Almost 4 won't potty train!

[crl]

My almost 4 year old son (4 in Jan) will not potty train and it's driving us all nuts. I always said I'd never let it get this far, but I seem powerless to stop it. Here's our story:

 

My son had constipation problems starting at his 2nd birthday. Which is normally when we would have started potty training. After a few months of trial and error, the doctor finally prescribed Mira-lax for him. We were also told that we should not try to potty train him until things had settled down and were regular again. Let's just say, that took till he was almost 3 before we could begin to wean him off the Mira-lax. So last spring we started the potty training with setting a timer and going every hour. For awhile, it was working that way. But if we forgot to set the timer or tried to encourage him to tell us, he would be wet. The farther we got into this, the more he protested and started not being dry when the timer went off. So we backed off since this was obviously something he was using as a power struggle. Since the beginning of October we have been trying to do this again. At first, he would go with the timer routine until he earned his prize, then he would relapse into the being wet before the timer went off for a day or so till he wanted another prize. Now, he has a prize in mind, but still refuses to use the potty. And we know he has the ability to stay dry for a few hours at a time (he has proved that). He's even had many nights when he's dry in the morning (though I understand that may take more time).

 

We are desperate and are willing to try just about anything to get this kid using the potty since I'm tired of cleaning up a wet kid and wet floor or changing the pull ups. Even DH has tried with no success and gave up.

 

Just for reference, my DD was fully trained at 20 months by letting her have a naked day then followed up with a timer for a few days just to be sure we both remembered. So this struggle and using other techniques are foreign to us. Please help this desperate mom!

[gardening momma]

I waited with my second dd, much longer than I did with my first dd. In fact, I hadn't really made much attempt at potty training dd4, and she started using the potty herself. She never even used the potty chairs--she used the potty seat on the toilet from the beginning. I don't know if it was laziness on my part, or not wanting to deal with the struggle potty training involved with my first dd, but it sure was nice to just relax and wait until she was ready. I don't even think I thought of it that way, but that's how it turned out. She was potty trained very close to her 4th birthday, IIRC. She's dry at night and goes #1 during the day without help. She's also had constipation issues for 1.5-2 years, and so we have to watch for the signs and get her on the toilet quickly, but we've only had an accident in that regard once, I think. Her main problem is that she holds her #2 until it hurts.

[cathmom]

IMO your dd is extremely unusual and your son is normal. I bet if you back off he will train.

 

One of my sons did not start using the potty until closer to 5. As he grew, I told him that there were no bigger diapers. When he started to get uncomfortable a bit in the diapers, he figured it out. IMO pull-ups prolong potty-training and should not be used.

[vkay]

So we backed off since this was obviously something he was using as a power struggle.

 

I have two ideas/thoughts: 1. Backing down from a power struggle only encourages the little people and teaches them that "it worked". 2. Maybe instead of rewarding the successes, try making consequences for the "accidents". Two of my three dc tried to challenge the whole potty training idea. I came down quick and hard with consequences (as soon as I was 100% sure it wasn't just an innocent accident) and they never tried that again.

 

The consequence has to be something that they care deeply about. For one of mine that was computer time (yep, even at 2 - we're a computer-geeky family). As soon as I was sure that he was just testing this whole potty thing, I clearly told him that if he got his pants wet again, then no computer until morning. Twenty minutes later....he wet AGAIN. So I calmly took computer time away. He was upset by this and about 2 hours later he went potty in the toilet and proudly announced that he can have the computer back. I reminded him that I said it would be gone until morning, and he can have it back then if he stays dry. He did. He never ever had another accident in all of his years. The kid LOVES his computer!!! You just have to find what makes them tick and use it against them.:D

[Susan in KY]

Yup. We switched to cloth and it worked like a charm.

[melmichigan]

Absolutely no more pull-ups. Harsh, I know, we just completely eliminated them. I had tried cotton (happy heiny's), they are too absorbent. Then we just used pull ups at bedtime, he figured that out and held it until then. We bought good old fashion gerber cotton trainers and two pair of Imse Vimse for when we are out and about. We did the hour thing, not confrontational just you will sit.

 

Once he started staying dry there we moved on to #2. We are two weeks with one accident after following others advice and when he had skids in his underwear he had to sit until he went. After two days of this taking forever, and I mean hours, we just look for the signs and he has mandatory sitting time whenever I think he might have to go or hasn't gone. This is the only time he can take a leapster or vtech and just sit. Sad, but it is working so far.

 

I would keep reminding past a day or even week until you notice them going on their own accord. You can spread it out a little more but I would still remind them, little ones get to preoccupied at times.

 

My girls were much easier.

Edited December 15, 2009 by melmichigan

[runamuk]

Our son was almost 4 when he finally started using the toilet. He knew when he had to go and would leave the room, go in his diaper and then ask to be changed. We put him in underwear, but he didn't make any effort to make it to the bathroom and would wet his pants. After several days of this, we had him change his own wet clothes and clean up any puddles he left on the floor. Within a 2 days he was using the potty.

 

Making him responsible for getting to the toilet and cleaning himself up if he chose not to go was the key in getting him trained.

[coffeegal]

Making him responsible for getting to the toilet and cleaning himself up if he chose not to go was the key in getting him trained.

 

:iagree: Cold turkey often works the best. Switch to underwear, teach the child to clean themselves, and let it go. My potty training holdouts were using the toilet within a week. ;)

[gardening momma]

One of my sons did not start using the potty until closer to 5. As he grew, I told him that there were no bigger diapers. When he started to get uncomfortable a bit in the diapers, he figured it out. IMO pull-ups prolong potty-training and should not be used.

We used pull ups for both our girls when they got to the point that diapers were just a royal pain during diaper changes. Somewhere around the age of 2-2.5 yrs old it was easier to do pull ups and standing changes than to mess with diaper tabs. It didn't delay potty training in our first dd at all. I wouldn't blame them in our 2nd dd's potty training "delay" either (I'd blame me :D). Plus, with pull ups, the child can pull their "diaper" off themselves and pull it back up when they use the toilet/potty seat.

Edited December 15, 2009 by gardening momma

[babysparkler]

:grouphug: Boys are just plain difficult...

 

Sounds JUST like my sons. My first was a pill... he decided he "didn't want to use the potty" until his 4th birthday. He has always been a strong-minded and strong-willed kid. Sure enough, he started ON his 4th birthday!

 

My second boy (3rd child) was just over 3.5 when he finally potty trained. For him, we tried everything, but nothing worked. Finally, out of desperation we purchased a Potty Watch and it WORKED! He potty trained in less than a week with that watch! Here is a link to the one we used:

 

http://www.weeminder.com/

 

We are about to pull out the watch for our 2.5 year old and are hopeful that it will work again!

[Amber in AUS]

I would go cold turkey too and just deal with the accidents. If he wets while you are out take him straight home. Let him know that it isn't acceptable to wet in public and that if he does you will need to leave immediately from the playground, store, friends house etc.

 

Make him somewhat responsible to changing and cleaning himself. Obviously you need to be included in super bad #2 messes.

[myfatherslily]

My son will also be 4 in January and just started using the potty full-time (well, during the day) a few months ago. He just couldn't figure out how to poo in the potty. I was trying to just be relaxed about it, but getting to a point where I really wanted to get this done soon! Finally one day he had a little tummy virus and said his tummy hurt. I suggested he sit on the potty and sure 'nough... After just a few times, he was all set. He had it all figured out and didn't turn back. For him, it just had to click.

 

My nephew was a real stinker and turned it into a power struggle too. But, rest assured, at 7 he is no longer wearing diapers;) It will end, one way or another!!:)

[StartingOver]

My children all potty trained at different times, DD 22 mo., DS 2.5 yrs, DS 2 yrs, DS 3.5, DD 20 mo. I always wait for readiness, then get the training pants and plastic pants to go over them. I start with the clock for regular trips to the potty. IF that doesn't work we go to the rubber pants, these hold most of the mess in and are pretty uncomfortable when wet. They usually do the trick. Pull ups are only for bedtime and car rides here.

[Redrapunzel]

I don't have the answer, but I am feeling your pain. My 3 1/2 year old is no where near ready to potty train. He is killing me. He was starting to toilet train, then my husband started talking to him about it, offering rewards, making comments, and WHAM, back to square one. I set the timer and took him to the potty every hour on the hour and he still wet his diaper all day. He just wants something to bounce his ball off. After we finish moving to our new house and get past the holidays I am going to start making him clean himself up and then we will see how he likes pooping his pants. I also am going to add daily mommy time in a structured way so he gets one on one time other than diaper changes.

[cathmom]

We used pull ups for both our girls when they got to the point that diapers were just a royal pain during diaper changes. Somewhere around the age of 2-2.5 yrs old it was easier to do pull ups and standing changes than to mess with diaper tabs. It didn't delay potty training in our first dd at all. I wouldn't blame them in our 2nd dd's potty training "delay" either (I'd blame me :D). Plus, with pull ups, the child can pull their "diaper" off themselves and pull it back up when they use the toilet/potty seat.

 

Interesting! I never found standing changes easier - I think they are harder. I'm glad they worked for you. Usually I hear the other way! :D

[6packofun]

:iagree: Cold turkey often works the best. Switch to underwear, teach the child to clean themselves, and let it go. My potty training holdouts were using the toilet within a week. ;)

 

Yep. We don't bother even starting the training process until the child starts to show some signs of readiness and bladder control (staying dry longer while in diapers, etc.) and then when it's obvious that they are capable but just not willing, we move to cloth underwear like Potty Scotty and matter-of-factly teach him how to clean up after accidents (with a little help). And then it's about 7-10 days of inconvenience to REALLY potty-trained. :)

[gardening momma]

Interesting! I never found standing changes easier - I think they are harder. I'm glad they worked for you. Usually I hear the other way! :D

Not a #2 change. :tongue_smilie: I made them lie on a changing pad for that.

[TxMama]

I'd put him back in diapers(not pull ups), show him where his potty and underwear are located and let him figure it out on his own. No charts, no prizes and no reminders(that means no comments and no nagging :lol:).

 

He will figure it out. There aren't many 4yos who will be willing to walk around in a soggy diaper.

[cathmom]

Not a #2 change. :tongue_smilie: I made them lie on a changing pad for that.

 

Oh, that makes more sense LOL!

[homeschoolally]

Finally, out of desperation we purchased a Potty Watch and it WORKED! He potty trained in less than a week with that watch! Here is a link to the one we used:

 

http://www.weeminder.com/

 

We are about to pull out the watch for our 2.5 year old and are hopeful that it will work again!

 

 

:001_smile: THANK YOU! I had no idea such a thing existed! We could REALLY use that around here!

[SonshineLearner]

I told mine that Mommy's didn't buy wipes for 3 year olds. I then used tepid water...bordering on cold 2x and he decided to go in the potty. I then purchased toddler wipes for a long time... cuz they are just nice. Anyway, it wasn't necessarily really nice... but it worked... and it didn't cause him pain.... and really... 3 was old enough. He was going... hiding... and coming back.. I figured that if you could do that.... you could.... go... hide on the potty:-) and call the mama:-)

I never got mad... or anything.. just matter of fact...

Carrie:-)

[WiseOwlKnits]

Throw out the diapers and tell him that's it. Yes, it will be hard for a few days. But you're just prolonging the agony for both of you by waffling back and forth on this topic. The best parenting advice I got (a little late for you) is either train a boy before 2 or after they turn 4. Something about boys and being 3 doesn't work...

 

My DD trained at 20 months and my DS at 23 months. The first 3 days were awful with him. Well, really the first day. He must have had 20 accidents. The next day he had maybe 10 accidents. The third day only a couple. And after that he was done. He night trained a few weeks later.

[gardening momma]

Throw out the diapers and tell him that's it. Yes, it will be hard for a few days. But you're just prolonging the agony for both of you by waffling back and forth on this topic. The best parenting advice I got (a little late for you) is either train a boy before 2 or after they turn 4. Something about boys and being 3 doesn't work...

 

My DD trained at 20 months and my DS at 23 months. The first 3 days were awful with him. Well, really the first day. He must have had 20 accidents. The next day he had maybe 10 accidents. The third day only a couple. And after that he was done. He night trained a few weeks later.

When training dd4, the only problem I had with this concept (of getting rid of the diapers and having 20 accidents a day, or at least the first day) was that we had new carpet all through the house. With dd6, when I trained her, we had the old carpet still. She did have some accidents, and we did have to do some spot carpet cleaning. I just wasn't so willing to let that happen with our brand new carpet!! And it wasn't something we thought of when we got our new carpet--we might have delayed a year or so if it had occurred to us.

[WiseOwlKnits]

When training dd4, the only problem I had with this concept (of getting rid of the diapers and having 20 accidents a day, or at least the first day) was that we had new carpet all through the house. With dd6, when I trained her, we had the old carpet still. She did have some accidents, and we did have to do some spot carpet cleaning. I just wasn't so willing to let that happen with our brand new carpet!! And it wasn't something we thought of when we got our new carpet--we might have delayed a year or so if it had occurred to us.

 

True. Only our bedrooms are carpeted. So it wasn't a problem for us. I just restricted their movement to areas where there wasn't carpet. But carpet throughout would make me more hesitant to do that!

[babysparkler]

:001_smile: THANK YOU! I had no idea such a thing existed! We could REALLY use that around here!

 

Yes... I am just not good at remembering to go at even intervals. It was super and it comes with a DVD and book to teach the kids what to do. My 2yo hasn't started using it yet, but he already knows the little "Hop, Hop, Hop to the potty place" song. It is a catchy tune :)

[Mommyof4ks]

I agree with no more pull ups. My middle son was 4 when he PT, and he just had no interest at all. Finally when he was outgrowing the size 6 huggies I said, well these are too small and there are no bigger diapers so now you have to go on the potty. He was not happy, but stopping his game to clean up (which I did VERY SLOWLY to prove my point) was not fun so he gave up and used the potty.

 

Funny thing with my youngest about PTing. He was going to his oncology clinic weekly when he was 2, and I had no intention of PTing him at that time due to his meds and such, but the clinic social worker offered him a truck if he would come in in undies the next week. He PTed that afternoon and never looked back. Do you have someone that can offer your son something cool like that lol?

[*Inna*]

Our 3.5 year old potty trained in a day after her little brother was born. We told her that we can have only one person in diapers in our family.

It was amazing, after months and months trying to persuade her (physically she was ready a long time ago).

[cathmom]

Our 3.5 year old potty trained in a day after her little brother was born. We told her that we can have only one person in diapers in our family.

It was amazing, after months and months trying to persuade her (physically she was ready a long time ago).

 

Should I wish a set of twins on you LOL? "Let's see...who gets to wear the diaper today?"

 

:lol:

[dirty ethel rackham]

Since you mentioned a history of constipation and needing Miralax, I would make sure he was checked out by a doctor to make sure that there aren't any underlying issues. A child could be constipated, but the softer stool can leak around it so it doesn't look like the child is constipated (this is called encopresis.) Constipation can impact urinary control. I could not believe that my son was constipated until they showed me the x-ray of his belly full of stool because he always seemed to have bms. That was just the stool leaking around the blockages. He was a late trainer because of this.

 

If medical issues have been ruled out, I would ditch the pull ups. There are no consequences when wearing pull-ups. They don't feel bad and don't need to change clothes. With my stubborn boys, I went back to cloth, which made them much more aware of when they went. I also went cold turkey one day on all diapers. I taught them how to clean up after themselves every single time. The did get it.

 

Oh and one more thing - we learned that the best time for children to make a bowel movement was 15 - 30 minutes after a meal because eating stimulates the peristaltic action of the digestive system.

[crl]

Thanks for the support. I hadn't thought about the long time constipation affecting his urinary control. I'll have to look into that before forcing him to go cold turkey.

[babysparkler]

Should I wish a set of twins on you LOL? "Let's see...who gets to wear the diaper today?"

 

:lol:

:lol::lol::lol:

[babysparkler]

I tried what you tried. I tried buying special "big boy" underwear. I tried rewards. I tried it all. He just didn't do it until he made up his mind to do it.

 

That was my firstborn. He was determined not to use the potty until the day HE chose (his 4th birthday).

[stripe]

I just wanted to mention this book. It Hurts When I Poop!: A Story for Children Who Are Scared to Use the Potty . It might help.

[KidsHappen]

I only potty trained my first two. With the rest, I just waited them out until they potty trained themselves. Sure it was more physical work but way less stress. I handle work better than stress. :tongue_smilie: I would rule out medical issues and then wait until he was self motivated.

[LibrarianMom]

My son was well past 4. I prepped him for several weeks that when this bag of pull-ups is gone, we weren't buying anymore. The first day he had one accident at the sitters house and after that he was fine. He even was fine at night.

[Verity]

Three boys here. I potty trained my oldest when I was 5 months pregnant with my middle son, ds was almost 3. We used the "Potty Training in a Day" book/method and it worked that day. Within 3 days he was trained for #2 also. In hindsight I can say that my oldest son is most interested in pleasing and wants us to be happy with him. My second son trained at around 3 years old using the same method but continued having resistance and accidents with #2 until he was 3.5 even though he was at part-time school and pottying with other kids during the day.

 

I started my youngest son at around 18 months by introducing the potty. He sat on it once or twice and may have even peed in it then refused outright to sit on it again (by refuse I mean running away yelling "no, no!" and shaking his head, nothing worked to calm him). We tried again at 2.5 and had no success at all. At three I tried really focused Potty Training in a Day cold turkey and found myself with just alot of messes to clean up. He would wear dirty soiled underwear for hours if you let him. :(

 

With this child he was just extremely strong-willed, much more so than my other two boys. Trying to force him to do something basically was like declaring war to him. He doesn't really care what we want him to do most of the time - it's his way or nothing (in his mind). I consider myself fairly strict and require compliance in areas where safety or family need is an issue. There are some things you can force someone to do, for instance wear a seatbelt, put on clothes (though they can take them off), sit in a chair...but you can't force someone to toilet or eat. So finally I put up the Thomas the Train reward chart in the bathroom (yes, had been tried many times before), showed him the rewards and told him that when he was ready he could use the potty and earn the rewards. In the meantime I worked at making him more responsible for cleaning up (some days it was putting his own pullups in the garbage, others he would run around naked and have to clean up any messes - and yes we have whole house carpet - I'm hoping to get it replaced now!)

 

Essentially I had to remove any personal emotion from the process and let it be his thing - not my accomplishment or failure. Even reminders from me set up resistance. It took several months of two steps forward, one step back; some days of total regression. Suddenly a couple of months ago (maybe 10 weeks now?) he started going on his own regularly. We occasionally have nighttime accidents and once or twice he had an accident while we were out. I still carry a backup pair of pants and underwear and a pullup in case of sheer emergency but otherwise he is totally in charge of his own toileting - and he turns 4 on the 19th.

 

Hang in there - it will happen!!

[cathmom]

A thought just occurred to me about this so I wanted to add it. There is one thing I did differently with my first than my second (first was 4.5, second was 2 when trained). I did not use pull ups with the second. I refused. They are just overpriced ineffective diapers that don't do wonders for potty training and independence like the makers lead one to believe.

 

I don't know if there is something to that, but I'm convinced it did not aid in potty training. I think it prolonged the frustration.

 

Well, certainly, diaper manufacturers have a vested interest in children NOT potty-training.

[*Inna*]

Should I wish a set of twins on you LOL? "Let's see...who gets to wear the diaper today?"

 

That should be interesting. :lol:

[AnitaMcC]

Each of my kids had their own challenges-LOL.

 

I was bound and determined to get my twins potty trained before Ds#2 was born.

 

Dd was stubborn!!!!!! She was 3 yrs and 7 months old. I tried everything with her... stickers, rewards, bribery. She would stay dry all night, and wake up wearing her pullup... and then let loose. She never would tell me she needed changing. She would soak through without caring about the mess. Finally I just told her no more diapers/pullups and that if she had another accident then she was going to clean it up and have to stay in her bedroom until no more accidents. She had an accident... I had her clean it up and then she had to stay in her bedroom (I was tired of dealing with ruined furniture/carpeting all over the house as she just didn't care about soaking through). She was fully daytime/nighttime potty trained in one day-LOL.

 

Her twin brother was another story.... he wasn't day potty trained until he was 5. Even then he had to go on a strict schedule or he would have accidents. But he had a medical issue... neurologically his brain/bladder signals didn't mature. Even at 3 yrs old he peed 3-4 times an hour automatically just like a newborne. At night he wet 4-5 times a night. His bladder couldn't get full to send brain the full signal. His brain instead would just send the automatic signal to empty the bladder every 10-15 minutes. He had to train his brain. Even then, once he finally did learn what a "full" bladder signal was... he had only minutes to get to bathroom. He couldn't hold it for long. He actually was #2 trained before he was #1 trained. He had ot go on medication for night time until he was 9yrs old because once he fell asleep his brain reverted back to "automatic".

 

Ds#2 was very stubborn. He had constipation issues and was scared of sitting on the potty. He potty trained when he was almost 4yrs old. Also he had a medical issue... I forget the name of it, but he had to have surgery to fix the hole when he was 7 years old.

 

Ds#3 was even more stubborn. He just plain refused to sit on the potty and wouldn't go near it. He refused to go near the training potties as well. He was wearing underwear and would change himself into pullups when he needed to go and then come to me to clean him up. He finally was #1 potty trained when he was nearly 4 1/2. He just turned 5 (April bday) when he finally sat on the potty to go #2. That was close!!!! He would have had to stay in the special ed (autism) preschool another year and not attend kindergarten if he wouldn't potty train.

[crl]

Thanks for sharing.

 

Yesterday, DS said his tummy hurt. So I said that maybe he was hungry or needed to potty. He said I think it's potty. So we took him to the potty and he went. So he now is starting to associate that feeling with needing to potty. So we may be on the right road finally.

[kpupg]

My ds didn't have any health issues, but he did not daytime train until his 4th birthday. He could ... for instance, he never had an accident during his preschool sessions ... but he would not commit. At last, dh had a big talk with him, privately, and ds decided he would begin wearing underwear on his next birthday. He did and never had an accident.

 

It took longer for nighttime dry ... and that came very quickly once I implemented a policy of making HIM change and launder the wet bedsheets. :)

 

So, it was definitely a willpower issue for my ds. I'm sorry you're dealing with the hassle :grouphug:

 

Karen

[babysparkler]

Thanks for sharing.

 

Yesterday, DS said his tummy hurt. So I said that maybe he was hungry or needed to potty. He said I think it's potty. So we took him to the potty and he went. So he now is starting to associate that feeling with needing to potty. So we may be on the right road finally.

 

That's super!

[Sputterduck]

No one goes to college not potty trained unless there are other problems involved. I promise!