bank sent ppl out to take pics of home

[Denisemomof4]

my sister's bank sent people out to take pictures of her home. It was traumatizing to her because her kids, and their friends, were inside the house. I feel so bad for her; bankruptcy court Wed. to settle their credit car debt, then yesterday the mortgage company (they have been struggling to get their mortgage caught up for months, and struggling to pay the mortgage for years. I do believe losing the home is the best thing for them, but it's still SO PAINFUL) and they found out her husband's company is getting further and further behind and they fear he'll lose his job. What little inheritance my sister was going to get is going to be taken by creditors, and she feels so bad over that. I'm having a hard time coming up with comforting words, there really arent' any.

 

Oh, and New Year's eve their car was hit in a parking lot. That car is like an energizer battery. They desperately need a new one, but this one keeps going and going and going.....

 

 

Siiiiiiiiigh. What happens in the foreclosure process? I went onto foreclosure.com and it looks like the process usually takes 3 months. dear sis is certain it takes 5 - 6 months. What will happen, will they just come home one day and be locked out of their home? I do know they'll get notice in the mail before this happens.

 

I'm so worried for her and her dh. The stress is killing them. And brother checked himself into the hospital again. I feel so helpless!

[Margaret in GA]

my sister's bank sent people out to take pictures of her home. It was traumatizing to her because her kids, and their friends, were inside the house. I feel so bad for her; bankruptcy court Wed. to settle their credit car debt, then yesterday the mortgage company (they have been struggling to get their mortgage caught up for months, and struggling to pay the mortgage for years. I do believe losing the home is the best thing for them, but it's still SO PAINFUL) and they found out her husband's company is getting further and further behind and they fear he'll lose his job. What little inheritance my sister was going to get is going to be taken by creditors, and she feels so bad over that. I'm having a hard time coming up with comforting words, there really arent' any.

 

Oh, and New Year's eve their car was hit in a parking lot. That car is like an energizer battery. They desperately need a new one, but this one keeps going and going and going.....

 

 

Siiiiiiiiigh. What happens in the foreclosure process? I went onto foreclosure.com and it looks like the process usually takes 3 months. dear sis is certain it takes 5 - 6 months. What will happen, will they just come home one day and be locked out of their home? I do know they'll get notice in the mail before this happens.

 

I'm so worried for her and her dh. The stress is killing them. And brother checked himself into the hospital again. I feel so helpless!

 

Sorry, no answers here. Just wanted to send you hugs.:grouphug: Sounds really terrible!

 

Margaret

[mysticamethyst]

I wish I could pass on any information but I can't so I can offer :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:. It is most painful to watch the ones we love struggle.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Taking the pictures of the home is probably part of a more in depth assessment.

[Whereneverever]

I think she'll get more of an accurate time line at the hearing. I do believe that you are correct that it's shorter then 6 months for the process, though.

[grace'smom]

I heard you can keep the process going by demanding ownership papers from the bank. Usually they sell the loan so many times it is hard for them to place those papers.

[kelouis75]

I think she'll get more of an accurate time line at the hearing. I do believe that you are correct that it's shorter then 6 months for the process, though.

 

 

:grouphug: I feel bad for the OP's family but the process really does depend upon the state.... Some states like GA are 3 months and some like NY can take over a year. Bankruptcy can affect the timeline because not everyone surrenders the home. Your ds really does need to get clarity from her lawyer.

[Renee in NC]

:grouphug: I feel bad for the OP's family but the process really does depend upon the state.... Some states like GA are 3 months and some like NY can take over a year. Bankruptcy can affect the timeline. Your ds really does need to get clarity from her lawyer.

 

Yes, our foreclosure took 8 months, but it kept getting put off because of moratoriums on Freddie Mac foreclosures.

 

I am so sorry for your sister. This is a hard, heart-wrenching thing to go through, especially when you walk away with nothing.

 

They will not just "put her out" right away, but she does need to make arrangements for somewhere else to live. Eventually they will come and remove all her stuff and change the locks. She'll have plenty of warning, though.

 

Have her talk to her attorney. Usually you get to keep something - the value depends on the state.

[Denisemomof4]

Yes, our foreclosure took 8 months, but it kept getting put off because of moratoriums on Freddie Mac foreclosures.

 

I am so sorry for your sister. This is a hard, heart-wrenching thing to go through, especially when you walk away with nothing.

 

They will not just "put her out" right away, but she does need to make arrangements for somewhere else to live. Eventually they will come and remove all her stuff and change the locks. She'll have plenty of warning, though.

 

Have her talk to her attorney. Usually you get to keep something - the value depends on the state.

 

I'm so sorry you had to go through this!

 

they don't have an attorney and can't afford one. They can't afford to heat the house and they haven't paid on their credit cards for 3 years now, hence the bankruptcy hearing this week. Their bankruptcy attorney really doesn't seem like a bright guy and they wouldn't trust his judgment, but he has nothing to do with the house anyway. They filed in a way to keep the house, but I'm quite certain they're going to lose the house.

 

She said she hasn't gotten anything from the bank, but I'm suspecting her husband may have the mortgage info. because he keeps things from her to keep her from worrying. They are in default on both their mortgage and their equity loan. They want to have both loans stretched out to 30 years (owe 14 on mortgage, 20 on equity, have lived there 20+ years) but since they keep going into default, struggle to catch up, default, etc. I don't think the bank will work with them. They were first told almost 3 years ago that they were being foreclosed on. Also, her husband's overtime was cut and even with it, they only cleared enough to cover their mortgage ALONE - no groceries or utilities. The bank isn't going to work with them. My sister said she'd get a job, but they won't count it yet because by the time she DOES find one she will work at it for such a short time it won't count.

 

It is sad, but I think living the way they have the past three years is going to kill them if it continues. Neither of them are sleeping. Last year her husband would go get a gas can filled daily to heat the house. It was so stressful. I told her she needs to find out if they're going to foreclose because if they are, she needs to stop making ALL payments so they can save the money to rent somewhere. Who will rent to someone who just filed bankruptcy and was foreclosed on? I don't know what's going to happen to their family. It's so sad. We are 2 hours away so our home isn't a possibility. They want to stay in the area they are for the kids.

[Peek a Boo]

oh man......

 

My biggest suggestion would be to start going from church to church begging for help, advice, WHATEVER they can get. They don't need to be members of a church to receive help. Type up a plea, try to get some credible people to sign it [pastor, business owner, someone "known" in the community so it's obvious it's not a scam] and go church to church asking if anyone has ANY ideas that can help this family.

 

If you can get some friends to type up a support letter too that can help.

Contact the local Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, and 4-H offices to see if anyone in the organization has contacts or advice that can prove helpful.

 

It's a small world. You never know when or how you might stumble upon someone that can help. But they have to know about it first.

 

prayers going up.....

[lionfamily1999]

I heard you can keep the process going by demanding ownership papers from the bank. Usually they sell the loan so many times it is hard for them to place those papers.

Also, banks that can't come up with them have lost their fights to foreclose. They HAVE to have those papers to prove the loan is owed.

 

Tell your sister to look into this.

 

I'm so sorry things are so rough right now :grouphug:

[DesertDweller]

I'm so sorry you had to go through this!

 

they don't have an attorney and can't afford one. They can't afford to heat the house and they haven't paid on their credit cards for 3 years now, hence the bankruptcy hearing this week. Their bankruptcy attorney really doesn't seem like a bright guy and they wouldn't trust his judgment, but he has nothing to do with the house anyway. They filed in a way to keep the house, but I'm quite certain they're going to lose the house.

 

She said she hasn't gotten anything from the bank, but I'm suspecting her husband may have the mortgage info. because he keeps things from her to keep her from worrying. They are in default on both their mortgage and their equity loan. They want to have both loans stretched out to 30 years (owe 14 on mortgage, 20 on equity, have lived there 20+ years) but since they keep going into default, struggle to catch up, default, etc. I don't think the bank will work with them. They were first told almost 3 years ago that they were being foreclosed on. Also, her husband's overtime was cut and even with it, they only cleared enough to cover their mortgage ALONE - no groceries or utilities. The bank isn't going to work with them. My sister said she'd get a job, but they won't count it yet because by the time she DOES find one she will work at it for such a short time it won't count.

 

It is sad, but I think living the way they have the past three years is going to kill them if it continues. Neither of them are sleeping. Last year her husband would go get a gas can filled daily to heat the house. It was so stressful. I told her she needs to find out if they're going to foreclose because if they are, she needs to stop making ALL payments so they can save the money to rent somewhere. Who will rent to someone who just filed bankruptcy and was foreclosed on? I don't know what's going to happen to their family. It's so sad. We are 2 hours away so our home isn't a possibility. They want to stay in the area they are for the kids.

 

The worst thing they can do...is do nothing. She or he should call the mortgage lender and ask what the status of their account is. How late are they? What are the options? If they are eligible to apply for a loan modification, the lender should let them know that or they may ask for their financials in order to make a decision. There is also the possiblility of a short sale. Maybe that is something they can ask about doing. They should call and ask what is going to happen next, when, how long will it take. The lender should be able to answer some of those questions. Not knowing is really worse than knowing.

 

We've been dealing with our lender on a loan modification. We still don't know whether we'll get it, but dh has asked them what happens if we don't and how long we might have. Good communication is important.

 

Will her husband discuss this with her so that they can work together and get a handle on the situation? I feel sorry for her because the idea of losing your home is so very stressful. Not knowing what's going on can only make it worse.

[Denisemomof4]

The worst thing they can do...is do nothing. She or he should call the mortgage lender and ask what the status of their account is. How late are they? What are the options? If they are eligible to apply for a loan modification, the lender should let them know that or they may ask for their financials in order to make a decision. There is also the possiblility of a short sale. Maybe that is something they can ask about doing. They should call and ask what is going to happen next, when, how long will it take. The lender should be able to answer some of those questions. Not knowing is really worse than knowing.

 

We've been dealing with our lender on a loan modification. We still don't know whether we'll get it, but dh has asked them what happens if we don't and how long we might have. Good communication is important.

 

Will her husband discuss this with her so that they can work together and get a handle on the situation? I feel sorry for her because the idea of losing your home is so very stressful. Not knowing what's going on can only make it worse.

 

first of all, my sister called the bank who holds the equity loan and asked for the ownership papers and she got them. Her husband asked if they could do a loan modification, and for what ever reason, they were told their taxes for 2007,8 &9 have to be done first. Long story, but they just got 2006 done. My sister has "issues" and sat on the papers for a year. I think the bank is done with them.

 

From what I've read online today, I seriously doubt my sister and her husband would qualify for a loan modification. His hours have been cut back (no overtime) and his company may close it's doors. With what he's making now, they can't barely cover the mortgage, and I'm not even sure if they can. If all of a sudden things pulled through with the company, they will never have the money to pay back what they are default on. My sister isn't saying how far behind they are, whether out of embarrassment or her husband not cluing her in. But either way, this has been a struggle for years and even though family members have helped through the years, they simply owe too much on the house and need to walk away. But she can't hear of it.

 

We can delay the inevitable, but honestly, they can NOT afford a house where they owe as much as they do on her husband's salary. This has been going on for 3 years now and I think the sooner they put this behind them, the better off they'll be. My biggest concern is the affect all of this is having on their health. The stress of it all is eating away at them. I'm hoping they can walk away, heal from their trauma, and then live more responsibly so this doesn't happen to them again.

:crying::crying:

 

She says she can't take anymore. My brother is doing bad, we lost both our parents within 11 months, their business shut it's doors, they were going to divorce but are now rebuilding, her husband may lose his job, etc. She sounds like she is not going to be able to keep going on and I fear she's going to have a mental break down. :sad::sad::sad:

[Denisemomof4]

forgot to mention, that I told her that I thought she should call the bank to see if they sent someone out, their plans, etc. but I don't think she can handle it right now. She feels beaten up and defeated.

[Renee in NC]

first of all, my sister called the bank who holds the equity loan and asked for the ownership papers and she got them. Her husband asked if they could do a loan modification, and for what ever reason, they were told their taxes for 2007,8 &9 have to be done first. Long story, but they just got 2006 done. My sister has "issues" and sat on the papers for a year. I think the bank is done with them.

 

From what I've read online today, I seriously doubt my sister and her husband would qualify for a loan modification. His hours have been cut back (no overtime) and his company may close it's doors. With what he's making now, they can't barely cover the mortgage, and I'm not even sure if they can. If all of a sudden things pulled through with the company, they will never have the money to pay back what they are default on. My sister isn't saying how far behind they are, whether out of embarrassment or her husband not cluing her in. But either way, this has been a struggle for years and even though family members have helped through the years, they simply owe too much on the house and need to walk away. But she can't hear of it.

 

We can delay the inevitable, but honestly, they can NOT afford a house where they owe as much as they do on her husband's salary. This has been going on for 3 years now and I think the sooner they put this behind them, the better off they'll be. My biggest concern is the affect all of this is having on their health. The stress of it all is eating away at them. I'm hoping they can walk away, heal from their trauma, and then live more responsibly so this doesn't happen to them again.

:crying::crying:

 

She says she can't take anymore. My brother is doing bad, we lost both our parents within 11 months, their business shut it's doors, they were going to divorce but are now rebuilding, her husband may lose his job, etc. She sounds like she is not going to be able to keep going on and I fear she's going to have a mental break down. :sad::sad::sad:

 

The bankruptcy court *does* have juridiction of her house. The bank cannot foreclose until the Bk court says so. However, she does have to prove that she can make the payment, and it doesn't sound like she can.

 

Her mortgage company will send papers. It really does depend on state law. In our case, they sent papers once. Then we got a 3 month stay (to see if we could increase our income enough to keep the house.) We could not, so it went back to foreclosure. The entire time we were trying to short sale the house as well. It kept getting put off.

 

My mortgage company would no longer speak to me after they filed the original papers, so we had to deal with the foreclosure attorney. They were very easy to deal with. We finally got a viable offer, but the bank refused, saying they wanted about $30K more than the offer. The house went to auction, no one bought it, and the people with the original short sale offer did end up buying it for what they had offered originally (that the bank turned down.):glare:

 

Anyway, if their income isn't high enough they won't get the modification. The bank doesn't want to do all this work to have them pay a payment or two and they go back into default. We couldn't get a modification because our income wasn't high enough (and we weren't able to increase our income enough to meet it.)

 

I just went through all this, except I hadn't lost my parents and I was no where near divorce (we grew *closer* together through all this.)

 

One question, though - how has she been able to file bankruptcy if her taxes aren't done? Or has she not had her first hearing yet? The bank wants the taxes as proof of income and the bankruptcy court needs proof of income to proceed.

[Denisemomof4]

The bankruptcy court *does* have juridiction of her house. The bank cannot foreclose until the Bk court says so. However, she does have to prove that she can make the payment, and it doesn't sound like she can.

 

Her mortgage company will send papers. It really does depend on state law. In our case, they sent papers once. Then we got a 3 month stay (to see if we could increase our income enough to keep the house.) We could not, so it went back to foreclosure. The entire time we were trying to short sale the house as well. It kept getting put off.

 

My mortgage company would no longer speak to me after they filed the original papers, so we had to deal with the foreclosure attorney. They were very easy to deal with. We finally got a viable offer, but the bank refused, saying they wanted about $30K more than the offer. The house went to auction, no one bought it, and the people with the original short sale offer did end up buying it for what they had offered originally (that the bank turned down.):glare:

 

Anyway, if their income isn't high enough they won't get the modification. The bank doesn't want to do all this work to have them pay a payment or two and they go back into default. We couldn't get a modification because our income wasn't high enough (and we weren't able to increase our income enough to meet it.)

 

I just went through all this, except I hadn't lost my parents and I was no where near divorce (we grew *closer* together through all this.)

 

One question, though - how has she been able to file bankruptcy if her taxes aren't done? Or has she not had her first hearing yet? The bank wants the taxes as proof of income and the bankruptcy court needs proof of income to proceed.

 

wow. that was very helpful - thank you for sharing. I hate to say that, though, because I wish you didn't have this experience to share. I now remember you writing here about the bank not taking the short sale offer. That's a rotten shame.

 

My sister was told at the hearing on Wed. that they had to get 2007,8 &9 done within 30 days. But I'm not quite sure how they have jurisdiction over the home when they filed in a way they won't lose their home?

 

Just like the denial of your short sale was unjust since they got the same offer in the end, my sister's having to file bankruptcy is not right. Their creditors have been wanting to settle, and they could have paid off all their debt with what she's going to be getting from my mom and dad. She said some credit cards were willing to settle for 20% of the bill! The problem was that they had to come up with the full amt - which they couldn't do. How can a poor person do that? So they had to file. And they had to borrow the money to file bankruptcy because it cost $1500. I don't get it!

[hillfarm]

In Ohio, the state Bar Association (for attorneys, not drinkers:tongue_smilie:) has been training attorneys to help people in your sister's situation. Dd's best friend's mother is one who received the training. She told me that she was taught how to help people who were about to be turned out of their homes to go over their paperwork, loan agreements, etc. with a fine toothed comb, looking for various legal phrases and things that can delay the proceedings a bit. They don't do anything illegal, but make sure to hold the lenders to the absolute letter of the law.

 

Perhaps your state has something similar? Couldn't hurt to call a couple of attorneys' offices and ask.

[i.love.lucy]

We're in the midst of this as well. Early last year I sent in a mortgage payment late and it was returned. At that point our mortgage co said we were in default but that we could apply for a loan mod. Well, due to Obama's Making Home Affordable plan taking forever to kick in, and then my mortgage co being sold, it's all gone on about a year and is now finally coming to a head. We jumped through all the hoops, including providing paperwork they asked for like tax returns and pay stubs, and were finally told last month "No." So, our file has been turned over to a loan "resolution" company so that we can try for a short sale. The thing that I find ironic about all this is that we could have tried long ago for a sale, but they told us that would cancel our consideration for a loan mod. :confused:

 

We have a appt this coming week with a local realtor who specializes in short sales and he's going to throw it on the market for us. I'm not sure how much hope I have, but we are going to make this place shine in the hopes that it will sell.

 

One thing he said was that we should delay filing bankruptcy until after the sale is done because that can complicate and delay a sale going through because of all the red tape with attys and trustees, etc.

 

We have been fortunate to be living in our home and on hold with our payments long enough to have saved some money. We should have enough to secure a rental with an extra security deposit that our realtor thinks will be enough to overcome our deficiencies. That is my fervent hope and prayer.

 

Denise, I am so sorry your sis is going through this. It sounds like she is being hit from all sides. I hope that she and her dh can look eachother in the eye, make a pact that they are a team, and they will get through it together. Like Renee, my dh and I are growing closer through all this. I wish I had more words of wisdom to share. I would agree that if this is all happening anyways, she should IMMEDIATELY stop trying to make any payments and save that towards finding a place to rent. I also agree with Peek that they should try to find some large churches and appeal to their community outreach pastor for help.

 

:grouphug:

[Julieofsardis]

The worst thing they can do...is do nothing. She or he should call the mortgage lender and ask what the status of their account is. How late are they? What are the options? If they are eligible to apply for a loan modification, the lender should let them know that or they may ask for their financials in order to make a decision. There is also the possiblility of a short sale. Maybe that is something they can ask about doing. They should call and ask what is going to happen next, when, how long will it take. The lender should be able to answer some of those questions. Not knowing is really worse than knowing.

 

We've been dealing with our lender on a loan modification. We still don't know whether we'll get it, but dh has asked them what happens if we don't and how long we might have. Good communication is important.

 

Will her husband discuss this with her so that they can work together and get a handle on the situation? I feel sorry for her because the idea of losing your home is so very stressful. Not knowing what's going on can only make it worse.

 

:iagree:This is good advice. I worked in foreclosures for a while and in my experience, most people who were foreclosed on did not even attempt to work anything out. The mortgage company does not want the house. They will go to a lot of lengths to prevent foreclosure. It is not profitable to them to do it. If the person she speaks to is not helpful, ask for their supervisor. Find someone who will listen.

[Suzanne in ABQ]

I don't have any comforting words, but I did read that if your home is going into foreclosure, you need to find a place to live BEFORE it is final. Once the foreclosure shows up on our credit report, it is difficult to find anyone to rent to you. I read that in a book by Suzie Orman.

 

Just a thought.

 

I wish I knew how you could help your sister and her family through all this. And, I feel for those kids, home while those people were wandering around, taking pictures. Yuck.

[elegantlion]

forgot to mention, that I told her that I thought she should call the bank to see if they sent someone out, their plans, etc. but I don't think she can handle it right now. She feels beaten up and defeated.

 

:grouphug: BTDT and it bites.

 

Financial stress sucks and there can be times when it feels like if the whole world collapsed on you at least you could hide. In the end circumstances should not define a person. Defeat is only permanent if we allow it to be. :grouphug:

[angela in ohio]

They need to:

 

(1.) Get their taxes done.

 

(2.) Talk to the bank. Both of them, in person. Like a PP said, they do NOT want the house. Forelosures cost the bank a lot of money (I worked in loan servicing BK.) They need to know what the options are; not just assume or guess.

 

(3.) If that fails, they need to find a non-profit organization in their area that helps people in their situation. They could call any social services organization and ask them for a number of the group that helps with foreclosures and financial issues in their area. Like Peek said, churches may help. They don't just need money; they need someone willing to sit down and help them sort this out; someone who knows what help is available.

 

(4.) If necessary, they need to leave the house now and rent somewhere else, as a PP said. If they find they are goign to lose it anyway, why keep up under the stress of not knowing whether your door will be locked when you get home?

 

(5.) If they still aren't making it; they really need to think more about the well-being of their family as a whole as opposed to what the kids want and re-consider moving in with you (or other family.) There is no way their kiddos are happy the way things are, anyway.

 

:grouphug:

[Denisemomof4]

thahks so much, everyone, for your responses. I do want to reiterate that I don't think there's any way at all they can work something out with the bank. They owe 350k on the home (it's value) and there's NO WAY her husband can support that amount. Even with her working it will be next to impossible. They can't afford the house. They borrowed too much against it. They can't afford to heat the house. Every red cent goes to the mortgage and I don't understand how they have anything left for groceries, utilities, heat, etc. Although it's extremely difficult, they have to walk away. They need to let all their financial burdens go to be able to TRULY start over. They can live comfortably IF they walk away from this house. If they continue to struggle to keep it, the past 3 years will repeat itself. I think for their own sanity they need to let it go, and it's probably going to be taken away from them anyway.

 

I've been thinking about this for days. Ultimately, I'm not sure I'm helping her if I'm giving her advice to delay the process or to help her to try to keep the house. I think the best thing she can do for her sanity, her marriage, her family and her life is to let it go and start to rebuild. I don't want her to prolong her suffering.

 

ANd without sounding cold hearted, I have a hard time telling her to go to the church for financial help. I've hesitated to post this here. Set me straight if you disagree. They chose to live irresponsibly and live the high life, buying boats they could never afford, taking extravagant vacations twice per year, buying a time share, all designer clothing for their kids, she shopped regularly, huge, large screen tv, you name it, they have it. I don't think one single person in that family knows what it's like to do without. This is what caused her debt, on top of a failed business. They'd still be in dire financial stress without the business because of all of their lavish spending. Is it right for them to go to churches for help when they didn't truly fall on hard times due to circumstances but instead due to irresponsibility? I hate to say that, but it's true. They've lived a lavish life for 20 years, buying extravagant jewelry, the travels, etc. They'd buy hugely expensive gifts for friends and family, and for their own kids - you literally could open a store. IMO, this is not a charity case.

 

Still, my heart breaks for what they're going through. I've asked my sister to PLEASE do three things in the future: never withdraw form their 401k, never take out a line of equity on the house, and never run up their credit cards again. This all happened because they wanted to not only keep up with the Jones' but to far exceed them.

 

I just think they need to take responsibility and move on. Their kids have no clue as to what's going on, but to have them live the life they have when the money was never there to do it was, in my opinion, a lie to the kids.

 

Ok, now I probably sound like a HUGE jerk.

[RoughCollie]

Is it right for them to go to churches for help when they didn't truly fall on hard times due to circumstances but instead due to irresponsibility?

Ok, now I probably sound like a HUGE jerk.

 

I don't think you sound like a jerk at all. I understand where you are coming from.

 

Two words come to mind: grace and mercy.

[Jean in Newcastle]

No, you don't sound like a jerk. You sound like a very responsible person. Unfortunately, the changes your sister's family is going to have to make requires some major revamping of their thinking on a number of levels. And they have to do that on their own. I sincerely hope that they would take your advice. Perhaps if you gave them one of the Dave Ramsey books or an equivalent type book (I don't know what is out there) it might be helpful to them. But as they say in counseling circles, you have to want to be helped. I don't know your sister and her husband, but unfortunately so many people don't want to be helped when they are in trouble. They just want to be bailed out of their trouble.

[Renee in NC]

thahks so much, everyone, for your responses. I do want to reiterate that I don't think there's any way at all they can work something out with the bank. They owe 350k on the home (it's value) and there's NO WAY her husband can support that amount. Even with her working it will be next to impossible. They can't afford the house. They borrowed too much against it. They can't afford to heat the house. Every red cent goes to the mortgage and I don't understand how they have anything left for groceries, utilities, heat, etc. Although it's extremely difficult, they have to walk away. They need to let all their financial burdens go to be able to TRULY start over. They can live comfortably IF they walk away from this house. If they continue to struggle to keep it, the past 3 years will repeat itself. I think for their own sanity they need to let it go, and it's probably going to be taken away from them anyway.

 

I've been thinking about this for days. Ultimately, I'm not sure I'm helping her if I'm giving her advice to delay the process or to help her to try to keep the house. I think the best thing she can do for her sanity, her marriage, her family and her life is to let it go and start to rebuild. I don't want her to prolong her suffering.

 

ANd without sounding cold hearted, I have a hard time telling her to go to the church for financial help. I've hesitated to post this here. Set me straight if you disagree. They chose to live irresponsibly and live the high life, buying boats they could never afford, taking extravagant vacations twice per year, buying a time share, all designer clothing for their kids, she shopped regularly, huge, large screen tv, you name it, they have it. I don't think one single person in that family knows what it's like to do without. This is what caused her debt, on top of a failed business. They'd still be in dire financial stress without the business because of all of their lavish spending. Is it right for them to go to churches for help when they didn't truly fall on hard times due to circumstances but instead due to irresponsibility? I hate to say that, but it's true. They've lived a lavish life for 20 years, buying extravagant jewelry, the travels, etc. They'd buy hugely expensive gifts for friends and family, and for their own kids - you literally could open a store. IMO, this is not a charity case.

 

Still, my heart breaks for what they're going through. I've asked my sister to PLEASE do three things in the future: never withdraw form their 401k, never take out a line of equity on the house, and never run up their credit cards again. This all happened because they wanted to not only keep up with the Jones' but to far exceed them.

 

I just think they need to take responsibility and move on. Their kids have no clue as to what's going on, but to have them live the life they have when the money was never there to do it was, in my opinion, a lie to the kids.

 

Ok, now I probably sound like a HUGE jerk.

 

Denise - have they sold all their "stuff"? They can't now, BTW, if they hadn't before because of the BK. I was just wondering. (And if they haven't, the BK court will take a lot of it because it sounds like she is in Chapter 7, not 13.)

 

I think a good indicator of a changed heart is the sale of all the stuff in order to live, pay off creditors, what have you.

[Denisemomof4]

 

Two words come to mind: grace and mercy.

 

I have never said a thing to her. In fact, I bite my tongue (just did again minutes ago) when she continually blames the bank for qualifying them for so much money. I have heard this at least 15 - 20 times, or more, but only once said, "******, we have also been offered that much money, even more. But we don't take it and spend it!"

[SonshineLearner]

Is it possible to rent out part of the house, so that they can have some help? My husband and I have a house that I've always thought, "If times get tough enough.... we could maybe rent out a part." Of course, this wouldn't count as income for the loan... just some $$$ to help get there. Of course, it depends on the laws where they live...

[Denisemomof4]

Denise - have they sold all their "stuff"? They can't now, BTW, if they hadn't before because of the BK. I was just wondering. (And if they haven't, the BK court will take a lot of it because it sounds like she is in Chapter 7, not 13.)

 

I think a good indicator of a changed heart is the sale of all the stuff in order to live, pay off creditors, what have you.

 

no, they've only sold the contents of their business to try to save their home. It helped them for a short period of time, but they always come back to this.

 

And Jean - I don't believe my sister wants to change because she's taken responsibility a couple of times, saying they've made many mistakes, but the majority of her message is that the bank did this to them, they shouldn't have qualified them, etc. I told her that I don't think they're going to modify their loan, because certain they don't qualify for the amt. they owe in the first place, which angered her and she said, "They gave us this money!" I told her things were different now, banks are in crisis and aren't qualifying like they once did, etc. It angers her, and what I do is bite my tongue, but what I *want* to say is, "YOU SPENT ALL THAT MONEY!!!!!" I don't vbelieve my sister has learned, but her husband has. He's taken all money from her but the grocery money (she was a compulsive shopper and he should have stepped in before now!" and pays all the bills. He hates credit cards. So I'm hoping he'll never allow it again.

 

UPDATE: my sister found out that it was the bankruptcy that sent people out to take pictures of the house. They went back to get a picture in the daylight and to ask questions about the boat. And yes, they filed chapter 7.

 

I did tell her today that they need to stay in contact with the bank so they know what the bank plans to do. That way if they find out they're going to lose the house, they can stop paying BOTH mortgages and save up for a rental. She doesn't want to hear it but she does need to prepare for it. While we were on the phone the mailman came to the door to have her sign for a letter from their bank. She said her husband already got one in his name and now she did and it was about the house. She didn't want to talk anymore because her son was home, which honestly - he was before too, so I have no idea what the bank is sending them. They did tell her, however, that to do a modification they need to get their taxes done and fill out the packet of papers for the modification. But she's saying they could never come up with the money to get their loan current.

Edited January 9, 2010 by Denisemomof4

[Denisemomof4]

Is it possible to rent out part of the house, so that they can have some help? My husband and I have a house that I've always thought, "If times get tough enough.... we could maybe rent out a part." Of course, this wouldn't count as income for the loan... just some $$$ to help get there. Of course, it depends on the laws where they live...

 

they've already considered this. Part of their expense came when they added on a garage, a huge room above for my sister to store all her "stuff;" and a laundry room. It has it's own entrance. The problem is that it's all unfinished and they don't have a dime to put into getting that ready. They'd have to convert the laundry room to a bathroom, then make a kitchen and apt. above the garage. They could never get the money for that. Even so, they're still too far behind on their mortgage, the monthly rent won't come on time to help that.

[RoughCollie]

I have never said a thing to her. In fact, I bite my tongue (just did again minutes ago) when she continually blames the bank for qualifying them for so much money. I have heard this at least 15 - 20 times, or more, but only once said, "******, we have also been offered that much money, even more. But we don't take it and spend it!"

 

No, no, Denise, I was in a hurry and didn't express myself clearly at all. I apologize for that. The church would exhibit the qualities of grace and mercy if they helped your sister & her family. That's up to the church, and I see no problem with you suggesting a church as a resource.

 

True, they did not have to take the $$ the bank offered them.

 

Of course, the banks are culpable too, IMO, because they offered money and had people believing that due to the bank's own credit check, the people would be able to afford to pay the money back. But the bank was never interested in helping anyone, or in merely making money from the loan interest -- they were making money by selling the loans to investors. Naturally, it is much more complex than that, and my take on it is a gross over-simplification. I think, though, that the banks defrauded the American people, and that this took place at the upper echelons of money and power -- not at the level of an ordinary bank employee.

 

Then, thanks to the massive fraud and greed taking place way above the heads of ordinary people, our economy collapsed. People have lost their pensions, their life savings, their businesses and their assets, thanks to this.

 

Does it matter to those in the upper echelons? Not IMO. We are peons, pawns, prey. We are at the mercy of those who have great power. The effect seems small when it is individualized, and it is easy to blame person 100%. That is why these things can happen -- unless a significant percentage of the population is adversely effected at the same time, it is easy to hide the results of planned and orchestrated greed and corruption.

Edited January 9, 2010 by RoughCollie

[DesertDweller]

 

I did tell her today that they need to stay in contact with the bank so they know what the bank plans to do. That way if they find out they're going to lose the house, they can stop paying BOTH mortgages and save up for a rental. She doesn't want to hear it but she does need to prepare for it. While we were on the phone the mailman came to the door to have her sign for a letter from their bank. She said her husband already got one in his name and now she did and it was about the house. She didn't want to talk anymore because her son was home, which honestly - he was before too, so I have no idea what the bank is sending them. They did tell her, however, that to do a modification they need to get their taxes done and fill out the packet of papers for the modification. But she's saying they could never come up with the money to get their loan current.

 

In some of the programs available for loan modifications, they put the past due amount on the back of the loan. It is possible that they could not only have their payments reduced, but they would also just start paying the new payment amount without having to come up with a lump sum for the past due.

 

Getting their taxes done is critical though. In our dealing with our lender, any documentation they asked for they wanted almost immediately. If they can't produce the financial documents being requested, there is no way they will be helped.

[RoughCollie]

Here's a forum which has lots of helpful information for those who are going through the loan modification or foreclosure process:

 

http://www.loansafe.org/forum/

[Denisemomof4]

No, no, Denise, I was in a hurry and didn't express myself clearly at all. I apologize for that. The church would exhibit the qualities of grace and mercy if they helped your sister & her family. That's up to the church, and I see no problem with you suggesting a church as a resource.

 

True, they did not have to take the $$ the bank offered them.

 

Of course, the banks are culpable too, IMO, because they offered money and had people believing that due to the bank's own credit check, the people would be able to afford to pay the money back. But the bank was never interested in helping anyone, or in merely making money from the loan interest -- they were making money by selling the loans to investors. Naturally, it is much more complex than that, and my take on it is a gross over-simplification. I think, though, that the banks defrauded the American people, and that this took place at the upper echelons of money and power -- not at the level of an ordinary bank employee.

 

Then, thanks to the massive fraud and greed taking place way above the heads of ordinary people, our economy collapsed. People have lost their pensions, their life savings, their businesses and their assets, thanks to this.

 

Does it matter to those in the upper echelons? Not IMO. We are peons, pawns, prey. We are at the mercy of those who have great power. The effect seems small when it is individualized, and it is easy to blame person 100%. That is why these things can happen -- unless a significant percentage of the population is adversely effected at the same time, it is easy to hide the results of planned and orchestrated greed and corruption.

 

I agree with you 100% but I also wish my sister thought more realistically and responsibly from day one. Everyone must know that no bank cares for us personally, they're only after our money. I can't tell you how often I throw away applications for approved credit cards with some outrageous amount, and we also throw away all the applications for our approved line of equity on our home. We want no part of either.

 

My sister, OTOH, took all of them and applied for all she could get. I know the bank has some responsibility, but ultimately it's their lives, their family, their responsibility to make wise, well thought out decisions. They fell into the materialism trap and that was more appealing to them than spending sensibly and wisely.

 

So yes, the banks are to blame in part. And greed most definitely is what caused the collapse of our economy. And the "big guys" have always crapped on the peons. But I think most of the blame is on my sister for her exorbitant spending and lavish dreams on a VERY, VERY humble salary. Even the house they own - you would not believe.

[Denisemomof4]

In some of the programs available for loan modifications, they put the past due amount on the back of the loan. It is possible that they could not only have their payments reduced, but they would also just start paying the new payment amount without having to come up with a lump sum for the past due.

 

Getting their taxes done is critical though. In our dealing with our lender, any documentation they asked for they wanted almost immediately. If they can't produce the financial documents being requested, there is no way they will be helped.

 

I still find it hard to believe that they could afford what they owe on the house ALONE, let alone the thousands in default. I couldn't possibly see them qualifying for that on her husband's humble salary. And I told my sister that even if she did find a job (which she's talked about for over a year now but hasn't really put any effort into trying) that I don't know if they'd allow her salary to be a part of the ratio because she will likely be there only weeks. Their possible foreclosure is a very thing NOW and she hasn't even tried to find a job. Years ago you had to be there a minimum of 6 - 12 months to allow those numbers to be factored in. Does anyone know if it's still like this?

[RoughCollie]

My sister, OTOH, took all of them and applied for all she could get.

 

I cannot figure out what made people do that. Is it poor judgment, an inability to resist temptation, the person feeling they deserve things they don't have and cannot afford to buy for cash, keeping up with the Joneses? Is it, ultimately, symptomatic of a character (a/k/a personality) disorder or some other mental disorder?

Edited January 9, 2010 by RoughCollie

[Denisemomof4]

I cannot figure out what made people do that. Is it poor judgment, an inability to resist temptation, the person feeling they deserve things they don't have and cannot afford to buy for cash, keeping up with the Joneses? Is it, ultimately, symptomatic of a character (a/k/a personality) disorder or some other mental disorder?

 

well, my sister does have bipolar, and compulsive shopping is common with SOME bipolar people. That's what her husband was told by a therapist *he* went to see because he found life with her so difficult. She also has hoarding tendencies/issues. You wouldn't believe all the stuff she kept when my dad died. I mean honestly - the brush to scrub a toilet? I didn't say anything because I didn't want to get her mad. She bit her tongue at times because I think she thought I was being disrespectful by not keeping Every Single Thing. I donated a TON of stuff to charity and I have PLENTY for memories. She kept half used toilet paper rolls, opened food items (they're all still in her box truck) so yes, it is a sickness.

 

BUT, she and her husband always had to have bigger and better than everyone. People from his workplace were shocked when they visited them at their home - a home that most people on his salary couldn't touch. My sister got everything during a divorce with her first husband, bought a condo, and lived in it many years. When she sold it they had a very nice down payment on a home, and found a gorgeous home that the owner was desperate to sell. I do think it's a hard sell of a home as most people raising kids don't want three levels with the parents bedroom the only room on the third floor, so he went way down on the price. And it looks like a playboy suite, complete with a jacuzzi tub right in the room. :001_huh: Gorgeous home but not for everyone.

 

They always talked about their dreams of travel, how they wanted to be rich, etc. They bought and bought and bought. Her husband had a contest with a neighbor as to who could build the best tree house. We bought a typical, boring wood playset, her husband had to build a HUGE, elaborate one. They always had to be bigger and better. I never quite understood why they had to constantly talk about how they took two vacations every year: a summer one and a winter one. UNTIL, that is, my kids went into school. Even my oldest dd was in school for a year and a half. I volunteered all the time and that's when it all made sense to me. Everyone would come back from vacation and talk about what they did over the break: either as a class or with their group of friends. So my take on that was that their kids had to always do bigger and better than anyone else. THey'd never admit it, but I'm certain of it. I mean I used to constantly question HOW they got that HUGE boat, one large enough it had sleeping quarters and a good sized kitchen! How did they get that timeshare? Disneyworld several years in a row, Mexico, San Francisco, etc. You get the picture. What I didn't know is that they were racking up their charges, withdrawing from their retirement fund, AND taking out equity loans. Stupid me - it never occurred to me. She had her first baby and her husband goes out and gets her a diamond tennis bracelet. And my concern was, how could they afford for her to stay home? It went on and on like this. She'd shop from the time stores opened until they closed, sometimes not coming home until 4:00 in the morning because she was in the 24 Walmart. It's a sickness, yes, but I think she was trying to fill an empty hole in her heart. She swears her marriage is fine now but I feel so sad for her. Her husband and kids are never around and she's lonely. I think that's why, ultimately, she shopped all she did. But he was a huge part of the problem, too, having to buy and/or build to out-do everyone. And he only enabled her when he added on to their house so she could have somewhere to store everything.

 

Because she was SO difficult earlier, I had to separate for her for 10 years. Yes, 10. Things spiraled during our separation. When I saw her house after all that time, honestly, it was like what you see on those hoarding shows. My eyes teared up and all I could say was, "Something had to have gone terribly wrong for things to get this bad." I was absolutely STUNNED.

 

So sickness, yes. Materialistic and keeping up with, no BYPASSING the Jones', yes; always. It's a combination of things. Should they have qualified for the equity line they did? No. But they got it and spent it and now they're about to have every red cent ripped out from beneath them. And my only hope is that they can LEARN from what they've done. But until my sister and bil BOTH take responsibility for the predicament they're in, I don't really see them turning things around.

 

Wow did that get long!!!!

[Peek a Boo]

ANd without sounding cold hearted, I have a hard time telling her to go to the church for financial help. I've hesitated to post this here. Set me straight if you disagree. They chose to live irresponsibly .....Is it right for them to go to churches for help when they didn't truly fall on hard times due to circumstances but instead due to irresponsibility? ..... IMO, this is not a charity case.

 

 

no, not a jerk :-)

 

But I'd still start requesting help from churches and anyone else: sometimes that help can be in the form of prayers, accountability, or someone that can help them deal with what they are in NOW. Help getting out of the house, finding somewhere more suitable, offering advice that resonates with how they hear and accept, etc.

 

I understand [and agree!] that you don't want to enable them, but with kids in the picture, they DO need help.....

 

good luck!

[missmoe]

We were renting a home that went into foreclosure. I have no way of knowing what information the landlord received, but we had a notice taped to our door letting us know the property had been foreclosed on. We had 90 days to vacate the property. The bank did come several times trying to get into the house before those 90 days were up, but one is under no obligation to allow them access to the property. Also, during those 90 days no payments need be made to the bank. I know that in CA the laws have changed in the last year or so to allow people more time to move after a foreclosure.

 

HTH

[cillakat]

Every red cent goes to the mortgage and

 

Really though, if the house is going - and it sounds like it is - they need to stop paying asap so they have money for a deposit on an apt.

 

;/

 

k

[cillakat]

well, my sister does have bipolar, and compulsive shopping is common with SOME bipolar people. That's what

 

ahhh;/ it makes more sense now. also sounds like there might be some ADHD on top of it all what with the taxes not ever being filed.

 

hugs

K

[tex-mex]

:grouphug: I feel bad for the OP's family but the process really does depend upon the state.... Some states like GA are 3 months and some like NY can take over a year. Bankruptcy can affect the timeline because not everyone surrenders the home. Your ds really does need to get clarity from her lawyer.

:iagree:Her bankruptcy lawyer would have a better idea of how long houses are in "shadow inventory" or quickly auctioned off by the county courts the first of the month. It depends on the state. Better for her to rent out a new place to live before her credit gets ruined by the foreclosure. Once it is listed in her credit report... it will be difficult to find a nice place to rent.

 

There is the chance if she has credit card debt in the foreclosure it may or may not be discharged -- if not, she can be sued by the credit card companies. The trustee will look at the debt lists and make the determination. Again, she could have a judgement in her credit report and $$$ taken from her bank accounts or paychecks if not discharged. It can be a mess.

Edited April 22, 2010 by tex-mex

[Crimson Wife]

Of course, the banks are culpable too, IMO, because they offered money and had people believing that due to the bank's own credit check, the people would be able to afford to pay the money back. But the bank was never interested in helping anyone, or in merely making money from the loan interest -- they were making money by selling the loans to investors. Naturally, it is much more complex than that, and my take on it is a gross over-simplification. I think, though, that the banks defrauded the American people, and that this took place at the upper echelons of money and power -- not at the level of an ordinary bank employee.

 

Then, thanks to the massive fraud and greed taking place way above the heads of ordinary people, our economy collapsed.

 

This is a load of cr*p. Wall Street is being made the scapegoat because average Americans don't want to face up to the fact that the true culprit is, as in the OP's sister's case, their OWN greed. Nobody held a gun to folks' heads forcing them to buy stuff they couldn't really afford.

 

Back in our parents'/grandparents' generation, people simply did not make purchases unless they actually had the money to pay for them. If a family took out a mortgage to buy a home it was a plain vanilla 15 year fixed with at least 20% down (and often more than that) with documented income & assets and the purchase price was no more than twice annual income.

 

If everyone had stuck to the old-fashioned idea of living below one's means and saving for the future, our country wouldn't be in this economic crisis.

[Melissa in FL]

 

Who will rent to someone who just filed bankruptcy and was foreclosed on? I don't know what's going to happen to their family.

 

We would and are. We've been landlords for a long time and most tenants do not have good credit. We have one that has great credit and could buy a house but chooses not to, but that is very rare. One of our homes is rented to a family that was foreclosed on. A lot of landlords see that as a plus over the renter that moves every couple of years. Foreclosed families usually know how to care for a home and don't call the landlord for everything, they know how to do simple repairs. They generally treat the home as their own and take care of it as such. They typically view it as a long term situation and don't want to move every year. They really do make great tenants. Most landlords in today's climate see the benefits to renting to people who have been homeowners in the past and will rent to them over a lot of other people. We did do a very careful check of income to make sure the family wasn't getting into another bad situation (that then would put us in one). They really shouldn't have to much problems renting.

 

As far as foreclosure, it varies greatly by state. If they are in FL I could let you know how it goes here, but if they're somewhere else it won't apply.

Melissa

[MomtoCandJ]

Dh and I rent and we have only been asked once about a credit report in Michigan or Georgia. Although we usually rent houses and mobile homes instead of apartments, our first place together requested a credit report because they were income based apartments. I would look for places that are either in the paper, drive around looking for signs in the yards and also put the word out that they are looking for a place to rent and what the minimum they are looking for (like for dh and I if we move back to MI would ask for 2 bedroom 1 bath because that is the minimum we need) we found our current place by word of mouth and if you know somebody or what ever the rent may even be cheaper than what going rate is.