VENT re: Training Barking OUT of a Dog UPDATED

[Familia]

Please discuss barking with me.  I have a reactive barker.  She is 1 and a half years old.  Barks at deer, odd sounds outside, and visitors. I find this so frustrating because we have such a well behaved dog otherwise.  If she goes to the vet, where she must be overwhelmed by smells/dogs, she miraculously doesn’t bark.  There, she can show off all of her manners.  They rave about her basic obedience (wait at doors, down on command, stay, etc) and says she is their best behaved client.  Inside, I am thinking, “You don’t understand, she is obedient, but not in control”  Twice a week, I take her to train at parks and parking lots.  She does best in busy places.  At the park, though, when quiet and there is a squirrel 40 feet away?  She turns into a barking mess!

Then, the visitors.  Our big, black ball of fluff barks at visitors out of (I guess) fear.  No lunging, no snarling, just stands there and barks.  Well, we don’t let her stand there, but, if we did nothing, that is what she would do.  

Usually, she is crated out of sight of arriving company, but can hear them.  We wait for her to calm, then take her out, past the company (only way out)  to potty outside, then back in to bark/sniff/calm after a minute or two or we re-crate.  Maybe the barking lasts longer.  It is loud and, therefore, a long, long minute or two!  Also, she may randomly bark at them again.  Especially children, who I know she sees as unfamiliar creatures.  If we put her back in the crate, she might whine or bark or quiet fairly quickly.  Then we will repeat this process in half hour or so.  This sounds so much better than it actually goes.  Not that smooth, not always begun in crate, not very pretty

We live so far out and have company so seldom, I just don’t know how to get past this.  People are so unhelpful.  I tell them to ‘Please ignore the dog’, but it becomes a HUGE event, and, as I said, people are so unhelpful.  They either look uncomfortable to have her barking in the background (open floor concept with no where else to put crate...although it is tucked around a corner), they give her attention that I told them not to, they give me advice in the moment like, “You need to teach her to understand ‘he’s a friend!’”, or they are put out about the fact that the dog is taking over our visit.  I don’t blame the latter, I also just want to visit with my company and not have the dog be the center of attention.  I love my dog, but I am not the type of person who has cute decorative signs up in the house that say, “If my dog makes you uncomfortable, I’d be happy to lock you in the other room”.

For basic obedience on leash, distance and household manners, we use a little of everything.  Clicker, remote collar, prong collar, treats, good old yelling, each of those has its place in her life.  She is a lazy, sweet dog, but when she decides to bark at something, I cannot regain control.  This makes me start the search for the perfect barking solution.  Oh, how many chapters & blog posts I have read and how many videos watched!!  All those problem-solving sources talk about easing her into company or noises.  Usually, they show the beginning (dog barking crazily) and the end (example of a well trained dog), but they leave out the messy middle part (the practice).  Some are ridiculous.  We still ROFL every time we remember the Dunbar guy saying to ‘invite different groups of 6 men over every week for beer, pizza, and a game on TV’.  I guess I do not know that many men haha!  And, we really are too far to ask people to just drop by to help train the dog.  Another example is Kikopup demonstrating acclimating the dog to noises by banging on the side of the washer/dryer with a fist.  Well, if dogs aren’t great generalizers, that certainly won’t help me when she hears a concrete truck driving by outside the house.

I guess I am looking for perfection...can I have permission to just allow her to bark, loose among the company and be ill mannered like other people’s dogs when we visit their homes?  Could this actually lead her to eventually accept them?  Does it always have to be a slow conditioning process??  

Edited September 20, 2019 by Familia
Title Edit

[ktgrok]

What you practice, you get better at. She is practicing barking, and getting good at it. Also, some dogs, the more they do it, the more worked up they get. Kind of like how if I let my 9 yr old daughter start to grump and fuss she will get more and more grumpy. if I stop her she can go back to having fun. So no, I wouldn't allow the barking. 

How did you correct other poor behavior? 

I'd try a Pet Corrector. It's just a can of compressed air, and you don't spray them with it, you just use it to make an unpleasant noise that tends to interrupt the barking. If you can get them to stop they can take a breath and notice that wow, the world isn't ending after all, and settle down. So that's my first idea. Other would be the remote collar or even a bark collar. I do NOT like the citronella ones (the smell lingers even after they stop barking - so they keep getting punished even though the behavior stopped - not good). But I have a feeling the pet corrector with good timing may be the way to go. 

And yes, have them ignore the dog. 

[TheReader]

Our dog is the same way. I'll be interested to see what people say. We thought we socialized him well when young, but turns out we got him used to the family we hung out with then but he absolutely is a terrified/reactor barker to all others. (even us, when we return home). 

No advice, 'cause....same. But watching this with interest. I had some minor success recently when I cussed at him, LOL!, something along the lines of "What in the ever-loving he(ck) is wrong with you? Hush!" and he actually sat, got quiet, and stayed there while I (gasp!) retrieved a package off the porch. Something in my demeanor must have been more "I'm not asking you, I'm telling you" or something. Now if I can manage to duplicate that......and again when there's a person on the other side of the door.....:sigh: 

Anyway, I'm rambling, and I've already said I have no clue how to fix this, so.....here's hoping someone knows something. Or we just make a pact to have annoying barking dogs and who cares. LOL! 

[JustEm]

I have an 11 year old beagle who sounds to bark under the same circumstances yours does.  The thing that works best for her is to put her in a gentle leader when guests are around or when out at a park.  In my house the gentle leader subdues her enough to keep her from barking at all and she eventually calms down enough for us to take it off at some point.  Out in public it works most of the time to keep her from barking.  She can certainly bark with it on but it is the way it subdues her that makes her not bark.  But if an animal gets close enough, like right next to her, she will start barking like crazy.  I just make sure I am hyper aware of my surroundings and move away from things coming towards her that may trigger her to bark.

[Familia]

59 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

. So no, I wouldn't allow the barking...

How did you correct other poor behavior? 

... Other would be the remote collar...

And yes, have them ignore the dog. 

I appreciate the reminder that what she practices, she repeats.  I just don’t want to work this hard ... yes, this is a whine!  I don’t know how to get over the hurdle of not enough visitors to make it stick.  I guess invite people over more.  I may be able to swing once/week.  Especially children.  It was more fun having other people’s children over when I had someone to offer them to play with (thinking other humans=). It is honestly a little bit of a pain to invite children when we are no longer the ‘fun house’, and they have little to do (except play with the dog, which they cannot do b/c, well, barking haha)

We ignored other behavior and redirected.  This is so hard, because the guests make it hard.  They.do.not.ignore.the.dog no matter how much I tell them ahead of time.  Then, orchestrating it like I try to do, in order to make it clear when they (the company) needs to do makes it so ‘about the dog’ that it makes visiting awkward.  I guess I would give up if I didn’t like occasional company so much.

I would ‘try’ the remote, but I save it for distance work and recall almost exclusively.  Low stim, she responds well and looks forward to be out in the woods with me.  But, the timing with company in front of me, not to mention their potential horror at the use, just makes this potentially great solution, probably unrealistic.

[ktgrok]

1 hour ago, Familia said:

I appreciate the reminder that what she practices, she repeats.  I just don’t want to work this hard ... yes, this is a whine!  I don’t know how to get over the hurdle of not enough visitors to make it stick.  I guess invite people over more.  I may be able to swing once/week.  Especially children.  It was more fun having other people’s children over when I had someone to offer them to play with (thinking other humans=). It is honestly a little bit of a pain to invite children when we are no longer the ‘fun house’, and they have little to do (except play with the dog, which they cannot do b/c, well, barking haha)

We ignored other behavior and redirected.  This is so hard, because the guests make it hard.  They.do.not.ignore.the.dog no matter how much I tell them ahead of time.  Then, orchestrating it like I try to do, in order to make it clear when they (the company) needs to do makes it so ‘about the dog’ that it makes visiting awkward.  I guess I would give up if I didn’t like occasional company so much.

I would ‘try’ the remote, but I save it for distance work and recall almost exclusively.  Low stim, she responds well and looks forward to be out in the woods with me.  But, the timing with company in front of me, not to mention their potential horror at the use, just makes this potentially great solution, probably unrealistic.

I get it. That's why Im saying try the pet corrector. It's not as upsetting to other humans, lol. And it really does seem to interrupt their attention in a way that other things don't. Once they stop then you can praise. If you do it right, it really probably won't be that hard. 

I'd invite people over and tell them ahead of time the point is to work on the dog's behavior. Offer them a glass of wine or cookies or whatever their currency is to do this. I'd even ask that they come in, you do the pet corrector, dog calms down, then they walk out the back door while dog is distracted and come right back in the front, ringing doorbell first, etc as if they are a new person. Do it a few times in a row, take a break and have wine/cookies/coffee/whatever and then do it three more times. If you put out a call for help from friends explaining the issue I bet you will get some volunteers. Maybe even some teens from a local homeschool group? (don't give them wine, lol!)

 

[Jean in Newcastle]

My Rottie mix is a barker.  I do a couple of things.  Outside, I just tell her "no bark" every single time.  She looks at me and I redirect her.  She doesn't bark much anymore. 

With visitors I would not give negative reinforcement.  Instead, I hand treats to our visitors (especially men who she reacts to more).  She has to sit quietly and then gets a treat.  I don't have to have visitors come every day if every time they come she has to sit quietly and get a treat.

She has had a bad habit of "policing" our neighborhood.  Every person going to their mailbox is at risk of being barked at.  I make her sit, heel etc.   Ie.  I keep her so busy obeying me with commands that she doesn't have time to police them.  She's getting better.

This weekend I took her to a local festival.  It was the best thing for her socialization.  She was very popular with kids and adults alike and got tons of chances to sit and to get treats.  What I noticed though is that if someone came at her from behind or even touched her back that she would freak out.  So I did a lot more coaching of the people in approaching her than I did coaching her (she knew that she had to sit quietly for the treat.)  She had only one slip when a toddler had a candy at her nose level with his hand held out a bit in front of him (hard to describe but he was just holding it and not actually offering it).   She thought that he was offering and took candy from a baby!  Oops!   

I have to admit that I am very thankful that she barks at people at the door.  I want her to alert me.  And I like that she sounds scary because I am here alone a lot and there are people casing houses etc.  But if I actually go to the door to open it (after checking to see that I know who it is through a window), she's put in a sit- stay and has to sit quietly because her job is done. 

ETA:  Juliet is 18 months and I still consider it very much my job to be training her still. 

 

Edited September 10, 2019 by Jean in Newcastle

[klmama]

My dog is an exuberant 3yo, and we're still training.  She discovered her bark this last year.  Sometimes, it's great, because we do want her to sound scary to someone on the porch (lots of break-ins here start with ringing the doorbell), but barking at people walking their dogs by the house at 6 a.m. or barking in the night to tell us she's bored and wants company are definitely not acceptable!  I've found that putting a hand around her muzzle and holding it firmly for a few seconds gets her to stop.  

[Farrar]

My friend with dogs who have bad company behavior have the spray bottle on the porch. We know to pick it up as we ring the bell. They don't even need to be sprayed. They just need to see that we were entrusted with it or something. Though I don't know if spraying with water is considered a no-no now. I'm not a dog person.

[73349]

I don't have a dog but I remember a family that trained their dogs that when the front door is opened, you have to go get a pillow or stuffed toy and bring it to whoever is invited in, and sit down with it and look at the person. (You can't bark with a pillow in your mouth.)

[Terabith]

Reminds me of this story I read:  

The neighbours have been complaining that my dogs had been barking non-stop. I hate the electric zapping bark collars so I purchased a humane citronella collar. When a dog barks, it shoots a blast of citronella under their nose and apparently they don't like it.
This morning I was getting the collar ready and filled it with the citronella liquid. And that's where my morning should have ended. But no, it's me, and I begin to become curious as to “how” the collars actually work.
So I'm standing by my back door "barking" at my dog's collar. Nothing happens. I make sure it's turned on, check the fill level, and go through the "getting started" check list one more time. Again, I bark. Nothing happens. Now I'm not quite sure, why I had this next thought, but I did...I put the collar on. I seriously extended the band and fit the growl box against my throat and barked. Apparently, the collar only works if it feels vibrations, because I immediately received a blast of citronella to the face.
I began coughing, which only caused the darned collar to continue squirting bug spray over and over into my nasal cavity. I'm now on my hands and knees in my back yard, trying to breathe, and to make matters worse, the stupid dog is barking. So between coughing and yelling at him to shut up, I've emptied over a dozen blasts of citronella to my face. During all of this ruckus, I'm trying to undo the clasp of the collar, which has somehow managed to weld shut during this whole fiasco.
I finally get the collar off and threw, yes I threw that inhumane thing across the yard, and lay in the grass sucking in the cool morning air. In the middle of thinking this is probably the dumbest thing I've done in a while, I hear laughter. MY NEIGHBOR SAW THE WHOLE THING! He was laughing so damn hard he couldn't breathe. Between gasps, he tells me, "I was gonna come help, but every time I started to climb over the fence, you'd set it off again and then I would started laughing and couldn't make it." So now, not only are my eyes red, but my face and ears are too. After checking to make sure I was ok, we parted ways and I went in to shower so I wouldn't smell like ode de' Tiki Torch.
Lesson learned: next time (yes, there will always be a next time with me) make sure that:
1. Don't fill the collar before trying to set it off. 
2. Remember your neighbor is not a good source of help in a comedy crisis situation.
On the plus side, I won't have a mosquito problem for a few days!

Edited September 10, 2019 by Terabith

[Familia]

13 minutes ago, Terabith said:

Reminds me of this story I read:  

The neighbours have been ...

Thanks for the laughter (and tears=)!  I had just read a review on Amazon for the Pet Corrector spray, and I thought that lady’s story was funny - yours wins!!

[Pawz4me]

17 minutes ago, Terabith said:

Reminds me of this story I read:  

The neighbours have been complaining that my dogs had been barking non-stop. I hate the electric zapping bark collars so I purchased a humane citronella collar. When a dog barks, it shoots a blast of citronella under their nose and apparently they don't like it.
This morning I was getting the collar ready and filled it with the citronella liquid. And that's where my morning should have ended. But no, it's me, and I begin to become curious as to “how” the collars actually work.
So I'm standing by my back door "barking" at my dog's collar. Nothing happens. I make sure it's turned on, check the fill level, and go through the "getting started" check list one more time. Again, I bark. Nothing happens. Now I'm not quite sure, why I had this next thought, but I did...I put the collar on. I seriously extended the band and fit the growl box against my throat and barked. Apparently, the collar only works if it feels vibrations, because I immediately received a blast of citronella to the face.
I began coughing, which only caused the darned collar to continue squirting bug spray over and over into my nasal cavity. I'm now on my hands and knees in my back yard, trying to breathe, and to make matters worse, the stupid dog is barking. So between coughing and yelling at him to shut up, I've emptied over a dozen blasts of citronella to my face. During all of this ruckus, I'm trying to undo the clasp of the collar, which has somehow managed to weld shut during this whole fiasco.
I finally get the collar off and threw, yes I threw that inhumane thing across the yard, and lay in the grass sucking in the cool morning air. In the middle of thinking this is probably the dumbest thing I've done in a while, I hear laughter. MY NEIGHBOR SAW THE WHOLE THING! He was laughing so damn hard he couldn't breathe. Between gasps, he tells me, "I was gonna come help, but every time I started to climb over the fence, you'd set it off again and then I would started laughing and couldn't make it." So now, not only are my eyes red, but my face and ears are too. After checking to make sure I was ok, we parted ways and I went in to shower so I wouldn't smell like ode de' Tiki Torch.
Lesson learned: next time (yes, there will always be a next time with me) make sure that:
1. Don't fill the collar before trying to set it off. 
2. Remember your neighbor is not a good source of help in a comedy crisis situation.
On the plus side, I won't have a mosquito problem for a few days!

Funny story (kind of), but the better lesson to be learned from it is to never even think about using a citronella collar. They are terribly, incredibly inhumane.

I've had a reactive barker in the past. It's a hard thing to live with and a hard thing to train a dog out of. We were occasionally in a situation where I had to make sure the barking was minimized, so I gritted my teeth and used a bark collar. I got a very good quality one (TriTronics). And . . . I was amazed at how well it worked. Yes, the first time the dog barked was painful--I think it hurt me more than him (it was set on the lowest level). But the really amazing thing was that it had a very calming effect on him. After he learned (and he learned quickly), then putting that collar on was almost like giving him a sedative. He seemed almost relieved to have it on--it was like the collar meant he was off duty and could relax. That was a really unexpected benefit!

Another thing you might try around the house is a Thunder Shirt. For some dogs it has that same subduing effect that @hjffkj mentioned about the Gentle Leader.

[ktgrok]

1 hour ago, Pawz4me said:

Funny story (kind of), but the better lesson to be learned from it is to never even think about using a citronella collar. They are terribly, incredibly inhumane.

I've had a reactive barker in the past. It's a hard thing to live with and a hard thing to train a dog out of. We were occasionally in a situation where I had to make sure the barking was minimized, so I gritted my teeth and used a bark collar. I got a very good quality one (TriTronics). And . . . I was amazed at how well it worked. Yes, the first time the dog barked was painful--I think it hurt me more than him (it was set on the lowest level). But the really amazing thing was that it had a very calming effect on him. After he learned (and he learned quickly), then putting that collar on was almost like giving him a sedative. He seemed almost relieved to have it on--it was like the collar meant he was off duty and could relax. That was a really unexpected benefit!

Another thing you might try around the house is a Thunder Shirt. For some dogs it has that same subduing effect that @hjffkj mentioned about the Gentle Leader.

I think it works that way because if they keep barking they work themselves up more and more. If you interrupt it before they really get going they don't get that flood of adrenaline. And yes, he may now think that if he's wearing it he doesn't have to "patrol" and that's relaxing. 

[Familia]

I agree @Pawz4me    that collar, as illustrated in that story, sounds awful!

Today was an adult visitor, not the children I am expecting later in the week.  When my friend arrived, the dog barked like mad, so we sat in the adjoining living room.  She calmed to a whimper, but, since that wasn’t letting up, I feel for the ‘she must have to go’ routine.  Straight out past visitor, on leash, sniffing toward her.  We went out, then right back to crate.  Of course, she didn’t really have to go!  But, this time, silence in crate!  After a few minutes, I released her, put her on leash and kept in another room, within eyesight of friend, but 20 feet away, giving treats for simple ‘sit’ ‘stand’ commands.  All was good and quiet.  So, I let her off leash, took the treats to my friend, and attended to lunch setting.  The dog did wonderfully!  Sniffed my friend all over, but no bark.  After a minute the dog laid down and took a nap at friend’s feet.  I think the heat helped.  And, my friend being a woman.  I’ll let you know how the children go (ages 2-14).

And, @Ktgrok I ordered the Pet Corrector.  Sounds perfect for the barking out the window routine.  I also need to train family to stop yelling  ‘Enough!’  

Edited September 10, 2019 by Familia

[ThisIsTheDay]

On 9/10/2019 at 1:40 PM, Terabith said:

Reminds me of this story I read:  

The neighbours have been complaining that my dogs had been barking non-stop. I hate the electric zapping bark collars so I purchased a humane citronella collar. When a dog barks, it shoots a blast of citronella under their nose and apparently they don't like it.
This morning I was getting the collar ready and filled it with the citronella liquid. And that's where my morning should have ended. But no, it's me, and I begin to become curious as to “how” the collars actually work.
So I'm standing by my back door "barking" at my dog's collar. Nothing happens. I make sure it's turned on, check the fill level, and go through the "getting started" check list one more time. Again, I bark. Nothing happens. Now I'm not quite sure, why I had this next thought, but I did...I put the collar on. I seriously extended the band and fit the growl box against my throat and barked. Apparently, the collar only works if it feels vibrations, because I immediately received a blast of citronella to the face.
I began coughing, which only caused the darned collar to continue squirting bug spray over and over into my nasal cavity. I'm now on my hands and knees in my back yard, trying to breathe, and to make matters worse, the stupid dog is barking. So between coughing and yelling at him to shut up, I've emptied over a dozen blasts of citronella to my face. During all of this ruckus, I'm trying to undo the clasp of the collar, which has somehow managed to weld shut during this whole fiasco.
I finally get the collar off and threw, yes I threw that inhumane thing across the yard, and lay in the grass sucking in the cool morning air. In the middle of thinking this is probably the dumbest thing I've done in a while, I hear laughter. MY NEIGHBOR SAW THE WHOLE THING! He was laughing so damn hard he couldn't breathe. Between gasps, he tells me, "I was gonna come help, but every time I started to climb over the fence, you'd set it off again and then I would started laughing and couldn't make it." So now, not only are my eyes red, but my face and ears are too. After checking to make sure I was ok, we parted ways and I went in to shower so I wouldn't smell like ode de' Tiki Torch.
Lesson learned: next time (yes, there will always be a next time with me) make sure that:
1. Don't fill the collar before trying to set it off. 
2. Remember your neighbor is not a good source of help in a comedy crisis situation.
On the plus side, I won't have a mosquito problem for a few days!

 

I am laughing! (Okay, I'm crying!)

Actually, your citronella collar idea is helpful. My always-before well behaved 11 year old dog has begun running outside barking. I'm not sure what she's looking for, squirrels, deer, or anything? And it's at night. She only goes out for a few minutes, but I about die each time she takes off running and barking.

After your post, I have absolutely NO plans to test it!

Edited September 15, 2019 by ThisIsTheDay

[ktgrok]

6 hours ago, ThisIsTheDay said:

 

I am laughing! (Okay, I'm crying!)

Actually, your citronella collar idea is helpful. My always-before well behaved 11 year old dog has begun running outside barking. I'm not sure what she's looking for, squirrels, deer, or anything? And it's at night. She only goes out for a few minutes, but I about die each time she takes off running and barking.

After your post, I have absolutely NO plans to test it!

1. older dogs can get a bit of dementia, like people, especially at night. Thee is medication that can help. 

2. Do NOT use a citronella collar. They are cruel and ineffective because the smell lingers long after the dog stops barking. So then they are still being punished even though they stopped barking! The ones that vibrate or have a low level shock (most start below the type of shock you get from touching a doorknob in winter and you can dial up from there) are much more humane. and with bark collars you get what you pay for. Cheaper units are the ones that tend to go off accidentally, etc. 

[MaBelle]

I didn't read the other responses and I don't know what kind of dog you have, but with my ACD who was very aggressive this is what worked for her.  I'd grab the ruff on each side of her face and make her look me straight in the eye and then give her a shake and say "NO, stop it!", sometimes lifting her off her front feet.

If I had done this with other dogs we had it would have destroyed them.  With a bull headed heeler this was the only way to get her attention and it only worked if I did it because I was her person.  Last resort thing, kept her from killing my kittens.

 

Edited September 15, 2019 by MaBelle

[MaBelle]

On September 10, 2019 at 12:40 PM, Terabith said:

Reminds me of this story I read:  

The neighbours have been complaining that my dogs had been barking non-stop. I hate the electric zapping bark collars so I purchased a humane citronella collar. When a dog barks, it shoots a blast of citronella under their nose and apparently they don't like it.
This morning I was getting the collar ready and filled it with the citronella liquid. And that's where my morning should have ended. But no, it's me, and I begin to become curious as to “how” the collars actually work.
So I'm standing by my back door "barking" at my dog's collar. Nothing happens. I make sure it's turned on, check the fill level, and go through the "getting started" check list one more time. Again, I bark. Nothing happens. Now I'm not quite sure, why I had this next thought, but I did...I put the collar on. I seriously extended the band and fit the growl box against my throat and barked. Apparently, the collar only works if it feels vibrations, because I immediately received a blast of citronella to the face.
I began coughing, which only caused the darned collar to continue squirting bug spray over and over into my nasal cavity. I'm now on my hands and knees in my back yard, trying to breathe, and to make matters worse, the stupid dog is barking. So between coughing and yelling at him to shut up, I've emptied over a dozen blasts of citronella to my face. During all of this ruckus, I'm trying to undo the clasp of the collar, which has somehow managed to weld shut during this whole fiasco.
I finally get the collar off and threw, yes I threw that inhumane thing across the yard, and lay in the grass sucking in the cool morning air. In the middle of thinking this is probably the dumbest thing I've done in a while, I hear laughter. MY NEIGHBOR SAW THE WHOLE THING! He was laughing so damn hard he couldn't breathe. Between gasps, he tells me, "I was gonna come help, but every time I started to climb over the fence, you'd set it off again and then I would started laughing and couldn't make it." So now, not only are my eyes red, but my face and ears are too. After checking to make sure I was ok, we parted ways and I went in to shower so I wouldn't smell like ode de' Tiki Torch.
Lesson learned: next time (yes, there will always be a next time with me) make sure that:
1. Don't fill the collar before trying to set it off. 
2. Remember your neighbor is not a good source of help in a comedy crisis situation.
On the plus side, I won't have a mosquito problem for a few days!

I tried out my heeler's shock collar.  In our schoolroom in front of the kids.  I was sitting in an office chair and flew backwards after my "test run".   The children laughed hysterically and wanted a repeat performance.  When I used it on the dog she'd blink, look at me and say "What??"

[ktgrok]

34 minutes ago, MaBelle said:

I tried out my heeler's shock collar.  In our schoolroom in front of the kids.  I was sitting in an office chair and flew backwards after my "test run".   The children laughed hysterically and wanted a repeat performance.  When I used it on the dog she'd blink, look at me and say "What??"

Whereas with my dog, the settings go 1 to 100. I can’t even feel it below 13. But I can usually use it on the dog if we are in a low distraction environment at about a level four or five. Just enough to kind of irritate or tickle to get his attention.

[gardenmom5]

you can use a spray bottle of water - they can't see the spray bottle! - when they bark inappropriately, spray in the face - then get the bottle out of sight.  it will distract them long enough to stop barking.  may or may not start up again, but eventually they'll learn to not bark when it's inappropriate.  (frankly - sometimes it is appropriate.   if someone is poking around your backyard - you want your dog to bark.)

[gardenmom5]

4 hours ago, MaBelle said:

I tried out my heeler's shock collar.  In our schoolroom in front of the kids.  I was sitting in an office chair and flew backwards after my "test run".   The children laughed hysterically and wanted a repeat performance.  When I used it on the dog she'd blink, look at me and say "What??"

reminds me of when one of the parents at the kids elementary school came to do science demonstrations for the older kids.  (he's a chem prof).  things went wrong - and went BOOM.  when he could hear again.... the kids were screaming "do it again!".

[ThisIsTheDay]

12 hours ago, Ktgrok said:

1. older dogs can get a bit of dementia, like people, especially at night. Thee is medication that can help. 

2. Do NOT use a citronella collar. They are cruel and ineffective because the smell lingers long after the dog stops barking. So then they are still being punished even though they stopped barking! The ones that vibrate or have a low level shock (most start below the type of shock you get from touching a doorknob in winter and you can dial up from there) are much more humane. and with bark collars you get what you pay for. Cheaper units are the ones that tend to go off accidentally, etc. 

 

THANK you for this #2!

I don't think she has any dementia, she just likes to chase down anything she sees as an intruder. When a mama deer charged her two years ago, she was a bit cautious for awhile. But now she's brave again.

[Familia]

So, I got the Pet Corrector spray.  It is just awesome for the 'barking out the window/door and won't stop' routine.  It is also very entertaining=)  I have hidden it behind my back, and, usually, I am not in the same room.  Her searching for the source of the sound is so entertaining, it was worth the cost of the can just for that LOL  I purchased it on Amazon.  Thanks @Ktgrok

Oh, and I updated about all the children visiting in my other thread, but she did very well.  The children crowded her at one point, and I had to tell them to back off.  I think having her out of sight of them when entering (I put her in her crate) was effective.  I read that somewhere, that the dog, at the beginning of training, cannot handle watching people come through the threshold of the door into their space.  When the children reentered after going hiking, it upset her (not thinking about it ahead of time as a 'reentry'), and I put her to bed.

The vet (and people on here) mentioned stress as being a cause of stomach upset in dogs. I sure hope she isn't so sensitive that the two guest occasions in one week caused her recent illness, but it is certainly something to consider.

Edited September 20, 2019 by Familia