Plaid Dad Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnTheBrink Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 :iagree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinmom Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 :iagree::iagree::iagree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragons in the flower bed Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 :iagree::iagree::iagree: Gosh, agree would have been a totally better word to use than approve, which I copied from the rep form out of writer's block when I repped PlaidDad . . . duh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle in MO Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Plaid Dad. I'm beginning to understand the wisdom of this more and more. :) :iagree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plaid Dad Posted August 2, 2008 Author Share Posted August 2, 2008 The ignore list is your friend. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinmom Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Yeah, definitely...but how do you ignore someone when they are constantly quoted by others who've been ticked off? It becomes difficult to do! Plaid Dad, your advice is the only way to go...stop feeding it altogether! It would take everyone to do this, so sadly I don't see it happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Yep. :iagree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenschooler Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Oh, darn. I'm such a sucker for them. Sorry, won't do it again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama Lynx Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Ugh. I usually don't. But I just was not able to practice restraint this morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starlashine Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Seriously. I was away for 1hr + it has already grown to 5 pages! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I don't consider him a troll. Yes, he often posts with an eye toward stirring the pot (even if he won't admit that), but he also contributes regular ol' stuff like anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom2GirlsTX Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 :iagree: Now I have to figure out what you guys are talking about...LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I don't consider him a troll. Yes, he often posts with an eye toward stirring the pot (even if he won't admit that), but he also contributes regular ol' stuff like anyone else. Maybe it should be qualified with don't feed Phred with regards to certain topics. :tongue_smilie: I agree he probably is not a real troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacqui in mo Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I agree I don't think Phred is a troll. Just very, very assertive in his beliefs & proselytizing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie in CA Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Ok now I get it, but it's so fun to watch and makes life interesting.:lurk5: Laurie in CA;) (dd 14) TOG and some other stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFP Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 If anyone's truly interested in internet trolls and not just another round of Phred-bashing, there's a lengthy article in the New York Times this week that would be worth your time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 If anyone's truly interested in internet trolls and not just another round of Phred-bashing... I specifically didn't engage in bashing of any sort, as you might note if you read my previous reply to this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camy-7 boybarians 1 lady Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I just like the way it is spelled..."Ph"-r-e-d. Kewl. Kinda like "Ph"-r-e-a-k-i-n. LOL. Blessings, Camy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFP Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Colleen, I read, I noted, and I specifically wasn't talking about you even though I failed to deem it necessary to exclude you by name in my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
readwithem Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I just like the way it is spelled..."Ph"-r-e-d. Kewl. Kinda like "Ph"-r-e-a-k-i-n. LOL. Blessings, Camy I think of it like "Phish" :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom to Aly Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 OK, someone please explain, I have no idea what you are talking about. Enquiring people wanna' know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy in TN Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 While I have come to believe- There is no compulsion in religion, for the right way is clearly from the wrong way. Whoever therefore rejects the forces of evil and believes in God, he has taken hold of a support most unfailing, which shall never give way, for God is All Hearing and Knowing. I also feel that if someone asks- and I say to you, Ask, and it shall be given to you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened to you then I feel strongly that I should- proclaim the good news to all the creation. Phred knows that he is seeking or he would not have asked. If God wills, an answer may open for him through a post. Good grief- for someone who is IRL not particularly religious, I sure am coming across that way. Someone who is a devout, practicing believer should probably come help me out of this hole I have dug. Bleh, lightning may be striking my house today. Mandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenny in Atl Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I agree I don't think Phred is a troll. Just very, very assertive in his beliefs & proselytizing. I like you... you are free to sit at my table anytime. I'll be with the arty odd ball kids no one else likes to talk to. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy in TN Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I like you... you are free to sit at my table anytime. I'll be with the arty odd ball kids no one else likes to talk to. :D :iagree: me, too! Mandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom to Aly Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Um, just got it. Isn't there something in the rules that says specifically not to bash others? And aren't you all just a little bit ashamed of yourselves? I thought we were supposed to be the grownups here. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Um, just got it. Isn't there something in the rules that says specifically not to bash others? And aren't you all just a little bit ashamed of yourselves? I thought we were supposed to be the grownups here. :( Ashamed to point out that we shouldn't 'feed' a person who likes to stir up controversy? Ummm....no. I'm not ashamed. I don't think this thread is a Phred bashing thread...someone called it that, but I don't think that is what it is. Just because his behavior is being specifically mentioned doesn't mean we are bashing him. I guess calling him a troll could be considered bashing...but I think the main point was stop arguing with him because he just likes to argue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phred Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 You guys don't get it. You live by a double standard. You're free to praise your god and pat each other on the back and spend page after page after page going on about how wonderful he is... but when I decline to post within that thread and rather start my own, with a disclaimer right off the top, that suggests such posts are nonsense... I'm a troll and starting trouble. If you can praise your god I can not praise it. And I can seek to not praise it with others who think like I do. I know they're here, they've just been bashed into silence. One person thinking something weird... that's a nut. A whole bunch of people thinking something weird, that's a church... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiver0f10 Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 :iagree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I don't think most of you have been on a board infested with real trolls. Someone with a minority opinion and likes to debate is not necessarily a troll. I do think there are people who could pay a little bit more heed to specific board culture but there are probably people who think that of me. eta: I didn't see the original thread that inspired this post, I am speaking generally. Just for the record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 ... I'm a troll and starting trouble. It does seem like you like to start trouble. Shrug. At the very least those of us who don't agree with you should stop engaging with you in those discussions because it is futile. Clearly, I don't have the will power to not engage. :) I'm going to work on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiver0f10 Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 You guys don't get it. You live by a double standard. You're free to praise your god and pat each other on the back and spend page after page after page going on about how wonderful he is... but when I decline to post within that thread and rather start my own, with a disclaimer right off the top, that suggests such posts are nonsense... I'm a troll and starting trouble. If you can praise your god I can not praise it. And I can seek to not praise it with others who think like I do. I know they're here, they've just been bashed into silence. One person thinking something weird... that's a nut. A whole bunch of people thinking something weird, that's a church... When people are posting about praising God they are doing it to , well praise God. You on the other hand post things like your thread just to get people riled up. There is a difference. Maybe you need a hobbey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy in TN Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 If you can praise your god I can not praise it. And I can seek to not praise it with others who think like I do. I know they're here, they've just been bashed into silence. One person thinking something weird... that's a nut. A whole bunch of people thinking something weird, that's a church... Your stance isn't wierd or even uncommon. There are athiest forums. If you wanted like-minded responses, you would post there. Back to common ground- your faith (network of values, beliefs, etc.) is how you see the world just as my faith is how I see the world. I bet we could find lots of thing that we have in common.:) Mandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnTheBrink Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 You guys don't get it. You live by a double standard. You're free to praise your god and pat each other on the back and spend page after page after page going on about how wonderful he is... but when I decline to post within that thread and rather start my own, with a disclaimer right off the top, that suggests such posts are nonsense... I'm a troll and starting trouble. If you can praise your god I can not praise it. And I can seek to not praise it with others who think like I do. I know they're here, they've just been bashed into silence. One person thinking something weird... that's a nut. A whole bunch of people thinking something weird, that's a church... Here's the difference, Phred. When someone posts praising God, it has nothing to do with you, your beliefs or what you think of their post. It just doesn't. It's not about you. It really really isn't. When you post one of your famous, "I don't believe in God and think those of you who do are fools" posts, it IS about other people. It's not about what you believe or don't believe, it's about publicly bashing Christians. When people post their praise for God, they're not bashing non-believers. When you post about NOT praising God, it's all about bashing believers. You may be sincerely struggling with all this; with Christianity, with God, with faith. And if you are, I truly hope you find answers. But my feeling is (and granted, feelings are simply feelings) that you simply want to irritate people then point out how flawed they are. If you find joy in that, well, that's sad. And frankly, I'd think you'd be bored with it by now. I hope the truth of the matter is that you're struggling. Because if the truth is that you just want to irritate people, what a sad statement that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genie Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I don't think Phred is a troll. I think he's someone with strong beliefs who enjoys arguing. I totally get that and enjoy his presence on this board. So while I agree with the concept of not feeding trolls, I don't think it applies here. I think it's much clearer and more productive to say, "Don't open threads started by posters who get you riled up if you don't like being riled up." But for those who enjoy the debate, why not allow them to have their thread? Why tell people not to dialog with someone if they clearly feel compelled to? I'm not trying to criticize Plaid Dad, because I have a huge amount of respect for him. I just really don't like the idea of a group of people trying to tell someone else they ought not post. That seems like the admin's job. And they're pretty good at doing it when they feel it's called for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parabola Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Phred's not a troll. But I guess it has been awhile since we thoroughly bashed him, so this was due huh? I would've loved to chat in his thread, its something I've wondered about myself. I'm sad it got deleted, a good discussion with other atheists would've been fun for me. There's plenty of room here for all world views, everyone keeps saying that. If there's room for CC in a thread, why isn't there room for AC? Oh, and I've said it before: if you don't like to read Phred, don't open his threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I think it's much clearer and more productive to say, "Don't open threads started by posters who get you riled up if you don't like being riled up." I don't mind being riled up so to speak. Not that Phred riles me up. However, the main reason I wish I would avoid posting in those kinds of threads is because it is so pointless. He doesn't care one bit about what *I* think or how I arrived at that conclusion. He just appears to want to stir the pot. If he really wanted to just talk to other atheists about how stupid Christian reasoning is he could easiy find people to talk to him about that. In fact, he could have put 'Christians enter at your own risk--atheist discussion here.' And then I doubt people would have 'bit' on the chance to explain things to him. Instead he put 'if you are offended by the questioning of beliefs'...which led me and others to think he wanted a discussion about such beliefs. I should have known better. I've been on the boards long enough to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I would've loved to chat in his thread, its something I've wondered about myself. I'm sad it got deleted, a good discussion with other atheists would've been fun for me. There's plenty of room here for all world views, everyone keeps saying that. If there's room for CC in a thread, why isn't there room for AC? There is room, but let's consider this rationally. Let's say I, as a Christian, have questions about Islam (for example). Would a post like this be fruitful: "I really want to understand the Islamic faith. How could the Qur'an be the perfect word of Allah? There is no Allah! I really want to understand this. And by the way, I don't want any Muslims to answer this. I'm only interested in discussion with other atheists." Is that logical? Asking questions about a faith while simultaneously refusing to entertain discussion with persons of that faith? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragons in the flower bed Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 You guys don't get it. You live by a double standard. You're free to praise your god and pat each other on the back and spend page after page after page going on about how wonderful he is... but when I decline to post within that thread and rather start my own, with a disclaimer right off the top, that suggests such posts are nonsense... I'm a troll and starting trouble.. We on this forum have agreed to disagree, when it comes to religion, to overlook it, and discuss the topic at hand rather than our various religious approaches to it. Those labels -- CC or AC or PC -- are there NOT to provide a safe covering under which one may break that guideline, but to to assist each other in politely ignoring that content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragons in the flower bed Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I just really don't like the idea of a group of people trying to tell someone else they ought not post. That seems like the admin's job. And they're pretty good at doing it when they feel it's called for. I feel it's important that the group speaks up about what they prefer, what they want the board to be, rather than just leaving it up to admin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parabola Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 There is room, but let's consider this rationally. Let's say I, as a Christian, have questions about Islam (for example). Would a post like this be fruitful: "I really want to understand the Islamic faith. How could the Qur'an be the perfect word of Allah? There is no Allah! I really want to understand this. And by the way, I don't want any Muslims to answer this. I'm only interested in discussion with other atheists." Is that logical? Asking questions about a faith while simultaneously refusing to entertain discussion with persons of that faith? There are times when I want to discuss christianity with other atheists, its a very different discussion then when christians are involved. So yes, I think its logical. Maybe he didn't want to learn about the faith, maybe he wanted to discuss the psychology of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genie Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 He doesn't care one bit about what *I* think or how I arrived at that conclusion. He just appears to want to stir the pot. He enjoys debate. One of my best friends and I argue all the time, and we LOVE that we can do that with each other, because there aren't a lot of us out there. Someone standing on the outside of one of our debates might think we were about to tear each other's heads off. But we completely enjoy it. It gets our juices flowing. It's never about convincing the other person of our view, sometimes it's just to help us cement our own beliefs. Every great once in a while, one of us actually does change our opinion. But that's not what it's about. And it's not about stirring the pot. It's about enjoying lively debate with people. If he really wanted to just talk to other atheists about how stupid Christian reasoning is he could easiy find people to talk to him about that. In fact, he could have put 'Christians enter at your own risk--atheist discussion here.' And then I doubt people would have 'bit' on the chance to explain things to him. Instead he put 'if you are offended by the questioning of beliefs'...which led me and others to think he wanted a discussion about such beliefs. I should have known better. I've been on the boards long enough to know. I agree that there are many places on the internet where he could go to find great dialog about atheist opinions, or evolution, or whatever hot topic. Just like many of us could go to a forum specifically about vacuum cleaners, and get great information, possibly better than we could get here. But we still come here, and we still talk about things that could be discussed in greater detail some other place. I wish the thread hadn't been deleted, because I can't remember his wording exactly. I remember he DID warn people about the atheistic content of his thread. But I didn't understand him to be asking for Christian opinions. Like I said, I wish it hadn't been deleted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PariSarah Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 There's plenty of room here for all world views, everyone keeps saying that. If there's room for CC in a thread, why isn't there room for AC? Oh, and I've said it before: if you don't like to read Phred, don't open his threads. . . . posting a CC warning is intended to allow those who don't care to read Christian threads to avoid them, not to exclude non-Christians from participation. And people who post silly or controversial things in those CC-labeled posts get the same kind of responses Phred did--they get persons of other faiths or no faith (or radically different Christian faith) challenging them. I'm sorry, but despite Phred's protestations of a double standard, we're all subject to the same kinds of responses Phred got. When you ask questions or make challenging statements, you get responses. If you ask for advice, you get it. If you put limiters on your post--"Please no spanking suggestions" or "Vegetarian recipes only" or "Biblical perspective needed"--the long-term posters around here will generallyrespect that. There are some social klutzes, for sure (I can't figure out why everyone was spouting Bible verses at Phred in the deleted thread, for example), but that's grist for the mill. You're in an online forum. It's gonna happen. "Be a man! Take some Pepto Bismol and get over here!" Uh, I mean, IT. Get over it. I don't really have any patience with the "pity me, the poor persecuted minority" attitude when it comes to participating in an open forum like this. It's the maladie du siecle. People disagree with each other around here. Publicly. And because we're interested in good education, people tend to be very good at making their arguments around here. If you want to have a conversation ONLY with people who agree with you, this is just not the place to be. And that's true for all of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genie Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Is that logical? Asking questions about a faith while simultaneously refusing to entertain discussion with persons of that faith? Here's how I saw it. Picture an old man asking, "What's with kids today?" He's not looking for a response from a kid. He wants other old timers to chime in and say, "Yeah, look at them putting crazy-colored streaks in their hair and listening to that rock n' roll music." But I've come to realize that I obviously read Phred's posts in a totally different way than most people. :tongue_smilie: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 He enjoys debate. One of my best friends and I argue all the time, and we LOVE that we can do that with each other, because there aren't a lot of us out there. I agree that there are many places on the internet where he could go to find great dialog about atheist opinions, or evolution, or whatever hot topic. Just like many of us could go to a forum specifically about vacuum cleaners, and get great information, possibly better than we could get here. But we still come here, and we still talk about things that could be discussed in greater detail some other place. I wish the thread hadn't been deleted, because I can't remember his wording exactly. I remember he DID warn people about the atheistic content of his thread. But I didn't understand him to be asking for Christian opinions. Like I said, I wish it hadn't been deleted. In hindsight, and should have been foresight, I am SURE he wasn't asking for Christian's thoughts. However, his wording was 'warning for those offended by questioning of beliefs.' I guess he didn't want to question Christians ABOUT their beliefs. He only wanted to question other atheists on HOW Christians could believe that nonsense. Or so it seems now. I guess he could tell us what he really meant. And I didn't mean he should leave the boards to discuss his feelings. I just think he could be a little more clear that he wants to discuss that silly little thing called belief in god/God with other atheists and that he is NOT interested in hearing how we feel about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 There are times when I want to discuss christianity with other atheists, its a very different discussion then when christians are involved. So yes, I think its logical. Maybe he didn't want to learn about the faith, maybe he wanted to discuss the psychology of it. If the goal is not merely discussion, but to truly want to understand (those were Phred's words), how does rejecting discussion help attain better understanding of the psychology? Beyond that, if you initiate a discussion here specifically with other atheists, do you intentionally insult those of other faiths in the process? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinmom Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 . . . posting a CC warning is intended to allow those who don't care to read Christian threads to avoid them, not to exclude non-Christians from participation. And people who post silly or controversial things in those CC-labeled posts get the same kind of responses Phred did--they get persons of other faiths or no faith (or radically different Christian faith) challenging them. I'm sorry, but despite Phred's protestations of a double standard, we're all subject to the same kinds of responses Phred got. When you ask questions or make challenging statements, you get responses. If you ask for advice, you get it. If you put limiters on your post--"Please no spanking suggestions" or "Vegetarian recipes only" or "Biblical perspective needed"--the long-term posters around here will generallyrespect that. There are some social klutzes, for sure (I can't figure out why everyone was spouting Bible verses at Phred in the deleted thread, for example), but that's grist for the mill. You're in an online forum. It's gonna happen. "Be a man! Take some Pepto Bismol and get over here!" Uh, I mean, IT. Get over it. I don't really have any patience with the "pity me, the poor persecuted minority" attitude when it comes to participating in an open forum like this. It's the maladie du siecle. People disagree with each other around here. Publicly. And because we're interested in good education, people tend to be very good at making their arguments around here. If you want to have a conversation ONLY with people who agree with you, this is just not the place to be. And that's true for all of us. :iagree: I think you nailed it here, Sarah! Couldn't have said it better if I tried, really...you are very eloquent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I don't really have any patience with the "pity me, the poor persecuted minority" attitude when it comes to participating in an open forum like this. It's the maladie du siecle. People disagree with each other around here. Publicly. And because we're interested in good education, people tend to be very good at making their arguments around here. If you want to have a conversation ONLY with people who agree with you, this is just not the place to be. And that's true for all of us. Bravo. Nicely said. Spot on. I agree....even with that French stuff.;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genie Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I feel it's important that the group speaks up about what they prefer, what they want the board to be, rather than just leaving it up to admin. I don't disagree with you. People SHOULD voice their opinions. It just bothers me when it starts to feel like bullying. But in all reality, it shouldn't bother me, because obviously Phred is a big boy who can stand up for himself. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 . . . There are some social klutzes, for sure (I can't figure out why everyone was spouting Bible verses at Phred in the deleted thread, for example), but that's grist for the mill. Yes...well social klutz here....I can't remember if I spouted Bible verses or not, but this is what I meant when I said I wish I had not engaged. There was really no point and I had hit 'submit' before I remembered that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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