Do you spank your children?

[Tree House Academy]

I do indeed have issues with this topic, though I wasn't beaten as a child or anything, if that's what you mean. It's a hot button issue for me because I believe children should be entitled to the same bodily integrity as adults. And since this is a discussion thread, I don't really have to agree to disagree (though it might save my sanity today). I can try all I want to change minds and express my opinion, the same way I've seen others do in other threads.

 

I'm certain that most people who spank their children love their children. I simply do not see physical punishment as a necessity. I've disciplined my children in non-physical ways and still had them come to me in repentance and sorrow for what they did. There was no need to lay a hand on them. I simply don't believe it's a necessity. Again, I point out that many, many parents have strong-willed children, and they manage to discipline and change behavior in non-physical ways.

 

I'm sorry you're feeling offended (didn't we just have a thread about that?!), but I stand firm in my beliefs on this, and I'm unapologetic for them. I taught my children that you don't hit to solve your problems, and I believe the same goes for adults as well. I'm sorry if that doesn't concur with what you believe.

 

 

I was spanked by one parent, physically abused by the other on several occasions. There IS a difference. A huge difference. I also ran all over top of the family members who didn't spank me. I was one of those kids who NEEDED that kind of discipline and to this day, I respect and love the parent who spanked me properly. We won't talk about the piece of sh*t who abused me.

[Debbie in OR]

I think your shock that people "still spank" must equal my shock at a child who is never naughty. LOL

 

:lol:

[Jorsay]

As an adult who was spanked as a child, I can tell you that connotation meant nothing to me.

I was being hit. Period.

 

Then I would guess that you have never been hit because there is a difference. For instance, spanking in the UFC is generally not as effctive as hitting.

[Orthodox6]

There are different types of spanking.

 

We never spanked prior to age 4, nor past age 7. We would deliver a carefully-measured (carefully controlled level of impact) swat on the bottom (up to three, for a serious behavioural infraction), AFTER informing the child that such was about to occur. No "impulse spanking" allowed for the parent. We didn't do very much of this, either.

 

I agree with those who point out that "hitting breeds hitting." What I'm describing bears no relationship to that, however.

Edited July 2, 2009 by Orthodox6

[Frelle]

Yes, we do.

Our oldest was on the receiving end of many, because it was what worked for her. If I placed her in time out, she was a clingy mess for several hours afterward. If given a choice between time out and a spank, she would choose the spank, and often did.

 

We have had to spank our middle two very infrequently. Other means of discipline work better for them. In fact, spanking makes my second oldest more wild, we figured that out quickly.

 

Its not the only tool in our toolbox, and it's not the one I go to first. But it's there.

 

To really scramble your brain, I am a non vaccinating, homebirthing, extended nursing, co-sleeping mom! YOu dont find many of those who spank.

[melissel]

To really scramble your brain, I am a non vaccinating, homebirthing, extended nursing, co-sleeping mom! YOu dont find many of those who spank.

 

Wow!!! No, you really do not! Consider me scrambled :tongue_smilie:

[lionfamily1999]

Then I would guess that you have never been hit because there is a difference. For instance, spanking in the UFC is generally not as effctive as hitting.

I would LOVE to see one of them spank another.:lol:

So does that mean I can tell my kids that as long as they hit kids at the park in only one specific way, and with love, that it's OK? I don't think spanking is OK. I actually think it should be illegal, the same way it's illegal to strike strangers. I won't be convinced that any parent couldn't live without it in their "toolbox" and that there are not equally effective, more loving ways of disciplining a child. Striking a person is hitting, plain and simple, whether you do it on the bottom, the face, the back of the head, the hand, whatever.

Having thought about it, I don't teach my kids that hitting is wrong. I tell my kids that they should only use violence as a last resort, but I do leave it as a last resort.

 

I guess we disagree even more than previous thought ;)

[Jorsay]

I would LOVE to see one of them spank another.:lol:

 

Having thought about it, I don't teach my kids that hitting is wrong. I tell my kids that they should only use violence as a last resort, but I do leave it as a last resort.

 

I guess we disagree even more than previous thought ;)

 

:iagree:

 

UFC Couture vs ortiz. It was very funny.

[pqr]

Given all the drivel, and yes it is just that, about not spanking as it is impossible to teach a child not to hit by hitting him and such....

 

I would like to offer a public thanks to my parents for every single time they spanked me. My father believes in the belt and you can be sure it left a mark.

 

I was spanked for:

lying; rudeness; poor grades; violating the rules of the household; hurting my younger siblings; doing anything that was dishonorable and laziness.

 

I learned many of life's lessons through this and no matter how much it hurt I never felt that it was done unfairly. Following the punishment I was always given a hug and reminded that I was loved. This was not a trite expression but a genuine demonstration, from my Father, that I was loved and that he meant it.

 

My father never told me "this is going to hurt me more than you," but even at a young age I could tell that it hurt him to spank.

 

It seems to me that a lot of today's children could do with a spanking once in a while, some of them more than once in a while.

 

 

Spanking promotes a true understanding of the world. It demonstrates that there are consequences for actions and that they can be painful.

 

I only think back to my childhood, once we moved to the States. In PS I ran into many boys whose parents would never spank them (and yes if you must know we lived in the "North" so they were all enlightened "Northerners"). Indeed I frequently heard the snide comment from these children about how if their parents ever spanked they "would sue them."

 

I was a little younger than the other boys in my class and subject to a high degree of bullying. My main tormentor was one of these boys whose parents would not spank. Despite being talked to about his behavior (by his parents) he continued.

 

Given some posters opinions, one might wonder where he learned such behavior. Surely a boy that was never spanked and was raised by those who (how did you put it Gingersmom? Oh yes...) "always thought spanking was a thing of the past" and who "live in the North" where they "do things different," would not turn to violence in his interaction with others. Surely it is only children whose parents have demonstrated that violence begets violence who would do that.

 

Anyway, I digress....Had his parents spanked him for his behavior (bullying), it might have stopped as the application of pain is a great behavioral modifier. Eventually, in a fight, I badly broke his nose and it was this application of pain that led him to leave me alone. I blame his parents and their "enlightened" view for the tyrant that their child became.

 

I know far far more children who were ruined by refusal of their parents to spank than were ever hurt by excessive punishment.

 

This is not to say that spanking is a must, but when properly done it does work.

Edited July 2, 2009 by pqr

[FlockOfSillies]

I really, really do not want to get sucked into this discussion further. All I will say is you might want to search over at Biblegateway.com for selected verses on God's discipline of believers. I highly recommend reading the entire 12th chapter of Hebrews. And if there's any further doubt about God's use of severe discipline upon believers, I'd kindly direct you to the case of Ananias and Sapphira.

 

It is so tiresome to hear people say or imply that there's no evidence for spanking in the Bible.

 

Must... not... get... sucked in... further...

[melissel]

I was spanked for:

lying; rudeness; poor grades; violating the rules of the household; hurting my younger siblings; doing anything that was dishonorable and laziness.

 

Huh. I wasn't spanked for any of those things, and I think I turned into a pretty decent adult. My husband loves me, my friends are loyal to me, I did very well in school and am a valued employee (sometimes a little too valued, actually :glare:), and my kids are bright, cheerful, smart, funny, polite, well-behaved, and seem to think I'm doing OK as a mom. I can't imagine how that could be, when I was only spanked a few times in my life.

 

What I don't understand is why people who believe in spanking seem to think that there is no parenting at all between the kind where you spank for disobedience and the kind where you let your kids run wild and be rude to everyone in sight. Parenting without spanking does not equal non-parenting, as the majority of the people who have met my kids would tell you. Yes, there are a lot of kids running wild in the world today. Some of them were spanked, some of them probably weren't. ALL of them need better discipline and parenting. Lack of spanking could not possibly be the only factor.

Edited July 2, 2009 by melissel
proofreading

[Blessedfamily]

I didn't read all the post because, frankly, this has been discussed thoroughly in the past and I know what the majority of responses will be. :001_smile:

 

:iagree:

 

Actually, when I was a teen, I was told by a very Southern man *race undisclosed* that the harder you beat your children...the more you love them.

 

*race undisclosed* for what reason?

 

 

This is absolutely the first time that anyone has ever asked that question on this board! We talk about a lot of things, but spanking just never seems to come up. :glare:

 

Seriously, you're kinda new here, so here's a tip. If you really wanted to know about the varied discipline philosophies of the people who post here, you could just do a search. (The skinny, dark blue bar near the top of the page, third link from the right.) Reading the other 141 threads that include the word "spank" could take up an entire evening, and you could spare us the condescension. (Look for the ones with the "locked" icon. Those are real potboilers.)

 

If, after reading some of those threads, you really felt like you could contribute something new to the discussion of the topic, then posting a new thread would be a swell idea. Anyone who really wanted to be groundbreaking on the spanking topic would say that they never spank, never yell, but they do have incorrigible hellions for children.

 

Other topics you could search before posting new threads:

-- Why there are so many evangelical Christians on this board (You're from the North; no one up there admits to being a right-wing fanatic, right? :001_rolleyes:)

-- Is there anyone here who doesn't recycle? Who doesn't eat organic?

-- Is there anyone here who doesn't breastfeed? Who doesn't do attachment parenting? Who gives birth in a hospital -- with drugs?

-- Is there anyone here who doesn't have a college degree?

 

I guarantee, your eyes would be opened to the rich diversity of opinions on this board. It's amazing how much backwardness continues to thrive out here in Flat-Earthland.

 

Amen. Hallelujah.

[Dirtroad]

As an adult who was spanked as a child, I can tell you that connotation meant nothing to me.

I was being hit. Period.

 

Then you were not being treated fairly and with love. Not being mean, I hate to hear this sort of thing. Really, there is a huge difference.

 

I experienced both.... and there was a difference. Today, I resent several situations that were done in rage/anger and were NOT really forms of discipline. I understand completely the ones that were discipline. They were totally different methods with totally different results.

[emmsmama]

My kids are 10 and 6.5 and have never been spanked. They also are very well-behaved and respectful kids. My son is active and can try my patience sometimes, but he is a pleasure to be around 99% of the time (and I can't say that for a lot of kids, including ones who have been spanked). In general, if you give respect then you get it. If you treat a child with respect then they will still follow your rules even if you don't spank.

 

Imo many people spank a) because they can't control their own anger; b) they don't know any better strategies to use (or don't want to be bothered to use them); or c) they think God says they should (I won't even comment on that one. I don't think spanking is the most vile or awful thing on the planet, but I do think it is disrespectful toward kids (ie. Because I'm bigger than you I can hit you to get you to comply with me) and isn't a good form of discipline. It is a good form of punishment maybe if that is what you are aiming for, wanting your child to listen to you at all costs and show them who's boss - but it is not a good form of discipline, which teaches a child to have self-control and hopefully should be your ultimate goal.

 

Often if you sit back and look at a child's negative behaviour (or perceived negative behaviour because I really don't think a baby trying to touch something interesting is bad behaviour just because that something is your prized china piece that you absolutely feel the need to leave out on your table) you can find the root of their actions and rectify that, which often goes farther toward resolving problems than a swat on the bum. My son might have a meltdown in the grocery store because he is tired and hungry and a hug will go a lot farther to get him to calm down than a smack on the bottom will. My dd might be talking sassy to me because she just came back from a friend's house where her friend talks like that, so I will tell her it is unacceptable and disrepsectful to talk like that so stop and she will because I try to treat her with respect and so she gives it back to me.

 

One thing I say to my son that works very well is, "Good choice or bad choice?" Often kids can figure out for themselves what the right choice is. I don't tolerate misbehaviour, but my goal in parenting is to raise loving kids with respect for others and self-control and I don't need to spank to do that.

[LoveBaby]

My loving Father God does not cause me physical pain to help me learn obedience."If God's kindness leads His children to repentance, why do people think the opposite will work on their own children?"

 

Our loving Father God does not cause me pain, but my diobedience against his laws and commandments most certainly does. God didn't *cause* the pain, but He does allow it. It is a natural consequence of disobedience to His laws. Just as my child, when disobeying my "commandments", would feel the pain of his disobedience. Whether the pain felt be being removed from an activity, forfeiting priveleges or in some cases being spanked.

 

All that said, I don't spank very often, because I was raised in a "let them get away with it until it bugs you then let 'em have it" sort of house and I desperatly don't want that repeated in mine.

[Pamela H in Texas]

WOW, I came back and instead of 4 pages, there are SEVENTEEN! I'll just keep adding to one post.

 

I don't spank, and have four well-mannered children who get compliments on their behavior every time we leave the house. I am very firm, and we have rules, but I enforce those rules without hurting them.

 

My experience with parents has shown me that people who have clear rules, enforce them, and are firm don't find it necessary to punish much at all. The less people do the foundational discipline (teaching/guiding), the more they feel compelled to punish.

 

I've had plenty of people tell me that they wonder if I'm TOO strict. I have HIGH standards and expectations. I also expect compliance. I believe in the relationships the Bible sets forth (authority, submission, etc). I just don't think punishment or other harsh methods are necessary to reach these goals. Instead, we use strong discipline (teaching/guidance).

 

I really believe the majority of parents can learn to discipline effectively enough to drop almost all punishment (yelling, spanking, time out, taking items punitively, early bedtimes, tobasco/soap on tongues, etc).

 

I think it is disingenuous to say hitting and spanking are the same thing.

 

I've heard this argument for many many years. However, the places I've lived, even spankers call it hitting. I can't imagine claiming otherwise because a lot of people in Texas (and Louisiana) know that spankers hit their children. They offer to hit them just as often as to spank, whip, swat, pop, etc. JME. I use the words interchangeably unless the context requires a certain level of hit be described (1-2 swats vs a 10 strike whipping, for example).

Edited July 2, 2009 by 2J5M9K

[Orthodox6]

I just went back and edited my original post. I was wrong -- in the environment of a mixed-religion message board, although not wrong in the environment of my faith group -- to mention the Bible. I shall try harder to refrain from this in future.

 

I'm also disappointed that some venomous remarks about the subject of spanking appeared later on. What I had read previously was "OK" with letting people voice their own opinions.

[Ginevra]

I would like to offer a public thanks to my parents for every single time they spanked me. My father believes in the belt and you can be sure it left a mark.

 

I was spanked for:

lying; rudeness; poor grades; violating the rules of the household; hurting my younger siblings; doing anything that was dishonorable and laziness.

 

I'm glad you don't hold it against them, but frankly, this makes me want to vomit. No one should ever be hit with a belt, IMO.

 

And I was spanked, too. But it's definitely nothing I would thank my parents for, although I can appreciate that they were trying to do the right thing.

 

And honestly, it is so silly to constantly go through the "so-and-so was spanked and he's great"/"so-and-so was never spanked and she's awful". I've known an awful kid or two who was never spanked and a few who were constantly spanked. It's not about the spanking! But if you can do a great job without spanking, why wouldn't you? If you can model someone who doesn't spank, but whose kids seem to be pretty nice, why wouldn't you?

[Blessedfamily]

I just went back and edited my original post. I was wrong -- in the environment of a mixed-religion message board, although not wrong in the environment of my faith group -- to mention the Bible. I shall try harder to refrain from this in future.

 

....

 

I didn't see your unedited post, but mentioning the Bible as a source of guidance is allowed. :001_smile:

[pqr]

I'm glad you don't hold it against them, but frankly, this makes me want to vomit. No one should ever be hit with a belt, IMO.

 

 

 

 

Why would I hold it against them for making me what I am? I am comfortable with who I am but know that without the strong hand of my parents I would have been someone else and somebody who I would not want to be.

 

My Father ensured that I worked at school, he ensured that I did not lie, cheat or behave in what he (and I) deemed a dishonorable manner. Had it not been for him, his love, his guidance and yes the occasional application of the belt I would have been a lesser man.

 

I needed the odd spanking, I am adult enough to know this, I am also strong enough not to "want to vomit" at something as inconsequential as corporal punishment, when deserved.

 

It is not silly to "go through the 'so-and-so was spanked and he's great'/'so-and-so was never spanked and she's awful." If I had not been spanked I would have been that bad kid we talk about. I was willful, aggressive and intelligent. I understood the love of my parents and I did know what was right, but there was always that little devil sitting on my shoulder and sometimes it was the realization (not fear) of the consequences of a potential action to my posterior that was the final decision maker.

[HRAAB]

It is not silly to "go through the 'so-and-so was spanked and he's great'/'so-and-so was never spanked and she's awful." If I had not been spanked I would have been that bad kid we talk about. I was willful, aggressive and intelligent. I understood the love of my parents and I did know what was right, but there was always that little devil sitting on my shoulder and sometimes it was the realization (not fear) of the consequences of a potential action to my posterior that was the final decision maker.

 

If you're correct, I find that a sad statement about humanity: that children need to be struck to become decent adults.

 

Janet

[pqr]

If you're correct, I find that a sad statement about humanity: that children need to be struck to become decent adults.

 

Janet

 

In my case, I can say, unequivocally, that I am correct. I needed love, direction, guidance, conversation everything that my parents gave me. Nevertheless I also needed the occasional spanking. I can admit this freely and without reservation.

 

Spanking is simply a form of discipline, but in some cases it is extremely effective. This is not a “sad statement about humanityâ€, it is just a fact and there is nothing wrong with it. Why some have been so conditioned to shudder at the thought of spanking is actually odd. No one advocates abuse, but spanking….why not?

[SonshineLearner]

:iagree:

*race undisclosed* for what reason?

 

 

I guess cuz I get a big smile on my face when I think of this guy. What he said, and how he said it was just "the love of a Dad" and I can still picture him in my mind. He was just a good guy. And, he said it was his culture, or something to that effect.

 

I miss "The South" sometimes! I really miss parts of it. I could use some Sweet Tea right now!

 

Carrie:-)

[SonshineLearner]

If you're correct, I find that a sad statement about humanity: that children need to be struck to become decent adults.

 

Janet

 

Hey Janet:-)

 

I actually propose the idea that some Adults could use a good caning. I watched, I think in Singapore??...where a r*pist was talking about being caned. He said every time he thought of r*ping a woman that his entire body felt pain. That may make our society safer....

 

Oh well, just thinking...

 

Carrie

[lionfamily1999]

We need a smily with duct tape over his mouth, or else one that is biting their tongue.

 

:X

[LibraryLover]

We haven't ever made it a part of our parenting toolbox, if you will let me use such a tired phrase. My dh was never struck as a child, (I was) and he was admamant that we not. I never saw it do any good in my family, so I was grateful. 4 kids, 20 years, no spanking. (Great temptation to do so, and a couple of rough grabs of the arm, which always made me sick to my stomach afterwards, so it's been years since even that has happened).

[Jorsay]

Hey Janet:-)

 

I actually propose the idea that some Adults could use a good caning. I watched, I think in Singapore??...where a r*pist was talking about being caned. He said every time he thought of r*ping a woman that his entire body felt pain. That may make our society safer....

 

Oh well, just thinking...

 

Carrie

:iagree:

[BillieBoy]

Other topics you could search before posting new threads:

 

-- Is there anyone here who doesn't have a college degree?

 

I guarantee, your eyes would be opened to the rich diversity of opinions on this board. It's amazing how much backwardness continues to thrive out here in Flat-Earthland.

 

I started a thread (my first) this morning asking if parent age and education really matter, and in fact I believe it does not. I truly hope you are not inferring that I did so because I wanted to know who doesn't have a college degree. Your tone sounds as if us "newbies" bother you, or at least we are too stupid to figure out how to do a search. I was trying to belong to a community and "broaden my backwardness" since I must live in "Flat-Earthland". Thanks for the warm welcome.

[lionfamily1999]

I started a thread (my first) this morning asking if parent age and education really matter, and in fact I believe it does not. I truly hope you are not inferring that I did so because I wanted to know who doesn't have a college degree. Your tone sounds as if us "newbies" bother you, or at least we are too stupid to figure out how to do a search. I was trying to belong to a community and "broaden my backwardness" since I must live in "Flat-Earthland". Thanks for the warm welcome.

Before I read your post, I thought it was another one of those. It's not, you're fresh :)

 

Sometimes, though, and you'll understand this in about two weeks, tops, the same things keep getting brought up over and over and over and over and over and over and over....... and if it happens to be a topic people are passionate about (do you need a degree, do you spank) then people feel compelled to answer and sometimes it just gets tiring to put the same comments up and argue the same arguments over and over and over and over and over..... and yes, you don't have to comment, but sometimes you feel like you do, iykwIm.

 

I am SURE it was not meant as a bash to you :)

[SonshineLearner]

I started a thread (my first) this morning asking if parent age and education really matter, and in fact I believe it does not. I truly hope you are not inferring that I did so because I wanted to know who doesn't have a college degree. Your tone sounds as if us "newbies" bother you, or at least we are too stupid to figure out how to do a search. I was trying to belong to a community and "broaden my backwardness" since I must live in "Flat-Earthland". Thanks for the warm welcome.

 

The NHERI site has quite a few statistics about such things. Interesting for just about anyone:-) http://www.nheri.org/

 

And, I don't think that anyone's smackin' on newbies:-) She was just commenting:-) For real, Welcome!!:D

[BillieBoy]

Before I read your post, I thought it was another one of those. It's not, you're fresh :)

 

Sometimes, though, and you'll understand this in about two weeks, tops, the same things keep getting brought up over and over and over and over and over and over and over....... and if it happens to be a topic people are passionate about (do you need a degree, do you spank) then people feel compelled to answer and sometimes it just gets tiring to put the same comments up and argue the same arguments over and over and over and over and over..... and yes, you don't have to comment, but sometimes you feel like you do, iykwIm.

 

I am SURE it was not meant as a bash to you :)

 

Thank you lionfamily1999, you are kind. I'm sure I was being over sensitive. It's scary jumping in here with two feet. :blushing:

[Ester Maria]

I was never hit by either of my parents. I consider myself to have been a well-behaved child and a good student nonetheless. I never hit either.

 

An example is worth a thousand words. If you teach your children, in theory, about some virtues - being calm, respectful, thought-out, etc - and then they see that the moment things go bad or unplanned in practice you suddenly change your attitude and go against all you taught them, that is what they will learn.

Hitting out of anger or disappointment is not a reaction of a calm person, is not an act of respect towards another person (even if that person is your child - especially if that person is your child), is not a thought-out behavior, is not a sign of good manners, but rather an impulsive act and - in my opinion - pretty barbaric reaction.

 

The only situations in which I justify it is when it is "medically" needed - the cases of severe shock or hysteria, fainting, etc, but even then we talk of a single hit, given to provoke shock rather than physical pain, not a beating of any kind. Some extreme toddler tantrums can fall under the "hysteria" category, and I don't consider a parent a monster if they hit their child in such a state, as long as they did it calmly, not out of frustration with an accompanying scene/yelling/etc - but for the vast majority of other cases, I find hitting unjustified and more a method for a parent to unwind than anything else. Which I strongly disagree with.

 

But a beating - actually beating, as in, repeatedly hitting a child with a foreign object with an intention to cause actual, physical pain - I do consider that an abuse. If you have to resort to that, I believe that something, somewhere, went terribly wrong between you and your child.

[lionfamily1999]

Thank you lionfamily1999, you are kind. I'm sure I was being over sensitive. It's scary jumping in here with two feet. :blushing:

I still close my eyes when I click 'submit reply,' no worries :)

 

(and you can call me Julie)

[cin]

I'll start my kids' therapist fund now for having a mom who spanked them.

 

Some people have college funds, we have therapy funds.

:smilielol5::smilielol5::smilielol5:

[lionfamily1999]

Some people have college funds, we have therapy funds.

:smilielol5::smilielol5::smilielol5:

You people and your funds...

 

That's why I'm teaching my kids, so they can afford their OWN funds :lol:

[Tree House Academy]

Oh honey...if all my kids go to therapy for is the spanking, then we did GOOD!

[lionfamily1999]

My thought is, if they can afford to go to therapy, then I've done well.

[HRAAB]

In my case, I can say, unequivocally, that I am correct. I needed love, direction, guidance, conversation everything that my parents gave me. Nevertheless I also needed the occasional spanking. I can admit this freely and without reservation.

 

Spanking is simply a form of discipline, but in some cases it is extremely effective. This is not a “sad statement about humanityâ€, it is just a fact and there is nothing wrong with it. Why some have been so conditioned to shudder at the thought of spanking is actually odd. No one advocates abuse, but spanking….why not?

 

So there was absolutely nothing else, nada, under the sun that your parents could have done except use corporal punishment that would have resulted in a moral, upstanding adult?

 

I still find it sad that you believe that humans have to be physically struck and inflicted with pain to grow into moral adults; that there is no other way for some children. I have no example in my life that proves this to be true. In fact, I know personally a couple very hard headed, willful children that were not spanked and grew into pleasant, law abiding citizens. So although it can obviously work, it is not the only way.

 

Putting that all aside - since we will never agree - I'm pleased to see the honor and respect you give your parents. I feel the same way about mine. I try to remember to give thanks for the wonderful, moral, hardworking parents I had. They had high standards, and we lived up to those standards. Without ever receiving a spanking.

 

Oh well, these threads are really dead ends. I won't change, you won't change. It's all okay.

 

Janet

[SquirrellyMama]

Oh honey...if all my kids go to therapy for is the spanking, then we did GOOD!

 

It's my reply for anything people think I'm doing wrong as a parent.

 

I read somewhere that we can only blame our parents for 20% of our problems so I'm of course only saving up 20% of their therapy :001_smile:

[Amy loves Bud]

.

[Free Indeed]

Given all the drivel, and yes it is just that, about not spanking as it is impossible to teach a child not to hit by hitting him and such....

 

I would like to offer a public thanks to my parents for every single time they spanked me. My father believes in the belt and you can be sure it left a mark.

 

I was spanked for:

lying; rudeness; poor grades; violating the rules of the household; hurting my younger siblings; doing anything that was dishonorable and laziness.

 

I learned many of life's lessons through this and no matter how much it hurt I never felt that it was done unfairly. Following the punishment I was always given a hug and reminded that I was loved. This was not a trite expression but a genuine demonstration, from my Father, that I was loved and that he meant it.

 

My father never told me "this is going to hurt me more than you," but even at a young age I could tell that it hurt him to spank.

 

It seems to me that a lot of today's children could do with a spanking once in a while, some of them more than once in a while.

 

 

Spanking promotes a true understanding of the world. It demonstrates that there are consequences for actions and that they can be painful.

 

I only think back to my childhood, once we moved to the States. In PS I ran into many boys whose parents would never spank them (and yes if you must know we lived in the "North" so they were all enlightened "Northerners"). Indeed I frequently heard the snide comment from these children about how if their parents ever spanked they "would sue them."

 

I was a little younger than the other boys in my class and subject to a high degree of bullying. My main tormentor was one of these boys whose parents would not spank. Despite being talked to about his behavior (by his parents) he continued.

 

Given some posters opinions, one might wonder where he learned such behavior. Surely a boy that was never spanked and was raised by those who (how did you put it Gingersmom? Oh yes...) "always thought spanking was a thing of the past" and who "live in the North" where they "do things different," would not turn to violence in his interaction with others. Surely it is only children whose parents have demonstrated that violence begets violence who would do that.

 

Anyway, I digress....Had his parents spanked him for his behavior (bullying), it might have stopped as the application of pain is a great behavioral modifier. Eventually, in a fight, I badly broke his nose and it was this application of pain that led him to leave me alone. I blame his parents and their "enlightened" view for the tyrant that their child became.

 

I know far far more children who were ruined by refusal of their parents to spank than were ever hurt by excessive punishment.

 

This is not to say that spanking is a must, but when properly done it does work.

 

This reminds me of the old Andy Griffith Show where the new boy came to town and was a menace. Opie just stared wide eyed at the things he got away with. Then there was a light that came on in the dad, and Andy directed him out back to the woodshed. I love that episode. :D

[lionfamily1999]

So there was absolutely nothing else, nada, under the sun that your parents could have done except use corporal punishment that would have resulted in a moral, upstanding adult?

 

I still find it sad that you believe that humans have to be physically struck and inflicted with pain to grow into moral adults; that there is no other way for some children. I have no example in my life that proves this to be true. In fact, I know personally a couple very hard headed, willful children that were not spanked and grew into pleasant, law abiding citizens. So although it can obviously work, it is not the only way.

 

Putting that all aside - since we will never agree - I'm pleased to see the honor and respect you give your parents. I feel the same way about mine. I try to remember to give thanks for the wonderful, moral, hardworking parents I had. They had high standards, and we lived up to those standards. Without ever receiving a spanking.

 

Oh well, these threads are really dead ends. I won't change, you won't change. It's all okay.

 

Janet

Do you mean to come across as high mighty?

 

I'm curious, because what I've just read, in your post, is a bash on someone's parents. Oh, your parents were nice, but my parents were great people. Was that the intent?

[SquirrellyMama]

No, your loving Father God caused his own son excruciating pain and agony to take away OUR sins...not those of his only son. If you believe, for one second, that there is no pain for our sins, then you are severely mistaken. It may not be physical pain...but often times, I would rather it be! God does punish for wrongs. He gave humans the ability to know right from wrong, to feel guilt, pleasure, and pain. You bet we feel pain and are punished when we sin. I would much rather God smack me on the bottom than teach me something like patience through example, to be honest...

 

:iagree::iagree:

[Amy loves Bud]

No, your loving Father God caused his own son excruciating pain and agony to take away OUR sins...not those of his only son. If you believe, for one second, that there is no pain for our sins, then you are severely mistaken. It may not be physical pain...but often times, I would rather it be! God does punish for wrongs. He gave humans the ability to know right from wrong, to feel guilt, pleasure, and pain. You bet we feel pain and are punished when we sin. I would much rather God smack me on the bottom than teach me something like patience through example, to be honest...

 

I don't believe we are punished by God for our sins when we have the saving grace of Jesus Christ in our lives. Yes, we suffer consequences of our actions (ie, we punish ourselves through our disobedience)but God does not punish us. If he did, then what would be the point of the death of Christ? Is Christ's death not sufficient to cover our sins?

[SonshineLearner]

I don't believe we are punished by God for our sins when we have the saving grace of Jesus Christ in our lives. Yes, we suffer consequences of our actions (ie, we punish ourselves through our disobedience)but God does not punish us. If he did, then what would be the point of the death of Christ? Is Christ's death not sufficient to cover our sins?

 

Isn't that because we won't suffer the eternal wrath of God, by being separated eternally from him? It covers our sins, so that we won't have to perish, but it doesn't mean that God won't allow a smack to us...to give us the desire to walk on the "right" path.

 

God says that you know He loves you when He's disciplining you as a son. (paraphrase)

[Haiku]

 

I brought her up AP-style, and have never had an issue with crying, tantrums, and her being purposely bad.

 

Spoken as the mother of only one child. :) I remember when my two youngest kids and my (only child) nephew were playing a card game (they were 5, 4, and 4) at the time. I walked past and casually asked, "Who's winning?" My sister jumped up and said, in a very syrupy voice, "It doesn't matter who wins, what matters is having fun." I said the same thing to her: "Spoken as the mother of only one child." Ask ANY kid who's a sibling: they'll tell you that it does indeed matter who wins. :)

 

I remember when I had only one child and thought that what I did would determine what she did.

 

I have three kids, none of whom are biologically related. All kids are different, and I can assure you that "AP-style" is not the magic bullet.

 

Tara

[Amy loves Bud]

I don't believe that discipline and punishment are the same thing in this sense. As in, I will discipline you because I love you and want to draw you near to me vs. I will punish you because you must pay the price for your disobedient actions.

 

I'm no theologian, and probably in over my head here :lol:, but this is my simplistic understanding.

[MamaT]

I haven't read all the replies, but yes we spank. Not our first go-to for an offense, but for outright disobedience, defiance, etc.

 

My dh and I were both spanked. We haven't needed therapy for it yet.

[Jorsay]

So there was absolutely nothing else, nada, under the sun that your parents could have done except use corporal punishment that would have resulted in a moral, upstanding adult?

 

I still find it sad that you believe that humans have to be physically struck and inflicted with pain to grow into moral adults; that there is no other way for some children. I have no example in my life that proves this to be true. In fact, I know personally a couple very hard headed, willful children that were not spanked and grew into pleasant, law abiding citizens. So although it can obviously work, it is not the only way.

 

Putting that all aside - since we will never agree - I'm pleased to see the honor and respect you give your parents. I feel the same way about mine. I try to remember to give thanks for the wonderful, moral, hardworking parents I had. They had high standards, and we lived up to those standards. Without ever receiving a spanking.

 

Oh well, these threads are really dead ends. I won't change, you won't change. It's all okay.

 

Janet

 

Your first question assumes that there is something wrong with spanky. I honestly feel that it is good for them. I am glad that I was spanked. I learned from it. I learned about discipline, physical pain, emotions, and all kinds of other things. The first (and only) time I was yanked out of my car and shoved around by a couple of policeman, it wasn't a complete shock. I understood that sometimes life is physical. I was able to deal with it by staying calm and without fighting back. Had I never been physically punished, perhaps I would not have handled it so well.

 

Spanking is a good thing. Spanking has important lessons. I do not say that you have to spank your child to be a good parent, but I believe that it is good for your child.

 

BTW: The cops profiled me as a drug dealer. Incorrectly of course.

[Tree House Academy]

I don't believe we are punished by God for our sins when we have the saving grace of Jesus Christ in our lives. Yes, we suffer consequences of our actions (ie, we punish ourselves through our disobedience)but God does not punish us. If he did, then what would be the point of the death of Christ? Is Christ's death not sufficient to cover our sins?

 

So you think God actually crucified his only son - watched him bleed and die on the cross, heard his cries "forgive them Father, for they know not what they do" - and that was it. That means we just have a freebie now to sin all we want as long as Jesus did the dying? I absolutely, 100% disagree with you.

 

I believe that all sins will be punished by God. If I go out and have an affair, I may divorce my husband, marry the other man, but is my marriage going to be happy? Going to be easy? Am I going to live without guilt? Can I really walk into the house of God with my head held high? No! I can't. I can't because God, my Father, loves me and wants me to do what is right. He is not going to disown me or send me to Hell for this sin (because my faith in Jesus Christ saved me from this), but he is going to lay burden on my heart. Because I love Him and want to please Him, my hell will be a silent hell that I live inside myself each day. God would forgive me, but I wouldn't. And that is where I believe we are punished for our sins. You seem to separate God and us - as if my guilt and feelings could exist without Him. He made me - every part of me. Just as He can ease the grief of a widow and give her peace that passes all understanding, He can allow me to suffer grief for my wrongs.

 

As parents, I think that we all strive to make sure our children feel sorrow for their wrongs (so they will correct them and learn from them). God is no different when he punishes us. And like I said before, sometimes I would really rather God give me a whack on the bottom than to punish me from the inside out.

 

FYI - the example above is just an example. No, I am not cheating on my dh or running off to marry someone else. LOL

Edited July 2, 2009 by Tree House Academy