I feel sick! Domestic violence mentioned

[Geo]

The police won't do anything about someone threatening suicide. They will do something about someone hurting someone else. I know about the suicide threat from personal experience. They wouldn't do anything because it's not a crime. I am assuming that this is over by now and I hope you sister is safe.

 

WRONG. Suicide (even a threat) is a crime in some states, and OK is one of them. It's "intent to do bodily harm". I know someone who even had to stand before a judge for it, and was put on probation.

Edited August 13, 2011 by Geo

[AlisonK]

Praying for all of you :grouphug:

[wendybird]

Ugh...Woolybear got it right that this will be a long term problem. They made it through the night with her hiding his car keys and locking herself and the kids in a bedroom. This morning he says he wasn't drunk but that he meant everything he said. :crying: She feels like she could be nicer and he will respond in kind. He agrees. He swears he won't drink ever again. I am so frustrated!!! Classic blame the victim crap, and of course he won't drink again...until he does. I asked her if my nephew can come stay with me for awhile( I raised him until he was 4). She said no...everything is ok now. I will be having my husband talk to him in a firm but non confrontational way I guess, and also asking the pastors to contact them(we sort of go to church together...in that she says it is her church but doesn't go). They both carry guns all the time. The officer who went over last night said he made him unload his, but that was the extent of his help. It really is a "good ole boys club" in some OK towns still.

Thank you for all your advice and understanding. I don't know how to be a supportive sister when I think she is completely wrong. My mom died 9 years ago and my dad died earlier this year...I want to be there for her, but just really feel like things don't just "get better" .

I so wanted to give an update along the lines of," She used her head and told him to leave until he gets professional help. The kids won't ever have to see or hear him touch her, or see him pace with a gun again."

Thanks again, it helps to have somewhere to write it all out and know others see how dangerous and stupid this is.

[Alicia64]

Ugh...Woolybear got it right that this will be a long term problem. They made it through the night with her hiding his car keys and locking herself and the kids in a bedroom. This morning he says he wasn't drunk but that he meant everything he said. :crying: She feels like she could be nicer and he will respond in kind. He agrees. He swears he won't drink ever again. I am so frustrated!!! Classic blame the victim crap, and of course he won't drink again...until he does. I asked her if my nephew can come stay with me for awhile( I raised him until he was 4). She said no...everything is ok now. I will be having my husband talk to him in a firm but non confrontational way I guess, and also asking the pastors to contact them(we sort of go to church together...in that she says it is her church but doesn't go). They both carry guns all the time. The officer who went over last night said he made him unload his, but that was the extent of his help. It really is a "good ole boys club" in some OK towns still.

Thank you for all your advice and understanding. I don't know how to be a supportive sister when I think she is completely wrong. My mom died 9 years ago and my dad died earlier this year...I want to be there for her, but just really feel like things don't just "get better" .

I so wanted to give an update along the lines of," She used her head and told him to leave until he gets professional help. The kids won't ever have to see or hear him touch her, or see him pace with a gun again."

Thanks again, it helps to have somewhere to write it all out and know others see how dangerous and stupid this is.

 

You can make a CPS report anonymously. CPS would be outside of the "old boys network."

[abbeyej]

I'm sorry. This is exactly what I would *expect*, but I hoped it might not be your report. ...

 

Stay friends with your sister. Be kind to her. Avoid saying anything negative directly about *him* -- she'll just try to defend him to you, and it'll build up her sense that she needs to protect him from you. (Sick, sick, sick, I know.) Let her know that she can tell you anything, that she can ask for help from you, whatever.

 

That said, if you need to call CPS to protect the kids, DO IT. If you ever have any INKLING that he might hurt them, call CPS. Call them again and again if you have to.

 

But you can't make your sister leave. If she does leave, she will *probably* go back to him. Keep giving her chances, 'cause one of these days it may stick. If you can document any of the abuse, do so, with or without her help. She may need it some day. If she doesn't have a bank account of her own, encourage her (separately from any talk about *him*) to maintain it and continue squirreling away some quantity of money.

 

In the meantime, feel free to daydream about tornadoes dropping houses on him. Or cement trucks accidentally dumping on him. Or other freak accidents of a permanent nature. Sigh.

[ereks mom]

The police won't do anything about someone threatening suicide. They will do something about someone hurting someone else. I know about the suicide threat from personal experience. They wouldn't do anything because it's not a crime. I am assuming that this is over by now and I hope you sister is safe.

 

Dh & I work with couples who have been involved in domestic violence situations such as this, and if the children are witnesses to his threats, the dad would be charged with child endangerment.

[ereks mom]

I'm sorry. This is exactly what I would *expect*, but I hoped it might not be your report. ...

 

Stay friends with your sister. Be kind to her. Avoid saying anything negative directly about *him* -- she'll just try to defend him to you, and it'll build up her sense that she needs to protect him from you. (Sick, sick, sick, I know.) Let her know that she can tell you anything, that she can ask for help from you, whatever.

 

That said, if you need to call CPS to protect the kids, DO IT. If you ever have any INKLING that he might hurt them, call CPS. Call them again and again if you have to.

 

But you can't make your sister leave. If she does leave, she will *probably* go back to him. Keep giving her chances, 'cause one of these days it may stick. If you can document any of the abuse, do so, with or without her help. She may need it some day. If she doesn't have a bank account of her own, encourage her (separately from any talk about *him*) to maintain it and continue squirreling away some quantity of money.

 

In the meantime, feel free to daydream about tornadoes dropping houses on him. Or cement trucks accidentally dumping on him. Or other freak accidents of a permanent nature. Sigh.

 

:iagree: completely. It's sad but not at all surprising that the sister won't leave, and even blames herself for not being "nicer". It's part of the mentality that goes with this kind of thing, and I've seen it happen over and over. :(

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

Never mind. I posted before reading replies

Edited August 13, 2011 by wy_kid_wrangler04

[Cricket]

You can make a CPS report anonymously. CPS would be outside of the "old boys network."

 

:iagree: If there is any way to report this to someone outside the "network", I would.

[WishboneDawn]

You can make a CPS report anonymously. CPS would be outside of the "old boys network."

 

Yup. There's a child in danger here. CPS needs to be involved.

[cseitter]

WendyBird,

 

I am so sorry you are in this situation. I was in the same situation with my sister about this time last year. Unfortunetly, it doesn't get any easier.

 

My sis has been married to this guy for about 5 years, has put her in the hospital twice with the last time because he was choking her all with her older son and daughter in the house. I finally talked her into moving out and moving in with me. My husband and I moved her out of her house or tried to while he was on the road (he is a long distance truck driver). Until she called him and told him she was leaving. He rushed home and while my husband and I took our 5 kids home he proceeded to break everything she owned worth anything in the house while the cops were there.

 

Anyway, she got out moved in with me for 3 months and I guess it was to hard for her because she got sucked right back in. She moved to an apt near me and now he lives with her there. To be honest, I have no idea how there relationship is now. After dealing with this with her for the last 3 years, getting her out and her going right back time and again, it is an emotional roller coaster for me. She refused to go to YWCA because she swears she isn't abused. She says "it's not like he punches me in the face or anything!" No he just breaks all your things, chokes you and drags you from the car by your hair and across the front yard.

 

My advise to you is measure how much you can help her. She has to want to leave the situation for it to work at all. Remember they are in an abuse situation everyday so they hear the same things day in and day out. They (her DH) has convinced her that she can do NOTHING without him and that no one will EVER want her if she left. With that being drilled in your head everyday you begin to believe it and that is why they don't leave. I hope she seeks help but just be prepared to be on a long hard road with her or stay on the outskirts until she calls for help. I stay on the outskirts and refuse to be in the same building as her husband. I feel that if I try to make nice with him that I am just telling him it is OK to hurt my sister and that is NOT an option for me.

 

Sorry to babble but if you need to talk to someone that has been where you are, you are more than welcome to message me.

 

:grouphug: I hope everything works out!!

[JenC3]

I grew up watching my best friend's father beat her mother over and over again. He's police officer and also an alcoholic. She needs to leave him NOW. If he is called on twice he will lose his weapon and have to sit at a desk job. I hate to sterotype, but military and police officers have a high percentage of DA. I can't tell you all the issues my friend has had due to growing up in a violent ousehold. Please talk to your sister. This man has severe mental issues.

[laundrycrisis]

I would report to CPS. It does not sound like your sister is in a frame of mind to protect the children. She is in over her head in an unhealthy relationship and can't see it. The situation sounds so dangerous with substance abuse, emotional instability and firearms. She is demonstrating that she is not mentally capable of seeing all this clearly right now. If she could see it clearly, she would already be gone, hidden in a shelter and taking the first legal steps tomorrow morning. It may be completely up to you to protect the kids from a dangerous, angry drunk who expresses himself with his gun. I'm sorry, but this sounds like a setup for a tragedy.

[Carol in Cal.]

Call CPS right now today.

 

Your sister is in tremendous danger and so are the kids, especially the one with the other father--he will be a target. This is how it works.

 

Please, don't wait.

 

I agree that you can't make her leave him, unfortunately, and I do think that you're wise to keep communication open with her, but someone has to protect those children. Do not EVER tell her that you called CPS. But still do it. Now.

[Harriet Vane]

Call CPS right now today.

 

Your sister is in tremendous danger and so are the kids, especially the one with the other father--he will be a target. This is how it works.

 

Please, don't wait.

 

I agree that you can't make her leave him, unfortunately, and I do think that you're wise to keep communication open with her, but someone has to protect those children. Do not EVER tell her that you called CPS. But still do it. Now.

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

Please. Just please call. Do not underestimate the danger.

[elegantlion]

Being drunk is not necessarily the issue. Many people drink to excess. Drinking, waving a gun, and threatening bodily harm to himself and others is not normal behavior, even for an alcoholic. This man needs help. If he snaps on duty and harms an innocent person could you, your sister, or his "buddy" live with those consequences?

[Guest submarines]

Call CPS right now today.

 

Your sister is in tremendous danger and so are the kids, especially the one with the other father--he will be a target. This is how it works.

 

Please, don't wait.

 

I agree that you can't make her leave him, unfortunately, and I do think that you're wise to keep communication open with her, but someone has to protect those children. Do not EVER tell her that you called CPS. But still do it. Now.

 

:iagree:I hardly ever think that is better for a child to be "in the system" than with his parents, but this is the case where the children are in clear danger. Besides, the child will be placed with family, rather than in foster care. A win-win situation for everone involved. Your sister will be able to get the help that she needs.

 

If you don't call, and something happens, you won't forgive yourself. And it is already happening--the little ones are witnessing so much violence already. But they could end up being physically hurt as well. :grouphug:

[WishboneDawn]

Being drunk is not necessarily the issue. Many people drink to excess. Drinking, waving a gun, and threatening bodily harm to himself and others is not normal behavior, even for an alcoholic. This man needs help. If he snaps on duty and harms an innocent person could you, your sister, or his "buddy" live with those consequences?

 

Another thought. This isn't all about him. This is also about the sister who doesn't understand where to draw the line to keep her child safe. She's failing her child as well and nothing can make that clearer then having CPS step in.

[Carol in Cal.]

Another thought. This isn't all about him. This is also about the sister who doesn't understand where to draw the line to keep her child safe. She's failing her child as well and nothing can make that clearer then having CPS step in.

 

Don't you fail him, too. He needs you.

[Sputterduck]

I'm so sorry. She is so lucky she has you.

[MHowell]

I'm glad to hear they are okay for now. I agree with everyone else that it might be a good idea to get CPS involved. I hope there can be a resolution to this.

[Alicia64]

I just want to add -- and I worked in the field of domestic violence as long as I could stand it -- that you need to approach the subject of leaving him with her very carefully.

 

The go-to saying that we always kept in mind as staff was, "if the counselor bugs the woman to leave the husband -- she won't leave him, she'll leave the counselor."

 

Please take a moment to read this article: http://www.washingtonian.com/articles/people/19152.html

 

Alley

[BarbecueMom]

When you talk to her again, ask her what she would say, as a police officer, to another woman in her situation? If she responded to a domestic dispute and saw a terrified woman and two scared children living with an abuser with a loaded weapon, what would she tell her?

 

A woman that I went to high school with was killed in a domestic dispute five years ago. She was a police officer. So was the boyfriend that shot her while his own children were in the house. That's why your sister's situation jumped out at me. I hope she gets help and gets out. :grouphug:

[KnitWit]

Wendy, I'm praying for you, your sister and your families. :grouphug:

[Amy1k]

I agree with most of the advice here, but also PROTECT YOURSELF and YOUR CHILDREN. Because many times innocent victims get caught in the cross-fire. :(

[Guest]

WendyBird,

 

I am so sorry you are in this situation. I was in the same situation with my sister about this time last year. Unfortunetly, it doesn't get any easier.

 

My sis has been married to this guy for about 5 years, has put her in the hospital twice with the last time because he was choking her all with her older son and daughter in the house. I finally talked her into moving out and moving in with me. My husband and I moved her out of her house or tried to while he was on the road (he is a long distance truck driver). Until she called him and told him she was leaving. He rushed home and while my husband and I took our 5 kids home he proceeded to break everything she owned worth anything in the house while the cops were there.

 

Anyway, she got out moved in with me for 3 months and I guess it was to hard for her because she got sucked right back in. She moved to an apt near me and now he lives with her there. To be honest, I have no idea how there relationship is now. After dealing with this with her for the last 3 years, getting her out and her going right back time and again, it is an emotional roller coaster for me. She refused to go to YWCA because she swears she isn't abused. She says "it's not like he punches me in the face or anything!" No he just breaks all your things, chokes you and drags you from the car by your hair and across the front yard.

 

My advise to you is measure how much you can help her. She has to want to leave the situation for it to work at all. Remember they are in an abuse situation everyday so they hear the same things day in and day out. They (her DH) has convinced her that she can do NOTHING without him and that no one will EVER want her if she left. With that being drilled in your head everyday you begin to believe it and that is why they don't leave. I hope she seeks help but just be prepared to be on a long hard road with her or stay on the outskirts until she calls for help. I stay on the outskirts and refuse to be in the same building as her husband. I feel that if I try to make nice with him that I am just telling him it is OK to hurt my sister and that is NOT an option for me.

 

Sorry to babble but if you need to talk to someone that has been where you are, you are more than welcome to message me.

 

:grouphug: I hope everything works out!!

 

Good for you! That's a great message to send.

[Guest]

I think deciding to call CPS is a tough decision. In this case, it is 100% necessary. His behavior is not going to stop. It's going to get worse because your sister is allowing it by staying. He now sees he can get away with waving a gun around their house in front of the children, and that your sister will stay! He's going to do more. How far is everyone going to let it go? This is in no way your fault, obviously, but you need to make the decision that your sister is unable to make right now. The only way this "man" is going to change is if he is forced, and it's time to start forcing him by making him lose everything.

 

I agree that the child with a different father has it worse than everyone else has it. Get them out. I know you are hesitating because you are afraid to make the wrong decision. You are trying to avoid drams. You are probably talking yourself out of doing anything, just like your sister did. Step back and see that this man is out of control and you just might lose your sister and niece/nephew. Better the drama than the loss of lives. There is no going back once someone is dead.

 

I'll be praying for all of you.

[Guest submarines]

Any updates? :grouphug:

[Joanne]

A few things:

 

Being alcoholic\drinking is a separate problem. It may exacerbate the abuse, but the abuse exists even when he's sober.

 

Google "power and control wheel" for an accurate range of the ways women can be abused.

 

Your sister has normalized behavior that is abusive; she therefore lives in a "it's not THAT bad" dimension.

 

Abusers do not get better unless they get specific interventions for batterers (not intending to limit abuse to physical). Most absuers never get better.

 

In an abuse dynamic, the victim DOES not have a part. There is no % "wrong".

 

Please read "Why Does He Do That" by Lundy Bancroft and "The verbally abusive relationship" by Patricia Evans.

 

Women stay because of the dynamic, which is complicated. Women are, in the short term, more unsafe when they leave.

[Liza Lee]

 

Please read "Why Does He Do That" by Lundy Bancroft and "The verbally abusive relationship" by Patricia Evans.

 

 

Those are two of the best books out there about abuse. Another book that was important for me is "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin de Becker.

 

Also, check out the links in my signature.