Help, please. My 9.5 YO doesn't read.

[dorothythomas]

So I am really beginning to stress.

 

I posted here a couple of months ago about our homeschooling situation. Things are better now and more steady. We are doing WP Children from Around the World, slightly modified. He uses Math Mammoth 3A, Latina Christiana (at his request), Phonetic Zoo, and 20 minutes of reading time. Right now he is slogging his way through Harry Potter 3. We've read that together so he is really enjoying reading it by himself. It is very hard for him though. He doesn't want to read on his own. He got a letter today from a friend and I ended up reading it to him because he asked since it takes so much effort. I don't know where the break down is but he just is progressing soooooo slowly. We read aloud at night. Right now we are on the second Benedict Society book which he loves and he loves to listen to audio books well above his reading level, obsessively so in fact.

 

I had him tested, on the advice of lots of folks here, and nothing turned up. He does have some sensory issues but in general, they shouldn't interfere with his reading.

 

I am at a loss and embarrassed around other third grade parents at church whose kids are in school. Sure, my kid knows more about space than some astronomers, can knit a mean scarf, and can tell you what nearly every plant you find is called and used for, but he can't read well, his writing is below grade level and his math is close.

 

And more importantly, of course, I want to do my best by him. I want him to thrive and competent reading is such a big part of it. I feel like the middle school years are looming, and how do you do logic stage work if he can't read well. I am going crazy.

 

Anyone have any advice? I am at my wit's end.

[Ellie]

:grouphug:

 

Ok, well, actually, he *does* read, doesn't he? He just isn't reading at his age level yet. This is an important distinction. :-)

 

I'm going to recommend Spalding. I'd drop the Phonetic Zoo and required reading time. You will see *amazing* results in a fairly short amount of time with Spalding. Really. :-)

[EKS]

If he already knows basic phonics, you might try REWARDS Intermediate. It teaches how to read multisyllabic words in 25 lessons. Very powerful.

 

Also, I'd have him read aloud to you every single day at his fluency level, meaning where it is comfortable for him to read quickly and accurately. This will probably mean going back to 1st or 2nd grade books (Magic Tree House and the like perhaps). Have him read aloud for 20-30 minutes daily and gradually increase the reading level over time.

 

I know you said you had him tested. Did you have his vision checked by a developmental optometrist? If not, that's where I'd start.

[Alira]

First off, Harry Potter is well above a 3rd grade reading level. I would not be worried at all that a 9yo finds it difficult. Can he read books like The Boxcar Children, The Courage of Sarah Noble and Charlotte's Web without too much difficulty? I know our local public school reads all of those in 3rd grade, and kids who can read Harry Potter at that age would be considered well ahead of the class.

 

Have you tried any remedial reading programs, or redoing basic phonics? Phonics Pathways and Reading Pathways helped one of my boys tremendously in 3rd grade, but I'm sure there are plenty of good options.

[PollyOR]

In the same boat with an 11yo girl. My goal? Progress. :)

[Mom-ninja.]

I second REWARDS

[lewelma]

Harry Potter at 9? This is definitely reading.

 

I have been posting on developing advanced reading skills on this thread: http://forums.welltr...reading-skills/

 

It concerns nonfiction, but post 28 lays out the steps you need to follow to improve reading skills of young children. I discuss rewards and how to use them effectively.

 

Ruth in NZ

[Farrar]

Another vote that HP at 9 is great. Yes, there are kids that fly through it at age 6, but that doesn't mean a 9 yo is behind! I think the OP is being way too hard on herself and her kid.

 

In my opinion, he probably needs an easier series book to dive into. Sometimes easy and fun to help him improve his fluency. Like others are saying, there may be phonics issues too, but I would first just try to hook him on reading something at a lower level. Like, a second or third grade level.

[Ravin]

Interest has led progress for us. DD will read IF she's strongly interested. Usually, these are books her friends are reading that she wants to read, she's willing to try. When she first tried to read Diary of a Wimpy Kid, it was difficult for her, but she has since ready every single one of them, and moved on from there.

 

Your son is doing fine. HP is at a 4th-6th grade reading level. Kids vary widely in their skill level. The important thing is that he keeps slogging and finds intrinsic reward in doing so (sense of accomplishment, enjoyed the story, whatever). It sounds like that is happening.

[Trilliums]

I am at a loss and embarrassed around other third grade parents at church whose kids are in school. Sure, my kid knows more about space than some astronomers, can knit a mean scarf, and can tell you what nearly every plant you find is called and used for, but he can't read well, his writing is below grade level and his math is close.

 

And more importantly, of course, I want to do my best by him. I want him to thrive and competent reading is such a big part of it. I feel like the middle school years are looming, and how do you do logic stage work if he can't read well. I am going crazy.

 

Anyone have any advice? I am at my wit's end.

 

 

I was stressed too when DS was 9 and not reading. :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: He was also behind in math and handwriting.

 

For him, when he did learn to read (and write and work on math), his ability grew much faster than I expected. He did not slowly become a better reader and he did not stay behind. By the time he was in middle school (age 13-14) he was all caught up and now (age 16) he scores exceptionally high in reading comprehension tests (and other subjects). He has never learned to knit though. :)

 

He also loved audio books and could hold onto an incredible amount of information. He is an auditory learner and this has served him well in high school classes. He reads slowly but thoroughly. I hope your DS will progress in the same way. I wish I had a secret method to guarantee this, but I don't. I just kept loving and supporting him and I didn't push reading (we had already tried a few programs for dyslexics and they all caused incredible frustration). One thing that might have helped him was listening to audio books and then reading them. He did this with the Artemis Fowl books...I wonder if he basically memorized the audio and then deciphered the book from that.

[Sue G in PA]

My 10yo was reading 2 grade levels behind at the end of last school year. He just turned 10 at the end of Jan. and is in 4th grade. He was having difficulty with books like Frog and Toad. I was beside myself trying to figure out how to help him. His math is a grade level behind as well. Some days it "clicks" and others I wonder if he left his brain in bed. :glare: As for reading, he was making progress and I was happy. This year I stumbled upon Read Live/ Read Naturally online. I used the free 30 day trial and it has been the single most effective thing I have tried with him! I did an informal reading level test with him a couple weeks ago and he score a 4.1 (4th grade, 1st month!). I was beyond shocked and thrilled! He is now tackling books like Magic Treehouse with some ease and asking to read harder books. He has a long way to go but this is real progress. His writing? Ugh. Let's not even go there. :glare:

[blessed3x]

My DS10 is *just* now beginning to read and enjoy it. Give him time.

 

He has not interest in Harry Potter and is still intimidated by larger books, but *loves* biographies and science type books.

 

Find something that he enjoys reading or that he is interested in and encourage him to read daily. It will come.

[JanetC]

While I agree with the others that Harry Potter is great for 3rd grade, I also think moms shouldn't ignore a little voice in their head telling them "something isn't right."

 

What kind of testing have you done? If you've tested for dyslexia, maybe you need in-depth vision testing, or vice-versa. Some subtle problems do require a highly knowledgeable tester. There is actually a whole branch of "2E" learning disabilities where the child is gifted in some areas, which masks weaknesses in other areas, and these types of LDs are the hardest to diagnose.

 

Have you thought though your family tree? (For my own DD, who struggles with reading, she comes from a long line of family members with various vision issues. Her specific issue is different, but still it made sense after thinking through her history to include a developmental optometrist when trying to piece together a puzzle.)

 

If he has cousins the same age who are not great readers, then the diagnoses would be useful to know. For aunts/uncles and especially grandparents, kids with learning problems were more likely to be labeled as dumb or lazy than to get a specific learning disability diagnosis. Still, talking with those family members might help with getting a sense of what your DS might be going through.

 

Good luck!

[ElizabethB]

What did you use to teach? Did you use any sight words?

 

Have you used any of my diagnostic and reading grade level tests? I would give the NRRF part 1 diagnostic phonics test, then the part 2 grade level test. If the NRRF grade level is 1st grade or lower, give the MWIA level I (page 6 of the MWIA.) Make 2 copies of the page, and time teach portion, the phonetic and holistic. Mark any errors on your version (for example, if "frog" is read as "fog," write fog over frog on your copy. If you don't have time to write out the misses, just put an x through the word for a miss. Write S/C for a self correct that is eventually right--for example, "pack, wait, no, it's pick." (if the word was pick.) If the NRRF grade level is 2nd grade or higher, give the MWIA version II, pages 7 and 8. Make 2 copies of each page. Then, give my New Elizabethian Test.

 

(You can do the tests over a few days if needed. Do the MWIA all in one day with a break of 5 - 10 minutes between the 2 portions.)

 

Based on the scores, the type of errors on the MWIA, and what you used to teach, I will have different recommendations. (I have tutored remedial reading for 19 years.)

[FriedClams]

What did you use to teach? Did you use any sight words?

 

Have you used any of my diagnostic and reading grade level tests? I would give the NRRF part 1 diagnostic phonics test, then the part 2 grade level test. If the NRRF grade level is 1st grade or lower, give the MWIA level I (page 6 of the MWIA.) Make 2 copies of the page, and time teach portion, the phonetic and holistic. Mark any errors on your version (for example, if "frog" is read as "fog," write fog over frog on your copy. If you don't have time to write out the misses, just put an x through the word for a miss. Write S/C for a self correct that is eventually right--for example, "pack, wait, no, it's pick." (if the word was pick.) If the NRRF grade level is 2nd grade or higher, give the MWIA version II, pages 7 and 8. Make 2 copies of each page. Then, give my New Elizabethian Test.

 

(You can do the tests over a few days if needed. Do the MWIA all in one day with a break of 5 - 10 minutes between the 2 portions.)

 

Based on the scores, the type of errors on the MWIA, and what you used to teach, I will have different recommendations. (I have tutored remedial reading for 19 years.)

 

 

I agree with Elizabeth and others on doing more specific diagnosis.

 

HP is a great read for a 3rd grader, but it sounds from your wording that he's not embracing and "reading" it but laboring through it. I think the standard is if a student needs help with 5 words on a page it's technically above their reading level. If he's reading it but slowly - then that would lead me to believe it's a practice issue. If he's laboring - then I think you're being reasonable in wanting to see if there's more to his lack of progress with reading.

 

The other thing I'd gently ask is are you doing too much for him and making it too easy for him to not read? If my son got a letter, I'd sit with him as he read it, but I would be really hard pressed to do it for him. Do you read thing for him that he can do - but are hard? Do you have him read directions to his math, and explain them to you - or do you do it for him? Yes, it is quicker to do it yourself, but if he's capable - even though it's hard - I'd have him read it to you. Every single thing. Make brownies - but he reads the directions and directs you... Read the paper and follow a favorite team... Do the daily family bible reading... You get the idea. Practice can be worked in throughout the day in painless ways.

 

:-) Hang in there!! You can do it!! You're a great mom for finding ways to better help your kid!! Go Mom!!

[dorothythomas]

What did you use to teach? Did you use any sight words?

 

Have you used any of my diagnostic and reading grade level tests? I would give the NRRF part 1 diagnostic phonics test, then the part 2 grade level test. If the NRRF grade level is 1st grade or lower, give the MWIA level I (page 6 of the MWIA.) Make 2 copies of the page, and time teach portion, the phonetic and holistic. Mark any errors on your version (for example, if "frog" is read as "fog," write fog over frog on your copy. If you don't have time to write out the misses, just put an x through the word for a miss. Write S/C for a self correct that is eventually right--for example, "pack, wait, no, it's pick." (if the word was pick.) If the NRRF grade level is 2nd grade or higher, give the MWIA version II, pages 7 and 8. Make 2 copies of each page. Then, give my New Elizabethian Test.

 

(You can do the tests over a few days if needed. Do the MWIA all in one day with a break of 5 - 10 minutes between the 2 portions.)

 

Based on the scores, the type of errors on the MWIA, and what you used to teach, I will have different recommendations. (I have tutored remedial reading for 19 years.)

 

 

 

Wow. I am totally doing these over the next few days. THANK YOU. I will post what I find.

 

As far as teaching to read, it was really piecemeal. He kind of got taught at 3-4 by a preschool teacher using phonics mostly. Then I went through a Waldorf phase and so we did no reading work for a year or so. Then I realized that wasn't serving us well. So I started using a second grade curriculum and realized we were behind. So I started teaching both my kids ( my youngest was 5) phonics together. He rebelled because he knew some of it already and was unhappy being grouped in with younger sis. So I started AAS with him and did year 1 and 2 and I saw the most improvement then but he started to hate it and it was so intensive. So we moved away from it and that is where we are.

 

I did not serve my son well. Now that I have figured more out, I am trying to fix that.

[ElizabethB]

Wow. I am totally doing these over the next few days. THANK YOU. I will post what I find.

 

As far as teaching to read, it was really piecemeal. He kind of got taught at 3-4 by a preschool teacher using phonics mostly. Then I went through a Waldorf phase and so we did no reading work for a year or so. Then I realized that wasn't serving us well. So I started using a second grade curriculum and realized we were behind. So I started teaching both my kids ( my youngest was 5) phonics together. He rebelled because he knew some of it already and was unhappy being grouped in with younger sis. So I started AAS with him and did year 1 and 2 and I saw the most improvement then but he started to hate it and it was so intensive. So we moved away from it and that is where we are.

 

I did not serve my son well. Now that I have figured more out, I am trying to fix that.

 

 

You're welcome!

 

It sounds like the most like thing is that he just needs a bit more phonics work. There are some great things out there for an older child. Here are 3 quick ideas:

 

1. My phonics lessons! (Free online, they do use the book of Romans.)

 

2. The things on my how to tutor page.

 

3. We All Can Read, 3rd grade and above.

[dorothythomas]

Well I went ahead and did Part 1 of the NRRF test and he did fine. By the end of the last section he was really having to work to decode the words but he was able to do it without missing one or making mistakes. That's good, right? It is just hard for him to read. I'll be doing the other tests over the next few days so as not to burn him out.

[ElizabethB]

Well I went ahead and did Part 1 of the NRRF test and he did fine. By the end of the last section he was really having to work to decode the words but he was able to do it without missing one or making mistakes. That's good, right? It is just hard for him to read. I'll be doing the other tests over the next few days so as not to burn him out.

 

 

That is good!

 

Many boys (and some girls) need a lot of practice before they are reading fluently. I am working a lot harder with my son than I had to with my daughter, he needs about 100 times more repetition than she did for phonics. Of course, he needs less repetition in math and science. My daughter was reading anything fluently by now...my 2nd grade son is still reviewing basic phonics and building up his fluency.

 

Also, my son needs phonics practice over the summer or it all jumps out of the brain. My daughter needs math practice over the summer but never needed phonics practice, even the summer after she learned to read. Math does not jump out of my son's brain. During the summers, we take a few weeks off and then do their jump out of the brain subjects twice a week.

[imagine.more]

It sounds like he would benefit most from some fluency and confidence-building work. I've done this with both an advanced student I had as a teacher and my own oldest son. I'd give him lower level books on topics that interest him. Harry Potter 3 is a 5-6th grade reading level both in words and content, it's fine for a 3rd grader to read it but certainly not expected. I'd look for 2-3rd grade books and even a smattering of silly K-1st grade level books (under the guise of reading to a younger sibling to 'help' you out ideally). Take the pressure off as much as possible and restore his confidence by letting him read these at his leisure every single day.

 

I would also be sure, if you're not already, to do a solid spelling program with him. These can often be a good phonics review in case he has any small gaps since his reading instruction has been a bit hodge podged. But really this sounds like a fluency issue, which is common with bright kids who learn to read early with just a little instruction. Once his fluency picks up his comprehension will improve and so will his enjoyment.

[jetzmama]

We don't do the full Spalding method (SWR) b/c I got bogged down in the prep work when I tried it with my olders. BUT, you can order just the flashcards for the 70 phonemes now and memorize them. Have seen a huge difference in reading skill, level since starting these w/ 9yo in Jan. (had same result with middle using these flashcards several years ago).

 

I told ds he was learning these sounds to help make reading and spelling make more sense. After the first 15 or sounds were introduced, we began playing a game on the steps. I showed him the card. If he knew the answer and got it right, he could jump down one step. If he answered wrong he had to jump back a step. If he didn't know, he had the option of asking for help and remaining on the same step. The goal is to jump all the way down and back up the stairs more times than the previous day. 10-15 minutes a day, consistently, has maxed a marked improvement in reading and helped me realize there are other underlying issues in spelling. When there is a phoneme he struggles with, or for the similar ones (er, ir, ur, ear, wor) I do spend a few minutes reviewing those on the whiteboard ... Sometimes drawing pictures to help his VSL style. This is one of his favorite activities during the day!

 

I would recommend that if you get only the flashcards and not the whole program that you watch some you tube instructional videos since most of us have our own regional form of English that we unknowingly include with our sounds. The videos can help to be sure the sounds are being pronounced correctly.

[Jungle Mama]

My just turned 11yo ds is a late reader, only really progressing this year. Our library was good and recommended some books that are interesting to boys but not too hard. They are the Zac Power series published in Australia and are graded books. They really don't look like baby readers so they are going down well here. The other books I am finding that he likes to read are the Asterix and Obelix comic books. He takes a long time to read them but he is recalling what he has read. I figure slow decoding is better than no decoding.

 

My eldest, now 14yo, was a late reader too, about 9 years old, but for him it just clicked and he went from Wimpy Kid to chapter books very quickly.

 

My 8yo ds reads fluently and has for almost a year.

 

I have no clue why the differences. The late starters have all had various medical check ups and there has been no notable reason for the delay. I figure time heals all wounds/problems. Not much help I know, but maybe if you have checked everything else then time is the best answer.

 

Best wishes

Jen in Oz

 

http://hardiegrant.com.au/egmont/books/zac-power/~/link.aspx?_id=3EF12359E685458F85496264F34E154D&_z=z

 

Edited to add website for Zac Power books.

Edited April 20, 2013 by Jungle Mama

[kiwik]

My just turned 11yo ds is a late reader, only really progressing this year. Our library was good and recommended some books that are interesting to boys but not too hard. They are the Zac Power series published in Australia and are graded books. They really don't look like baby readers so they are going down well here. The other books I am finding that he likes to read are the Asterix and Obelix comic books. He takes a long time to read them but he is recalling what he has read. I figure slow decoding is better than no decoding.

 

My eldest, now 14yo, was a late reader too, about 9 years old, but for him it just clicked and he went from Wimpy Kid to chapter books very quickly.

 

My 8yo ds reads fluently and has for almost a year.

 

I have no clue why the differences. The late starters have all had various medical check ups and there has been no notable reason for the delay. I figure time heals all wounds/problems. Not much help I know, but maybe if you have checked everything else then time is the best answer.

 

Best wishes

Jen in Oz

 

http://hardiegrant.com.au/egmont/books/zac-power/~/link.aspx?_id=3EF12359E685458F85496264F34E154D&_z=z

 

Edited to add website for Zac Power books.

 

 

The boys do like them don't they? I just wish there was something between spy camp/test drive which are too easy for my son and the standard ones. I am sure he could read them but he is not ready to try. He is reading magic treehouse instead but we are about to run out of the librarie's supply of those.

[Julie Smith]

If you want to build fluency and confidence the "Secrets of Droon" series could be perfect for him.

 

It was on some important list as one of the top ten series to read when waiting for the next Harry Potter book. So it's likely that he would like it. The series starts out with short easy chapter books. A mere 80 pages and then builds up in difficulty, length, and content till you reach book 44.