Where should I move? (Does this place exist?)

[Greta]

This is mostly just for fun. But in a year or two, it could possibly become reality. My husband and I were chatting over breakfast, as we often do, about where we might move once he retires from his current job (which could be in as little as one year from this week). I have a love-hate relationship with Albuquerque, he has a hate-hate relationship with it :lol: and our daughter has never lived anywhere else but she's up for an adventure.

 

So what we would be looking for is:

 

The northern half of the US or anywhere in Canada (east, west, or middle doesn't matter, but we do want to migrate in a northerly direction :) )

 

A larger town or a city (no small towns or rural areas) with a reasonably good public college/university

 

Safety - low crime rate (this one is very important!)

 

We've accepted that pretty much anywhere we'd like to move is going to have a higher cost of living than the Burque, and that's fine. But super-high is out of the question (Manhattan and San Franciso, for example, are off the table. Sadly.)

 

Good public transportation and/or pedestrian- and bicycle-friendly would be a HUGE bonus

 

Mountains or other beautiful wild places nearby would make my dh super happy.

 

A large number of cloudy days per year would be a problem for me after living in super-sunny desert for so many years. I don't mind the cold, but grey and dreary is a problem. I'm thinking, for example, that Spokane would be fine but Seattle probably wouldn't. (Someone please correct me if my perception is wrong - I've never been to either!). This is not the most important factor in the decision, but it is a factor.

 

My daugher would love a place with good art museums and galleries.

 

 

So, oh great and wise hive, where would you send me? :)

[isaac_megan]

Boulder?

[Greta]

Boulder?

 

My husband would love Boulder!  I've only visited once, but I thought it was very beautiful.  And not far from Denver, with its airport and other big-city amenities.  Great suggestion!

[Bluegoat]

Hmmm - what are you thinking when you say low crime rate?  My city for example has had a higher murder rate than average over the past few years, but your chance of getting murdered is still pretty darn low.  Are you more interested in other kinds of crimes, or being able to walk around easily?

[3 ladybugs]

My first thought was Burlington, Vermont. It has been a while since I was last there but I think it would fit.

[Annie G]

Perhaps Madison, Wisconsin. The town has a nice college, has lots to do along the lakes, is very easy to bike, and has a good bus system.  There are lots of pretty things to see in the region, though not mountains.  I don't know about the crime rate, but we've never had any problems when we've visited.   We've spent a lot of time there over the years- there is a LOT to do in Madison!

[catz]

Minneapolis/St. Paul, MN   :)   Duluth is a great area too if you prefer a smaller city.

 

Mineapolis is #3 in terms of biking cities.  My DH bikes everywhere!

http://www.bicycling.com/ride-maps/featured-rides/2014-top-50-bike-friendly-cities/3-minneapolis

[MEmama]

I was going to suggest Portland, Maine, but we do have our share of clouds and fog. Fits all the other requirements, but definitely lacking the sunshine of Boulder (is less expensive and has an ocean, though! :) ).

[Greta]

Hmmm - what are you thinking when you say low crime rate?  My city for example has had a higher murder rate than average over the past few years, but your chance of getting murdered is still pretty darn low.  Are you more interested in other kinds of crimes, or being able to walk around easily?

 

 

Mostly just a general sense of being able to walk around without worrying about personal safety.  I know that's pretty vague.  But I don't know how to quantify it.  Albuquerque is by far the most unsafe place that I've ever personally lived.  And the funny thing is that while the statistics are bad they aren't outright horrible.  But what makes it different from other places I've lived is that in other cities, there were good parts and bad parts and as long as you stayed in the good parts you were generally okay.  That isn't true here - you can't escape the crime even in the "good" parts of town.

[Greta]

My first thought was Burlington, Vermont. It has been a while since I was last there but I think it would fit.

 

 

My husband lived there for 12 years (before we were married) and LOVED it!  He would move back in a heartbeat, so this one is definitely on the list. 

[Greta]

Perhaps Madison, Wisconsin. The town has a nice college, has lots to do along the lakes, is very easy to bike, and has a good bus system.  There are lots of pretty things to see in the region, though not mountains.  I don't know about the crime rate, but we've never had any problems when we've visited.   We've spent a lot of time there over the years- there is a LOT to do in Madison!

 

We have considered Madison and were thinking about taking a vacation there to see if it's as nice as we've heard.  Thanks for this!

[Greta]

Minneapolis/St. Paul, MN   :)   Duluth is a great area too if you prefer a smaller city.

 

Mineapolis is #3 in terms of biking cities.  My DH bikes everywhere!

http://www.bicycling.com/ride-maps/featured-rides/2014-top-50-bike-friendly-cities/3-minneapolis

 

 

I was going to suggest Portland, Maine, but we do have our share of clouds and fog. Fits all the other requirements, but definitely lacking the sunshine of Boulder (is less expensive and has an ocean, though! :) ).

 

 

Thank you, I will look into both of these more!  :)

[Bluegoat]

Mostly just a general sense of being able to walk around without worrying about personal safety.  I know that's pretty vague.  But I don't know how to quantify it.  Albuquerque is by far the most unsafe place that I've ever personally lived.  And the funny thing is that while the statistics are bad they aren't outright horrible.  But what makes it different from other places I've lived is that in other cities, there were good parts and bad parts and as long as you stayed in the good parts you were generally okay.  That isn't true here - you can't escape the crime even in the "good" parts of town.

 

Yes, I can see what you mean.  It's very uncomfortable to feel like you can't just walk around in your neighbourhood.

 

I haven't visited any American cities, but here in Canada Ottawa is a nice place, cold in the winter but not as rainy as the west coast, a few universities, and really greak infrastructure for bikes.  There are also a lot of museums and cultural groups.  It's a bit expensive though.

 

I'm in Halifax, which I quite like - it's a good sized city but can feel smaller, especially in some areas.  I feel safe walking almost anywhere.  And it has five universities.  It can be a little damp in the winter, but I guess the flip side of that is that if climate change gets really bad, we'll probably not be as badly off as many other places.  Sping is wet and gross, but summer and fall are really nice.  There are lots of beaches and if you like older architecture there is plenty of it - it can seem a little more European than some western cities.  We have some of the highest levels of farmer's markets in the country.

 

Buses are ok, if you take some care in your location, and biking is getting much better. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

We have all of your requirements here except for the cloud part.  :)  (Seattle area - but I would not live in Seattle itself because it isn't as safe.)

[lllll]

..

[Greta]

Yes, I can see what you mean.  It's very uncomfortable to feel like you can't just walk around in your neighbourhood.

 

I haven't visited any American cities, but here in Canada Ottawa is a nice place, cold in the winter but not as rainy as the west coast, a few universities, and really greak infrastructure for bikes.  There are also a lot of museums and cultural groups.  It's a bit expensive though.

 

I'm in Halifax, which I quite like - it's a good sized city but can feel smaller, especially in some areas.  I feel safe walking almost anywhere.  And it has five universities.  It can be a little damp in the winter, but I guess the flip side of that is that if climate change gets really bad, we'll probably not be as badly off as many other places.  Sping is wet and gross, but summer and fall are really nice.  There are lots of beaches and if you like older architecture there is plenty of it - it can seem a little more European than some western cities.  We have some of the highest levels of farmer's markets in the country.

 

Buses are ok, if you take some care in your location, and biking is getting much better. 

 

Thank you, this is very helpful!  The European architecture sounds wonderful, as do many of the other aspects you mentioned.

[creekland]

Rochester, NY

Pittsburgh, PA

Chattanooga, TN

Ottawa, ON

Halifax, NS

 

all come to mind as worthy of consideration.

[Greta]

We have all of your requirements here except for the cloud part.   :)  (Seattle area - but I would not live in Seattle itself because it isn't as safe.)

 

 

My husband loves Seattle.  I think I'd have to go on anti-depressants.  But if they did their job, then I'm sure I would love it too.  :)

[ElizabethB]

I would go to northern Idaho. But I'm not sure that meets all your requirements. I've just visited a few times ages ago and loved it. And it gets plenty of sunshine with lots of mountains.

Northern Idaho might around the college up there, I forget what it is called.

 

But, I know for sure that Boise would. The downtown area is fun and safe and walkable, there is BSU. We have family in the Boise area and visit every few years.

 

We lived in Albuquerque 20 years ago and recently visited a friend there, I felt safer in East St. Louis than at times in Albuquerque! (I tutored in East St Louis when we lived in the St. Louis Area.)

[Greta]

I would go to northern Idaho.  But I'm not sure that meets all your requirements.  I've just visited a few times ages ago and loved it.  And it gets plenty of sunshine with lots of mountains. 

 

Do you mean Coeur d'Alene?  My BIL used to live in Idaho Falls and it seemed nice.  But that's the southern end of the state.  I've never been to the northern part of the state.

[elegantlion]

How much cold and average snowfall are you willing to put up with? 

[Greta]

Rochester, NY

Pittsburgh, PA

Chattanooga, TN

Ottawa, ON

Halifax, NS

 

all come to mind as worthy of consideration.

 

Thanks!  Hubby grew up in Pittsburgh and we've talked about it as a possibility.  I will mention these others to him as well.

[Greta]

How much cold and average snowfall are you willing to put up with? 

 

My husband LOVES to ski.  So for his sake, a lot.

 

I love the beauty of the desert, most especially the big open sky and beautiful sunsets.  But I miss having a real winter.  It snows two inches here and I'm giddy.  A few hours later, it has melted, and that was it for the winter.  (I'm exaggerating slightly, but not by much!).  

 

I especially miss beautiful fall colors.  

[lllll]

..

[Jean in Newcastle]

My husband LOVES to ski.  So for his sake, a lot.

 

I love the beauty of the desert, most especially the big open sky and beautiful sunsets.  But I miss having a real winter.  It snows two inches here and I'm giddy.  A few hours later, it has melted, and that was it for the winter.  (I'm exaggerating slightly, but not by much!).  

 

I especially miss beautiful fall colors.  

Oh.  If you want a real winter then cross the Seattle area off of your list for sure!  

[Greta]

I don't remember.  We were camping back then.  I just remember there was plenty of sunshine, lots of wildlife, and huge mountains and trees.  I remember going to Jackson Hole over in Wyoming and loved it there, too.  We were actually living in Pocatello, ID, and I didn't care for that.  The COL was great, but I much preferred the more northern areas of ID.  Southern ID has lots of farming, more flat, etc. 

 

Wyoming would be a possibility, too.

 

It sounds lovely.  

 

Jackson Hole is nice.  I bet my dh would love it there.

[Greta]

Oh.  If you want a real winter then cross the Seattle area off of your list for sure!  

 

 

Is there skiing available within driving distance of Seattle?  If so, that would be similar to the position we're in right now.  It doesn't snow much at all where we live, but there are ski areas within driving distance.  (But the season is pretty short.)

[Jean in Newcastle]

Yes, there is skiing within driving distance most years.  This year was even more temperate than usual and the skiiers suffered.  We'll most likely have drought this summer as well because we won't have all the snow run-off to fill up the reservoirs.  

[Greta]

Yes, there is skiing within driving distance most years.  This year was even more temperate than usual and the skiiers suffered.  We'll most likely have drought this summer as well because we won't have all the snow run-off to fill up the reservoirs.  

 

Yeah, I think that's the general direction that things are headed.  We may have to move REALLY far north to get the amount of winter that he would like.

[creekland]

I think Chattanooga might be out if you want a bit of skiing opportunities.  Folks who live closer can say for sure.  I know there's skiing near Rochester.

[Melinda in VT]

My husband lived there for 12 years (before we were married) and LOVED it! He would move back in a heartbeat, so this one is definitely on the list.

If sunshine is a requirement, you might want to avoid Vermont. We average 157 sunny days a year (including partly sunny days).

 

I'm from Oregon, so I find cloudy days cozy and I don't notice a lack of sun here, but I'm guessing you might.

[ElizabethB]

There is good skiing in Boise and very good skiing up north in Idaho. The local skiing in Boise is very cheap, you can get day and night ski tickets for way less than the cost of day skiing in Colorado.

[MEmama]

Halifax is a lovely little city but it's very difficult to move to Canada, especially to retire. Going through the process took us a couple of years and LOTS of paperwork (and $$$); retirement will throw a huge wrench into admittance. It's expensive and isolated compared to almost anywhere in the states, and you'd want to look into what the health care situation will actually look like for you as you age. The system doesn't work the way most Americans assume it does. Just saying, BTDT. But to visit, it's our favorite Canadian city in our favorite province (probably explains why we ended up inHalifax's American counterpart!). :)

[Aiden]

Salt Lake City, UT

 

I lived there for 3 years and loved it. I'm not as sure about museums and such--not my thing at the time--but there was a decent bus system, it was bike-able, the University of Utah is there, the weather overall was nice with some good winters (and Park City for excellent skiing very close by). You could live in the city, then drive 10-15 minutes and feel like you were in the middle of nowhere with good hiking. I don't recall how cloudy/overcast it was, but I do remember being stunned by the beauty of the sun shining through the clouds. It's much higher elevation than I was used to, and I remember a native Salt Laker laughing at me when I exclaimed that I felt like I could reach up and touch the clouds.

[ElizabethB]

Boise has an art scene:

 

http://www.idahocalendar.com/events/first-thursday-in-downtown-boise-listing-1262-13873.aspx#.VRQ-zog8KrU

 

And is good for biking, they have bike trails and roads. Lots of biking, hiking, camping, tubing, etc. If you like birds, they have a lot of good homeschool and research opportunities with their bird center, fun to get a tour even if you only mildly like birds. Also, on the STEM side, a lot of stuff with Micron.

 

Birds of Prey is the bird center, we have visited multiple times, they always have new tours and exhibits.

[Greta]

If sunshine is a requirement, you might want to avoid Vermont. We average 157 sunny days a year (including partly sunny days).

 

I'm from Oregon, so I find cloudy days cozy and I don't notice a lack of sun here, but I'm guessing you might.

 

 

I looked it up, and officially Abq gets 310 days of sunshine per year.  Honestly, I would have thought it was more like 350!  I wonder if they're counting mixed days as being cloudy, but to me, mixed is sunny.  I lived in upstate NY for two years, and I don't know if this is typical, but for those years we literally did not see the sun once from the end of October until some time in May.  There was a horizon-to-horizon ceiling of clouds all winter long.  I thought I was going to go mad.  I do like the cozy feeling of occasional cloudy days, but when cloudy is the norm, that's pretty rough on me.  My Dad has SAD and I'm pretty sure I inherited his tendency toward it.  Maybe the mid-west or Rockies would be better for me?

[Sarah CB]

Kelowna, BC is like a little paradise.  It has tons of sunshine, but does get a little gray in the winter.  Summers are hot and beautiful and there are lots of sandy beaches.  It's on Okanagan Lake so people water ski or sail.  There is also a world class ski resort 45 minutes away from town.  It's mid-sized - about 150,000 including the surrounding area.  There is a very good university in town (UBC-Okangan) as well as a college.  Public transportation is improving.  There is a nice art gallery, a few museums and a fabulous symphony orchestra.  Plus, Vancouver is only a 4 hour drive, so if you want to go to the big city for any reason it is accessible.  

 

Housing prices are a little high, but I still think it's worth the price.  A lot of people move to Kelowna for the lifestyle.  It's seriously beautiful and there are tons of things to do outdoors during all of the seasons.  It hardly ever rains.  

 

And there are lots of really nice homeschoolers :)  

[Greta]

Halifax is a lovely little city but it's very difficult to move to Canada, especially to retire. Going through the process took us a couple of years and LOTS of paperwork (and $$$); retirement will throw a huge wrench into admittance. It's expensive and isolated compared to almost anywhere in the states, and you'd want to look into what the health care situation will actually look like for you as you age. The system doesn't work the way most Americans assume it does. Just saying, BTDT. But to visit, it's our favorite Canadian city in our favorite province (probably explains why we ended up inHalifax's American counterpart!). :)

 

 

I did not know this, so thank you for educating me!  I will most likely go back to work once my daughter goes to college, but even that remains to be seen.

[Greta]

Salt Lake City, UT

 

I lived there for 3 years and loved it. I'm not as sure about museums and such--not my thing at the time--but there was a decent bus system, it was bike-able, the University of Utah is there, the weather overall was nice with some good winters (and Park City for excellent skiing very close by). You could live in the city, then drive 10-15 minutes and feel like you were in the middle of nowhere with good hiking. I don't recall how cloudy/overcast it was, but I do remember being stunned by the beauty of the sun shining through the clouds. It's much higher elevation than I was used to, and I remember a native Salt Laker laughing at me when I exclaimed that I felt like I could reach up and touch the clouds.

 

 

Boise has an art scene:

 

http://www.idahocalendar.com/events/first-thursday-in-downtown-boise-listing-1262-13873.aspx#.VRQ-zog8KrU

 

And is good for biking, they have bike trails and roads. Lots of biking, hiking, camping, tubing, etc. If you like birds, they have a lot of good homeschool and research opportunities with their bird center, fun to get a tour even if you only mildly like birds. Also, on the STEM side, a lot of stuff with Micron.

 

Birds of Prey is the bird center, we have visited multiple times, they always have new tours and exhibits.

 

 

Kelowna, BC is like a little paradise.  It has tons of sunshine, but does get a little gray in the winter.  Summers are hot and beautiful and there are lots of sandy beaches.  It's on Okanagan Lake so people water ski or sail.  There is also a world class ski resort 45 minutes away from town.  It's mid-sized - about 150,000 including the surrounding area.  There is a very good university in town (UBC-Okangan) as well as a college.  Public transportation is improving.  There is a nice art gallery, a few museums and a fabulous symphony orchestra.  Plus, Vancouver is only a 4 hour drive, so if you want to go to the big city for any reason it is accessible.  

 

Housing prices are a little high, but I still think it's worth the price.  A lot of people move to Kelowna for the lifestyle.  It's seriously beautiful and there are tons of things to do outdoors during all of the seasons.  It hardly ever rains.  

 

And there are lots of really nice homeschoolers :)

 

Thank you so much.  They all sound lovely!!!

[ElizabethB]

I grew up in the Seattle area, you do not want to live there weather wise. Eastern Washington is more sunny but I do not think any of the cities there meet your requirements, and we have visited all of the bigger cities.

 

Idaho and Colorado have sun and have cities that meet the requirements. There are weather sites that show number of cloudy and sunny days for each city.

[Whereneverever]

It sounds lovely.  

 

Jackson Hole is nice.  I bet my dh would love it there.

 

Jackson is EXPENSIVE and no university, but you should look at Laramie. Very walkable, surrounded by mountains. Skiing right there as well as national forests. 

http://visitlaramie.org/

 

And tons and tons of sunny days. :)

[ElizabethB]

Jackson is EXPENSIVE and no university, but you should look at Laramie. Very walkable, surrounded by mountains. Skiing right there as well as national forests.

http://visitlaramie.org/

 

And tons and tons of sunny days. :)

We have driven through and it is beautiful there. We had friends who lived there for a while, they enjoyed it.

[Greta]

Northern Idaho might around the college up there, I forget what it is called.

 

But, I know for sure that Boise would. The downtown area is fun and safe and walkable, there is BSU. We have family in the Boise area and visit every few years.

 

We lived in Albuquerque 20 years ago and recently visited a friend there, I felt safer in East St. Louis than at times in Albuquerque! (I tutored in East St Louis when we lived in the St. Louis Area.)

 

Somehow I missed your post earlier.  So, a belated thank you.  Boise does sound really nice.  Albuquerque is a sad mess in so many ways, and it's a shame because I feel like it has a lot of potential. But that potential will never be realized until the crime and poor education are addressed.  I'm just tired of feeling like I can't go anywhere or do anything without worrying.  I'm a really anti-gun person by nature, but living here has made me seriously consider getting a gun!  And that's just not what I want for my life, so I think moving is the better option.

[Greta]

Jackson is EXPENSIVE and no university, but you should look at Laramie. Very walkable, surrounded by mountains. Skiing right there as well as national forests. 

http://visitlaramie.org/

 

And tons and tons of sunny days. :)

 

 

Thank you!

[Greta]

I grew up in the Seattle area, you do not want to live there weather wise. Eastern Washington is more sunny but I do not think any of the cities there meet your requirements, and we have visited all of the bigger cities.

 

Idaho and Colorado have sun and have cities that meet the requirements. There are weather sites that show number of cloudy and sunny days for each city.

 

Hubby and I were talking about eastern WA this morning, but I didn't realize that none of the cities there met our other requirements.  Thanks!

[ElizabethB]

Somehow I missed your post earlier. So, a belated thank you. Boise does sound really nice. Albuquerque is a sad mess in so many ways, and it's a shame because I feel like it has a lot of potential. But that potential will never be realized until the crime and poor education are addressed. I'm just tired of feeling like I can't go anywhere or do anything without worrying. I'm a really anti-gun person by nature, but living here has made me seriously consider getting a gun! And that's just not what I want for my life, so I think moving is the better option.

:grouphug:

 

Yes, we loved everything about Albuquerque except the crime. It could be such an awesome city.

[whitestavern]

Portland, ME?

[ElizabethB]

The cost of living in Boise is pretty reasonable, a cost of living calculator said it was a few percentage points higher than Albuquerque. It is a bit cheaper than a city like Boulder but there are suburbs in Colorado that are probably about the same as Boise, although it has been a while since we lived in Colorado.

 

We are currently in a very low COL area, a town of about 100K in the South, our gymnastics costs are 1/2 what they were in the St. Louis area. The per hour cost in the best gym in Boise is identical to the cost here. I was surprised, I thought it would be about halfway between the two, I did not expect it to be the same as our current location.

[Ali in OR]

Portland OR meets a lot of requirements but might not have enough sunny days. Consider Bend OR--high desert, sun, close to skiing (Mt. Bachelor). I think it has a branch campus of Oregon State University.

[Greta]

Portland OR meets a lot of requirements but might not have enough sunny days. Consider Bend OR--high desert, sun, close to skiing (Mt. Bachelor). I think it has a branch campus of Oregon State University.

High desert sounds like my kind of place! :)