This isn't working - is it curriculum, schedule, what?

[bnrmom]

I'm feeling increasingly frustrated with the attitude of the kids and our progress. Part of it is me feeling like we have no direction. I feel good about math (they're both using Math Mammoth) but right now our Language Arts is incredibly scattered. Dh is doing some social studies with them (beginning of humans/evolution), and we haven't started science yet. So I'm feeling like I'm not doing very well. And then there are the attitudes I'm dealing with.

 

For instance, in ds10's math lesson today there were directions about shortcuts when multiplying numbers with zeros (like 380 x 260). The instructions showed the examples of how you could just multiply 38x26 and then add the two zeros. Then there was a graph paper section where you were supposed to work some of the problems.

 

I told ds to read the directions, and ask me if he had any questions, because I was working with my 7yo. When he came about 1/2 hour later, he showed me the worked problems. He had done them all just as he always done, and had not practiced the shortcut. When I asked him about it, he admitted he hadn't read the directions at all. In addition, he didn't use the graph paper, and instead wrote in huge numbers all over one page, and had torn out two small pieces of paper from a notebook, done one problem on each, and taped them into the book.

 

This makes me furious. Yes, he did the math (although not in the way the lesson was teaching), but he really needs to learn how to work within a given context. He's always trying to circle and draw lines from one thing to another instead of writing it out. Or he tries to use an existing number in a word problem as one of the addends and put the other addend on top of it to make an equation.

 

Ds7 whines EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. we sit down to do schoolwork. He then zooms through it, as he learns it all very quickly. But there's always the whining factor.

 

Then there's the tipping back the chairs. The throwing pencils around. Starving or needing water right after we get started. Using the pencil with the stupid blue eraser even though it leaves blue streaks and doesn't erase well. Being silly with their answers and writing sixteen zeros off the side of the page just to make a big number. They stop working the second I walk out of the room to help the other one. I end up frustrated and yelling, then the tears start, and now it's been 2 hours and we've gotten barely anything done.

 

I feel like they hate school just as much here as they did in school, and at this point they were probably learning more in school, so what are we doing exactly?

[bnrmom]

This is technically our third week, but is really more like our second week as we had an interruption the first week.

 

I also feel like we're not doing any games or projects or anything fun, but I'm spending so much time pulling teeth just to get the basics done I'm not sure how to add those in.

Edited September 12, 2011 by bnrmom

[SorrelZG]

I'm not experienced enough to give any advice so I just came to give hugs.

:grouphug:

[TxMama]

.

 

 

I told ds to read the directions, and ask me if he had any questions, because I was working with my 7yo. When he came about 1/2 hour later, he showed me the worked problems. He had done them all just as he always done, and had not practiced the shortcut. When I asked him about it, he admitted he hadn't read the directions at all.

 

 

I don't expect my kids to be this independant at age 10. One quick, easy solution is to have him read the directions in your presence. Then you clarify with him how he is to solve the problems.

 

Set up some sort of reward/consequence for not following through. Example, if you do as expected then you can watch videos for 1 hour after school. If you do not do as expected then no videos. Of course, set the consequence/reward as you see fit for your family and it needs to motivate him to follow through with directions.

 

 

 

Ds7 whines EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. we sit down to do schoolwork. He then zooms through it, as he learns it all very quickly. But there's always the whining factor.

 

Same as above. Set a consequence/reward for getting through school work without whinning.

 

 

Then there's the tipping back the chairs. The throwing pencils around. Starving or needing water right after we get started. Using the pencil with the stupid blue eraser even though it leaves blue streaks and doesn't erase well. Being silly with their answers and writing sixteen zeros off the side of the page just to make a big number. They stop working the second I walk out of the room to help the other one. I end up frustrated and yelling, then the tears start, and now it's been 2 hours and we've gotten barely anything done.

 

I feel like they hate school just as much here as they did in school, and at this point they were probably learning more in school, so what are we doing exactly?

 

 

I pick one habit to work on at a time. If I were having multiple issues, then I would remove as many other temptations as possible. I'm just tossing ideas out now...... Stand to do work to eliminate chair tipping. 1 pencil and if they toss it then they can do their lesson in the girly pink crayon. Throw the blue eraser away. Work with 1 child at a time but explain that tv/games/etc. don't come on until all schoolwork is done by both children.

 

HTH

[Chris in VA]

I'm feeling increasingly frustrated with the attitude of the kids and our progress. Part of it is me feeling like we have no direction. I feel good about math (they're both using Math Mammoth) but right now our Language Arts is incredibly scattered. Dh is doing some social studies with them (beginning of humans/evolution), and we haven't started science yet. So I'm feeling like I'm not doing very well. And then there are the attitudes I'm dealing with.

 

For instance, in ds10's math lesson today there were directions about shortcuts when multiplying numbers with zeros (like 380 x 260). The instructions showed the examples of how you could just multiply 38x26 and then add the two zeros. Then there was a graph paper section where you were supposed to work some of the problems.

 

I told ds to read the directions, and ask me if he had any questions, because I was working with my 7yo. When he came about 1/2 hour later, he showed me the worked problems. He had done them all just as he always done, and had not practiced the shortcut. When I asked him about it, he admitted he hadn't read the directions at all. In addition, he didn't use the graph paper, and instead wrote in huge numbers all over one page, and had torn out two small pieces of paper from a notebook, done one problem on each, and taped them into the book. Sounds like this lesson needs to be done again. Properly. Tell him that, without anger.

 

This makes me furious. :grouphug:

 

Yes, he did the math (although not in the way the lesson was teaching), but he really needs to learn how to work within a given context. Yep. Give him the chance to learn it, and realize it won't come all at once.

 

He's always trying to circle and draw lines from one thing to another instead of writing it out. Or he tries to use an existing number in a word problem as one of the addends and put the other addend on top of it to make an equation. Sounds like he's got the shortcut thing down pat.B]:D;)[/b]

 

 

Ds7 whines EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. we sit down to do schoolwork. He then zooms through it, as he learns it all very quickly. But there's always the whining factor. It's hard to be patient. Try to use humor to dispel the whining--or use either a carrot or a stick, depending on his reaction to either approach. IOW, (carrot) "Your whining (give an example) makes me feel frustrated and grouchy. So, in order to help you cut it out, I'll give you (whatever carrot might work) each time today that you don't whine." Or (stick) "Your whiny attitude makes me feel frustrated and grouchy. So whine again and (stick) will happen. Your choice. "

 

Then there's the tipping back the chairs.

Deal with it. When they fall, they will stop. Natural conseqences are the way to go here, imo

 

The throwing pencils around. Tell them to stop or (carrot or stick).

 

Starving or needing water right after we get started. Set them up with a glass of water and a plate with a small snack on it.

 

Using the pencil with the stupid blue eraser even though it leaves blue streaks and doesn't erase well. THROW OUT THE PENCIL.

 

Being silly with their answers and writing sixteen zeros off the side of the page just to make a big number. :glare: Boys...

 

They stop working the second I walk out of the room to help the other one. Put them in the same room or set up a consequence.

 

I end up frustrated and yelling, then the tears start, and now it's been 2 hours and we've gotten barely anything done.

 

I feel like they hate school just as much here as they did in school, and at this point they were probably learning more in school, so what are we doing exactly? You are learning how to teach, be the authority, and bond as a family. No one gets it in one day. :001_smile:

 

:grouphug:

Edited September 12, 2011 by Chris in VA

[enviromommy]

How long have you been at it? I find the beginning to be very hard. Getting into the swing of things can take time.

 

:iagree:

This is our second year homeschooling, and I still have a lot of the same problems you are describing, but it is better than last year. Hang in there. It is too soon to conclude it's not working.

[endurancerider]

I'm feeling increasingly frustrated with the attitude of the kids and our progress. Part of it is me feeling like we have no direction. I feel good about math (they're both using Math Mammoth) but right now our Language Arts is incredibly scattered. Dh is doing some social studies with them (beginning of humans/evolution), and we haven't started science yet. So I'm feeling like I'm not doing very well. And then there are the attitudes I'm dealing with.

 

For instance, in ds10's math lesson today there were directions about shortcuts when multiplying numbers with zeros (like 380 x 260). The instructions showed the examples of how you could just multiply 38x26 and then add the two zeros. Then there was a graph paper section where you were supposed to work some of the problems.

 

I told ds to read the directions, and ask me if he had any questions, because I was working with my 7yo. When he came about 1/2 hour later, he showed me the worked problems. He had done them all just as he always done, and had not practiced the shortcut. When I asked him about it, he admitted he hadn't read the directions at all. In addition, he didn't use the graph paper, and instead wrote in huge numbers all over one page, and had torn out two small pieces of paper from a notebook, done one problem on each, and taped them into the book.

 

My son tried this one time. I told him that it is better to do your best the first time, but if he didn't, then practice makes perfect. I made him erase all of it, and then do it again the right way. When the paper ripped, I copied extra problems out of the back of the book, and had him do those too. He didn't do that again.

 

This makes me furious. Yes, he did the math (although not in the way the lesson was teaching), but he really needs to learn how to work within a given context. He's always trying to circle and draw lines from one thing to another instead of writing it out. Or he tries to use an existing number in a word problem as one of the addends and put the other addend on top of it to make an equation.

 

Ds7 whines EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. we sit down to do schoolwork. He then zooms through it, as he learns it all very quickly. But there's always the whining factor.

 

Whining is a HUGE pet peeve to me too, I feel your pain (in the ear). ;) I tell mine to change their attitude, or I can help them with it. Then if it persists, I take away their privilege to talk, which means no sounds either. This has truly nipped the problem in the bud around here.

 

 

Then there's the tipping back the chairs. The throwing pencils around. Starving or needing water right after we get started. Using the pencil with the stupid blue eraser even though it leaves blue streaks and doesn't erase well. Being silly with their answers and writing sixteen zeros off the side of the page just to make a big number. They stop working the second I walk out of the room to help the other one. I end up frustrated and yelling, then the tears start, and now it's been 2 hours and we've gotten barely anything done.

 

I have a schedule posted for snack-times and lunch. This helped them to know when there would be breaks, and to stop asking (that's what they are really after, is a break).

Also, for subjects that seem taxing to my kiddo's, I take out a small bowl of goldfish. For each problem that they finish, they get one cracker. This helps them stay on track, and motivated to complete the next problem.

 

I feel like they hate school just as much here as they did in school, and at this point they were probably learning more in school, so what are we doing exactly?

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not one of the parents who thinks homeschooling is for everyone, but if you want to continue, I believe it will get better as you discover the tools that work for your family. I hope that some of this helps you. Good luck!

[TxMama]

Ohhhh, this is your 3rd week of your first homeschooling year?

 

In that case, start slowly to develop a solid routine.

 

I would then split up the kids for the basics until you get this routine solid. I wouldn't expect them to know to keep working when you leave to go help the other. I would gradually get in the habit of leaving their side but being close enough to step in when they start to dawdle. Once you get each individual child in the habit of doing 1. math, 2. writing,3. other independant subject...then you can try to integrate them both doing it at the same time. But you need to train them into doing it and that means you being there to direct them.

 

Doing school at home is an adjustment for them! Give it some time.

 

Spend the morning working on the basics. Spend the afternoons working on games/projects but only after you have your morning routine going smoothly.

 

HTH

[AngelBee]

:grouphug:

[Tracy]

:grouphug: I have not BTDT, but I wish that I could help.

 

One idea I saw recently that I liked: Put 5 skittles in front of the child, and tell him if he follows the rule, he gets the candy. Every time he does X, mama eats one skittle. The woman who posted this idea said you cannot imagine the horror on the face of the dc when his mom eats HIS candy, but it worked like a charm in her house.

 

HTH

[woolybear]

You've had some good advice so far. One thing I can add is something I am trying this year. I also have two boys, ages 11 and almost 9. Their attitudes seem quite different when they are not in the room together. I find it more productive to work one on one with the other NOT doing school work. I start around 8:30 with my younger son. We have an hour to do math,reading, handwriting or copywork, and then we usually have time for something more fun--a short read aloud, living math, a game. Although some of that is work he can do on his own, it is helpful for me to be available to answer questions or help without having big brother around as a distraction. Same goes for when I work with older ds. Here is our basic schedule:

 

8:30-9:30 Work with younger ds--includes his independent work and work with mom stuff. Older ds still has free time.

 

9:30-9:45 morning basket with both

 

9:45-10:45 younger ds takes a break. I work with older ds. Much of this work, I do not directly help him with, but I am available as needed. There are some subjects which I do help more, such as grammar and math.

 

10:45-12:30 Snack and then do together subjects.

 

I am trying to leave the afternoons free or do some of our projects and read alouds in this time.

 

I just wanted to post this to give you another thought on how to schedule the time.

[Corraleno]

In addition, he didn't use the graph paper, and instead wrote in huge numbers all over one page, and had torn out two small pieces of paper from a notebook, done one problem on each, and taped them into the book.

This would just make me laugh and smack my forehead. Next time make him read the directions to you; if you want him to work the problems in a specific place, maybe you could put the problem numbers (1a, 1b, or whatever) on the paper for him, to show him where to work.

 

This makes me furious.

The biggest change you can make in your homeschool is to not get furious about little things like this, otherwise you will all be miserable. They're kids, being kids. Correct what needs correcting, and move on.

Or he tries to use an existing number in a word problem as one of the addends and put the other addend on top of it to make an equation.

Clever! I wouldn't have a problem with that.

 

Ds7 whines EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. we sit down to do schoolwork. He then zooms through it, as he learns it all very quickly. But there's always the whining factor.

You've had lots of good advice about this; I always prefer to reward good behavior rather than punish bad behavior.

Then there's the tipping back the chairs. The throwing pencils around. Starving or needing water right after we get started. Using the pencil with the stupid blue eraser even though it leaves blue streaks and doesn't erase well.

You realize that kids do the exact same things in PS, right? Homeschooling doesn't magically turn wiggly little boys into adults overnight. Get rid of the blue eraser. Have you tried getting them to do jumping jacks or run laps around the house before starting schoolwork? Or perhaps before you start "class" in the morning, you could give the boys 90 seconds to see how far back they can rock in their chairs without falling over, let them each throw 3 pencils (or something else) as far as they can down the hall, then they each get one pencil to work with and it's all four chair legs on the floor. Schedule snack & drink breaks and set a timer so they can see how long until the next one. If they get distracted, gently direct them back — definitely without anger and with humor if possible.

 

Being silly with their answers and writing sixteen zeros off the side of the page just to make a big number.

I would make a joke or game out of that, or else just ignore it.

 

I end up frustrated and yelling, then the tears start, and now it's been 2 hours and we've gotten barely anything done.

They're perfectly normal little boys, you're in the first few weeks of your first year of homeschooling, and there's no reason it needs to be so tense or frustrating. It doesn't need to be perfect the minute you start homeschooling. It doesn't ever need to be perfect. It just needs to be pleasant and effective. Silliness is not the enemy of pleasant and effective.

 

 

 

Jackie

Edited September 13, 2011 by Corraleno

[Lisa in the UP of MI]

My oldest (7yo) tends to whine and she also sometimes does sloppy or incorrect work. I'm usually there with her. We have a rule now that if she does either of those things she gets more work, whether it's school work or house work. She still does it sometimes but since I started enforcing this rule it has been so much better. And I agree with doing the one-on-one work separately. I only have a second grader and kindergartener, but we do their math and language arts at different times so that I can concentrate on just them. Now that dd is a little older and this is her third year officially homeschooling she is able to do a little bit of independent work, but I do make sure to stay nearby and am ready to help as soon as she needs it.

[lewelma]

I always prefer to reward good behavior rather than punish bad behavior.

 

:iagree:

 

For whining, my son earns one chain for his paper chain for each subject he does with a good attitude. This is for 10 to 15 minute subjects. For his most miserable subject, he gets a paper chain if he ends with a good attitude, but he gets a special lacy chain if he can start and finish with a good attitude. 3 weeks to a GREAT attitude. Has worked like a charm.

 

I agree with keeping the children in separate rooms. I alternate my time between my 2 kids.

8-8:45 work with younger

8:45-9 help older get started on something he can do independently

9-10 work with younger

10-11 work with older

etc.

 

Be patient with yourself and your children, but expect slow but steady progress to better work habits.

 

Ruth

[MerryAtHope]

This is technically our third week, but is really more like our second week as we had an interruption the first week.

 

I also feel like we're not doing any games or projects or anything fun, but I'm spending so much time pulling teeth just to get the basics done I'm not sure how to add those in.

 

What I do every year is start slowly with just a subject or two (maybe one that could be done independently, and one that needs your attention, so that you can work with one while the other is independent). Then, plan something fun after that as a motivator.

 

Sit your kids down and say, "Here's how things are going to work today. I'm going to work with younger sibling, while older sibling, you will do xyz (maybe reading). Then I'm going to work with older sibling, while younger sibling, you will do xyz. If you are both diligent, we should be done by X time. If you have a good attitude, we will do X fun activity. If we have bad attitudes, I'll know that you need to work on attitude, and we'll do some chores first and then see if we have time for X fun activity.

 

For your son and math--ok, I know it's frustrating, but this is so normal. I've learned to laugh when my kids do this (in fact, I had made the comment that the "pretty letters all over the page have meaning and purpose" so much that my son quoted me to my daughter one day, "yeah, those words aren't just there for decoration!" LOL! Just go back and read them together, and then make him do it again. "If you do it correctly the first time, you won't have to do it again. Sorry bud (in a tone that is sympathetic but acknowledges this is the path HE chose). But if you ever read them and aren't sure what to do, ask me. I'm here to help."

 

For the graph paper--you are going to need to demonstrate EXACTLY what you want done, from how and where to number the page and how to lay problems out in an orderly manner, how to show the work, and so on. You demonstrate, and then have him demonstrate while you either watch or he comes to show you after only ONE problem. (If he does them all wrong again, he'll have to do them all again, and you want to make this easy on him, you can say, so you really do want him to check with you after the first one). After one, if it's correct, ask if he wants you to walk him through another or if he's got it.

 

Develop good work habits with just a couple of subjects first, and then gradually add on more subjects.

 

For your 7 yo, talk this through ahead of time. Ask why he whines. Note that he then goes on to sail through the work--does it seem easier than he thinks it's going to be? Then see if you can laugh together--really, it's kind of funny to be so upset & then have school be so easy! Then give him something to do instead of whine tomorrow, role play and have him practice. I used to have a "School Rules" sign posted that said:

 

v Be Kind J

 

v Be Cheerful J

 

v Do Your Best! J

 

v Ask Mommy for as many hugs as you want J

 

 

Be joyful always; pray continually; give thanks in all circumstances for this is God’s will for you in Christ Jesus. –1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

 

You can drop the verse if that doesn't fit your style, but see if they can learn the above. My oldest asked for 100 hugs when I put this sign up, LOL! And I did it, we laughed, and moved on. Try to encourage a good attitude and to model cheerfulness when you do hard things too. (Sometimes I'm not very pleasant when I find something hard for me--I found I was sabotaging my efforts to lead THEM in a good attitude by MY attitude at times! So I worked on that too). Expect it to take some time to develop character (ever seen an adult throw a tantrum?!). We're all in process.

 

Hang in there! Merry :-)

Edited September 13, 2011 by MerryAtHope

[FriedClams]

Honestly, it sounds like you are homeschooling a couple of kids and you're expecting them to be more like adults. Kids don't sit attentively and follow directions the first time. They aren't usually super self motivated. They're young and easily distracted. Boys are a lot like puppies (in the good ways!). They arent being subversive and bad - they are being kids.

 

The first things I'd change is my expectations. Yes, get your worklist done, but lighten up little. Don't expect a young boy to be able to read directions, learn then material themselves, put it neatly on the correct paper, and then quietly turn it in to you. They are learning, and you are their teacher. Teach them. Hes too young to be his own professor. Sit with your son and encourage him. Cherish the opportunity to teach and mentor him. Before you blink he'll be a man! Make check points in lessons - and mini races. Show him every day for a week how .to set up the paper like you want it. Then have him show you for a week. Then grade him on it. Slow and steady. Do you remember how long it used to take in school for the teacher to get everyone on the same math page in the beginning of fifth grade?? forever!!! The kids had to be trained. It's the same with our kids, even with our student to teacher rations being so low.

 

For basic school rules - post them. No sitting back in chairs. If you do you stand for a subject. Whining gets you two lessons instead of one. Snack time is at 10. So is the water break. Or, have water bottles on hand. Or, better yet, haves the kids bring a water bottle if they want one, otherwise, waters is at 10. Make some of school...fun. For our spelling the kids can use any word, spelled correctly, to fill in worksheets. It's hilarious. Math on a white board goes twice as fast. Racing subjects for candy corn is fun. Quizzing for candy corn is fun, too. Send them for a run around the house if they need to stretch their legs. Have them grab the mail for you. There are tons of ways to make things more fun - which actually speed the kids up and make them enjoy school more.

 

It sound like you have very high expectations, which can be good and bad. You can achieve your goals, and have fun doing it, but it will require some training of the kids and some lightening up. Please, enjoy the process. I think some of the lessons I'm learning the most from have nothing to do with checking off my to do list or getting another grammar lesson done. :001_smile::001_smile:

[boscopup]

You have normal boys. :D Here's how I'm dealing with similar issues in my house with a 7 year old...

 

I told ds to read the directions, and ask me if he had any questions, because I was working with my 7yo.

 

Go over the directions with him. Later, you can work on independence.

 

This makes me furious.

The hardest part is changing your own attitude (and trust me, BTDT!). Your son DID do the work. If I'd told my son to read the directions and do the math, he'd have sat there playing with his pencil or falling out of his chair. Don't be furious. He's being a normal 10 year old boy.

 

He's always trying to circle and draw lines from one thing to another instead of writing it out. Or he tries to use an existing number in a word problem as one of the addends and put the other addend on top of it to make an equation.

Ha! Smart boy. He doesn't want to write. That's ok. As long as he shows his work when asked, and he properly shows where the answer is, I wouldn't fret.

 

Ds7 whines EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. we sit down to do schoolwork. He then zooms through it, as he learns it all very quickly. But there's always the whining factor.

Is the work too easy? I have a quick learner. I've had to bump up grade levels until I found work that slowed him down and made him think. You may need to do that also. If he's bored, that could be a huge source of whining.

 

Then there's the tipping back the chairs.

I told my son that when he fell backwards, I would laugh at him. And then i did. :D

 

The throwing pencils around. Starving or needing water right after we get started.

Oh, the water! We dealt with that a lot this summer. We'd sit down to do school, and he'd suddenly be thirsty. He'd get up in the middle of me teaching a lesson. Finally, I put my foot down and said no more! I told him his teacher at school didn't let him get up anytime he wanted to go get a drink or go to the bathroom, and that he wasn't going to disrespect me like that either. When I am teaching, he will listen. I will not tolerate interruptions like that. Sure enough, that stuff stopped quickly. Let them know that such behavior is unacceptable and that is disrespectful to you.

 

Using the pencil with the stupid blue eraser even though it leaves blue streaks and doesn't erase well.

We had one of those. I quickly removed it from the school-time options. :)

 

Being silly with their answers and writing sixteen zeros off the side of the page just to make a big number.

If they're being silly with answers, I again have to wonder if the work is too easy? I also explain that there is a time to be silly and a time not to be silly. This is not a time to be silly. I'll provide them with times to be silly (like during grammar when we needed to make up a sentence for Rod & Staff worksheets... I just pictured what the Mennonite teachers would have said if they'd seen some of these sentences :lol:).

 

They stop working the second I walk out of the room to help the other one.

Put them in the same room. :) My boys have desks right next to each other. The 4 year old sometimes does math with the 7 year old. I sit between them and help each of them as needed.

 

Alternately, work with them at separate times. Your 10 year old may need 100% mom for a bit as he gets used to homeschooling. Then you can ease him toward independence. Not all 10 year olds are independent though, and it's possible he's just not ready.

 

I end up frustrated and yelling, then the tears start, and now it's been 2 hours and we've gotten barely anything done.

If we're getting frustrated and DS is in tears, I have us take a break. He goes and lays on my bed to rest for 10 minutes or so, then we come back both refreshed. We might do a different subject and come back to the frustrating subject later. Don't let one subject drag out! There is a point where you're not going to get anymore done, no matter how long you go. :tongue_smilie:

 

I feel like they hate school just as much here as they did in school, and at this point they were probably learning more in school, so what are we doing exactly?

You're only 2 weeks in. Give yourself some slack. It will take time to adjust. You can do this. All of these problems are normal startup problems. Fear not! :grouphug:

 

Perhaps you could plan a day here and there to do a fun project or field trip? Sounds like some mother-son bonding would be a good thing.

[ktgrok]

Trust me, they were doing the same thing in public school, you just didn't know about it. And they were getting away with it, because the teacher didn't have time to deal with it. My son does the same thing with instructions. A few times of redoing it the right way fixes that. Or just showing him how much easier it would have been to use the shortcut. I pointed out that same lesson to my son I think. He was very frustrated that he had done all that work when it could have been much easier. lesson learned, mostly. At least you noticed he didn't follow directions and can point it out to him. If he was in public school it wouldn't have even been noticed.

[chepyl]

My son uses the numbers in word problems as part of his equation to avoid writing as well. I just call it creative problem solving! ;) I male him write some problems out, some I let him short cut. If I give him a little freedom for some of those things, he follows directions on others.

 

It took me most of last year to start to loosen up! I still have to work on it. Stick to your schedule and let them get used to it. After 6 weeks my ds knows that schoolwork comes before Wii or tv time and he is motivated to get it done. He knows it must be done well or we do it again. It did take at least a month to hit that point. Give it some time and take a break when you feel the frustration coming.

[Hottater]

food issue - Give them something that after each problem or sentence or phonics blend etc. they get 1 bite or one sip. :D:lol: I do it with my son.

[mrs.m]

My rule is snacks at 10 and 3. NO exceptions and no grazing. Grab a water bottle before we start or wait until break. And I also tell them to go to the bathroom before we start. Otherwise they wait until I'm finished teaching!

 

Hang in there! Mine are still squirrels at times but it has gotten better since I set the rules.

[skueppers]

I wonder if part of your frustration is that you want to get a specific amount done in a day, so you feel stressed and rushed, and then they do this stuff that slows everything down, making you feel more stressed.

 

Or maybe I'm just projecting. :)

 

Anyway, I try to remember that it doesn't really matter if we finish everything I have planned every day. I can always reschedule it. Sometimes learning together how to get through these issues IS the lesson. And sometimes I have to remind myself that it's OK to dawdle if the dawdling is itself productive.

 

For example, today my daughter took forever to do some math I'd meant as a five-minute exercise. The reason she took forever is that while I had asked her to measure in centimeters, she wound up measuring in centimeters and in inches and comparing the answers. I did eventually have to move her along, but I don't want our school to be one where she doesn't have time to do stuff like that.

[Hope in God]

What I do every year is start slowly with just a subject or two (maybe one that could be done independently, and one that needs your attention, so that you can work with one while the other is independent). Then, plan something fun after that as a motivator.

 

Sit your kids down and say, "Here's how things are going to work today. I'm going to work with younger sibling, while older sibling, you will do xyz (maybe reading). Then I'm going to work with older sibling, while younger sibling, you will do xyz. If you are both diligent, we should be done by X time. If you have a good attitude, we will do X fun activity. If we have bad attitudes, I'll know that you need to work on attitude, and we'll do some chores first and then see if we have time for X fun activity.

 

For your son and math--ok, I know it's frustrating, but this is so normal. I've learned to laugh when my kids do this (in fact, I had made the comment that the "pretty letters all over the page have meaning and purpose" so much that my son quoted me to my daughter one day, "yeah, those words aren't just there for decoration!" LOL! Just go back and read them together, and then make him do it again. "If you do it correctly the first time, you won't have to do it again. Sorry bud (in a tone that is sympathetic but acknowledges this is the path HE chose). But if you ever read them and aren't sure what to do, ask me. I'm here to help."

 

For the graph paper--you are going to need to demonstrate EXACTLY what you want done, from how and where to number the page and how to lay problems out in an orderly manner, how to show the work, and so on. You demonstrate, and then have him demonstrate while you either watch or he comes to show you after only ONE problem. (If he does them all wrong again, he'll have to do them all again, and you want to make this easy on him, you can say, so you really do want him to check with you after the first one). After one, if it's correct, ask if he wants you to walk him through another or if he's got it.

 

Develop good work habits with just a couple of subjects first, and then gradually add on more subjects.

 

For your 7 yo, talk this through ahead of time. Ask why he whines. Note that he then goes on to sail through the work--does it seem easier than he thinks it's going to be? Then see if you can laugh together--really, it's kind of funny to be so upset & then have school be so easy! Then give him something to do instead of whine tomorrow, role play and have him practice. I used to have a "School Rules" sign posted that said:

 

v Be Kind J

 

v Be Cheerful J

 

v Do Your Best! J

 

v Ask Mommy for as many hugs as you want J

 

 

Be joyful always; pray continually; give thanks in all circumstances for this is God’s will for you in Christ Jesus. –1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

 

You can drop the verse if that doesn't fit your style, but see if they can learn the above. My oldest asked for 100 hugs when I put this sign up, LOL! And I did it, we laughed, and moved on. Try to encourage a good attitude and to model cheerfulness when you do hard things too. (Sometimes I'm not very pleasant when I find something hard for me--I found I was sabotaging my efforts to lead THEM in a good attitude by MY attitude at times! So I worked on that too). Expect it to take some time to develop character (ever seen an adult throw a tantrum?!). We're all in process.

 

Hang in there! Merry :-)

 

 

:iagree:What a great post.

[bnrmom]

Thank you so so so so so much! You are all very right - I need to relax my expectations of their independence. I think the main thing that's making be uptight about this is that one of the things ds10's teacher liked to give me a hard time about when he was in 4th grade last year was his lack of independence. She made it sound like every other kid in there was able to do the work assigned, and he required too much hand holding. (Of course, he ended up getting all As and Bs and acing the standardized test.) So I've been really paranoid about not sitting with him through every bit of his work. But I want this to be a pleasant experience for both of us. (He was homeschooled K-3, but we were very unschooly at the time, so I do think he had an adjustment when he went to public school last year.)

 

Also, my kids have a tendency to spiral completely out of control if I indulge their silliness. I feel like if I give an inch they take a mile, so I tend to get overly grumpy about any silliness, when in honestly I'd prefer to giggle about it a bit and move on. But they tend to run with it and before I know it they're screaming through the house telling butt jokes and it takes 10 minutes to get them reigned back in. So I'd like to find a happy medium with that, and discussing it with them is probably a good first step.

 

Ds7 is a hard one to figure out. If something is too hard at first glance, he melts down and literally says things like "Why would you do this to me?" and then refuses to even listen to me try to explain it to him so he can see that it's something he really can do. But then if it's too easy, he complains that it's babywork and boring. We're walking a fine line with this, and even though he is an advanced reader, writing in particular is a real challenge. We have WWE coming in the mail, and I'm hoping maybe this will help us ease him into a bit of a language arts routine.

 

And really, if I am to be honest, a lot of my stress is coming from a place of not being secure about what we are doing. I feel good about math, I think science will be fine once we get started, but I am completely at a loss about Lanugage Arts. I feel like I'm just piecing some random thing together from 38 different sources with no direction or confidence that we are on the right track. I'm hoping to spend some time getting that figured out in the next week or two.

 

But really, I can't tell you how much I appreciate your feedback and advice. I will be rereading this thread to remind me to lighten up and not be afraid to have fun with them!

Edited September 13, 2011 by bnrmom

[nikkid]

He really needs to learn how to work within a given context. He's always trying to circle and draw lines from one thing to another instead of writing it out.

Then there's the tipping back the chairs. The throwing pencils around. Starving or needing water right after we get started. Using the pencil with the stupid blue eraser even though it leaves blue streaks and doesn't erase well. Being silly with their answers and writing sixteen zeros off the side of the page just to make a big number. They stop working the second I walk out of the room to help the other one. I end up frustrated and yelling, then the tears start, and now it's been 2 hours and we've gotten barely anything done.

I feel like they hate school just as much here as they did in school, and at this point they were probably learning more in school, so what are we doing exactly?

 

I could have written this post in the beginning of last school year, my first year (except my kids are different ages). We still have it happening again this year, but not nearly as bad. I feel pressure from my teacher-husband to meet his expectations to keep up with public school since he wants to make sure we can put them back in someday, I feel pressure from my dd trying to make sure she respects me and learns to sit still and do as she is told, I feel pressure from myself because I love to learn so much and I want to move on to check it off and keep learning...

BUT I am learning that these expectations are on MY time table and not on my KID'S time table (or God's time table if you follow that line of thinking more). Homeschooling was supposed to be about going at their pace and sometimes that requires a lot of patience since I thought their pace would be faster than in public school because of the individual attention no--but many days it's not.

 

I've come to realize a few things that might help:

--When things get hard like this, try starting your day all together in your jammies in your bed and start reading a series together (like Narnia, Lord of the Rings, etc.) for 15-30 minutes. Then declare "getting ready for the day" recess and have a race to see who can be ready first. This helped me start my school day earlier so it really didn't cut in too much.

--It takes time to learn a new routine, and kids act up (sometimes adults do too!) when we feel like change is being imposed on us and we're not used to it.

--Homeschooling isn't easier than public school I think (if you have a decent one to go to). It just changes when the stress happens (until you can get more years under your belt at least). It's nice that the stress is spread out through the day instead of the mad-dash to get ready, make your lunch, and get out the door and the mad-dash to finish homework and go to bed (plus after school activities). Homeschooling has ended up taking up more of my life than I ever thought it would, but I see some dividends already. My two kids are closer than ever, for one. And now I feel like I understand more how to be an advocate for my child's education should we decide to put them back in public school. A lot of the frustration that has come so far was with my unrealistic expectations that I could do what my parents did and send my kids off to school and the kids would do the homework and the parents didn't need to be involved. Our society doesn't function that way anymore for kids to be successful in school.

--I have noticed since homeschooling that I am so much more busy that I've had to be more organized and been able to give up those things that don't really matter (like tv shows I was addicted to). The housework suffers, but I try to make up for it on the weekend. I feel better about myself because I'm not wasting any time (well, not as much time during the day...this forum tends to fill some night hours :)). I don't have as much time to feel sorry for myself. I know not to expect "me" time during the day like other mom's with public school kids so it doesn't bother me as much, but I do still make time to get out at night once a week or so. We all need breaks.

--I've heard to expect slumps in the first weeks, again in October, and again after state test time if you do those, or a few other times. Just know this is natural to go through these ups and downs and you are not alone. Next time it happens say to yourself, "Oh, here comes that slump again...I can beat it."

 

Hope this helps! I've been in a depressive slump right now too...I kind of lost my desire to homeschool seeing these issues with getting back up and started after the summer break happen again. I'm tired of the disrespect and silliness. But reading through threads like this reminds me I can do it, and that for me, this is the road I need to be on right now. So, I have a choice...I can drag my feet and wish for the greener grass on the other side, or I can take the challenge head on, give it my best, and not give up. Once my decision is made for the latter, each day gets easier than before.

 

Good luck,

Nikki

[nikkid]

Just saw your 2nd post so wanted to add...

 

Also, my kids have a tendency to spiral completely out of control if I indulge their silliness. I feel like if I give an inch they take a mile, so I tend to get overly grumpy about any silliness, when in honestly I'd prefer to giggle about it a bit and move on. But they tend to run with it and before I know it they're screaming through the house telling butt jokes and it takes 10 minutes to get them reigned back in.

 

You are probably going to get feedback here on how you need to be more of an authority and not let them be allowed to run all over you. This may be true for me as well, since this happens to me. But there are definitely some personalities that are harder to guide than others. My dd's hyper personality, mixed with lots of dramatic flair and extreme desire for everything to be fun is very challenging and requires a lot of creativity and patience on my part to not yell. It's a daily challenge to try to not squash her excitement for life but teach her to be appropriate. We've had lots of talks about respect and she turns the tables on me and gives me examples of when I don't respect her. So I'm trying to be humble and start with respecting her more.

 

Ds7 is a hard one to figure out. If something is too hard at first glance, he melts down and literally says things like "Why would you do this to me?" and then refuses to even listen to me try to explain it to him so he can see that it's something he really can do. But then if it's too easy, he complains that it's babywork and boring.

 

Once again, are you describing my life?! My dd was very much this way last year--trying to find that balance of challenging/not baby-work, but not too hard so you hear the mental breakdown and beating themselves up routine is tough. It has gotten better with maturity. I've had to take below-grade assignments but do them in more challenging ways.

 

I am completely at a loss about Lanugage Arts. I feel like I'm just piecing some random thing together from 38 different sources with no direction or confidence that we are on the right track. I'm hoping to spend some time getting that figured out in the next week or two.

 

I did First Language Lessons last year for grammar, and although it's very dry, I loved that it held my hand the whole year. Same with Ordinary Parent's Guide to Teaching Reading. I LOVE All About Spelling for the same reason. Easy to use and very thorough. We use Writing with Ease, but have had to adjust it a bit to make it not too challenging. I find these programs go together nicely, with very little prep work. This year we started Writing Tales 1, and my dd LOVES it. It's grammar, writing, spelling, etc all in one, but it's not quite as thorough as the programs I wrote about above. But I think it's more than she would be getting in ps. We supplement most subjects with multiple curriculums, but this means we don't finish each subject every day with all that I want to do. I may end up simplifying as the year goes on. I just love that I'm learning right along with her.

Hope that helps with the LA decisions! There are so many to choose from.

[Angie in VA]

I haven't read all the responses, but what I have read is good advice.

 

I am still amazed at how much more work my dc get done, and how much more quickly they get it done, after doing something physical. This is especially true w/ ds. Amazing difference! When it is nice out, both of mine have outdoor chores, yard work or they can just play, but when the weather is bad, our rebounder (mini trampoline) saves the day. Just had to share that.

[NorCalMom]

You've already gotten some great advice. I just wanted to send :grouphug: and say that we've been there too. Our first year with dd was an adjustment, but adding in ds last year was really tough. Hang in there, stay positive....it gets better. I agree with Angie that physical activity is VERY important. My ds really needs this to get the wiggles out, and it helps him stay focused.

[Dolphin]

This is our 2nd year, hang in, it does get easier.

 

I am thinking back to some of our problems, maybe this can give you some ideas.

 

Our first big problem was trying to get to much done, so I dropped history, science, art etc.. and just focused of getting math and language arts going. Then I slowly added the other subjects back in.

 

Then spelling. DS HATED the program we were using. I figured there were going to be a few changes, so I went to our local homescool store and put him in front of the spelling section. I told him that he had to do spelling, however he could choose what he wanted. THe shop owner came over and chatted with him and together they choose AAS. Spelling is now his favorite subject.

 

Then Math, I really wanted SM to work. It was just to hard to jump into at 3rd grade. Even going back for certain things was not helping. We ended up with Teaching Textbooks.

 

The other big thing I changed, we started doing something fun at the beginning of the day. Circle time. We have breakfast and then sit down together for morning prayer. We then do circle time, we sing, we tell jokes, we talk about what we are doing to do for they day. It is a nice start. Then they both have to go and get a drink, and try to go to the bathroom and it is time for school.

 

Best of luck, this year will be more about learning home home education will be with your family then anything else. Stay flexible and you will find something that works. Remember, you have just jumped into a full time job, with no training. Give yourself some time.

 

Nicole