedule is.... how long you spend each day and how many days per week you do science.

 

This would be so helpful. Thank you so much for responding!

Edited November 8, 2010 by Sweet Home Alabama

[Sweet Home Alabama]

CPO fan here :D

 

 

Luckymama, same CPO question to you!:001_smile:

 

Are you using the middle school text? How do you do experiments? What is your science schedule?

 

Do you feel CPO is preparing your child for high school science? How much math do you do with CPO?

[Sweet Home Alabama]

Science Explorer would be worth checking.

It's a collection of middle school topics in fairly small books. You could focus pretty hard on it and do physics and chemistry books in parallel. They are independent of each other.

 

I do like RS4K Chemistry Level II very much, but don't know of any comparable program for physics.

 

 

Carol, how can I view Science Explorer? It looks like there is an interactive feature....

 

It's hard to see text books on-line sometimes. I'd like to see more of this.

 

Thanks SO much for your help!

[Carol in Cal.]

Carol, how can I view Science Explorer? It looks like there is an interactive feature....

 

It's hard to see text books on-line sometimes. I'd like to see more of this.

 

Thanks SO much for your help!

 

I have no idea, but older (but not very old) editions of Science Explorer books are for sale on ebay very cheaply all the time. I recommend taking the plunge and buying one, just to check out the format.

 

It's more colorful than, say Saxon or Rod and Staff, but not distractingly so. There is a big emphasis on building science vocabulary, which is one of my priorities. I liked the Weather and Climate book a lot--that's an obscure topic that I was glad to have DD learn more about. She used most of the biology ones, but we had already done so much chemistry that she didn't use the chemistry ones--I found them used, very cheap, so we do own them. The earth and physical science ones were great.

[EKS]

Kai, how could I do BOTH of these in the same year? I'm SO sorry for asking this many questions. Maybe I misunderstood something.

 

The book is designed to be completed in a year. If you do slightly less than one chapter per week, you will get through it easily in a year (assuming that you are only doing the physics and chemistry parts). We went really, really slowly through physics the year we did it, and could certainly have doubled our speed with no trouble.

[EKS]

Kai, please correct me if I'm wrong but I was under the impression that the Physical Science Exploration physics portion was the same or extremely similar to the Conceptual Physics the High School Program. Did you find this to be the case?

 

Yes, it is extremely similar. It is simply an abridged version of Conceptual Physics (high school) and Conceptual Chemistry, with earth science added.

[NineChoirs]

At the moment I am also planning on using the Prentice Hall Physical Science Concepts in Action (using the Kolbe lesson plans) for my dd next year who will be in 8th. This year she is doing Biology work in her LoF book. She is also doing "The Elements: Ingredients of the Universe" by Ellen Johnston McHenry. I bought this book a couple of years ago and never used it. But this year I decided that it would be perfect to help her memorize the Periodic table before starting Chemistry.

 

The reason I shelved it originally is because I felt it was too silly and not fleshed out enough (it was one of those oops purchases). I also didn't like the idea of blackline masters that had to be copied. After having used it though I am glad I bought it. She is actually really learning alot from it. She already has many of the elements and information pertaining to them memorized. I am not making copies of the pages but just putting one chapter at a time in a 3-ring binder for her. She is having a blast with it and considers it a "fun subject". It has several catchy songs on a cd and flashcards to use with the program. It's great because it is a gentle introduction to Chemistry. I am certain that because of it, she won't be intimidated by the subject when it becomes tougher.

 

I actually already own the Apologia Physical Science. I used it with my oldest son when he was in 8th. He loved it and thinks I should use it with my dd. I have decided the Apologia series is a bit too chatty/preachy for me though. I would prefer a book that focused more on the actual science. I will just supplement with reading materials and discussions which reflect our beliefs.

[NineChoirs]

 

Science and religion have similarities also, but they are basically different. Science is concerned with physical things, while religion is concerned with spiritual matters. Simply put, science asks how; religion asks why. The practices of science and religion are also different. Whereas scientists experiment to find nature's secrets, many religious practitioners worship God and work to build human community. In these respects, science and religion are as different as apples and oranges and do not contradict each other. Science and religion are two different yet complementary fields of human activity.

 

When we study the nature of light later in this book, we will treat light first as a wave and then as a particle. To the person who knows a little bit about science, waves and particles are contradictory. Light can be only one or the other, and we have to choose between them. But to the enlightened person, waves and particles complement each other and provide a deeper understanding of light. In a similar way, it is mainly people who are either uninformed or misinformed about the deeper natures of both science and religion who feel that they must choose between believing in religion and believing in science. Unless one has a shallow understanding of either or both, there is not contradiction in being religious and being scientific in one's thinking.*

 

Many people are troubled about not knowing the answers to religious and philosophical questions. Some avoid uncertainty by eagerly accepting any comforting answer. An important message from science, however, is that uncertainty is acceptable...

 

*Of course this doesn't apply to certain extremists, Christian, Moslem, or otherwise, who steadfastly assert that one cannot embrace both their brand of religion and science.

 

 

 

 

It seems like this might just be a very badly worded footnote. I don't think they meant to say that those groups are extremists so much as certain extremists might be found in any given group. Otherwise it seems to contradict everything they wrote above it. Still it is a very unfortunate footnote and they probably shouldn't have addressed the issue at all. I am sure a student's parents can (and will) explain the matter better than a few token paragraphs in a textbook anyway.

[NineChoirs]

Here is a thorough review (at Rainbow Resource) to the Chemistry book I am currently using with my daughter: The Elements: Ingredients to the Universe

[mom31257]

Thanks, everyone!

 

I have considered Rainbow..... yet it is more than I want... I don't need the biology. We're doing BJU Life Science this year.

 

I've only briefly considered Singapore. Maybe I'm wrong, but since we've not used Singapore for math, I thought it might be more difficult to do. I can certainly look again!!:001_smile:

 

I truly am so thankfu for all your responses!

 

The biology and earth science is designed to be done in the 2nd year of the program. If you follow it as written, you only cover physics and chemistry the 1st year. My dd did Year 1 last year. I thought it was a good middle school course for those subjects. You have 2 lessons per week, 1 lab per week, and a test every other week.

 

What about Dive Science Integrated Chemistry and Physics? You can choose from a variety of science textbooks to use as the reading supplement to the lectures. I haven't used it yet, but I'm strongly considering it for next year.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

Here is a thorough review (at Rainbow Resource) to the Chemistry book I am currently using with my daughter: The Elements: Ingredients to the Universe

 

So many people LOVE Ellen McHenry's Elements and Carbon Chemistry. I'd like to know how long each one takes to do. I think I read that you have to start with Elements.... is this right?

 

I know these are written for a younger age, but Carbon Chemistry is for up to grade 9! Would it be possible to maybe do CPO stressing physics and fold in McHenry's The Elements and Carbon Chemistry just to reinforce chemistry? Would this be *fun*? What about religious content? I read earlier today that it talks about Intelligent Design. As a Christian, would this majorly offend you? Would it keep you from using these?

 

I would LOVE for science to be fun at the same time as prepping us for high school.

 

Maybe CPO stands alone. I could still do McHenry's with my younger boys who will be in 3rd and 6th grades. The 8th grader could do her own thing and listen in to the boys' science.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

The biology and earth science is designed to be done in the 2nd year of the program. If you follow it as written, you only cover physics and chemistry the 1st year. My dd did Year 1 last year. I thought it was a good middle school course for those subjects. You have 2 lessons per week, 1 lab per week, and a test every other week.

 

What about Dive Science Integrated Chemistry and Physics? You can choose from a variety of science textbooks to use as the reading supplement to the lectures. I haven't used it yet, but I'm strongly considering it for next year.

 

 

DIVE is highly used.... I've just had a feeling that it's more than I want for next year. I might be wrong.

 

Because we might do TPS English I and we will do Algebra I, I really want science to take a "back seat". English and math will occupy MOST of our time.

 

Am I wrong about DIVE?

[NineChoirs]

So many people LOVE Ellen McHenry's Elements and Carbon Chemistry. I'd like to know how long each one takes to do. I think I read that you have to start with Elements.... is this right?

 

I know these are written for a younger age, but Carbon Chemistry is for up to grade 9! Would it be possible to maybe do CPO stressing physics and fold in McHenry's The Elements and Carbon Chemistry just to reinforce chemistry? Would this be *fun*? What about religious content? I read earlier today that it talks about Intelligent Design. As a Christian, would this majorly offend you? Would it keep you from using these?

 

I would LOVE for science to be fun at the same time as prepping us for high school.

 

Maybe CPO stands alone. I could still do McHenry's with my younger boys who will be in 3rd and 6th grades. The 8th grader could do her own thing and listen in to the boys' science.

 

I didn't even know about the second book! It looks good, I will probably pick it up and have my daughter use it this year as well. The first book could be done as quickly or as slowly as you wanted. I have been drawing it out by focusing on memorization (knowing there is a second book will allow us to move through it faster). The extra activities in the back are entirely optional. You could just work through the regular chapters and get through it pretty quickly, or make it last longer by using some or all of the many activity recommendations in the back.

 

I should point out that the first book doesn't seem very fancy. I put it on the shelf when it first came in the mail because I wasn't very impressed with the overall layout and presentation. But in actual use it has been great. I haven't seen any religious (pro or con) references at all. If I did come across a casual reference in this or the next book it wouldn't be too big of a deal for us. As long as a textbook doesn't push any kind of agenda then it just becomes a talking point.

 

I feel this program is perfect for an introduction to Chemistry. It is sort of like memorizing the multiplication tables & mastering basic arithmetic (except alot more fun) before moving onto advanced math. It allows the student to feel comfortable with the subject they are studying. It looks like the second book keeps the same "fun" factor. This book is perfect for multi-age study.

 

Since I haven't seen the second book, I don't know if it can be done without doing the first one. But if you buy the first for your younger students it would be pretty easy to re-mediate a bit if necessary. The only thing I think might be an issue is the memorization/familiarity of the periodic table. If the second one reintroduces it, then I wouldn't see the need to start with the first one. If however, it assumes the student is already very familiar with the elements, it might be difficult to jump into.

[melmichigan]

We are working through Conceptual Physics the High School program right now. After all the talk I printed the first chapter of the Elements to look through with my DD. This might be something fun to do before we get to Conceptual Chemistry. I really like the focus on memorization. :001_smile: (I need some fun right now, this physics stuff is work. :lol:)

[Sweet Home Alabama]

Well....

 

Now I need for someone familiar with CPO physical science to share information. Does CPO physical science stand alone, or can/should I supplement. I ask only because there are more physics chapters than chemistry chapters.

 

I still have a lot of reading to do about CPO and Ellen McHenry, but I want to find out if they could be used together.

 

For 8th grade I am wondering:

 

1st semester: CPO middle school physics portion done as primary science. The younger kids would do The Elements. The 8th grader would do this on the side.......VERY secondary to CPO.

 

2nd semester: CPO middle school chemistry portion with Carbon Chemistry. OR..... RS4Kids Chemistry Level 2 with Carbon Chemistry (since you're supposed to come up with your own experiments.)

 

Does CPO physical science stand alone? Is there enough chemistry to be a prep for high school?

Edited November 8, 2010 by Sweet Home Alabama
clarification

[EKS]

So many people LOVE Ellen McHenry's Elements and Carbon Chemistry. I'd like to know how long each one takes to do. I think I read that you have to start with Elements.... is this right?

 

I know these are written for a younger age, but Carbon Chemistry is for up to grade 9! Would it be possible to maybe do CPO stressing physics and fold in McHenry's The Elements and Carbon Chemistry just to reinforce chemistry? Would this be *fun*? What about religious content? I read earlier today that it talks about Intelligent Design. As a Christian, would this majorly offend you? Would it keep you from using these?

 

I would LOVE for science to be fun at the same time as prepping us for high school.

 

Maybe CPO stands alone. I could still do McHenry's with my younger boys who will be in 3rd and 6th grades. The 8th grader could do her own thing and listen in to the boys' science.

 

As much as I loved McHenry's The Elements, I honestly do not think it's enough for an 8th grader.

[EKS]

We are working through Conceptual Physics the High School program right now. After all the talk I printed the first chapter of the Elements to look through with my DD. This might be something fun to do before we get to Conceptual Chemistry. I really like the focus on memorization. :001_smile: (I need some fun right now, this physics stuff is work. :lol:)

 

Unfortunately, the focus in memorization in The Elements isn't really on the right things. The most important things to know about the periodic table are the trends, but McHenry spends lots of energy on memorizing the elements themselves, which is really not overly relevant to the study of chemistry. (FWIW, my degree is in biochemistry and so I've had lots of chemistry).

[Sweet Home Alabama]

Unfortunately, the focus in memorization in The Elements isn't really on the right things. The most important things to know about the periodic table are the trends, but McHenry spends lots of energy on memorizing the elements themselves, which is really not overly relevant to the study of chemistry. (FWIW, my degree is in biochemistry and so I've had lots of chemistry).

 

 

Kai, thank you for weighing in!

 

I know The Elements is for a younger child.... I would use it in 1st semester secondary to CPO physical. Then in 2nd semester, I would use Carbon Chem which is "supposed" to be appropriate for up to 9th grade.

 

Since I don't want rigor and only want foundational material, I was hoping the CPO chemistry portion with Carbon Chemistry might provide the foundation for high school...... maybe Spectrum? That's another thread!!!!:lol:

 

Do you still feel like this is inappropriate? If so, my alternate is RS4K Chemistry Level 2 with Carbon Chemistry. The thing is, CPO middle school physical science might be enough all on its own, and here I go complicating things!

 

Please let me know what you think. As always, thanks so much for all your help!

[kangato3]

We used the CA version of CPO, Focus on Physical Science, for 8th grade, and I thought it to be excellent prep for high school science. We had previously tried Rainbow and PH Science Explorer, and both dd and I preferred CPO, hands down. Besides the text, there are plenty of free skills sheets online which reinforce many of the concepts and skills.

 

9th grade dd is currently taking Biology and feels that the chemistry she learned last year has been a huge help.

[Maverick_Mom]

 

I have considered Rainbow..... yet it is more than I want... I don't need the biology.

 

 

 

IIRC, Biology is in the *second* year of Rainbow. The first year is Physics and Chemistry. So you could use year 1 only.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

IIRC, Biology is in the *second* year of Rainbow. The first year is Physics and Chemistry. So you could use year 1 only.

 

Thank you, Maverick Mom! I thought you had to buy both years. :001_smile:

[Sweet Home Alabama]

We used the CA version of CPO, Focus on Physical Science, for 8th grade, and I thought it to be excellent prep for high school science. We had previously tried Rainbow and PH Science Explorer, and both dd and I preferred CPO, hands down. Besides the text, there are plenty of free skills sheets online which reinforce many of the concepts and skills.

 

9th grade dd is currently taking Biology and feels that the chemistry she learned last year has been a huge help.

 

 

This is so encouraging, Kangato3! :001_smile:

 

If you have a chance, would you please tell me what your schedule is? There are 18 chapters in the regular CPO middle school science book (which I'll probably use. I like the topics covered better.) Will 18 chapters last the whole year?

 

How many days/week and how much time/lesson do you schedule CPO? Also, how do you handle the experiments? The kit from CPO is VERY expensive (~$1500) I think.

 

There is more physics in CPO than chemistry, and I have wondered about supplementing the chemistry with Ellen McHenry's The Elements in 1st semester (which I would also do with my 3rd and 6th graders.) In 2nd semester I would use Carbon Chemistry.

 

This may be too much. CPO may be enough. I just want to be sure we have a good foundation in both physics and chemistry.

 

What is your opinion?

 

Thank you sooo much for responding!!!

Edited November 9, 2010 by Sweet Home Alabama
added a question

[Mom22ns]

I think you are right in your evaluation of DIVE. It is intended as a 9th grade Chemistry/Physics class and is pretty intense for 8th grade. It is less intense than what I was doing on my own with a 9th grade book, but I don't think it would sit well on the back burner. If you are concerned with her not having time for it, I wouldn't go there (even though we are there and enjoying it).

 

I think CPO sounds like a good choice, even though I haven't used it. I have tried a couple of the Science Explorers. My dd did the weather book for 5th grade. I am not impressed with these for 8th grade. We've used them to follow rabbit trails, not as a main curriculum and found them fun for that.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

I think you are right in your evaluation of DIVE. It is intended as a 9th grade Chemistry/Physics class and is pretty intense for 8th grade. It is less intense than what I was doing on my own with a 9th grade book, but I don't think it would sit well on the back burner. If you are concerned with her not having time for it, I wouldn't go there (even though we are there and enjoying it).

 

I think CPO sounds like a good choice, even though I haven't used it. I have tried a couple of the Science Explorers. My dd did the weather book for 5th grade. I am not impressed with these for 8th grade. We've used them to follow rabbit trails, not as a main curriculum and found them fun for that.

 

 

Thank you, Debbie! I know a lot of people use DIVE. I will keep DIVE in mind as my dd gets into high school. CPO is "feeling" better and better.

[NineChoirs]

Unfortunately, the focus in memorization in The Elements isn't really on the right things. The most important things to know about the periodic table are the trends, but McHenry spends lots of energy on memorizing the elements themselves, which is really not overly relevant to the study of chemistry. (FWIW, my degree is in biochemistry and so I've had lots of chemistry).

 

Do you think the Carbon Chemistry is the same way, or does it go deeper into the subject? The first time I ever looked at a periodic table, I was a junior in High School, to say I was overwhelmed would be an understatement. My primary goal, as I am understanding the OP's to be, is to keep my child from being overwhelmed when they are introduced to High School chemistry.

[NineChoirs]

You can download the first chapter of Carbon Chemistry for free here: http://www.ellenjmchenry.com

 

It looks really good to me. I am going to be ordering it this weekend. I will let you know my opinion of it when I get it. :001_smile:

[EKS]

Do you think the Carbon Chemistry is the same way, or does it go deeper into the subject? The first time I ever looked at a periodic table, I was a junior in High School, to say I was overwhelmed would be an understatement. My primary goal, as I am understanding the OP's to be, is to keep my child from being overwhelmed when they are introduced to High School chemistry.

 

I haven't seen Carbon Chemistry. FWIW, the chemistry of carbon (that is organic chemistry) will be a very small part of a high school science course (like a chapter or less), so using the McHenry resource won't be much help with high school prep.

 

While McHenry's The Elements is a nice introduction to the table (with the exception of the emphasis on memorization), Carbon Chemistry will likely have very little about the periodic table in it.

 

If you use Conceptual Chemistry or Conceptual Physical Science-Explorations (the chemistry part) in middle school, your child will have a good understanding of the trends in the periodic table. Any high school or college chemistry instructor that has any sense at all will not be asking his/her students to memorize the periodic table and will give the students a periodic table as a reference during tests. Students will become quite familiar with the specific properties of the more common elements through the course of the year simply by doing lots of problems.

 

Another possibility would be the Science Explorer chemistry books (there are two). I haven't used the chemistry books specifically, but I have used the earth science books and they are quite good. The level will be lower than the Conceptual books, more of a typical middle school level (with the Conceptual books being at an upper middle/lower high school level).

[StephanieZ]

You could consider Galore Park's So You Really Want to Learn Science series. For 8th grade, I had dd read Vol 1 over a couple weeks, doing the exercises orally with me when she finished each chapter. Now, she's doing Vol 2 traditionally (reading a chapter each week and doing the exercises in writing.)

 

It lays a great foundation for all branches of science.

 

HTH

[Blossom'sGirl]

I am pretty sure we will use CPO next year for 8th and 6th grades. I also want to cover physics and chemistry and I need something that is doable only twice a week. I get overwhelmed if I try to mix and match programs.

 

We are using CPO earth this year and I like it a lot better than science explorer which we used the year before. It is much more readable.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

I haven't seen Carbon Chemistry. FWIW, the chemistry of carbon (that is organic chemistry) will be a very small part of a high school science course (like a chapter or less), so using the McHenry resource won't be much help with high school prep.

 

While McHenry's The Elements is a nice introduction to the table (with the exception of the emphasis on memorization), Carbon Chemistry will likely have very little about the periodic table in it.

 

If you use Conceptual Chemistry or Conceptual Physical Science-Explorations (the chemistry part) in middle school, your child will have a good understanding of the trends in the periodic table. Any high school or college chemistry instructor that has any sense at all will not be asking his/her students to memorize the periodic table and will give the students a periodic table as a reference during tests. Students will become quite familiar with the specific properties of the more common elements through the course of the year simply by doing lots of problems.

 

Another possibility would be the Science Explorer chemistry books (there are two). I haven't used the chemistry books specifically, but I have used the earth science books and they are quite good. The level will be lower than the Conceptual books, more of a typical middle school level (with the Conceptual books being at an upper middle/lower high school level).

 

 

Kai,

Just curious, what do you know about Real Science for Kids Chemistry Level 2? This looks wonderful, but I've read some threads here that suggest it has had trouble with errors. I do not know if this is still the case or not.

[sbaloue]

Have you considered Aurora Lipper's SuperCharged science. She is a rocket science and most of her lessons cover physics and chemistry. She sells complete kits. We did the online summer camp this year and really enjoyed it. Your can check it out at www.superchargedscience.com. Click products at the top and then kits.:001_smile:

[EKS]

Kai,

Just curious, what do you know about Real Science for Kids Chemistry Level 2? This looks wonderful, but I've read some threads here that suggest it has had trouble with errors. I do not know if this is still the case or not.

 

I have only used pre level 1 and level one of RS4K chemistry. I wasn't particularly impressed with level 1 as it didn't explain things in enough depth. I understand that level 2 is much longer, so it might be better, but I haven't used it. I do know there are (at least there were) extensive samples on the website.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

I haven't seen Carbon Chemistry. FWIW, the chemistry of carbon (that is organic chemistry) will be a very small part of a high school science course (like a chapter or less), so using the McHenry resource won't be much help with high school prep.

 

While McHenry's The Elements is a nice introduction to the table (with the exception of the emphasis on memorization), Carbon Chemistry will likely have very little about the periodic table in it.

 

If you use Conceptual Chemistry or Conceptual Physical Science-Explorations (the chemistry part) in middle school, your child will have a good understanding of the trends in the periodic table. Any high school or college chemistry instructor that has any sense at all will not be asking his/her students to memorize the periodic table and will give the students a periodic table as a reference during tests. Students will become quite familiar with the specific properties of the more common elements through the course of the year simply by doing lots of problems.

 

Another possibility would be the Science Explorer chemistry books (there are two). I haven't used the chemistry books specifically, but I have used the earth science books and they are quite good. The level will be lower than the Conceptual books, more of a typical middle school level (with the Conceptual books being at an upper middle/lower high school level).

 

 

 

Kia,

I just read from a different WTMer who suggested studying deeper (like CP and CC) can help a student more on ACT/SAT than using a physical science which teaches chem/physics "lite".

 

I feel just a little torn only because I don't want something overwhemling in 8th and I want to be sure I prep for both chem and physics.

 

I could use CPO and study both chem/physics "lite" OR I could use CP in 9th and CC in 10th OR I could use Conceptual Physical Science. The CPO is the only version written for 8th grade.

 

Ultimately I have to make the decision, of course:001_unsure:, and I'm trying to figure out the consequences of each choice.

 

So what if I do CPO and we study chem/physics in a "lite" way? Then we can study a deeper level of both of them in high school.

 

If we study CP in 8th and CC in 9th, will it be overwhelming? I just don't know.

 

I *think* our classes will look like this:

 

Math: Lial's Intro to Alg. I

Science: ?

LA: TPS English I (which will be challenging); Megawords

History: Medieval

Lit: LLftLotR orally to supplement history (doing ancients this year)

For. Lang: Rosetta Stone Spanish yr. 3

 

The math and LA will be challenging for us in 8th grade, which is why I've thought I could let science be light.

 

So, I'm leaning toward CPO. Is this a mistake? Should I reconsider and do CP in 8th and CC in 9th so we have a deeper understanding????:confused:

 

My head is beginning to spin!:tongue_smilie::lol::D

 

Thanks for your help!!!

Edited November 9, 2010 by Sweet Home Alabama