Pedophiles

[asta]

The "should the pope step down" thread has made me start noticing other stories in the news. Here are some of the latest.

 

USA Swimming Coaches Molested, Secretly Taped Dozens of Teen Swimmers

 

The priesthood is being cast as the refuge of pederasts. In fact, priests seem to abuse children at the same rate as everyone else.

 

Pedophile trial against Boy Scouts begins

 

Pedophilia: Not Just A Catholic Problem

 

It made me start thinking about Joanne's comments about how pedophiles cannot be rehabilitated, about the woman here who was concerned about sending her child into the swimming locker room alone... about many things.

 

So here is my question: What on earth IS it? I deal with the mental health community every. single. day. and I don't come into contact with anyone who thinks that "gee, I think molesting a kid would be a great way to start my day". Where on earth does this idea of children as sexual beings (vs, well, CHILDREN) come from?

 

This is a serious question that has me stumped. Is it simply a complete lack of sexual maturity on the part of the pederast? Or is it a power trip?

 

Anyone have some ideas? Opinions on the matter?

 

 

asta

 

p.s. I'll state it right now - I'm not looking for "these men and women have strayed from the bible, and satan is making them do it". Throw tomatoes at me if you want, feel free to think that is the reason if you want, but I'm looking for something beyond that. I am able to come up with that one by reading this board all on my own.

Edited April 10, 2010 by asta

[newlifemom]

I have no idea, but it breaks my heart.

 

 

 

 

:confused:

[Annabel Lee]

Is it simply a complete lack of sexual maturity on the part of the pederast? Or is it a power trip?

 

Yes, and yes. Generally, (not 100%, but many) sexual predators were abused during their own formative years. Many were overstimulated too early, and in an abusive situation it could warp their perspective completely. Sometimes there's other mental illness involved, that left untreated, progesses the pedophelia. I've always thought maybe it originates from trying to continue a very wrong, warped, but familiar pattern in their lives vs. acknowledging that it's against nature & seeking help. That's my best stab at it. Please don't get me wrong - I don't think there's ANY excuse, ANY justification at all. Period. I also am absolutely not making the generalization that "victims of abuse will become abusers". I just think that sometimes that plays a part. Maybe if someone immersed themselves in p@rn and kept gradually looking at younger and younger people (eventually kids) involved, that could lead to it... but I tend to think that would be just one piece of a larger puzzle.

 

I don't know. It stumps me too. I really think our nation needs to make the decision to take a strong and unyielding stand for children against these predators though. What is in place is obviously not enough.

[Thea]

The current theory (well, from about 5 years ago ) is that sometime around puberty the part of the brain that regulates sexual desire stops developing. In a normal individual, attraction continues to develop and we are attracted to individuals of similar development. This part of the pedophile's brain is --stunted, for lack of a better term. That would also help to explain the recidivism rate and the continued failing of rehabilitation attempts.

 

There are theories as to the why this happens, but of course they are just that-theories, although there seems to be a recurring theme of some sort of sexual trauma between 10 and 13.

 

That's pretty much all I recall. I just remember that it was a tough, tough seminar to sit through.....

[jld]

I remember reading about a man who developed these tendencies when he developed a brain tumor. When they removed the tumor, he was normal. Then, some years later, he started doing that stuff again, and they found another tumor had started growing.

 

I really don't think people want to be this way. I feel sorry for them, but I can't have them around my children.

[MariannNOVA]

I would look for books by Anna Salter - particularly TRANSFORMING TRAUMA -- I think that your question is answered (regarding some pedophiles) there.

[rfhsmom]

My DH works with juvenile delinquents and in the past 20 years they have become predominately s** offenders. So very sad, but according to him most of the s.o. clients have been abused in their young lives. It is just tragic! There are tons of statistics out there, but unfortunately when families break down children are the ones left most vulnerable to abuse.

[secular_mom]

Some people are attracted to men, some are attracted to women, some are attracted to people with nice abs, some are attracted to people with nice feet/shoes, etc. And, some people are attracted to children. Not all people who are attracted to children act on that, really. There are lots of people who are attracted to children who only use porn as a means to meet their 'needs'. (yes, IMO, sexual release is a need)

It's the people who prey on children and are actual sex offenders that are the problem, and they need help.

Just a different POV from someone who has looked into this subject.

[Mejane]

I once became so aggravated watching a tv show about pedophilia that I turned to my husband and asked, "WHY? Why do men do this? Explain it to me!" He looked at me as if I had lost my mind and said, "How would I know? I would never...!"

 

This to say, I wonder sometimes if it is within the bounds of "normal" understanding. As secular_mom said, there are all kinds of things which stimulate people which the majority of us would consider anomolies. The difference with pedophilia is that there is victimization of a child involved, and that makes us see red.

[Gratia271]

I once became so aggravated watching a tv show about pedophilia that I turned to my husband and asked, "WHY? Why do men do this? Explain it to me!" He looked at me as if I had lost my mind and said, "How would I know? I would never...!"

 

Same here.

[Carol in Cal.]

I've only ever been attracted to men, and only to certain ones. In my single days there are guys that were attracted to me that grossed me out completely. There were guys that I was attracted to who were not attracted to me at all. There were guys who only ever liked women with my hair color who went from one to the other even though we were completely different from each other in body type, values, and personality.

 

How can I know why this all was true?

 

I can't relate to a woman being attracted to another woman, but I am sure that it's as strong and specific an attraction as mine is for a man.

 

And I can't relate to ANYONE being attracted to a child, but I am sure that that is as strong and specific an attraction as any other.

 

It must be controlled and any action on it repudiated, but it's not subject to logical explanation.

[Nicole M]

.

Edited April 10, 2010 by Nicole M

[Joanne]

I don't believe it's just another preference, or on a continuum.

 

I believe it's probably co-factored in some cases with abuse. I'm not *sold* on that assumption or research since a great number of non abusing adults have been through abuse or trauma.

 

I think it is, at least in some cases, a severe dysfunction of the brain. A mental illness that is routed in a physiological malfunfunction.

 

Skimming the list in the OP, it's imperative to remember that pedophiles will go to the professions that offer easy access, afford automatic trust and safety and will develop charm and skill in order to build "relationship" with kids and families. It should not suprise anyone that the worst and most prolific offenders are Coaches, Youth Pastors, Boy Scout Leaders, Clergy.

[joannqn]

Read Conversations with a Pedophile.

 

For most, it is about control; the sex is secondary.

[FloridaMomTo5]

I agree it is mostly about control. Most, not all, but most you will also notice have some sort of inferiority complex. Expecially the ones that are offenders of small children. They prey on the weak. :( So sad.

 

My sister has one that has moved in on either side of her. She is dealing with the reality that the law is mostly on their side. Her one neighbor sits outside to smoke and faces his chair to her backyard. She has 3 children. Then, when she put up a fence they fought the fence and tried to get her to take it down. :confused: They are sick! Sick! SICK!! I truly see them as sick individuals. It's really sad to think what must have happened to them at some point in their life to send them down this path.

[kalanamak]

Sexuality is a very strong, primitive part of us all. People have been pilloried and stoned to death for going against the norm, and yet people still go against the norm, it is so powerful.

 

There is, for me and many others, a huge gap between "consenting adults" and anything else. The "anything else" adds a layer of anti-social personality on top of the tinderbox of sexuality.

 

As to how we live our sexual lives, I am in agreement with Simone de Beauvoir's closing words on her chapter on lesbianism in The Second Sex:

 

"Like all human behaviors, it will lead to masquerades, disequilibrium, failure, lying or, on the contrary, it will be the source of fruitful experiences, depending on whether it is lived in bad faith, laziness, and inauthenticity, or in lucidity, generosity, and freedom."

Edited April 10, 2010 by kalanamak
" "!

[Excelsior! Academy]

Ugh! I can't help but think our society feeds their addictions in some ways. The s**ualized dress for children for one.

[Tangerine]

Ugh! I can't help but think our society feeds their addictions in some ways. The s**ualized dress for children for one.

 

 

I have to wonder about this though. I think this precocious sexuality might contribute to men looking at young girls in a way they otherwise wouldn't. But pedophiles, those attracted to PREpubescent children, it seems would be attracted to a childlike way of dressing and behaving. Not overly sexualized children made to look older than they are. I'm sure there are so many dimensions to the issue, but that's just what it made me think.

[Impish]

Evil. That's what it boils down to for me. Same as serial killers who hunt their victims.

 

I'm not saying "The Devil made them do it." I'm saying that some people are simply evil, and defiling the innocent is what turns them on.

 

I personally think that ignoring the presence of evil is one of the problems we face in today's society. Everyone must be 'sick' on one level or another...we ignore and treat as superstitous and simple and stupid those that suggest the presence of evil...but for a person that molests their children, for someone who seeks out jobs or volunteer positions to put them near children, who groom them, violate them...there's nothing else I can think of than to say 'Evil'. There's nothing impulsive about this behaviour.

 

Evil.

[mcconnellboys]

Good grief! After being involved with USA swimming for SIX years - this is the FIRST I've heard of any of this!!!! That's awful!!! Thanks for the post,

[Hillary in KS]

Good grief! After being involved with USA swimming for SIX years - this is the FIRST I've heard of any of this!!!! That's awful!!! Thanks for the post,

 

Same here. But I saw the show last night, and it was apparently 36 coaches over the past 10 years. 36 coaches out of over 12,000. The headline makes it sound as if it's a rampant problem, and it's not.

 

Those 36 coaches are a problem. And the LSC's need to do a MUCH better job of screening employees. But I don't think the rate of child predators in USA Swimming is any higher than in the public school system, or any other organizations in which children are involved.

 

I plan to continue to be diligent at swim practices, but not panicked.

[katemary63]

Some people are attracted to men, some are attracted to women, some are attracted to people with nice abs, some are attracted to people with nice feet/shoes, etc. And, some people are attracted to children. Not all people who are attracted to children act on that, really. There are lots of people who are attracted to children who only use porn as a means to meet their 'needs'. (yes, IMO, sexual release is a need)

It's the people who prey on children and are actual sex offenders that are the problem, and they need help.

Just a different POV from someone who has looked into this subject.

 

Ah....um.....ah.......I don't even know what to say....um.....NO! Pedophilea is NOT just another thing normal people are attracted to. There is such thing as acceptable and unacceptable, and of course, what is and is not acceptable is open for debate TO A DEGREE. But being attracted to children, weather one acts on it or not, is a pathology and most definately NOT acceptable. If a person were to feel a sexual attraction to children even while understanding that acting upon it would be wrong and choosing not to do so, that person should still seek professional help for the mere fact of the attraction itself. Sexual attraction to children (acted upon or not) is a severe mental illness/ personality disorder issue and should never be compared to the normal variations in sexual behavior such as, "I like abs, you like legs." Um...just no.

[Sputterduck]

Evil. That's what it boils down to for me. Same as serial killers who hunt their victims.

 

I'm not saying "The Devil made them do it." I'm saying that some people are simply evil, and defiling the innocent is what turns them on.

 

I personally think that ignoring the presence of evil is one of the problems we face in today's society. Everyone must be 'sick' on one level or another...we ignore and treat as superstitous and simple and stupid those that suggest the presence of evil...but for a person that molests their children, for someone who seeks out jobs or volunteer positions to put them near children, who groom them, violate them...there's nothing else I can think of than to say 'Evil'. There's nothing impulsive about this behaviour.

 

Evil.

 

Absolutely.

[EthiopianFood]

Children are more accepting and trusting than adults. Abusers often have a difficult time making true connections with adults, so they turn to children to fulfill that need. S#xual contact provides the intimacy they need. This type of predator is often immature and reclusive. There are different types, but this is the type that I am most familiar with. :glare:

[Laurie4b]

I don't believe it's just another preference, or on a continuum.

 

I believe it's probably co-factored in some cases with abuse. I'm not *sold* on that assumption or research since a great number of non abusing adults have been through abuse or trauma.

 

I think it is, at least in some cases, a severe dysfunction of the brain. A mental illness that is routed in a physiological malfunfunction.

 

Skimming the list in the OP, it's imperative to remember that pedophiles will go to the professions that offer easy access, afford automatic trust and safety and will develop charm and skill in order to build "relationship" with kids and families. It should not suprise anyone that the worst and most prolific offenders are Coaches, Youth Pastors, Boy Scout Leaders, Clergy.

 

I don't believe pedophilia is another preference, either. (I do think attraction to young teens might be--but sexual attraction to prepubescent children and sexual attraction to teens who have gone through puberty are two different things often lumped together.)

 

I think pedophilia has a number of influences. Being sexually victimized is certainly one of them, though of course, not everyone who is victimized becomes a victimizer. Male victims are more likely to act out that way than women, who are more likely to keep setting themselves up for abuse--a generalization, but it holds much of the time.

 

But not all boys who are abused end up as pedophiles. Secondly, there are people who are emotionally/ developmentally immature and children are their peers emotionally and developmentally, but not physically. For others, children are less threatening than adults. Whatever the influence, once the attraction is acted on and paired with orgasm, it becomes strongly reinforced.

 

Having worked with a number of boys who were sexually victimized and who also had other emotional/mental/family difficulties already, I could see some of them becoming victimizers later in life. It was very sad to think about their futures. I am one who wishes that we would continue to work to help them and not just hate them--but they do need to be kept away from children.