Family's young kids running wild in neighborhood, trespassing in yards

[nmoira]

How about—and here's a really wild idea—you invite the neighbor kids over to see the pond (to satisfy their curiosity, and while they're there you let them feed the fish with proper fish food?

 

While they are visiting you explain you don't want them jumping the fence and going into your yard (and why) and that while it isn't good to throw people food in the pond if they want to come back in a few weeks and feed the fish again when the family is home they can knock on the door. Explain they can't come everyday, because your children have school at home, but of they want to come over every one-in-a-while while you're home, they can knock.

 

Fair enough, and your neighborhood kids are lucky to have you around. :) I'd hope that the OP would have spoken to the children kindly, had they not run away each time they saw her (which to me indicates they know they shouldn't be there); however, not everyone wants to be so accommodating as you with their time and their property, and not everyone should have to be.

[Spy Car]

 

 

Funny that you offer "a really wild idea" like the OP is some sort of evil witch neighbor. Not sure how she became the bad guy here.

 

I think it is a somewhat better solution than calling in Child Protective Services or the police.

 

Bill

[NotSoObvious]

Let me join you in dissent.

 

What the heck happened to "childhood" that kids can't explore their neighborhoods without people calling the police or CPS?

 

Personally, I'd love to see more kids out riding bikes, playing ball in vacant lots, climbing trees, without adults hovering all the time. That freedom I enjoyed as a child are lost to today's children. It is a big loss. And the reflexive response to call the police on children who are being children is at the crux of the problem.

 

If their is a pond safety issue, find a way to resolve it without going "nuclear."

 

Crikey!

 

Bill

 

 

What happened? Negligent, sue-happy, entitled parents.

[Mrs Mungo]

You better call the cops sand report it. You need someway to CYA if one of those kids falls into your pond. Put up no trespassing signs, make sure the gate is locked and have the police go talk to the parents so they know you are serious.

 

I agree. These kids are six and under. If you know they have been in your yard and did nothing? It would be serious legal trouble if one drowned in your pond.

 

Inviting them over and implying permission to visit would be asking for more legal trouble, IMO. It would be different if our society was less litigious.

 

You can find loads and loads of stories like this:

http://madisonrecord.com/issues/426-wrongful-death/232859-wood-river-sued-over-4-year-olds-drowning

 

A quote from the article:

“For years before July 23, 2010, the Defendant had actual knowledge that minor children and other individuals would enter the tunnel, walk on the spillway and attempt to swim in the retention pond or basin.â€

 

Knowledge that this is going on and doing nothing is exactly what results in lawsuits.

 

ETA: Calling police doesn't mean filing charges against a small child. The police are often used to arbitrate issues between neighbors. Calling the police will (hopefully) cause the parents to take the situation more seriously.

[AdventureMoms]

So if they are crossing the line, speak with their parents.

 

Others have spoken to the parents to no avail, and the OP has tried to contact them but they do not appear to be home. So that route has been tried. Parents do not always fix these problems, if they don't the OP needs to go to the next step.

 

But don't make the children pay for the perceived sins of their parents.

 

Pay how? The cops are not going to take the kids to jail. They will likely talk to the parents, who sound like they need a little sense talked into them. Maybe they'll catch the kids and haul them home, which might even get the message through that this behavior is unacceptable.

 

And try to remember that kids running around the neighborhood having fun and getting into a little mischief was the way generations of Americans grew up (me included) and we (those of us who are old enough) look back on it as a "Golden Age" compared to the stifled and scheduled childhoods most kids have these days.

 

I had a pretty free-range childhood myself. But I was not running the neighborhood alone as a preschooler or kindergardener. If these kids were 8+ my feelings would be completely different. But they are REALLY little kids.

 

Incidentally I asked my neighbor (raised kids in the 60's) what she'd have done about kids causing damage "back in the day" She said she'd either spank them herself (if she knew the parents) or haul them home by the scruffs of their necks and hand them over to their parents. If the parents were unresponsive, she'd call the cops. She was also SHOCKED when I mentioned the ages. At that age she said that "babies should be home with their mothers". She has a neighbor with kids who have done similar things now, and she has called the cops on them more than once (the parents are unresponsive). My mom (raised kids in the 80's) said she'd call the cops.

 

We have become a neurotic, fearful, and oppressive culture. We rant about "government oppression" but fail to realize we are the oppressors, and are ready to call in the police or CPS for "kids being kids" or to settle a score with an unliked neighbor.

 

Sorry, but I don't think "kids being kids" should extend to letting a bunch of preschoolers destroy your property and possibly drown in your pond. If they are not old enough to realize that that isn't ok, they are not old enough to be unsupervised. We have a lot of free range kids in our neighborhood even now, but they are not babies and if they destroy stuff people call the cops on them. I don't think this destroys their childhoods, it simply teaches them the consequence of destroying others' property is police involvement. (The police here do seem to be sensible and don't totally overreact to this stuff, though. I might change my tune if they were going to do something over the top.)

[AdventureMoms]

double post

[nmoira]

If the children are damaging your stuff, deal with it. Speak with the kid's parents. Calling the police or CPS is a disproportionate response.

 

I agree about CPS, though I believe that was brought up due to the ages of the children. However, calling the cops isn't a bad idea (after speaking with the parents of course) as a CYA measure. It officially establishes both the OP has attempted to deal with the situation and the parents have been informed. Like it or not, if one of the kids has an accident, there's a good chance of a lawsuit. (Yeah, I've been in the US too long... starting to think like an American.)

 

I'm assuming whatever regulations the city/town/county has regarding ponds is being met by the OP.

[songsparrow]

Pools, ponds and similar features can be considered an "attractive nuisance" for which "No Trespassing" signs may not suffice as the children are not old enough to understand the dangers. OP may have an obligation to secure the area more thoroughly. I would recommend checking with the police, town officials and/or an attorney as to the extent of your possible liability and the steps that need to be taken.

[Parrothead]

Another thing that hasn't been grasped by some is that these kids are 3 siblings under the age if 6. So what are they 3, 4, and 5? 2, 3 and 4? These are essentially babies running around unsupervised by parents. Allowing a toddler and a preschooler to be watched over by a kindergartner is neglect. Who is feeding these kids during the day when their parents are not home? Who do they go to when they are injured?

[briansmama]

 

 

Let me join you in dissent.

 

What the heck happened to "childhood" that kids can't explore their neighborhoods without people calling the police or CPS?

 

Personally, I'd love to see more kids out riding bikes, playing ball in vacant lots, climbing trees, without adults hovering all the time. That freedom I enjoyed as a child are lost to today's children. It is a big loss. And the reflexive response to call the police on children who are being children is at the crux of the problem.

 

If their is a pond safety issue, find a way to resolve it without going "nuclear."

 

Crikey!

 

Bill

 

My boys play in our neighborhood most afternoons. My youngest is 6 but even when he was 4-5 he was allowed to play in the vacant lot next door and ride his bike on our minimal-use road (shared with about 12 houses). I'm out there when I can be but sometimes I come in to fold laundry, start dinner, etc and they play. When it's cold out I only last out there for a little while, but they don't seem to get cold and want to play for hours.

 

Honestly, my boys live for playing out doors and they have firm boundaries and rules. Several of our neighbors have ponds and my boys know not to go on their properties.

 

There was an instance where my boys were fascinated with one of the ponds (lots of frogs) and would love to visit (no fence) and Dh and I had to talk to him about that.

 

I'd suggest talking with the parents. Some parents have a different comfort level with their kids than others. A family on our old street had kids ages 8-11 and the mom sat within feet of them every day after school. Her point was that if one of her boys got hit in the head, etc, she wanted to be right there. While I get that, I just don't parent from that same place of fear. I'd much rather my children be outdoors than inside at any given time because I know they need it. I just can't always be right there with them.

[Spy Car]

 

 

Fair enough, and your neighborhood kids are lucky to have you around. :) I'd hope that the OP would have spoken to the children kindly, had they not run away each time they saw her (which to me indicates they know they shouldn't be there); however, not everyone wants to be so accommodating as you with their time and their property, and not everyone should have to be.

 

I read something somewhere about "loving ones neighbors" and treating people like we would want to be treated.

 

I guess those are old fashioned values in this era of "me. me. mine," but how difficult is it to show a little kindness to children who are naturally curious about things like ponds?

 

We choose what kinds of worlds we make with our actions.

 

Bill

[JBJones]

 

 

What happened? Negligent, sue-happy, entitled parents.

Exactly.

I did want to clarify that we did not want our neighbor's child on our property for this very reason. They are already involved in D. fraud, W. fraud, drugs, and thieving from the UPS man. You can't reason with the unreasonable.

[Spy Car]

 

 

I agree about CPS, though I believe that was brought up due to the ages of the children. However, calling the cops isn't a bad idea (after speaking with the parents of course) as a CYA measure. It officially establishes both the OP has attempted to deal with the situation and the parents have been informed. Like it or not, if one of the kids has an accident, there's a good chance of a lawsuit. (Yeah, I've been in the US too long... starting to think like an American.)

 

I'm assuming whatever regulations the city/town/county has regarding ponds is being met by the OP.

 

America used to be "the land of freedom."

 

We, the people, are slowing killing that idea (while taking none of the blame).

 

Bill

[kitten18]

Let me join you in dissent.

 

What the heck happened to "childhood" that kids can't explore their neighborhoods without people calling the police or CPS?

 

Personally, I'd love to see more kids out riding bikes, playing ball in vacant lots, climbing trees, without adults hovering all the time. That freedom I enjoyed as a child are lost to today's children. It is a big loss. And the reflexive response to call the police on children who are being children is at the crux of the problem.

 

If their is a pond safety issue, find a way to resolve it without going "nuclear."

 

Crikey!

 

Bill

I agree that kids should be out exploring but this situation sounds like an unsupervised mess. They are disruptive and destructive.

 

 

 

 

From reading your previous posts, you are more than one generation out from childhood, as I believe you are older than my parents. Many cities and neighborhoods are very different than when you were a kid. It isn't as safe as it used to be, and I'm not just talking about increased worries about stranger danger and what not, but more traffic, and less parents at home keeping a general eye out for the neighborhood children.

 

And these aren't grade schoolers, they are under the age of six, and they playing near water. That's different than playing in vacant lots and riding bikes.

 

OP, I would try very hard to talk to the parents before I called anyone. If you can't reach them, then try the certified letter. And can you ask for the police to increase drive-bys through the neighborhood before actually reporting them? Maybe the police will see them out unattended, without you having to make a report. For their safety, I hope their parents will become more aware of where their kids are and what they are doing.

I don't buy that the world is a more dangerous place now.

[Mrs Mungo]

 

 

I read something somewhere about "loving ones neighbors" and treating people like we would want to be treated.

 

I guess those are old fashioned values in this era of "me. me. mine," but how difficult is it to show a little kindness to children who are naturally curious about things like ponds?

 

We choose what kinds of worlds we make with our actions.

 

I think it IS loving those children to insure they are properly supervised and cared for. If they neighbors have been unresponsive to calls of concern, then the next step is necessary.

 

My dh once had a soldier whose children were temporarily removed due to the filthy state of their house. They cleaned it up, got rid of their animals, got their children back and dh performed once a week inspections until they left his unit. Those were necessary steps to insure the animals and children were clean and cared for. Loving your neighbor sometimes means involving authority figures, when they are not doing the right thing on their own.

[kitten18]

I forgot to say what I would do.

 

I would try to talk to the parents in person. If I could not catch them at home, I would find their email addresses (you said they're local realtors, that shouldn't be too hard). I would email them (then you will have proof that they opened your email), telling them what the problem is and that you will be calling the police the next time their children are near your pond.

I would also secure the pond. I agree with a pp, a sign is not enough liability protection.

[nmoira]

I read something somewhere about "loving ones neighbors" and treating people like we would want to be treated.

 

I guess those are old fashioned values in this era of "me. me. mine," but how difficult is it to show a little kindness to children who are naturally curious about things like ponds?

 

We choose what kinds of worlds we make with our actions.

 

Bill

 

I think you're veering into a "false dichotomy" here. :D Just because the OP doesn't want neighbor children in her yard, damaging her property, and in a potentially dangerous situation, doesn't mean that she's unkind or a bad neighbor. Being a good neighbor extends to showing respect for others as well, little things like picking up your dog's poop, keeping your property relatively neat, not letting your garbage blow through the neighborhood, not letting your children repeatedly trespass and damage your neighbor's property. We have some outwardly friendly neighbors (the majority), and some that prefer to be left alone. Some like and welcome kids and their questions, and a few are uncomfortable with children or have temperamental dogs, etc. We respect all. I don't know where the OP falls, and it shouldn't matter.

[AdventureMoms]

I read something somewhere about "loving ones neighbors" and treating people like we would want to be treated.

 

I guess those are old fashioned values in this era of "me. me. mine," but how difficult is it to show a little kindness to children who are naturally curious about things like ponds?

 

We choose what kinds of worlds we make with our actions.

 

Bill

 

If my toddlers and preschoolers were climbing fences, destroying property, and playing in a pond on someone else's property, and the property owner could not get ahold of me, I would certainly hope they would call the cops! Seriously, with all the ranting about a culture of fear, why are you so afraid of the neighborhood police officer?

[Spy Car]

 

 

I think it IS loving those children to insure they are properly supervised and cared for. If they neighbors have been unresponsive to calls of concern, then the next step is necessary.

 

The parents of the children have not been spoken with about this problem. Nor have the children been invited over for a safe look at the pond (where the ground rules and boundaries could be laid out). To go "nuclear" by calling in CPS or the police is an over reaction as far as I'm concerned.

 

My dh once had a solider whose children were temporarily removed due to the filthy state of their house. They cleaned it up, got rid of their animals, got their children back and dh performed once a week inspections until they left his unit. Those were necessary steps to insure the animals and children were clean and cared for. Loving your neighbor sometimes means involving authority figures.

 

If people are beating their children, or living in squalor you have a point. Kids exploring their neighborhood is not in the same class as "parents behaving badly." There are better way to deal with this than going to extreme measures, and ones that might, frankly, traumatize the children.

 

Bringing "the authorities" ought to be the last step if other methods fail, and not the first move in cases like this. Adults making children live in squalor? Different story.

 

Bill

 

[Anne in CA]

I have two things I would like to address. First of all, it is pointless to argue with Bill over this, he and his wife both work and send their kids to ps and Bill seems to assume, although I might be wrong, that he believes that if most of us did the math on our incomes we would make the same choice. I did the math on the income and decided to invest my time with my kids. He does not share the same views on the level of parental involvement that many people on the board have. I believe that letting a child as young as six run through the neighborhood is not as dangerous as some things, but is not good parenting. Bill does not believe that, and in America he has a choice to believe what he wants, but I see evidence of the paradigm he lives in. The world was structured differently at the time he was allowed to run free and kids were taught a level of common sense at a young age that children today are not allowed to develop. A nine year old would be different, but a six year old could have gotten hurt playing with wires for the fish pond. It simply isn't safe and the parents are refusing to deal with anyone in the neighborhood so the "helpful" suggestion to talk to them is pointless.

 

I would leave a review on the parents real estate website regarding the fact that their kids run wild while their parents are selling real estate. I would get all the neighbors who would to write similar reviews until the problem was resolved. They are ignoring their kids to make money. If their treatment of their children hurts their income they will get a babysitter.

[Myeightkiddies]

Step 1 - Talk to the parents yourself. It may be hard to catch them home but try, even if later at night. Have your dh go with you if needed. I believe this is important. Neighbors have spoken to them unsuccessfully, but it may be different for you.

 

Step 2 - See where Step 1 takes you first.

 

By talking to them yourself, you will know more about the situation and the alternatives. It could be resolved this time. If, after speaking with them, you are not satisfied with the results, at least you tried. Any authorities that you may contact (lawyers, police, social workers, etc.) will all ask you if you have spoken to the parents. Saying that you haven't but heard from other neighbors that it does no good will not make you appear to be serious. They could question how much of a problem those children are if you won't talk to the parents. Start there. Bring some cookies. Explain to them that your concern is the safety of the children near the water and electrical devices. Ease into the destruction toward the end. It will help keep their ears open.

 

I hope things get resolved for the best of all involved. :grouphug:

[Spy Car]

 

 

If my toddlers and preschoolers were climbing fences, destroying property, and playing in a pond on someone else's property, and the property owner could not get ahold of me, I would certainly hope they would call the cops! Seriously, with all the ranting about a culture of fear, why are you so afraid of the neighborhood police officer?

 

 

You have clearly never lived in the jurisdiction of the LAPD, where they treat you like a "King." ;)

 

Bill

[Parrothead]

 

 

America used to be "the land of freedom."

 

We, the people, are slowing killing that idea (while taking none of the blame).

 

Bill

 

 

What are you talking about?. This is a sibling group of 3 children under the age of six. Do the math. These children are 2, 3, 4, or 5 roaming the neighborhood unsupervised. I do not think there is a state in the nation that allows for toddlers and preschoolers to be left home alone to roam the neighborhood. Who is feeding these children? Who is caring for injuries? Who is protecting them from falls, poison and the over consumption of sugar?

 

Would you have left your ds at home alone when he was a preschooler or kindergartner?

[nmoira]

I have two things I would like to address. First of all, it is pointless to argue with Bill over this, he and his wife both work and send their kids to ps and Bill seems to assume, although I might be wrong, that he believes that if most of us did the math on our incomes we would make the same choice. I did the math on the income and decided to invest my time with my kids. He does not share the same views on the level of parental involvement that many people on the board have. I believe that letting a child as young as six run through the neighborhood is not as dangerous as some things, but is not good parenting. Bill does not believe that, and in America he has a choice to believe what he wants, but I see evidence of the paradigm he lives in. The world was structured differently at the time he was allowed to run free and kids were taught a level of common sense at a young age that children today are not allowed to develop. A nine year old would be different, but a six year old could have gotten hurt playing with wires for the fish pond. It simply isn't safe and the parents are refusing to deal with anyone in the neighborhood so the "helpful" suggestion to talk to them is pointless.

 

 

Do you have a list of criteria that should be met before one's opinion or experience is worthy of being put forth for consideration? I'll wager there's exactly one person "here" who lives in the OP's neighborhood and shares her precise circumstances.

[Spy Car]

I have two things I would like to address. First of all, it is pointless to argue with Bill over this, he and his wife both work and send their kids to ps and Bill seems to assume, although I might be wrong, that he believes that if most of us did the math on our incomes we would make the same choice. I did the math on the income and decided to invest my time with my kids. He does not share the same views on the level of parental involvement that many people on the board have. I believe that letting a child as young as six run through the neighborhood is not as dangerous as some things, but is not good parenting. Bill does not believe that, and in America he has a choice to believe what he wants, but I see evidence of the paradigm he lives in. The world was structured differently at the time he was allowed to run free and kids were taught a level of common sense at a young age that children today are not allowed to develop. A nine year old would be different, but a six year old could have gotten hurt playing with wires for the fish pond. It simply isn't safe and the parents are refusing to deal with anyone in the neighborhood so the "helpful" suggestion to talk to them is pointless.

 

I would leave a review on the parents real estate website regarding the fact that their kids run wild while their parents are selling real estate. I would get all the neighbors who would to write similar reviews until the problem was resolved. They are ignoring their kids to make money. If their treatment of their children hurts their income they will get a babysitter.

 

 

Please don't speak for me, and invent ideas and options that are not mine. It is really obnoxious.

 

I can express my positions myself without your creating misrepresentations of my thought.

 

OK?

 

Bill

[msjones]

 

 

I would leave a review on the parents real estate website regarding the fact that their kids run wild while their parents are selling real estate. I would get all the neighbors who would to write similar reviews until the problem was resolved. They are ignoring their kids to make money. If their treatment of their children hurts their income they will get a babysitter.

 

 

 

Are you serious? Or joking?

[Anne in CA]

I am completely serious. If they do not respond to people trying to talk to them, I would use whatever methods necessary. It is seriously unsafe to let children this young run wild.

[Mrs Mungo]

The parents of the children have not been spoken with about this problem. Nor have the children been invited over for a safe look at the pond (where the ground rules and boundaries could be laid out). To go "nuclear" by calling in CPS or the police is an over reaction as far as I'm concerned.

 

Disagree. Three children under six have no business out and about, especially when they are destroying property. Would I attempt totalk to the parents? Absolutely. But, I do NOT believe that calling the police=going nuclear, if I cannot reach the parents or the parents are unresponsive.

 

If people are beating their children, or living in squalor you have a point. Kids exploring their neighborhood is not in the same class as "parents behaving badly." There are better way to deal with this than going to extreme measures, and ones that might, frankly, traumatize the children.

 

These are very small children who appear to be completely unsupervised during the day. The *parents* need a wake up call and have not listened to neighbors up to this point. There is no reason that a visit from a police officer would be traumatic.

 

Bringing "the authorities" ought to be the last step if other methods fail, and not the first move in cases like this. Adults making children live in squalor? Different story.

 

 

I did not suggest it should be the first move. It would not be the first move. Other neighbors have attempted to speak to the parents. Yes, I would speak to the parents, but would not hesitate to involve the local police to help with the situation. I do not think allowing very small children to roam unsupervised, leaving a path of destruction behind is much different on the parenting scale than living in squalor.

 

You have clearly never lived in the jurisdiction of the LAPD, where they treat you like a "King." ;)

Bill

 

 

Wow, you obviously have a very dim view of police officers. Many of us are heavily involved in the community and deal with the police in a positive way on a regular basis. Several people here have been police officers or are married to police officers.

[FaithManor]

The parents of the children have not been spoken with about this problem. Nor have the children been invited over for a safe look at the pond (where the ground rules and boundaries could be laid out). To go "nuclear" by calling in CPS or the police is an over reaction as far as I'm concerned.

 

 

 

If people are beating their children, or living in squalor you have a point. Kids exploring their neighborhood is not in the same class as "parents behaving badly." There are better way to deal with this than going to extreme measures, and ones that might, frankly, traumatize the children.

 

Bringing "the authorities" ought to be the last step if other methods fail, and not the first move in cases like this. Adults making children live in squalor? Different story.

 

Bill

 

 

Bill, I get what you are saying. In theory, I agree...in many cases, free ranging is good for kids. However, these are three children six and under...so 6,5,4 or 6,4,2 or whatever combo that comes up to a six year old being responsible for a preschooler and a toddler, two preschoolers, or two toddlers. That.is.a.tragedy.waiting.to.happen.

 

Three ten year olds, yeah, I'd be doing a lot of things before I'd call CPS. I would certainly attempt to make contact with the parents multiple times and I would attempt to reason with the kids. But, the OP stated that the parents do not engage.

 

This could be very bad and I wouldn't want it on my conscience. I'd rather let the proper authorities come and talk to the parents about proper supervision than someday find the toddler floating face down in my pond.

 

OP, empty your savings, borrow from retirement funds, take out a second mortgage, max out a credit card, get a signature loan....whatever it takes...fence that pond with a 4'x8' privacy fence and put a padlock on the gate. In a lawsuit, taking the step to fence the pond, counts very well in your favor.

 

Faith

[poppy]

Bringing "the authorities" ought to be the last step if other methods fail, and not the first move in cases like this. Adults making children live in squalor? Different story.

 

This is not calling the authorities to correct the neighbor's parenting. The kids are committing a crime, an actual on-the-books crime. Two actually, trespassing and vandalism. Kids being kids don't actually normally commit crimes.

 

How do you stop them from doing that?

First step: Ask kids to stop. Didn't work.

Next step: Talk to parents. Parents haven't been around for multiple attempts.

Next step: ???

Certified letter and police both seem reasonable, in an effort to communicate what should be a no-brainer, "no trespassing" .

No one is talking about CPS except you.

[AdventureMoms]

You have clearly never lived in the jurisdiction of the LAPD, where they treat you like a "King." ;)

 

Bill

 

True. But issues with one police department do not make me think that no one should ever trust their police. I called my local cops when the neighbor was shooting guns into my yard and damaging my property. The cops handled it just fine. They spoke to the neighbor, they spoke to us, and the incidents have stopped. The OP hasn't clarified that her PD is terrible, so I don't think they need to be left out of this conflict at all costs.

 

That may be one of the issues here - I wonder how people's view of police affects their opinion on this matter. I view police as community members whose job is to help protect the community (including children and property owners). Sometimes that job includes helping to resolve neighbor conflicts (especially if laws are being broken or childrens' lives are at risk). I do not see them as a last resort that I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy, but rather as someone who can help if a problem requires outside intervention.

 

In my state children under 7 cannot be left home alone (or sibling groups where the oldest child is under 7). I think that is a pretty reasonable rule, personally, and would be concerned about an unsupervised group of children under that age. The groups of elementary and older kids I see wandering around every day don't bother me at all. But they're old enough to know better than to go fishing in the neighbor's pond. If they do get caught doing such a thing, they're old enough to learn that the consequence of that behavior may be that the cops come and take you home or come tell your parents what you did. That's no different than my own childhood or my parents or my grandparents.

[Spy Car]

I did not suggest it should be the first move. It would not be the first move. Other neighbors have attempted to speak to the parents. Yes, I would speak to the parents, but would not hesitate to involve the local police to help with the situation. I do not think allowing very small children to roam unsupervised, leaving a path of destruction behind is much different on the parenting scale than living in squalor.

 

So we agree that speaking to the parents is the best first move, and that "calling in the authorities" is something we'd report to if other options fail?

 

Wow, you obviously have a very dim view of police officers. Many of us are heavily involved in the community and deal with the police in a positive way on a regular basis. Several people here have been police officers or are married to police officers.

 

The LAPD has operated historically under a rather unique model of policing ("we are the baddest gang in town") that has not fostered very good police-community relations. Things are slowly changing in the right direction. But, if you are unaware of the reality of the history of the LAPD in Los Angeles, don't go making too many assumptions. OK?

 

Bill

[AdventureMoms]

Disagree. Three children under six have no business out and about, especially when they are destroying property. Would I attempt to talk to the parents? Absolutely. But, I do NOT believe that calling the police=going nuclear, if I cannot reach the parents or the parents are unresponsive.

 

 

Yes. This is where I'm coming from too. To me, "going nuclear" would be rigging the pond with explosives or shooting at the kids or something. Calling in law enforcement to enforce the laws that are being broken (after attempting to resolve the issues myself unsuccessfully) is a reasoned and logical response to me.

[Spy Car]

 

 

True. But issues with one police department do not make me think that no one should ever trust their police. I called my local cops when the neighbor was shooting guns into my yard and damaging my property. The cops handled it just fine. They spoke to the neighbor, they spoke to us, and the incidents have stopped. The OP hasn't clarified that her PD is terrible, so I don't think they need to be left out of this conflict at all costs.

 

That may be one of the issues here - I wonder how people's view of police affects their opinion on this matter. I view police as community members whose job is to help protect the community (including children and property owners). Sometimes that job includes helping to resolve neighbor conflicts (especially if laws are being broken or childrens' lives are at risk). I do not see them as a last resort that I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy, but rather as someone who can help if a problem requires outside intervention.

 

In my state children under 7 cannot be left home alone (or sibling groups where the oldest child is under 7). I think that is a pretty reasonable rule, personally, and would be concerned about an unsupervised group of children under that age. The groups of elementary and older kids I see wandering around every day don't bother me at all. But they're old enough to know better than to go fishing in the neighbor's pond. If they do get caught doing such a thing, they're old enough to learn that the consequence of that behavior may be that the cops come and take you home or come tell your parents what you did. That's no different than my own childhood or my parents or my grandparents.

 

Who said no one should trust their police?

 

If the situation can't be resolved by other means call the police. I just would not make it the first move.

 

Bill

 

[mom2myboys]

Has anyone gone over to talk to the parents the minute they see the children doing something or do they wait until later? Maybe that would be one way to talk to the parents is to head right over as soon as the children are spotted in someone's yard or doing something they are not supposed to be doing? I would hope that the parents are home and are just letting the kids go out and play. If they were not home at all while their little ones were roaming around, that would change the way I would handle things.

[Mrs Mungo]

So we agree that speaking to the parents is the best first move, and that "calling in the authorities" is something we'd report to if other options fail?

 

According to the OP, she has attempted that and failed:

The family who lives behind us has three young children, all six and under. Their parents work during the day as realtors. The children don't seem to be supervised well, and they have been known to ring doorbells and run away, go into people's yards and pick flowers, and generally make nuisances of themselves. I have never met the parents, nor have I had any conversation with the children.

*snip*

On the occasions -- not many, but a few times -- when I've caught them in the act, they ran away.

*snip*

I have not been able to catch the parents at home, but my next-door neighbor has talked to them unsuccessfully numerous times. I do plan to speak with them and let them know that I'm very serious about not wanting their children in my yard. What else can I say that won't inflame them?

 

The LAPD has operated historically under a rather unique model of policing ("we are the baddest gang in town") that has not fostered very good police-community relations. Things are slowly changing in the right direction. But, if you are unaware of the reality of the history of the LAPD in Los Angeles, don't go making too many assumptions. OK?

Bill

 

What assumption am I making, according to you? You admit to having a dim view of police. You are the one placing your perception of your local police department onto other police departments across the nation and answering posts accordingly.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Here's another thought. If you can't ever catch the parents, have your attorney craft a letter stating that the children are not allowed on your property and especially not allowed near your pond. Have it sent certified mail.

 

Include a bill for all damages with the letter. You should not have to pay for what those children damaged.

[AdventureMoms]

Who said no one should trust their police?

 

If the situation can't be resolved by other means call the police. I just would not make it the first move.

 

Bill

 

I don't think it is a first move here. It's just not the absolute last resort to me. If it resolved the dangerous situation sooner, I think there's some sense to getting some help in dealing with them. That said, parents who would let a couple of preschoolers roam the neighborhood under the supervision of a kindergartner don't leave me a lot of hope that they will be able/willing to deal with the situation themselves. Perhaps that's my bias - I tend to think that reasonable people would wait until a kid is old enough to follow basic safety rules before letting them roam the neighborhood unsupervised.

[Spy Car]

 

 

According to the OP, she has attempted that and failed:

 

There is a "yawning gap" between "attempted" and actually doing it.

 

What assumption am I making, according to you? You admit to having a dim view of police. You are the one placing your perception of your local police department onto other police departments across the nation and answering posts accordingly.

 

No. I have a dim view of the model of policing that has been historically practiced by the LAPD. This is not a minority position in Los Angeles, and someting our current (and past several) police chiefs have attempted (to only partial success) to change.

 

I might be more included to call the cops if I knew the officer that would handle the situation would be more like Andy Taylor than what I'd expect of the LAPD, but I'd call the LAPD if other options failed.

 

You are trying to create the impression that I'm unaware that other police jurisdictions follow a friendlier and more community-based model than the LAPD (which has not), but I'm aware that is the case. I still would not make it my first move (Andy Taylor living next door being the possible exception).

 

Bill

[CatholicMom]

Yikes. If you can't get ahold of the parents to talk to them in person, I would write a note and put it in their mailbox or tape it to their door. You can include your phone number and let them know you are willing to talk in person or over the phone, but a note was second-best since you hadn't been seeing them around. I would be very clear, though polite.

 

I think it is definitely NOT OK for kids to be roaming into others' yards. Nobody is stopping them from riding bikes, playing outside, and what have you. But wandering into people's yards, ruining plants, destroying your stuff, is way over the line of "exploring." Plus, with kids 6 and under, it's very likely that at least one of them can't swim. That is pretty frightening to me if they have been unsupervised near your pond (and climbing over fences to get to it, if I remember right?! That's absurd).

 

I would not call CPS at this point, or the police. I would contact the parents through the note if necessary, ASAP. If they respond in a way that says "screw you" or you get the idea they are not going to comply with your wishes to keep their kids out of your yard, then I would call the police. Then you can say that you made the issue known to the parents and they have not changed their ways.

 

The pond thing is a big safety issue for those kids. How horrific would it be if one of them was face down in your pond one day? It would NOT be your fault... but horrible, and I cannot believe the parents don't know their kids are doing this.

 

I didn't read every single post, but are you saying the parents are at work and these kids are literally unattended?? If that is the case and you are quite sure of it, I might not even bother with the note and call the police asap. That is incredibly dangerous and foolish.

[Catwoman]

Has anyone gone over to talk to the parents the minute they see the children doing something or do they wait until later? Maybe that would be one way to talk to the parents is to head right over as soon as the children are spotted in someone's yard or doing something they are not supposed to be doing? I would hope that the parents are home and are just letting the kids go out and play. If they were not home at all while their little ones were roaming around, that would change the way I would handle things.

 

I'm wondering about that, too. It would seem that, with children that young, it would be a legal requirement that a parent or caregiver be at home to supervise them, so I'm wondering if anyone has gone to their home at a time when they have seen the kids out and about in the neighborhood.

 

If the parents are leaving the kids alone at home for hours on end, that puts an entirely new spin on the whole situation, and should be the primary concern here. I would definitely report it to the police if I knew for sure that such young children were roaming the neighborhood while their parents were nowhere to be found.

[unsinkable]

 

 

 

From reading your previous posts, you are more than one generation out from childhood, as I believe you are older than my parents.

 

 

Oh, wow, this made me laugh!

 

"You are older than my parents."

 

It strikes me as funny. Anyone else? Just me?

 

 

[Spy Car]

 

 

Oh, wow, this made me laugh!

 

"You are older than my parents."

 

It strikes me as funny. Anyone else? Just me?

 

 

I'll teach you whippersnappers to make fun of your elders :D

 

When I'm less tired.

 

Bill

 

 

[Anne in CA]

Do you have a list of criteria that should be met before one's opinion or experience is worthy of being put forth for consideration? I'll wager there's exactly one person "here" who lives in the OP's neighborhood and shares her precise circumstances.

 

I was not saying that anyone's opinion was invalid, but some opinions are never going to find a point where the converge, if that makes sense. My only point was that when two people have really different viewpoints they are unlikely to find a place of agreement.

[unsinkable]

Oh, the topic...

 

I'm more of let kids be kids mom. Because I'm raising special snowflakes and all.

 

But the pond scares the crap out me, because drowning scares the crap out of me. If they were older, maybe I'd set up some trip wires to catch them.

 

But at 6 and under, if the last resort to keeping them out of the yard is calling the police, I'd reluctantly do it.

[unsinkable]

Another thing that hasn't been grasped by some is that these kids are 3 siblings under the age if 6. So what are they 3, 4, and 5? 2, 3 and 4? These are essentially babies running around unsupervised by parents. Allowing a toddler and a preschooler to be watched over by a kindergartner is neglect. Who is feeding these kids during the day when their parents are not home? Who do they go to when they are injured?

 

 

I vote 5, 5, 5.

 

Triplets

[Mrs Mungo]

There is a "yawning gap" between "attempted" and actually doing it.

 

Not really. What is the OP expected to do? The three children under six are out and about, the parents have not been home.

 

No. I have a dim view of the model of policing that has been historically practiced by the LAPD. This is not a minority position in Los Angeles, and someting our current (and past several) police chiefs have attempted (to only partial success) to change.

I might be more included to call the cops if I knew the officer that would handle the situation would be more like Andy Taylor than what I'd expect of the LAPD, but I'd call the LAPD if other options failed.

 

Again you admit that your perception is coloring your view. What *assumption* are you accusing me of making?

 

You are trying to create the impression that I'm unaware that other police jurisdictions follow a friendlier and more community-based model than the LAPD (which has not), but I'm aware that is the case. I still would not make it my first move (Andy Taylor living next door being the possible exception).

 

 

Nobody said it should be a first move. It would not be the OP's first move, if she called them now. She attempted to talk to the children (who ran away) and attempted to speak to the parents (who were not home).

 

I think it is definitely NOT OK for kids to be roaming into others' yards. Nobody is stopping them from riding bikes, playing outside, and what have you. But wandering into people's yards, ruining plants, destroying your stuff, is way over the line of "exploring." Plus, with kids 6 and under, it's very likely that at least one of them can't swim. That is pretty frightening to me if they have been unsupervised near your pond (and climbing over fences to get to it, if I remember right?! That's absurd).

I would not call CPS at this point, or the police. I would contact the parents through the note if necessary, ASAP. If they respond in a way that says "screw you" or you get the idea they are not going to comply with your wishes to keep their kids out of your yard, then I would call the police. Then you can say that you made the issue known to the parents and they have not changed their ways.

The pond thing is a big safety issue for those kids. How horrific would it be if one of them was face down in your pond one day? It would NOT be your fault... but horrible, and I cannot believe the parents don't know their kids are doing this.

I didn't read every single post, but are you saying the parents are at work and these kids are literally unattended?? If that is the case and you are quite sure of it, I might not even bother with the note and call the police asap. That is incredibly dangerous and foolish.

 

 

Exactly.

 

Oh, wow, this made me laugh!

"You are older than my parents."

It strikes me as funny. Anyone else? Just me?

 

 

Why is it funny? I think Bill is older than *my* parents.

[unsinkable]

 

 

I'll teach you whippersnappers to make fun of your elders :D

 

When I'm less tired.

 

Bill

 

 

Love this!

[Spy Car]

 

 

I tried to check his age on his profile. It says unknown. Maybe he is so old he lost track or forgot or something.

 

:lol:

 

Just kidding Bill!

 

 

I will be 55 on Sunday, and you guys are ruining by birthday :D

 

Bill

[Mrs Mungo]

 

 

I will be 55 on Sunday, and you guys are ruining by birthday :D

 

 

Ah, so slightly younger than my parents. ;)