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How many schools did your DC apply to?

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I would caution against defining a reach versus non-reach solely by stats.  (I'm not familiar with parchment.)  I agree with a PP, I would also consider Duke a reach for any student, even if their stats were above average for the school.  

 

A person with a perfect SAT and GPA is unlikely to get in to Harvard unless they have something else amazing going for them.   And for that matter Duke.  There are just too many kids with nearly perfect SAT and perfect GPA.  

 

 

I already stated that we personally consider Duke a reach.  And they calculate everyone as a reach and not likely to get into Harvard, Princeton, or Stanford.  She's considered striking the Ivies from her list anyway.  Duke is a reach but for other reasons it will stay on her list.  It isn't as far of a reach for her as Harvard either.

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Yes, sorry, I didn't mean to be so negative.  I just want to make sure everyone gets in somewhere, and of course you have so many safeties on your list, she should be fine.  It's just so crazy these days for name schools.  I think you have the process well in hand.  

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Yes, sorry, I didn't mean to be so negative.  I just want to make sure everyone gets in somewhere, and of course you have so many safeties on your list, she should be fine.  It's just so crazy these days for name schools.  I think you have the process well in hand.  

 

 

Name schools are definitely an insane reach for anyone.  Paper-perfect kiddos get turned down.  I've tried to sway dd away from any ivies.  Maybe by the time she applies she will change her mind and not apply, haha.

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Name schools are definitely an insane reach for anyone.  Paper-perfect kiddos get turned down.  I've tried to sway dd away from any ivies.  Maybe by the time she applies she will change her mind and not apply, haha.

 

On the other hand, I think there is some worth in reaching high, even if odds are that you won't get in.  If you apply and don't get in, you will at least know that you DID try, and that going there wasn't an option for you, vs. not applying and always wondering "what if".  

 

There are a couple of people in my extended family who didn't bother with the reach, and regretted it, in one case for many years thereafter.  The ones who did reach and got turned down (but had a full suite of good choices just below the reach) seemed to be more satisfied with where they ended up.  They knew they had reached as high as they could, and landed where they were supposed to be.

 

(And the ones who reached but didn't have good back-up choices either had a serious scramble in the spring to land somewhere worthwhile, or spent several years in a safety school feeling very unchallenged.)

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On the other hand, I think there is some worth in reaching high, even if odds are that you won't get in. If you apply and don't get in, you will at least know that you DID try, and that going there wasn't an option for you, vs. not applying and always wondering "what if".

 

There are a couple of people in my extended family who didn't bother with the reach, and regretted it, in one case for many years thereafter. The ones who did reach and got turned down (but had a full suite of good choices just below the reach) seemed to be more satisfied with where they ended up. They knew they had reached as high as they could, and landed where they were supposed to be.

 

(And the ones who reached but didn't have good back-up choices either had a serious scramble in the spring to land somewhere worthwhile, or spent several years in a safety school feeling very unchallenged.)

The tippy top schools that provide strictly need-based aid only make sense to apply to if you know you can afford what the NPCs show. The prevailing wisdom is that they offer great aid. Well, it is all a matter of perspective. For my kids, they cannot afford them bc we won't cosign loans and we can't afford what the schools think we can. It isn't just a reach in terms of admissions, it is not feasible even if accepted.

 

College applications are expensive. By the time you pay application fees and sending all the test scores and DE transcripts if you have them, not filtering schools can lead to spending a thousand dollars+ on 10 applications that were never real options.

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DS applied to 8, but like another poster mentioned, mostly due to the music auditions being just another layer of acceptance to get through.  Oh, and to hopefully end up with a few affordable choices.  He got accepted to all 8 academically, passed all auditions, but for two he did not get into the music degree of his choice.  DS disliked his safety after going through the audition process there, so it was off the list right away.  He's down to two affordable options (which gave him great merit and music scholarships as well as grant aid), another two that aren't totally out of reach financially, but he'll have to take more in loans, and his top choice, to which he is appealing his financial aid package, that is at the moment totally unaffordable.  The other two aren't affordable at all.  So, the list of 8 got whittled down quite a bit.

 

I read on some thread on College Confidential that 6-8 schools is a good number for those auditioning.  DS chose to shoot for 8.  By the time he had completed 6 auditions and all the traveling up to that point, he almost cancelled the last 2 auditions.  Both remaining schools were an uncertainty for even academic admission, because they don't notify of academic acceptance until after the audition (this was not true for all the schools, though).  He ended up pushing through to the end, and I'm glad he did, because the last school is one of the two affordable options and one he likes.

 

8 schools, 6,000 miles of driving later--here we are crunching the numbers.  I can't wait until he makes his decision.  It's been a long 4 months...

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Hugs Nancy, BTDT got the tee shirt. According to my mother, she aged a lot waiting for my decision. But, with auditions to get into the programs, and then additional scholarship competitions, and then waiting for the number crunching, it was June before we knew for sure. I had dorm deposits at three schools to hold my spot which of course was no refundable and hurt a lot financially, but back in the day it was the only way to make it happen for performance majors, and I believe it was also that way for Art majors who had portfolios being judged. Not fun. The school I landed at waited six weeks after the last scholarship competition which was in April to notify participants of the results. It was a substantial amount of money and a make or break deal for many students. I just don't have a lot of respect for departmental talking heads who put students through this kind of waiting when they know that their own campus has deadlines for deposits that must be met and those are generally NOT refundable. I feel like they should be held to the same standards as all of the other academic departments, get their ducks in a row, have the auditions in early winter or if waiting until March or April, make their darn decisions immediately and start contacting students, and stop torturing kids. It sounds like your son though will be able to make his decision before the May 1st deadline which is very good.

 

There's my rant! LOL :lol:

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Sixteen --yep, sixteen. My daughter did not do any AP tests, only had 6 college credits, and a few online classes (mainly with John Hopkins CTY). She did do rigorous high school classes with AP books but refused to take the tests. She did university summer courses but not for credit. So we were afraid that she would not be accepted and sent applications to sixteen schools. She was accepted by seven schools with scholarships and honor college slots before we had to pull the rest of her applications due to her Early Decision Acceptance at her dream school.

 

Would I advise her to do sixteen again? Yes. Despite the time and all the essay writing, every acceptance made her calmer. Having an acceptance early on (with a scholarship) at a good school made her feel like she did the right thing in her high school choices. Having more than one good college to go to would have lessened the blow if she had not gotten into her dream school. It validated her choices, choices that everyone (including me) tried to talk her out of. Hope that makes sense.

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My two older girls each applied to just one college because by the came it down to doing the applications, there was just one college they were interested in. They were assured of acceptance and both got great scholarships.

 

My youngest desperately wanted to go out of state (and really needed to since her health condition keeps her from being able to tolerate heat at all and we live in Texas). She applied to four schools. Three out of state and one in state. She got accepted to all four and got scholarships at all four. The in-state school was just a $1000 one-time scholarship (same school her sisters went to, but she has much lower test scores). All three of the out of state schools offered $26k-$28k, but only one of them was close to affordable (due to tuition cost being $10k lower than the other two).

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Ds applied to 6 though there were 10 on the list.  

 

I don't think it would have changed ds's ultimate choice, but I did find one problem with too many applications: burnout.  He ended up ordering them by early application deadline, so the early applications were done, but the later ones weren't.  There were a couple of schools that he really liked where he didn't finish their applications.  He also didn't have lots left in him to do extensive scholarship applications.  I didn't think it would hurt to have lots of applications in and compare offers, but there was definitely a cost.

 

We were also in that middle area where we needed more applications.  We can afford about half of our quite large EFC.  

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On the other hand, I think there is some worth in reaching high, even if odds are that you won't get in.  If you apply and don't get in, you will at least know that you DID try, and that going there wasn't an option for you, vs. not applying and always wondering "what if".  

 

There are a couple of people in my extended family who didn't bother with the reach, and regretted it, in one case for many years thereafter.  The ones who did reach and got turned down (but had a full suite of good choices just below the reach) seemed to be more satisfied with where they ended up.  They knew they had reached as high as they could, and landed where they were supposed to be.

 

(And the ones who reached but didn't have good back-up choices either had a serious scramble in the spring to land somewhere worthwhile, or spent several years in a safety school feeling very unchallenged.)

 

 

The tippy top schools that provide strictly need-based aid only make sense to apply to if you know you can afford what the NPCs show. The prevailing wisdom is that they offer great aid. Well, it is all a matter of perspective. For my kids, they cannot afford them bc we won't cosign loans and we can't afford what the schools think we can. It isn't just a reach in terms of admissions, it is not feasible even if accepted.

 

College applications are expensive. By the time you pay application fees and sending all the test scores and DE transcripts if you have them, not filtering schools can lead to spending a thousand dollars+ on 10 applications that were never real options.

 

 

Because of the aid, dd could go to an Ivy or one of the full-need-met schools for cheaper than a state school.  It would be a seriously great financial option and that is a lure for dd.

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Another suggestion is to keep some variety on the final list. DD was adamant that she wanted a small school. Now, after visiting the smallest one on her accepted list and realizing the entire staff of the school paper is three people.... Well, she's wondering if she aimed a little too much in the opposite direction from her very large CC.

 

Edited by JanetC
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My ds applied to eight schools. 

 

We could never really figure out what a "safety" would be. As several of you had told me, we found that LACs and private universities offered merit scholarships that brought their COAs down to the same level of our state schools, which means slightly more than our EFC.  The only "safety" would be the university 20 minutes from us that doesn't really have a strong program in ds's area of interest.

 

He also didn't really have a "reach" in terms of exclusivity. His stats were generally in the 75th percentile for the schools he applied to with maybe one of them placing him at the top end of the 50th percentile - I think.

 

He was accepted to all eight schools with some form of merit scholarship.  The schools range in size from 1300 to about 10,000 undergraduates.

 

With regards to affordability, one school could be done without my returning to work, thanks to the extremely generous merit aid.  The other schools all require my returning to work, which of course will affect the following year any grants he received.

 

Ds has narrowed his choices down to four schools.  I think we know which way the wind is blowing and I have mixed feelings. 

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Ds applied to seven, all either local or near relatives who he could live with.  He received generous merit aid from all but two schools.  Of the schools that did not offer merit, one was a highly selective 'reach' school, the other was a school that is known more for their stem majors and Ds is most likely an English major, which is reflected in his high school transcript.  His math scores are barely average and I almost made him retake the SATs, but I am glad I didn't.  HE needed the time for current courses and scholarship applications (b/c he is a member of several clubs that have scholarships going unused every year and they are almost begging Ds to apply).  In the end, I think his English scores and his extracurriculars (lots of public speaking and leadership) made the admissions officers look past his less than stellar math performance.

 

He is down to the 2 most affordable options (no loans), which happily are the two that he would feel most comfortable attending.  Making a decision is proving very difficult for him.  

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Does anyone want to help dd narrow down to 8?  Just for fun :coolgleamA:

 

She has

strong extracurriculars, 6 AP classes (all 5's on exams) and she'll take 3 more next year, leadership positions, service hours, strong letters of rec from outside teachers, and a 34 ACT.  She has only take the ACT once this year and she can't decide whether to take it again or not.

 

Which school(s) should she nix? 

 

Reach schools (no plan to get in, haha) ...

Harvard, Princeton

 

Slight reach (parchement calls this a match but at only 45% likelihood we are still calling it a bit of a reach) ...

Duke

 

Matches

Wake, Emory, W&L, Davidson, Chapel Hill

 

Safety

Queens, Furman, Elon, NC State

 

Edited by Charleigh

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Since you asked ;)

 

Nix NC State. Its a clear outlier and NPC is bad. Everything else on the list is more liberal artsy... you clearly aren't doing engineering. If you need a sure fire safety add in another lower ranked state school. UNC-A was pitching itself as a liberal arts university back in the day. My sister's final two college choices were either a small sports scholarship at Elon or a very generous merit scholarship at App with no possibility of div1 college athletics... she went to App. 

 

I would also nix Furman just because I like it less than the other schools on your list.

 

I would nix the Ivies unless you can swing the EFC. If you can afford that I would keep both of them so you aren't left wondering "what if".

 

 

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I would not retake the ACT. You don't mention subject tests. I would suggest those instead. Pretty sure the Ivies want them, and I imagine a couple of those others do as well. Two is usually an acceptable number, but ds had three.

 

Not much specific advice on which ones to cut, but if you cut two safeties and two that you have labeled as matches, that gets you down to your desired number. However, I'd keep UNC-Chapel Hill for sure. I assume you are in-state, and that's going to likely be a good value for you compared to others in that category unless she gets some competitive merit. I don't really see much need for more than two safeties. Ds had three, but two would have been fine.

 

Just my$0.02!

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Wow- sounds like too many schools.

 

Why so many safety schools?  

 

Isn't that playing the odds with respect to merit aid? It seems reasonable to me. Shop around.

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I would not retake the ACT. You don't mention subject tests. I would suggest those instead. Pretty sure the Ivies want them, and I imagine a couple of those others do as well. Two is usually an acceptable number, but ds had three.

 

Not much specific advice on which ones to cut, but if you cut two safeties and two that you have labeled as matches, that gets you down to your desired number. However, I'd keep UNC-Chapel Hill for sure. I assume you are in-state, and that's going to likely be a good value for you compared to others in that category unless she gets some competitive merit. I don't really see much need for more than two safeties. Ds had three, but two would have been fine.

 

Just my$0.02!

She's signed up for subject tests. She's done very well on practice for those so we hope for strong scores. Unc CH is in state for us.

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Since you asked ;)

 

Nix NC State. Its a clear outlier and NPC is bad. Everything else on the list is more liberal artsy... you clearly aren't doing engineering. If you need a sure fire safety add in another lower ranked state school. UNC-A was pitching itself as a liberal arts university back in the day. My sister's final two college choices were either a small sports scholarship at Elon or a very generous merit scholarship at App with no possibility of div1 college athletics... she went to App.

 

I would also nix Furman just because I like it less than the other schools on your list.

 

I would nix the Ivies unless you can swing the EFC. If you can afford that I would keep both of them so you aren't left wondering "what if".

I think she should nix state too but she's so hesitant because she likes state a lot. She doesn't love CH but academically it is a better fit. She wants to double major in Bio and English.

 

The EFC for ivies is what draws her to apply. It is the cheapest option for us and it will mean no loans for her.

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I'd nix Furman, but quite honestly that's because it's the only school my middle son applied to that came back absolutely unaffordable, so essentially wasted his time.  We'd have had to pay 30+K more per year for him to have gone there than where he's going (U Roc).  All of his other schools came in within 10K difference.

 

If you want to consider a couple of others that can be very good with need based aid with her stats, consider Vanderbilt, U Miami, and if she wants to head north + is interested in research, U Rochester.

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Since financial aid will be a factor in your decision, I would be increasing your list of schools rather than reducing it. 

 

You have three lottery schools on your list right now: the two Ivies and Duke.  Does Duke meet full need? If so, is that need met with grants or loans?  (If it is met by loans, I don't really consider that meeting need.)

 

I would add more "lottery" schools to your list that are known for meeting need with grants, not loans.  Have you checked out any of the "little Ivy" schools? 

 

I would add more match and safety schools to your list that are known for giving good merit aid.

 

Have you checked out College Confidential?  There are quite a few threads on that forum that would help you formulate a list.

 

Good luck!

 

 

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Absolutely agreeing with snowbeltmom----build the list from the base (safety) up. Finances are most important to you, right? So you need to focus on selecting schools that are totally affordable yet that fit your dd's needs (program, size, location, whatever comes after finances). Then, and only then, should she select reach/lottery schools.

 

Frankly, I am over the whole safety--match--reach distinction. I think there are only safeties (that you know are affordable for your particular situation and that your student will gain admission, based on stats) and reach schools. Just read results or the financial aid forum on CC. So many kids were rejected or "soft rejected" through waitlists from schools considered to be matches. So many kids were admitted to schools they cannot afford without a zillion dollars in loans.

 

I will do everything I can to make sure dd will not be one of those kids next spring. Building her list is so very time consuming :(

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I will do everything I can to make sure dd will not be one of those kids next spring. Building her list is so very time consuming :(

 

Time consuming, but totally worth the time IME.

 

Best wishes to all in this "finding schools" position.

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Considering your daughter's stats, I would add more lottery schools to her list because many of these lottery schools are also the best at meeting need.  (I would guess this is a reason why these schools get so many applicants each year and are lottery schools to begin with.)  Here are a couple of sites that may be helpful.

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/troyonink/2015/07/31/forbes-2015-best-college-list-you-can-afford-the-top-ten-but-not-the-bottom-ten/#29d8a5a668db

 

http://blog.prepscholar.com/colleges-with-the-best-financial-aid

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Why do we feel so much stress about this?

To add, to take away? Which schools to add or take away? Ugh

Edited by Charleigh

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Isn't that playing the odds with respect to merit aid? It seems reasonable to me. Shop around.

 

First, you need to be a merit aid family. If your EFC is low, going for solid need-based aid is often a better bet. Merit aid families at private schools are generally high EFC, high stats, but have parents solidly enough in the middle class that the kid can bring in some tuition dollars, just not the full 60K price tag.

 

Second, the best time to shop even for merit aid is while building your college list. It's not like all schools offer it equally.

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I have another 18 months before we hit critical mass ;)  However, I started with suggestions I received and found the lists over at College Confidential (They have a list of "free"/no tuition schools, automatic full-tuition/free-ride schools, competitive full-tuition/free-ride schools, and then NMF schools).

 

Once I had my list, I eliminated any that didn't have a program for DS/DD.

Then, I eliminated schools that had full tuition and no good opportunities to add additional scholarships, our our NPC was too high, or were too far/in places DS/DD would not want to be

Then, I eliminated schools whose competitive programs pretty much were limited to one or two "super" scholarships (especially at highly desirable schools).

Next, I will eliminate or rank based upon program opportunities/internships/job prospects/distance & cost to home/grandparents/relatives.

Then, DS/DD will look at what is left, and get rid of those they don't really like, don't have swim/water polo if it matters (there are a couple I've given them no choice to apply for, because the Merit Aid is just too good)

 

We're categorizing "reaches" based upon financial aid needed/competitiveness to get in.  All safeties are financial safeties.  

 

My oldest has the following "reaches:'  Webb Institute (free), USNA, USMMA, Notre Dame, Duke and Stanford.  In another year it is possible that one or two of these will go away.  He has a lot more on his "safety" list, but he is undecided between two programs.  My hope is to get the list down to 15 schools total.

 

Right now my oldest daughter is really just thinking about: USNA and Liberty University.  However, I will probably insist that she also apply to U of A and U of Miami.  Swimming is very important to her right now.  She knows she can swim D1 for both Navy and LU, and she knows her advanced academic work will be taken into account at both USNA & LU.  In both cases, the schools are within a 3-hr drive from where we'd be living *and* where her grandparents live (also important).  I haven't narrowed down her big list though, because she has 4 years to grow and change (hehe, she's still growing vertically, too).

 

 

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Since you are a high need family, I agree with others that you should probably consider adding a couple meet need schools.

 

Do you definitely have a financial safety? Can you 100% afford the schools you are confident she will be admitted to? Are any of them automatic merit $$ schools? With her stats, it seems to me that there are schools where it would not take much time or effort to apply to and yet could result in full-ride or close to full-ride offers, especially is she makes NMSF. I would add a couple of those so that no matter what happens with the other admissions that you know she has at least a couple of schools you don't have to worry about FA packages.

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Why do we feel so much stress about this?

To add, to take away? Which schools to add or take away? Ugh

 

Why?  Because you're human and you care.   :grouphug:

 

It is worth the time and effort, so I won't tell you to stop contemplating.  You don't have to add a dozen lottery schools (or reach schools in general).  My high stat guy only applied to one lottery school (and was waitlisted) because he didn't want to be bothered by others.  The prestige they offered meant nothing to him.

 

He did, however, apply to 5 other schools (including Furman) where we thought he'd do ok.  Two of those were safety schools he felt he'd be happy at (Pitt and U Alabama).  U Alabama didn't have his preferred major, but if it came down to money, they were known to be affordable at his stats and higher caliber than other probable affordable schools.

 

Since Pitt generally had everything he wanted and notified him early (they're rolling decision), all of his other apps were to "I might like this better than Pitt" schools.  In the end, he did end up choosing one of those that came in a couple thousand less expensive and he liked them much better when he visited.  Win-win for him.  He'd have done fine if he had had to go to U Alabama for financial reasons though.  It wouldn't have been the same experience (different major and all), but he'd have still done just fine.

 

If you have a financial safety she likes, only apply to other schools she thinks she'd like better.

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 You don't have to add a dozen lottery schools (or reach schools in general).  My high stat guy only applied to one lottery school (and was waitlisted) because he didn't want to be bothered by others.  The prestige they offered meant nothing to him..

Many families that apply to the lottery schools, are not applying for the "prestige" - they are applying because they offer the best financial aid to families that are solidly middle class.  For these families, it is less expensive to go to a lottery school than it is to attend their local university.

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Since you are a high need family, I agree with others that you should probably consider adding a couple meet need schools.

 

Do you definitely have a financial safety? Can you 100% afford the schools you are confident she will be admitted to? Are any of them automatic merit $$ schools? With her stats, it seems to me that there are schools where it would not take much time or effort to apply to and yet could result in full-ride or close to full-ride offers, especially is she makes NMSF. I would add a couple of those so that no matter what happens with the other admissions that you know she has at least a couple of schools you don't have to worry about FA packages.

 

 

I'm not sure - if the NP Calculators are accurate then any school that offers good need based aid is about the same for us..

Duke, Wake, Harvard, W&L, Chapel Hill, Emory, etc will cost us between $5,000-$7,000 per year.  That isn't easy to find in our budget but when I take into account the tax credit, her current school expenses, etc then I think we can swing it.  The difference is how much of a loan DD is supposed to add in addition to that - Harvard = $0, Davidson = $0, CHill =$2,300, Wake is the highest at $7500 and I don't get it because that seems high. I hope it ends up better because it is her favorite school.  Keep this in mind that all other schools fall in this range (without merit aid added) and now look at State - They say we should pay $12,500 a year and that dds loan will be $5500.  That is almost full ticket.  There is no way we can do that.  I feel like we are missing something with State. 

 

Ok, Furman, Queens, etc use a different calculator and they all say we will need to pay $22,000 a year and we can't possibly do that but I think dd should hit significant merit aid with Furman, right?

She's thinkin Queens will not stay on the list.

 

 

I want to say W&L didn't have loans either?  

 

Harvard is farther from home than she wants but $5,000 a year from us and no loans for DD is so tempting.  And they calculate a fairly good amount in that for personal expenses and books. 

I know that the ivies are a stretch but dd keeps getting emails and mail from them that she is an unrecognized minority because she is first generation + has high stats.  The ivies keep making a big deal about this.  DD will be the first person on either side of the family (parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins, etc) to go to college and that is a pretty darn big deal to ivies.

Edited by Charleigh

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Many families that apply to the lottery schools, are not applying for the "prestige" - they are applying because they offer the best financial aid to families that are solidly middle class.  For these families, it is less expensive to go to a lottery school than it is to attend their local university.

 

No argument here.  

 

The prestige part only comes into play when there's no other financial safety.  With a financial safety, there's no reason to apply to any school they don't like better than that one.  Many kids actually do get attracted to prestige and apply to many lottery schools because of it.  There's nothing wrong with that either.  It just didn't apply to my guy.

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Many families that apply to the lottery schools, are not applying for the "prestige" - they are applying because they offer the best financial aid to families that are solidly middle class.  For these families, it is less expensive to go to a lottery school than it is to attend their local university.

 

 

This is us... it is SO not about the name.  Truthfully.  It is about the fact that we will get great need based aid and dd will be debt free.

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Is she going to make NMSF? Is there a reason you are not considering *** any*** high merit schools? Some of them would be free or close to free just with merit $$, no loans, no work study, etc. It seems like you basket is competitive admissions heavy and relying strictly on FA. Yes, they are great deals, but what if she isn't accepted to any of them?

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Is she going to make NMSF? Is there a reason you are not considering *** any*** high merit schools? Some of them would be free or close to free just with merit $$, no loans, no work study, etc. It seems like you basket is competitive admissions heavy and relying strictly on FA. Yes, they are great deals, but what if she isn't accepted to any of them?

 

 

 

I need to look into this more.  She was 99th percentile this year but her score took a hit because of sickness.  I'm not sure she made the actual state cutoff.  We'll have to wait til Fall I guess.  I do need to look at a few merit aid schools.  Because she really doens't want to go too far and none of them are close we didn't look but if she's willing to go to Harvard then....well.  Any suggestions?

Edited by Charleigh

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Is she going to make NMSF? Is there a reason you are not considering *** any*** high merit schools? Some of them would be free or close to free just with merit $$, no loans, no work study, etc. It seems like you basket is competitive admissions heavy and relying strictly on FA. Yes, they are great deals, but what if she isn't accepted to any of them?

 

Quoting again because it won't let me edit :/  When I got my principal letter for NMS, it said that dd is in the running but it also made it sound like the commended cut off has jumped to 209 and I'm just not sure she'll make it semi-finalist with her score hit.

Edited by Charleigh

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I need to look into this more.  She was 99th percentile this year but her score took a hit because of sickness.  I'm not sure she made the actual state cutoff.  We'll have to wait til Fall I guess.  I do need to look at a few merit aid schools.  Because she really doens't want to go too far and none of them are close we didn't look but if she's willing to go to Harvard then....well.  Any suggestions?

 

I'm pulling these off of my big list...I believe these are "automatic" scholarship and *competitive* scholarship schools.  Automatic scholarships are given to everyone based upon scores/grades (some may be first come, first served, most require EA).  I believe the remainder are competitive scholarships (require minimum scores, application, essay, etc.).  I'm pretty sure these are all full-ride schools.  If you are over at College Confidential and look under financial aid/scholarships the stickies will lead you to a few threads that have links to complete lists (I've already edited mine down a bit).  I believe we'll be applying to at least 10 here -- and will focus mostly on the automatic ones vs. the competitive ones. But, it will come down to the final scores needed (and program, other costs, etc)

 

University of Alabama

University of Miami

U. KY

Ok U

Hampton University

Troy University (AL)

AL State

FL A&M

NC Central

U DE

Emory

UGA

U Louiville

LA State

UMD

MS State

Ole Miss (UMISS)

App State

Davidson

NC A&T

UNC

NC State

U Pitt

Villanova

Clemson

USC (Carolina)

UVA

Liberty University

 

**What you may be missing with some of your calculations are scholarships that are competitive**  

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I need to look into this more.  She was 99th percentile this year but her score took a hit because of sickness.  I'm not sure she made the actual state cutoff.  We'll have to wait til Fall I guess.  I do need to look at a few merit aid schools.  Because she really doens't want to go too far and none of them are close we didn't look but if she's willing to go to Harvard then....well.  Any suggestions?

If your D is ok with flying, you may want to look more closely at schools that are close to a major airport.  My son is over 12 hours away from home by car.  However, he is only about 15 minutes or so from a major airport that offers cheap non-stop flights to our airport that is 30 minutes away from our house.  So while he is far away by car, it doesn't feel like he is that far away.  He came home quite a few times last semester.  He left on a Friday after his last class and was back at our house a few hours later and flew back out Monday morning and got back to campus in time for his Monday classes.

 

 

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Wait....your daughter is both an underrepresented minority and a first generation college student?   With her test scores, she is going to be in extremely high demand.  One thing I would suggest is that you and your daughter seriously consider eliminating the geographical restriction on her college choices and then target schools that meet full need without loans and have additional targeted programs for URM and/or 1st generations. If the application fees are a financial hardship, ask for them to be waived.  We couldn't cast a wide net due to my dd's health issues, but we absolutely would have otherwise done this.  Limiting yourself to a certain proximity to NC really, really limits a high performing kid!  There are so many wonderful schools out there for high-performing kids, many that do a really good job with financial aid.  The problem is that most of these schools have low acceptance rates and so they are reaches for everyone...hence the need for the wide net.   

 

 I honestly believe that, barring disasterous/obnoxious admissions essays, UNC Chapel Hill is both an academic and financial safety for you dd. My computer is acting up, so I can't post a link, but search on the UNC website for Carolina Covenant.  Also, search on scholarsprogram to see some of the merit scholarships available--as an instate student with her stats/academic background, I wouldn't be surprised if  she gets some merit aid.  I also think she has a good shot at Honors Carolina...my dd who was also initially attracted to Wake, loves her small discussion-oriented honors classes.  

 

I think safety schools are really hard with a high performing kid.  Would your dd really fit in at Queens, Furman or Elon? How important is having a high-achieving peer group?  For my dd, it was super important.  I would leave NC State on the list as it attracts the top STEM kids in the state there will be a strong peer group.  What about Alabama as a safety?  The honors program attracts top kids due to the guaranteed financial aid based on test scores.

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Quoting again because it won't let me edit :/  When I got my principal letter for NMS, it said that dd is in the running but it also made it sound like the commended cut off has jumped to 209 and I'm just not sure she'll make it semi-finalist with her score hit.

 

If she hit the right number last year, but missed it this year because of illness, it's worth a phone call to NMS to see if they will use last year's score for her.  I have no clue if this will pay off, but it's worth asking.  I've found them to be very helpful on the phone.

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Also - I would look carefully at the student's specific major at each of these schools.  What is the required course sequence?  What are the possibilities for a concentration or a minor?  What are the core humanities/etc. requirements, if any?   What kind of depth/breadth of courses is there to choose from, both in the major and any minor areas of interest?  Do they have any special programs that may be a good fit - study abroad, Master's degree in 5 years, co-op/internship program, etc.  The same major can look very different at different schools, and your dc may find that one school's approach or focus might be a better fit for their interests and career goals. 

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Wait....your daughter is both an underrepresented minority and a first generation college student?   With her test scores, she is going to be in extremely high demand.  

 

 

No, with her stats and the fact that she is first generation, the ivies keep sending her info saying that makes her an unrecognized minority.  If that makes sense?  Harvard and Princeton keep sending her info and emails on this and asking her to please apply.

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Is your dd a URM? Your wording is confusing since you say unrecognized minority. Is that based on 1st generation?

 

 

Yes, just based on first generation.  She is not a racial minority.  She's white.  They keep sending her info saying she is an unrecognized minority because her stats + first generation aren't typical.  If that makes more sense?

Edited by Charleigh

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Wait....your daughter is both an underrepresented minority and a first generation college student?   With her test scores, she is going to be in extremely high demand.  One thing I would suggest is that you and your daughter seriously consider eliminating the geographical restriction on her college choices and then target schools that meet full need without loans and have additional targeted programs for URM and/or 1st generations. If the application fees are a financial hardship, ask for them to be waived.  We couldn't cast a wide net due to my dd's health issues, but we absolutely would have otherwise done this.  Limiting yourself to a certain proximity to NC really, really limits a high performing kid!  There are so many wonderful schools out there for high-performing kids, many that do a really good job with financial aid.  The problem is that most of these schools have low acceptance rates and so they are reaches for everyone...hence the need for the wide net.   

 

 I honestly believe that, barring disasterous/obnoxious admissions essays, UNC Chapel Hill is both an academic and financial safety for you dd. My computer is acting up, so I can't post a link, but search on the UNC website for Carolina Covenant.  Also, search on scholarsprogram to see some of the merit scholarships available--as an instate student with her stats/academic background, I wouldn't be surprised if  she gets some merit aid.  I also think she has a good shot at Honors Carolina...my dd who was also initially attracted to Wake, loves her small discussion-oriented honors classes.  

 

I think safety schools are really hard with a high performing kid.  Would your dd really fit in at Queens, Furman or Elon? How important is having a high-achieving peer group?  For my dd, it was super important.  I would leave NC State on the list as it attracts the top STEM kids in the state there will be a strong peer group.  What about Alabama as a safety?  The honors program attracts top kids due to the guaranteed financial aid based on test scores.

 

 

These are great thoughts.  Thank you.  DD and I were just talking about this today after I was reading some of ya'lls posts to her.  She is wondering about casting her net wider.  We plan to sit down this summer and really research first generation schools with full neet met and make a list.  She's considered adding Rice and Vandy to the list.

 

As far as "will dd fit at Queens, Furman, Elon?"  I'm not sure.  I honestly don't think so.  DD is super intellectual and thrives on intellectual discussion.  Serioulsy, she gets giddy over the craziest things like .... essays from Francis Bacon and she had to read this book called The Swerve for a lit class  and all of the kids groaned and hated it and she was enthralled.  DD is deep and philosophical and loves, loves school and anything academic.  Learning is a passion for her.  My honest opinion is that (at least at Queens) she will come across odd for caring so much and she won't have the peer group she needs.  Furman has been recruiting with merit aid and they have upped their ACT score 2 points just in the last 2 years that we have been looking into them.  I think they also have an honors program so it might work?

Edited by Charleigh
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Charleigh, just as an FYI...I've never heard URM used in the college arena as anything other than a race other than white.  A lot of times schools will use URM/1st generation together, but they are referring to two separate groups, URM as I just defined it and then 1st generation (regardless of race).  Obviously, there is some overlap between the two, but belonging to one of the populations does not automatically put you in the other.  I'm surprised the solicitations you are getting from Princeton and Harvard are blurring the two!   High stat's kids from either group are definitely in  demand.

 

Hopefully, others can chime in on whether I am correct about this since I know you wouldn't want to unintentionally missrepresent your daughter's URM status:)

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Charleigh, just as an FYI...I've never heard URM used in the college arena as anything other than a race other than white.  A lot of times schools will use URM/1st generation together, but they are referring to two separate groups, URM as I just defined it and then 1st generation (regardless of race).  Obviously, there is some overlap between the two, but belonging to one of the populations does not automatically put you in the other.  I'm surprised the solicitations you are getting from Princeton and Harvard are blurring the two!   High stat's kids from either group are definitely in  demand.

 

Hopefully, others can chime in on whether I am correct about this since I know you wouldn't want to unintentionally missrepresent your daughter's URM status:)

 

 

I don't think there was a blur because these contacts were sent just for first generation students and nothing to do with racial minorities.  The actual phrase, now that I remember it, was hidden minority for one school and under represented for the other.  It wasn't a general email, letter, booklet, etc for all minorities....it was just geared for first generation. 

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