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Omicron anecdata?

Not_a_Number

By Not_a_Number,
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kbutton

kbutton

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, mommyoffive said:

Oh thanks.  I checked and they don't have under 12 around me yet.  Booo.  But another place that is around that I can keep checking.  Thanks so much.  Asking the ped. today about it.

They are usually staffed by nurse practitioners, so whether they offer it or not might have to do with whether the particular practitioner staffing an individual clinic can do younger kids. There are a lot of different certifications for NPs. 

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Spryte

Spryte

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Has anyone here done an antibody test post-infection?

We are trying to determine if we had a recent round of Covid in the house, despite negative rapid tests. Working on figuring out the timing of our next vaccines, and also concerned about some odd bloodwork that has come back for one household member, that looks like post-Covid stuff.

DH volunteered as tribute, errrr, to get the bloodwork, and came back with high antibodies. (Positive would be above 0.8, his was in the 700 range.) his last vaccine was a year ago, so we did not expect a high result. Would that type of number be indicative of recent infection? 

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mommyoffive

mommyoffive

Posted
Posted (edited)

https://peoplescdc.substack.com/p/peoples-cdc-august-31-2024-covid?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=1004289&post_id=148475708&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=q2z70&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email

 

The Bridge Access Program, which was slated to end this month, is reportedly not covering the updated vaccines for uninsured and underinsured adults, and out of pocket costs are estimated to be around $200.

Edited by mommyoffive
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KSera

KSera

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, mommyoffive said:

Sigh.  The ped. did not have the shot at all.  Not even for 12 and up.  Really?? They said they won't get it until October!

Oh and nobody at the doctor's office was masked.  

Do you live in a state with Rite Aid? I’ve been seeing some people getting pediatric shots there this week. 

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mommyoffive

mommyoffive

Posted
Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, KSera said:

Do you live in a state with Rite Aid? I’ve been seeing some people getting pediatric shots there this week. 

Sigh, no.  I just was though.  I wish I would have known.    This is so frustrating. 

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Amoret

Amoret

Posted
Posted (edited)

As COVID Surges, the High Price of Viral Denial

“The subject of how to respond to a slow burn pandemic remains taboo because most public health officials have already declared the emergency over. They’ve also stopped collecting critical data. COVID-19 deaths in Canada are not reported in a readily publicly accessible fashion. And most of the media pretends that an immune-destabilizing virus that can harm the functioning of your organs including your brain has little more import than a benign cold. As a consequence, authorities can’t now turn around and admit to the breadth of their mistake, let alone acknowledge the growing disorder in public health. Nor do they dare collect critical data documenting the scale of their errors including the relentless march of long COVID…. Here, then, is where we’ve arrived. We’ve entered a vicious cycle where more infections generate more COVID variants. The new variants have become more immune evasive. At the same time society has generally abandoned masks, testing and basic public health messages. We could slow and suppress the cycle by facing the challenge squarely. For example, by cleaning dirty air the way we once tackled the disease-ridden spectre of cholera-infested water. But public health officials are afraid to talk about clean air let alone the obvious: avoiding infection. Beating back COVID requires hard work, communal wisdom and clear policies that markedly reduce the level of infection in society. To date we have chosen viral denial, dirty air and a triumphant reign for long COVID.”

Edited by Amoret
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Corraleno

Corraleno

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Posted

I've been reading about the newest (and "most contagious yet") subvariant that some think will be the next big thing, XEC, and it seems to be a recombination of KS11 and KP33, so it is more closely related to KP2 than JN1, and it apparently differs "substantially" from XBB, which is what the booster was last year. So the two take-aways from that for me are (1) it's really important to get the updated shot this year, and (2) it seems like the mRNA shots are going to be a better match. Dang, I was really hoping for Novavax, I'm not looking forward to the side effects of another mRNA shot. 😞 

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KSera

KSera

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On 9/4/2024 at 7:09 AM, mommyoffive said:

https://insidemedicine.substack.com/p/voices-us-surgeon-general-on-vaping?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=1183526&post_id=148452456&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=q2z70&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email

Still really frustrated by this common statement:

Quote


“Certainly when I'm in a clinical setting where mask is recommended, I will certainly do that if I'm around people who are immunocompromised, I will certainly mask.”

 

How can very smart people responsible for public health make statements like this? How do they think they are able to identify who is immunocompromised? Why do they think these conditions are so rare that they wouldn’t be encountering people with them in every location they ever find themselves? Immunocompromised people find themselves continuously surrounded by people without masks, I’m sure many of whom would say they “will mask around immunocompromised people“.  

On 9/4/2024 at 7:14 AM, mommyoffive said:

https://caitlinrivers.substack.com/p/where-are-we-with-the-hygiene-hypothesis-e25?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=1017072&post_id=148283331&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=q2z70&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email

This was an excellent coverage of where we are on the hygiene hypothesis. Thanks for sharing it.

Quote

The thing about rhinoviruses is that after recovering, you're not protected from the next infection. There is no real immune protection there. Most of us suffer from colds throughout our whole life. So that's kind of a unique case. Like I said, bacterial exposure is what's key to priming the immune response. Not so much viral, most of the viral illnesses are not positive. 

 

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kbutton

kbutton

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, mommyoffive said:

https://erictopol.substack.com/p/joseph-allen-the-pivotal-importance?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=587835&post_id=148504668&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=q2z70&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email

I am only partway through this, but it’s fantastic so far. @wathe might especially appreciate it as she monitors air quality around her.

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Faith-manor

Faith-manor

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, Corraleno said:

Dang, I was really hoping for Novavax, I'm not looking forward to the side effects of another mRNA shot. 😞

I guess it is time for me to pick my 3 days of abject misery for the shot. I am a ridiculous reactor and my arm gets a huge knot, and is on fire for days. But the alternative is worse. I just have to get myself geared up for it, and can't until I get mother in law through a series of diagnostics of her knee. N95. She will refuse, but I will be wearing one and driving with the window down.

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KSera

KSera

Posted
Posted
30 minutes ago, Amoret said:

Is It OK to Stop Worrying about COVID? Nearly five years on, it might be time to stop treating COVID as exceptional

🤬🤬

What a load of crap from someone supposedly responsible for public health. Complete abdication of responsibility. Even while acknowledging at least 7% (low ball estimate) of Americans already have long COVID at 4.5 years in, with a virus people will get over and over again if they “stop treating it as exceptional” with each infection increasing risk of  long COVID. What percentage of the population is acceptable before it matters? 20%? 50%? How many years before we hit 20%?  It’s crazy to be that unconcerned about such a profound risk. 

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kbutton

kbutton

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Amoret said:

Is It OK to Stop Worrying about COVID? Nearly five years on, it might be time to stop treating COVID as exceptional

Is it OK to Stop Pushing this Disingenuous Premise? Nearly five years on, it might be time to stop treating COVID as just another seasonal virus.

It’s super annoying that they are using the Olympics as a permission structure when athletes with Covid were collapsing after their races.

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KSera

KSera

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, kbutton said:

It’s super annoying that they are using the Olympics as a permission structure when athletes with Covid were collapsing after their races.

Totally! And there were multiple athletes that were unable to compete at all  because of a past Covid infection. 

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Ausmumof3

Ausmumof3

Posted
Posted
On 9/4/2024 at 4:43 AM, Spryte said:

Has anyone here done an antibody test post-infection?

We are trying to determine if we had a recent round of Covid in the house, despite negative rapid tests. Working on figuring out the timing of our next vaccines, and also concerned about some odd bloodwork that has come back for one household member, that looks like post-Covid stuff.

DH volunteered as tribute, errrr, to get the bloodwork, and came back with high antibodies. (Positive would be above 0.8, his was in the 700 range.) his last vaccine was a year ago, so we did not expect a high result. Would that type of number be indicative of recent infection? 

I’m interested to know what you work out. I’m still suspicious about DS recent cold because his endurance with school stuff and ability to think things through seems a bit diminished 😞 we did multiple RATs all negative though. It could just be pre puberty brain fog as he is 12 

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Spryte

Spryte

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

I’m interested to know what you work out. I’m still suspicious about DS recent cold because his endurance with school stuff and ability to think things through seems a bit diminished 😞 we did multiple RATs all negative though. It could just be pre puberty brain fog as he is 12 

It looks like we did indeed have Covid despite the many negative home tests.

My doc says she’s been seeing this. 

I think it’s possible for your DS to have had it, too.

Sigh. We are all dragging here, and needing multiple naps. My brain feels like mush, and the fatigue is real. It was very mild for all of us. DH was mostly asymptomatic, I had a few under the weather days, kids ran fevers, but nothing remarkable. It’s been 3-4 weeks and none of us are 100%.

DD has some test results that look like post-Covid, too, but we still have to follow up with specialists, just in case. We are both getting antibody tests tomorrow, among other things.

DH has a whirlwind trip overseas that’s packed with meetings next week — yikes. 

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Matryoshka

Matryoshka

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Posted
10 hours ago, Spryte said:

It looks like we did indeed have Covid despite the many negative home tests.

My doc says she’s been seeing this. 

I think it’s possible for your DS to have had it, too.

Sigh. We are all dragging here, and needing multiple naps. My brain feels like mush, and the fatigue is real. It was very mild for all of us. DH was mostly asymptomatic, I had a few under the weather days, kids ran fevers, but nothing remarkable. It’s been 3-4 weeks and none of us are 100%.

DD has some test results that look like post-Covid, too, but we still have to follow up with specialists, just in case. We are both getting antibody tests tomorrow, among other things.

DH has a whirlwind trip overseas that’s packed with meetings next week — yikes. 

They haven't updated the home test since the original strain. I don't think they're that accurate anymore. :mellow:

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Spryte

Spryte

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Posted
2 hours ago, Matryoshka said:

They haven't updated the home test since the original strain. I don't think they're that accurate anymore. :mellow:

That is a very good point.

We did have one person’s test have the faintest shadow of maybe where the line would be — but you could only see it on a photo, zoomed in, if you squinted and stuck your tongue out sideways. We retested next morning and it was negative.

It’s a shame we can’t rely on the at home tests right now. I wonder if they are still good at measuring whether one is contagious?

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kbutton

kbutton

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Posted
4 minutes ago, Spryte said:

It’s a shame we can’t rely on the at home tests right now. I wonder if they are still good at measuring whether one is contagious?

The Inside Medicine guy had some home anecdata about this, but I don’t know if it still holds. It’s not recent, but I would guess it wasn’t more than a year ago either.

I wonder if some brands are better with some strains. I’ve seen Binax bashed a lot lately, but when we’ve had definitive positives after some initial negatives, Binax was usually involved in the positive test.

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kbutton

kbutton

Posted
Posted
Just now, kbutton said:

The Inside Medicine guy had some home anecdata about this, but I don’t know if it still holds. It’s not recent, but I would guess it wasn’t more than a year ago either.

I wonder if some brands are better with some strains. I’ve seen Binax bashed a lot lately, but when we’ve had definitive positives after some initial negatives, Binax was usually involved in the positive test.

That’s not a lot of data though—four of us in the house and only one round of Covid two years ago. 

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Spryte

Spryte

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, kbutton said:

The Inside Medicine guy had some home anecdata about this, but I don’t know if it still holds. It’s not recent, but I would guess it wasn’t more than a year ago either.

I wonder if some brands are better with some strains. I’ve seen Binax bashed a lot lately, but when we’ve had definitive positives after some initial negatives, Binax was usually involved in the positive test.

Maybe. 

We used Binax, mostly, and also Indicaid because we scored a deal in those when we ordered our last batch of masks. The Binax was clearly negative, Indicaid was the maybe-if-you-squint-at-a-photo brand. I tended to trust the Binax more, for no particular reason. 

I know exactly where we picked it up, and have to say: it wasn’t worth it. Had it come from the 100 yr old’s bday party in June, it would feel like at least it was for a good cause! Kicking myself now, though, because we made a mistake and took an obvious risk. Ugh.

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Amoret

Amoret

Posted
Posted

What would an adequate COVID response look like?

"The problem is stark: we have unmitigated transmission of a deadly and disabling virus, in all public spaces, with zero plan to bring it under control.

We’re seeing millions of infections in each wave, and multiple waves a year; an unsustainable health burden on an already strained healthcare system.

We’ve got a student absence crisis, record worker sick days, rapidly rising disability, and the expulsion of high-risk people from public spaces.

And unfortunately, we have a public that is largely uneducated about and unaware of the problem, thanks to the tireless efforts of our political leaders and corporate media outlets who pushed for a “new normal” of forever COVID reinfections.

The first hurdle is making people aware of the problem. But beyond that, a second hurdle; often, once the risks of recurrent COVID infections are conveyed, the next objection is: but what can we do about it anyway? Surely you don’t want a permanent forever lockdown?

Well, I don’t. So what, in my wildest dreams, would competent public health bodies be doing to mitigate transmission of COVID, even years into a botched response with millions of people negatively polarized against collective measures?"

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KSera

KSera

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, Matryoshka said:

They haven't updated the home test since the original strain. I don't think they're that accurate anymore. :mellow:

My understanding (though I wonder myself if there is now something else at play as well) is that the tests aren’t working as well because of our own immune responses to the virus. Almost everyone has some kind of immune memory, whether from infection or vaccination or both, so the response is super quick once exposed. That means people start having symptoms while viral load is still very low — too low to show up on a test. Then the thought is that because of the immune memory, some people’s  bodies are them clearing it again so quickly that they never end up testing at a time that coincides with high enough viral load for a home test to detect it. OTOH, many people are still testing positive for 10-14 days and sometimes people with long COVID or impaired immune systems are testing positive for months in rapid tests. It seems like they’re still capable of picking it up when levels are high enough  I’d love to see the contagiousness correlation with positive rapid tests studies redone. But the fact that each variant is continuing to be even more contagious than the last makes it seem that people are still contagious just as much. Would love to find out the rapids are still reliable for pre event testing but they just don’t seem that way right now.

 

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kbutton

kbutton

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, KSera said:

Would love to find out the rapids are still reliable for pre event testing but they just don’t seem that way right now.

There has always been a high false negative rate though. I don’t mean to downplay a tool that people find more acceptable than masking, but we don’t hang out unmasked with people who offer to test so that we will unmask (though we absolutely thank them for their thoughtfulness!). When DH had Covid and was absolutely miserable, he kept testing negative! Finally he tested negative one AM and positive that evening. We were only testing that often so that he could get off work and get paid (and theoretically not be harassed to return to work early)—none of that applies at this point anymore at work; sick pay was totally only a Covid thing.

I feel like tests have always been used as a compromise for not masking, not as a true mitigation, but I do wish we knew if they were still a reliable gauge for contagiousness. That would be much more honest a way to use them, and it would convey that if you’re at an extended stay with someone, testing the minute they step unmasked off the plane is a snapshot, not a guarantee that they won’t infect you over the next week, and if they work as a snapshot of contagiousness, maybe we could find a way to eat with people inside once in a while. It’s a long, lonely winter with no picnicking! 

 

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Mom_to3

Mom_to3

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Posted

^one of the big failures is not improving testing. Considering how contagious this variant is, and how widespread covid is year-round, it would help immensely if people could test before a work/school/family event and be reasonably sure that they are not contagious at that time. Of course, I suspect that the higher-ups don't actually want us/the public to know, because then more people may choose or demand to stay home...

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kbutton

kbutton

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Posted
1 hour ago, mommyoffive said:

Sigh.  Asked at the pharmacy if they had the kids shots.  They thought they could do it then nope they couldn't.  They told me another pharmacy in a different town has them, called and nope.  I am so dang frustrated. 

This whole pandemic has made me happy that mine aren’t little anymore. I can’t imagine taking babies and toddlers who can’t mask anywhere. I still see some strollers at the children’s hospital covered with little plastic tents (sometimes even with parents not masked), but nothing in public. 

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mommyoffive

mommyoffive

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, kbutton said:

This whole pandemic has made me happy that mine aren’t little anymore. I can’t imagine taking babies and toddlers who can’t mask anywhere. I still see some strollers at the children’s hospital covered with little plastic tents (sometimes even with parents not masked), but nothing in public. 

I didn't have kids that young or baby during this.  I can't imagine how stressful that would be.  I have been stressed enough when the vaccines were only for a certain age group and half my family didn't have the vaccine.   That was hard.

But man we are almost 5 years into that.  5 years.  That is so long.  And I am still searching and searching for a vaccine for under 12.  I just feel like it shouldn't be this hard at this point.

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KSera

KSera

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Posted
7 hours ago, kbutton said:

There has always been a high false negative rate though. I don’t mean to downplay a tool that people find more acceptable than masking, but we don’t hang out unmasked with people who offer to test so that we will unmask (though we absolutely thank them for their thoughtfulness!). When DH had Covid and was absolutely miserable, he kept testing negative! Finally he tested negative one AM and positive that evening.

 

We don’t either, but we did have a few occasions in past years where we did use them as a snapshot that way—everyone testing right before thanksgiving dinner so that family could have dinner together. I counted it as a gauge of contagiousness good for a few hours. Studies have indicated it’s a good proxy for contagiousness, except that it tends to remain positive for half a day or so longer than the virus being shed is actually replicable. Since shedding is higher in afternoon than morning, I’d guess your dh caught it right on the edge where viral load was just high enough to be positive in the afternoon but hadn’t been that morning. I no longer have any data to make me feel that I can count on the test being a measure of contagiousness, so we don’t do that anymore. There are a couple home molecular tests that I would trust though. Not quite PCR accuracy, but close. They’re just too expensive to be practical though. Technology is there so it really seems like in an ideal world they would make those tests with that kind of accuracy attainable  

 

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Corraleno

Corraleno

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, mommyoffive said:

But man we are almost 5 years into that.  5 years.  That is so long.  And I am still searching and searching for a vaccine for under 12.  I just feel like it shouldn't be this hard at this point.

Does the vaccine still come in multi-dose vials? Kids just get a smaller dose of exactly the same vaccine, I don't understand why doctors or pharmacists can't just pull a child-sized dose?  Even if it comes in individual adult-dose vials, why can't they split one adult-dose Moderna vial between 2 kids (kids get 25 mcg vs 50), or split a Pfizer dose between three kids (10mcg vs 30)? It just seems completely absurd that all these places have the exact same vaccine kids need sitting right there, but they can't just pull the correct dose from a vial like they did with millions of people at the beginning of the pandemic???

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BeachGal

BeachGal

Posted
Posted
On 8/31/2024 at 10:45 AM, mommyoffive said:

Anything else you are doing?

Ack. Sorry. I just saw your question.

Besides avoiding spaces, wearing masks, etc., another thing I do is follow Covid in wastewater and when it starts to rise, I take NAC, NOW brand, 600-1200 mg until the levels start to fall.

Another is making sure my omega-3 index is in an optimal range. Omega 3 fatty acids tend to be too low in Western diets which means cell and mitochondria membranes, which use structural lipids as building blocks, have to use omega 6 instead and that creates a wonky membrane. I think maintaining mitochondrial health is probably very important when treating Covid before and after. That's what red/near infrared light impacts -- mitochondria.

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mommyoffive

mommyoffive

Posted
Posted
On 9/6/2024 at 11:56 PM, Corraleno said:

Does the vaccine still come in multi-dose vials? Kids just get a smaller dose of exactly the same vaccine, I don't understand why doctors or pharmacists can't just pull a child-sized dose?  Even if it comes in individual adult-dose vials, why can't they split one adult-dose Moderna vial between 2 kids (kids get 25 mcg vs 50), or split a Pfizer dose between three kids (10mcg vs 30)? It just seems completely absurd that all these places have the exact same vaccine kids need sitting right there, but they can't just pull the correct dose from a vial like they did with millions of people at the beginning of the pandemic???

This I don't know.  But you raised a great point.  Maybe I will ask about that.  What you say makes amazing sense.  Is there some kind of reason they couldn't do that?   

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kbutton

kbutton

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, mommyoffive said:

This I don't know.  But you raised a great point.  Maybe I will ask about that.  What you say makes amazing sense.  Is there some kind of reason they couldn't do that?   

If it’s not multi-dose vials, they can also waste some before injecting.

Around here a lot of pharmacies won’t do vaccines for under 12, which is why we used the Little Clinic in Kroger for stuff when my kids were younger.

Did you try your local health department yet? (Sorry if you did and I missed it).

 

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mommyoffive

mommyoffive

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, kbutton said:

If it’s not multi-dose vials, they can also waste some before injecting.

Around here a lot of pharmacies won’t do vaccines for under 12, which is why we used the Little Clinic in Kroger for stuff when my kids were younger.

Did you try your local health department yet? (Sorry if you did and I missed it).

 

I tried Kroger and nope.  The pediatrician, nope. Walgreens, CVS, Costco, nope.  I think I tried a few others.  Walmart.  All these pharmacies do kid vaccines, so that isn't it.  I will look into the health department. I honestly didn't think it would be this hard

Are you saying that they could do the idea of splitting one adult dose into 2 kid ones?

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kbutton

kbutton

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, mommyoffive said:

I tried Kroger and nope.  The pediatrician, nope. Walgreens, CVS, Costco, nope.  I think I tried a few others.  Walmart.  All these pharmacies do kid vaccines, so that isn't it.  I will look into the health department. I honestly didn't think it would be this hard

Are you saying that they could do the idea of splitting one adult dose into 2 kid ones?

If it’s single dose prefilled shot, they probably would need to use one adult dose per kid but squirt some of the liquid out first before injecting each child. 

I have a kid who gets prefilled syringes for an occasional medication. We have to squirt out a small portion to get the precise dose because it’s slightly higher than what the doctor wants him to have (he’s thin, and it goes by weight).

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Mom_to3

Mom_to3

Posted
Posted (edited)

I would not ask a pharmacy to do this (don't they have to note lot numbers etc in their files?). Also questionable if insurance would reimburse the pharmacy. Have you tried small independent pharmacies? That's where we got lucky.

Edited by Mom_to3
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