I think I'm gonna faint...I found something extraordinary

[iwka]

Classical Liberal Arts Academy

 

Before you click off and say: it's religious (Catholic), just look around and read.

For the beginning scroll and pick from here:

http://www.classicalliberalarts.com/resources/index.htm

 

If you have seen it or enrolled your kids in any classes, please let me know, what you think...

[Blueridge]

Wow, thank you! I bookmarked that for later reading!

[Melissa B]

My kids attend and I love the program, as do they. My eldest daughter has been in the program for about three months. It has been a wonderful addition to our homeschool program and completely changed my plans for the kids' future schooling. I only have great things to say about it.

 

 

Having said that, it IS religous and it IS Catholic. Mr. Michael's focus is on providing a Catholic classical education. I think it would be difficult for those of other religions to enjoy this program. Mr. Michael is very good about answering emails if you have any questions and there has been some discussion of this program on the Latin centered yahoo group run by Andrew Campbell (Plaid Dad.)

[iwka]

My kids attend and I love the program, as do they. My eldest daughter has been in the program for about three months. It has been a wonderful addition to our homeschool program and completely changed my plans for the kids' future schooling. I only have great things to say about it.

 

 

Having said that, it IS religous and it IS Catholic. Mr. Michael's focus is on providing a Catholic classical education. I think it would be difficult for those of other religions to enjoy this program. Mr. Michael is very good about answering emails if you have any questions and there has been some discussion of this program on the Latin centered yahoo group run by Andrew Campbell (Plaid Dad.)

 

How did CLAA change your plans for your kid's future studies?

[Vida Winter]

Thank you so much for this site!

[Melissa B]

I had never imagined that my kids could have the level of Latin and Greek that they will have before even entering high school. My older two daughters have been plodding along with me the last couple of years and we have made moderate progress. But I really didn't know what I was doing to a great degree - especially in Greek. It is very different having someone who knows what he is doing setting up a course of study and being available to answer any questions - often within the hour. Dd11's Latin has surpassed my own already, as it should have a couple of years ago.

 

I am very excited about the kids being able to discuss philosophy and theology (especially Aristotle) with someone other than myself. I love to read and study myself, but I do not have the level of education I wish I did. I also really like having a group of kids online that are working through the same subjects with them that they can also discuss with. Mr. Michael and his wife have been working hard to not only set up the curriculum, but to set up a children's forum and family forum and even a competition forum for children that would like to display what they have learned. They are working toward an online academic (and religious) community for the students. We have never had like-minded homeschoolers around us and I think this is an area that was lacking in our studies. The kids didn't have anyone to share all of their studies with.

 

Finally, I have moved my focus more toward Latin and Greek. It has always been our goal to help the children become truth seekers as opposed to obtainers of information. We come from an extended family of philosophers at heart. I just haven't been able to figure out how to make that happen in our homeschool. I had not planned to reach philosophy at the level CLAA is teaching during our high school years. I also have not found any online program that teaches languages to the level they can now reach. Most latin programs would not even accept students below 7th grade, except for a "fun" introductory Latin program and very few teach Greek at all. Not knowing what the end results would be with me trying to teach them Latin and Greek, I didn't want to put too much time into that area. I feel much more confident in their overall schooling now that I have the opportunity to pass the Latin, Greek, Logic, Rhetoric, Philosophy and Theology portions (and maybe even math!) into more capable hands. It leaves me to focus on History, Literature, English, French, athletics and fine arts. All areas in which I have much more confidence in my ability to provide an excellent education. I have very high hopes for this program. So far, it has exceeded my expectations!

[sagira]

Wow, really interesting. Affordable too. Thanks.

[SueinNC]

Another thank you for this site. It looks very promising. :)

[LG Gone Wild]

I am so excited. I would be more excited if I hadn't just spent a bundle on books.

[KatieO]

This program looks wonderful. Do you know what grade levels the courses are suitable for?

[cathmom]

Families are being set free from the unrealistic expectations of home schooling and are experiencing the trickle-down effect that the CLAA has in all areas of family life.

 

This is from the section "Who We Are." What does he consider the unrealistic expectations of homeschooling, do you know?

[MomOfOneFunOne]

It looks so exciting . . . and yet so boring. The idea is great but when I view the sample lessons, they just look really dry. Maybe it's just the first of each subject that's boring? I'd like to hear about that from someone in the know!

[cathmom]

The tone is a little...harsh.

[iwka]

This program looks wonderful. Do you know what grade levels the courses are suitable for?

 

I signed up for their family forum and also send some questions to the founder of this program (both on the left side bar on their web site). I've got my answers within two or three hours (or maybe sooner). It seems to me that they have just started last fall and they are very helpful with customizing their courses to specific family needs. It is rather stage then grade specific.

 

They also offer a program for the parents and educators, called "Praeceptor program" and dr Andrew Campbell, author of "The Latin centered curriculum" signed up for it:

I've been working through the Praeceptor program and am finding it challenging and inspiring. It's a perfect way for homeschooling parents to learn about the foundations of classical education and how to apply them today.

 

[iwka]

This is from the section "Who We Are." What does he consider the unrealistic expectations of homeschooling, do you know?

 

As far as I understand (after just two days of sitting and reading their "stuff"), they are trying to simplify yet enrich every course they offer, and make it as independent as possible for the students, so it's not parent heavy in teaching.

[Melissa B]

This program looks wonderful. Do you know what grade levels the courses are suitable for?

 

The Petty School that will open for registration in the fall is a kindergarten or pre-CLAA program. There are children as young as five in the regular CLAA classes. That said, my dd11 is finding the level one grammar and vocabulary classes to be challenging and my dd9 is going to wait for fall to take those two classes because I really don't think she is ready.

[Melissa B]

It looks so exciting . . . and yet so boring. The idea is great but when I view the sample lessons, they just look really dry. Maybe it's just the first of each subject that's boring? I'd like to hear about that from someone in the know!

 

Nope, all of the lessons are just like the samples. :D

 

This is a very traditional, memory-focused program. There are no bells or whistles of any kind.

 

My kids have not found the lessons boring (but they also like Saxon K-3.) The lessons are very intense. There is a great deal of information to commit to memory. In Grammar I the child is able to recite John 1:1-10 from memory in both English and Latin and write it from memory in both English and Latin by the end of lesson 6. Lesson 7 introduces all six Latin noun cases and all uses for a noun. It is too challenging to be boring. But the format never changes so it would be monotonous for some children.

[iwka]

It looks so exciting . . . and yet so boring. The idea is great but when I view the sample lessons, they just look really dry. Maybe it's just the first of each subject that's boring? I'd like to hear about that from someone in the know!

 

What I have seen so far, it is a completely different set up from anything else out there. They are really focused on helping kids to think logically from early on (which is a popular thing to say around classically minded educators), but they are aware that just reading great books later on and having some kind of discussion (Socratic is another popular word), is not going to make them great thinkers (and CLAA would be just another program out there). So the whole grammar stage is based on memorizing and learning the basics as tools for later use, when the minds will be expended and trained in rhetoric and logic.

 

I am learning a lot from that website, mostly about what classical education really is or should be.

[SueinNC]

The Petty School that will open for registration in the fall is a kindergarten or pre-CLAA program. There are children as young as five in the regular CLAA classes. That said, my dd11 is finding the level one grammar and vocabulary classes to be challenging and my dd9 is going to wait for fall to take those two classes because I really don't think she is ready.

 

How intense is the Geography class for your 9yo? My dd is only 8 1/2. I am in the processing of signing her up for Catechism I, Grammar I, Math,and the Vocab. I am wondering if I should hold off on the Vocab class too. I did read that each lesson must be completed to mastery before moving on to the next. How many lessons are there per course? And is there a time limit when the course "expires" ? How long (daily/weekly) does your 11 yo spend on each lesson?

Thanks :)

[Melissa B]

How intense is the Geography class for your 9yo? My dd is only 8 1/2. I am in the processing of signing her up for Catechism I, Grammar I, Math,and the Vocab. I am wondering if I should hold off on the Vocab class too. I did read that each lesson must be completed to mastery before moving on to the next. How many lessons are there per course? And is there a time limit when the course "expires" ? How long (daily/weekly) does your 11 yo spend on each lesson?

Thanks :)

 

Arithmetic is not yet available. I believe it will open for enrollment late in the summer. I do not think the geography lessons are nearly as intense as the grammar/vocabulary. It is my dd11's favorite class. My dd9 does fine in that class as well.

There is no time limit on how long a class takes to complete. I do not know how many lessons are in each class, but an approximate would be a year's worth of material - maybe 30 lessons? The school has not even "officially" opened yet. The first real school year will be this fall. So, many of the classes are being tested (and some even written) as they go this year. I believe Mr. Michael is going to try and have a S&S for each class before the end of the summer.

Every lesson must be passed with 100% accuracy. I think vocabulary is the most difficult class, but it is also a very rewarding class. It covers quite a bit of ground with each lesson.

My dd11 spends approximately 1.5-2 hours daily on grammar/vocabulary, 30 minutes per day (3x weekly) on geography and 15-20 minutes daily on catechism.

[katilac]

It looks so exciting . . . and yet so boring. The idea is great but when I view the sample lessons, they just look really dry. Maybe it's just the first of each subject that's boring? I'd like to hear about that from someone in the know!

 

I can't seem to find the sample lessons??

 

Edited to add: Okay, it looks like only certain courses have sample lessons, that's why I wasn't seeing them.

Edited May 21, 2009 by katilac

[SueinNC]

Arithmetic is not yet available. I believe it will open for enrollment late in the summer. I do not think the geography lessons are nearly as intense as the grammar/vocabulary. It is my dd11's favorite class. My dd9 does fine in that class as well.

There is no time limit on how long a class takes to complete. I do not know how many lessons are in each class, but an approximate would be a year's worth of material - maybe 30 lessons? The school has not even "officially" opened yet. The first real school year will be this fall. So, many of the classes are being tested (and some even written) as they go this year. I believe Mr. Michael is going to try and have a S&S for each class before the end of the summer.

Every lesson must be passed with 100% accuracy. I think vocabulary is the most difficult class, but it is also a very rewarding class. It covers quite a bit of ground with each lesson.

My dd11 spends approximately 1.5-2 hours daily on grammar/vocabulary, 30 minutes per day (3x weekly) on geography and 15-20 minutes daily on catechism.

 

 

 

Thanks Melissa,

Your schedule is very helpful. I had not realized that the math was not ready yet. I will switch to the Geography class.

[Melissa B]

Ok, while I like the rigor of this program their requirements for admission are hard to swallow. And make no mistake about their true intentions of wanting to promote their religious views. While they claim to admit non Christians and non Catholics they go so far as to say that anyone who doesn't embrace the Catholic doctrine is incapable of full fledged logical thinking. For example, read the section titled "Catholic Christian Culture" on the link below:

 

http://www.classicalliberalarts.com/admissions/requirements.htm

 

For me that screams BRING IT ON (I like a challenge). But honestly, it is insulting and obnoxious. I'm an atheist raised in a Catholic family. I do have some understanding of the faith, but it is precisely these attitudes that turn me off to any religion.

 

 

This is absolutely a Catholic program. The religious views are a focus of this program. So definitely, make no mistake about the intention of wanting to promote a specific religious view.

[iwka]

Ok, while I like the rigor of this program their requirements for admission are hard to swallow. And make no mistake about their true intentions of wanting to promote their religious views. While they claim to admit non Christians and non Catholics they go so far as to say that anyone who doesn't embrace the Catholic doctrine is incapable of full fledged logical thinking. For example, read the section titled "Catholic Christian Culture" on the link below:

 

http://www.classicalliberalarts.com/admissions/requirements.htm

 

For me that screams BRING IT ON (I like a challenge). But honestly, it is insulting and obnoxious. I'm an atheist raised in a Catholic family. I do have some understanding of the faith, but it is precisely these attitudes that turn me off to any religion.

 

I don't use this program (yet :001_smile:), but I understand that they want the best Catholic education possible for their kids and they find it in Classical Education that was the only existing Catholic education throughout centuries.

 

As far as pluralistic points of view being included in any Catholic institution, there is no place for such ideas. There is place for people who are searching and find useful things developed by Catholic church. It has nothing to do with ignorance or discrimination or pride, but with finding the truth and standing by it.

[camibami]

Maybe I am missing something, but where is the interactive/talking with others part of their programs you mentioned in the original post?

 

I can't find it!!

 

I am mulling over the vocab class for my oldest, though I have next years really boring Wordly Wise books already bought.

 

I have been looking at Angelicum's Great Books Discussions for my oldest, and possibly my youngest, for next year. The schedule will be a little wonky, as we'll be in Asia, but it should work. I think my oldest NEEDS that sort of interaction. We are also using their philosophy materials, but I would love, love, love to have an interactive class to discuss philosophy rather than just me and a kid. But I couldn't find philosophy on the site?

 

Their cathecism classes would send my kids into fits, but *I* learned the Baltimore Cathecism, so... that is a possibility. Memorizing is good brain work, I think.

 

The geography looks interesting, too. We did (don't laugh) Geography Songs last year, after using Trail Guide 2 previous years, and learned WAY more. Why? Simple, no bouncing around, straight memorizing. Heck, *I* learned more geography than ever with those songs!! So their program looks interesting, like Geography Songs but less cheesy, LOL.

 

Thanks for the link, this looks interesting!

[iwka]

Maybe I am missing something, but where is the interactive/talking with others part of their programs you mentioned in the original post?

 

I can't find it!!

 

I am mulling over the vocab class for my oldest, though I have next years really boring Wordly Wise books already bought.

 

I have been looking at Angelicum's Great Books Discussions for my oldest, and possibly my youngest, for next year. The schedule will be a little wonky, as we'll be in Asia, but it should work. I think my oldest NEEDS that sort of interaction. We are also using their philosophy materials, but I would love, love, love to have an interactive class to discuss philosophy rather than just me and a kid. But I couldn't find philosophy on the site?

 

Their cathecism classes would send my kids into fits, but *I* learned the Baltimore Cathecism, so... that is a possibility. Memorizing is good brain work, I think.

 

The geography looks interesting, too. We did (don't laugh) Geography Songs last year, after using Trail Guide 2 previous years, and learned WAY more. Why? Simple, no bouncing around, straight memorizing. Heck, *I* learned more geography than ever with those songs!! So their program looks interesting, like Geography Songs but less cheesy, LOL.

 

Thanks for the link, this looks interesting!

 

You might ask about everything on their forum:

http://groups.google.com/group/claafamilyforum?hl=en&pli=1

 

or this is the contact info:

http://www.classicalliberalarts.com/contact.htm

 

They have forum for the kids who are taking classes, and are going to open up a Stadium, where kids can engage in a healthy studious competition.

 

Also this article might be of an interest to you. It compares well known classical Catholic curriculums (Kolbe, MODG, RCA, Seton and Angelicum)

[LG Gone Wild]

I filled it out but I have serious doubts if we pass muster. LOL! I mean, how to prove I am really providing a culture to support liberal arts? I tried not beg,"I swear I'll do my best! Please let me in, pretty please?"

 

We shall see. At least I have the website for inspiration.

[clwcain]

I filled it out but I have serious doubts if we pass muster. LOL! I mean, how to prove I am really providing a culture to support liberal arts? I tried not beg,"I swear I'll do my best! Please let me in, pretty please?"

 

We shall see. At least I have the website for inspiration.

 

I wouldn't let that trouble you. If you take educating your children seriously (you obviously do) and you're working to move your family life to a culture supportive of the pursuit of Wisdom and Truth through Reason and Revelation (as all Christians should) you'll probably be fine.

 

It is my impression, as I work my way through the Praeceptor Training and watch my oldest work his way through the Catechism l course, that most of the questions are there to help the parents determine whether or not they're willing to work to support this.

 

Many people, as I'm sure you know, want to essentially "drop the kids off at the pool" and pick them up again in time for college admissions. I've found this attitude even among homeschoolers.

 

I can't speak for The CLAA or Mr. Michael, but from my own experience they understand the risk that the method of instruction (self-paced lessons distributed over the Internet) can present to the unwary parent.

 

Those of us who sign on must be willing to sign on completely and support our children in this completely. Tire kicking and half-@rsed attention will not produce the expected or desired results.

 

HTH

[LG Gone Wild]

Many people, as I'm sure you know, want to essentially "drop the kids off at the pool" and pick them up again in time for college admissions. I've found this attitude even among homeschoolers.

 

I can't speak for The CLAA or Mr. Michael, but from my own experience they understand the risk that the method of instruction (self-paced lessons distributed over the Internet) can present to the unwary parent.

 

Those of us who sign on must be willing to sign on completely and support our children in this completely. Tire kicking and half-@rsed attention will not produce the expected or desired results.

 

HTH

 

Thanks, clwcain. I have to say there are times I wish I could just drop my kid off at the pool but I know he needs my constant guidance and supervision. No wonder I am aging so fast.

 

I hope to get my ds doing Catechism I shortly. Perhaps through CLAA, I can move him to being more independent from me in certain areas so that I can focus on areas that he needs intensive tutoring for me AND I have energy left for my other children's needs.

[SueinNC]

I am not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but have you seen their World Chronology Chart? It is very impressive.

http://www.classicalliberalarts.com/courses/chronology/index.htm

 

At the top of the page, click on:

 

 

 

CLICK HERE TO PRINT THE

WORLD CHRONOLOGY CHART

 

 

[katilac]

It is my impression, as I work my way through the Praeceptor Training . . .

HTH

 

oooh, can you tell us a bit more about the praeceptor training? all details welcomed!

[Twinmom]

Hmm...this is pretty tempting! I'm close enough to even make it to their on-site classes in Charlotte! I've been looking for a way to help my kids work more independently next year with the twins joining us for the first time...this is a good option.

 

Thanks for the site...going off to do some reading now!

[iwka]

Those of us who sign on must be willing to sign on completely and support our children in this completely. Tire kicking and half-@rsed attention will not produce the expected or desired results.

HTH

 

So are your kids going to use exclusively CLAA as a curriculum until college?

Edited May 23, 2009 by iwka

[Tress]

Oh yes, please tell about the praeceptor training! Does it add to your understanding of Classical Ed, even if you have already read LCC en Climbing Parnassus? Does it improve your homeschooling? Please tell, it looks so interesting, but pricey..

[iwka]

 

It is my impression, as I work my way through the Praeceptor Training and watch my oldest work his way through the Catechism l course, that most of the questions are there to help the parents determine whether or not they're willing to work to support this.

 

HTH

 

So...how is that Praeceptor Training?

[clwcain]

Slowly, but only because I've let my day job and sloth interfere with my studies. :D

 

The initial component is a very general, but very thorough, overview of the origin of what we'd acknowledge to be the Seven Liberal Arts along with Philosophy and Theology.

 

I would recommend the training for any of you who are curious as to what the CLAA is about in terms of origin, method, and goals.

 

It is not a program to mix with other programs. It is an complete, integrated approach to real education, as William Michael attempts to make clear in various essays he's written that are available on the website.

 

Our oldest is now enrolled and we are very happy with the results.

 

HTH

[Audrey]

Many people, as I'm sure you know, want to essentially "drop the kids off at the pool" and pick them up again in time for college admissions. I've found this attitude even among homeschoolers.

 

 

Oh boy! I just can't let that go by without saying how much I completely agree!! In fact that is one of my biggest peeves.

 

But back to the topic at hand: Classical Liberal Arts gets discussed frequently on the Latin Centred Curriculum yahoo group. If anyone wants some input, thoughts and discussion on CLA that is, perhaps, somewhat impartial, that would be a good place to look.

[iwka]

is here

[4wildberrys]

I know this thread is older, but after reading the Requirements for Admission, it sounds more like Cult Training than academic training!! Can anyone say: Stuck Up and Egotistical?! This Mr. Michael sounds like he wants to mold any student in 'his' program to the values and habits of his own family instead of letting each family be who they are while using his program. This alone should be a warning:

 

"Families must also commit to cultivating a spirit of sobriety and maturity among their children, rather than allowing the perpetual childishness that ruins American children. The Catholic Church teaches that the age of reason is normally around 7 years old--not 18, not 22. Children are considered morally accountable by the age of their first confession and this should be taken seriously. There is no excuse for inordinate play, entertainment, idleness, etc.. "Youth is the time for extraordinary toil." said the philosopher Plato--who knew a thing or two about true classical education. "

 

We ARE Catholic, but I would never do this to my children! This program sounds set up to create large ego's if followed according to this philosophy! I don't like the Holier and Smarter Than the General Population Tone one bit! There is just something that smacks "Really Wrong" with this program :001_huh: I found this thread trying to find reviews on Angelicum Academy---which certainly has a MUCH different tone than this one....shudder....

[iwka]

I don't like the Holier and Smarter Than the General Population Tone one bit!

 

General Population is what is the problem. There was an interesting article today here about how US education came to the point of today's mess.

 

As for Angelicum...never used it, but I doubt that they teach Grammar, Dialectic, Rhetoric and Logic in a classical way. Classcial Grammar is an enrichment course there, and it should be included in Trivium. "Discussion" about "Great Books" without Dialectic is just that...a discussion leading into forming opinions, not searching for the truth.

[Laura Corin]

Ok, while I like the rigor of this program their requirements for admission are hard to swallow.

 

This is on discipline:

Those who oppose such traditional views of parental discipline (and there are some) should realize that even the laws of the United States leave to parents and guardians the right to chastise their children. To hold an opinion, then, that contradicts not only explicit directions of biblical wisdom literature, but also our own civil laws (which represent the mind of the majority of men) is to hold an opinion that should be questioned carefully.

 

The fact that United States law allows children to be hit by their parents does not mean that refraining from hitting a child 'contradicts... our civil laws,' nor does this law necessarily represent 'the mind of the majority of men' - lawmaking often precedes or lags public opinion.

 

Laura

[4wildberrys]

General Population is what is the problem. There was an interesting article today here about how US education came to the point of today's mess.

 

As for Angelicum...never used it, but I doubt that they teach Grammar, Dialectic, Rhetoric and Logic in a classical way. Classcial Grammar is an enrichment course there, and it should be included in Trivium. "Discussion" about "Great Books" without Dialectic is just that...a discussion leading into forming opinions, not searching for the truth.

 

That article is great! There was a time when Ivy League meant something important---no longer in my book.

 

But I still can't stand the tone from LCAA---they take Classical to the extreme snobby end---at least that's the way it sounds on the website. And True Classical certainly isn't the only method of educating to avoid being part of that "General Population"----but apparently Mr. Michael has other thoughts on that. :glare: I find the tone strange especially for such a 'pious' missionary family at that. :confused:

[elizabeth]

That article is great! There was a time when Ivy League meant something important---no longer in my book.

 

But I still can't stand the tone from LCAA---they take Classical to the extreme snobby end---at least that's the way it sounds on the website. And True Classical certainly isn't the only method of educating to avoid being part of that "General Population"----but apparently Mr. Michael has other thoughts on that. :glare: I find the tone strange especially for such a 'pious' missionary family at that. :confused:

Not surprising as there has been a resurgence of ultra conservative catholic voices prompted in no small part by a focus on anything but grace. I find his tone as grating as that of other strident voices who purport to speak for God.

[iwka]

4wildberries,

 

I would encourage you to sign up for the CLAA forum and then form your opinion. I am not American and for me "the tone" is nothing more or less that I would expect about a program of this kind. I think that people are naive to the point that they easily criticize negatively something that rocks their comfort zones but do not check the ideas, methodology and goals for programs that are claiming and are ready to prove that what they say they can back up with historical findings.

 

Get beyond what SEEMS offensive to your mind, and try to have a fresh look. :-)

[catalinakel]

Ok, while I like the rigor of this program their requirements for admission are hard to swallow. And make no mistake about their true intentions of wanting to promote their religious views. While they claim to admit non Christians and non Catholics they go so far as to say that anyone who doesn't embrace the Catholic doctrine is incapable of full fledged logical thinking. For example, read the section titled "Catholic Christian Culture" on the link below:

 

http://www.classicalliberalarts.com/admissions/requirements.htm

 

For me that screams BRING IT ON (I like a challenge). But honestly, it is insulting and obnoxious. I'm an atheist raised in a Catholic family. I do have some understanding of the faith, but it is precisely these attitudes that turn me off to any religion.

 

We looked into this school also, excited to know that such a school exists. However, in reading through much of the website and their requirements, I realized that, as reformed protestants, there is NO WAY our doctrinal beliefs would be supported or respected, let alone accepted as valid. And there is NO WAY I would give up what I believe, or lie about it, in order for my kids to study with this school. I cannot. I will not. Here I stand, I can do no more. With all due respect.....

[HRAAB]

Not surprising as there has been a resurgence of ultra conservative catholic voices prompted in no small part by a focus on anything but grace. I find his tone as grating as that of other strident voices who purport to speak for God.

 

Just saying :iagree:so you won't be alone.

[4wildberrys]

4wildberries,

 

I would encourage you to sign up for the CLAA forum and then form your opinion. I am not American and for me "the tone" is nothing more or less that I would expect about a program of this kind. I think that people are naive to the point that they easily criticize negatively something that rocks their comfort zones but do not check the ideas, methodology and goals for programs that are claiming and are ready to prove that what they say they can back up with historical findings.

 

Get beyond what SEEMS offensive to your mind, and try to have a fresh look. :-)

 

 

I get what you are saying---really ;) But I am American, and this tone doesn't sit well with me----and so I can't bring myself to do any more reading/research about this particular program. Where are you ----in a general geographic sense :D----that this tone sounds like normal, charitable Catholicism to you? Classical sounds awesome---don't get me wrong. But the whole tone of THIS particular Classical program sounds like an attempt to create some sort of New Classical Master/Monster Race or something---ew. :tongue_smilie: As an American and most importantly a Catholic Christian---I simply cannot look down on my fellow Americans in this manner-------even if they studied Accounting and not Aristotle.....

[iwka]

I get what you are saying---really ;) But I am American, and this tone doesn't sit well with me----and so I can't bring myself to do any more reading/research about this particular program. Where are you ----in a general geographic sense :D----that this tone sounds like normal, charitable Catholicism to you? Classical sounds awesome---don't get me wrong. But the whole tone of THIS particular Classical program sounds like an attempt to create some sort of New Classical Master/Monster Race or something---ew. :tongue_smilie: As an American and most importantly a Catholic Christian---I simply cannot look down on my fellow Americans in this manner-------even if they studied Accounting and not Aristotle.....

 

I am from Poland. Can you give me details of what offends or bothers you?

[4wildberrys]

I am from Poland. Can you give me details of what offends or bothers you?

 

I guess what is bothering me is that I am sensing that Mr. Michael is Pre Vatican II Ultraconservative? The critical, negative light that is shed on American families---just the 'tone' he takes with comments like this:

 

 

4. Simplify Your Life

You wouldn't have piles of laundry if you had a daily routine and stuck to it. Your children wouldn't need ten outfits and they wouldn't be randomly changed (and thrown into the hamper or on the floor) throughout the day. You wouldn't have piles of dishes and hours of food preparation if you simplified your diet. The hectic housewife is a product of her family's inordinate tastes and impractical schedule. You can simplify.

5. Serve the Poor

Most American families are idle and invent problems for themselves. Scripture tells us, "You who have two tunics (shirts) give to him who has none, and you who have food do likewise." One of the causes of impiety and unhappiness is selfishness. Get out of your house and go help the poor, the elderly, etc.. They need clothing, food and help. You have it all.

2. Family Chapel

You cannot meditate and pray in the middle of the kitchen. There needs to be a sacred (set apart for the Lord) space in the home where you can go for quiet prayer, read a devotional book, meditate before a crucifix, etc. Rather than devoting a room to the television or to extra beds, devote it prayer and worship. You have room.

 

Nothing wrong with these ideas---but YOU HAVE ROOM? Really? MOST American families are idle and invent problems for themselves??? Really? If life is hectic it is because of my family's inordinate tastes and impracticle schedule??? Could this be any more ridiculous and offensive?

 

And I can say that I know of no Catholic Churches, so far, that use the 'Original" 1885 Baltimore Catechism in its sole entirety. I think it's because of things like teaching our kids that even 'attending' a wedding in a Protestant church is a mortal sin and even if it was a child---the family should excommunicate them? Sorry---this is NOT Christian thinking. I won't teach my kids bigotry and uncharitable behavior like this. Ever. And our Parish Priest agrees.

 

So I guess this is the tone I am picking up from this site---an old-fashioned sort of bigoted attitude about being Catholic and somehow 'we' are better than the rest of humankind. Well, especially with a True Classical Education under our belts. I do believe that this type of attitude is what fueled HUNDREDS of years of bloodbath wars throughout Europe. I'll take a more American Melting Pot kind, charitable, loving Christian attitude over this any day. ;)

[Supertechmom]

Did you have to buy any textbooks for Grammar 1? I didn't see that in the quick look through. SOrry if it is there somewhere and I just didn't look deep enough.

Thanks