Dr. Hive? need advice

[sarasue7272]

Sorry for such a vague title. 

 

I have noticed a problem my son, DS9 is having. It isn't new, but things are finally coalescing in my mind about what is going on.

Some backstory: He went to public school for K, we then homeschooled for 1st and 2nd, he went to different ps for 3rd, and is now at a another different school for 4th. (Different schools are because we moved). I strongly suspect he is dyslexic. He reads on grade level now after lots of work at home, we had absolutely no money at the time for testing. 

 

I have been noticing that DS does not always seem to fully understand what people are saying to him, and does can't always follow the conversation. It is not obvious, because he may not say anything at the time, he just goes along. I know that's vague, so here is an example. Yesterday during family christmas, &&& says to DS, "the Flash is in the Bible", DS disagrees. &&& proceeds to tell him about Elijah running really fast like the flash, $$$ joins in somehow as well. DH also found the story in question in the bible last night and read it to DS. This conversation was at the other table, so I wasn't really following, but I heard some of it.

 

Today, DS was being snotty and I sent him to his room. Really, he was tired and hungry and I hoped laying down for a bit while I got his lunch ready would help. It didn't. When I went to talk to him he is crying (again, tired and hungry) and I asked him why. I thought it would be because of the most recent altercation that got him sent to his room, but no, it was this conversation from yesterday. 'I doesn't like when people gang up on me and tell me I'm wrong. &&& said the flash is in the bible but I said no. I know the flash isn't real. Everybody just kept telling me I was wrong. Everyone at school gangs up on me too.'

 

Now, &&& is really into superheroes. I can see why he would make this kind of analogy for himself and his kids. DS is a smart kid. I feel like most kids would understand that &&&'s statement was not meant literally. DS seems to only hear part of what you say and then either takes it completely literally or interprets it in a wrong way. It's so hard to even describe. I often only realize it has happened after the fact. I'm not sure what to call this, to do any research. I can look back on things and see where this has been going on a long time.

 

I feel sad that I wasn't paying attention to the conversation yesterday, I could have explained it to DS.

 

&Edited out&

 

I'm not sure how help my son, or get him help. Where do I start?

 

I'm pretty sure I'll delete this later, too much to personally identify me!

Edited December 28, 2016 by sarasue7272

[Paige]

I'd start with a good hearing test. The world can be a confusing place w/ mild hearing loss and, as the parent of a kid undiagnosed until about age 10-12, it's easy to miss.

[Tanaqui]

If you think there is something wrong, then your child needs a full evaluation. Happily, if you live in America, your school district is required to provide one upon request, absolutely free of charge. You'll hear people complaining about school-provided evals, but it is better than nothing.

 

Now, in my experience, you absolutely have to fight to get dyslexia diagnosed. For various reasons, many districts will go out of their way to avoid acknowledging that it exists. However, from what you said, I'm not sure that's your kid's primary problem. I have something in mind, but I tend to jump the gun a bit on that, so I'll wait and see if others suggest it first.

[Tanaqui]

I'd start with a good hearing test. The world can be a confusing place w/ mild hearing loss and, as the parent of a kid undiagnosed until about age 10-12, it's easy to miss.

 

Also, testing for an auditory processing disorder.

 

[sarasue7272]

Last year he failed the required hearing test to enter school. He had an evaluation that seemed pretty extensive and passed with flying colors. I think I asked about auditory processing disorder, but I will call the place that did it and ask.

[Pawz4me]

Is it possible he could be on the autism spectrum? Taking things literally is one sign of that.

[Pippen]

Comprehensive testing for communications issues involve evaluations both by an audiologist and also by a speech and language pathologist.

[JFSinIL]

Do not just get hearing tested. Also request he be tested for an auditory processing delay. Hearing can be fine, but if the brain is even a tad slow on processing the incoming signal, it can make it hard for the person to "keep up" and follow everything.

[Ottakee]

In addition to the above you could have him fully tested with IQ, subtests, etc. and tests for non verbal LD. 

[Innisfree]

That raises autism flags for me, too. I would suggest a full evaluation if you have concerns about both reading and literal understandings of speech. Social difficulties like your son described are also typical for kids on the spectrum.

[Paige]

Get a 2nd opinion on that hearing test. My ds kept failing the test at school and passing at the dr "good enough." He probably needed hearing aids from about age 5. Finally we moved and when he failed the school's again we saw a new Dr for clearance and they said he needed hearing aids asap and his type of loss is not related to fluids or circumstance and would have been steady for years. We thought hearing aids wouldn't make a difference but after living with him wearing them for a few years I'm amazed we didn't know. The brain has an incredible ability to fake it.

[Paige]

I think the Ent we saw first was incompetent.

[Shellydon]

Thorough speech-language testing including for auditory processing.  His inability to understand figurative language is a hallmark of a language disorder

 

http://www.home-speech-home.com/language-disorder.html

 

 

[zaichiki]

Is your primary concern that he does not hear all of the words in a conversation (and therefore misunderstands the intention of the speaker)?

 

The fact that your ds "held onto" the hurt makes me wonder if he is generally sensitive (emotionally and socially).  Or is this example isolated?

 

Could there be extenuating circumstances that led to him feeling like everyone is ganging up on him?  (Does he have a difficult relationship with his father/siblings? Is he being bullied at school? Could depression be a factor?)

 

Socially -- Does he have a best friend? Or a group of really good friends? Are there other social factors involved?

 

This is like a can of worms, no? Heh. But you're opening it!  (which makes you a really good mom, btw, and he's very blessed to have you)

 

 

 

 

 

 

[sarasue7272]

Is your primary concern that he does not hear all of the words in a conversation (and therefore misunderstands the intention of the speaker)?

I don't know if he is not hearing all the words, or if he is hearing everything but doesn't understand.

 

The fact that your ds "held onto" the hurt makes me wonder if he is generally sensitive (emotionally and socially).  Or is this example isolated?

This is not isolated. I would say he is sensitive emotionally.

 

Could there be extenuating circumstances that led to him feeling like everyone is ganging up on him?  (Does he have a difficult relationship with his father/siblings? Is he being bullied at school? Could depression be a factor?)

His father is not easy to understand because of his own brain injury issues. He felt bullied at school last year, although I really think the whole atmosphere in his class was negative, and the mean kids were mean to everyone - even their own friends. I deleted a paragraph from my OP about this. He had a lot of emotional outbursts last year. We really worked with him on how to deal with his frustration but nothing seemed to help. We were hoping this year would be better at a different school, but its not. One of the reasons he went back to ps after homeschooling was because we had a hard time making friends. Now I am thinking whatever is going on with ds is the reason, not just circumstance.

 

Socially -- Does he have a best friend? Or a group of really good friends? Are there other social factors involved?

No. He has a good friend that he only sees at church. All last year he would not say anyone at school was his friend, although I know he played with kids. He just wouldn't call them a friend. Until the end of the year, when he said two boys were his friends.

 

This is like a can of worms, no? Heh. But you're opening it!  (which makes you a really good mom, btw, and he's very blessed to have you)

This school year has kind of been a sh!t storm. He has had several instances of strange for him behavior at school, bad language, grabbing his teacher by the arms on the playground, eating weird stuff at lunch. His teacher was not a very good teacher, and now she is leaving and he will have a new teacher in January. Apparently she was having an affair with another teacher on the same grade level at school and he is leaving too. I would love to just homeschool  again, but I am not sure that I can give him what he needs, especially if I can't figure out what that is. I have a kindergartener who is doing great at school with an awesome teacher, so I don't want to change anything for him.

[gaillardia]

:grouphug: You're on his side. I love to read about moms going in to visit a child and trying to really understand what's bothering the child. My only advice is to stay on his side, which you are already doing. It's amazing what confidence it can give to a child when he knows he's not alone, that someone wants to understands him.

[dirty ethel rackham]

:grouphug: to you and your son.  My heart hurts for this kid.  I second (or is it 4th or 5th) the recommendation for a full evaluation ... auditory processing, working memory, autism spectrum disorders ...the whole gamut.  You may have to fight with the school because they are likely only interested in testing and remediating things that seriously affect his academic progress.  If he is working at grade level, many schools will try to get out of testing and providing services that don't directly relate to academic progress.  I would look for speech and language evaluation, auditory processing, and, perhaps a neuropsych evaluation. 

 

I hope you are able to find a solution soon.  In the mean-time, continue to let him know that you are in his corner and help him problem solve issues he may be having at school.  For the social issues, I would pay attention to the social issues and work on ways to make that better sooner rather than later because he is getting to an age where it is harder to have mom involved in one's social life. 

[Terabith]

Well, I'm not saying nothing is wrong. Auditory processing and language issues are common in dyslexic kids. I think it's time for an evaluation.

 

But. The issue with your husband sounds VERY confusing, frustrating, and scary to any nine year old, even without issues. Some school classes get stacked with mean kids. And, holy hell? Most 9 year olds would be confused and frustrated by an adult saying the Flash was in the Bible and making fun of them for not agreeing. I would be furious.

[Tanaqui]

Aha. Autism is what I thought too. It's the combination of potential auditory processing + being literal that did it. However, there is definitely not enough information for me sitting her to go "Yup, that kid's on the spectrum all right!" so, you know, don't assume that's it, just get it checked out.

[sarasue7272]

Well, I'm not saying nothing is wrong. Auditory processing and language issues are common in dyslexic kids. I think it's time for an evaluation.

 

But. The issue with your husband sounds VERY confusing, frustrating, and scary to any nine year old, even without issues. Some school classes get stacked with mean kids. And, holy hell? Most 9 year olds would be confused and frustrated by an adult saying the Flash was in the Bible and making fun of them for not agreeing. I would be furious.

 

No one made fun of him, they just can't see that the connection between an unknown story about elijah and the flash is not obvious to a nine year old (or anyone!)  they were explaining it to him, of course not very well since he still didn't get it the next day. They have a tendency to say the same thing a bunch of times / repeat each other. 

Or, he was already emotional when &&& tried to explain it to him and he stopped listening/couldn't understand.

They are not the kind of people who would make fun of a kid, they are the type to not notice that kiddo is still upset about being "wrong" and not following after that point.

Edited December 28, 2016 by sarasue7272

[Tanaqui]

They have a tendency to say the same thing a bunch of times / repeat each other.

 

they are the type to not notice that kiddo is still upset about being "wrong" and not following after that point.

 

Interesting. One question - do you see these traits in your son as well?

[sarasue7272]

Well I will definitely delete this stuff later if I say anything about inlaws.

 

DELETED

 

I often am perplexed by my inlaws actions and words. Like I really don't understand how their minds work. Sometimes they do things, not crazy weird or mean things, where I just can't puzzle through why someone would say or do that. They are nice people, they just don't make sense to me sometimes. And my own sweet boy is often a mystery as well, though I love him dearly and feel a strong desire to figure it out! He is not like me at all so its so hard!

 

I will get in touch with the place that did the hearing test, and when school starts i will make an appointment with the school SLP.

Edited December 28, 2016 by sarasue7272

[Tanaqui]

Sarasue, with this context I am going to say that autism is sounding much more likely to me than it was before. It is common for autistics, especially older autistics, to have been misdiagnosed adhd. It is also common for families prone to adhd to also have autism, and it is common for both autism and adhd to be present in the same individual.

 

Dyslexia is also comorbid with both autism and adhd, as is auditory processing disorder.

 

I would strongly suggest that if you cannot get the school to test for it, and it isn't covered by insurance (which it ought to be) that you find the money or a low-cost place to have your kid evaluated now for both autism and adhd, and also the aforementioned auditory processing disorder and dyslexia.

[sarasue7272]

Thanks everyone for the advice. I have never thought of autism for him, but have often thought it was something to do with language. Is there a way to get insurance to pay for an evaluation? The pediatrician is very laid back and non-interventionist so I don't see him being very helpful. 

Also, the boy he is friends with at church has some issue that I suspect is autism. 

[Terabith]

No one made fun of him, they just can't see that the connection between an unknown story about elijah and the flash is not obvious to a nine year old (or anyone!)  they were explaining it to him, of course not very well since he still didn't get it the next day. They have a tendency to say the same thing a bunch of times / repeat each other. 

Or, he was already emotional when BIL tried to explain it to him and he stopped listening/couldn't understand.

They are not the kind of people who would make fun of a kid, they are the type to not notice that kiddo is still upset about being "wrong" and not following after that point.

 

That is VERY abstract.  That's just not a fair set up to the child.  It really isn't.  I'm so sorry. I would tell him he's not the one in the wrong and they were playing a mean joke.  Because basically, they were.  If you want to have esoteric, metaphorical conversations about the similarities between Elijah and modern day superheroes, a NINE YEAR OLD is not who you do it with.  (I mean, unless the 9 year old is the one who came up with it and all.)  You don't try to explain it.  When the kid is upset, you apologize and say you were wrong.  That's what decent people do.  I'm more inclined to think your kid is a normal kid in a family of autists than the other way around. 

[zaichiki]

That is VERY abstract.  That's just not a fair set up to the child.  It really isn't.  I'm so sorry. I would tell him he's not the one in the wrong and they were playing a mean joke.  Because basically, they were.  If you want to have esoteric, metaphorical conversations about the similarities between Elijah and modern day superheroes, a NINE YEAR OLD is not who you do it with.  (I mean, unless the 9 year old is the one who came up with it and all.)  You don't try to explain it.  When the kid is upset, you apologize and say you were wrong.  That's what decent people do.  I'm more inclined to think your kid is a normal kid in a family of autists than the other way around. 

I dunno... my kids could definitely be involved and interested in a conversation comparing people from the Bible with modern-day superheroes (by 9 for sure)... IF they were in the proper emotional mood.  If my child was upset about being "wrong" or had some other emotional hang-up about the conversation (or the people involved in the conversation), I can totally picture them stomping off in a huff or yelling at the adults. What I cannot picture in my own kids, though, (and I do have four of them with very different personalities) is still holding onto the upset a day later. That, more than anything else, makes me think there are some additional challenging social/emotional things happening in this boy's life that need parental involvement.  Whether it's something that needs a diagnosis, I don't know... not enough info/experience for me to say... but whatever it is, it's too heavy for a young kid (it's dragging on him) and he needs help.

 

Good luck OP!

[Terabith]

I dunno. When my kids get upset, they start going through all the things that have bothered them in their memory. They've told me they were crying about a lost balloon from two years ago. But, my kids are definitely weird. And not good at pinpointing why they are upset NOW.